Sasquatch Chronicles - SC EP:243 The Big Thicket Saga

Episode Date: August 13, 2016

What happened to the big thicket team in Texas? Why is Sasquatch being covered up? Bob Garrett and Tim Sermons will be my guests for an up coming show. Remember they had their Sasquatch expedition shut down by several law enforcement officials, now you get to hear it first hand from the guys, what really happened? You heard Steven from Texas give his first hand account of the law enforcement raid that took place now you get to hear what led up to that situation and the aftermath.

Five, five, four, four, three, three, two, one. One. When I had come down this hill, I had seen this creature cross the road. They would have ripped my locked door from my truck, extracted me from my vehicle, and no one damn thing I could have done about it. This thing I got to notice in its eyes. His eyes was real, real evil, real sinister looking.

You know, the look it was given me. Get somebody out here. What's going on now, sir? That son of a bitch is about six foot. Sir? Yes, I'm looking right heading. Sasquatch Chronicle. A place where people share their accounts.

Let's start the show. We just finished getting our tents up and everything else. We look up and here comes a line of about six to eight. I don't remember the exact amount. I know there's a minimum of six. I want to say there was eight. SUVs all coming right down the road, pulling right into the camp area. And they surround the whole camp.

I mean, it's like a drug rape that it was this obvious show of force. First thing they do is tell us all be calm. They disarm everyone who's carrying a weapon. And then they proceed to separate us. And they start, they first say separate us out into a couple of groups. They keep us there for about 10 and 15 minutes. The primary agent singled out Bob. He demanded, you know, to know where Bob was at that point.

right when they come in. I remember hearing that. And they proceeded to question us. Now, I'm not going to go into what the questions were. These guys, I think, still have ongoing legal issues. So I'm not going to say what questions were being asked. I will say they seemed like ridiculous questions. They were petty.

They did not seem to make sense at the time for what was actually going on. We all lined up. We all, you know, we were asked. We gave them our answers. And for the next two hours, after that, we were just standing there, isolated from each other, and they would hit people individually.

They'd go up and they'd go and ask them, you know, pull them aside and ask questions. They, you know, pull someone else aside and ask them questions. Their show of force was more of the quiet intimidation. Just stand here for 30 minutes and don't say, anything. You know, that kind of a thing. And they kept this up for about two or three hours. During this time, they'd start asking questions and making statements, and it became obvious

they had been listening to us before they came to the camp. Welcome to the show, everyone. Thanks for being here tonight. The Big Thicket watch group, Bob Garrett, Tim Sermons, Mo, all those guys were trying to do expeditions for people. They wanted to take people out in certain areas where they've had encounters, kind of show them what they know, and then things went bad really quick with regard to the government. Back on the episode you just heard from Stephen, who was a participant of that expedition, he was explaining from his perspective what was going on. They had just set up camp.

All of a sudden, they get, you know, six to eight SUVs rolling on and on them. Law enforcement gets out, kind of gets on top of these guys, separates everyone, a lot intimidation going on. And keep in mind, these people are looking for Bigfoot. I mean, I don't understand why that doesn't shock anyone. But anyway, they go through, they separate all these guys. You heard Steve's side of the story with regard to what happened. And I have Bob and Tim Sermon's on the line, and they are going to tell their side of the story on what happened. Bob, welcome to the show. Thanks for being here tonight. Hey, how you doing, Wes? Doing pretty good. I'm doing pretty good. I'm glad to hear you're doing better.

And I also want to welcome Tim Sermons to the show. Tim, thanks for coming on. Hey, no problem. How are you guys? Doing well. There's been kind of a situation out there in Texas. And I was kind of, I'm glad you guys decided to come on and talk about, you know, what's been going on down there. Maybe, Tim, if you would start from the beginning, kind of give the audience a timeline of how this whole thing exploded.

And Bob, feel free to jump in it at any time. Well, we decided, you know, we were going out and we were doing, we were getting a lot of things and we wanted to share it with people. We came to that conclusion because we were helping some other groups and they were actually getting, they were based on what we were telling them, they were getting, they were getting their own evidence. They were having their own sightings. So, you know, we decided we wanted to share it with people what we do and, you know, we know where to go and everything and have the experiences that we have. So we came up with the idea to start to think of watch LLC. So we discussed it. We discussed it

for quite a while. Bob and I went back and forth on even whether or not we wanted to do it. The goal behind it was to just educate people and to have a good time and you know, we wanted to feed them and we wanted to do everything else,

you know, take care of everything so they can just come out and enjoy what we enjoy. So, you know, in that regard we did asked for a fee, but it wasn't like it was a big money-making thing. And, you know... The fee thing, you know, we weren't going to make any money, Tim.

You know, I mean, you know, we already knew that. The fee was basically just to buy groceries for everybody, because when they came out, we didn't want them to have to worry about, you know, buying, you know, their own groceries and coming out and everybody having a separate camp and everything. We wanted it to make it fun for everybody, and so we wanted to have like a chuck wagon cookout in a way,

and everybody eat at the chuck wagon, everybody socialized, and tell what, you know, they've been experiencing, and, you know, the guys could, you know, give them some stories of what they might, come across and the footprints and the sounds we might hear at night and, you know, things of like that. And so it was a good idea. It was a good idea to have the chuck wagon, I guess you might say.

You know, have everybody socialized. Like I said, we just wanted everybody to experience the things that we've been experiencing, you know, helping some of these other groups organize since I have. the maps and everything, you know, made their little expeditions quite popular here in Texas. And so we just decided to do it for ourselves as well. Mostly, I just wanted to, I wanted to gauge the reaction. I wanted to see people's reaction. And people did get scared.

If they would go out the first night, Saturday, you know, they absolutely, and some of them absolutely did not want to go. back in the woods on Saturday. And, you know, we discussed things like that and, you know, gauged, you know, we got their reactions. And a lot of the unbelievers became believers very quickly in just a few minutes. Prior to this, you guys were finding evidence and you guys have been on the show, Bob's been on the show, you guys are finding evidence and you come up with the idea of taking people out. I know you guys looked into the permit, and most people don't know the permit story, because when this whole thing happened, they said, well, you should have just got a permit.

And if they actually knew the backstory on the permit, it's a little shocking. At what point did you decide, hey, let's go get a permit, and then what happened? Well, Bob researched and I researched what kind of permit we needed. We found absolutely nothing. So there were quite a few participants on the very first expedition. So we thought we were well within right by what we were doing because we were told if there was no more than 25 people, we wouldn't need a permit.

That was the initial information that we received. Well, the minute we got out there, it was Friday of that very first expedition. Here comes the feds. They rolled in on that one. Now, we haven't really talked about that, but they did. They rolled in on that one. and they said you can't do it. You don't have a permit.

You have all this other stuff. So after, you know, they detained. And see, I wasn't there. I came at the camp when everything was finishing up. You know, then at that point we figured, well, crap, we're going to have to go to the main ranger station and sit down and have a conversation with those guys. So we talked about that.

