Sasquatch Chronicles - SC EP:200 The 200th Show Part Two

Episode Date: March 14, 2016

Tonight researcher Brenda Harris stops by to say hi and talk about what is going on around the reservation in New Mexico. Brenda shares an encounter that happened on the reservation when two young men hit a small Sasquatch with their truck and the events that took place afterwards. Brenda also shares with us some recent encounters of Sasquatch looking in the windows of peoples homes and what she advises witnesses to do to make these creatures leave. I also welcome back Duke who stops by to share an encounter he has not shared before when he was younger with his cousin. My final guests tonight are the Bigfoot Outlaw, Coonbo, Bear and Matt. This will conclude my 200th show!

Five, five, four, four, three, three, two, one, one. When I had come down this hill, I had seen this creature cross the road. They would have ripped my locked door from my truck, extracted me from my vehicle, and there wasn't a damn thing I could have done about it. This thing I got to notice in its eyes. His eyes was real, real evil, real sinister with it. You know, the look it was given me. What would airport?

somebody out here. What's going on now, sir? That's son of a bitch is about six foot. Sir? Yes, I'm working right at him. Sasquatch Chronicle. Place where people share their encounters. Let's start the show. Welcome to the show, everyone. Thanks for being here tonight. I know this is episode 200, part two of the Big 200.

I guess it's technically episode 201, but who's counting. And tonight's going to be a big night. I got a lot of great researchers coming on. And normally I give researchers a hard. time. I think a lot of them are blowhards. So I do give researchers a hard time sometimes. But there are good ones out there. There's a lot of people I respect, even people I haven't had on the show, that I respect what they do. And tonight's three of my favorites. Last night you heard from

Bob Garrett. Tonight you're going to hear from the Bigfoot Outlaws. And the Bigfoot Outlaws have their own radio show called Bigfoot Outlaw Radio. Bear and Cumbow, Matt Map. You guys have heard them before on the show. And I'm also going to be welcoming Duke to the show. Back to the show. He's going to share a story he hasn't shared before. So look for that here in a moment. If you've had an encounter and you'd like to be on the show, shoot me an email. My email address is Wes at Sasquatch Chronicles.com.

And if you get a chance, please check out the website, Sasquatch Chronicles.com. Thank you so much for being here. Thank you guys for listening. It's an accomplishment for all of us. You, the listener, the past guests have had on the show, everyone, we're all in it together. So thank you guys so much for a great show and the success of the show. I really should be thinking, you guys. First up, I want to welcome Brenda Harris.

And Brenda's from the New Mexico area. She's been on past shows. She wanted to stop by, say hi, and share some things that have been going on on the reservation. One of the things I like about Brenda is Brenda spends her own time and money, and she'll go out and help people who are having troubles on the reservation and off the reservation, for that matter. But she's always willing to go out and help people. And it's been a while since I've spoken to her.

But Brenda, thank you for being on. I'm honored to have you on the 200 show. Oh, thank you. You're welcome. So it's awesome always to drop and say hello, you know. And hey, I've got to say congratulations on your 200. So that's really awesome for you guys. And you're really good in beginning out that way.

That's really cool. No, I appreciate that. And I know you were on, gosh, I think before we were actually even numbering the shows. So it was probably more like 220 shows ago or 230 shows ago. You were on. And I got to have you on more often. And I know last time I talked to you, which was so long ago, I was really impressed with you because you take the time to actually go and talk to witnesses.

and try and help them on the reservation, off the reservation, try to help them in difficult situations with these creatures. Has there been anything new going on around the reservation? Yes. There's been a lot of road crossings, you know, in different parts on the reservation and off the reservation. Also, this thing seems to be looking more into people's homes, through the windows.

And even I'm getting a lot more reports of, you know, peeking in the windows. And also with the doorknobs, you know, turning the doorknobs of the homes, front or the back doors. So, well, you know, they're really curious, you know, and a lot of the people are getting pretty, they're getting kind of scared, you know, and I've been sharing with them some of the things that they could do, you know, like you had mentioned, just a few minutes ago, we'll have, you know, things that they can do to try to prevent this thing from either walking into the home or busting through. You know, the matter of what we put under the door knobs, you know, as strong as these things are, they'll just bust the way through. You know, it's been to do a lot of that lately.

Also, dogs and cats are coming up missing some of the farm animals can as to because there's no harvest food. So right now they're going after animals. And so, you know, we begin, I've been in a lot of ports of that as well, and it's been yelling quite a bit in different areas on the reservation as well. I had just posted a video that's called Hull, like, yells. The teammate John Lee and I, it's been ready here now, and I thought I had deleted, you know, lost the vocalizations. And we're going through my recordings, I just find it, and finally got it together, and I posted it on YouTube. So that's how you all to take a listen to it. It's called Staticon.

It's called Halback Yeld. That's what that means. And we've got some works and some wood knocks and what sounds like drumbeats as well. So take a listen at that. And that's what we've been going on around here in our area. There's a lot of reports on the reservation out in the mountains. And that's what we've got going on out here. And that's not good.

When they're coming up to the windows, they're getting almost too familiar when they come up that way. I think that, you know, I realize that might be curiosity behavior. And some people may not look at that as a big deal, but God, if a grizzly bear had come up and it was really peeking in the windows and trying to figure out a way to get into your home, you'd probably have, you know, most people might have a different attitude. about it.

Oh, yeah. With these things, it worries me when they come up and they're looking in the windows and they shake the door handles. I mean, I've had several, you know this, Brenda, because you've talked to several eyewitnesses, and I've talked to several. When they do that, it's disheartening when they come up and shake the door handle like that. Because like you said, you know they can break through if they want to.

Are they just doing it to screw with the people? Are they obviously had seen humans do it several times, so they're trying to figure out to do it. It's disheartening, isn't it? I mean, I can't imagine, have you ever gone out to someone's home and they're happy about it? No, I, you know, I haven't, you know, as much I said yesterday, we went out on a little hike in an area, and I was talking to the young boy who was, you know, showing me some stuff, and we went to the back of his house, well, his girlfriend came along, tagged him on, and they were telling me that just last Wednesday that they were watching TV.

The girl was at night, and they had the front porch light on. She noticed something was looking in the window, and that really scared her. She was like, oh, my God, and, you know, the light from the porch, she said it's really really, you know, really bright, but she noticed this dark figure. I mean, it just blacked out that light, it was looking in the window. Boy, that really scared her. She said, And next thing you know, it was playing with the front door knob.

But that really, she said that she had got up and ran back to the bedroom and told for her boyfriend. And I said that really scared of things out there. So the young guy, he got a firecracker. And he lit and he threw it out. They said, they could hear that thing run off. And that's one of the things that I've been, you know, telling some of the people like, she, you know, don't want this thing around.

and it's doing that instead of shooting a gun because you have people that live close by you. There's some, here's some things that you guys could do that it may help, you know, to make this thing go away is let a firecracker and throw it outside. And it worked. He goes, oh, my God, because you were right, it worked. And another, his mom, as a matter of fact, a couple weeks ago, she was, she got up about three o'clock. the morning, and she's getting ready to go through her early, early morning walk about 4 o'clock in the morning. And she just went up to start the car, and she just happened to look down to do with a footprint.

I'm getting to do it to post this on YouTube, so look out for it. It's a footprint that she found out by her car. And also, she found a handprint on the back of a rear window of her car. then that really, you know, really spooked her. She's like, oh, my gosh. And they had noticed as well that this thing has been throwing pebbles, rocks, small rocks at the window. You know, that is something also that they'll do

to try and to get some attention for you to come out. And I don't, you know, come, hey, don't go out there. You know, that's just, it's basically like a trick. They want you out there. So there's one or two things you can do. He is, you know, several things you can do. And one of them, like I said, was a cracker, a firecracker. Throw that out there.

And that worked. I said also, if you have an alarm on your car, set that alarm off, because it'll just don't run, you know, because you're scared it. And she did that. And, you know, she did that, you know, that really worked. That really helped, you know, that, you know, she felt better. He said, just before you go out to start a car to warm, them, set that alarm off, let it, you know, go off on your car, you know, run off if it's still

around. You know, she shared a lot of stuff with me with what's been going on around their place. Like last summer, they have a corral, and it's, like, south to the corner of the house, and it's in the dark. This is one thing that is stress to the people is if I see their corral in the dark, you see they're going to go for the animals. So I come in to light it up. put as much light as you can around your corral, your lifestyle.

She said that someone that one of the sheep had come up, they went to go feed the sheep in the morning, you know, and when they went into look, they noticed one of the sheep, the head was your thought of its body. That's some of the things that, you know, were, I'm coming across out here with different people. A lot of the sheep were coming up missing as well. And he had shared that with me.

That was one thing I told her right away, get some light up because that was the first thing I noticed when I was driving into their plot. And some of the relatives didn't believe it. And I said, they're coming for animals. I said, and make sure you guys get some blind. And she had mentioned me that some of her relatives. And, of course, I didn't have any lighting around their animals instead of that they had some baby pigs. and I said, make sure you get light up because they're going to be going after. I said, guarantee you they're going to come back.

