Sasquatch Chronicles - SC EP:187 Mountain Giants

Episode Date: January 24, 2016

You asked for it and I am here to give the people what they want. I had many requests to bring Duke back on the air to share all of the information he has regarding "mountain giants" and Duke has agreed to return to the show. Duke told me that he has a lot of information on the mountain giants and has given presentations on it.   To see the photos Duke discusses, visit the episode page on our site HERE.

Five, five, four, four, three, three, two, one. One. When I had come down this hill, I had seen this creature cross the road. They would have ripped my locked door from my truck, extracted me from my vehicle, and no one in the damn thing I could have done about it. This thing I got to notice in his eyes. His eyes was real, real evil, real sinister looking.

You know, the look it was given. What would you have put him? somebody out here. What's going on now, sir? That's son of a bitch is about six foot. Sir? Yes, I'm looking right at him. Saskwatraunicle, a place where people share their encounters.

Let's start the show. Welcome to the show, everyone. Thanks for being here tonight. Got a great show planned for you this evening. Before I get into that, if you've had an encounter and you'd like to be on the show, shoot me an email, Wes at Sasquatch Chronicles.com. And if you get a chance when you shoot me your email, please include your contact information and wait for me to call you.

Again, it's Wes at Sasquotronicles.com. And if you get a chance, please visit the website, Sasquotronicles.com, become a subscriber, get additional shows. I really appreciate you guys being here tonight. I really appreciate you guys listening. A fan favorite has returned Duke. A lot of you remember him from Last Sunday's show. I got a lot of emails asking me to have Duke return to the show

to talk about mountain giants. So if you're curious about mountain giants, this is a show for you. I want to jump into it tonight. There's a lot to get to. Duke, welcome to the show. Thank you for being here tonight. Hey, it's always a pleasure.

Glad to be back and really overwhelmed by the response from the fans out there. Really glad you guys enjoyed the last show. Hopefully we can give you some more interesting stuff to us to on this one. Yeah, no, I appreciate it. And, you know, one of the things I wanted to talk about a little bit more, I know on the last show, you and I talked about the, I brought it up real briefly about that, Nephlam in Afghanistan that was killed by the soldiers and you started going into the mountain giants. You know, we just moved along with the conversation and a lot of people stopped and went, wait a minute, wait a minute, wait a minute, what was that you guys were just talking about?

So what I thought we do is bring you back on here and, you know, give us a presentation on the mountain giants. Tell us a little bit about the mountain giants. Tell us where, how did it start? Why did you start looking into it? And what did you find? Well, let's go back to the very, very beginning of the mountain giant thing, as it sort of exists, there's not many people being it. But as I mentioned during the last interview,

it started all with Bigfoot superhero Canadian John Green, actually being the first person to notice this. I'd like to actually quote Lauren Coleman from forward to true giants on this one. And he says by the late 1960s, some researchers began to realize that something bigger than Bigfoot was out there, being seen and leaving enormous tracks nearly two feet long. One of these researchers, John Green, had noticed from the accounts he had collected North America that a whole group of giants existed who were clearly bigger than the Sasquot to the Pacific Northwest. Green was convinced that the evidence supported their existence because he had talked to the witnesses who were very certain as to what they had seen. So he was the first one that noticed this. He was collecting these reports like we talked about last time,

where you had all of these different things on the reports that were so unlike a Bigfoot report, but yet consistent with each other, that it made him start thinking that there was a pattern to it and that there was, in fact, something out there other than Bigfoot. Well, this was enough information to get Lauren Coleman and Mark Hall going on it and go through the... Each one of those guys has been doing this for upteen years, so they must have collected a lot of reports,

and went through all the reports that they had and went, well, which ones fit this pattern? And lo and behold, they actually had quite a few of them. They had enough to actually put out a small book on it, and like I mentioned last time, True Giants is gigantic. The other than is still alive by Mark Hall and Mark Coleman. There's a very little information on what they call true giants and what I call a Mountain Giant.

The reason I call it Mountain Giants is because I've done more research on some of the really, really old sightings. And as you probably are aware, West, in addition to calling him Wild Man and Yahoo and some of the other colloquial names for them, the name Mountain Giant pops up every so often. And it seems like it's usually used in conjunction with something which pretty much fits the bill

the description on these things, which is to say a lot larger than a regular Bigfoot. Feet tracks that have been found vary from seven inches to 36 inches, 36 inches, way outside the regular size for a Bigfoot's foretoed prints. The creatures themselves and they're cited don't fit

the usual description of a Bigfoot. They're not massive and thick. They don't look like the incredible Hulk with a fur coat on. They're built more like Shaquille O'Neal or something like that. There's some other details that go along with these things that make them very unlike

the regular Bigfoot reports. As I mentioned last time, too, there's also a bunch of the native tribes that have multiple names for Bigfoot. I actually found one that had eight names for Bigfoot. And three of these you could attribute to some local story about a particular individual, and they had a particular name for it. But as in that case, and in a bunch of others, there were multiple names for Bigfoot,

and you could pretty much tell by looking at the description how the name translated that there was one of them that they were talking about what we would think of as regular Bigfoot or Sasquatch. And the other name was for something way worse in skill, judging by the description. that they were talking about definitely something different. And then when any of these things actually had stories attached to them, the attributes that came with it were universally negative, and were not only gigantic, but they were also, they would attack people

with a little or no provocation. If they think they could stop you and get away with it, they definitely would do it. Known to be manned eaters, all the tribes have legends that had any name for them. the legends all were about how these things were attacking the tribe and eating all kinds of people. You know, usually there was some big conflict and they throw it away somehow or something,

you know, along those lines. And that's what most of these stories seem to revolve around. So, again, it was, you know, a really negative connotation that went along with these things. And the only thing that I could say is, thank God they're very rare because you just rarely run into reports of, Wes, how often do you think we get a decent set of tracks having pictures taken of them were a pretty reasonable, believable Bigfoot sighting happened, like maybe once or twice a week? Yeah, I would say so.

Now, these things you find maybe every two or three years, somebody will find a track line, if that often. And it may be 10 years in between sightings. So that tells me two things. First of all, there's a lot less one. And secondly, they're probably not in areas around where humans. they take too big of a amount of land to move around on to have enough food available for them. They've got to be able to the middle of nowhere.

Plus, if they were anywhere near humans, it would be conflicts. People would be disappearing on a regular basis. It would become quite noticeable, and, you know, suspicion would be cast in the direction of something unusual going on. So I think that they are still around. They're very rare. They live in predominantly mountainous or extremely heavily wooded area. is. I've got it on some pretty good, believable, up in Alaska. Like last time I even mentioned, one of the places where they could be found, if you're

so crazy as to want to go there, and I definitely think that you should not. But considering some of the other attributes to go along with, I really, really think you should I know that you mentioned earlier when we were talking that you actually had collected some accounts that you sort of shelped and went, I just don't know what to make of this, and then you started noticing there was a pattern between the accounts you had gotten too. Yeah, I have gotten a few accounts, and I really wasn't sure what to make of them. Before I go into that, I know, Duke, you had sent me some footprints, and would it be already if I post those on Sasquatch Chronicles under this episode for people to look at?

I was blown away when I saw those footprints. I was like, what the heck is this? Yeah, that was sort of the reaction I had when I saw them, too. And, yeah, go ahead and post them up. That's why I sent them to you for us, so everybody else could take a look at them, and see that, you know, this isn't just some imaginary thing. There really are tracks to go along with this thing. People have been finding them, and usually they're gigantic.

Also, some of the sightings in the past are really aggressive Bigfoot encounters that have become almost like Seminole legendary may have been attributed to Bigfoot incorrectly and have been going into the category of Mountain Giants because their aggressive behavior and excessively gigantic size seems to point away from the usual Sasbodge big foot type sightings. I would tend to agree with that. You know, I've gotten some,

going back to some of the reports have gotten, I think as long as I've been doing this, I think I've gotten maybe three total. And one I can really think of was in Alaska, believe it or not, and the guy was hunting. And he said,

Wes, I've been listening to your show for a long time. He didn't want to come on the air. He said, I think what I saw was something else. And I go, well, what did you see? and he goes, we were up, way up in the mountains, we were hunting in the middle of nowhere. And he goes, I don't know what to tell you.

He goes, it was a very, very large manlike creature, but the size was just enormous. And I said, well, how big was it? And he goes, maybe 18, 19 feet? He goes, it wasn't like 10 feet tall. He goes, the thing was just enormous. And it was heading up the size. of the mountain. And he said it had tusks.

And I go, what do you mean? It had tusks. And he goes, well, it had like lower canines. And it had taut. He goes, I don't know what to tell you. It had tusks. He goes, I'm not crazy. I've never seen a saskwatch.

He goes, I don't think this thing was a saskwatch. But it was huge. He goes, it's way out of the parameter of, you know, eight, nine, ten feet tall. He goes, this thing was a monster. And he goes, I was terrified. when I saw it, and I saw it from a distance, and I went the opposite direction. He goes, I can't tell you where it went.

I can't tell you. He goes, but it was huge. And what was interesting about that particular encounter is the guy wasn't trying to sell me on anything. He didn't want to come on the show. He just wanted to relay this to me. And one of the things he said, he goes, I don't think it was a Sasquatch. He goes, it was just too big.