It was me, Bob and Whalen, and that's what we decided we were going to do. So I can't remember the date we went, but we went in there. And, you know, after everything that we've been through and not ended to get into other things that have happened prior to this with our experience with some of these fellows, I thought it would be an outstanding and awesome idea if I took an audio recorder in there, recorded the whole conversation. So we went in there, had a meeting with the head ranger. and we were sitting there talking to him and you know, we told him what we wanted to do and everything and he goes, well, give me just one minute, let me get this other guy.

This other guy walks in, this guy must have been seven foot tall. But he was a BLM guy, the Bureau Land Management guy, and he's over the dog on Ranger. So the five of us were sitting there having a discussion about the permit. And when I tell you, it was like, trying to cut a deal with the mob. That's exactly what it was like.

They said, well, you can't, you can do this as falls under outfitting and guiding. We would need to see your financials. We would need to see what your business plan is. We would need to see all this stuff. And he said it has to be worth our while in order to do this. And getting a permit can be very difficult. Not to say that it wouldn't, it can't be done, but it could be very difficult. And you told them that you planned on taking people out to look for Bigfoot, right?

Absolutely. And they didn't bat an eye. It's a matter of fact, you know, with all my run-ins with them before Tim, you know, came on to the scene and into our ends with them in the first place. One of the first things they wanted to know from us was they wanted to know the migration habits. I guess they had some of the migration, but they wanted to know what I knew about migration of these creatures. They did not deny, pardon me, they did not deny at all that these creatures existed.

They wanted us to fill in some of their blanks for them. Yeah, that's exactly right. They didn't, neither one of those guys batted a single eye at the whole situation. They kept going on about the money. It's got to be beneficial for this. Getting a permanent permit for this is going to be extremely difficult, if not impossible. He said, I come from Colorado where we do a lot of outfitting and guiding, but here in Texas,

we don't know if we're going to do all that stuff. And then they said they would have to open it up for bidding. And then he goes, you know, part of the problem is this is what he said, this is just kind of blew me away. He was part of our problem is we don't know where big foot or Sasquatch goes. I'm going to have to get with the biologist and see what their opinion is of this. And he goes, we may even have, and this, this blew me away. We may even have to rely on experts such as yourselves.

That whole statement blew me and Bob Wood. We're like, what? You got a BLM guy telling us this? You know, he just, the big thing with that was he kept, we were in there for an hour. He kept talking about the money and everything else like that. So what they also didn't know is we actually had a copy from another group of a special use permit that they authorized them. And they basically told us that we couldn't get the permit or they told us they would email. They would mail us a permit.

When we got to that point and talking about it, he specifically said, well, we can do that, but we would have to agree on one general location that you could go. And I asked the question. And I said, where can we go or where can we not go? And he said, you cannot go anywhere west of I-45. He said your areas that you can go to would be east out of Huntsville, Texas, north of 190, south of 190, all the way over to I-59. So he cut out half the dang forest and half the dang forest. Well, we won't get into that.

And I want to go more into this conversation that you had with them, but did he say why you couldn't go that in those areas? He claimed some woodpecker. They said they had some sort of breeding population, the largest reading population of this woodpecker in the entire south. And he said that they had been have a law on their books that you, even if you're hiking on the Lone Star Trail, you cannot camp within 100 feet of any cavitated tree. That law, so dang vague, find a tree that doesn't have a hole in it. You know what I mean? Yeah, that's ridiculous. So, you know, and then he was talking about doing controlled burns.

Well, they had already done the controlled burns. And then he was talking about logging operations. You know, but we know where all those are. And I'll tell you what, everything west of 45? They had done that a couple of years ago. They're not doing any logging over there. They're not doing any control of burns over there. They don't want us over there.

That was made plain and simple. Do not go over to west of that road, I-45. Do not do it. Don't take people in there. Don't go over there. That's just really kind of odd to us. Had you guys been in those areas? I'm not, I mean, you guys drove me everywhere when I was down there.

Had you guys been in those areas he's talking about? Every one of them. You're about the parmint. I want to back up just a little bit to make it a little more clear for the people that are listening. You know, as we were helping these other groups, they would go get their permit and they would have it, you know, the first day. And they didn't pay for the permit, which is a special use permit. A lot of the times. But a lot of times, but most of the time they didn't need a permit.

They were told if they had, you know, 25 or less people or whatever, that there was no permit needed. Right. And we're talking about the BFRO, right? Yeah, I'm just not naming any names. Oh, okay. Sorry. Go ahead. That's okay.

Anyway, yeah, you know, they had what helped them out with and showed them on the maps, you know, my maps. You know, they had a good time. They had sightings, and, you know, I think like 14 of them had a, had. had the sightings of the same squarches. But, you know, that's beside the point. The point is that we were working on that clarification to me that we didn't need a permit as long as we stayed under 25 people. Okay, so, you know, that was fine.

And so in the beginning, we fully thought that we were totally told. within our ride, out there, you know, places, and we didn't need a permit. I had been doing it for years and had never been bothered. And so we thought it would be, you know, no different with us, but I should have known because I have had run-ins with the feds since, you know, before then. And I should have known that I would be differently. Yeah, I would be treated differently. And sure enough, they sped, they interrogated me for, but there was a lot of, I guess, I don't know, we don't have to get into them.

But I just wanted to clarify that one of the reasons why we didn't go and get the permit in the beginning of 25 or, and needed no permit. And that's what we were working on. That's the way they worked with the other group for years and years. I thought that we would be no different than the other group, but it escalated from there for us. Before you guys get into that, what kind of run-ins did you guys have with the feds? Well, we're to start on that one.

Bob's had quite a bit more experience with them than I've had. But, you know, we've been out in the woods. And, you know, you can go back to your insider episode that you've done, not the most recent, but the one you did where, with Ken, I think was his name, and where we were in the woods, and we were getting shot at.

And that guy told you when, where, what time we left, everything, and we were getting shot at, that's the truth. And that was not a very small caliber gun that was being shot at us at all. Oh, brother. You know, so that's happened.

We've been shot at a few times out there. Can you say, you know, the same night that that was coming out, that that happened? We were going down the road and here comes a car right up on us, a cop car, and turns his lights on, and it comes around us and turns on down the road. So that's the kind of thing is that I've had more experience with them face-to-face. I have not had too many. Bob's had way more, and I know some of those are a little sensitive, so I don't know how much he's going to want to say. but that's

that's been mainly my experience with them at this point until all this well you know Tim when you first the first day you came out with us and then you started really coming out you know I told you I said don't be surprised

Game Ward and Legal agents come out here and you thought that's crazy I know you did I told you about the hell. And then what happened on the corridor? Yeah, Wes, you've been to the spot. We were down at this one particular place.

