Sasquatch Chronicles - SC EP:448 It's face changed like it was mad

Episode Date: July 1, 2018

A listener writes "I've had a pretty interesting encounter back in 2010. It took place in Wyoming and I got a pretty good look at two of them and I'm pretty sure there were others with them but I would love to talk to you about it." Spoke to the witness and he said "I was out on a mountain bike riding these trails and everyday I felt like I was being watched. We were helping family move and being 11 years old I was not much help so I rode the trails everyday. I stopped by the river next to the trail when this thing stepped out in front of me. I was in shock. I have never seen anything like this before. It was not a bear. He looked at me and than started doing this mouth popping and clicking sound. The sound was not directed at me. I picked up my bike and started turning around to ride off and it's face changed like it was mad and it started growling at me. That is when the second one stepped out…"

Black thing go from left to right, and I thought, I'm going to die out here and no one's ever going to know. I couldn't believe what my eyeballs was showing me. I'll never forget how evil the eyes were. It was a horrible. I mean, I've never seen nothing that evil. It ran towards me at a rate that I can't even explain, turned and stared at me. And this look of, I just want to kill you. I want to say it was human, but it wasn't.

He was yelling at me to grab a gun, grab a gun. I was like, for what? He said, just grab a gun. And there's footprints all the way to the door of my house. It had went inside my garage all the way to the door. 911, what are you reporting? Get somebody out here. What's going on now, sir? That son of a bitch is about six foot, nine, I don't know.

Do you see him now, sir? Yes, I'm looking right at him. You're listening to Sasquatch Chronicles. Check us out online at Sasquatch Chronicles.com. If you've had an encounter, email me. My email address is Wes at Sasquatch Chronicles.com. Welcome to the show, everyone. Thanks for being here tonight.

Got a great show planned for you tonight. Going to be talking to Miguel. And Miguel actually ran into two of these creatures. One, he got a really good look at. But, you know, he was 11 years old. He was helping family move. move. And as you and I know, I mean, an 11-year-old kid really doesn't do a whole lot as far as helping someone move. So Miguel would take off on his mountain bike and ride around in the back

country. And one day he actually ran into one of these creatures and a second one stepped out. But it's really fascinating to hear Miguel tell the encounter. You know, we all hear about the Ron Moorhead sounds, a mumbling in the forest. And Miguel talks a little bit about that. but when he actually ran into this creature, he talks about this mouth-pop clicking sound it made. And that always fascinates me because I think of there's tribes in Africa. And some of these third world countries where they'll talk, but it's mouth pops and it's clicks. And it reminds me a lot of what Miguel was talking about. If you've had an encounter and he'd like to be on the show, shoot me an email.

My email address is Wes at Sasquatch Chronicles. And if you get a chance to check out the website, Sasquatch Chronicles.com. You can become a member, get additional shows, a lot of cool things on the site. So I hope you get a chance to check it out. Let's actually jump into it. Miguel, welcome to the show. Thanks for much for being here. No problem, Wes. Thanks for having me. Yeah, I really appreciate you being here, man. I'm really excited to talk with you. If you would, would you kind of start from the very beginning. walk us into this encounter. All right. So my grandmother, who's about 97 now, lived out there and land around by herself. And me, my stepmother, my cousin were out there trying to move her stuff, like move her back to her union because she couldn't live by herself anymore.

And we were out there for about a week and a half. And we get there and put one thing about me is I love animals. like dogs, cats. I've seen bears, like elk, moose, deer. Any animal you can think of that doesn't live in Africa. But I've seen so many animals. I just love just being out in the wilderness. I'm always in the forest.

And we got there, and she was in a very small house, one story. So my cousin, my stepmom didn't really need my help really throughout the week. And in my grandmother's garage, she had. I had a not like an old bike, just like a regular mountain bike. And there's bike trails around Lander leading up to Shoshone National Forest. And every day I would just go out and just ride. Like I would leave the house at like 9 o'clock, 10 o'clock in the morning. And I wouldn't come back to about 7 p.m.

I'd just be out just enjoying the forest by myself. And there's this not per se lake, but this creek bed on one of the trails that I would ride. on every single day. And it wasn't like my spot spot, but I'd go out there. It's a nice place to be. There's lots of deer around. You can just like chill and just hang out. And I'll go up there every single day, every day for about a week.

And every day I go up there, I'd see deer all the time, birds chirping. And this one particular day, I just, something just didn't seem right. I mean, I always have just feeling being out there that. Someone was watching me. Always had that feeling, but this was back in 2010. I was about 11 years old at the time, and I wasn't. Knowing what I know now about Sasquatch, I didn't even come close to thinking about at the time. So, just one particular day, I'm riding, and I keep two water bottles on the bike,

one on the front by the handlebars and one under my seat. And this one day I'm riding, and just the forest just seems. I don't know, just seemed dead. Like, I didn't hear birds, heard them like I normally do. And I only saw, like, I only saw, like, one deer that day. It was just,

it just felt like an off day. And I'm riding, and I'm not, I'm not at the creek bed yet, but I'm, like, almost there. And I just got tired. I wanted to take a little break, and I just stopped my bike

and by I grab some water, my water bottle. And the second I do, that I started hearing like sounds like children playing in the forest and usually when I'm out there there's never kids out there riding their bikes to me usually like just older people but I rarely would see people out there on the trail just I'd never see people I mean I might say like a few maybe one or two but that's it and just the sound of hearing children playing in the forest it didn't just didn't it didn't sound

sound right to me. I mean, because one, I wasn't at the creek bed yet. And it was coming around the direction. I thought, okay, maybe there's kids over there with their parents maybe. But I heard it, but it was off like the side of me. And it quickly turned from like kids playing. And the sound, it sounded like just like people talking in the woods. Like just like murmuring.