He goes, I don't know what it was. I was not hallucinating. He's like, I wasn't drinking. I didn't smoke anything. I don't do drugs. He goes, but I'm telling you this thing was a freaking giant. He goes, I don't know what else to tell you. And so I've gotten, and it's very few, like I said, maybe two or three reports I've gotten of these things.

And generally speaking, those people don't want to come on the air because he said it's so, he goes, I don't think anyone would believe me. And I kind of believe this guy. I mean, after doing this for a while, you get a sense when someone's full of it. And when they're, you know, you give me five minutes with someone and I can kind of tell you if they have some mental issues or they're actually have seen something. And I've been, I've been lucky because I think 99% of the people I've talked to that they've seen something. And this guy saw something. He was terrified. He gave up hunting.

and it just kind of blew me away. It really wasn't sure we're at a place at, but you're right, when you look at some of the old native, especially the Native American stories, you almost kind of get a sense they're talking about two separate things. They're talking about Sasquatch here,

but they're talking about something else over here. And I think as you read old reports, we kind of lump everything into Sasquatch. When you kind of feel like deep down, they're really not talking about Sasquatch. they're talking about something else. Yeah, and I totally agree with that because, you know, we were talking about last time,

the typical Bigfoot Sasquatch characterization is just of a shy, retiring creature that wants to stay away if he wants to be left alone. He's not looking for trouble. He's not trying to hurt someone. As long as you're not in his territory, making a big mess and causing problems for him, he's just going to try and stay away from you.

And these things have exactly the opposite sort of behavior. They're not at all afraid of people, they'll come out looking for trouble. They don't really care if you see them or not. They'll just stamp on you. You know, because let's face it, if something is 19 feet tall, built like that, we're talking six, seven thousand pounds. They decide to stamp on you, you're done.

One stamp, squish. That's it. You're done. I agree. And the other thing, I will say that's consistent between the reports I've gotten, off the two or three reports I've gotten. I think each person said it had Tusk, which threw me off. because one of them said that it had huge teeth coming out like, I said, like elephant tusks.

And they said, no, I think it was its teeth. He goes, I think it was bottom canine teeth that were sticking out. And he goes, it kind of looked like tusks. And every witness I've talked to, that that's one thing they've brought up beyond just the enormous size. That's something consistent out of the very few reports have taken. Right. And the ones I've come across where there's actually any sort of mention, or maybe they got, you know, the ones where they actually got to see the face,

they could tell, they again would talk about that. Well, you know, it had these big old tusks. And for, you know, quite a while I was trying to figure out what, obviously you're talking about the lower canines protruding somehow. What is that they're talking about? And just recently came across more information that makes me think that were really what they're trying to describe like a boar's tusk sort of thing, like a curb, lower, And like I said you earlier here before we got out on the air,

how often have you seen depictions of fairy tale ogres and giants with exactly that attribute, those weird tusks coming out of their mouth? Now, where did they all get that weird idea from? Yeah, and you're right. As you look at old, you know, the old, I guess, quote-unquote, fairy tales, the jolly green giant, well, I think America has, the jolly green giant really wasn't a friendly giant. We've put them on a can of peas or whatever vegetable it is

and made him into this friendly giant. But if you read the old stories, Jack be nimble, Jack be quick, well, there's a reason why he needs to be nimble and he needs to be quick. It's because the giant's going to kill him. We've Americanized it and made it into canned vegetables. But you're right.

You know, when you look at some of the old depictions, especially like Greek mythology, they do have these tusks. And it didn't hit me until, like I said, those very few people I've talked to. What are these things? I mean, what's your take after researching this? Where do you think they come from? What are they?

What are people seeing? Well, they're seeing a real creature of some kind. Where, you know, where did it come from? Well, obviously they've been around long enough that the natives are well acquainted with them and have lots of old legends and even names for them. So they've been here for a long time. Are they actually like a sub-variety of Bigfoot or something? I really don't think so at this point.

I'm not sure that they're actually related. They might have been on a parallel line of development, along with, you know, humans, great apes, bigfoot, whatever. They could be some kind of a weird hybrid, too. I mean, you know, for those that like to think about the Nephilim or the ancient giants or something, well, what if one of them crossbred with a really big foot and what kind of a kid with that produce might look something like?

that. But, you know, that's, at this point, that's just going to be utter speculation because we just have not even come close to gathering enough information on these things. And part of the reason is, is because they're really rare. Part of the reason is because they're incredibly dangerous. Who wants to go, I'm looking for volunteers who wants to go to take an expedition out to one of the areas where they're known to live and get some pictures up and for me. I'm not doing it. I'm not going there. Uh-uh. No. If I find their tracks, that's enough to let me know that they're in the area, and I probably shouldn't be researching there anyway.

And the tracks, the pictures you're going to post for everybody to take a look at, we're collected right here in Montana, about 30 miles from where I'm saying right now, in a tiny little deserted ghost town called Coloma, which was a mining town. Before it was there, there was an Indian burial ground, which is right next to the mining town. That might have been some bad karma right there, building a mining town right next to an Indian burial ground. There's another really horrible rumor going around that what sank the town was that the mines had played out pretty much. They weren't getting enough actual mineral wealth out of them to make it worth the effort to keep doing it.

And in those days, they were paying their workers every two weeks. And so they waited until it was payday basically. and rather than paying their workers, they collapsed the mine on them, which is why the mine is collapsed, and that has been found by archaeologists that are actually... I'm not sure if they found any remains in there or anything, but the rumor is it that they were working on the railway system going through here,

and we figure they'd get a job working the mines or something, and, you know, so there's that whole thing going on, and then you've got finding tracks of a mountain giant there. And you start putting all that together, and it makes this area really, really unappealing to be in. You know, anybody that's superstitious at all pretty much doesn't want to be there. We took a video of our little EM meter going completely crazy there. I mean, he was buried in the red over three minutes.

And it took me about 15, 20 seconds, just to pull the camera out and get focused on it and start videotaping it. We still got like 2 minutes, 45 seconds of this. It was asking questions to the entity that was there and said, well, if you're here, can you turn off this little bit of this little bit? box over here. So that was pretty creepy, you know. So during the day, we're talking to ghost and at night we're looking for mountain giants. And I got to tell you, you know, when we weren't getting enough action to keep us totally terrified, we actually got into the SUV that

researcher X had there with us. And we listened to an episode of Sasquatch Chronicles. So there you go. Well, you know, you talk about ghost or mountain giants and my shows, you know, I doubt it's terrifying when you start hearing that kind of stuff. You know, I hate ghosts. I hate that whole subject. You know, I think there's something to it. I wanted to ask you, Vince B. from Sasquatch Chronicles, he's a subscriber. He said, I have a special request. On a recent show, you talked to someone who mentioned that an airman was hiking in Montana with

his family and got chased out by a 15-foot tall, bigfoot. That was, in fact, me, and I was recounting the story that I have pulled up in front of me right now, so I'm going to read it to you so that I don't get any details on it wrong. The year was 1977. This happened right here in Montana. This is one of two reports that I've got them out in Giant's in Montana, not including the tracks that we found. It was 1977. It was August.

Great time to go do some camping in Montana. There were three men, two youngsters in this group that were camping, and they went to a hill above Belt Creek Canyon. However, a wicked thunderstorm struck their little camp about 2 a.m. on August 20th, and they decided that safety was a better option than valor and decided to head back to the vehicle. On their way back, they heard some kind of a weird noise, which attracted their attention.

The man in question, Fred C. Wilson was one of these three men and Fred was the one who took it past a polygraph test on this story. He tells us what happens next, and I quote, I turned on my flashlight and saw this huge creature standing beside a tree about 25 yards away. We watched it for about 10 seconds before it moved off into the trees, and then we ran for the car, unquote. Okay, by the time the men reached the car, the creature is still walking upright. It's crossing a clearing. But keep in mind, this is at night during a thunderstorm. There's probably lightning crashing down,

and they're intermittently lighting things up, and they can see this damn monster over there. This has got to be really unnerving. Well, by the time they reach the car, the creature's still walking up, it was crossing a clearing, and at this point, they made a dreadful mistake. One of Fred's companions fired a shotgun

twice to fright the animal away from. According to Mr. Wilson, and I quote, The shots were not fired at the animal, but only adjacent to it, unquote. And again, quoting, we were not trying to shoot it. We were just trying to keep it away from us so we could get out of there, unquote. But instead, the 15-foot-tall hairy monster charged their car. According to Wilson, and here's his description, it looked like a semi-truck coming at us. It took 40-foot strides.

It was hideous. It had small, apish-type eyes, a flatten nose, and canine-type fangs. which showed when its mouth was open. Its face was totally covered with hair, and the head was oblong. Three men, all airmen from Malmstrom Air Force Base, which straight here in Montana, and the other two men who wished not to be named, backed up for its story 100%. They said the creature got to within 20 feet of the vehicle before they got up enough speeded out-distance. Now, there's no question that the men's aggressive actions helped to trigger the charge,

which may not have been a bluff charge. but it's also important to add the side note that the character of these creatures is noted by the local natives does not lend a whole lot of positivity to the whole thing. In addition to the names for Bigfoot, which they all have, they have to see names for these creatures as well. The Cardalene, Calisville, and Flathead Indian tribes, call it Nataluskiliutan, which means killers of men. Well, the northern Paiute call it the

Muzhou or crushers of people. Most recent reports, other than the Colometrax course, come from New Mexico, possibly, in August of 2005. 310 to 12-foot-tall behemus resided there in the Navajo who have no legends of Bigfoot, but do have legends of something else that they call Yeltsou in their language, and this word translates to mean really monstrous. There you have it.