This particular place we always go, and there's just hardly enough room to turn around, so I always turn around and back in and face my way out because you can't go anywhere. You can't go straight once you get to the end. We're sitting there. Bob and I, we have the windows down. We had our audio recorders,

and then off to our right, which would be going north. Up River, you can hear we hear three or four extremely awesome fricking squatch calls. And I'm telling you not five minutes

after that happened. You hear the helicopter coming and he's flying low right across the lake. It comes right, right to where we are. He's got the spotlight on. He's spotlight in the ground and everything. He didn't light us up, but he put that spotlight in front of us. I don't, if he's

saw us, he did. I mean, I don't know how he didn't. And then he turned and went north to where those calls came from. So that was my first, and we actually reported the helicopter flying over, but I mean, he was so low that the tops of the trees were blowing, you know, from us rotors.

So, and it was, it was most definitely a Black Hawk helicopter. Well, they hover over our camps occasionally with their spotlights on. What these are? These are actually called little birds. They're small, you know, smaller than a black. They're called little birds. And they're, they also are, because I'm familiar with them,

they are equipped with night vision and also, you know, heat seeking. These things have always, you know, they've always followed us down the trails that we go through. If we're on the car door, which is a migration area for these things, I think there's ground sensors out there. And what they do is they come out and they spotlight us at night, spotlight us occasionally. It's

not an everyday occurrence, was the fact that we would get followed. We would get followed all the time from into the National Forest and then there would be an apparent Department Police are

the feds. I'll just say it the feds. They're not just aren't police and they're not just, they have their own federal agents. So, I mean, you know, we've had run-ins with them. You know, they haven't been as aggressive as with this situation. Well, let's, and so let's go back to the permit. You guys are trying to get the permit. How does, how do you guys, he's saying you can go into these areas, but don't cross over here,

don't go to this area. And how does that conversation kind of end? He just said, you know, that's where he said, I don't know where. Bigfoot goes. I don't know this. I'd have to getting the permit, I'll be happy to email you the permit or not email, mail you the permit application,

but I can't guarantee you anything. It has to be within the government's interest. It has to be beneficial to the government in order for it to even be considered. And at that point they didn't even guarantee us anything because they said if they were going to do it, that they would open it up to bidding

to other groups. and everything to see if they wanted to do this. And, you know, with the government, they're going to go the lowest bid. So, you know, that was pretty much kind of how it went down. To the Senate sent the application to us. I knew that they were never going to do it. But, you know, we kept them out and checked them out and checked them out.

And neither one of us got anything. Our business address never got anything. And Whelan, you know, who is pretty much a part of us, He went in there to get a permit to go into what we call Monkegon. He was just innocently going in there because I think he was going to take his girls or something. Yeah, his children. You know, of course, we were going to come out there at night and do some camping and everything. The thing about it is that he saw this Frank.

Matter of fact, Frank was basically watching him. and he told Frank and reminded him the permit, you know, the applications for these permits. And, you know, Frank said, well, you know, I've been busy with, you know, broken pipes and stuffed up plumbing and stuff like that, some of the campgrounds and everything. and, you know, but it doesn't take you five minutes to permit, but an application for a permit in the mail. You know, I mean, the secretary could do that. You know, it's not a big deal.

But the thing about it was, is that he was issued a permit to this area, and it was that 10 minutes that he left the Forestry, headquarters that he got a telephone call, they pulled his permit. Yeah, that's Wayland, yeah. Yeah, that's Wayland. They pulled his permit. From going into the monkey bomb? Yeah, they called him and told him in the camp.

They told him the camp area was full and that they couldn't, that permit was no good. And she was looking at the wrong calendar day or something like that, which is a bunch of crap. Because I can either deny or confirm we still went in there that night and there was not a soul in that place. allegedly, you know, so that's proof of positive they were just screwing around with us. Yeah, so when you guys were trying to get the permit, had you guys done any outings yet? You guys had done a couple of them, hadn't you? We did the one, and that's when the, I don't know, the, what was it, Bob?

The game warden showed up. Right. The game warden showed up. The game warden was bored. I mean, he didn't give it to him. the the two park police

who work real close to the federal agents uh the park agents uh they were there and then the agent himself was there the federal federal agent was there

and uh yeah they talked to us for a long time and you know wanted to know all kinds of information that really if he was just going to give us a ticket you know I had nothing to do with anything. He's the one that told us to go down there and do that. I was trying to, you know, get him to, I was trying to get him to make me understand why, if these other groups have been doing this for years, why are we being busted doing exactly the same thing that they're doing on the, you know, the same way? And basically, they don't want, us to let people know what we know.

They wanted to know what I knew, and I wasn't going to tell them. And they were real interested in my maps and stuff like that. But I wasn't going to let them, I wasn't going to give any of that stuff up. So anyway, I got my ticket, and everybody had to leave. I had to get out of there right now, and, you know, all my people, Or, you know, well, not my people, but, you know, all the guys had to get out of there right now. So, you know, I didn't have a choice. I had to go or go to jail.

Everybody went to a different spot. But they had a good time there, too. Is this the second incident, Bob? Or the first one? This is the very first one. This is the very first one. And on my ticket, it said January. January.

Well, this is within February. And I'll get to some of that about the courthouse and that little tidbit of information right there. It said January. We had not been out in January. We were still, me and Tim were still talking about permits and what we need to do legally and everything else in January. No one had ever been out in January. It was February that people came out. One of the other things about that first meeting, Bob, I don't know if you want to talk about it or not.

But, you know, we had the satellite camp because do you want to talk about the other part of the thing? Yeah, I'll talk about it. I don't care because we've been to court. Everything's done. I want everybody to know one thing, though. I really do apologize. Me and Tim from the bottom of our hearts totally apologize that we have left so many people in limbo

out there. But the reason why is because we were told we could not contact any of the

participants, any other participants from that night that we got really busted and they

came in with like seven, eight cars and everything that last night, not the first one.

But we could not, but we, we could, could not talk to any of these people, or we would get more tickets. And so we didn't. And I know a few people got upset about it and everything, but there was nothing that we could explain. And I know that we were being monitored, being, you know, watched and everything. And so we could not speak to these people. We did not know how they were

monitoring us exactly. But they were. We conform to just a total blackout of not speaking to anyone. Tim and I did, and I just wanted you all to understand that. We could not do anything. And we conformed to that to keep ourselves further out of trouble. And so Tim had mentioned the satellite camp. Oh, what's the satellite camp? Yeah, the satellite camp. You know, people were asking to, you know, do some satellite camping, and there's a place. It's a pond. It's a beautiful place, but, oh, my God, you know, it's like two miles into the middle of nowhere.

So we went out there, we were setting it up, and Tim and Waylon and I, you know, we took out a bunch of, and I have this big trailer, and we had to pull a fight to kill. It's hard to kill Tim and Whalen. But I'm not laughing at you guys, but it was kind of funny. Thank you, Mr. Yeah. And both of you all decided we're not doing this again. Yeah, we're not taking anything out there again.

Well, my sons, they were going to be in charge of the satellite camp, and a lot of people wanted to go. They had gone. And they were setting up the tents and getting ready for everybody to come out there, getting ready with the campfire and the food that they would cook and things like that. Well, they had walked down. They had to make several trips of that two miles back up to their pickup truck. But people would really like it because there's a lot of activity out there.