Like you could tell someone was talking. You can't like make out what they're trying to say. like I'm not I'm not sure how to like describe this but like not like you have like a screen door in the back of your house that leads up to your back porch or backyard and you can close it so that bugs can't get in but you can still hear what's going on outside it's something like I was outside and the screen door was closed but I could hear people in the house talking but I couldn't tell what they were saying they were just like murmuring and at this point I asked my wrist getting scared. Like, just talking about this is giving me chills. Like, I'm like shaking right now.

Forgive me. Yeah, no, that's right. But, um, I'm there and off to my right, not like to my right, but like in front of me to the right, like northeast of me, I'm on, I'm on the trail. And I hear like something coming through the forest. I first thought, okay, maybe it's beer, but then it starts getting closer. And like, I've heard bears before, but it didn't, it didn't sound like a bear because bears you could tell that this thing was on two feet it was like a thud and like a thud thud thud just walking through the forest at this point i'm just like okay it's probably just someone walking but at that point because people don't people don't walk off the trail i mean because when i get off my bike and like hang out by the creek bed it's not like off the trail it's like right

on the trail just people don't walk in that thick brush that's closer to the trail it just you just don't. It's too hard to get through that stuff. So I'm thinking, okay, who's walking through the forest? And plus, they weren't just like regular footstead. They're like heavy, heavy footfalls coming from the brush. And at this point, it's getting closer, and I'm just stuck because I'm curious to what it is.

And this thing just takes like two big steps on the trail. And mind you, this trail is about, 25, 30 feet wide, because it's enough room for people to go back and forth on it and not, like, run to each other. And this thing steps out, and, God, this, it was just massive. I mean, my first thought, okay, maybe it's a bear, but I've seen bears before, and bears don't walk in their high legs. I mean, I've seen bears before, like, hobble in their high legs before, but bears don't walk with a stride. So that's, I was my first thought, okay, this isn't a bear. What is this?

And it steps out on the trail, and it wasn't looking at me. It was kind of like facing the way it was going. And my second thought was, okay, what's a guy in a gorilla suit doing out here in the forest? That just doesn't make any sense to me. And mind you, I'm 11 years old, so I'm not, I mean, I'm thinking this in my head, but I'm not, like, processing it yet. And I'm just looking at it. And it just really just, it wasn't what I would expect to be in the forest.

I mean, and plus, if it was a person in the suit, that hair had to been glued on to that person. And even so it was glued on. Like, I've worn a suit before for plays. I've worn, like, suits. And, like, you can't get that kind of bend in a suit. And you can't see the person's skin under the suit. And then that's when it turned and looked at me. And mind you, it didn't turn its head and look at me.

It turned its whole, like, upper body to look at me. And at this point, I'm just, I'm just frozen. I just, I don't know what to do. It was just, it was incredible what I was seeing. And I was about 30 yards, 35 yards away from it. So I can, I can clearly see what it is. And it had, it had just black matted hair just all over it. but it didn't have, it didn't have, like, hair over its face, on its face.

And, like, I can clearly see, like, the facial details, like, like, deep brow ridges. Its eyes were just black. And its nose, I mean, it had a human nose, but it wasn't, like, ours. It was, like, just, like, wider. Like, just a lot wider than ours. Its lips, its mouth was just huge, like, to see how wide its mouth was. And, like, it didn't have, like, human lips, but, like, it had thin lips, but, like, like, You couldn't really tell the headlips or not because they were that thin.

And I'm just looking at this thing. I'm just like, I just couldn't believe what I was seeing. This thing was just massive. It had to be, wow. I had to put it at nine foot, maybe four feet across the chest. There's a big barrel chest. I could tell it was a male. It was incredible.

And I'm still frozen. I don't know what to do. And it's looking at me. And it starts making this, this like, this like, like, like, not clicking noise, but like, popping noise. You know, like, put your, you put your, like, tongue to the top of your, uh, top of your throat at that. Yeah.

That type of thing. It was just, it was weird. I've never heard an animal, you actually do that before. And it started doing that. It was very, it was very quick. It wasn't like, it was like, it was, prolonged clicking, but I could tell it was, like, trying to do something or, I don't know if it's kind of. communicate with me, but once it finished doing the little popping noise to my left where it was

facing when it first came out of the tree line, I heard like the same type of popping noise, but like it had like a little like yell to it, like a popping yell to it to the left side. And at that point, I'm just like, okay, I need to get up out of here now. And I slowly start turning my bike around. and once I start, once I start moving, the one in front of me starts growling. And this growl, it wasn't like a roar, but, you know, it was like, you know, one of those, like, you don't need to be here, you need to get out of here now, type of growls. I could feel the growl in my chest. Like, it was, it was very guttled.

It was crazy. At that point, I'm trying to move faster, looking at my bike back across the trail. I'm starting to go back and then I hear like off to where the second popping noise came from. I hear like movement in the forest and I could I could see an outline of another one. Black fur, same thing, but I can only see like the chest about the collarbone head. That's it. And I'm looking at that. And I'm like, okay, wow, I need the guy out of here.

and before I started taking off, you don't turn your back to the predator. You don't do that because then it's going to start chasing me. And I thought that if I had turned around and started going at that point being 30 yards away, it would have had me. So I tried to move as slow as I could to put some more distance between me and the black figures, whatever I could. And the second one, it stands up in the brush, and that one was bigger than the first one.

