Sasquatch Chronicles - SC EP:58 Sasquatch on the Indian Reservation

Episode Date: November 3, 2014

We speak with a local on an Indian reservation who talks about several encounters her and her family have had while growing up on the reservation. The witness also talks about some possible cover-ups going on with the people's encounters. The witnesses' brother is a police officer on the reservation and she tells us that he was called out to a home that a Sasquatch was attacking and as he pulled up he was able to get the creature on his patrol car's dashcam.....what happen next is very strange. We welcome the Rocky Mountain Sasquatch Organization who gives us an update on Sasquatch encounters from an old ghost town, Deadwood. We will also be discussing government cover-up stories that are directly related to Sasquatch encounters.

Four, three, two, one, zero. When I had come down this hill, I had seen this creature cross the road. It would have ripped my locked door from my truck, extracted me from my vehicle, and there wouldn't have been a damn thing I could have done about it. This thing I got to notice in its eyes. His eyes was real, real evil, real sinister looking. You know, the look it was given me.

What are you reporting? I got somebody out here. What's going on now, sir? That's the son of a bitch is about six. I got a frantic call from a past guest who was kind of involved in, I think, a government cover-up. A person had disappeared, and they claimed it was a bear, a bear attack. They're refusing to release a body to the family, and he was well aware of the situation. It was where he had an encounter.

And make a long story short, these two guys show up at his house to talk to them. And I've heard this over and over and over again for about the last year and a half. It's kind of an interesting story. These two guys that tend to show up, they don't show up when you have an encounter, but they tend to show up when, if a person claims to shoot one or if a situation where a person disappeared. And about a year and a half ago, I heard this story about these two guys showing up. And they're always, they always present themselves the same way. They never really say what government organization they're with,

what federal branch of the government they're with. But one guy is always in a suit or he's well-dressed, and he's generally the polite guy. He's the good cop. The other guy that shows up with the one that's nicely dressed and that's polite, he looks more like Grizzly Adams. he's described as kind of a bigger guy, usually has a beard. People have told me he kind of looks like a hell's angels.

And he's just a complete dick. And so they play this good cop, bad cop routine. The type of verbiage that they tend to use a lot is it would be in your best interest if, you know, and then insert the quote, you saw a bear or you shot a bear or, and I I've heard this over and over and over again over the last year and a half, and I never really gave it much. I never gave it as due credit. But it struck me. I got this frantic call on Saturday night last Saturday.

The guests that called me said, hey, West, these two guys came to my house. They're still parked out front in an unmarked vehicle. It was a crowned Victorian at the time, is what he said it was in front of his home. but and as he started describing them I said well is one guy kind of dressed nice and is the other guy kind of looked more rough does he look kind of like a hell's angel and they play the good cop bad cop routine and there was like this 30 second pause on the phone

and he said how do you know that and so I mean what's your take Will I mean I never gave this stuff much well I you know I didn't either when we talked about this before but I've been getting the same information from several different witnesses also and you're right it's when there's a fairly serious situation going on it's not just a run-of-the-mill sighting it's when there's you know human life is in danger or or something

along those lines and these guys show up and they tell people don't talk about it that's not what you saw so it's definitely and in one can I know a couple of cases they were identified as or at least identified themselves as as Department of the Interior. And I think wasn't that from the guest that you were talking about? Yeah, that's what he said. He said they eventually identified themselves as being from the Department of the Interior. You know, I contacted her friend Mr. Black after you and I talked about this.

And he says, yeah, absolutely, they send these people out now. I don't know about the specific people. I haven't asked him about that yet, but he said that, yes, they will send them out. I don't know exactly why yet. Maybe they're, you know, trying to eliminate those threats or whatever, but it is something that goes on. It's very serious. And we probably know about a half a dozen different witnesses that have been approached that way by these same two people. Or at least people that look like these, you know, the same character.

I was just wondering if these people have been, especially the one that gave you the friend at Call West. Are these people intimidated enough by the actions of these two people to go, yeah, I'm not ever going to talk about this again? Is there an impression of that? Yeah, I mean, a little bit. He was worried enough because they had actually came to his house twice. The first time they came and spoke to his dad and then they were parked out front of his home and they were just sitting there. He called the cops. The cops come, talk to these guys for about a minute,

and then the cops drive off and the guys stay there. They haven't made any real direct threats, except for it would be in your best interest not to discuss this. You know, since this is fairly new coming out, people who have had direct threats probably haven't come forward yet and express that. That's true. One encounter that I can think of where there was a direct threat, this guy had claimed to have shot one, and I think out in Virginia, and that's how he describes him.

And that's the first time I ever heard it. And then I heard the same story over and over again, but I heard it firsthand from people. And what they had expressed to him because he was arguing back with them after they said, hey, it would be in your best interest not to discuss this. He starts arguing with them, and the threat they had made to him was, you know, people disappear all the time. And bad things can happen to you and bad things can happen to your family if you don't let this go. Yeah, I'd say from what I've heard, that's pretty accurate.

So it makes you wonder, makes you wonder who they are, what their agenda is and what they're trying to accomplish by. It's not really like men and black type stuff. These guys are just, it's just odd. It's just a real odd encounter with these guys. I get the sense that it's not really a cover-up situation. Maybe it's more of a way of masking whatever it is they're trying to accomplish. Yeah, I was talking with J.C. Johnson about it, and I'd asked him if he had ever heard that before. He said he'd heard things like that before, and he assumed that they were from the Forestry Department.

But I don't think they're from the Forestry Department, especially after Saturday, in a night when this kid's calling the cops. Cops come out and after a minute the cops leave and the guys stay there almost like they're above the law. Do you ever wonder with you and Woody's encounter it's not your typical

big foot encounter and now you have this show and it's very popular and you have a lot of listeners do you think that because you do have this platform that that's the only reasons that you haven't been visited yet?

Well, we can tell you one thing. We know they listen to the show. We've gotten that from a couple different sources. Actually, that our show was mentioned in the conversation. Specifically. I think that these guys go out to do this whole good cop, bad cop routine. Like we'll was saying before, when something specific, it has to be an incident to where either A, people have come up missing and they have to deal with it or be someone claims to have shot one and is talking too much.

I think situations like that, these guys tend to show up. I mean, I don't think they're going to show up at my front door. If they do, I'd love to talk to them. Yeah, I don't think it's necessarily a bad intentions they have. Maybe it's just the way it comes across. Well, do you guys have anything else before I go on to the website? I was just going to say if anybody else out there has had this kind of, have encountered to contact us. We'd love to hear about it. Yeah, and we will, we'll protect your

identity, too, if you come forward and talk about it. We'll definitely protect your identity. But yeah, if anyone out there has had something like that happened, please contact us. I know we were shooting for November 1st for the website to go live, and we ran into a couple of issues, well, the web developers have run into a couple issues, but they're working them out. and so the website will be live most likely around the 17th, but we're going to shoot for a launch date just to be completely on the safe side for December 1st. And a lot of people have asked us about the website,

asked us what is it that you guys are going to do, what would I get for the extra paid content? We're still working on adding more than what we're just going to talk about tonight. as a current listener of the show, right now you get about an hour, hour and a half shows we do a show every week. And what we're going to do for the, and you'll continue to get that,

we're not going to take the show away from anyone. We're going to increase the show's format, so we're going to move to a two-hour format. Right now you're getting an hour show a week. Sometimes we do an hour and a half, but generally it runs about an hour show per week. and what we're going to do for the paid content is there's going to be an additional hour long broadcast, so there'll be a total of two hours.