Well, guess what? Sure enough, just last week, it came in. It took one of the sheep. It came up missing. So I told them to make sure, you know, you hear something. Light a firecracker that scares them in the runoff, you know. It's just things like that that I try to share with the people different things, trying different things that will make them leave.

And that has helped a whole lot of people. So a lot of them are very thankful. You know, some of the things I've been for, and it really has helped them a lot. Yeah, and you do that. You do help out a lot of people. One thing I wanted to ask you, around the reservation,

how do people describe the creatures in your area? Do this describe them more human-like? Do they describe them more chimp-like, more ape-like. What is the main description you get out of the New Mexico area? It's like a mixture of what you just said. A lot of them say they've noticed that this thing drops down on all fours. And to them, it looks like a gorilla running on all fours.

A lot of them also say when they see them, they look human-like, face-wise. The body's all covered with hair, but the face kind of has a human feature to it. And some, you know, some say they look awful. You just don't want to look at their face. They look like a monster. There was one fellow that, the closest he could describe it to was that movie, what do you call that, Lord of the Rings, you know, how those early monster things are out there running. because I swear I've seen one the face looks just like that

because they've been pretty scary. Do you guys get a lot of Dogman reports out there? I've had a few of them. Yes, I have. I've out there in the, oh, what do you call it? In the Chiska Mountains out that way. I've heard some reports in that, different parts in the mountains.

I've also heard one out here probably in the area where I live. I'm going to say about maybe 15 miles to the south of where I live. They're seeing that they've seen something like that. Real big. You know, how high or any kind of triple four-by-four trucks sits. They say it's taller at that on all fours. Wow, that is big. Yeah, it's big.

Yeah, there really is a lot of going on around these reservations. I mentioned it last night, but on Friday I had Isaac on from the Ute Tribe, and they don't really have anything great to say about the Sasquatch, but I think what they called it was a child snatcher, most of its derogatory terms towards a creature, but they don't have any love for it. And he said that what was interesting is, I still think about it, his encounter, and I was thinking of when you hear them on the reservation,

especially like in his situation, he said they would come up at night and go through the trash, kind of like a barewood. And they'll chat chatter back and forth and they'll dig through the trash. Yes. And then they'll leave right before the sun comes up. Has there been any violence on the reservation that you know of, either someone shooting one or someone getting attacked? We've had a lot

I've been hearing a lot lately of gunshots going on down towards the river where I live along the rivers on the reservation I've been hearing a lot of gunshots going off now just about a week over a week ago

I've noticed that we've had some Bigfoot hunters out here what they're doing out here I don't know I don't know if they're the ones that's doing a lot of the shooting I have no idea. Some with California plates and Louisiana plates out here.

So what they're doing out here, I know they're scalping definitely along the river because we've seen, like I said, have seen their truck going up and down the road where I live. That's a big no-no on the reservation, isn't it, unless you're invited? You know, you get caught, you know, you well get asked. What are you doing? You know, if there's some people out here that don't want you, they'll tell you to leave. Yeah, that amazes me. I always thought you had to have permission to go on a reservation and do something like that. Because can you imagine someone showing up? You should. You should be. Yeah. Can you imagine someone showing up, blasting away, and then now everyone on the reservation has to deal with what they did? Yeah. I mean, Jesus. You heard, I mean, you know the bad stories. You shoot at these things. You shoot one. And it's never over with these things. They'll come back and have a revenge streak. Yeah. So, That would piss me off if I was on the reservation and some guys showed up and they were just popping shots off.

Yeah. Weren't from around there. Did you get the tribal police on that? You know, it's been going on a lot, you know, bench shots going off. That's quite a bit even before they have shown out. You know, but just recently lately, we've noticed that there's a lot of outsiders coming in. and are some of the people out here

inviting them? I really don't know. You know, I'm finding out that there's a group out here that's trying to that want to put one down. You're asking for trouble just so they can become famous. You know, that's just crazy. You know, like, well, someone in the meantime's going to get hurt,

you know, that's what you guys are going to really do. You don't have to answer to a lot of people for them. Yeah, especially if someone gets hurt. You know, and I've always stated that if, you know, the only way that I would shoot one is if it does tax, you know, community here or someone or my family or one of my teammates, you know, we're out in the field.

If it attacks us, then yes, I will because we are defending ourselves. Well, I can understand them wanting to shoot one. I don't know that showing up on a reservation or near a reservation would be the place I would do it just because you I'd feel terrible shooting one dragging it out and now someone on the reservation

or even near a small community gets hurt because I blasted one of them and pissed off the rest of them now everyone else has to deal with it I wanted to ask you there was a wasn't there an incident where a kid or two kids had actually shot one of these creatures

on the reservation and then I think the cops showed up or the Fed showed up. I don't think I've heard of that one. No. I've heard of two young guys. They were coming back from work out of the oil fields, and they're hitting them once. They thought it was a deer.

And that was, I believe, towards the Gulf Sea area. They were heading back home. And they thought it was a deer that they had, and they pulled over. to make sure when they looked at it, it wasn't the deer. It was a young juvenile that they had hit. They didn't know what to do, and they ended up calling the cough, and they showed up out there.

And, of course, the boys, you know, they took pictures of it and all. And by the time when the Rangers got out there, and they looked at it, and when they went to go look at the body, they thought it was dead. Of course, they got it with a deer as well, but when they got closer to it, they got a good leg at it, and it was a juvenile that they had hit,

and like I said, found it was dead, but it was still breathing. He lived in about 25 minutes later, here comes, according to them, they said, was a black band. Some guys in, I guess, men in black, I took the saying, they haul the body off and told the boys

not to never talk about it, getting see it never happened. They took their phones away and they didn't read it all the pictures they took over. Yeah, it's amazing how that works, isn't it? I know. Yeah, it's true. Wow, here's it coming in. I get a lot of reports like that that have happened out on the reservations.

Supposedly, something similar like that happened, you know, where they show them and haul the body off. And I've heard that too, and that's the thing. I think when a lot of people listen to the show or they listen to, witnesses talk about Sasquatch. And, you know, one of the biggest questions now is, well, why don't we have a body? Why hasn't someone shot one? Why hasn't someone hit one? And, you know, when I've talked to some of these, and I use the term insider, but when I've

talked to some of these insiders, they say that's been done several times over. And it just gets covered up. And then you hear stories like what you just told. And it just kind of reconfirms the fact that there is some sort of cover-up going on. It's like those guys showing up on the reservation popping off shots. I don't think they'll ever walk out of there with the body. I just don't think it'll happen. Yeah, I don't think so either.

But, you know, you just never know the way people are these days. Like I said, all, because they just want to get rich and famous off of it. And that's too bad. Yeah, I can think of a million other things to get rich and famous off of besides Bigfoot. It's hard to get rich off Bigfoot. You know what I mean? It's not really a... have a guy out here that's telling other people that, yeah, if you have a good clear picture,

you have to make millions of dollars. I'm like, if that's true, then that should be a millionaire right now. I'm like, oh, my God, guys, it does not work like that. You don't make millions of dollars off of pictures, you know? No, you don't. You don't. Even if you have a clear picture, they'll say it's a guy in a suit, or they'll say you CGI did it.

Exactly. They'll say, you know, it's almost a curse even coming out with a decent picture or with a decent video. Yeah. Because they'll eat you alive after you post it. Oh, yeah, for sure. I mean, that's like I even post it, why even short, you know? I mean, I've got several pictures that I'd like to post, but now, you know, and I tell me, you said, you know, guys, you can't make money off of that stuff. That's crazy.

I mean, I said, I guarantee you just watch us to post it. and if it's a good good picture you'd be ready to be calling to hoax and it's a guy you're going to mock you like crazy but now you didn't believe me and he started to post all these pictures and uh the fact of off they tell you they want to listen to hey what that's you don't do well i think in this topic i think if you're in it for the money you won't last very long that's true it'll disappoint you because this isn't really gold prospecting. It's not like you're waiting to hit the big nugget and then you can retire the rest of the year.

I mean, those are pipe dreams people have. I honestly think I'm on the opposite side of the fence as you. I think one should be shot and dragged in if the government would allow it. But I think it should be just so everyone out there knows what they're dealing with. Everyone knows out there what is out there. I think it's unfair to people not to let them know

what's out there. You know, God, there's these things out in the woods. That's right. And they can harm you. And they will harm you if they get a chance. Yes, we know. Now, are they all godless killing machines? No. Neither are grizzly bears. Grizzly bears aren't killing godless killing machines, but you get too close or you screw with them, and you're going to pay a price. And with these things, they're the top predators and everything else. And I just respect what you do, Brenda. I know you, I don't think a lot of people know how much of your own time. your own money, you spend, and I know you love the subject, but you spend a lot of time helping people and trying to get these things to go away.

Right. And that's a rare thing in this world, you know, especially for something that supposedly doesn't exist, taking the time to help people. So I really respect what you do. Thank you. Thank you very much. That means a lot. I just don't want anybody to get heard, you know, really pay attention out there, you know.

There's so many people out there thinking they're so friendly and all. No, you know, be careful because they will turn on you. You just don't know. We just don't know when and where, you know, and it is. We're just not enough. There's no, no expert out there that truly don't think these are capable of doing. There's no schooling for this at all. That you're right.