But anyway, my son's got shot at. my son's got shot at some of the rounds weren't but about 25 feet away from them and believe me if you've been in combat 25 feet is 25 feet too damn close you know yeah my uh Travis my son well he pulled his gun he he was looking for something to shoot back down range but he couldn't see him and uh then the shooting stopped well they set they sat in there and they're you know watching very closely and nothing had happened, nothing else happened for a while. So they got up and they started moving and they moved on to the camp. Well, they called me and told me

that they were being shot at. And I told the, I was in the middle of talking to the agent, the agent. And I told them, I said, well, here, talk to him. And I gave him the phone. I said, people are shooting at my sons. Well, he didn't want to take the phone and took it, and he talked to him, and they all rushed out and everything. They came in a whole different way than we know anyway, and we've been out there for years.

And as a matter of fact, they came in from no man's land. That's what I call it, no man's land. Now, when you say they came in, are you talking about, okay, is this the second time you guys had been interrupted with the federal agents, or is it still the first time? It's still the first. Still the first expedition, yes. And you said the agents came in from no man's land. What does that mean? Basically what it is is there was one road that skated off that we would walk in.

And if you had a key, you could drive down part of the way. There was another way in there that we didn't know about. And they came in their vehicles completely around a completely different way and came in behind them. And that's what he means by that. They came in a completely different way. We had no idea. We had no idea. There was even a way to get back there that way.

So they came in from just a random position, not the normal way you would drive into this camp. Yeah, they didn't take the direct route. They took an indirect route, which didn't make any sense either unless they were already out there. They didn't care that my sons had gotten shot at. what they cared about was what was in the tents, what was in their backpacks, what was in, you know, what was in their pouches, their tins of food and stuff like that. What was in there? Do you all have any drugs? You know, wear your guns and all of this stuff and everything.

And Travis, you know, Travis is really quiet, but he's kind of like me. He's got a hell of an attitude. And he told him, he said, hey, look, we got shot. We got a shot at right down here. He said, I can take you down here and show you where we got shot at. The bullets hit the trees. And they waved him off and said, oh, no, no, no, no, no. Don't worry about that.

Yeah, that's exactly what they told him. Travis was mad, boy, and so it wasn't Brandon. That's odd. You think that'd be high up on the priority, someone getting shot at generally, and very close to where. Well, I'm fixing to get to that. that's something that really upset me and shocked me. And I'm fixing to get to that in just a second, okay? They left my sons out there in danger.

When does law enforcement of people leave people out in the middle of nowhere where they have to walk down past where they just got shot at in the middle of danger instead of driving them to their vehicles. When does that happen? It doesn't happen. So we got a group together, and we started out there, and believe me, if somebody would start shooting at me, I was going at it with my semi-auto. I mean, I was just going to go at it, and everybody out there with us, Tim, Whalen,

and a couple of people from the participants. We wanted them to shoot at us. I was mad. These were my boys, and they left them in danger. Well, anyway, Travis showed us the trees, and, lo and behold, my God, man, somebody had gone up those trees with a tree spurs on and dug the damn bullets out of those trees.

They dug the bullets out of those trees. You could see each tree that the bullets hit. You could see the spikes that went up the trees and were, you know, it was torn up around underneath of them because of the spikes. And, you know, I'm a tracker. You know, me and Tim, we discovered where they came in from and where they went back. And, you know, we got pictures of where the holes were dug out. And maybe I'm telling too much, I don't know.

But anyway, one of the things I discussed with the Head Ranger and Frank, the BLM guy, and I don't know if I should use the name or not, is this fact. And it's on tape. We have it all on tape. Everything is on tape that we're talking about. I asked them. I told them, I said, if we have to go before the judge, I am going to ask the judge why. this happened.

Well, they didn't like that. He said, well, I can't speak to the law enforcement part of the force. They don't report to us. And I don't know what their policies are. But anything that they do is designed to keep people safe. Now, that comment right there made no sense whatsoever. It did not fit what was asked of them. So how I was getting shot at keeping people safe?

And this is coming from that guy. You know, it just blew us all away. Yeah, it's interesting. You know, if you were talking to a cop and he's talking to you, like, let's say, for a speeding ticket and someone runs up and's like, hey, someone's shooting at me over here, you think he'd drop what he was doing and run over there and see what's going on. And these guys were just totally uninterested in what was said about being shot at. They didn't care, it seemed like. Yeah, they didn't care. They didn't care at all.

My idea was that, and I'm not. going to quote the agent here, but they knew that the boys were getting shot at. They already knew that the satellite camp was going up, and I think that they knew that the boys were getting shot at. And so what happens next? Well, after that, that was pretty much the end of that whole meeting. He assured us that we would have it within a few days of the application for the permit, and we kind of left it at that. Well, wait, hold on a second. They did tell us, Tim, or was it you, or Whalen asked, well, where can we go?

It was wonderful. Where can we go? And they told us Four Knott Road. We could go there. Yeah, and that's, well, that's out the Big Woods. Well, I know Big Woods real well, and I wasn't going to take anybody in there. I'm checking it all out and everything and said it was just fantastic. It is.

It's fantastic. But there's a lot of stuff. goes on there, and there's a lot of squashes in there. What kind of stuff goes on in there? People get killed up and down to that part of the Volstar Trail. I don't want to go into that stuff. So Whalen checks it out, and then what happens? Well, see, we thought that we were perfectly fine going into that area

because that's where they told us we could go. That was the impression we were left with, yep. So we thought we were totally within our management. means, legal means to be there because we were told by the BLM guy and the head ranger hey you guys can go over there that's what we did and that's why

we continued with the expeditions and they turn and of course you know they turned out to be really good but they're extremely aggressive over there and you know people were getting really scared they didn't

want to go back out the next day which was fine you know not all of them wanted to go out. Some of them still wanted to adrenaline jockeys, you know what I mean. But the whole thing is that as far as the permit goes, they told us we could go in there.

We went in there, we thought we were built within our illegal, and they went off real good without a hedge for a good while. All of a sudden, we are just basically stormtrooped. And if you would kind of talk about what happened, Tell us what happened in that whole raid, I guess, for lack of a better term.

Well, one of the first things that happened, of course, you know, they wanted to know. They came out first. The police, the park police came out first. And, you know, they wanted to know people paid and stuff and all this stuff. And, you know, a lot of these people paid a long time ago. And some of them paid, you know, just recently. And I didn't want to help any trouble for these people out here. no none of these people shouldn't have but but I did

it was they left and within 15 minutes I'm pulling in there with guys and you know in their their bulletproof vests and you know all of this stuff and everything course you know they knew where I was at and they came to the trailer I said we can have a talk about me asked me and said well can I come in I said I told you come on in and one of them stood outside the door

and he said, you know, we know these people, you know, have paid, and we're one of the people that, you know, paid. You know, it was us. He said that, you know, we've been having y'all surveillance. He said that, he said they have a recording, you know, me telling the people don't say anything, you know, if they're asked if they paid. And I just said, well, you know, I'll tell you what. I picked up my phone, and he told me to put my phone down. I told him, I want my lawyer. He said, I'll talk to you and your damn lawyer together if you want me to,

and I said, well, I'm trying to get my lawyer right here on the phone. I'll put your phone down. So I just threw my phone down. And I said, well, I'm not going to say anything else to you without my lawyer present. And so he tried to question me several times, and I just said that I invoke, my Miranda Wright speak to you anymore. We know about that. We know this. We know that.