That second hour will be part of the paid content. And then we're also going to be doing a midweek show. So as a listener, people have asked us for more shows per week, and this will give us the opportunity to create more content. again, we're not going to take the show away from people. We're just adding more to it. And so by creating the membership, there's going to be about 75% more content per week

that you, the listener, will have access to. So December 1st, this thing will go live. So by doing the midweek show for our paid members and having the extended interviews during our normal show, we looked around a lot of different podcasts, and a lot of the different podcasts out there like Mysterious Universe, Jim Harold,

they generally run about $10 a month. But for the extra content and the more, the content that we're adding to the show, we're going to be charging $7 a month. The other thing that we'll be adding to the show is we'll be adding, there'll be some videos that we'll be doing

behind the scenes. We're going to be inviting guests. We're members on that we can talk to and have hangouts with. So there's going to be exclusive shows. There's going to be

the extended weekly show that you're getting now. There will be some uncut audio extras and then we're going to have a full podcast catalog.

Members will have access to. But again, I didn't want to take away the show from people who enjoy it now. For what people

are, the people that enjoy the show now, I want them to continue to enjoy the show. We're just going to be adding so much more to it.

And if you choose to, you know, we hope you support us on our endeavor to make the show bigger and add more content. On the cost part, did you want to mention, you said the monthly cost, but what about like six months and a year? I know I always like to kind of know what up front, what something's going to cost so I can think about it a while and sort of convince myself that that's what I want to do. So the cost of the show will be $7 a month. If you pay it increments like six months.

I think I believe it's $40. If you pay it for a year, it's $70. So it gets cheaper the more you pay on it. Just giving people different options to choose from it, if they choose to pay for the extra content. Yeah, I think one of the things people always want is they always want more shows, more shows, more shows. I mean, a lot of the reaction when we,

if we take a week off, people are pretty upset. And that's flattering. I mean, it's definitely flattering for the audience that they enjoy the show that much. But I think, you know, we all work. You know, we're the working class here. So it would be impossible to add all of this more content, do more shows, have longer shows without going this route. It's not like some of these other shows, you know, that were free and then monetized. And they're getting the same thing that they got for free before, you know,

For instance, you know, if they were getting one show a week or a month and then they monetize for nine, ten bucks a month, they're getting the same thing for that. Our folks will be getting what they're getting now, but if they want to pay for it, they're getting an extra, what do we say, three hours a week? Right. Minimum, yeah. So, and all the other additional things. And it's a building process. So we were talking all the time about what else we want to put in there, you know, for the paid members. And it's not going to be like an increase if we add more. You know, if you pay for a year, if we add a bunch more stuff in there, which we will be doing, that's all under the same

cost. It's not like we're going to raise according to the amount of content we put in there. It's going to be the same. You know, we sat down and we talked with the people from the Rocky Mountain Sasquatch organization. I know Kelly Shaw, he tends to post a lot of videos. And he talks about a lot of older encounters on his YouTube channel. And I tend to watch him because there's a lot of stories that are in newspapers, you know, that are archived online that you'd have to go dig up. So it kind of cuts down on the research. So it's kind of nice to watch some of these encounter stories that we had. But we sat down with them and talked with them.

They went up to Deadwood. It's an old mining town that they were in. and it's been abandoned since then. And people started having strange encounters with Sasquatches that were inhabiting the older buildings, the rundown buildings that were in the town of Deadwood. But take a listen. And can you talk a little bit about your recent travels to Deadwood?

I was really fascinated by the story and what you guys found there. We read about a sighting report, that happened there about 18 years ago. It talks about three sightings over like a two-day period. To me, like it, there was probably all less a bunch of loggers, copter logging crew, three times. There was five of them that had seen it. But all summer long, everybody on the logging crew

when they would take time off to go hunting, a creature that would stay out. Once a while, they would hear whoops. It pretty much messed with them all summer long, but in a 24-hour period, I don't know if five people got lucky or got it aggressive, but the logging boss and his two sons got chased off. They were the first one in the timeline to see it. They were up on the mountainside hunting and showing itself going from either a tree coming towards them and intimidated them off the mountain down into the logging camp. And then that night, actually in the morning, the guy that runs the water trucks, he got up the earliest. And he saw it across the river.

He actually smelt it and sensed it before he saw it. And he put his spotlight across the river and got a little bit of its eye flash. Then it started making its way from tree to tree. And then the next morning, I think it was like 11 a.m. The logging boss spotted what he thought was a black there a couple of weeks ago. And that river is a creek to me. It's not very well. It's pretty close to him.

And he thought it was a bear. And he said that the eyes just came out. They locked the gaze for a little bit. And then it started coming towards him. And just like the other witnesses, it made his way from tree to tree coming closer. And he ran back to the camp and locked himself in, well, the entire logging crew was staying. a ghost town that was abandoned in the 40s. That's where they were staying.

Then the kid locked himself up for two days, eventually took him home. Most of the ghost town is really dilapidated down to nothing. There's only a few buildings left. And then there's also three reclaimed buildings that's a local rancher. They somehow are on his property, and he reclaimed them. They've been in his family, I think, like 30-something. years were able to rent one of them actually stay in it. And we didn't know what to expect one complete abandoned place.

One and stayed in that. We were just going to stay in a tent. Didn't you guys say that there was, the locals were telling you that they thought the Sasquatch were staying in some of the abandoned buildings? Oh, yes. When the loggers were there, the first thing that they found when they were staying there that was odd was one of the abandoned. buildings that's still standing near the mine.

In the basement, they found a big nest of pine boughs, and they could tell that some kind of animal had been sleeping in there, and there was still some type of an animal. This nest, I mean, like within a week, activity started in the sightings, the three sightings in 24 hours. Three sightings in 24 hours. I'm like, I want to go. I was kind of curious about the movement. He mentioned a couple times from tree to tree.

I was wondering what he meant by that. I mean, was it hiding behind the tree, or maybe that was just his impression of the thing walking towards a witness that way. When I originally talked with him, he was saying it was going from tree to tree, like it would stop and take cover, look, and then come towards him again, stop.

Kind of odd behavior. Yeah. It is odd behavior, yeah. Well, I know on the final clip that we have with the Rocky Mountain Sasquatch organization. Derek talked about his encounter. It happened back summer, like I think July of 81. Myself and a couple buddies, we're just sleeping out in the backyard of our friend's house.

You know, lift three doors up the street from me. We always just pitched a tent and they'll screwing around, you know, basically during the summer. we got up doing a typical thing. About 1 or 2 o'clock in the morning, we always got up and headed up to like a local 7-Eleven, bought some candy, screwed off at night, came home. Well, this evening that this happened, buddy Chris and I had got up and walked behind a few houses and threw an apple orchard, got up to the office. orchards kind of kitty corner from our elementary that we went to school at and had noticed that something had come walking out of a big park. I don't know initially why it was, you know, at first I just thought it was just somebody

coming. So, you know, being little kids, I was like 10 and about 10 at the time, we ditched it down in a little irrigation canal that I basically faced. at the orchard, down under some weeds, and we're just going to wait for this guy to come walking past, and, you know, before we took off and went on our way. Well, while waiting, after seeing this thing come out of the park, I stuck my head out and looked, and I had just passed underneath a street light, and the street light was kind of shining down from behind it, so I didn't get like a facial of it.

got basically just a big profile of this massive creature hair going down the back of its neck, shoulders hanging off its arms. So, you know, I didn't get a, I can't say that it was a clear picture of what it was, but it was just massive. That's the main thing that I still see in my visual that still gets my freaking hair crawling and thinking about it. well, you know, we duck back in. I mean, we both actually saw it.