You know, all the researchers out there. All you people out there, just be worried about what's out there. You know, these things, they're smart. You know what they're doing. Just be really careful out there, and don't be dumb about things out there thinking if you can catch one. Yeah, no, you're right. It's like Bob Garrett always says to me,

they're not toys to be played with. They're not your personal toys out there to play with. They can't bite you back. You know, they can't come back and get you. So that's interesting. You're asking about the firecracker trick. I'll have to remember that. You'll have to tell me if anyone has any bad experiences with the firecrackers if it sets one of these things off. I would imagine just like anything else, any other wild animal, it would kind of scare them off.

The noise alone would kind of scare them off, and no one gets shot in the meantime. That's right. You know, it does. It does work, and I'm sure eventually they'll figure out what it is. But, you know, for now, you know, how many suggest people to use that, that way, you know, because they have neighbors that are so close, and you don't want a straight bullet. You get a straight bullet, guess what?

You're going to be going to jail. That's one thing I really, you know, stress and people be careful. Set your car alarms off. That works. Put your cat food, dog food, and your livestock people that have corn in it. Put all that stuff up. You know, feed your animals.

It's dark. You know, put a lot of lighting around your area. That really helps. because they don't like the lighting. But when I'm getting out here, they're coming out more in the light too. So I'm not interested in them as well. Be careful.

You know, they're getting more daring now, coming out in the light. Brenda Harris, check out her YouTube channel. Just look up Brenda Harris. Or if you want to find her on Facebook, she's under the New Mexico Shadow Seekers. Go add yourself to the group. If you get a chance,

subscribe to Brenda on YouTube. Again, it's under Brenda Harris. Brenda, thanks for coming on. I appreciate you being here for the 200th show. I know this is night too going into it, but I'm really glad you could be here. Thank you. Thank you for having me, and congratulations to you guys on your show there.

That's really awesome. Thank you. Thanks, Brenda. You're welcome. Next up, I want to welcome Duke to the show. Everyone knows Duke. We did the Mountain Giants show together. We've done a few shows together,

and I know he's fast becoming one of the show. of the favorite researchers to come on, share stories, and talk about what he knows about these creatures. Duke, thanks for coming on, man, for my 200 show. I appreciate it, brother. Hey, it's great to be with you again, Wes, and I'm just super psyched for the whole show to be available for everybody to listen to it. Yeah, man, it's an honor having you here tonight. One of the things I wanted to ask you, I don't think we ever talked about it on the last couple shows, but you had kind of a strange encounter with your cousin. Do you want to tell the audience about that? Yeah, this one was

it was really an oddball encounter. We were both deciding to be adventurers in the summer of 1980. He had actually graduated from high school one year previous and had been out here in 79, spent the whole summer hitchhiking around out west, just had

a great time. He spent several weeks panning gold and a little bit that he was making was more than enough to cover his food and all the everything that he needed to keep himself going. So when he mentioned it, you know, Hey, I'd love to go back out there again next summer. I went, hey, yeah, sign me up.

I'll go. I'll be out of school then. So that's what we did. We hitched across country, and we went back out to Wyoming, the same general area. He had been in the previous year and had a whole lot of interesting adventures, including some other encounters. I don't have time to go into right now. But one of the scariest thing that happened the whole summer was when we were over on the far western border of Wyoming, actually over into Utah.

He had never really been in that area the previous year. He'd been there, and I'd never been there, of course. And I was just curious. He said, hey, you know, what's over here? And he said, you know, I don't know. There's, let's go take a look and see what there is. And well, it's about as soon as we got out the road and started walking, we found out there was a good-sized river there.

And honestly, I don't know what the name of the river is, but it's real. And we spent about two, two and a half weeks going up and down this river and basically taken a look around, he wanted to see if there's any place there. He could pan gold and make money that summer to lay the land. The first week we were there, the weather was really beautiful. It was very mild, very nice and warm, wasn't particularly cold at night. The river itself had a fast flow, but wasn't particularly deep.

So it was possible to cross it, but you had to find spots where it was shallow enough to wait across because, of course, being a mountain river, it was so damn cold if you fell in. And with the current being the way it was, it would have drugged you a long ways down the river before he got out. We were pretty careful about that. After we had been there about three or four days, we were going down the eastern side of the river. I think we were actually heading north. We were a long ways from where we had come in at this point. It was going to take us at least, you know, a day or two to walk back to where we had actually come under the river in the first place.

It was getting dark, and when we said, you know, we need to set up a tent here pretty soon as it could be two-dard. to see what we're doing. And both sides of this river were really clear a long ways back, you know, apparently from blood stages, but sometimes the water level is a lot higher. So you have these big gravel bars on both sides of it, you know, 60, 70 feet in before you even got to where there was any vegetation. And aside, we were on, there was a line of trees that went down almost to the river and seemed like the wind was picking up and we thought it might, you know, turned into a storm later on or something. And they're never radio with us or anything, so no way it's with a weather.

Our tent, sort of this little break in between this tree line here, that'll give us a little bit more shelter. It should be okay. Set up everything. It got dark. We made some supper. Both went to sleep. I was in the middle of the night's tent collapsed. Well, I woke up first.

Kick my cousin. He woke up. Went, what the hell? And I said, yeah, the tent fell down, dude. And I heard something grunt. And he goes, what? I said, yeah. And he goes, well, you're close.

We were laying off the directions. I was one that was close to the opening of the tent. So even though it collapsed, I could sort of feel around and find the zipper, and I unzipped it. And I looked straight up, and everything was black. And I figured, well, maybe the storm had blown in. There was, you know, and it had gotten windy for a while. We thought maybe there was going to be a storm. That's why I couldn't see the stars.

And then whatever it was must have hurt us unsipped the zipper and grunted and continued moving. At which point, it was no longer black. I could see the stars. There wasn't a big cloud there. What I was looking straight up at was the belly of a move. who had walked down his regular trail at night, and we had stupidly had our tent set up in his regular trail at night. He hadn't even seen it, apparently, that their vision is very good.

And he walked right in Newton-Claps the damn thing on top of us. We were just really lucky he didn't step on either one of us. But apparently after he knocked it down, he kind of stood there for a minute to figure out what it was he'd just run into, which gave us enough time to unzip it, and for me to see the belly will move some poverty. There were people underneath up, took a couple more steps, and he just slowly continued on his way.

Oh, wow. And, you know, a surprising, that was surprising in two ways. One, we got the tent collapsed on us. And secondly, it was the moose that did it. And, you know, we're down in Utah. We're not expecting feeding moose down there. So, yeah, I mean, that was a real big surprise for me. I had no idea there was moose around.

I don't think he did either. And we both got, you know, kind of a bang out of that. Well, that was good fun, and we didn't get killed, and the moose just kept on the walk, and so that's fine. Well, a couple days later, we had found a good shallow spot to cross the river, so what we were doing is we were both working our way, I think it was north again, up the river, and we were looking for little streams that were entering it on either side, which would be good spots to check and pan gold, but there was any, you know, little gold

that was getting washed in there from up above or something. You'd be able to find it, and that would be a good spot to pan that. Well, we hadn't found much of anything like that, and it was hot. I remember that particular day was sunny. It was really hot. And I had sort of lost track where my cousin was. I hadn't seen him across the river in a while. And I figured I'd go over the river and sort of bend down.

I wasn't too sure I could drink the water out of it, but it was cleaning up. But I wanted to just throw some on myself off a little bit. Well, I was bent down in the river doing that. All of a sudden, I had this weird feeling. And as, you know, anybody that's done a bunch of hunting and spent a lot of time in the woods, me have experienced it. It was not only the feeling that something was watching me, but that something was watching me with ill intent.

And you just get that sick feeling at the pettier stomach. And it felt like there was eyes burning a hole in the back of my. And I stood up, and I turned around and looked, and I didn't see a damn thing. There was a really steep hill, you know, almost like a small mountain, going up right there at the base of the river, and there was a tree line maybe 30 feet thick, a bunch of brush and stuff.

And all I could see was just there was an area, a shadow there and that was it. I stood there and stared at it for a while and missed maybe 20, 30 seconds and didn't see anything. Nothing was moving. I turned around, went back to what I was doing, and washed my hair a little bit more. And I got done with that, maybe a minute or two later, I stood up and looked across the river, and there was my cousin waving his arms frantically, just freaking out. And I'm like, well, what's going on here? Why is he trying to get my attention so much? And he was pointing back, help the river in the direction we had come from. So I figured he must have found something interesting.

I needed to get back across the river and find out what it was. Well, it must have been a good couple hours before I actually got back to where it was shallow and out to the Fort Cross River and made it crossed him. At which point I said, well, would you find a good spot or anything? And he said, no, I'm just glad I got your attention. It got you out of there. I thought that was going to get you. And I'm like, what?

What was going to get me? And he goes, you didn't see it? And I said, no, I didn't see it. What are you talking about? And he said, well, you remember when you stopped and you're running that water through your hair, you were washing your hair or whatever, and I said, yeah, I didn't even see you cross the river. And he goes, well, I saw you. And I was watching you wash your hair, and some huge black thing was working its way slowly down the steep hill side behind you.