He said, I want to know what you know. I said, I don't know nothing. I only want my lawyer. Ask me questions about Tim. Ask me questions about Mo. You know, another guy that I'm not going to say his name on here because they can, I know that they're going to be listening.

Oh, they also told me, West, that they have people who monitor your show constantly in case you didn't know. Always nice to have new fans. And I said, you know, all I want is my lawyer. So he got frustrated and he got up and he left. He told me he said, do not leave this, do not leave your trailer.

Do not come out there. He left. They shut my door. I was instructed not to come out, not talk to anybody. So they started interrogating everybody out there from what I understand. I don't know what happened out there because I wasn't allowed to go out there and be among the people and listen to what was being said and what was, you know, they were asked. But they were apparently bringing people to their car, and apparently they were recording them,

getting statements from them. And, you know, they did it with Mo. they did it with Whalen and some of the other ones and everything and they knew their guy's names.

They knew all our little secret names for every they had actually taken two of our game cams

that had just been put up and it says in their rules and regulations their rules and regulations those game cams

can go up for 24 hours. Those game cams weren't up more than two hours and they took them and they told us that they took them. That's theft. They came back over to my trailer after the people

and they told me that I had to leave now. If I was still here in 15 minutes to put me in jail or I would get another ticket and everything. They told me I couldn't leave anything

with the people. I couldn't give them anything. I couldn't give them anything. I couldn't show them anything. I couldn't show them any videos, audios, pictures. I couldn't show them nothing. And I couldn't leave anything for them because that would be me giving,

or me providing for them. And that's against the wall, and I would get another ticket. I wasn't even supposed to speak with them. Well, I did stay longer. And we, we ascertained surveillance, And, you know, I try to tell everybody, you know, that I'll try to, you know, be in contact with them and everything.

We finally picked up my trailer and the chuck wagon. I couldn't leave them any food. I couldn't leave them any water. They would just have to be on their own. But they did let Moe stay there until 6 o'clock in the morning, which was good. But he really wasn't supposed to give him anything, you know. Or he would get another ticket. So anyway, we left.

That's really interesting. Yeah, we left and, you know, Mo left and everything. And these people were basically on their own, and I felt sorry for them, but we were being watched. When I left my neighborhood to go to the store or just go down the street, I would have a black or a white SUV on my butt watching me, you know, following where I was going. I couldn't go back out there and take care of these people. I felt horrible about it. Tim felt horrible about it. We discussed it some.

But there was nothing that we could do. And I want the people to know that we didn't mean to desert them. That was not something Bob Garrett does or Tim Sermon does or any of the guys. We did not want to desert them, but we could not go back out there under penalty. of another ticket or possibly jail, and they were following us around. They wanted us to come back out there. They wanted us to...

They wanted to bust us again, and I am sorry about that. You know, it just broke my heart to leave those people out there, and I know that I'm getting off a little bit, but this is what happened. I've seen the tickets, and it is funny, some of the dates aren't right.

I know the one in January. I mean, I can just go off of the show and know that the date isn't right, which seems odd that the date would be wrong. So they had actually been watching you for a while. What did he say to you when he handed you the ticket? Was there any instructions, or what did he, was there a fine on the ticket? No, there wasn't a fine. There was a, we had to go before the judge, it said. I had to go before the judge, which I never.

the district The American The U.S. What should I say prosecuting us. We didn't see a judge. Before we get into that, Tim, you had a run in with this guy

because you weren't there the night that when this, let's call it a felony took place where they rated you guys. What was your running with the guy? Well, I had to work. I had to work several of the expeditions. I had gone, I wasn't out there Friday. I had gone home early, early, early, early

from it just came home and went to bed and got up around four, three, thirty, four o'clock. I had to go to work for seven o'clock. I was going to head out there and I was told that all this, all this stuff went on and I was just kind of blown away. And then I was told that I was given a number and told I needed to call this guy and I called him and he said, well, we need to meet with you and I'm like, what do you need to meet with me for? He goes, I need to give you a citation. And I'm like, for what? For being out in the National Forest?

And I said, I wasn't even out there. And at that point, there's just no point to argue with him. I said, look, all right, okay, I'll meet you. So I drove to their headquarters and sat there, walked in there, and was talking to him, the two feds there. And they said, do you mind if I record this? And I said, not at all. And I pulled out my audio recorder as long as you don't mind me,

recording us. And they didn't have any objections. So I've got that whole conversation recorded as well. It was the same thing. They was trying to interrogate me about Mo, about Bob, everything else. I wanted to know this, that, the other. And I just told them I didn't know anything. They asked me if I was an expert. And I said an expert at a mythical creature, according to you guys, doesn't exist. He goes, well, you're going to have to go before the judge. I said, okay, so I'm going to go before the judge and say I'm an expert of something that the state of Texas says doesn't exist. oh how's that going to go you know but that's pretty much kind of how it went

and he wrote me the ticket and he walked me out walked me back to my truck and he looked at my truck he goes oh you're the that's your truck and I said yeah and he said you're the one that pulled Bob's camper out there and I said yeah I did

I did that on Thursday that's pretty much all he said I got in the truck and left well so he knew your vehicle and everything yeah and my ticket said the same thing that, you know, the other one said it just had no fine on it.

I said it had to appear. And it was a appearance was going to be within 60 days. Well, 60 days came and went. Well, I had this guy's card. So I called him up. I'm like, what's the deal? And he said, well, that conversation was interesting.

He said, you know, the district attorneys do not know what to do with this case. they don't know what to do with it. And I go, so what's the point? And he goes, well, the wills the justice just turned slow. You'll be getting your summons. Like, all right, well, whatever. Anyway, he said, it's not like, he goes,

this isn't any more than a glorified speeding ticket. He goes, it's not like you were out there poaching. Well, when he said that, I said, well, we run across those from time to time in our travels about poachers. And he goes, really? Well, if you do, you can let me know. And he goes, if you scratch my back, I'm not opposed to scratching your back. And I said with this whole situation, he said, yeah, I can, I can intercede on your behalf where the district attorneys, you know, pertains to them.

So Bob and I, Whalen, went out and we knew of about five, six, seven places that they were actively poaching. We documented them, GPSed them. and came on back to the house. And I didn't trust the guy, but we, you know, we went and sent him one, one place. And that'll be a little later. I can clarify what happened with that. But that's pretty much the two conversations that I've had with that fellow. And so what happens next?