We ducked back down and just basically froze in place of where we were. And this thing walked within, I mean, I could have almost reached out and grabbed its leg. It walked right past us, across the street and into this, just into a field and out of sight. I think the whole encounter was probably 45 seconds to a minute or so as this thing walked out, probably maybe a little bit longer than now. It's scared enough that I didn't bunch. This thing walked and was out of sight before I got up and basically highted out of home. We ran home and, well, literally just, I think we stayed in that tent until about noon the next day.

Literally, let's get to sit out of it. that was definitely an underwear changing moment. Yeah, it was. He gets a T-shirt. Yeah. The only thing I was thinking was when he talked about the hair hanging off it, and I think people get confused sometimes because you will get one-siting account

and they'll talk about the hair being relatively short, like with Patterson, Saskatch, and then others, with longer hair hanging down almost like a horse's mane. Right. I was chatting with some friends on Facebook last night, And one way, I mean, there's some different ways to identify different types of the four types we have. And I think that something it's overlooked in that is the way the hair is, you know, where some have, like with the Patterson Sasquatch, you know, the face is largely covered with hair. And with the type 2s, it's a lot less.

There's not the same mustache, you know, beard and things like that. It's more of a flush face. but, you know, and with those longer pieces of hair hanging down off your arms and shoulders. So that was an interesting observation. Yeah, it was. And I want to thank Kelly, Jenny, and Derek from the Rocky Mountain Sasquatch organization for coming on the show and sharing some of their stories with us. You know what I was thinking for next week is maybe if we did a midweek show where we had people, call in, or we took more calls. Generally, we don't take a lot of calls, but maybe if we did

like a Wednesday night show and had guests come on and then allowed people to call in and share their encounters. That would be cool. I think it's a good idea. Well, if you'd like to call into the show next week, we'll probably do the call-in show probably Wednesday. Or does Thursday work better for you Will? Either day is fine. Well, we'll probably do the call-in show on Wednesday of next week. So if you had an encounter and you want to share your experience, the call-in number to talk with us will be 646-716-8-7-9-1. And what do you think? 6 p.m. Pacific Standard Time next Wednesday?

Yeah, I think so. That'd be fun. Well, next on the show, we had a Native American that came on the show and shared a lot of the stories and a lot of the encounters that they had there on the reservation. I don't believe that she wanted to really be identified. A lot of the stories get kind of weird. Not really weird, they get kind of creepy. But the first clip I'll play for you is her discussing her encounter.

My first encounter happened when I was a freshman in high school. I was home by myself. We actually live outside of a town, about four miles outside of a town. and it was a really rural area at the time. Now there's a lot of houses around, but at that time it was just our house, maybe another one on our side of the road, and we didn't have any phones,

and we live about a quarter mile off the highway. However, behind our house is there's a valley and there's a creek that meanders down there. And so, and beyond that, on a bunch of hills, like pine bluffs and that kind of a landscape. I was home by myself. It was a Sunday afternoon. Listening to music really loud. Of course, I was a teenager, so, you know, I was jamming out to my music.

And I heard a really loud screen. I didn't connect it with anything. I was wondering what that was, what made that noise. and sometimes our washer down in the basement used to squeal when we were doing the laundry. So I kind of assumed it was a washer. And when I think back on it, now the sound didn't come from the basement, came from outside. But I wasn't really aware of that at the time. At this point of time, this would have been back in the late 80s.

They were having a lot of sightings around the area where I was living. A lot of people in a community knew about it, and even the local law enforcement was involved from time to time in the sightings. So there was a lot of activity at that point. I had a grandfather who lived about six miles down the road from me. At that time, it was just myself, my mother, and my younger brother and sister who were like four and two. So my grandfather He would always ask me if we were fine If we were doing okay

Because he told me that he could hear that The Bigfoot making noises Yowing around and growling Down where he lived along the creek dead there He lived along the creek and he could hear it at night So he was concerned about us So I told him we were fine Because we lived up top

We didn't live on the bottom where the creek was my mom worked for a part of the law enforcement. So we weren't really concerned at that time. So it's kind of a backstory. So that afternoon I heard the yell, the yell screen thing. Didn't say nothing of it. So it's about, I would say about four. And it's in the fall.

And where we are, it's up in the northern country. And the, you know, the days are really short in the fall. So I was going to go out and ride my bike. I went along the edge, like we live on a flat, so then it goes down into the valley. So it's kind of along the edge there. And we had two dogs, and they were Blue Healer Crosses. They were really good dogs. And they were with me.

And before we got to the edge there, they were playing. I was just riding my bike along. There was an old dirt road, so I was riding my bike. I noticed that they had stopped and they were on either side of me. They stopped playing and it got really still. Like it was kind of a breeze, but it was really still. The whole feeling of the afternoon changed. It's hard to explain.

But I was standing on the edge and down below there's about maybe an acre where, about eight and a half where there was a pasture where there were horses. And so there's a fence line that kind of ran down where the acre was. Let's see, there was fence line on two sides of the acre, and then the creek kind of made the boundary of the other two sites. So I'm looking down there, and the dogs are standing on each side of me, and they kind of have, they're doing this weird, like a little growl, you know, like a deep, a deep growl. It wasn't really loud, though, but they were standing there doing that.

So I was like, what are they looking at? So I looked down into the pasture and there's a bunch of horses. But I noticed that the horses are all grouped together towards the northwest side. and they were all in one group, and that was kind of weird. And I could see their tails kind of blowing in the breeze on the more southern, southeastern corner closest to me. I would say it was about three or 400 yards for me, was this big, tall figure.

And this thing was huge, and it was faced towards the creek. I wasn't registering what I was looking at. And I was standing there thinking, what is that? I didn't see the tail blowing in the wind like the other horses, but I could see the long shaggy firs blowing all. And I got a really sick feeling in my stomach because it dawned on me what I was looking at. So was a creature on all fours? No, no, no, no.

It was standing upright. This thing was tall. And when I was looking at it, and I guess I was in disbelief, and I was looking at the other horses, and this thing was like three times as tall as those horses. I mean, it was huge way down there. And I couldn't imagine how big it would be if we were on a level of ground because I was standing above it. And I was watching until I got the distinct feeling that it was going to turn and look

at me. I just had that feeling that it was going to see me. And I dropped my bikes. I dropped everything. I ran back to my house and I was maybe about 100 yards from my house and the dog stayed right beside me the whole way. And I ran in the house and I don't know. I was freaking out. I didn't know if that thing had seen me if it was going to follow me up, you know, up the hill. That thing was huge. Where was I going to go? So that was my first encounter. I did tell my mom, and she told me that I had to get a grip on myself and that we weren't going to move. She wasn't going to move because of that thing.

So she didn't believe you, though? Yeah, she believed me. She knew about it. There was no doubt that, you know, she never denied that that thing existed. You know, I was thinking about something when she was talking about the tribal police being involved. It made you think about an account where, and I can't remember which tribe it was, but they were talking about how the tribal police knew about the things that were happening with these things. And what they would do is they would get a call, you know, somebody would have one around their house doing something,

and they would actually delay going there because they didn't want to see these things. They didn't want to confront them. I thought it was interesting her mom's reaction to the whole thing. Wasn't surprised. Well, you guys want to take a call? Yeah. This is Gerald. Hey, Gerald.