And right about the time it got to the base of the hill, you stood up and turned around and looked right at it. Are you telling me you didn't see it? And I said, no, I didn't see anything. All I saw was just, you know, some shadow in the trees. I had a feeling something was watching me, so I stood up and turned around and looked, and I didn't see anything. So I went back to doing what I was doing. And he said, oh, my God, I was yelling and waving my arms and everything. You didn't see me across the river?

And said, no, I couldn't hear you, man. You know, fast-running river, lots of rushing river sounds. You know, it's 100 feet across. I didn't notice you. I didn't even know you were there. And he said, well, something huge came down that hill behind you when you were washing your hair. You stood up and looked right at it, at which point it didn't move. And I thought you saw it.

You turned around and went right back to washing your hair, and I started screaming and yelling. and waving my arms, and I didn't realize you hadn't even seen me. And I said, well, what did it do? And he said, well, as soon as you turned around, and I start screaming a yell and wave my arms, whatever it was, turned around and went back up the hill. And I said, well, did you get a look at it?

And he said, well, it was huge in black, whatever it was. And I said, well, so it was a really big black bear. And he's like, no, no, it was too big to be a black bear. Well, how big was it? Well, it was like the side of a buffalo. And I said, no, wait a minute. You're telling me a buffalo was sneaking down that steep hill trying to sneak up on me. He said, no, it wasn't a buffalo.

It wasn't the right color. It was just the size of a buffalo, and it was black. And I don't think there's any black bears that get that big out here. The grizzlies are the big ones out here. And he said, I know that has always scared me to this day. Because, you know, as you know if you're a hunter, the prey animals, they don't get picked off by the predators they see. they get picked out by the predators they don't see.

And whatever the hell that was, it was sneaking up behind me. I have no doubt whatsoever in my mind that he was looking at me as a nice, easy target, potential meal. And the only reason this thing turned around and went back up the hills is because he saw my cousin across River waving his arms. I don't know that he could hear him or not, but he must have seen him and figured, you know, there's somebody else probably got a gun. That's it. I'm done. Turn around and back up the hill. So to this day, I do not know what that was. But my cousin is one of those people that does not believe in Bigfoot.

You know, Bigfoot was standing 10 feet in front of me, try and make up another excuse for what it was. He would never, ever say that he would never, ever say that it's not Bigfoot. So, yeah, that's one of those things that just had me creeped out for years, man. I still do this take. I wonder exactly what that was, and if it was a Bigfoot, what his intentions were, because I just don't think they were good to be honest with. Yeah, it's an interesting story. I remember when you told me that the other day, I was pretty fascinated by it. And it's interesting, too, the Sasquatch's behavior kind of slowly comes down the hill to check you out. Then it doesn't really run off like a black bear. You know, a lot of black bears when they see you, they'll sprint off. This sounds like it just kind of mozied on its way back up the hill. Did he say whether it was on all fours or was it on two legs or did he say at the time?

I got the impression from his description that it's, you know, and I didn't ask him to be specific because he wouldn't have been it. It was on high legs anyway. But it sounded to me like from what he was trying to describe that it had been on all fours making its way down that steep hillside and back up again, which didn't surprise me. And after he told me about it, I was wondering how anything could have made it down that hillside and back up again. It was really incredibly steep. I mean, it was just short of a cliff. If it would have been any steeper, there wouldn't have been any possibility of plants growing on it, basically. That's one of those, again, where you've got some, you know, something the size of a buffalo

that's black and it's sneaking up on you. That does not bode well. And then subsequent to that, you know, I've had some conversations with some of my other Bigfoot and friends that have actually done a bunch of research around there, and there are more than one counts of people going missing up in the Lasatch Mountains up there. so, you know, there's a reason to pause and think about what potentially could have happened, you know. And once again, we're out here in the middle of the wilderness. Neither one of us has a good common sense to have a gun with us to protect us.

We're just, you know, oh, we'll scare animals away by virtue of fact that there's two of us. You know, it doesn't necessarily. We were just damn lucky. And all I can attribute to the fact that it didn't come after me is that it must have been had. you know, I don't know what their thought process of this animal is or even what it was. But, you know, that's just the way it came across to me. It seemed like it realized it had been spotted, and it just turned around and slowly made its way back up to the ill again. Yeah, it's kind of a creepy story.

Yeah, it's, you know, even in the face of having seen these things three times, that one still scares me the worst because it's the unknown. Whatever it was was huge. It was acting predatory. and to this day, I don't know what it was, and I probably never will. But the options of either huge bearer or predatory big flood are not reassuring. Yeah, either one doesn't really reassure you, does it? Yeah.

So, once again, pure good luck is about the only thing that kept me alive through that one. And now that I've gotten older, I decided to quit taking less stupid chances. Hopefully I'll get to be a little bit yet older than I have at this point. Yeah, funny how that works as you get older, isn't it? Yeah, you start looking back at the stuff you did when you're younger going, what in the hell was I thinking? It's true. No common sense.

No common sense. I shouldn't have been there. I shouldn't have been doing that. Definitely shouldn't have been, you know, a couple days walk out into the wilderness without having a gun with us for God's sake. What the hell were we thinking? It's of youth and just sure good luck that I'm still around to tell the story. could have been stepped on by a moose too, you know.

I would have crushed me. They're not light critters. They step on you. They're going to pancake you pretty good. That was the big scary point in the, well, we were in the Lasage Mountains. I had something unknown shake our tent when we were up in the Big Horn Mountains earlier that summer,

but that's another story, and that would be the first of two times that I've had my tent shaken, and I'm pretty sure that it was a big put to did it? Well, for the audience, did you see an outline, or did you see anything that made you think it was shaking your tent? When we were up on the mountain, well, we were up near the very top of a mountain. It was night. There was no human beings anywhere around there, up in the big horns or anything, that's off-limits.

So basically, and somebody had a pasture up there that he was grazing his cows in. And we were actually up above the pasture right near the top of the mountain, and about 70-80 feet above us, there was a very obvious cave. Because, you know, this might not be the best place to camp. There's a cave up there. And he said, well, if it's a bear, it probably won't mess with that. that will keep in the middle of the night, there's something there shaking a tent.

Whatever it was, this is one of those A-frame tents, you know, like an old pup tent military style or something. And then it grabbed onto the front post at the top of the tent was actually just shaking the tent back and forth really hard. Just kind of surprised me because it was a bear or something and it was smelling food. You would figure it would be sticking its snout up against the tent.

And there was some... Now at this point, I was actually the one that was furthest away from that side of the tent. My cousin was over there. And once again, being the sound sleeper, I booted him one and went, hey, and that wasn't enough to make whatever it was shaking the tent. Stop, it kept shaking it. And he woke up, reached into his backpack, and pulled out his cast iron fry pan. And whatever it was, he reached up and whacked at the top of that pole and plighted with something. And we heard whatever it was go, ugh.

and that was the end. And neither one of us had the courage to crawl out of the tent and see what it was. Just, no, let's leave well enough alone, sort of thing. But I've always wondered about that one, too, because I've had that same sort of behavior repeated when I was over at Coloma last summer. Again, you know, if you've got a bare mess around with your tent, maybe you spilled some grease on part of it or something. You know, they're going to come over and they're going to smell that grease,

and they'll be on the outside of the tent trying to lick it or something like that. You know, they'll have the nose up against it. They don't grab onto the top of the tent and shake it back and forth. That's just not something you would expect to bear to do. And, you know, my cousin, of course, blew it off. I thought, wow, that was probably just a rancher up here messing with us. Dude, around the top of a mountain, miles from the nearest house, in the middle of the night, there's no damn ranchers up here messing with us.

Seriously. But, you know, doesn't believe Bigfoot. So he had to come up with something that would fit within his, concepts of reality. It's amazing how that works with some people. You know, they have to have whatever within their frame of reference is the only explanation. Yeah,

you know, and that's just the kind of guy he was. I mean, he even saw that, whatever it was, come down the hill behind me, and he, as much as he was sure that it was on Buffalo or a black bear, he didn't say what he thought it was or trying to put any kind of a name on it, which, I mean, I guess that's, you know, that's reasonable.

He wasn't sure what it was that he saw, but what I didn't. I didn't see it. I mean, I looked right at the damn thing, and it froze. It didn't move while I was looking at it. As soon as I turned around, according to him, that's when it turned around and went slowly walking back up the hill again. Coming down the hill.

Yeah, that's crazy. Makes you wonder, there's a lot of weird things like that. I know it's not like your first encounter with the Windigo or anything like that, but it's interesting because a lot of hunters, a lot of people on the woods, they have strange encounters like this. There's no explanation for it whatsoever, and it's hard. hard to fit it into a box. I guess if you don't believe in Bigfoot or Sasquatch and you're out in the woods and something like this strange happens,

there's really no explanation for it. You know, they don't want to go down the Bigfoot route, so it must have been a bear, which a bear doesn't really make sense. No, again, you know, like, as you and I both know, Wes, there's primary motivations. And where they're going to get food out of the whole deal, they're just not going to get involved in them. Usually they're not, they're not an animal that's really curious that's going to go take a little. look at something just out of sheer curiosity. If it's not for food motivated,

usually they don't have any interest in being involved in it. So, you know, why would it be there shaking the tent in the middle of the night? Yeah, you know, I've run into that sort of thing with other friends of mine that are hunters and whatnot. And, you know, one of them was with his cousin, and they actually saw one jump out of a tree and go running off during gear hunting season. They both turned around and just left the area and refused to ever go back there again. And I wouldn't say either one of them is what you would call a big foot believer.

but on the other hand they saw this sink jump out about 30 feet up in a tree land on its hind legs and go running across the field away from them so they don't know what the hell it is and they're scared enough of it that even though one of them owns that land neither one of them will go back there again well I'd imagine at that point you almost have to become a believer at that point especially if you see one you know yeah honestly I think the only reason that they're not copying that attitude is because there's such both of such habit outdoors been and hunters that it would just buy them them to have that in the back of their mind all the time to have to think about that. I think that's really, and probably with a lot of hunters, that's one of the reasons they just try and blow it up and think of it, you know, it's got to be something else.