You guys go to court? Oh, yeah, we waited, waited, waited. Finally got a notification. All three of us got notified on the same day. of the court date. The court date was August 9th, downtown Houston, Texas at the U.S. District Court. We get down there and it's 9 o'clock in the morning and we get down in there and go up to the courthouse and have to find the place and going there and sit and wait. The point was it 9 o'clock and we go in there and there's a few people in there and the U.S. District Attorney gets up there. He goes, this is equivalent to traffic court.

and they had us all sit in a line of the order which we got there because they were going to just do it that do it that way. Well, they pretty much cleared. We were the first three. Mimo and Bob were the first three in there. We're sitting down there. You know, they hit everybody else. They hit everybody else and got their little tickets

or little speeding tickets or parking tickets, whatever, got them out of the way. And, you know, these two feds are there too. And so then they call us and they sit and they look around, they look around, they look around. Then they go back and they say, sit at the table and they all sit there and talk and talk and talk. Then they come back and get us and say, look, we need to go out in the hallway.

Now, keep in mind, there is no judge in this courtroom at all. We're supposed to be before a judge. There's no judge. We have a U.S. Assistant District Attorney and the two feds. And they pull us out in the hallway, away from everybody. And they say, well, all right, well, Mr. Garrett, you have this and this. Mr. Sermon is and Mr. Mischo, you have this. this amount. And then the Fed say yes, and

$2,000 in restitution. Where is that getting paid to? Directly to the Forestry Service, we'll set that up with you. I mean, it was going in there. It was like dealing with the mob again, all over again. It was like a damn racket.

No judge. Coming to here basically saying that we had to do this deal or not because they basically threatened us $10,000. six months, six months to a year in prison and federal prison. Yeah, if you guys wanted to contest it. Yeah, if you guys wanted to contest it.

Yeah. You know, they said you can just talk about it about yourselves. Or actually even see a judge? Yeah, we didn't even see a judge. There was no judge in there. What I'm saying, though, is how shady is it? It's like, okay, here's the deal. You guys take this deal or if you'd like to speak to a judge and you'll probably go to prison.

I mean, that's, I guess that's our justice system. God bless America. Yeah, no kidding. But, you know, they would have had to prove their case. But, you know, what's to say they wouldn't have fabricated anything. You know, I mean, that, I don't know, I was formed. I was floored by the whole situation. I was floored by the whole situation, Moe was.

But here's the kicker. So we go ahead and agree to the terms, and we go back in there. And so Bob says what they said it was. and then me and Moe, they added an extra fine to us just because it's almost like they decided that right there on the spot, oh, we're going to get it with two fines because they're not going to argue with this. And they said, well, you got one ticket, but you got two charges. I'm sitting there thinking, well, crap, how does that work?

You know, I mean, it's like the freaking mob in action all the way. Yeah, and it's too bad. That's really the way the justice system is set up. It's just for them to collect a paycheck. They don't really care what about justice or the truth. They didn't care about the fact that Tim wasn't even out there that one weekend. They didn't want to see any of it. They told us, Point Black, we don't want to see any y'all have against the officers.

They didn't want to see any evidence whatsoever. They just wanted you to take their plea deal and accept the money that they're not. they wanted you to pay. And that was the end of it. If you go to court, then... We were going to go to jail. Yeah, we were going to go to jail. I mean, they guaranteed us that we

win anything. The funny thing, though, is leading up to this. I contacted probably 15 to 20 lawyers. And I could not

get a lawyer to take the case, and neither could Bob and neither could Mo. They laughed about it. I said it was this is ridiculous. I don't, you'll never, this will never see

the inside of a courtroom. This is ridiculous. I had one guy tell me, I've been practicing law for 50 years and I have never seen this done ever. So, I mean, it's just shady,

shady, shady, shady stuff. Yeah, it is shady. I even ran it past two attorneys and they both laughed at it. They were like, there's nothing really here to, no judge is going to hear this case. These guys are charging to go look

for Sasquatch, both attorneys were like, there's, there's no way a judge is even going to hear this case. This is ridiculous. When I'd spoken with the attorneys, you know, I said that, well, obviously they had been surveillance in these guys for months on end. They told the guys that there was participants I've spoken with that overheard that they were surveillance in these guys for months. The attorneys were blown away by it. They just couldn't believe that, you know, both attorneys just thought this was a joke. And they're like, there's no way a judge is going to hear this. I ran into the same things that Tim did.

And it was the best, this is the best story I've had all months. You know, it's just, but at the same time, it's funny, you know. It's funny, sad that you can't get anybody to represent you in court, and you can't even see a judge. You're forced to take a plea deal. Yeah, it's really interesting. And I don't know if there's going to be a change in tied with how law enforcement handles is. But I know like the Olympic project, when I went up there to Derek Randall's place, when I was talking to some of the Olympic project members, they were saying a state forestry officer likes to come through there and hassle them.

Now, this is a huge piece of property in the freaking middle of nowhere. And I asked him, I said, well, why is he coming by? And it's only when they have groups out there. I guess this guy comes through and, you know, Derek and those guys are out there are some pretty big guys. But I guess he kind of comes through and hassles them, but there's really nothing he can do because it's private land. And you hear, I heard another BFRO member, kind of got nailed with what you guys got nailed with in Oklahoma or Arkansas. Tim and I were talking about it. And I think his fine was like 500 bucks, but they're going to go after the BFRO for it.

But it's just, it amazes me. It's like, does our forestry department have nothing better to do? You know what I mean? You would think poachers and you would think, I know there's a huge drug problem out there in Texas. You think they'd be more focused on people coming up from Mexico. I mean, I hate to sound like Trump, but you guys know what I'm talking about, coming through there. And I know there's a lot of drug activity through that area. You think they'd be really focused on that.

I mean, someone looking for Bigfoot. If I was a park ranger, I'd be like, well, who cares? You know what I mean? We got bigger fish to fry than people out looking for. pick foot. I want to tell you on a very serious note, and you and I have heard something going on. Most people, but, you know, a lot of people aren't going to find them or they're going to, you know, walk into them. Accident. Their accident. I need to know that. I can't get into it. That goes against my, the papers that I signed, and I know this is going to drop. But there's something out there that's bigger.

There's the newbies and all of that. Before you get into this, you need to think about it because you may well something you don't want to know. Before Tim even got with us, we had made that stumble. We would go to a different county. They didn't want us in there, and to say that they wanted to know, I just want to warn people, you go out there running into something that they don't want you to know.

I'm not saying don't do it. Don't, you know, stop doing it. We can't, we still cannot show community. We were threatened about that. Oh, yeah. We were told, we were told without a doubt anything that, anything that's gotten out on, gotten on the public land can be construed as a business venture. And they would prosecute to the fullest extent of the law, anybody that did that. If you take a picture out there, if you get an audio file and you put it up on YouTube and you get money, if money changes hands, they will come after you.

And that was made crystal clear. Now, with that being said, we did ask these guys, can't we still go out there and research? And he said, yeah, we're going to stop you from doing that. As long as there's no commercial enterprise going on, I don't have a problem with any of that stuff. That's how those are his words. We should plan an expedition, not charge, have everyone bring their own food and just go out there and see what happens, see if these guys show up? Oh, they'll show up.