Is this Wes? Yeah, this is Wes. Hey, nice talk to you. I've been listening to your show for months now, and I just love it. We have a mutual, so it's in. I had some inconsistencies, you know, that's been a current. the last 10 or 12 years. And I know Will's pretty familiar with the bear around Dugan Falls.

Right. Yeah. You know, here about in 1994, I was up and, you know where Cardio Road is? Yeah, it's... Yeah, right. Yeah, I was up there one time. And down where Eagle Creek work, it's kind of a tributary to the Washington River. And I shot a dough down in there.

And I just... And as I got the cardio road against my rig, I heard this deep guttural growl. This tree, you know, it was a tall tree. I'm about 50 feet tall. And all of a sudden, this tree just started shaking very vigorously. And at that time, I told myself, you know, it's just a bear, you know. But after listening to your shows and kind of looking through the big, one thing that they do, they shape trees. I actually saw that when I was about 10.

We didn't know anything about Bigfoot. But they had a, along the Puyallup River where I grew up, there was what was known by a few locals as the rock quarry monster, a big gray Sasquatch, apparently. And one day I come riding up on my bike and my mother and sisters were out there watching and all of our cows were backed into the barn. And down below at the tree line, something had a hold of the trees that were the thick maple. You know, it was really thick you couldn't see through all those leaves. but something was just shaking the hell out of that. And so I think back down thinking, well, geez, it wasn't a bear that had to be one of these things. But when you mentioned Bear Prairie, I'll tell you something about that area.

I had quite a few people tell me about their encounters from up in that area. One guy who lived up in that area was a, he told me he was a retired Marine Corps intelligence officer. So, you know, I took what he said pretty seriously. and he told me about his neighbor who had a shed that they hung all their deer in when they'd get him to cure and that a group of these things would come in there every hunting season and just beat the hell out of that shed trying to get into it to get the deer and apparently they did get into it once or twice and took all their all their kills so absolutely you know stuff like that did occur up there fairly often

and also you know I've listened to your shows in that Siege of Hanobia or Hanobia or Hanobia? Well, I understand that they mimic. Yeah, the Indians used to say that, too. They would actually, the term that was used, I think it was probably a poor translation. They called it ventriloquism, which actually meant imitate. They would imitate animals and other sounds. Well, you know what?

About three years ago, we set up this space site. And about three years ago, my friend and I, we went up there and we set up the site, and it is a Calum But you guys are familiar with this area. There's a bunch of elk up there. A bunch. And anyway, I remember as sitting in my tree stand, and as I was setting there and about it, and this is going to lead into something, it's got to dying to relate this information to you. It's just too much. But three years ago, I'm setting in my stand and I hear this whistle. Now, you know, it's that, you know.

But it was loud and clear and the enunciation of the thing. It was just so clear and loud that when I looked up, I expected to see somebody standing right there. And I looked up on the hill and I looked all around and I could not see anybody. It was kind of like a walkway call, like, you know, hey, I'm coming in, you know. As I said, I got mad. And I said, well, great. The hunters came into my side, you know, his sense everywhere.

So I kind of just, they kind of upset me, and I hauled out. Thanks a lot, fella. You know, I appreciate it. And I just left, you know. Well, I'll tell you what, this year, a friend of ours, and I, you know, he was in this stand. All of a sudden I felt, and it was just like something. was watching and I could not shake that feeling. For that two days, I left and I went searching to find another site.

Well, this year I put this individual in so strange because sure enough, my friend Ryan and I were in our sites, up in his site. This is the truth. You know, we did have a killed site. My son had gotten a cow earlier, and it's got piles about 40 yards up above me. And we had raven everything. And a raven will make more noise and different noises than you've ever heard in your life. Right.

Right. As I was sitting in my ground line, and Ryan, now he's a Montgomery County Fire Department, and a very sharp guy, and he lived in Alaska. And I'm sitting there, and directly behind me about 80 yards, I hear a monkey. And, I mean, it's a, you know, but it's a. it's deeper and louder, you know. Immediately it's an owl. The thing moved about 20 yards a little more farther east and did it again.

And then he moved another 20 yards and did it again. And then another 20 yards and he did it again. And now the hair is raising up on the back. I've seen and heard a lot of owls out and I've never seen them jump tree to tree. They either go from one area to a long distance over, you know. They don't go 20 yards. And you know what I mean? I heard that exact noise just outside of Mount Rainier National Park.

And it wasn't an owl. It sounded more like a chimp. Yes. Yes. Well, the thing is, you know, I'm sitting there and I'm just kind of living with it, you know? But when I've seen Ryan walking up a path toward me and he had this look on his face, it drew concern. And he looked inside my blind and he says, what the hell?

It sounded like. a monkey, Gerald. That's a monkey. And again, it was five now, okay? At that's just minutes before that, our friend was in his sight, and he's sitting there, and he hears this, and it's loud. Well, his buddy was on the other side of the 30 road over toward Longview. So he figured that he was coming in, right? And he's just warning him, saying, hey, I'm coming in. you know, but he looked and nobody's there. This thing moved down and he said about 15 minutes later, did it again. Then he looked around and go, he expected to see somebody standing there because of dog gone loud and perfect, you know?

And he said about 10 minutes later, he hears this, and he says it's a big branch. And he just, and he pulls the 45 out and he says, this thing is moving toward his X. And that, and he says, I'm leaving. Now, by the time he left that site and got to the road and went down to, that's when the monkey started. By the time he got down there, it's probably been 10 minutes. That's when the monkey sound started. It's like this thing left him and came right down to where we were. And I tell you what, it is figured this thing out because I go up there.

You know, I start my face site in May, you know, and I never go up by myself unless if I do, I take my dog. I take my dog slipping, both dogs. Anyway, this thing has to travel. That's a little corridor in there. Well, I'll tell you something about the whistling. It's probably the first recorded type of vocalization for me, seeing if you go back and look at any of the carved ceremonial masks that Indians make, and it's fairly universal.

What they say, you see the ones with the pursed lips, the whistling lips? Yes. That's always the Sasquatch, because they always said they, listen. And that was long before any of these other screens or anything else were described. And also on the, on the, I noticed, you know, our friends sent me some pictures that you sent him about these tree breaks, how they, they twist them. Right, right.

I mean, from where I park and where I walk down trail in, and it goes up to this, which is, you know, a game trail. then I follow that in my side right there and it's broken and twisted If you can't say that to me I'd like to see it Okay

I will The thing is You're going to have to give me your number and stuff I'm not on the web and stuff And I know you guys are going to go on to the web Here in November I'm going to try to get on there Because I'll pay

I love you guys the show I don't care if it's 20, 50 bucks a month I'm going to pay listen to this because I love it You guys are the most straight up and honest you know and you're telling it like it is

not some embellished BFRO freaks you know I watch the guys frustrating you know and they're not really not really on the mark

those guys yeah we appreciate it Gerald we're not it's not going to be 20 or 30 bucks a month for the membership we're talking more like

seven bucks a month but we're going to be doing war shows and I wanted to ask you, when you heard it shaking the tree, how far away from you was it? It's about a hundred yards down the hillside from me.