I just didn't see what I thought I saw or whatever else because they don't want it to ruin their favorite pastime of being out in the woods and hunting and whatnot. Well, Duke, I can't think enough for coming on. I know I was hoping you'd come by and just say hi, and I was thrilled when he said he'd share a couple stories you haven't shared before on the air. and I know for the 200 show I'm very honored to have you on. It's always an honor to be on your show, Wes, and I hope you have at least another 200 episodes,

and I'm definitely looking forward to hearing all of them, buddy. Thanks, Duke. Next up, I want to welcome the outlaws to the show, Bear, Cumbow, and Matt, and they have their own show. It's called the Bigfoot Outlaw Radio. You can find it on YouTube under Bigfoot Crossroads. Bigfoot Crossroads. So if you get a chance, give them a listen.

and these guys do a great job. Let's go ahead and bring them on. Bear, welcome to the show. Appreciate this, Wes. How are you doing, man? I'm doing good. I'm doing good. Kumbo, thanks for being here, man. It's always a pleasure.

Appreciate you having a sound again. Yeah, absolutely. And Matt, thanks for coming on, man. I really do appreciate you taking the time. Oh, absolutely. I feel like I finally made the big times. Well, I don't know about that. You guys got a great show.

I listen to you guys a lot. You know, I listen to your show a lot. And I'm just happy you guys could be here for the 200th show. It's a big milestone for me. It seems like just yesterday. I remember I was putting episode one up and episode two. So thank you guys for being here. It's a huge honor for me to have all three you guys here.

Oh, yeah. Congratulations on your 200th episode. That is a major milestone. Yes. Congratulations. Yeah. Pleasure of all hours. I'm surprised you haven't stressed out and killed somebody for doing

200 straight shows. No, I enjoy it. I really enjoy it. I love the whole subject. I think Bear came on. I want to say it was episode 18. Yep, it was pretty early. It sure was.

It's been a long way. And you make him a reveal like age now. It's, you know, it can't be hip. We're long in the tooth anyway. No, I learned the most from you guys from Bear and Kubo. And I really did. At a time where I really knew nothing. I mean, even today I know nothing.

I don't want to sound like I'm some expert now because I'm by far from it. But I knew a lot less back then. And in those early shows, you guys really helped me. I know Bear talking about your experiences, Kumbow, talking about your experiences. And, you know, what was cool about you guys, when I first met you guys, you guys were a lot different than a lot of the researchers I talked to, a lot of the Bigfoot experts I talked to. There was no ego with you guys.

and you guys, it was like talking to family. You know, anytime I had questions, I'd call Bear Up or I'd call Cumbo up, and, you know, neither one of these guys gave me a hard time. They were happy to take the time to answer all the questions, you know, all my questions and questions I had from witnesses. So I do appreciate it, guys. Thank you.

It means more to me than you guys will probably know. We appreciate that. We appreciate it. Appreciate it. Well, I can speak from experience, you know, of knowing these guys. for, you know, the past 16, 17 years now, that's not just a fluke. I mean, that's why we're as close as we are today because they did the same with me,

and I've seen them do the same thing with everybody. And that's kind of how we started calling ourselves the outlaws, just because falling in their footsteps and everything, they weren't like anybody else. They weren't like your typical Bigfoot researcher, you know, with the huge inflated ego trying to be the expert. and everything. And it's kind of led us down to this path to where we are today. And I'm thankful for it.

Yeah, and the best way to find your guys' show, if you go to YouTube and type in The Bigfoot Outlaws, is there a better way to find the show? We post all over shows. We have a fan page on Facebook. So if you just look up Bigfoot Outlaws, you'll pretty much find us. The YouTube channel that we're actually on is Bigfoot Crossroads.

So you can type that in and find us as well. And I know, Matt, you run Bigfoot evidence and you do a lot of posting over there, and it's one of my favorite sites to go to. It's probably the first one I look at in the morning. So I appreciate all your hard work. I don't think a lot of people, or you get enough credit, Matt, for the stuff you do. Because you do way more than I thought you did. I know you produce the show. You got the evidence out.

You're always searching and looking into this topic. Almost 24-7. Oh, yeah. It's all the time. constantly covering emails, searching through, you know, I've got my different little search enzymes I use and everything, my techniques. But yeah, it's pretty much an ongoing process. If you see me on the computer, then that's probably what I'm doing.

Yeah, I thought it was interesting on your guys' last show. I think it was, maybe it was just the last one I heard. You guys go on to tackle some subject no one really wants to talk about. We all know it goes on, but no one really wants to talk. talk about. I'll give you an example before I ask you about the show. I had a farmer one time call me. He was telling me about his Sasquatch encounter. There was a lot of things going on and around his property. And the main reason he didn't want to come on on the show was because of this. He went out one early morning out to the pasture and he saw a monkey basically raping his cow.

And I know probably the audience is snickering at that, but this guy was dead serious. And he didn't want to come on the show for the initial reaction most people will give of, you know, kind of that laughter. But this really goes on, and you guys talked about it on your last show. What made you go into that subject? Well, we've, you know, we've heard about it both there and I had. You know, we knew about it, you know, for, you know, for years. And, you know, I discovered that they were doing it to, you know, to our horses on our farm. Back to, you know, in the 1970s. When did you figure out that it was going on

on your place? It happened. It was in the early 70s, and we would see the physical evidence left after the fact that we knew that particularly the horses. The day after reaction from

the horses that, you know, we very well knew their pattern would change. It's like the next morning they would just run from one end of the pasture to the other for no apparent reason. Their eyes would be walled eyes. They would be very rapidly sweaty, visibly sweating. And if anybody knows horses, it takes a lot for a horse to visually sweat.

What mainly brings on a visual sweat like that is a lot of stress, being raised around. horses and cattle all my life, watching our personal friends and farm animals do this only on certain occasions, we got, we knew something wasn't right. We thought maybe they had got into some Jensen weed or what a lot of people out west called local weed, and that would change of horses behavior. But when we would finally capture them or slow them down on a lift to try to calm them down, they'd be very jerky and spooky and dodging our hands or whatever while we was trying to calm them down. You gentle a horse down by rubbing on him and letting him smell and getting real close to

him talking, you know, like the horse whisper. I mean, everybody lasts about all of it. But then we'd start seeing these braids in the main, and then we'd see some braids occasionally in the horse's tail itself. And we'd also start seeing at times when these things would get to the extent that they wasn't nothing but a visual bucket of sweat. You could see large handprints, way larger than the average human's hand, imprinted on the wet part of its length or its neck area or even the hips. we had no clue basically what was going on until our next-door neighbor, which I recounted that in the story at the beginning of the show when we introduced this subject.

Next-door neighbors come over there. Very much scared to even approach the subject with my grandfather. But once he started talking to my granddad, my granddad just called me from inside the house outside where they were discussing this on the front porch. and that's when everything became clear. It didn't make things easier. Actually, it gave us another problem we had to deal with and figure out a ways to deal with it.

Then over the various years, not only I've rodeoed a little bit in my past, and I've always been around various people who owned horses, particularly, and cattle. And I would, you know, off the cuff. would just say something to the effect, man, you know, have you ever just had any of your horses, particularly the mares, which is a female horse, have you ever seen their hair braided for any particular reason? And you'd find out occasionally somebody has run across this in various states across the south in particular. And then you'd find out it happened in other states in the continental North American continent.

Trying to put all this together, piece it together, without actually coming flat out saying that a Bigfoot or a Sasquot or a Booger did something like this. I mean, we was compiling information all this time. We had discussed doing this show since we started Bigfoot Outlaw Radio back in, what was it, Matt, 2007 when we first come on the air? Yeah, I think so. Yeah. It was back during our older show on Blog Talk. at that time, Bear was ready to bring out the subject then. I mean, it's something that we had discussed over the years,

heard it from other researchers. It wasn't just coming from Bear and Coombo. Back then, I was kind of leery about, you know, approaching the subject. We had a lot of stuff going on, and the Bigfoot community was completely different back then. And Bear brought it up again now that we're doing the newer show. We all decided, yeah, let's just go for it, you know. Yeah, it's time.