So it had to be, I say maybe a head above the first one, had to be about 10 feet tall. Had to be. At that point, once it stands up, I get on my bike and I go. I ride about maybe two and a half miles back to the house. and I didn't even put my bike in the garage. I just, once I hit the driveway, I just threw it down, ran to the house, and I told my mom, my cousin, what just happened? And it looked at me like, okay, you probably saw a bear.

Like, they're kind of laughing at me, actually. It's just, it's frustrating trying to, I've only told a story three times. Just the third time I put a story. And I don't know. a terrifying account, man, especially being a young man and then seeing these things. I wanted to ask you, did you, did it appear to be more human like, the one that you got a really good look at, and did its facial expression change at all? I know when you moved, it growled at you. Yeah, like, you know how I said, like, I thought a person in a suit? Like, it couldn't be

because you could see its face moving. Like, like, it showed, it showed, it showed, you. teeth, I forgot to mention that, and the teeth were like, I didn't see, I was too far away. I couldn't see like canines or whatever, but the teeth looked square. It had, the only thing human about it was it walked up right and had limbs like ours. The arms were just insanely long. And plus it wasn't like standing straight up. It was like kind of like, kind of hunched over, but you could tell the arms were long. and it didn't

it looked human but it had like it had some gorilla in it you know what I'm talking about yeah it wasn't quite human wasn't quite animals that kind of what you're saying exactly yeah exactly

it's like right in the middle like it had some gorilla in it or chimpanzee I don't want of those two but it has some human in it it's like a humanoid gorilla if you will yeah that's what a lot of witnesses

say when they see it and I can kind of see why they say that. Even people get a good look at the face. They'll say it wasn't human and it really was an animal. It was somewhere in between. And I hear that. It's very common for a lot of witnesses to say. What do you think it was doing? Do you think it stepped out and kind of was like, oh, crap, someone's there? To be honest with you, I don't know, I don't know what it was doing. I mean, I, knowing what I know now about Sasquatch, I maybe

it was, I don't know what it was doing, maybe trying to find its buddy or something, but, like I said,

I only saw one deer that day and I don't, I don't know what they were doing. And to be honest, with you, I want to say,

I know I heard, I heard, I heard two, I saw two, but knowing what I know now, there probably could have been more.

With them because when people see them, I know there's always like not like a family member or a buddy nearby. So there's probably more, but I saw it too, but I don't know what they were doing. Did you get the impression they were communicating back and forth? They were actually talking back and forth? Oh, yeah. When the first one I started doing that, that popping noise and that popping that type noise and the other ones doing the same thing, they had to be communicating had to be yeah it's a fascinating account so you rode away and that was pretty much the end of that that was the end of that i mean i to be honest with you i know like we

i mean have you ridden a bike trip before or riding a mountain bike through the forest before yeah of course you know how like when you're when you're riding your bike through the forest and like it's kind of like bumpy yeah when i was riding away it felt like the ground was vibrating more than it should be. And I did look back one time. And when I looked back, both of them were standing on the trail where I had stopped to get some water. And after that, I just, I didn't look after that.

And it just felt like the ground was kind of vibrating, like, more than it should be when you ride your bike through the forest. I don't know. I don't know if they were chasing it. I don't know because I didn't look back after that. I just kept going. I didn't want to look back. because I just didn't want to.

I felt like if I looked back, I might have, like, not watch where I was going. Maybe, like, fell or something. They would have had me. I don't know. But I just kept going. Yeah, it's fascinating. It makes me wonder if because of your age they didn't really see you as a major threat, you know, being a 11-year-old kid. Exactly.

Exactly. Because knowing what I know now, like, I know I've read, I've read stories about hunters. like how they, how they've encountered these things and they get like really riled up because they see that they have a gun on them. But knowing that I was a child basically, I mean, I'm 19 now. I'm a pretty good size man about 6'4, 220. And these things towered over me. But being an 11-year-old kid, 10-year-old kid, being about 5 foot 5, they probably didn't see me as a threat. And plus, I always had that feeling of something watching me every time I would go to the creek bed.

So they were probably watching me throughout that whole week. And they probably saw that I wasn't doing anything to harm anything. I was just hanging out, just being just being me. I mean, I don't know what they were doing. I mean, they could have been hunting because I know there's just plenty of deer in that area. I see me every single day. But that just that day, I didn't see, I only saw one deer that day. but I don't know what they were doing.

Yeah, the whole thing is fascinating to me, especially their reaction. Because you hear that a lot of times with hunters, a lot of times if they reach for their gun or they start making a movement, these creatures will react with growling at you. You know, they don't like you getting up and making a movement, even though you weren't going for a weapon.

You were trying to turn your bike around. Yeah. It didn't start ground until I, like, started turning my bike around. So I don't know. Yeah, sometimes they don't react. that way. You know, I had an encounter back, oh gosh, a couple of years ago. It was a police report I was looking into, and it was this 10-year-old kid riding down, I think it was in California. He was riding down. Maybe it was California. I have to go back and look. But anyway, he was riding on his bike, and he said a gorilla chased him. And what ended up happening is he's riding

as fast as he can. He said, this gorilla took off on all fours after him. And I can't remember he had something on his bike. I don't remember if it was like cards or something, you know, to create that motorcycle sound, that click, click, click as you go down the road. Anyway, it had grabbed the back tire and he went over the top of the

handlebars and it took his bike and it bent it in half and threw it up in a tree. He took off running home. And the fascinating part is he went, I actually talked to the cop that investigated it and the cop went out there, talked to this little kid and he said, what was it? Was it a bear? He said, no.

was a gorilla. Gorilla chased him. And it was, as a cop said, it was the largest gorilla he'd ever heard of. But it chased this kid down, and they thought the kid was full of crap. Well, they go out to where he said it snagged him off the bike, and they found his bike. It was like 20 feet up in a tree, and it was bent in half, a mountain bike, completely bent in half thrown up in this tree. Then there was no explanation for it.