There's enough brush where I couldn't see the base of it if it was there. You know, the other 50 feet up. Yeah. And Gerald, that uncomfortable feeling didn't leave you until you left the area, correct? Correct. Correct. And, you know, I said,

or talking to my money about this, I said, You know what? Why is he's saying, you know, this is a Sasquatch. He knows me. He knows my friend, you know, and he knows us. And maybe he's coming in saying, all right, I know they hunt at night. It's getting dark, fellas, you've hunted all damn day, now it's like her. And more than likely there was more than one there.

That's what I'm afraid. Right. And they're whistling. signal to another one. Oh, is that right? Right. And they may have been coming in to take your game. And I believe that.

We've got trail cameras up, but they've never, I've never seen one in there. You know, an elk and deer, but I've never had, you know, but we're setting out of socket to a friend of my neighbor, Jeff, he's a wildlife biologist from the state of Washington. And he told me, he says, put up some DNA traps. I go, how's that? and go up to a tree, put some barbed wire around. Hopefully they'll lose some hair for you. And I said, well, that's a pot.

So we're going to be doing that. We're going to set up our own little investigation, and we're going to be going up there, setting up a trail camera, because I think this thing is coming up, this one skitter road that's above our site, and it's coming up on top and dropping down on us, coming from the long-viewed area.

Yeah, they're going to be coming down from a high area where they're sleeping to the lower areas to hunt. Usually right around dusk and then early, around daylight, they head back up. And here's something that's, you know, for what it's worth, our friend Mr. Black told me that they see the IR from the trail cams. That's why trail cams don't work because we see them and avoid them. Yeah, I've always wondered about that. You know, you think, you know, I have infrared and I do think, you know, are they there watching me when I put these things up? Well, I tell you what, I've had two or three incidents that occurred to me when I was baiting this year.

And my dog took off running. And I mean, so she's a good side of college. She's 120 pep as I was, you know, and she took off the left, like running toward rock. I called her back. She stopped just before she crested, you know. And then when we got down to my site, my chocolate lab, he got, I was over at my son's side putting some big. out for him and I'll turn and he faced like

stayed totally focused to see anything but he knew something. When we left that dog was right by my side. He was right beside me like you're staying between me and whatever it is. You know that's kind of the way my colleague acted

you know when I had my first encounter he ran out to the tree line he froze and he was just really really focused on whatever was in that tree line and then he bolted back passed me to the house. You know, as I was watching this, I think it was unsolved mysteries the other night, they had this one galsh is doing a investigation, and they were talking about this group.

And they interviewed this one man and a boy, and his son, anyway, and they were coming back for fly fishing, and they described this area, and they showed this area where they witnessed this scene. Do you know what other things I can look for, you know, besides like a branch breaking, Or, you know, when you're out there, is there anything that kind of throws red flags to you? You should be able to find scat. I've seen a picture. Our friend sent me a picture of one that you had sent him.

And I've seen it look like Bear Scat. Right. Well, yeah, you can tell the difference between Sasquatch and Bear Scat. There's a big difference. Yeah, I've seen Bear Scat that was. look like pop cans. I'm not kidding you. There's some big bear around.

That's not, that's not Bear's Cat. What? That's not Bear's Cat. What? What are you saying it is? That's a sports cat. Bear's Cat doesn't get that big.

I, God, I wish I still had the picture of it. I couldn't believe how big it was. And this, it was a big. Yeah, that's, and you know what this was? You know where that was?

The Wild Boy. You know where you take Skamani County Road. You go up to the 1,200 Road, and you can either go right to go to Dugent Falls or go left and go up to Skamini Mines Road. Well, if you take Scamini Mines Road, drop off. That's the Wild Boy down in there. That is where I found that scat. That's up near where I had my second sighting. Do you know where Apache Cave is on the river there?

Yes, I do. What the local call? Up, right? That's up above. Right. Just upstream from that maybe 50 feet, I saw a big gray one that was right around 9, 10 feet tall, probably 1,500 pounds. My God, why don't you think? It was enormous.

It was enormous. So something that big could make a pile of crap that big. Just saying, and I'm serious. I remember I'd give it measurement, you know, and it went up. I'm not kidding. It wouldn't have passed my leg. And I didn't... There was size of big round it was.

There are no bear in that area that makes cap that big. I'll guarantee it. And I'll tell you what. In that area? And then also, it's amazing. Now that I've been listening to your show and been trying to pick up as much information as I can, it answers a lot of inconsistencies, you know, through your... I've hunted all my life.

And especially with these tree breaks stuff, because going down into that wild boy area, you know, there's a lot of marsh here. There's a couple really good little marsh areas in there. And I remember I watched this trail. And as I was walking this, and I dropped out the Sweening Mine's Road and dropped down to the thick stuff,

but it opens up. And I remember for about 150 yards, there's these tree breaks. And there are like every 50 yards, But they were just like the one that I got a picture up, and it was just like, I'm going, I wonder what's that. You know, I never registered to me. The first time I found those was in 1991 during the middle of the summer up in the Washagull River watershed. A couple of us were up there, about 2,200 feet up the slope going on the north side of the watershed.

And along a small ridge that was under the big ridge, inside the close. canopy, about every hundred yards we found one of these trees that were just snapped 90 degrees over, eight feet off the ground. Appreciate all the kind of words, man. Oh, no problem, man. I tell you what takes off to work. You know, I think everything happens for a reason. And I think braining, just as much to light.

And, you know, it really is. You know, I told my buddy, I listened to this story, and I tell you what, you know, You know him. He was dead serious. Anyway, I told him, I believe you. But then the more I listened to... Now, these are the answers to things that I've been seeing all along. I just didn't know what the heck it was.

And that happens to a lot of people. I think a lot of people just aren't aware of what they're looking at. And how many hunters out there? I know there's more hunters out there sees this thing occurring all the time. They just don't take no to it or just absolutely. You know, but this feeling in this area, I'm not kidding, it's so timber, you know, we're bow hunting, you know, and, uh, goodness, you just, if I believe him, then I got to believe that something is out there. I know the area you hunt well, and there's a lot of encounters in that area, a lot. Oh, yeah, and I spent 12 years learning the, uh, their movement patterns throughout that whole area, south of Mount St.

down at the Columbia River. So when you say they're in that area in September, that's right on the money. And that's what we've really, you know, I, and there's, like last year, not this year, but the year before last, I was up on the skitter road and I was going up toward the crazy hills area, stench. I don't know. It smelled dead, you know, and I looked around for something dead, but then it would leave. You know, you'd get like the wind would catch it. You'd smell it and then it would go away.

Then you'd smell it and it would go away, you know. And at times it was very strong that you think, well, I'd just walk a little ways off here. There's got to be something dead over here. But I never did find anything. And then all of a sudden, the hair on the back of my neck stands up. And then I listen to my senses. If it tells me, I leave, I leave. You know, we experienced that over on Wind River where the fish hatchery is over there.

Yes, I do. We walked right into a wall of stink that made us almost throw up, and we walked out of it, and when we came back, it was gone. Yep. And I found a spot where there was moss, and the moss was flattened down, but there was, you know, there were no discernible tracks or anything, but, you know, obviously something had pressed that moss down. It was raining, and, you know how it is. I mean, there's an explanation for it.

What it is, I don't know exactly what it was, but I'd never smelled anything like that before. or since. About four years ago, I was walking up the 32 road, and I was going to go up into the meadows. And as I got about a mile from the gate, I mean, you know, and it dropped down into the tall timber, and it went down toward Meadow Creek, a pretty good area to follow. So I walked down in there. And when I got down into the tall timber, there we go again. I'm getting goosebumps now.