It's time. We might as well go in and reveal it. There's a lot of researchers that have, like Matt said, there's quite a number of researchers that have noticed this, and we've talked about it amongst ourselves, but we were just the first ones that were stupid enough or brave enough to actually mention it on the air, you know, publicly talk about it in a public forum. Yeah, I'm kind of glad you guys did.

because I have talked to, it's been very few witnesses, and they generally don't want to come on the air and share this, but I have talked privately to some of these people, and they have described that type of behavior. What's your take, Matt? Why do you think they do that? I think it's just part of nature, animal nature in general, including us humans.

It probably has something to do with, I want to say, their hierarchy within their group, If, you know, the alpha controls all the mating with the females and you've got subordinate males that aren't getting any, they're going to find one way or the other to get it. And if they can't, you know, do it with the females in the group, they're going to have to go to other sources. I was actually just looking into it today, doing a little digging around and just websites involving just, you know, the known animals around the world. it's really a well-known, well-documented thing that animals do this.

Inter-species, intercourse, as well as just rape in general. I mean, everybody kind of cringes at the word rape, but that's, you know, what we're talking about. That's the best way to describe it, and it happens with a lot of animal species. You know, so we know it happens in humans. So I'm surprised, actually, that there's a resistance to this possibility in the Bigfoot community with so many people. Whenever you start looking at the facts of everything else on this planet doing it, why is it so far-fetched. Yeah. You know what really, what really blew our mind basically at first West?

I know how Matt got into the Bigfoot community back in 1999. and that. Basically, me and Coombo got into it about the same time, probably under almost the same circumstances. We got into it because me and Coombo had questions that we needed answers to. Of course, when we got into the community back in 1999 and 2000, you know, we'd been doing this for years on our own. Hell, me and Coombo didn't even know each other at that point in time. And we run across things that we've got questions towards. And negatively, we thought that everybody was acting like they had answers that they wasn't publicly showing to other people. And I just assumed, and you know what assumed does to people, you know, that the way these people were leading us on to believing that they had things that they kept secret,

become a good upstanding member of our group, and we don't mind sharing things. But then once you paid the price or you turned around and you become a part of that upstanding group, you start asking these little questions, but you're still kind of like that rancher farmer that you mentioned a while ago, you're hesitant about bringing this up.

And then once you have brought it up, though, and they look at you like, are you out of your mind? No, we're not out of our mind. I'm just sharing what we've seen happen, and we've got questions that, you know, I thought all the way up until this point in time you may have had answers for it.

That's the scenario I was in. I don't know how Tim thought of it. I was researching actively for, you know, for two decades before I ever met there. I still remember the first time I was talking to, he turned out he was a farmer and he had he had some horses

and and he was you know we were talking about things that he had been seeing and stuff like that and I noticed his horses had come up to the fence where we were well I noticed the braided tails

and the braided braided mains and so I started you know questioning him about about his horses and he got talking about and he said well yeah they you know And here just nine or two ago that they went crazy. And, you know, he started telling me all this stuff was going on.

And it was exactly the exact scenario that was happening to my horses. I was scared even to tell him what was happening to his horses. But I did tell him that the, you know, that the big foot were messing around them, or were scaring them. And that he ought to, you know, maybe, you know, put some lights out there. In the edge of the pasture, they're close to his house so that they could have a little, you know, refuge. You know, he needed to do some stuff. He had some old junk farm equipment just abandoned out there in the field that wasn't too far from the wood line.

It'd probably be a good idea for him to get that stuff out of the field, that, you know, that's something that they can hide behind and try to ambush his livestock. It took me quite a few years to get where I would even talk to openly, you know, tell people openly what was going on. you know, when we would discover that their, you know, their livestock was being molested as well. And Bear and I knew each other for quite a while. Full Hibber broached it to each other. So the whole reason I ever met there in the first place was because he was involved with a group. And I'm thinking, hot dogs, here's some folks who've been out here that's been doing this.

And, you know, boy, they all really know a lot about what's going on. I can get a lot of questions answered. And so I jumped in there, you know, at both feet. and lo and behold, you just can't imagine what a disappointment it was when I found out that these people that I was holding up in huge high steam, they really knew less, way less, than what I did. And then I actually, you know, got to go out in the field for the first time with Bear and figured out real quick that, you know, he knew a lot of the same stuff I did. And we started, you know, just questioning each other.

we were able to answer for of each other's questions and things. It's interesting behavior from these things, and I don't hear it too often. I do hear every once in a while. Most of the time I hear that they kill the livestock and take it. I wanted to ask you, Tim, did you ever want to go out and blast a thing for doing that to your horse? I mean, if something did that to my... Oh, yeah. Yeah.

Absolutely. Absolutely. Absolutely. I'm ashamed to admit this, but there was one time that they kept... They kept coming up messing around, trying to mess around with my dogs. I finally got enough of it, and I knew about where they were, where the direction they were coming from. I stepped down on the back porch with a Grueger Mini 14

and empty the 30-round magazine out into the woods, just as fast as I could burn them off, you know, and I just got sick and tired of it. I had to say this. They didn't come up there trying to mess with my dogs anymore at that place. I went out one time when I tried to bait them one time, and we had a calf that had died. I took it out and carried it over next to the woods on the back side of the farm.

I got back and got up in a tree, got up in a comfortable position, and this was during the summertime, so there was a lot of foliage on the tree to help conceal me. And I sat up there a good part of the night and hung up into the morning. hoping that one would come out. Because I suspected that, I didn't know for sure, but I suspected that they might have had something to do with the death of that calf. Because if wild dogs or coyotes did it, you know, they would, you'd see a lot of wounds on the legs and stuff like that.

And this particular calf, the only thing that was wrong with it that I could see was, and his left ear was partially torn off. And there were no pipe marks or anything. on the ear. It was just something that got in a hold of it and yanked, you know, yanking on it. You know, I intended if one of them came out, I was going to blow the sun a gun away.

Never did see hiding or hair of anything, though. And I can understand that. I think most people, to be honest with you, can understand that. I've talked to a lot of people that have them around their property, and they just get to a point, and I don't know what your take

on this is bare, but they just get to a point where they're just tired of it. They feel like they're being harassed. They feel like their livestock's being harassed. And they'll step out and blast off a couple shots just as a warning or, you know, if they shoot one, they shoot one. I think if one was messing with my dog or my horse, I'd probably put a bullet in it and not feel bad at all about doing it. My grandfather, he would unload his 16 gauge with birdshot, hopefully, of the cows, or the horses. Whenever this happened, my grandfather would start gathering once we was made aware of this every evening he would do what they call

in the country a cattle call and of course it didn't make no difference on the property wherever the cattle was at usually the horses are near them too and once my grandfather would start yelling this certain cattle call every evening it would bring them all into the inner pasture that we'd keep, you know, behind the house. Of course, we couldn't do this all the time, you know, certain times you'd be gone out of town or something and couldn't do it. But nine times out ten, he conditioned the cattle and the horses to where they would come into the inner pasture in the backyard. Well, we also had two Labdador retrievers. We'd always have one or two big dogs on the property. We'd call them yard dogs. But whenever booger.

would come around, these yard dogs would raise 10 times worth of cane, and it ended up up in the house. But what would be the clincher in regard to the boogers coming into the back pasture to probably try to get away with something like this cattle and horse molestation, the dogs would jump up underneath the house. We had about a two, two and a half foot gout. up under the house. And when the dogs, when the boogers would come close into the house,

the dogs that never failed would run up under the house. And every floor, joyous they would hit on the way to get into the center of the house would wake us up every time. And my grandfather would go outside and determine as best as he could, where the cattle was, so on, of so on. Of course, he didn't want to kill one of his cows. he had just shoot his shotgun in the general direction. And that usually came veins down for that night.

What just really bothered me more about everything was all these people that are supposedly claim and act like they know everything there is to know or claim about a Bigfoot, how come they're the ones that's giving us a lot of grief for the last radio show. They said that, you know, now was not the perfect time or the right time to declare something like that. But my question was, when would ever be the right and perfect time to, you know, say something about this? Because from where I'm standing, I'm believing that there's a lot of people out there that's trying to convince us that they know more about these things than other people do, whether it's to sell a book or video or whatever, how come they're not the ones that have made this declaration or announcement?

And that's what blows me away about it. I'm not saying that we're better than everybody else, because I'll be the first to admit we're learning every day. My question is, well, the experts, when something that we have determined is really actually happening, and how come they're not backing us up on this and acting like we're just full of crap? I mean, that's what blows my mind more than anything. Yeah, I think this is a tough business. You know, you have to, it's hard to play well in the sandbox when almost everyone in the sandbox is a jerk.

But it's like I was telling Chris Jerko when I was on a show, you know, he was like, are you a Bigfoot expert, are you a cryptozoologist? or are you a, and I was like, no, I'm not any of those things, man. I'm by no means an expert. Until I have one in my garage and I'm studying it, then I'm an expert. Until then, I'm guessing on a lot of things. I think some of them are good guesses based on behavior that you hear from witnesses, but at the end of the day, I'm still guessing.

One more thing to follow that with, you've got to stand in that farmer or rancor she's for five of kids, minutes to see where that rascal's coming from. And I've been in those shoes before. Here you are discussing something that you physically seem that does not, and everybody has told you don't exist, then you physically see this thing attacking your farm animals, particularly in this circumstance the horses are the cattle. And then you're going to try to just plead from the highest pinnacle there is,

pipe peak or wherever in the world. and saying, these things molest our farm animals. And the general consensus is going to believe, look at that dumb rednecks. He don't know what he's talking about. He's crazy. He's crazy. He's not paying no attention.