You know what I mean? Like, a bear's not going to grab you off your bike, bend your bike, throw it up in a tree, and let you go. Bears don't have the capability to even throw even a rock. Right. Right. And you hear a lot of hunters saying, well, I think a bear was throwing rocks at me one night. And it's like, you're a hunter.

Does that make sense to you? Does that out up in your head that a bear was throwing rocks at you? And a lot of times when you question those hunters, they'll stop and go, yeah, that doesn't make sense. But I think as humans, we try and, you know, come up with the best explanation that makes the most sense. And in your situation, the other thing, too, I want to ask you, so when you're riding away and you stop and you look back, and I realize you're at a greater distance now, beyond being taller,

did the second one look any different from the first one that stepped out? The only thing different about the second one was, the second one was about maybe a head taller than the first one, but they both had black fur, but to be honest with you, the second one, I know it was in the brush Like on its right side

It had like I want to say it was mud maybe It was kind of wet that day But I don't know if it was mud or just the sun Was shining on that side Because it looked like it was It was maybe I'd been laying down In the creek bed

On its right side maybe I don't know But that's the only difference Between the first one and the second one Yeah it's an odd account It really is I'm surprised that they Especially at the way they reacted

I'm surprised it didn't. So when it was popping its tongue, it wasn't directed at you by any means. You're saying it was directed at the second one that you eventually saw. Oh, yeah. Because when it stepped out, like before it turned its whole body, it was kind of making that noise, but it wasn't as loud. But it turned to me. It was still making the noise.

It looked at me. But after he had finished, like immediately, right after that, the second one was making the noise. too. That's why I thought they were communicating. Can you talk about the facial expression changing when it first stepped out and looked at you? How did it change during that whole experience? It just, it didn't, it didn't expect me to be there. That's the kind of facial expression they had in its face.

Its eyes were just, just wide-eyed, plus they were black too. And like I said, it did show teeth. at one point, but not like, you could just see its face grimacing. That's why I knew it wasn't a person in a suit, because you can't do that if you're wearing a suit. So kind of a surprise look and then kind of an angry, what are you doing?

Yeah, like a surprise look, but then went from surprise to like, why are you here, you shouldn't be here, type of thing. But I'm just glad that it was as far away as it was. And I'm just glad that I was moving slow enough away to where when I really started to get out of there that it was the way. I mean, I thought they're going to chase me.

But, I mean, they might have because, like I said, the ground felt like it was vibrating a little bit. And after I looked the first time, I didn't look back until I hit town. I did feel the ground like kind of stopped vibrating after I got maybe a mile out. I don't know. Yeah, that's odd. I hear a lot of witnesses talk about that too as well. A lot of hunters will describe that. You know, it's kind of like the jolly green giants coming through the forest coming for you.

And the ground kind of vibrates. Yeah, you can't, I can't even describe how big these things are. It's like, knowing what I know now, it's like, I don't, you got to, you got to be there to see how big they are. It's, it's incredible how big they are. How did this affect you? I mean, you go back, you tell your parents and your mom and everything, and everyone's kind of laughing at you, but how did it affect you after this? I'll tell you this. It just, I didn't, I didn't leave the house that whole week, because we were there about, like, around this time of year, we were there through Fourth July on that time.

I didn't, once the clock hit about 6 p.m. and the son started going down, I did not go outside. I never went back out in the forest unless I was with somebody. I never went to that trail again while we were there. And I just, my whole mood, that whole week and a half just changed. I was just so afraid of being outside. I mean, and plus even when I got home, I didn't tell you this, when I got home after that trip, I immediately went to computer. And I typed in, I typed in what I saw.

in Google and what came up was the Patterson film Sashwash Patty. I think that's what they call her. Yeah. And I looked at that and I was like, yo, that's pretty much what I saw, but it wasn't female. Yeah, it's life changing to run into these things. And, you know, it hurts, it was telling another witness says, you know, it hurts when family doesn't believe you. When someone you don't know doesn't believe you, it's like, well, who cares?

But when it's family, it hurts even more, man. It really hurts when they don't believe. Especially this, you know, it's terrifying. You know, I'm a big man, and what I ran into was quite very quick what you described. And I felt like a flea on a dog's back when I ran into it. I can't imagine being 11 years old and just the fear of when you talk about the size, you're right. It's almost it's unreal. It's very unreal.

Yeah, especially since we can't catch up with them, something that large should not be able to hide as well as it hides in the forest. Do you think we'd be running into them left and right all the time? You know what I mean? Yeah, I mean, I don't, like, even when I got home, like, it did change me a lot because, like, when I got home, I never, I never knew what a, what a Sasquatch was until, like, I got home. after that I started like going online reading different articles like I hopped on I used to watch monster quest all the time all the time um like I know that finding bigfoot show with Cliff and all them I mean I watched that show for the witnesses I mean it's not that exciting but I mean like mountain men I was just so fascinated about it I know I was on YouTube one time I watched like thinker thunker all the time I know Steve White has his strange but true stories. I watched those from time to time. I also stumbled upon Dr. Lloyd Pye's everything you know is wrong presentation.

I even bought his book off Amazon. I read that about human origins about that too. He definitely has a fascinating take on it, doesn't he? Lloyd Pye. He does. I mean, and everything he said, it kind of makes sense to me. but I don't, I'm not an atheist, but I mean, I believe in the Bible, but after seeing what I've seen in the forest, it makes me, it makes me question what's really going on.