You got the big timber that's dead. You have ferns that are eight feet tall. They're just huge. It's like going into three historic days, you know, going in there. Right. And then I get about 200 yards in there. And you know what? That's when I first saw this, I get this twist branches, you know, like a tree that's been twisted, that broke, you know?

Right. And I noticed that there. And I started to take a couple more steps and all of a sudden that here on the back, my next stand up. And I came to a complete stop. And it was almost like, I'm going, why am I feeling this way? You know? So, you know, I always told my buddy, hey, I'm the mean staying in the woods because, man, I carry a gun. If there's something out there, they didn't go to sneak up on something.

And then a couple days later, a couple of guys that were camping down the road from us, they had gone in the same area. And they heard, they stopped by the, but they went in that state. And they found the tree breaks in that area right by myself. And I don't hunt by myself. They're listening to your show. Yeah, I'll never go out alone. Now, it's just not safe. I know you said that, I mean, these animals are, or I guess you're an animal.

They're big. But I would think that you is to have. And so I would imagine something came across in front of me and stopped and blocked my way. Wouldn't you take that as a threat? Oh, yeah. And wouldn't you react in a manner as to defend yourself? You know, I get 40 with me, and I think, well, maybe a 30 out six would be like a 22 to these things. But, you know, they still have an anatomy and they're big.

Sure. And, you know, you can be easy with a bow. I would think, you know, shooting something like that, you know, I think in the chest or something with a 40, it would be stupid. I don't think it would be to do it, you know. Yeah, you'd have to get the right shot. that that that's why I would think you know I've been I was in law enforcement for training and SWAT training and so forth

and they describe different points of where you'd want to shoot somebody dead out I don't know how their neck you always say they don't have a neck right well the head sits down under the shoulders kind of like a gorilla so then if you used to shoot something like that would you get the spinal cord

you know what I mean like a human I would say if you were behind it, and that's something John Green and Renee DeHendon used to say many years ago was to go for a spinal shot of it was going away. I think if I were in that situation, I might go for an eye shot because then you might hit the brain. If you did a mouse shot, well, you might be buying yourself some time to get away in a case like that.

Yeah. Because that's the only thing I worry about. Here's the other consideration. If you shoot one, where are these buddies? And that's what I worry about. You know, and it's like you said, you know, when he's, you know, if he's whistling, maybe he is signaling another one, you know. Right. And maybe he just stayed there the whole time this buddy came down to where we were.

I don't know. Exactly. Yeah, it's hard telling. But this all happened with it. You know, that circumstance, that, the situation that occurred to happen within like a 15-minute period of time, you know, where it happened to him, my buddy, and then it happened to us, you know. So we had to know where our sights were, you know. Oh, sure. We'll see any primate, they're very well of everything in their environment.

And obviously, if something man-made is there, they're going to know all about that. Do you want to hang out with us while we listen to these last two encounters? Sure. You bet you. Well, yeah. If you don't mind, hang on and hang out with us and tell us what you think of these last two encounters I'm going to play. This is Lisa from an Indian. in reservation, and she talks, she's talking about encounters that she had on the reservation.

The second clip I'll play for you is about a four-minute clip, and she's talking about older stories on the reservation. Creature has been around our area for a long time. There's a lot of old stories that involve this creature, and six or seven years ago, we have our annual celebration at home and it's a big Native American Cal well. A lot of people there

I mean, you know, it's a busy bustling time. They were seeing it, they were siding it near, close to town, by the creek, just standing in the shadows watching people. And that story was going around. So people were saying, you know, watch your kids, that kind of thing. When I was a young girl, I would say six, seven years old, we went to a celebration in North Dakota.

At that time, a lot of the language spoken was our traditional language. So these gatherings were going on in their language. And I didn't understand. I grew up speaking English. So my grandmother was listening. and it was during this celebration and the MC, you know, the announcer, he was really telling a story

in our language, our traditional language, and every now and then you could hear him make growling, weird growling noises and then real high screams and it was scary and I was asking my grandma, what's he saying, what's he saying? And she was just shushing me because she was trying to hear what he was saying.

And I had no idea what the story was, but it kind of stopped the whole celebration and kind of made everybody in like a somber mood. But he was explaining, I guess, an encounter that they had up there. The whole community was involved before everybody was up there for the celebration, I guess. In this community, there was a young child that had been stolen. and the older gentleman, the announcer, was a part of a search party. What had happened was the young boy was playing with his cousins. They were playing along the creek, and I guess this big foot start chasing them. All the other little cousins, the kids, made it back to the house, but it got the boy.

It got the little boy. So the kids went and told their families and they got a search party out for this young boy. And this happened over a span of a few days where they were looking for this child. He was explaining how these things they run together in groups. He said that the announcer was saying this, that it can mimic a person's, the way a person sounds, It can mimic a person's voice that it really likes the sound of children's playing. That's what it tracks it around. And it can disappear really fast in that it really likes bonfires.

For whatever reason, it likes fire, and it'll start their own bonfires, and they'll gather around that scene around the bonfire. They never did find the young child, but they looked for it and looked for him and look for those things for a long time and it just led him on wild goose chases and it would try and lure the men who were searching.

It would try and single them out and lure them away before they realized what was happening. There are stories they tell us, you know, don't be out past sundown because you know, those things like to hear kids laughing. Kids laughing and playing

kind of brings it around, I guess. There are stories of it from way back, way a long time ago. So it's not a new phenomenon for our people. And I'm going to play this last part. It's a two-minute clip, but it's the police who had an encounter with the Sasquatch when it was called out to a home. And I'd like everyone's feedback on what their take on the situation. And Gerald, feel free to chime in and tell us what you think.

But take a look. I have another story from a cousin of mine who was a police officer on a neighboring reservation and they had a call, they had a frantic 911 from a lady who said there was a bigfoot harassing them and they lived in a trailer. So him and his colleague, two units went out to that trailer. the first unit got there, it turned on a, you know, it's spotlight, and they shined it on the front, the front of the trailer there where the front door was. And that Bigfoot was, like, sitting on the porch and banging on their house. The cop freaked out, and he couldn't believe what he was seeing.

And so that Bigfoot stood up and went to walk towards the unit. So the cop thought he put it in reverse to, you know, reverse out of there. And here he accidentally put the car neutral. So the engine made a big sound, you know, when it revved. And that kind of freaked out the big foot. So the Bigfoot stopped. And then just at that point, I guess my cousin rose up in his unit and he sees it. Now these units have those dash cams on it.

It was recorded on their dash cams. as my cousin pulled up in his unit and had his life on it, it ran off into, I guess there was a creek area as well near that trailer. So they interviewed the family, and I guess it just came, and it was begging on the house, growling at them, shaking the trailer, because it was just, you know, one of those single wide trailers. So the family was terrified, and they couldn't figure out why it had done that. just out of the blue. We asked my cousin about, you know, the dash cam if they had it recorded. And he said they did. They seen the recording.