Blah, blah, blah, so on. We knew we was taking a chance when we brought this subject out. But we also knew that people out there who accidentally either hear the show or they listen to it on their own time, by being possibly a regular listener, if they hear of what we've announced, they understand now more than anything, well, listen here,

I've been knowing of this for years, but these are the first guys that said anything about it, and I'm not looking for a pat on the back, even though that's what I'm going to be accused of. We also knew that this was a well-proven phenomenon, amongst lots of different animals. That this isn't, you know, this isn't some kind of weird thing that we're trying to treat it just to Bigfoot. This thing happens amongst many different species.

Yeah, you hear about men doing it in Afghanistan with goats. So especially when you're a primate, I guess you, like Matt was saying, you know, if it's, they're not around the females, you know, I don't know that I'd ever go that far personally, but I guess it does go on. Matt, how would you describe your guys' Bigfoot show to everyone out there listening? If they go check out Bigfoot Outlaws on YouTube, what can the listener expect? They can expect years and years, lifetimes of experience. Being around these creatures, having encounters, actively researching and investigating it.

I mean, it's a broad spectrum. You've got, you know, a redneck from Mississippi and a rocket scientist in Barren Cumber. It's a common sense approach to it. Common sense is the biggest key in all of our research as far as the outlaws are concerned. But, you know, we do have a rock and scientist. You know, we've got me. I'm a skeptic, you know. Yeah, and Matt, you're pretty skeptical, too.

I've noticed that about you. I like that about you. Have you had your own encounter with Sasquatch? Have you seen these creatures? Yeah. I've had what I call three for sure sightings, a couple probably several what I consider encounters. I know they're encounters. Do I got anything to prove it?

No, but I was there. The other people were there. And that's part of the reason that I am, skeptical as I am because I know these things are out there and whenever you start doing Bigfoot research, not having had a siding or an encounter, and then you have one, that changes things because now you know they're out there. So I have to double check myself and then I have to double check anybody else that says they have a siding because there's a lot of people that lie about it. You know, there's a lot of people that just make stuff up just to get

attention for whatever reason. And so to me, it was more important to become even more skeptical of people's claims and everything just so I didn't fall under the umbrella of, oh, well,

he's just going to say everything's a big so because he's seen one. And a lot of people do that. Also, Wes, Matt and I have done this ourselves together. We have had you know, we have had people try to hoax us. and try to draw us into some kind of a scheme. And because of our skeptical natures, we, you know, we caught it.

And anybody that's been out with us individually or with the group. You know, every dad going to hood all we hear, you know, there's always somebody there. Oh, listen, that's Bigfoot. You know, I hate to pop their bubble, but I said, no, that's, that's a bard owl, or no, that's a screech owl, you know. Or no, that's a, that's a, that's a, that's a, that's a, uh, great blue heron. You take a bad, you know, you talk about a damn bad ass noise that'll make your hair crawl. You ought to hear a great blue heron at night.

That's a, that is a terrible noise when you're within, uh, 50 yards of it. We try to eliminate, we try to come up with every, the crap that we find, we try to find, you know, through the process of elimination, we try to figure out, well, that's a bird, or that's an animal, or that's a, that track, that's probably, you know, this or that, or, you know, something. And then after we've eliminated everything else, then we'll say, hmm, maybe that, maybe that's big foot, you know, maybe that's big foot related or something. Yeah, you can't ever look at a piece of evidence and reach a conclusion just on that one piece of

evidence. You have to look at the context clues around it, everything that surrounds it. And usually, unless you witness it happen, the best you're ever going to get to is a 50-50 chance of it, either being a Bigfoot or a human that caused

whatever. And then that's whenever statistics come into play and experience, and, you know, the other factors play into it and you reach a determination, was it most likely a human that did it, or was it most likely a Bigfoot? And by having sightings and having encounters and having that knowledge that they exist and that question is erased,

it opens the doors for you to kind of make those deductions and use common sense and reasoning to come up with your conclusions that a lot of people just don't have. But if you don't have it, then you're not going to go anywhere. You can't forward your research ever if you're never going to admit that, well, this might have possibly been a big foot, even though I didn't see a big foot do it. What I've noticed with sightings, especially people reporting a sighting, one thing I'll tell you is 99% of the time they don't really want to come on the air. Right.

I know I have a lot of encounters with people, but 99% of the time, most people don't really want to come on the air. It's a lot harder to get people to share their story on the show than a lot of people realize. And I think a lot of people, I don't know if they're embarrassed by it, and I know they get crushed, and skeptical is not the right word, but there's a lot of, oh, you didn't see that, or, oh, come on, or how much were you drinking? If you listen to a lot of people's encounters, I guess what I'm trying to say is, I've kind of found the opposite with people.

Most people don't really aren't looking for attention. Most people really don't want to come on the air. They just kind of want it to get it off their chest. I wanted to ask you, Matt, with your encounter, did you get a good look at the creature? The first one I ever saw was through a Gen 3 night vision. That was the state-of-the-art thing back then. It was standing in brush. All I could see was about 75% of its face, I would say.

The very bottom, lower half of its jaw was covered up by a tree branch. And I was probably, I'm just completely guessing here. 30 feet away. It may have been a little bit farther than that because I think the scope had a little bit of magnification on it. But I got a really good look at that one's face. And then I got a glimpse of one with three other people. My best friend, he went down to Texas with me.

He was a complete skeptic. He was going because he wanted to know why his friend was going out with these crazy-ass strangers that believe in Bigfoot. And he ended up seeing one, and Bear was there at the time. Bear was one of the other witnesses, and another guy named Sammy. It was a blind location. In other words, we had never been there before. It was just a road that I saw on the way into the campgrounds.

I was like, hey, we should go check out that area. And we pulled up and immediately had a siding, literally immediately. And then the other one I saw was a juvenile. It was about 50 yards away. I saw that one for a couple of seconds. It was a full body, but I wasn't close enough to really see its face or anything. But the one through the night vision was the best look I got at a face for sure. How would you describe the face?

Not what I expected. One thing that's kind of stuck out to me that I, you know, I don't know. I know there's differences in them. similar to humans, from individual to individual. It sounds kind of cliche, but a cross between a human and an ape. You know, your eight-man scenario, it didn't have a forehead. That's one thing that bothers me about a lot of eyewitness sketches that I see and a lot of witness reports.

They'll talk about the forehead. I didn't see a forehead. The hairline came down and was part of the brow ridge. the brow ridge was actually thick at the center and tapered off towards the edges of the eyes. The eyes were almond shape. The nose was the bridge of the nose. It looked like it kind of dropped down

and the main part of the nose with the nostrils and everything was kind of squatty between the eyes sitting on the top lip. There was no, I don't know the medical term or whatever for it, but the tip of our nose, the fatty part on the tip of our nose, it didn't have that. It was just flat and widespread. The nostrils were slightly more upturned than ours, but not like a gorilla. The mouth was very wide. The lips were what I consider thin.

The cheekbones sat high. The jaw bones were very wide and powerful looking. The jaw bones stuck out farther than the side of its head. I didn't necessarily notice sageal crest. The hair kind of grew in a back pattern, though, so it may have had one. The mouth itself, where we have a divot between our nose and our upper lip, that space was very thin like ours. It didn't have that, you know, chimpanzee gorilla-type mouth that you would associate with them having.

and then around the eyes just below the eyes and on the nose were really the only place is void of hair. Really, the hair pattern was very similar to if he grew all the facial hair out, the same type pattern. You know, what's interesting is when I talked to witnesses, I used to have a hard time with their descriptions, and then I started finding that was very common. You'd have different descriptions based on location.

I wanted to ask you, Bear, do you ever get worried when you go out there and you call these things in? And I know a lot of people listening will go call BS on that, that you can call them in. But I've actually talked to people that have been out with you and Kumbow and said, yeah, these guys can, it's no joke, these guys can call them in. Do you ever get worried doing that when you have a group of people with you or you take someone new out calling them in and what might happen? Actually, I did when we first did this, it even goes back to what you just mentioned. Everybody was screaming BS. There's no way you can do this, no way you can do this. So I guess you could actually say, in our exuberance to prove otherwise,

we also knew, me and Cumbo both knew that the more that could actually experience, seeing us actually call them in would probably justify us in their eyes. See, we was doing it for the wrong reason. Over the years, though, me and Tim both have discussed this various times. We realized the folly of our ways. Actually, we've been very lucky that nobody has got hurt. Here in the last, what would you say, Tim, probably the last eight or nine years, years. We've been very selective in regard to who we take with us on our outings.