Sweet Jesus. That's the guy that I was talking about, and that was his actual description. Yeah, and that's terrifying. That, you know, and that's coming from an airman where, you know, he has everything to lose. Exactly. Coming out. Yeah, you know, it isn't like somebody that's going to go tell the tall tail just for a lark

because they want to get some attention or something. This guy's risking his entire life and livelihood, coming out and telling a crazy story like this. And then he does it under oath and has both of his buddies back it up, too. You know, so it's hard to see what the end game for something like that was. Since it's basically an unknown story at this point, there's very few people that have even heard of it. Yeah, and it's interesting, too. You know, we talked about that giant in Afghanistan. I talked about it on the last show, and what was that giant doing?

Why did the military have to go in and step in? Because it was killing people. It was killing Marines and eating them. So you start to see little correlations, definitely in some of these stories. Don Ray, he's asking, wondering if the Valley of the Headless Men has had any sightings of giants. And for people out there who don't know, the Valley of the Headless Men, I believe, is in Canada, and a lot of people go missing in that area.

I know the local tribes will tell you not to go in that area. But have you heard of any giants in that area? I have not heard any reports specifically of giants in that area, although it's interesting to note that the local tribe over the course of the last couple, two, three hundred years has been gradually moving their village further and further away from the rim. So there's something there that they're really uncomfortable being anywhere near, and occasionally they decide they're still too close.

They look at their village a little bit further. The legends about this thing are really creepy. There's apparently, reasonably, there's mineral welfare. There's been a lot of prospectors that have gone into the canyon against the advice of the locals to go prospect, and one of them even set up a cabin was there for a little while. All of them have been found without their heads. In a couple of cases, they actually sent in crews to find these guys. They went missing and go find them.

And they never came back. There's something there that's killing people and taking their heads off. And, you know, look for trophies. Is it some really primitive tribe that's still living in the area that's like trophy hunting for heads? Or is it one of the sub-varities we were talking about last week, like a Genosco or a Gugwe or something like that, you know, and even mountain giants, twisting heads off,

one of the preferred methods of killing their prey. Maybe they're just leaving the body behind us, you know, like, hey, stay the hell out of my territory sort of thing, take the head with them for a little, uh, drink it. We don't know. And it's, you know,

it doesn't look like there's been any move with any intrepid explorers to want to get together a team to go explore it and find out for us, let us know. And it's just got a really nasty reputation. There's a very, very little known about, it and people do their best to stay out of it. From what I understand, it's like some sort of a park or national forest or something up there,

but not very commonly visited. Don Ray was also asking about, have they been seen carrying clubs, sticks, or weapons? And, you know, one thing I can tell you is when you read a lot of old Native American reports, they will talk about these other things carrying clubs. What is your research found on that? In fact, I have come across reports of that where they're using primitive weapons like you would think of, you know, like your stereotypical caveman

carrying around your stone claw or your spear or something. You know, some a couple two not further back even talk about multiple animal hides put together or something like that. And maybe that's what they're wearing during the colder seasons of the year. So it seems like they have the attributes of being more intelligent, more tech.

savvy than Bigfoot. You know, you never hear of Bigfoot carrying a club around or using a stone axe or anything like that. And, you know, if they do use makeshift tools like a chimpanzee or something like that, it isn't something that they're going to be carrying around with them all the time. Yeah, that actually does come up in some of the stories about them, which is, again, disturbing because they're that intelligent. What else do they know how to do?

One of the other things that comes up repeatedly is that they live underground. Some of your listeners, in the earth, I'll note that word in. They can say on. They can say there were giants on the earth. They said there were giants in the earth. And a bunch of the reports of mountain giants allude to that sort of thing. There's been a couple people even that have been captured by them reportedly, and one of them escaped, and said, yeah, it was a hidden underground cave that they had a secret entrance to him. It was something so massive that, you know, humans could move it, or so it could be an entrance to something.

And that's how they're coming and going, hiding it. It makes me think of the Lovelock Caves. And for the listeners out there, I'm sure most people know the story, but the Native Americans, everyone always attributes that to Sasquatch. And I've always thought that was something else that they were killing off. But they were warring with this tribe of giants. And in the Loveloc caves, the giants had gone into the cave. The Indians trapped him in there and basically burnt the entrance or burnt the inside of the cave, killed them all.

What's interesting about what they pulled out of the Lovelock Caves is you'll see, going back to using primitive tools, they had like decoy ducks. They pulled all sorts of things out of that cave and he had two pictures of it online. Those decoy ducks are excellent, too. Those are excellent quality. Yeah, it's like something today that would be made. Yeah, exactly. But I've always wondered if that was more of the mountain giants than that. Sasquatch because they talked about them being red-headed giants that ate people, that basically

ate people and lived in this cave. The stuff they were pulling out, you never hear about Sasquatch having duck decoys or, you know, these primitive tools. And have you looked into that Lovelock Caves and related it to mountain giants? Yeah, actually, I did a lot of research on giants in North America in general when I got it in opening this whole can of worms that had mountain giants in it to see if they were talking about the same thing or if it was something different. And I found sufficient evidence for me to think that there's actually two types of giants that weren't mountain giants that used to live here in North America, the red-headed giants being the more recent and reasonable and civilized version of you had, compared to the earlier

ones, which were definitely Nephlin, who had double rose of teeth six digits on hands and feet, as described by the local natives who fought them on the side of the side of the of the red-headed giants. If I recall correctly, it's an Iroquois legend that they originally come from the west and that they were moving east for some reason. Well, the last time there was a big reason

for that might have been some sort of a major volcanic event or something that made the western areas a little bit unlivable for a while. So some of the tribes moved east and they got to approximately where the Mississippi was, if I remember the story correctly, and they came up against the river

and couldn't cross it because there was a hot, hostile tribe on the other side. In fact, there was another tribe that was sitting right where they had come up. We'd been there for a while, also wanted to cross the river and couldn't cross it because the hostile tribe on the other side. The tribe on the side of the river that they came up on were red-headed giants, seven to nine feet tall. And they said, hey, we'd like to go across, but these guys on the other side won't let us cross. They're really nasty, and we just can't fight them by ourselves, so we're kind of stuck here. The earthquake went, well, we're not as big as you guys are, but there's lots of.

of us, we'll team up with you if you want some help, maybe between the two us, he'd be irritable. And so, according to the legend, the red-headed giants, and like I said, again, I think it's the Iroquois, came up and went across the river and won't so serious butt on these big nastier giants, and according to their legends,

chased them down the Mississippi to the south, and they were never seen again. But, yeah, I mean, it almost looks to me like the mound builders probably either were or were descendants of the red-haired giants, and the nephalum were probably here even earlier than that. So again, the question arises, where do the mountain giants fit into this whole thing?

And I honestly don't think they do. I think there's something completely different. It doesn't matter if you're a giant or a saskatch or what you are to them. You're just not any tougher than anything else, and it could still deal with you. You know, let's face it, a nine-foot-tall giant. It's still a pipsquee compared to an 18-foot-tall.

all monster, you could just squash them. I really don't think that they're related, but I do think, you know, for those of you that are into the crazy conspiracy theories, there actually were two different kinds of giants that actually were here in North America before the, what we think was the Native Americans today, got here. Don Ray, who's, who had a lot of questions on here, but one of the questions he had asked about, has there been any reports of giants with one eyes? And, you know, going back to the Cyclops, it's been in our culture for a long time. What did the Cyclops do?

Well, it ate people. It was this large giant that basically ate people. But have you had any, through your research, have you come across anything with, I guess what Don Ray's asking is, any reports of giants with one eye beyond the Cyclops that the Greeks talked about? I have not come across on it to Cyclops.

Had any relation to Mountain Giants or anything. In fact, a lot of paleontologists now are leading toward the idea that what they were finding actually was mammoth and mastodon skulls. And because the hole in the middle of the skull where the trunk goes, if you hold it upright, it looks like that's where a big giant eye should go. And that's what they were thinking they were finding with cyclops skulls when they're pulling these mastodont skulls out of the ground,

like what heck is this thing? Oh, look, it's got that big hole in front of it. It must be a cyclops. Which came first, the chicken or the egg. The idea of the cyclops or them finding these things and going, oh, that must have been a cyclops. You don't know, and Knoll. But as far as reports of something like that, North America,

no, have not come across. I'd like to hear the report that you collected from Montana. Tell us about that one. Well, this one's actually collected by one of my researchers who has now moved, and this was just one of those serendipity things. He was hanging out at the local Walmart, waiting for a friend to come and pick him up. And while he was standing on front having a cigarette,

there was this older guy standing next to him. They just struck up a conversation. And it turned out the guy that he was talking to was a retired logger. who had spent pretty much his entire career right over here in the Bitter Rip Mountains being exactly what it sounds like a logger, got boundaries all the time. He said that he had witnessed several strange things during the course of retired at this point. For those of you who are paying attention, you probably already have your alarm bells going off because the Balman story from Teddy Roosevelt and lots of other reports of regressive Bigfoot encounters

have been coming out of the same area for at least $150. 50 years. Now, he claimed that he had seen Bigfoot, but beyond that, he related the following story. And I would have just written this story off as an utter hogwash, a tall tail, if it weren't for certain details that, again, start fitting into this pattern of, you know, what we're talking about with the mountain giants. This is near the end of the week. He had a logging crew that was finishing up in one area and making ready to move into another

new area, one which had never been logged before, urgent forest. they had therefore sent in a cat to bulldoze a road into the area, along with small crew to help. And by Friday afternoon, they had a road into the site and had some of their equipment there, two trucks, number of chains, several barrels of fuel, and the other kind of miscellaneous logging equipment that you expect from an operation like that. Now, on the crew returned Monday morning, they were in for a wee bit of a surprise, or major shock might be. There were no new tire tracks on the road going in, so they know that nobody drove in there. I mean, anything that walks across is going to leave a track. It's going to be obvious.