So my cousin said after his shift that the next morning when he came in, he was going to get the recording from his unit. That next morning, you know, he got off work when he went back in the next morning. The recording of that disappeared out of both their units. cover up. It's probably our two guys we were talking about earlier. Right. You know, and it's just like, you know, when you talk about Mr. Black, you know,

like get the economics, you know, about keeping some like this is secret or something, you know, and trying to keep it as a folklore type of. There's just too much evidence out there, you know. Right now, I mean, and your show is bringing it out. you know and that's what I love about your show it's phenomenal you know I you know I listen to you on my telephone

if I if I because my iPad died on me so I listen to all your your uh your uh you know why they want to cover something like this I thought you know it's just

besides it that's because I believe now that it is true and the main reason I wanted to call this evening is to get information from you guys and because I love hunting and I don't want to give it up and I'm not going to and if I do see something like that do I just continue just should I ignore it

and continue to just do what I'm doing? Well I think as long as it's not stalking you and trying to eat you you're probably okay if it just hangs in the area you know I don't mind to hang in the area yeah if there's no real interaction I wouldn't worry too much about it I spend a lot of time in that area and I never really, at least not to my knowledge,

had one trying to do anything to, you know, my buddies and I when we were up there. My buddy Reggie, and he was telling me a couple of years ago, him, they were up off the 65 road, going up toward Thomas Lake. They were at the crossroad, and he dropped his son off, and he was going to walk this ridge line, Reggie drove down about a mile, and then he cut up on the hill. And he stood there and he looked at his compass and said,

you know, he took the north direction, the south, and so forth. And he started heading up this hill. And so he got up to quite a way. He checked his compass again, and it said south, and he was traveling north. So he turned around and he said, okay, this got to be going north. So he started going north. He checked his compass a little later, and he said he was going south again. So he was getting, I think, a lab up there.

Right. That'll throw compasses off in that whole region. About that time, he said, he was going. thought, well, you know, it's kind of getting late, and I don't want to get lost, so he started head back when it came back down. And we were talking about this last night. He came across these tracks, and he says, Gerald, these things were 18 inches long. He thought, well, maybe, you know, the track kind of changed to where it was like, like it was, you know, the toes weren't there. You know what I mean?

Where before the toes were there, but then the toes were lifted up or something. and it was just getting like the ball and the hill area. He stopped and looked at it and it was just really straight. He goes, I wonder if he knew if it was a big foot. And he goes, it was Gerald. He goes out with that foot. If he knew us, he tried to change his track. You know, the one that I saw left 18-inch prints in that area too.

Oh, really? So it could be the same individual, but there was another one seen in that same area that was pretty close to the size of the one that I saw. one of it's kind of a dark brown color. But now, let me go back to something when you mentioned about worrying about being out there. Remember, these things don't all have the same temperament. So it really depends. And Wes can tell you this.

The group that he and Woody encountered had a completely different temperament. So it depends on, you know, the group that you're dealing with and their basic mindset, the individuals. It could even go right down to how well it's eaten that day, you know, or it's health and things like that,

what kind of temperament they're going to have. And they're a little testy to begin with. And then we're not even talking about different types. You know what? When I listen to that episode, it's going to be mean. Oh, yeah. They are.

I'm just circling you like that. I don't know what. I don't know how you guys was able to, you know, you guys are paralyzed, work you. Yeah, pretty much. Pretty much.

like mice and a bunch of cats playing with us? I just couldn't imagine do what you guys did. I think that would ruin me for a lot. Yeah, that's why I think we all get a little frustrated with the friendly forest giant stories that are since I knew

considering that the other stories go back hundreds of years and me and Will are partial to those stories and you don't hear those going back that far. This is all newer stuff. I think the people that generate that kind of stuff, have never had any sort of personal encounter.

Right. You know, I've never seen a, I've never seen a footprint. Well, I have, you know, I've seen a footprint one time, but it was up in San Point, Idaho property, and we came across this lake, and it was cold, you know, and I saw this human footprint the mud. There was just one single friend, and I just looked at it to Bigfoot, you know, and I just, and I couldn't even tell you, it looked like the side. Yeah, I thought it was cold.

Yeah, exactly. Yeah, you have to look at the context. My brother went on some tracks like that, and he passed it off thinking of it was, you know, he saw this father and his kids kind of playing in the water, and he thought it was them. And I said, well, how big were the tracks? So he kind of holds up his hand.

And I said, you need to take me and show me those. And it was about a month afterwards, and they were, you know, just over 14 inches long. Well, there's no person with a bare foot. It's over 14. They look just like the Patterson tracks. I mean, which were about the same size. There were roughly 100 tracks around there.

Now, would you say that? Yeah, for the most part. But there are the type 2s around too. And which are? Well, they're similar, but they, they, now the difference you can tell if you happen to see the teeth, the type ones, the Patterson type, has more squared teeth like we do,

no real protruding canines. But the type two, is definitely a little uglier creature. They will walk on all fours as much as they do two legs. And the hair distribution is a little different. And they have a very nasty temperament. They have large canines. Oh, really?

Are in the area, too? They are, yes. Not as much as the type ones, but they are around. They are around, though. You know, that close-minded to think that... Oh, you know. ...living in Washington State. And you know what...

Yeah, and that area that you're in, you know, is over 3,000 square miles south of Mount St. Helens. So that's a hell of a lot of forests. That's right. That's right. And to think that... Very seldom. Very seldom. It's like I'm talking about...

Yeah, right. Yeah, we're losing a bad bet. Yeah, exactly. Wes is like, I beg to differ. Yeah. It's not a rough. lottery. And people, you know, you always hear that people saying, oh, God, I'd love to see one.

Yeah, right. Well, I don't know if I want to see one. You don't really want to see one. I don't know if I want to or not, you know. And if I did, I don't know how I'd react. I think I would free. I would feel up right there with you. You know, I would think I would be an different for anybody, you know.

Adult, not crap my pants, but I think I might, you know. Well, the problem is you can't choose your encounter. You know, you can't be like, oh, yeah, I'm going to definitely see it from, you know, 200 yards away. But I'll definitely know it's a Sasquatch. Like, you can't choose. So. I think, you know. Yeah.

Very where I'm at, you know, if I do see one, it's going to be close. It's not going to be from 200 yards. It's probably 20 yards, you know. Right. I mean, and that's what I wanted to. Yeah, and that's why I wanted to get information from you is how do I react? I don't know. Because normally primates will challenge,

like I had a guy over, you know where YF is? Yeah. Over past the fridge of the gods on the Oregon side. Yeah, I do. Back in 88, I interviewed a guy that was charged by one over there. And he said,

well, I think I just kind of went into shock because I just stood there. I didn't do anything. Well, the thing ran at a dead run at him, screamed, and ran on a dead run at him. and he said about 10 or 15 feet away, it stopped. And it just kind of stood there and looked at it. Because he didn't move, because he didn't move, it walked away.

And you look at how these researchers approach gorillas. It's kind of the same way. You know, the guerrillas will demonstrate. They will bluff and they'll do all kinds of things. You don't react to him. You're kind of like a bear, you know, you just kind of, you know, don't engage them. don't, certainly don't antagonize them. No.

Because that's a losing proposition. And then when you get the opportunity to leave, get out of there. Do you think setting up like DNA drafts, I'm trying to get further out than that's on this thing? I don't know. You know, like I said, because they're going to spot any little thing that's out of place in their environment. And believe me, like any other primate, they know everything,

highly visual. Of all the five senses, vision is by far the most predominance. So they know everything that's in their environment. If you put something different out there, they're going to know it, they're going to see it right away and probably avoid it. I mean, they don't just go blundering along, you know, and just, you know what I mean? Yeah, I would imagine someone that's been out there in the woods that long.