But we can do it. Oh, they're still watching. They're still watching. We can do it. I mean, he's flat out told us as long as there's no money changing hands or anything like that. We can organize. We can do that. There's no money.

We're just out there, big group of friends, you know, out there doing research and stuff. You know, I don't, you know, he's made it crystal clear that that's perfectly fine. But also, whatever we get, remember Tim, whatever we get, stays between us. Yeah. We can't share that, or if we do share it, we could be prosecuted in some ways that they decided. Is it because it was taken on federal land, like video or?

Yes. Because it was taken on federal land. Yes. If it was taken on public land, we could do anything we wanted to with it. private land. I'm sorry, private land. Yeah, you're right, Tim. I'm sorry.

You know, you can do whatever you want to with it, as long as you can prove that you got it off of private land. But if you get it off of, if you get a picture of a squatch, nice, clear, beautiful picture, he said, he said, I don't care. But you use it, there could be repercussions. Tim asked, he said, well, are you going to go after us? us if we do.

And he said, uh, he thought about it for a little while and he said, uh, what, what do you say, Tim? He said, uh,

yeah, he said, uh, it just depends on the circumstances. It would be case by case. But yeah, the, the threat of that would be there.

And that, um, he goes the big key to it is that there's money changing hands. And you know, if you think about it, say you get a freaking awesome thing. You throw it on YouTube. You start paying you.

There's the avenue that they're going to go and they're going to he's going to prosecute you on or get you on. So the whole situation is just totally bizarre. It really is. But you know, the funny thing is I had mentioned, I don't know if we should say this, you know, I told him about the poacher. They actually caught one,

and they caught the guy that we turned in the site because he was in the courtroom with us. Oh, Jesus. Yeah, you got to watch out for those guys, man. Some of those guys, they, you know, if they find out it was you guys, they'll pay you a visit while they're out there. Some of those poachers, man, you don't mess with them. Yeah. But, you know, at the end of all this, we're sitting there talking to the agent.

You know what he asks us? He goes, you know what you guys can help me with? He goes, you guys know what you guys know what you're doing out there. You guys know what's normal, a normal trail, and what's not. Well, we're having an issue right now with the cartel as well, we're having an issue right now with the cartel is what he said. And he goes, if you run across those, just report them to me.

I'm sitting there thinking, cartel, I don't know if I report any of that crap. I like my head on my shoulders. Yeah, no kidding. You want to talk about somebody he doesn't play, it's those guys. Even after all this, he basically made it sound like we were

free to do whatever we want until we run across stuff. Just let him know. It's just crazy. It's like making a deal with the devil. It really was. It wasn't a normal day at court. Not that I've ever gone to court so much, but, you know, traffic court, yeah, back when I was driving, that's how I had to quit driving because a lot of people don't know that, but I do have seizures. So I can't drive anymore.

But, you know, normal traffic court is not like this. I even got to see a judge in normal traffic court. She's the one that just decided I wasn't driving anymore, which was fine. I shouldn't be. Yeah, I just think the whole situation is crazy. It'd be nice to, I'd love to arrange some expeditions where people can just come out and see if we run into problems with these guys. Because I have a feeling they really don't care if money's exchanged.

I have a feeling that's more or less just kind of a, Well, this is what we're after, but really, it's not really what they're after. You know what I mean? Yeah. On a side note, I wanted to ask you guys, Bob or Tim, have you guys ever been in a situation where you're out in the woods and you hear what sounds like children laughing or like a child laughing or a little girl laughing? Actually, it's, yeah. Like kids laughing. Actually, it's one of the expeditions that we had.

Everybody was out. I was at camp. And I think I was with Bob, and we heard it. Yeah. Coming from the woods. So, yeah, I've heard that. I haven't heard it often. And you've heard it too, Bob? Yes, I've heard it quite often, especially when I'm in the woods by myself, you know,

when I was mapping and going through the National Forest a lot, both up north and down here. Yeah, it's interesting. I've had two witnesses on now. in the last two weeks. And these guys didn't really see anything in both of these encounters. But what was interesting is there were two hunters, both in the middle of nowhere. And they both hear this sounds like a little girl laughing or like kids laughing. And I've had a few witnesses on before. And I've always wondered, is that something Sasquash does or is that something else that people are running into? I even had a Native American tribal leader high up in the, on the

reservation and he even talked about that, that he had heard this laughter. And it always, it makes me wonder if it's something Sasquatch is doing or if people are running into something else. Because I believe them. I think that this is going on. I just don't have a great answer for them on what it is their hearing. Well, I can't, I don't, I can't say if it's Sasquatch or not. I just know I've heard the sounds. I don't have an answer for you. The only thing, the Native Americans, my wife's family, they just say that their spirits, I've never gotten anything out of that, out of that, about that, out of them, are my sister-in-law who's novel. They don't talk about stuff like that much, but I don't have a direct answer for you, Wes. I really don't. I would imagine, though, hearing something like that would scare the crap out of you in the middle of the woods.

you know, especially, and you wouldn't think a child's laughter would scare you. Both of the witnesses I had on said it wasn't quite like a child laughing, but that's what they would compare it to. It would still creep me out, you know, being out there and hearing that in the middle of nowhere. There's an area over here that we don't, you know, I don't go into too much. I think Tim and I walked down at a little ways one time, but at night or early in the mornings, we used to hunt this area. Tent Travis and I did. you can hear blood-curdling screams, which really do raise a hair on the back of your neck, and they sound human, you know, just anguished, horrible screams.

And I don't know what all that's about. That's something beyond me. I mean, I'll take that's what you need to be besides the paranormal. I look at it as paranormal, and I don't want to mess with it. You know, it's kind of like the forest lights. There's no way I'm chasing them or anything. else. You know, we see them and, you know, that's fine. You know, they can just go away. I have no answer for any of that. Yeah, it's scary. It's terrifying, especially to hear that.

I've seen the lights, too, with you on that. I don't recommend people chase those lights because they will chase you back. And, you know, like I said, I wasn't sure if it's something, you know, the Navajo add-on, he was, the Navajo had on, I mean, that sounded really racist. The gentleman I had on from the Native American Reservation, he was talking about how Sasquatch laughs. He's heard Sasquatch laugh before. Well, they do laugh. You've heard them laugh before?

Yeah. Yeah, Sasquatch will laugh. They smile. They coon, they crude, crooned to their babies. They do a lot of stuff like that. They have a humor. They, uh, it, it's, it's just hard to explain when you, when you're watching them and you hear this laughter come from them and everything.