No vehicles got in or not. So considering the distance in, they pretty much could rule out human pranksters. When they arrived at the site, they first noticed that something had happened to a crane had dropped a wrecking ball, repeated beyond each one. One was on the ground, the suspension having given out, during the matter of the matter of, massive impacts delivered by the mystery vandal. There's a huge chain, a heavy logging chain, which had been holding all the chainsaws together to a tree. It had been snapped. None of the chainsaws were missing.

Each one of them was found. Each one of this blade wrapped around smaller trees in the area. All the fuel drums have been hurled down a ravine. Finally, there was a very obvious trail of destruction leading away from the area, which, according to him, and I quote, looked like a tank went through it, unquote. There were no signs of, of the vehicle having been there. Now, as was shocked and frightened, men observed this trail of destruction

and everything else that they were noticing around there, they noticed that on that trail of destruction there were monstrous tracks. They were nearly three feet long and clearly displayed only four toes on each print. The logger, having gotten the message, decided to keep quiet about it and wisely abandoned the site

moving under the next parcel they were allowed to log and going never to return to that area. But, yeah. What the hell could do? Could Bigfoot do that? I don't think we're going to the Bigfoot could even do that. You know, and it, once again, these giant tracks or toes, very aggressive behavior,

middle of nowhere in the mountains, fits all the other parameters of what we're talking about. The only thing we didn't get was a physical sight of it. That's absolutely terrifying. Do you notice with these mountain giant reports that it's always four toes? It's always four toes, yeah. And as a matter of fact, we've got some old ones that people have been trying to attribute, beat the Bigfoot for a while now that if you look at the original versions of them, you would find out that the actual description is in there. You just have to dig far enough to find it.

And they are talking about something with four toes. But the Opie-Finope incident, the man mountain of the Oki-Finoki Swamp, this is a famous one. There's two men in a boy. They went scouting in the swamp in an unusually dry year. And this is actually an understatement. It had been drive for like three or four years. The level of the swamp was way down. They figured this would be a great time to go in and map it because they've never been able to get into the interior of it. And they were in there for several days and encountered 18 by 9 inch tracks. First of all, huge tracks. Secondly, note what we were talking about last week, the 100-cent rule. The track is going to be 50% as wide as the entire length of it. So 99 is 18.

It's 18 inches by not. So that fits with stride. It was a triptial over six feet. Again, that's a little bit on the big side for a big foot track. Could still be a big foot. However, these tracks, according to the description, actually had four toes. So again, you're talking about something a little bit different. Now, these people that found these tracks were so scared by the whole thing

that they just went back out again and told their buddies, hey, we found tracks with something really weird in there, and we decided to get out. So a bunch of stout lads armed of the teeth with muskets, pistols, and sabres, party nine men decided that they would

go in and find the monster. And they were in there for a better part of a couple of weeks from what I understand. They found the track line again that had been described to them and they back-trailed it. And they figured they were coming closer up

on where it was at at the point where they decided to make camp. And I guess a couple of them were messing around in their guns. and fired a couple rounds or something. And at that point, it came bursting out of the woods and attacked them. Five of the nine men died in the battle with it. They had their heads ripped off their bodies.

Seven musket shots took the monster down. Lying dead on the ground, it was measured and found to be 13 feet tall. Again, four toes, gigantic size, extremely aggressive. Now, this to me looks like a report of a mountain giant, not the big foot that has been attributed to for the years, practically. I'll go longer than that. But, you know, there's a good example right there.

You start looking at some of these, especially really aggressive Bigfoot encounters, and you start coming up with some really strange stuff. It is interesting. You know, a lot of these old reports of Sasquatch, you do get a lot of aggressive reports. Generally, there's something initiated by it. Someone doesn't leave an area. They get stuff thrown at them. They stay there night after night after night.

And then something happens. Or they shoot at it and something. happens. But there's a lot of old reports to where just out of the blue something sets the saying off. And I'm with you, I mean, sometimes you read some of those old reports and you're like, are they talking about Sasquatch? They're talking

about something else? Like, you get lost on what they're talking about because it kind of fits Sasquatch, but it kind of doesn't in some of the details. And that's part of what you have to really look at, I think, is the details. You know, did they get a look at the face? Did they describe it?

How many toll did it have? What was it don't like, you know, things like that. And you can start winnowing away the Bigfoot reports from the Mountain Giant reports, you know, and it's not like I'm a fan of Bigfoot or anything, but I would rather not blame Bigfoot for something that maybe somebody else is doing. Yeah, and one of the questions one of the listeners had was, do you think these things are human or do you think they are animal? Just your personal opinion? My personal opinion, they're probably closer to being humans than any of the other sub-varieties a Bigfoot are just the tool used and the occasional sightings of them.

Make-shaped clothing would seem to point in that direction. Plus, you know, having the wearer with all the layers that nobody else is going to be able to find, you know, Bigfoot maybe using caves and stuff, entrance to the boulder, so nobody notices it or anything like that. Maybe they're doing it, but I just haven't seen the reports of it. And I would tend to agree with you. That's where I was lost on some of the old reports, especially with some of the Native Americans,

when they talk about these mountain giants, They'll say there were people. They're a tribe of people that are just giant, and they're cannibalistic, and they're monsters. And sometimes you talk to Native Americans, when they talk about Sasquatch, they'll talk about it as being an animal, not necessarily a person. And I think that's sometimes where, and I could be wrong, but sometimes when you read these old reports, are the natives talking about Sasquatch being a person? Or are they talking about being an animal? and then you read these mountain giant reports that they're talking about, and they're describing them as gigantic cannibalistic people.

Yeah. Yeah, that's sort of disconcerting, too, because you can almost understand if these things are animals, occasionally the humans, maybe they just don't know any better, but they have more of an attribute of sentient intelligence along the lines of the way we think of it for them than any of the other subspecies or any of the legions that go along with them. So it's, you know, it's really disconcerting.

It's like, well, the smarter they are, the more dangerous they are, and the more aggressive they are. This is just not really a good thing. So, again, you know, you can't fit these things into the box of Bigfoot, you know, thinking that, well, there's a certain way that Bigfoot ax and there's a certain way they haunts and da-da-da-da-da. We don't know dutely about these things. We don't know how they hunt.

We don't know what level of technology they have or communication or anything. There's just so little information available on them. We barely even know that they exist. I mean, you know, we're doing the best he can to gather information on them, but for the time being, there's just not a whole lot known. And in the interest of information, let me give you guys some stats. Here's some tracks that have been. Cold Lake, Alberta, June 1976, 21 by 10 inches.

So, Kwame, Washington, January, 1976, 17 by 8 inches. Astoria, Oregon, December of 1977, 17 by 7.5 inches. Tracks up to 24 by 12 inches have been found at four toes of body-equal size on them. The Long Beach, California Independent of November 28, 1941 reported that Fort Douglas British Columbia was being terrorized by an enormous Sasquatch. Jimmy Douglas and his family, who cited the behemoth, claimed it was at least 14 feet tall. about twice as tall as a normal normalist member of a Sasquatch species. And again, keep in mind, here's the words, being terrorized.

It's not just hanging around the area, it's terrorizing people. In Newfoundland in 1890s, William Decker was hunting along the pistol at bay when a giant man-like creature charged him in a marsh. It took three shots to kill it, and the hair-covered body was measured at 12 feet, the outstretched arm span 14 feet, and Bill, estimated its weight at about a thousand pounds. He left where it fell. I was in a swamp. He was by himself. I was going to drag it out again.

And then some of these other ones, you have to be, you know, sort of careful. Like, a lot of people would immediately jump on and go, well, the Lefleur incident is probably mountain giants then, too, isn't it? No. I really think that was the genosal one. You know, again, it's not, it's not like a big foot, but it's not like a malt giant. It's that in-between territory where if you read enough of the reports of the same sort of critter, there's this. same sort of behavior.

You know, very reprehensible behavior. There's a reason that a lot of the natives describe them of having revolting habits because they had quite a variety of them, apparently. So, you know, there's some more examples right there. These things are found. There are stories about them. They're just rare enough that most people tend to overlook them, and it hasn't really been paid much attention to until fairly recently.

And part of the reason for this is because the contents of a lot of these old newspapers that was only available on microfiche is finally being put into a digital format so you could access a computer, which means a lot easier for researchers to go and look at all of these old reports and put up keywords like, Well, Man, Yahoo, giant, da-da-da-da-da-da-da and see what they come up with. And they're starting to find some of these old reports that had been completely forgotten. Nobody even knew that they were out there.