It really does. What do you think Sasquatch is, Miguel, I mean, you've got to really look at two of them. If someone were to ask you, let's say the term Bigfoot doesn't exist. No one knows what you're talking about when he says Sasquatch. How would you describe to someone what you saw? Describe it. It's a context. I'd honestly say it's a pre-human.

Like, I know I've read and heard like Native Americans that have ancestors that have lived on the land that they have sightings in and they talk about them. Like they're just a normal tribe of people that just live out in the forest. So that's kind of what I think it is. I mean, also what I've heard from Lloyd Pye about how the, I know, like, if you look at the fossil record, I know, like, Neanderthal, Crow Magnon, Homo erectus, they all lived on the planet, like, at least side by side for at least 100,000 years. And knowing us, Homo sapiens, I mean, we're like two-legged hyenas.

We can take down a species if we want to. But Nanderthals, like, just knowing them by themselves, they can take out a line, head-on, and be fine, but I feel like when we came along, they just, they figured out, okay, these guys are bad news, you know, and packs. So like, let's just move away. And I feel like maybe they didn't go extinct when we think they did, and we just like drove them to places that we don't go any, that we don't go, which is like, you know, the British Columbia, Vancouver Island, like the upper montane forest that have plus there's not and plus even they're not just in North America too what they had the Yeti that lives exclusively in the Himalayan mountain ranges the Almas and the Ogadwe that live in

South America the Indonesian mountains they have those two so it's not like it's just over here and it just makes me wonder that there were four types of prehumans that came before homo sapiens and that there's four different type of hominoids that live on this planet. So that makes, that makes sense to me. Yeah, you've done your research. I'm impressed. It is. And you're right. There is a lot of hominids that we don't, that most people don't realize we're on the planet at one time. And you can go look at the schools of these things. And you're like, okay, that's not human. That's not human. That's not human. And so it is fascinating to speculate, you know, as far as what they are. It's fascinating. Whenever you talk to an eyewitness, I would say

most of the time, people say it's an animal. And then when you really start questioning them, you know, on the face and the eyes. And, you know, a lot of times people say, well, it's somewhere between a human and an animal. I don't know what else to tell you beyond that. But it is interesting when you start looking at some of the other hominids that you described. They were on the planet the same time we were. And it kind of makes you wonder. I mean, what is this saying?

What is this saying that, you know, that lived at one time? And, you know, you can look at the skulls of a lot of those other hominids. And you're right, they do appear to be human-like, but just on a larger scale. And I like the fact that you've done your research. Because you're right, humans, we as humans are a pack animal. We're not a super predator. We are. We're a pack animal.

We hunt and packs. And it's kind of like coyotes. You can kill a coyote. Good luck trying to kill 30 of them coming at you because you're not going to win that fight. and the Sasquatch appears to be more of a super predator. I think they are somewhat of a pack animal, but I think I would classify him more as a super predator because there's not much that can stand tow to tow with them.

Yeah, and I know people always tell me, like, I told my friend, like I told him one time, like, because we're in a car. I listened to one of your podcasts in the car last night, going to my games, and he was like, dude, this thing, this is so stupid. but I know how you believe in this stuff. I'm like, dude, I assume on myself. Don't question me. He's like, bro, no, you haven't.

Like, he's like, he's like, dude, we have pictures of bears, all this stuff. Why can't we find a time? I was like, dude, like, it's just, you don't understand. I called him. Like, I made a valid point to him last night. I was like, you know how long it took us for us to find a panda bear? He was like, oh, how long? I was like, it took us about 60 years to find a panda bear.

Where I'm going with that is, like, story would come by China about this black and white bear that only ate bamboo and every PhD in North America was like well we know about brown bears black bear and white bears there's no black and white bear that used bamboo and so people go over there to probably in China and see the hides of one on the market or whatever they're okay maybe they're real and it's not until when Roosevelt and they go over there and they they kill one everybody's oh wow a panda bear and if you think about it, if you go out and try to find a panda bear, it's difficult to just go out there and find one.

And they're a panda bear. I mean, you've seen them in zoos before. They're just, they're not, I'm not going to be rude that they're dumb animals, but I mean, they're just nonchalai animals. They're just hanging around, get stuck in trees, can't even mate in zoos, can't even fight each other, honestly.

But think about that. It took them 60 years to find a panda bear. But a Sasquatch is different. It's six to nine, six, ten feet tall, can move faster than we can, think better than we can, operates at night, 24-7, eat anything. Just incredible. I agree. And I tend to agree with, you know, I'm easy on skeptics because I think your friend has a valid point. And I completely get where he's coming from.

You know, it's, yeah, I get it. And I always talk to hunters and they say, well, I've been hunting my whole life. I've never seen one. I get it. I completely get it. I don't have an argument for you on it. I hunted my whole life and never saw anything. And the one day I'm out doing nothing, I run into him.

You know, and I've hunted that whole area. You never, yeah. You never coming across to them by accident. It's never, like, on purpose. It's always by accident. And I mean, like, I know, like, hunters, they say I hunted all my whole life. But, like, it's just when people, like, people, like, my friend, like, he's living in Virginia all his whole life.

Like, we don't, we think we look. live everywhere, but we don't live everywhere. And plus Sasquox, yes, they're big and people are like, okay, if it's so big, we should be able to find it, right? But the thing is, they don't just stay in one area. Like, they follow the food.