We don't, we just don't take everybody anymore. Yeah, we had, we had an outing that turned into a pretty much of a debacle. We had too many people and too many boogers in close proximity. We were, we were too successful. And things, things, actually, they did. get out of control. We're just, by the grace of God, the boogers stopped when they did. And we were trying to get people loaded up, trying to get them out of there, and they didn't want to go. They thought, why are we leaving now? They'd be screaming, why are we leaving now? They're right

here. They're right here. And go ahead, Tiel. Anyway, you know, they had been, they had been working their way in and doing one type of a call, you know, doing lots of different kind of calls and really is, but the call, what I meant, that the tenor of the calls was almost like they were just playing with us and, you know, and that they were, that everything was happy and, you know, and, uh, and fun, and they were enjoying messing with us as much as we were enjoying hearing them. Then all of a sudden, in an instant, in a split second, the hour. changed the tone of the calls, and it became an exceedingly dangerous, very, very threatening

situation. Let me ask you, what was it about the call that changed? Was it a tone, or what was it that made you go? It just became more. They had been doing mostly, and then it turned into, we've been doing just a bunch of silly shit like they'd start off of doing a doing some kind of a bird call and they'd morph off into a jackass

or a donkey brain or a or a cow moon or a crow calling or something and just just doing a bunch of silliness and the thing is we were getting really uneasy because Sammy had the thermal imaging

the thermal device and he was he was picking up at least two working their way in behind us that weren't making any noise whatsoever. And when the name group of them got within about, what, there 20 feet of us, something like that,

there was nothing I'd say at least 20 yards. We were in a, what had been an old parking area, sort of a turnaround area. And back, right around the edges of that was

a bunch of thick underbrush and stuff. You know, very thick underbrush. But then behind that, there were barely open time woods. When they got to the back side of that thick brush, all of a sudden, it changed from all the bird talls and all the other stuff and the, you know, imitating a lot of different animals and, you know, a bunch of whooping and carrying on to growls. And I can't even really describe it, but the types of calls changed in the way they've

were delivered changed. The volume went up. The fierceness went up. You could tell they were pissed. Yeah, it's like when your cat's happy and your dog's happy and it's, you know, it's barking and whooping and bouncing around and carrying on. And then all of a sudden they get pissed, you know, the mailman comes to the door or the UPS truck pulls up in your driveway and they start raising hell, you know.

Or your cat's had enough enough and he wants you to. leaving alone or something, you know, or he's mad at another cat. You know, everything changed. I gotcha. And it was in a split second. But then they started charging through that brush and two or three of them popped out on our side of the brush. And that's when he started, you know, physically shoving people into vehicles and slamming doors

and stuff. And Bayer had to run right past the... the bad gum alpha. And I thought he had him. He, you know, he swung at him. At the time, I thought he was trying to kill him and the bearer gets got lucky.

But thinking back on it, I think he was just, you know, trying to, you know, get the hell out of here and, you know, go. He was sort of like, you know, your grandma swatting you on the butt and you get out of the house, you know, while she was trying to clean the house or something, you know. Get on out of there, you know. He was just trying to get him up and overgras.

have. I wanted to ask you, Matt, do you ever, because I think I already know what Tim and Jim's answer is going to be, but I wanted to ask you, do you ever get burned out on this topic where you think, God, I just wish someone would shoot one, drag it in, and let's be done with this. You know, what I get tired of is the community of people around it. All the politics and the drama involved whenever we're all trying to get the same answers and people get involved and kind of screw all that up i i pray that uh you know it's officially recognized or brought in or one of my friends gets the answers i'm looking for you know in my lifetime but to be honest uh inside mentally i think about it all the time you know whether i'm in contact with others or not

And whenever I do get burnout with the community, you know, I'll leave it, I'll sign off or whatever and be gone for a few months or so. But, I mean, it's still in the back of my head. I can't unexperience the things I've experienced. You know, I can't unsee the things I've seen. And the fact that this thing is out there, I mean, some people, you know, call it lucky if you've been fortunate enough to see one and others, you know, call it a curse. and I think it falls somewhere in between. What about you, Bear? Do you think one should be shot?

I don't know if it would do any good if one's ever shot. I don't think entities in place in this country will not allow it to be recognized as something that does exist. I've done saying too many little things that, you know, we go back to the common sense part of it again, that when you start dealing with something like this, you go to locations and you find numerous tracks, numerous physical evidence like TP formation, things like this. You got a following or a pack of friends that you communicate with all time. I've been to So-and-So National Park last week.

I'm going back in two weeks. Then you go back in two weeks, and the entities involved, I'd rather not mention what entities they are. They know who they are better than anybody. I guarantee you that a representative is probably going to listen to this show. When you see they do a slow burn in that location and all the physical evidence just happens to be burned to a crisp.

And then the biggest kicker of it all is when you walk and find the spots where these footprints were left. anybody would have a eye tooth to have had a plaster cast of one of these footprints. They was my size of print, 16, 17 inches long, probably about 8 or 9 across the ball of the foot.

I mean, there's no doubt what you're looking at. Then you come back to that same spot, and they didn't even bother to get the dirt from the same location to fill up the holes with. They just got a dirt pound. put in the back of a dump truck, show up where these footprints are located at, and then they get that different composition of dirt and put it straight on the darn footprint. In other words, what you're looking at, you're looking at two, you're looking at discolored

locations where it placed its feet. I mean, it's so obvious it stinks. Something out there is keeping this from existing. My thought is it's going to be exceedingly difficult. if not nearly impossible for a private citizen to inform the world or to do what it takes to prove that this thing exists. They're just, it's just way too difficult. What's going to happen if they're ever admitted to exist, it's going to be, you know, I think it's going to be the government to decide, okay, well, let's say, we, you know, I think they can handle this now.

So they'll just go ahead and admit it and release some, they'll release some, you know, quote, new, unquote evidence that they've uncovered to prove that Sasquatch exists. But it's not going to come from somebody like, you know, me or Bear or you or Matt or anybody. I don't believe that there's any way that a private citizen is going to be allowed to present the evidence to prove that these things exist. What's your take, Tim, what's your take on why they're covering it up? You know, for one thing, it would cripple the logging industry. You know, look what the spotted owl did. You know, to logging up in your part of the country.

You know, look what the snail daughter did to a dam there in the Tennessee River system. It'll totally disrupt the forestry industry and probably would end up closing a large amount of, you know, national forest and public property. There would be such an outcry to protect their habitat and everything that they need help, that they've got to be protected in spite of the fact that they've gotten along just fine for tens of thousands of years without our help. There'll be a huge outcry to protect all their habitat and everything, and it'll ruin it for hunters and fishermen and backpackers, hikers, campers,

and it would just about cripple the National Park system probably and a large part of them, as well as National Forest and other public lands. Just look at the liability that would come from it. I mean, one day it's existing, you know, and yesterday it wasn't. And then your ain't Matilda didn't make it back from that trip in that park and y'all never could fully explain what happened to her, so that's got to be it.

Let me go find a lawyer. I mean, it's done gotten pretty thick in every direction you can look at. It's definitely one of the main reasons why it's being covered up. I think there's a lot of other reasons why it's possibly being covered up. You're right, Bearer. I mean, all the people have gone missing. You know, how are you going to explain that? You know, my grandmother disappeared there and they didn't have a great reason on what happened to her.

She just vanished. And so I could see lawsuits starting to pop out from this. You said earlier, why did we do the show on Bigfoot Outlaw Radio about horse and cattle molestation of all that? Actually, it opens up our subject line so we could cover and speak of other things that we know of or have dealt with in the past that is associated with Bigfoot that we haven't heard many people want to address. One of the things, and I'll just touch it very likely, is does this thing and has this thing ever produced a human offspring with, say, a human female? And, you know, that's just a question that's out there. And once this is allowed to exist, see, you have questions like that that have come forward out of the whole mix, that a lot of people will not stand still long enough to even want to understand or even

contemplate about. You're right. There definitely is a lot of questions and not many answers, very few answers. It would be nice for it to come out. It'd be nice to get all the answers. You know, I think the major answer I'd want to know is what exactly is it? Right. You know, I've been told many different things.

And a lot of people laugh at the conspiracy thing. They laugh at the government covering up and they say, oh, come on. you know, the government has better things to do. And you'd be surprised. I'm like you guys. I've ran through a lot of, I've come across a lot of different things that really makes me think this is absolutely being covered up. And it wouldn't shock me if they're listening to this show. Like you said, Bear, I had to laugh when you said that.

When's your guys' next show? Of our last show, it will be up there this weekend, probably on Saturday or Sunday. It's usually whenever I finished getting it ready and uploaded and everything, and then I release it on our fan page on Facebook. Facebook group the Bigfoot Outlaw Hideout. That's kind of our group page that we hang out at a lot and interact with the listeners of the show and anybody that wants to ask us questions. The Bigfoot Outlaws, Matt, Cumbow, and Bear,

go to the Bigfoot Crossroads on YouTube. subscribe to these guys. I really enjoy the show, you guys. It's probably one of the few Bigfoot podcasts I actually listen to, and I'm honored that you guys could be here for my 200 show. Thank you so much for coming on, you guys. It's our privilege with us. We appreciate it, man. Yeah, it is a privilege, and we do appreciate it. Thanks, fellas. And that wraps it up for tonight.

200 shows down. Hopefully we can knock another 200 out. Thank you guys so much for listening. Thank you for making the show what it is. If you've had an encounter, you'd like to be on the show. Shoot me an email. My email address is Wes at Sasquatch Chronicles.com. Until next time, everyone, have a great night. The country faster than the coronavirus and wagering week is your antidote.

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