And it's happening day by day, month by month, more and more of these are being found, and more and more of it's being put up on the Internet. So it's making it easier actually for us to go through all this information and be able to find these reports that have got these similar details to them that match up to this sort of thing. In my mind, this seems very unnatural, doesn't it? I mean, does this seem like natural to you? No, it doesn't. It seems very, very odd. And, you know, some of the other attributes that are given to them, it's believable that there could be,

relic hominids from the ice age that are maybe closer related to the Pontchic great apes that might have even become carnivorous. That's fairly believable. That could happen. I could sum 20-foot-tall humanoids with tusks that, you know, are like carnivores but still use tools and it all seems just very, very strange. And if it wasn't for the really, you know, again, all of the reports we've got and the pictures that we've got of the tracks and whatnot, the collapse.

that yes, those things really are out there, I mean, my God, I wouldn't believe it for a second. You know, it's just so far-fetched and so weird. It doesn't seem to fit into what we know about natural science and natural selection. They could create a creature like that. Diana M. asked, hey, Duke, do you have any further information on the alleged mummified finger, Swiss archaeologist Gregor? I think it's Sapporo. of 1988 photo taken during the private trip to Egypt.

I don't know if you've seen that or not. Oh, I know what she's talking. Yes, I have seen that one. I know what she's talking about. No, I don't have any more information on that. That looks like a standard giant's finger, though, to me. And, you know, unless you've got some way to get in this sample of DNA test that to see that it's actually something real,

that's pretty much where you're going to have to leave it at this point. Yeah, and for the audience out there that have it, seen it. I'll post it under this episode, but basically it's a mummified finger. I think it's three times, was it three times or four times the size of a normal finger? Yeah, it's gigantic. I know that. I remember seeing the photograph of it too, and it looks like a standard mummified finger only just ridiculously big, way outside the limits of what a human figure could be. Russell S. asked, I just listened to Duke's interview again. It was a Bell Creek area in southeast Montana. It's been a few years since I've been out that way, but isn't that high prairie? I'm curious where a giant like that would hide out that way. Is there forest somewhere in that area? I lived in Montana for a number of years, twice actually, so I'm very interested in the topic in that location. Yeah, honestly, I don't think that it lived in that area.

I think they just caught him moving through the area, and he figured he could safely do it during the cover of a storm. Nobody would know, you know, what humans are going to be out wandering around at 2 o'clock in the morning during a thunderstorm, right? But, no, I don't think that they live in the area, and, you know, Belt Creek Canyon, Canyon, waterway. They follow waterways. So he was moving from point A to point B, from where to where, I don't know.

But that's my theory. I really don't see that being an area that they can live. Yeah, no, and I don't know the area that well. He's right. It is mostly like high plains, and it's just, you know, got some canyons cut through and whatnot. It's not amenable to any creature like that actually living in the area long-term on a regular basis for anything.

But it would make a great trackway for them to go from point A to point B, especially if they're doing it at night. The one from Idaho, How long ago did that encounter happen? January 29th, 1902. The story actually comes from the Dubuque Telegraph Herald, and it mentions that in the little town of Chesterfield, Idaho, an isolated area of Bannock County.

Someone there had encountered an eight-foot-tall-haired monster who gave them quite the fright. Okay, well, this sounds like a standard Bigfoot report. Eight-foot-tall-covered monster. People are scared. On January 14th, a monster appeared to a group of youngsters who were skating on the river, whether in an area shall be cleared of snow or if, in fact, the entire river was clear, but we're not told. What is reported, however, is that the creature was acting aggressively, brandishing a large club.

Aha, wait, there's a clue. Bigfoot doesn't brandish clubs. You throw sticks. Uttering a series of yells that started to attack the skaters. No, none of them have fired at it or anything. They're just out there skating. Well, skaters who are willing to having skates on, of course, used to dart quickly to their wagons and get safely away from the thing. Now, Bigfoot are not known to be aggressive in general,

although they certainly can't do when it calls for it. And they're definitely not known to go after a group of humans, maybe one lone person or maybe even two of a group. That's even more unusual. Okay, not to mention the wielding a large club. We already went into that. none of this behavior fits in with what's usually reported in big foot sightings, but all of it fits in with the violent behavior and tool use described as mountain giants

in the reports on. So what do you make of the B.C. 8 foot height then? Well, consider this now. A youngster of that species would be about that height and still green enough to think it could catch skating humans in a group and get away with it, a task at which it obviously failed measurably. The story then goes on to relate that upon their return, tracks were found. These tracks were 22 inches along and seven inches wide, and had four toes. Now, can you picture a creature eight foot tall with two foot long feet? No, it doesn't make sense. That's the

hominid equivalent of snowshoe hair. Try drawing that and see how silly it looks. But now wait, those tracks were not found at the sighting. They were found along the range to the west of the river. Now, my guess is that what happened is that Junior there broke the rules, chased some humans, and whether from anger or for fun, and mama or daddy showed up, heard the ruckus he was making, knew what the humans would likely do, and came to drag Junior away, leaving behind a very obvious and enormous four-toked tracks leader discovered. Yeah, and these reports are amazing because they're from different time periods, and you kind of get the same story from different time periods. that's what makes me stop and kind of look at this and go, well, maybe there's something to this. That's what got my attention in the first place, West, I started seeing enough of these things with the same kind of details

to go, well, just wait a minute now. This just doesn't sound like Bigfoot. And you go and you look at the names that the natives had for them, and we talked about this a couple times already, that some of the weird names for them just does not sound like describing a typical Bigfoot or even at Genosco or Wendigo or, you know, guggly, anything like that. They're too huge.

They're too aggressive. They've got different attributes, these tools. You know, they've got these underground layers that they can hide in and da-da-da-da-da. Right down the line, it's all so different from what you normally hear of the descriptions of, you know, stick man and basket one. You know, things like that from the northwest where the big footer are assumed to be shy, retiring and fairly neutral. And occasionally they'll buggy and steal your fish. But usually they want to leave you alone. want to be left alone.

These things are, no, you get anywhere near them. They try and kill you and eat you. You know, this is a completely different kind of critter that they're talking about. Frankly, thank God they're rare. There's been some other strange things that have been attributed to these things. I actually got someone to talk to someone who lives in an area where apparently there is one nearby. And he's seen it at one point. And he said that it could press for details.

And I said, what does blend mean? The person that got the report said he was, He didn't have the right words to describe what he had saw, and that was the closest thing he could come up with. And then I thought of the reports of Bigfoot being able to cloak. And whenever I hear the word cloak, I think, like a Romulan cloak, you can just like turn invisible. How can something like that be happening?

But then you hear the word blend, and it starts making you think of something, maybe along the lines of camouflage. Or right about the same time that I got this information, I got information for a completely different course, where they had found that they couldn't figure out what the origin was. It didn't match with any animals that they knew. And as usual, with the Bigfoot-type hairs, it didn't have enough of a follicle to be able to do.

And it had one really unusual property. If you looked at it at a distance, it looked like it was gray. But if you put it up next to something with a color, it would actually pick up that color and reflect it. So if you put it next to a green tree, it would look green. If you put an extra brown dirt, it would look brown. Now, is this what he was talking about when he was saying blending? Maybe these things have this sort of semi-transparent hair, and you can pick up the color or whatever it is that they're standing next to.

And, you know, let's face it, when you're out in the woods, you're not looking for a 15-to-20-foot-tall hominidate. Your brain is not programmed to look for something like that. All these things really have to do is stand still next to a tree, and we're just going to walk right past not even notice them. How often do people look up? I mean, our eyesight is going to be like their knee level. You know, they stand still.

All we see is a couple of tree trunks. And the other thing about reports of these things, there may be more people that have seen these things than we actually realize and just have not reported it. Because if you see, you know, with all the media exposure at this point, if you see some hairy thing that's eight feet tall, run across the road in the middle of the night when you're on your way home, you might actually tell some of your friends.

You might eventually decide that you're going to tell somebody about this because you've heard a big foot, and maybe this is one of those bigfoot things that people are talking about. But you see some 15-foot-tall monster with tusks go running across the road in front of you in the middle of the night. Who are you going to tell about it? No, you're absolutely right. And the few reports have taken of something that's outside of the range of Sasquatch or the normal range, none of those people wanted to come on the air. They were like, hey, look, I don't know what it was.

And you're right, because Sasquatch is starting to become more acceptable. More and more people have seen them, but I think there would be a higher ridicule factor. If someone said, hey, I was up in Alaska and I saw an 18-foot-tall thing with tusks, most people are going to blow you off and just say, well, you were smoking or you were drinking, you were, you know, kind of what they used to do to people to sell Sasquatch. I wanted to ask you, what are the things with the hair? Where did they find the hair? I honestly don't remember.

I have to go back and dig up that information, but I can come up with it for you if you're really, interested in that. I got it from another one of my Bigfoot friends who had actually seen their part and was telling me about it. And that's where I put two and two together and hopefully came up with something at my approximate. Well, I'm kind of glad you brought that up, because I did read something like that a while back, and I thought, hmm, that's interesting. It was something, exactly how you described the hair. They said it was kind of a clear hair, and when you put it up next to something, it takes on that color of whatever it is, which is strange, and it might explain the cloaking. So, you know, not,

I don't think everyone's lying about the cloaking things. People either they're running into demonic entities or they're running into something. And when they talk about this, you know, everyone seems to have the answer. Well, Sasquatch and cloak, well, you know what? Maybe you ran into something else. Yeah. With regard to the... Or go ahead.