They follow what's going to keep them alive. Like, I've heard, like, reports about them using the Appalachian Mountains as a highway to get between eastern states. Like, I know like British Columbia and all there, where there's very dense force, like, they're all up there because they got

plenty of places to hide. And plus there's plenty of food around water sources. But it's just, you have to think about a bear isn't trying to stay away from humans. Bears just do wherever they can or whatever. But sex watch, they have to, they're a lot smarter than what we think they are. And if you think about it, they're, I want to say they're adapted to this planet. Like I remember I heard one of your podcasts last night about some guy was talking about this lady was telling him that, you know, what's his name? Anthony, I think. Anthony, I think I heard, I heard his story about how the lady was taking care of the big

foot or whatever at her house or whatever. I heard about that. He was talking about how she told him about how the adults would leave and go hunt 50 miles off where they stay in one night. Like, they can move when they want to. Yeah, I agree. They're hard to catch up with. It makes me raise an eyebrow a little bit on how hard it is to catch up with them. And I've mentioned this on the Confessionals when I did the Think Tank podcast. You know, it's fascinating. When you look at, you mentioned the Yeti. You mentioned the Almas in Russia. You mentioned, you know, in China, they call it the urine. In Australia, they call it, what do they call it in Australia? Or aren't pain deck? No.

That's none. That's not. It's going to drive me. Yowie, that's it. They call it the Yowie. And so when you look at the whole picture, you're like, okay, no one's caught up with this thing. We haven't caught up, you know, in Australia, and in Australia, it's a little bit different. I don't think you can actually carry a firearm out in the woods.

Canada's kind of the same way. They're so strict on guns. But, you know, the United States and some of these other places, you would think someone would have dragged one out by now. But it makes you. raise an eyebrow a little bit, or at least someone found one dead or someone hit one by their car. But when you hear those stories, you always hear some weird cover-up with those stories. But with your friend, again, I'm cool with skeptics.

I really am. I get it. I completely understand. But in the same breath, when you see something, it's like, hey, I've seen it. I don't have an answer for you. And when you start looking at the evidence of Sasquatch, like the footprints, some of the blurry pictures, the Patterson Gimland film, the sounds that have been recorded, eyewitness testimony. People are seeing something. You know, even for a skeptic, you've got to stop and say, people are seeing something. I don't

know what it is, but people are seeing something. And it's sure strange through Miguel's encounter, Wes's encounter, all the cops have had, everyone kind of describes the same thing. No one's really too far off. No one's describing a pink Sasquatch riding a unicorn through the forest. You know, everyone's saying. Like, it baffles me that I've heard or read stories that come over all across North America. And the only really, really difference is the hair color. But all the facial features and, like, size are the same. That's what gets me.

Yeah, they are slight differences, but I would say for the most part, you're right. People are really describing the same thing. And a lot of the same behavior, you know, the mouth popping, talked about, I've heard that a million times from hunters, from people out hiking and people have had these things on their property, they will describe this mouth pop. And you wouldn't think you... Have you heard the... Oh, go ahead, go ahead. Oh, no, I was just going to say, and you would think that's not really a language until you look at some of these African tribes and some of these people who haven't, or kind of outside of civilization. And I can pull videos and show you, and you'll

see where humans are communicating with mouth pops and clicks, and it makes no sense. And it's weird that you hear that with Sasquatch, because you'll hear the mouth pops, you'll hear the clicks, you'll hear strange language, what you described in the beginning where it sounds like people are talking, you can't quite make out what they're saying, but it's obvious, you'll hear a lot of that. And that's a little bit farther than just an animal, in my opinion. There's something else going on there. This is weird.

I know I've heard the I forget what they're called the Sierra Moorhead sounds yeah I think I've heard the I heard those on a documentary one time and it baffles me that it sounded just like that but like it was kind of I want to say not a little bit quieter than that but it sounds just so much like that it's just weird like I don't plus that's that's Sierra Mountains down in Nevada And I like, in Wyoming, that's state the part. Yeah, and you'll hear that people in Texas will describe it. I mean, I've heard it all over the United States. But going back to that, I had Scott, someone sent me an email and they said, you should have Scott Nielsen on your show and Ron Moorhead to describe the language. Well, I've already had them on. And it's fascinating because here you have a career, Scott's a career military guy.

He was a cryptolinguist, worked in intelligence. And he analyzed them. Wow. Now, he has nothing to gain by saying there's something to this. He has absolutely everything to lose and nothing to gain by it. And he reviewed all the audio. I mean, probably thousands of hours. I'll go back and listen to that show, but I know Scott spent months and months just analyzing it.

And he came to the conclusion, there's a language here. They're talking back and forth. He goes, I don't know what the language is. And he kind of describes how he knows it's a language, and it made sense to me what he was saying. but he said in those Sierra sounds, you can hear, there's absolutely a language going on. There's a conversation going on here.

And that's odd. It's weird. It's like a, yeah. Yeah, go ahead, Miguelitz. It's weird. It's like a, it's not like how, let's say you and I do it like,

like, it's not like that. It's like, it's like, it's like each one, each click is like different. And they can tell what they're saying. It's just weird. I don't, it's just hard it's just so hard to describe and like the way it was doing it was so it was so fluid it was

like and then like I'm not a side you hear you're here they hear the same thing maybe a different tone a little louder and plus when it came from the forest like it had like a how like a yell slash click to it so it's just weird I don't I don't understand that yeah and that's it's fascinating you say that because Anthony the guy had on he said the same thing he said every click was different. It wasn't just like a pop, pop, pop, pop. He said every one of them almost sounded a little different. And it sounded like, he goes, even though it was clicks and pops, it sounded like some weird language that they were talking back and forth. And I know in that particular incident, he even said the old woman kind of talked to them that way. But it wasn't just mouth pops and clicks. He would

hear them talk in some weird language he's never seen before. And that's a part that makes me really stop and go, Sasquatch has to be something else. I don't believe it's human. I hate to break it to everyone. I don't believe it's human, but I'm not so sure it's an animal either. I don't really know what this thing is. But every animal on the planet...