And you see them smile at each other, smile at their, they're young. I mean, it's like, uh, I'm looking at, you know, some indigenous people here. But then, but then again, like I always say, I don't understand them. I've said it so many times that they have a humanity, but their humanity, but their humanity is not like ours. It is not developed like ours. And their humanity is on the wild side. I still only believe that they are animals, but I think that they are very close. They're very close to us. You know, I've heard it say, a chief once said they didn't change when man changed. I don't know. I thought that was quite profound. I don't know. I don't know what to

say, other than I'm confused by them and interested in them at the same time. I know that they can laugh. I know that they can cry. I know that they can smile, that they crooned to their young, and they're good with their young, some of them are. Their humanity is just not like ours. I believe that they do have some humanity. But if you look at chimps, if you look at age,

They tend to portray a humanity of some sort, a wild humanity, an undeveloped humanity. Some people out there might understand what I'm saying. I'm not a scientist, you know. I just know what I've observed, and that's the way I feel about it. Totally inside my heart, that's the way I feel about it. humanity is not developed like ours is. Yeah, no, I agree with you, and that's why it's such a confusing subject, because you do hear about them putting on traits or doing things that are very human-like, and then in the same breath, you hear about these animalistic-type behaviors, like you're dealing with a wild animal. And so it is confusing at times.

You know, it would be easier to place this into a mountain lion, a mountain lion is a wild animal, or a bear. or something to where you kind of kind of gauge what you're up against. And sometimes with these things, it's hard to tell what you're up against. What you're looking at out there in my observations is you're looking at something that can't have a compassion, it does have a lot of compassion. But also at the same time, you're looking at something out there that for absolutely no reason, some type of trespass or whatever, a slight that they think that they got

will kill you. Take your head off. Pop you like a grave. You know, we have something in us that well, some of us do anyway, have something in us that, you know, does something to you when you know you've done wrong. You know, you get this feeling.

I don't think they have that. I don't think they ever developed that. I don't think that they know fully right from wrong or what we consider right from wrong, what they consider survival is the best way I can say it because I'm not a scientist, I don't know. It's just what I've seen, Wes. Yeah, I tend to agree with you on it.

I guess the only other thing before we get back to the, you know, just kind of wrap up the whole conversation, I wanted to ask you Bob and Tim what you guys thought about this. I had these two brothers on a couple weeks ago, and I still talk with them, and I absolutely believe this is going on in their first. property. They've even sent me lots of pictures I've gone through. They are one of the brothers, I spoke to him the other day. He said he is, he has a feeling now that they're trying to kill him. And I don't

think it's really paranoid. I really think this is how this guy feels. He said they've focused on him and his brother, his brother lives, I think about five acres down or, you know, a mile down the road or whatever. But he says that, because they're always out at night. This whole place gets, this whole community shuts down at dark. And he's spoken to some of the neighbors around this community. And they've, they said, yeah, these creatures are out here. And that's why, why do you think the place goes to a ghost town as soon as the sun's going down? It's because these things. They feel like they're trying to kill them. But one of the things, going back to animalistic type behaviors that we're talking about, both of these brothers have been chased by these things.

And one night, one of the brothers was chased into his garage. And he ran inside the house. The garage door was still open. The garage was still open. the garage was still open. Well, eventually it left. And when he was trying to get his brother to come down and say, hey, I just got chased by something, they finally go into the garage and they see muddy footprints, huge muddy, human-like footprints. But they also see where this thing had peed while it was chasing one of the brothers. And I thought that was kind of interesting.

You know, for some reason, I can picture a gorilla or some other non-human primate getting so excited of chasing something that it pees or, you know, It's, you know, and it's interesting because he said some of them look kind of humanish. Most of them look very monkey-like across between a person and a monkey, but he said some of them are more human-like. And he said there's one that kind of reminds him of Chabaca. He said, has really long hair. It's matted. It's not the biggest one.

But he said that it directs traffic. And I asked him, I said, what do you mean it directs traffic? And he was saying, well, it does like hand motions. and the rest of them move around like the military. Like you'd see special forces run around. But they're all following the direction of this one. And he said that's what it does. It makes like hand motions.

It clicks with its tongue. The only one that in this whole group where they say they've heard what you describe as like the samurai chatter or someone talking is from what they consider the alpha male. They said it's gray. It's the biggest one. and that's the only when he does this chatter thing, they all kind of come to him. I kind of went off on a tangent.

Sorry, guys, I just wanted to share that with you. I thought it was fascinating, especially at peeing while it was chasing one of the brothers. Well, that's nothing unusual. You know, that's just, it's a mark. They're marking. You can go out there and pee on his pee and come back and it'll have four or five spots

and it'll stink like hell out there. Travis and I did that too. We went out there and urinated all around. We set up some game cams. Well, the game cans were torn off, and they were peed on and everything. Yeah, I didn't show that. But, yeah, it's stuck really bad out there and everything. And, you know, really bad, but don't mark territory when you go out there and you know that they're around.

Yeah, and that's interesting. because one of the brothers said it stunk. He said it were it peed at stunk. Yeah, it'll make it stink. Well, I didn't mean to go off on a tangent with you guys. About that other stuff, I really don't know. I've never seen anything like that before. That's very interesting.

Yeah, I thought it was interesting, too. He said that he's the one that directs traffic. And they say he's the smartest one. And I said, well, what do you mean he's the smartest one? And they said some of them will make mistakes, like they'll throw stuff at the house, They'll go out there and they're standing in the open. This one with the longer hair, he said, never makes a mistake.

He's like the smart one out of the group. He goes, I don't know how to explain it to you, but he's just the smartest one in the group. You know, those brothers, they're just more or less wanting these things to go away. They have good information. If you talk to them, they'll just from their experiences, they'll tell you different things. And some of the things I hadn't heard before. This isn't a research project for them. They didn't know these things were real and they just want them to go away.

So it's a fascinating situation. I may end up flying out there to go check it out. Sounds very interesting. Yeah, it does. I appreciate you guys coming on and just talking about what happened. I know I had Stephen on, and he was describing it from the opposite perspective of you guys of being out there and being questioned. And, you know, he described the show of force that came in. And I just appreciate you guys telling the other side of it and just, you know, what happened from your perspective?

Well, now that it was, now that all this is over, we wanted to tell that sit side of it, Cam and I did. Yeah, we did, but, you know, we would have said things earlier. You know, we haven't been on anything, any kind of media at all, because we were told not to. It's not like we just disappeared, but we did, but it was an intentional thing. We were told not to do it. So we wanted to comply. At this point, compliance is more important than, uh, was more important than anything else.

You know, I think my wife said, she went to court with me and said, you know, those people can do whatever the hell they want to do. And there's nothing you can do about it. Yeah. Well, she hit it on the head. Yeah. Thanks, guys, for coming on and coming on the air.

Appreciate it. Oh, no problem. No problem, Wes. Well, thank you for giving us a chance to tell our side of it now that we can't. Yeah. And that's it for tonight, everyone. Remember, if you've had an encounter and you'd like to be on the show, shoot me an email. My email address is Wes at Sasquatch Chronicles.com.

And for the members out there, keep in mind right around the beginning of September, there's going to be shirts, beanies, all kinds of Sasquatch Chronicles merchandise. I've looked over most of it. I'm actually wearing most of it now. Very comfortable gear. I hope you guys get yourself something. Until next time, everyone, have a good night. Faster than the coronavirus and Wagering Week is your antidote.

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