It's going to be pretty, you know, it's kind of like a deer. You know, it's amazing how they know their neighborhood. Oh, yeah, absolutely. And they're the hunters, so they know it even better. And that's what, you know, and let's say, you know, kind of like when I first started listening, I always got the idea that they were vegetarians, you know, until I started listening to your show. Now I found out, I guess they're not, you know. And I guess if I was in their shoes, I wouldn't want to be a vegetarian either.

I like me, you know. And I just don't want to be on a dinner plate. I read something a while back when they were talking about the advantages of different types of food, what different types of foods do. And it has to do with brain size and things like that. Of course, all primates have large brains. It takes a lot of fuel to run a large brain, let alone the body size. So you have to eat just a ton more vegetation compared to a small amount of meat to get the same energy output from that.

So something that doesn't, especially in the Northwest, where, you know, food might be, you know, a few and far between. You have to maximize how much energy, you know, and they're ambush predators. So considering body size and all the mechanics involved, it's much more desirable like a big cat does to lay in wait for a game to come by. Then you use a quick burst of energy to get that prey. Then you maximize what you're getting out of it. So they hunt generally either far apart or alone or in coordinated efforts, you know, if they're going to get more. game, that's where I started finding droppings. I was in an area.

I have an area I call area number four. It's kind of my favorite because I go in there in the month of July and August, which is the only time of year you see sign of them in there. And in a 35-square-mile area, I can find up to 50 piles of their feces. I mean, they're eating well. They crap everywhere. So I went down to a creek area and we didn't see any feces there whatsoever. And I thought, well, this is kind of strange because it was everywhere else.

and I started thinking, well, if I'm something this big and want to maximize my energy intake but minimize the energy output, how would I do that? And I started looking inside the tree line near a game trail, and lo and behold, here are these dozens of piles of crap in there. They were hiding, waiting for deer to come by. Oh, my goodness. So, you know, it just requires a little bit of common sense and brain power to figure out what they're doing. and where they are.

Yeah, there's one trick that I was used for elk, you know, and when I do my bait side, I, my scent, then they hear my truck pants. If they're there, they hear the honk, I come down with the food, they just go off, and then it says to the food down the right back. So they're equating my scent. If the hotspatch is around, they smell that scent.

They know me, right? Actually, I think they don't have that great a sense of smell. I mean, they do smell because, you know, when you get out in the wild, you're self-hunting. After you're out there a while, your senses become a little sharper. Are they as sharp as like you're thinking elk or ear, Lucy? I don't think that much because with the snout,

one of the purposes of having a long snout is you have a lot more smell sensors in there, the nerve endings for our first smell, so they can pick up smaller particles, you know what I mean, to smell better. And a Sasquatch has pretty much a flat nose. There's not a whole lot of area there for those nerve endings. but they can smell something. I mean, like, you know, we can smell deer and elk

around hunting if you've been out a little while. Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. So I think they can smell that well, but it's going to be more visual and hearing, I think, with them. Yeah, that's the one thing. The main thing I called, you know, you know, they teach you to have to know the different

conscious and subconscious, you know. So if you go through the scenario, then if it happens, you've already done it'll be automatic. So I'm starting to thinking, I just want to be safe. You know, I love doing what I'm doing, but if the thing does it do, and he does pop out, you know, I want to know, through the scenario, I'm kind of running through my head. What am I going to do? Number one, I'm going to free you. I know that for a fact.

I'm not moving in the hands. Don't move. Don't antagonize him. You're probably okay if you've got a rifle in your hands because they seem to know what those are. When I first encountered two of them at 16, I had a 22 rifle. my hands, thank God, because I was only about, you know, 10 to 15 feet away from them. And I shot in the air. That's when the second one came around.

But I think it was just enough where they knew what the threat was. I didn't move. I did stare, you know, at the first one. And, you know, when the second one came around, I took off running. But, you know, they didn't follow me. Yeah. Because I had a rifle in my hands. And I didn't do anything.

that could have been taken as an aggressive act back. Right. That's what primates do. For instance, we had one recently where we talked about the kid on the bike who, and I don't know if you heard that, but had one grab his bike and the kid flew off the bike, and the thing was moving its lips up and down showing its teeth. Well, our anthropologist friend Mark Dobbs said with primates,

it's something they call a lip, And what that is is primates will, you know, especially ones that have large canines, will show their teeth to an opponent as a threat. That's a big topic. Yeah. And what it is in nature, he said that it's easier to threaten each other visually rather than actually get into a fight because you get in a fight nature. You can die very quickly from small things. So it's not something that they want to do, but they will jostle over, you know, food territory, you know, mates, things like that.

But so they'll do that display. And I think a lot of times when the Sasquatch is, you know, thrashing trees at a person or whatever it is they're doing, that's a display. That's a way, you know, they make themselves look bigger like they need to and batter as a way of saying, hey, this is my area, stay the hell out, or if you're a threat, I'm worse, this is what's going to happen to you, and so on.

So your best bet's just to stay still and don't do anything. The area that I do see something like this thing, this thing is going to be 20 yards from me, you know, it's not closer. And so basically, I don't have a chance in heck, you know, if this thing moves as fast as it does, you know, everything's going to happen very, very fast. Yeah, I think a lot of people don't realize how thick the foliage is out in Washington State, you know, out here in the Northwest.

If you come across one, you know, I would try and back out of the area before an interaction happens, but you're right. I mean, by the time you come upon it, you're going to be closer than you probably really want to be at the time. I would just be safe and just try and back out as quickly. Just try and back out. What Wes and Woody did was really a good case for that, you know, I don't think they didn't realize really what was going on, but didn't feel like they could do anything so they didn't do anything. I guess that's kind of simplifying it, but, you know,

you sort of freeze in those situations and you don't know how to react. So in some ways that's a built-in protection. Because if you act aggressively, they're going to react back aggressively. Right. Right. And a lot of times, you know, it's just me and my wife. My wife will go up with me. And, you know, I'm going to protect her.

And bottom line, my wife's going to get out of the woods safe. I don't care. And I'm up there. You know, she loves going up there with me. And I say, it's a good quiet time. get to walk to the woods and everything. And she enjoys doing the base ice with me and stuff like that. But most of the time in the daytime, you shouldn't have any problem.

And Wes made a good point. He said, you know, if you can, just back out of there. Because if they're in an area and they'll let you know they don't want you there, there's probably a good reason. Either there's a young one there or they've got food there. So if you just back away from it, they'll probably leave you alone. Okay. Now, if something ever just kind of walked by you, you know what I mean?

Say you're walking down the trail and you see it just crossing. Go back the other way. And that's telling you. Yeah, just easy. Tell them to stay away. Is that what it would be? I don't know. It's hard telling you.

It may be just crossing, but usually if it's probably going to know you're there, and it might be just, you know, the lesser males or something, you know, trying out their own displays, you know. So the best thing is just turn around and go back the other way. Gerald, thanks for coming on. Thanks for joining us. Absolutely. I really appreciate it.

I feel very grateful. Thank you, guys. And if I can get your number, I can send you that picture. It's probably better at my email. It's just William Jebbing at yahoo.com. Thanks a lot, guys. Oh, thanks for listening and thanks for all the kind of words, man. Really do appreciate it very much.

Okay, and I'm looking forward to getting on the net and watching you guys. Sounds good. Thanks so much, Ter. All right. Night, guys. Take care. Well, I want to thank Lisa for allowing us to interviewer, and I want to thank everyone for listening tonight.

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