I don't want to... Yeah, go ahead. No, no, go ahead, Miguel. I can't. I don't want to say, they say we evolve from chimpanzees, and this thing's part, chimp or whatever. Chimpanzees, they can't modulate. They can't say words.

and they can't, like, talk. I mean, I know Coco, they did sign language with her or whatever, but you never, I've never heard just kind of cooking and, like, murmuring before. It's just, it's weird. I mean, I've heard chimps in the zoo kind of, you know, make noises or whatever, but they're not, they're not this, like, sophisticated from what I heard from these things. Yeah, I would agree with that. I don't think they are.

I think when you watch Coco, it's pretty amazing. I remember the first time I saw Coco do the, and Coco just passed away. I posted that up on the blog, but the first time I had seen Coco, and it shocked me. It made me really stop and go,

what makes us human, really what makes us human, because here's Coco. I remember, and I talked about this on the blog, she was trying to break out of, and for the audience listening, who doesn't know who Coco is.

It was a gorilla. They trained it to speak sign language, as Miguel was talking about. Jane Goodall. Yeah, well, not Jane Goodall. Her name was Penny. Was I heard? No, someone else.

Yeah, it was Penny who raised this thing. And what's interesting, this thing, this ape. And what's interesting is when you, first time I ever saw Coco, she was trying to break out of the, this is like back in the 70s, she was trying to break out of her enclosure. And her enclosure is basically a room,

and she was trying to go out the window. And they stopped her, And they asked her, what are you doing? Well, the lady who was a caretaker, I believe her name was Penny, she said that she knew that Coco was trying to break out. So she really questioned her on what she's doing. Well, what the humans would do is they would go out and have a smoke. And they would smoke outside of this enclosure. They'd come in, talk to Cocoa and then go out and have a smoke. And Coco signed back. I was just going out for a smoke. And it made me really stop and go, what makes us human? I mean, here's an ape. And Coco talked about her parents being killed by humans. She talked about all sorts of things through sign language. So if you could get an ape to talk, the problem is there's not an ape out there that talks like that. And so what is Sasquatch? You know what I mean?

The Sasquatch seems to have the same. If you ever watch those with Coco, Coco's very intelligent what she says on a lot of things. She would make up her own words for different things, like a peanut butter and jelly sandwich. she had some weird, she would call it peanut butter and berries or something like she wanted peanut butter and berries, which means she wanted a peanut butter and jelly sandwich. And it makes you wonder how smart is Sasquatch and what is Sasquatch? But it's just fascinating. You know what I mean?

I don't mean to ramble on it. Did I mention the movement of it? No. I was kind of shaking up. I couldn't. It's so hard telling that story without being like the chills. But like I said, the trail is. what I say

about 30, I think 30 feet I can't like it's wide enough for people to go back and forward without like touching her and this thing when it stepped out it took a few steps and just the way it moved like West you and I when humans walk you know how we walk like heel toe

you don't I'm talking about right yeah it's like it's a short shot but this thing it had like a gate to it but every step it took like the few steps that it took it's heel never hit the ground like we do. Like when it stepped, like it was so like flat right in the middle of its foot, just like that. It just is, I don't know, the gate, it just seemed weird, but yet it was fluent. And like when I said, I thought it was a person in a suit, but you could tell this thing was in its natural habitat.

Like you could tell that it lived there. Like when you see like an animal out in the woods, you can tell. tell that it lives there because it has a fluent motion when it walks around. That's another reason why I knew it wasn't a person in the suit. Yeah, I think a lot of people's first reaction is, oh, that's a person in the suit. But I think once you, you know, that feeling goes away after about two seconds, have seen these things. And the gate is very odd.

It's, you know, when we walk, we plan our foot, we put all our weight on our front foot, and then we lend off on the back foot. Well, these things, when they land, they pull. And so it's almost like a forward moonwalk or like someone on cross-country skis because when they plant their foot, they actually pull what appears to be they pull their weight and everything with that foot. And it's just a real strange. It is weird. Yeah. It is weird.

It is weird. A reason why I say, like, it might be a pre-human because our joints wear out as we get older. and I don't know how long these things live but I mean like I've heard accounts about them looking like old but still moving like very fast like I mean like I know how I said like they're adapted to the planet

maybe they are pretty humans because if we're walking this way and our twins wear out by age 70 and these things are living longer not longer but as long as we are and still moving like that through the forest it makes you wonder like

this is their land Like, they know what's going on around here. No, it's hard to say. You know, and you're right, even the older ones. When people see the older ones, they'll still say it moved like nothing they'd seen before, but they could tell it was old. So it is fascinating when you hear eyewitnesses talk about that. That's crazy. Yeah, it is.

It is, and they're definitely out there, you know, it's one of those things to where it's almost like you have to see it to believe it. And I get that from eyewitnesses or from skeptics. I completely understand it, you know. But once you see it, it will change you, I promise you. I've never seen anything like it in my life. It's just now I'm not as scared now. I mean, if I had the opportunity to see it again, I would probably take a lot longer of a look, to be honest with you,

they're running away. But I don't know. It's just so fascinating, just looking at it. It's just like, I've never seen an animal. like that before. And I, I, I, I hate, I hate saying animal, because I feel, I, I feel like they're, they're not, they, when I say animal, I say it because they live on the forest and all that stuff, they have hair on their body, all that stuff. But, I mean, like, I feel like, they're not human, but, like, they're not all the way animals, just that their mannerisms, how they're wild, and they live on in the forest.