Well, I was going to say there's definitely that where, you know, you've got misidentification or... And I leaned toward this one in quite a few reports, where I don't think it's Bigfoot or any of the surprise that you saw. I think it was something else trying to make you think you saw Bigfoot. You know, for whatever, you know, getting giggles out of the silly humans falling for it,

whatever it is that they're trying to do. You know, I really think that there are some entities out there that get their jollies out of pranking humans or terrifying them. And they're more than willing to, you know, pick your brand and go, ah, you believe in Bigfoot, I'll make myself look like a Bigfoot. Or a dogman, a werewolf, you know,

whatever they think is going to get the most of a reaction out of you. You know, when I was talking to Rocky Elmore, he was telling me about one night, and everyone has listened to the show knows the story, but they were out up in the hills of Ote Mountain, and they came across this airman, and he said it was an airman from like 1940. The uniform looked like he was, I actually think it was during the day, Rocky said he saw it.

And he was wondering what the, this guy's doing out here. And so as they're pulling up, it's obviously not an illegal alien, but it's an, it looked like an airman from the 40s. And as they pulled up to this guy, Rocky stops the truck, and he's going to get out and ask the guy if he needs help or, you know, what's he doing up here? And he said the airman turned back and looked at him and smiled, this real creepy smile. And then he was gone. He just vanished. And I said, well, was it like a ghost?

Did you see when you originally say? He goes, no, it was very much like a flesh and blood man walking. And he goes, there was two of us, two Border Patrol agents. We both saw this guy. And he turns and he gives me this creepy grin and then he's gone. He goes, I don't know what to make of it. I guess he did some research later. And I guess a plane had gone down back in the 40s and a bunch of airmen died out there.

But you're right. I mean, you can run into, you start seeing weird. stuff and I'm not saying I have all the answers because I believe me I don't. But there is... Let me go on the record as saying that. I am not an expert. I do not have all the answers. Anybody that tells you they're an expert on Bigfoot is lying.

There's no such thing. Yeah. No, I... And it's just one of those things to where, you know, when people say the weird stuff they run into, I'm always quick to caution them. Well, you know what? That might be something else that you're seeing. That might be a different entity.

you don't want to mess with, because things just don't vanish. Things just don't disappear. And everyone says, well, we don't know anything about quantum physics. Well, you know what? I doubt that's quantum physics. Actually, we do know quite a bit about it. We just, we're not super expert, but we know quite a bit about it. And there's, you know, anything, the uncertainty principle says anything is possible.

However, there's a lot of things that are incredibly unlikely, and they're probably never going to happen with him. our lifetimes and some of them not even in the lifetime of our universe. So, you know, let's just throw that red herring out the window to start with. That's just kind of a cop-out right there. And some of the other stuff that people attribute to Bigfoot is having powers or anything, you know, like, well, it's, you know, there you see these swamp lights, the will of the whips, the orbs and stuff around the same areas as Bigfoot.

How do you know that is anything to do with Bigfoot? Maybe Bigfoot's looking at them like we are going, what the hell are those things? I'm out of here. You know, you don't know. You don't know that that has anything to do with Bigfoot. Another one that you get is, well, Bigfoot can float. I got in an argument with somebody here a couple weeks ago about that. And it's, you know, like when they were trying to say basically Bigfoot could levitate.

I'm like, dude, if Bigfoot can levitate, how is it that we have any casts of any footprints from any Bigfoot ever? Because why would they leave track if they could just levitate? Okay. Well, I've seen it floating through the forest before. Well, are you describing the way they walk, which looks like somebody that's cross-counter? country skiing because their head doesn't bob up and down. Is that what you mean by floating?

Because then you're correct. They look like they're floating. Are they actually floating? No. So you have to be careful of the descriptions you're getting from people because sometimes their English is just inelegant. And they're using a wrong word to try and describe what it is that they're trying to say. But at other times, they're simply letting themselves be misled by their misperception

of what's actually going on. Not a fan of the flute players out there to folks. Sorry about that. and just don't buy the Bigfoot out of the portals and shift into other dimensions and turn invisible and read your mind

and fly to the moon and come back with a unicorn and I don't believe any of it so I wouldn't even believe in Bigfoot so there you go I'm a horrible, horrible skeptic sorry about that folks no I'm with you on that

you know sometimes you have to with like the portal thing you know it's like well how do you know it was a portal like are you an expert on portals I mean if when someone says hey, I saw a light, and this is what... I remember I took a report one time from a...

It was people who claimed it was a dog man. But before seeing the dog man, they saw a light flash out of the forest. And they don't know what the light was. They can't describe what it was. But it happened right before. It could have been something completely separate. And it's easier to talk to someone when they just describe what they saw. Don't tell me that it was a portal,

because you don't know what a portal. What is a portal? You know, is it to other dimensions, or now you're an expert on portals? But, you know, a lot of these more legitimate people that will tell you things will say, well, I don't know what it was. It was a light of some sort, like the orb thing. I got more emails about orbs than I ever wanted in my life. And I just mentioned it one time on the show. I can tell you exactly how long I talked about it.

I talked about it for a minute, 27 seconds. And you know that? how long that was why west well I was shocked I was completely shocked I mean I got so many people that listen to the show where they're like hey I've never seen a Sasquatch but that orb thing you mentioned that ball of light I've seen that and I have no explanation for it but I've seen that and I mean people just came out of the woodwork and I you know I didn't really know much about orbs I've never seen one and I was just blown away by how many people it's kind of like the one kid in class, you know, I mention it for a moment.

And all of a sudden everyone is like, oh, yeah, you know what, I've seen that too. And one of the things I wanted to talk to you about, well, let me ask you this, was there more information on the mountain giants before I move on to this other topic? Well, one thing that I think that we should bring up that bears mentioning is that one of the ways that you can differentiate them from the, quote, unquote, normal giants. and in this case, let's say red hair giants, they've got body hair that covers all of them. That's one way that you can tell

that they're different. We've already mentioned several other ones. Now, I don't know if this is true in the reports that you got West, but the ones that I've got where it's actually mentioned, they not only have the Boralike tusks coming out of their lower jaw,

but they also have claws on their hands and feet, just like the description of the Wendigo. I'm trying to remember that report I took. I think he did say it had clause. It was a while back I took that report. But again, I didn't know what to do with it at that point. But I think he did mention it had claws.

Yeah, that's one of those things. You get a report with all these weird attributes to it. And you just like, this is so far out. There's just no way. Come on, man. And then he's right into another one that's like for a hundred years ago on the other side of the country. And they're talking about the same exact thing. You're like, well, wait a minute. What's going on here? These two people are making up the same crazy story, 100 years apart. was that possible? And then you start finding more of them and more of and more of them. It's, you know, it's beyond the point where there's a reasonable expectation that we're really talking about a real critter here.

I mean, you know, tracks don't lie. You something made him. If it was a hoaxer or a hoaxer made him, it was an actual animal and animal made him. Something makes tracts. And when you've got tracks that look really, really real and they've only got four toes on them, what hoaxer is going to go out and make four-toe tracks? Seriously, think about it. Who the hell knows that there are four-toe tracks?

Now, you guys know, but until very recently, very few people. So it's not something a hoax who's going to set out to go, I'm going to make four-toe big-foot tracks, do-da-da-da-da-da. No, you're going to make five-toeat big-foot tracks like everybody else makes, and you're going to think that's what big-foot speed look like, because that's what you do look like. They have five-toes.

Why are you going to make four-toe tracks? Yeah, and again, the guys, the reports have taken about with these mountain giants, I didn't get a sense from any of these people. They were lying about what they saw. I mean, I just didn't know what to do with the information. You know, I took it, and I was like, well, I believe this. I believe them. I think they saw something.

Do you think that the Boggy Creek monster, I believe, had four-toed tracks? Do you think that was just a Sasquatch that was inbred? Or do you think it was related to these mountain giants, like a juvenile? Yeah, I'd have to look into that one more. It was actually unaware that it was a four-toed track. I'd heard about the three-toed tracks on the one swamp monster that they had down there with Houston. And, yeah, I've heard reports of those, you know, three-and-four-toed tracks being found down there. It's possible, you know, it's certainly possible if they're in an area that's very built up and has very many humans in it, really unlikely.

They would need to be out in an area where it's really, really deserted. For animals that big, they need to have a really large area in order to feed them. themselves and they wouldn't want to be around anywhere and they could potentially be running into humans or be spotted by them so you can pretty much eliminate the ones that are anywhere near civilized areas you know and on this the subject of polytactylism they're really inbreeding will cause multiple toes not less toes so for people that think that three-toed and four-toed big puts were a result of inbreeding that is absolutely genetically backwards if you breed too much, you will get more toes and fingers rather than less.

I'm kind of glad you brought that up, because you're right. You actually get more digits, more digits, not less, with imbreeding. And you can see a lot of that online. I wanted to ask you about the different types of Sasquatch. And I want to run this past, past you. I've never talked about this on the air. Here we go. Okay. You know where I'm going, Duke. You and I've talked talked about it off the air. And it's always, this has always bothered me. I don't know if it's misinformation that I'm being given or if it's legitimate information. But just like the mountain giants, just like Sasquatch, sometimes when you're given information,

there's stuff I've been told in the past by people in the military and whatnot. And I've always just kind of put it on the shelf like, well, that's interesting, but I don't know what you want me to do with that. And I've, you know, with these different types of Sasquatch, do you think it's a genetically altered DNA splicing that's going on with the military? And I'll go into it more in a moment, but I wanted to get your take. Do you think these different types are DNA manipulation and it's just kind of a freak show that's being created out there? I've heard those rumors too and I've probably heard some of the same things that you've heard West

and my take on the whole thing is if the military with their technology is doing this. No question with the technology we've got nowadays if you give them enough budget they can create almost anything across a plant with an animal or you can make a, like we were talking about you can make a goat give milk that's got

strong body armor out of it and by putting one of the genes that it's milk produces spider pet. So, I mean, you could do genetically all sorts of weird things. Now, but all the types of bigfoot, the sub varieties that have been described and that are being seen by people all fall in the categories of things that have been named by the local Indian tribes living those areas, and for hundreds of years. So if the government was creating these, you know, DNA monsters, how did they send them back in time? because these things have been spotted for way before there was even white men here

and they just seemed to be indigenous to the area. You know, were they created? Are they synthetic beings? Well, if they are, they weren't created by our science. Let's put it that way. Unless at some point in the past, we had a tech level equivalent to what we have right now and a giant disaster, Atlanta sinking,

you know, glaciation, whatever you want to ascribe it to, wiped all the technology out, and then we had to start it scratch and then build everything back up again. Then I could see it as being excused for where these things came from.

But current technology, making them, okay, well, then why were they around hundreds of years ago? If they are making monsters like that, now they're being, they're being extremely vigilant about keeping a lid on it,

because they're not getting loose where anybody could spot one of them and go, hey, I saw this thing and it's not a big foot and it looked like this, which again, we'd probably file into the wacky reports that don't make any sense. But at some point, we'd look at it and go, well, what was it they were trying to describe here? This doesn't fit in with anything else we're seeing. And, you know, honestly, Wes, it's been a while since I've encountered anything that's even remotely Bigfoot related, and I can't stick into one of the sub-variety categories that I know of at this point. So, you know, unless there is good evidence that some other, you know, intelligent beings who had some interest in doing something like this, or we ourselves did it at some unguessly law in the past before our technology crumbled, our civilization fell, and then we had to start all over again.

I don't see how they could have done it. Yeah, and that's always been my argument with it. You know, I've talked to, and for people who glazed over what Duke just said there, look up that goat. that was the DNA was mixed with the spider. It's pretty disturbing to watch online. So if you get a chance to check that out, you can YouTube it and see exactly what Duke mentioned. But, you know, I've talked to, this goes back about a year and a half ago, or maybe two years ago. I talked to a special forces guy one time, and you always get a little bit of information from, while he claimed to be special forces.

And I think he was. One of the things I can tell you about people in the military, I never served. But one of the things I can tell you from talking to people in the military is they talk in acronyms. And it's almost like another language. And unless you know what acronym they're talking about, you have no clue. It's almost like Spanish. And he was on one of these kill teams. And he was describing to me how they killed them.

And I said, well, is it an area that you guys are going into because of, these creatures are killing people? Is it? And he's like, well, no. We kill him in the field. He's like, there's a scientist. And he went through and explained to me the whole thing. And he basically said that when we kill them,

we'll take certain organs out right there in the field, and then we'll airlift him out. And I said, well, where are they taking them to? And he said, I don't know. That's not my job. My job is to, I'm the trigger man. I shoot him. and he kind of explained it.

You know, again, I've never served. He said, you know, in the military, each person has their own little job, and you don't really, unless you need to know they're not going to tell you. So he didn't know where they were airlifting them out. But one of the things that was interesting when him and I talked, because I had a hard time buying into the dog man thing. And he said, when people tell you about the dog man, they're not lying to you. They're absolutely a creation.

of he said they were a genetically altered creation that is out there that was it was created by us it goes back to weaponizing these things and but he didn't really he didn't have a ton of information so i just put it on the that's interesting shelf and left it there and i've never said anything on the air about it well i talked to about a year after that i talked to another person who claimed to be in the military and they were telling us telling me about they were more on the other side of it, not the kill team, but more on the other side of it. And he said, you know, Wes, you're right about a lot of things, but you're wrong on a lot of things. And I said, well, what do you mean? And this person said that, I'm trying to think how to say this, he said these things aren't people and they're not really animals. And I said, well, what do you mean? And he said, well, the original ones weren't created by, they aren't natural, or if you want to say by God, but they're not natural. And the original ones weren't created by man.

And I said, what do you mean by that? He said, well, I'm going to leave it at that. He said a lot of these subspecies that people are seeing, they are absolutely a genetic creation. And he's, you know, he shared all kinds of information. like they have three different vocal cords, and one of the vocal cords is a human vocal cord. But he said that anyone that gets DNA, any geneticist that's worth their weight, that runs DNA on these things, they won't be able to make heads or tails of it. It'll make no sense when they run the DNA.

He said, you'll get Neanderthal DNA, you'll get human DNA, and you'll get about three different primates in a lot of these species. And he said, let me ask you something. Do you really think the lumber industry has that powerful of lobbyists to keep Sasquatch under wraps? Do you think the government really cares for one moment that these things come out? It would just crush the lumber industry because do you really believe that? And, you know, it kind of made me stop and think about some things, especially with this being covered up. But he said, once you open this, once you open this subject, it opens Pandora. box.

Yeah. And there's a lot of other things that will come out that are tied to this. And they don't want us to know about it, and that's for sure. Well, and he gave me all sorts of information, and I've heard this about three times with different lights that you use to stop them. He said red lights don't bother them. Blue and green lights bother them. And I've heard this about three or four times from people claiming to be in the

know. But they share a lot of information with me. And, you know, I look at it and I'm like, is this disinformation? Are they wanting me to go on air and talk about this? So I look like a fool, or is this real information? And I'm not subscribing to any of this for people listening. I'm just letting you know some of the information that I've never shared before. You know, one of the things I asked about a year ago, I talked to a guy that was part of the kill teams. And I asked him, well, how do you bring him in? I said, what do you guys go out there? do calls. I mean, how do you guys actually bring these things in when you're not tracking them down? And he talked about this weapon that they use, and it's a frequency weapon. And there's

a certain hurts that you use, and it drives these things crazy. And they'll come in, and then they'll, the controller will shoot them. But he, I mean, he used different terms, different phrases. And I just wanted to get your opinion on it. Again, I've never shared it on air, but I've gotten so much information from several sources. And they all are kind of saying the same thing. I mean, it's not like one guy's way out and left field. They're all kind of saying the same thing. And some of the DNA stuff they talk about, you know, he said, you know, this DNA and

genetic, genetics, he goes, do you think that's a creation from the 90s and we're just now figuring out in the 2000s? He goes, let me tell you something. That's been around for a long, long, long time. And they have it down to a science now. They can crossbreed just about anything with anything. You know, and that opens a whole other part, a horrible Pandora box, too, which is, if these things did have a synthetic origin and somebody in the past made them, they had the equivalent science to what we're talking about here. who was to say that some of these other mythological creatures weren't actually hideous genetic constructs,

and things like the hydras, a chimera, or a dragon, or, you know, God, think of any mythological weird critter. Can you make it with genetic science? Well, virtually, the answer is yes and almost all of them. You know, so the thing that I like to think of when I get to sort of information is that it may or may not be true, How do you vet something like this? Other than somebody else who is in the know in the same position that could verify this information, and anybody that's in that position is by virtue of being in that position

not supposed to be given you the decision. So how can you trust that the information that you're getting is actually accurate? Regardless of the fact that you've got multiple people telling you the same thing because if this is a counterintelligence op, they're going to have multiple people telling you the same thing to make it more believable. So it may even be true. true, but how do we vet something like that to actually determine if it is or not? And that's my biggest problem.

That's why I've never said anything on the air, because I can say this all day long on the air. Well, I talk to this guy, I talked to that guy, I talked to, but I haven't, you're right, there's no way to vet it. There's no way to. One of the things that makes me think some of it might be true, you hear so many unnatural things. Is that a guy on Friday, a gentleman who they were spotlighting in Texas? He said this thing stood up and it took off running and it ran about 40 miles an hour. Now, I don't know too many things that can get up and run on uneven ground at 40 miles an hour.

I'm starting to feel like it's more and more unnatural in the sense of some of the things that they do, like running at 40 miles an hour. You know, I mean, with these things, I don't know, apes can't run at 40 miles in it. And so you hear some of the stuff, and I don't know. Well, wait now. Let's think about this for a minute. How fast can a human run? What's the top speed for a human? Do you know that right off the top of your head?

Well, me, it's about two miles an hour. Well, me, it's considerably less than that. So if you ever have to run from Bigfoot, make sure I'm around, because you won't have to run very fast in order to get away. but if you take the, you know, let's not even say an Olympic, you know, just your average person. Can your average person, if they happen to really hard-pressed, can they run at, say, like, 20 miles an hour for a short distance? Probably not, you know. Maybe they can run, well, 10 is pretty slow.

That's pretty easy to do. 15 miles an hour. So if you've got somebody that's really, really athletic, maybe they can do 20 miles an hour. Now, if you make them twice as tall, they're taking twice as long a stride each step. Maybe they can run 40 miles an hour. Yeah, that makes sense. I'll buy into that. I'm not saying it's the actual answer and that it's true,

but I'm just, you know, I'm throwing other things out there. I give you other things to, you know, just to think about. Because any time you get one of these weird things to think about, you should try and think of every single option you can possibly think of that could fit into the parameters of what it is that you're hearing, that might be able to explain it. And some of them you'll be able to use Occam's Razor and go, this is just so far-fetched that it's really unlikely

and discard that silly idea. And usually it comes down to whatever makes the most sense. What's the most common-sense reason that you can come up for it being this way? It's generally the right answer. Yeah, and that's one problem I have with the big cover-up. Why is there such a big cover-up? You know, I've said in the past, if, you know, is this really that crazy of the subject?