It's what makes them seem like an animal, but I feel like they're, they got some human and them. Yeah, and I can understand why you would say that. I definitely can understand. Two questions I wanted to ask you. One, was there any smell that you noticed? And then two, you said he knew it was male. Did you see private parts, or was it just the appearance of being a male? Your first question, the smell, I'll be honest. I mean, in the forest, I mean, where I was, I mean, I didn't, I've heard about a very terrible body odor, but on this one, on these two, I didn't smell like a very bad body odor. It just kind of smelled like a, like a wet dog, kind of. I guess you could say that, but it wasn't like a really like bad body odor scent.

It just smelled like, like it just a wild smell. Yeah, that's what I was curious about. Yeah. But, yeah, I don't. It wasn't like a bad scent. It's just like you could you could tell like they were wild animals where they smell like just a wild smell. Just like it's a wet dog, I guess you could say. But it wasn't like anything more than that.

But I wasn't like up on them so I couldn't like really get a good width because the wind was blowing away from me. So I couldn't. Yeah, I understand. Yeah. And it makes sense that you would smell that. You know, kind of a you're relatively close. And it's odd sometimes people smell the smell. Sometimes they don't.

But that wild dog smell, it is kind of a wild. A lot of people describe it more of a wild smell. But yeah, I know I get what you mean. What about, did you see any private parts or was it mainly? I know it's an odd question. I don't mean to be kind of a weirdo asking the question. Yeah, the first one, I did see genitals on the first one. I did because it had matted hair all over its body, but you could see genitals.

Like you could see, like it had hair over his body, but not on his face. but like, down there's lower section, you could see genitals. I'm not going to say, like, an erection type, but you could see it like, not like hanging, but you could see genitals. Like, you can see it. Yeah, and that's fascinating, you know, and that really lends, you know, well, it all lends to being a physical creature, but a lot of people have seen them. And I had a professional, well, he's a wildlife guy, but he's professional, and he had seen one.

And he had described that. He said they were pretty small, which kind of would make sense. You know, it's, and I forget, forgive me audience, but it kind of makes sense it would be kind of smaller. If you ever look at like an ape or gorilla, the private parts don't match up with the size of the creature, you think they would be, well, I don't want to go into that. But you know what I mean? You would think it would be a lot bigger. Sorry, man, this is going sideways, this whole cover. I'm just curious about it because.

Not to say that about like body proportions, like how it's like, like, you probably bigger than. what it was because it's a bigger animal. To be honest you, like, the whole, its whole body just seemed like not in proportion with itself because, like, its head, like, it had very thick, what are they called?

Trapegous muscles, I guess, what they call them, in the shoulder, right? Well, you couldn't tell it had a neck on them, but, like, you could see, like, it had a head, like a vertical football on its head. It would, like, kind of. Kind of pointy. Kind of.

tone. Yeah, like, not like pointy, pointy, but like, yeah,

like a pointed, a pointed, a pointed top of the head a little bit. Like, you, you couldn't really see a neck on the first one,

but you could just, it was just so big, like, like, like, you know, barrel chest, like, it's arms long,

it's just, it's crazy. Yeah, they kind of look like, I remember when I described it, it said like a cartoon character. Everything's over exaggerated. Yeah,

like, exactly. It's like a, if like a, if like a, it's like a football player wearing pads on them but covered in hair. I'm talking about like how the head like right on top of the shoulders. Like not like a neck you can't see it, but like it's like just placed on top of the shoulders.

That's like that's kind of what looks like if you think about it like a lot. Yeah, it is. And they are like that. You know, it's very over-exaggerated, you know, like the most ton of a guy down in down in the south. they call him no heads. And he was asking me, well, what do you mean no heads? And I said, well, when I talked to people in the South, I asked him that question. Why do you call them, you know, they call them boogers.

They call them no heads. They call them. And I asked him one time, what do you guys call them no heads? And he goes, you ever seen one walk away from you? And I said, no. And he said, if you ever see one walk away, it looks like they don't have a head. It's all shoulders and a little bump. And it almost looks like they don't have a head the way it rolls, their shoulders

roll forward. And so, you know, a term down there in the South is they call him no heads. It's a fascinating account. It really is, Miguel, it's, and I'm honored that you, this is the third time you're sharing it. I'm honored that you come on the show and talk about it. It's nice talking to people that won't laugh at you or like, say, oh, you didn't see anything as a bear. I'm like, no, it's not a bear. Yeah, well, like I said, Miguel, it was my honor having you on.

Thank you so much for coming on and sharing the encounter. enjoyed talking with you. It was fun for me too. Thanks, Miguel. And that's it for tonight, everyone. Remember, if you've had an encounter, chew me an email. My email address is Wes at Sasquatch Chronicles.com.

If you get a chance, check out Sasquatch Chronicles.com. Until next time, everyone. Being across the country faster than the coronavirus and wagering week is your antidote. I'm Tom Barton, and I'm a veteran sports analyst and respected sports handicapper who will help build ESPN's brain. I've been recognized and awarded by Pro Football Weekly and Gaming Today magazine as the honest

handicapper. Let the other guys give you the same old boring sports talk with the same tired storylines. We'll give it to you straight here every Friday on Wagering Week. Don't gamble with other podcasts. Let SportsGarten Network's Wagering Week help your bottom line.