If you don't believe me, you don't believe my encounter, that's fine. Would you like to hear a judge tell you his encounter? Would you like to hear a doctor tell you his encounter? I got several police officers that'll tell you their encounter. I got people in the military, I'll tell you their encounter. Why the big cover-up on this saying, you know, and one of the things one of the guys said to me, he goes, I know you and your brother really want to shoot one, take its head off. He goes, you'll never make it down to the media.

If you think that we actually live in a free country and the media is not controlled by the government, he goes, I've got another thing to tell you, it'll never happen. It just won't happen. And he, you know, according to him, these things have been shot several times by hunters, have been shot several times, not people in the military, but actually have been shot. And so, you know, you're right, man. I don't want to go too far down the rabbit hole with this. I just wanted to share, I guess, with the audience and with you,

some of the things that have been shared with me that I've never talked about on air. And again, I'm not subscribing to it, but I guess take it for what it is. Take it for what you want it to be. You know, it's odd. Well, in a program where our main subject to conversation is, you know, 18 foot tall, 6,000-pound carnivorous behemus,

I think we could talk about just about any possibility and they didn't see right in the same ballpark with it. I mean, you know, some of this stuff is just so far out there until you really do a bunch of research on it. It's so hard to believe it could even be true. And, you know, when you find enough evidence to start believing it is true, frankly, it's just frightening as hell. I don't like to be in a world where there's mountain giants running around out in the middle of nowhere,

and you have to worry about those damn things if you're out there. that, you know, not really digging that idea. When I was at the Coloma, where those tracks were four-day for a day for a summer, you know, we had something respond to the tree knocks that I did that came up and shipped my tent. And, you know, was it a big foot or was it a mountain giant? Well, I didn't get out of the tent to find out. But it, you know, could have easily been either one.

You know, suffice to say that that was probably not some lone rancher on top of the mountain in the middle of the night. Figured that he was going to play a prank on the two people that were camped right in between the ghost town and the Indian burial ground. I tend to agree with you on that. A person doesn't make sense in a lot of those situations. You know, people get shot that, doing that kind of stuff in the middle of the night coming up in the middle.

Yeah, especially in Montana, everybody's got a gun, and everybody will shoot first and ask questions later. I shouldn't say everybody, but the vast majority, there's, you know, there's grizzly birds and mountain lines of stuff. People can't mess around here and have a reasonable expectations. of safety when in doubt they shoot. Well, going back to the Indian reservation that you mentioned, it's the other thing that I've been told,

the same, well, if you subscribe to the conspiracy theorists, I just mentioned, one of the things he said was, why do you think there's so many sightings around Native American reservations, the Indian reservations? Most people think the Indians are crazy. and so what a better way to unleash these things around those communities because, you know, they got a story for everything and most people think Indians are just nut jobs anyway.

I'm not saying that I do, so the Native Americans listening, please don't take offense to that. But he was saying, what a better way to unleash these things and around the reservations? Because most people won't believe what the natives have to say about these things. Well, you could have the same sort of an attitude about the south of Kentucky or Tennessee or something where it's like, well, who sees Bigfoot down there?

Well, just those crazy hillbillies and moonshiders, you know, pardon me, folks, I don't mean to that, but that would be what somebody would say, you know, it's those. So if hillbillies out the middle of nowhere that are making up the Bigfoot stories, know those Hillbillies out the middle of nowhere are living next to Bigfoot, that's why they're seeing him, because they're in the middle of nowhere. They're not making up stories. They're trying to describe you what it is this bothering that. that lives from the area where they're living.

Yeah, you're absolutely right. You're absolutely right. And it's like anything else you want to find out about weird things out in the forest. We'll go talk to a hunter, go talk to those quote-unquote hillbillies, go talk to the Native Americans. Those are the people out there all the time that run into weird things. Exactly. Exactly.

And, you know, to give them their just do, the Native Americans are my go-to guys. When I want to look and see if something's actually real, and if it's been around for a long time, I go look at their legends and words first. Because if it has been around the long time and it really is a real thing, they knew about it, they've got a name for it,

they've got stories about it. If they haven't mentioned anything about it, it's either a misidentification, hoax, lie, or some recent construct like we were just talking about. People always say, they used to say to me, well, you know,

they'll never share anything with the white, quote-unquote white man, baloney, you go ask them, don't be a dick, go ask them, and they'll tell you stuff. They'll tell you what they know. I've never come across a Native American that wasn't willing to share information, and as long as you're approached it a certain way, they'll share with you what they've seen or what they know about a certain topic. And a lot of times they'll tell you, too, if they think it's more of legends and stories or if it was something real.

You just have to ask them, and they'll tell you. Yeah, that's it. And, you know, part of the reason why they just go around the offering, this information is because they've had, they've been the butts with so much ridicule from the supposedly educated Western white man society, giving them a hard time, oh, that can't be real, oh, those things don't really exist, oh, that's just some savage superstition. No, these people lived here way before we did. They know what the heck is a little bit around here, and, you know, they're very well acquainted with it and what its behaviors are. It's a real thing.

They know about it. And you're right, Wes, all you've got to do is just, you know, ask them in a non-ridiculing way, you know, like I'm not here to pick on you or anything. I saw something, and have you guys ever seen anything like this? You know, and they'll come right out if they've seen anything like that, they'll tell you. And if they haven't, they'll go, well, my cousin saw, you know, he found a track over here, you know, somebody that I know saw this or something like that. And I've talked to a couple of natives just out of the blue that I just ran into on the street corridor and brought up, you know, something that I had.

seen in the woods and one of them actually had three encounters. One when he was a kid and two, he was out hunting. And just around the local area here, you know, and you don't find that stuff out unless you actually go ask them something. So they're not going to volunteer that information. They're sick and tired of being ridiculed. Yeah, it's a shame. Like I said, in the last show you and I did Duke, that this world is a lot stranger

and a lot crazier than I think most people realize. Like I said, before you get up, you go to work, you work your Monday through Friday, spend time with the family, do whatever on the weekend. And when he actually start looking into some of this stuff, there really is something to it. There really is something, not everyone's lying, you know, in a lot of this stuff. And I think if we actually knew the truth about all the strange legends and stories,

and I think people would be terrified. I think they'd be completely terrified. Well, I totally agree with you, because frankly, I'm terrified. And the more I learn about this, it isn't getting any more pleasant. It just seems to get scarier and scarier. So, again, like we were saying last week,

you know, you guys be careful what you asked for because you might just get it and you might not be too happy that you did. Yeah, you're absolutely right. One last question. I want to ask you about the mountain giants. Have you heard anything, anyone talk about the vocalizations? Was there any reports of them vocalizing?

Same exact thing. The windigo, loud, piercing, high-pitched piercing whistle that they use for hunting and communicating with each other. Well, it doesn't make me feel better. I was hoping he'd say no. Yeah, sorry about that. Unfortunately, yeah. So if you hear the whistle, it's potentially windigo or potentially a mountain giant. And again, you know, that brings up the thing.

Well, look, they're both using the same localization. They both got these, you know, pretty predatory-looking set of chomper's on them. They're both described as having claws on their feet and their hands. Are they perhaps related? Another possibility to think about it. Duke, I want to thank you for coming on the show. I really appreciate it. You know, the mountain giant encounters are fascinating to me,

and I don't know a whole lot about it. Like I said, I've only had a few people tell me little details about what they've seen. So I appreciate you coming back on. I know you're quickly becoming a fan favorite. The fans just really wanted to have you back. And I know you've had a long week, and I wanted to thank you again for taking the time to come on the show. Wes, it's always a pleasure being on your show.

Anytime you want me back or the fans pass to be enough to make you get me back again, I'll be happy to come back again. If you never need to ask me questions or anything, just get hold of me. I'm a fan of Sasquatch Chronicles, too. I've been listening to it since your little YouTube presence, and that was it, man. You know, so I've been along for this ride listening to what you've been up to, too, Wes, you know, and you've got one of the best broadcasts out there, so it's always an honor for me to be on here. Be more than happy to come back and do it again in the future if anybody wants me back again.

The honor was mine. Thank you, sir. All right, buddy. And that's it for tonight, everyone. Remember, if you've had an encounter, shoot me an email. Wes at Sasquatch Chronicles.com. And on Friday, I went out to visit Bob Gimlin at Hopswatch. I'm still working on that video. I'll be uploading that to the website.

For those of you who weren't able to be there, that should be up by tomorrow evening. Thanks for being here. Thanks for listening. Have a great night, everyone. Being across the country faster than the coronavirus and wagering week is your antidote. I'm Tom Barton, and I'm a veteran sports analyst.

and respected sports handicapper who helped build ESPN's brand. I've been recognized and awarded by Pro Football Weekly and Gaming Today magazine as the honest handicapper. Let the other guys give you the same old boring sports talk with the same tired storylines. We'll give it to you straight here every Friday on Wagering Week. Don't gamble with other podcasts. Let SportsGuard Network's Wagering Week help your bottom line.