Sasquatch Chronicles - SC EP:675 It Looked Like A Primitive Man

Episode Date: July 27, 2020

Tonight I will be speaking to Jack who had an encounter when he was young. Jack says "I lived in a rural area in Pennsylvania. I remember going down this road and I had this bike and the chain would always come off. I looked down at my chain and had a feeling I was being watched I looked up and saw this thing watching me. We will also be speaking to Will who is from Canada and he had a recent encounter. Will says "I thought it was a basketball player with a hoodie on. It had a small tree or branch in its hand and when it dropped what it had in its hand I noticed the deltoid muscle was the size of a basketball. It reminded me of a primitive man."

It looked like somebody was bent over and had their head in the window of the deer blind. It either heard me or smelt me, and he pulled his head out of the tent and stood straight up. That shocked me. They don't make people that big. The way it moved, almost as if it was gliding across the beach. I've never seen anything moved like that in my life. They were screaming at each other in gibberish. It sounded like a language and they were chuntering away back and forwards, back and forwards, back and forwards.

I know what a bear looks like and there is no way on this planet but what I saw were bears. What's going on? What do you report? Get somebody out here. What's going on now, sir? That son of a bitch is about six foot nine, I don't know. Do you see a bouncer? Yes, I'm looking right here. Uh-uh.

This is Sam Starbook from London, UK, and you're listening to Cessquatch. Welcome to the show, everyone. Thanks for being here tonight. Got a great show planned for you tonight. We're going to be chatting with Jack, who comes to us from Pennsylvania, and he had an encounter when he was very young. Jack has a fascinating take on this whole subject, because he spent so much time in the scientific world.

It's kind of fascinating to talk to a guy like this and get his take on this whole big foot subject. We'll also be chatting with Will, and William comes to us from Canada. He had an encounter a couple of years ago, actually, where he got a pretty good look at this creature. And Will's going to be sharing that with us tonight. If you've had an encounter and you'd like to be on the show, shoot me an email. My email address is Wes at Sasquatch Chronicles.com. And if you get a chance to check out Sasquatch Chronicles.com. You can become a member and get additional shows.

Let's jump into it tonight. I want to welcome Jack to the show. Jack, thanks for coming on. Yeah, my pleasure to be here. Yeah, I really appreciate you being here. And I know your encounter took place in Pennsylvania. How many years ago did this happen, Jack? So it was in the summer of 1982, so quite a while now.

Yeah, yeah, definitely still stays with you, though, doesn't it? it does it makes an impression on you for a lifetime i think no doubt no doubt well if you would take us back to that moment kind of tell us what you were doing and and walk us into what happened so it was you know it was a nice summer's day it was july i remember that i don't remember exactly what day it was but um i know i was nine years old at the time and you know like a lot of kids in the early 80s just out kind of tooling around playing outside. I lived at the time in a very rural area, so there were a lot of neighborhood kids to hang out with. But it was, you know, it was a good place to grow up, lots of farmland, lots of

forest. And I can remember that I had gotten a 10-speed bike, a free spirit was the brand from Sears Roebuck and Company earlier that year. And it was kind of funny because, you know, a 10-speed bike isn't, you know, something that actually is very functional out in a very hilly mountainous area where there's not a lot of good places to ride but it was still fun and so I remember that I was kind of riding it around in my driveway and yard area and I decided to go just up the road just a wee bit there's a cemetery that is diagonal from the property that I grew up on and it's crossed the road and it's so it was a macadam road so I rode up the macadam road and invariably would this particular bike.

As much as I loved it, the chain was always coming off. So you would switch gears and it would just pop off. And you'd have to stop and reset the chain and do all that kind of good stuff. So it was funny because at the time it happened right in front of the cemetery as I was going by. And I stopped. And there was a pull-off, not a formal parking lot for the cemetery, but it was a good little dirt pull-off. And then you had the cemetery gate.

and of course all the headstones and such. And the cemetery was surrounded by a stone wall, it was farming area, so it was natural to see a lot of stone walls around. And so I started working on my bike. And for a moment, when I look back now, it feels like a bad B horror movie that the chain fell off at that moment

because I was fixing it. And then I just kind of felt, want to say that I felt like I was being watched, but I felt like I was not alone. So I just stood up and I was looking around, and I noticed at the back of the cemetery, which the length of the cemetery, I would say West was a good, I've paced it. It's a good 110 yards maybe in length and maybe 40 yards wide. So I noticed like a figure at the back of the cemetery. and it was it was very very strange because I didn't know what I was looking at and it you know it wasn't that at the time I was unaware of soft squash as a kid you know a lot of kids growing up in the 70s and 80s were familiar with it but I think my my impression was more that it was more like a like kind of like a cranky chew pocket type character between seven and eight feet tall.

And that's not exactly what I saw. What I saw was very black. Like I can remember the, it had, it looked like a coat on. And the coat was jet black. It, it was a little shiny, but not super glossy or anything. But you could tell it was thick and clean. And the figure that I was looking at was, between nine and ten feet tall.

And the reason I know that is that it was standing next to a maple sapling, which I went back and looked at, which was a good maybe eight feet tall, and this was a good two feet above that, and it was standing next to it. I couldn't see any feet or hands as it was actually on the outside of the stone wall at the back of the cemetery. So, if you can imagine, I was looking through the cemetery to the back at this figure, and it was right behind the stone wall. But what was strange about it was it was almost rectangular in shape, like a vertical rectangle. And it had like a very small, from what I could see, bumped for a head. And I didn't quite understand that at the time.

I think looking back at it more and listening to other people's encounters that the trapezius muscles on these things can be extremely developed and may make the head look a little bit scrunched down. And that's basically what I saw. It was very black. It was the way the sun was angled. It made it very difficult to really distinguish a face necessarily. But I could, you know, as a kid, I had an impression that I was being, I was being, watched, you know, almost like your neighborhood dog might watch you as you pedal by his house. And I stood there and I looked at it for quite some time and I was just amazed by the size of it,

the way it just seemed to absorb the sunlight. And it was motionless. You know, I smelled nothing. I, you know, I heard nothing. But it was definitely there and it was staring at me. And of course, I immediately I didn't feel like this was a good place for me to be. So I grabbed that free spirit bike and I didn't even bother with the chain anymore. And I just took off down the road running. And it's funny because, you know, I didn't see it come or go. But a day or two later I ventured back to look and it was nothing there. So it wasn't that I had mistaken, you know, I don't know, a freestanding object like a stump or a,

a tree that had been lopped off by lightning or something like that there had been something large black humanoid looking with dark black fur standing there staring at me so after listening to many of

your your collars I feel like I really got off very lucky and you know I just wanted to share that because the you know listening to other people's stories have definitely helped me over the over the last few years just coming to terms with what I saw and what I'm pretty sure

was a bona fide encounter. Yeah, I appreciate sharing it. It's so bizarre. You know, I was talking about this on Friday Night Show for the members, because there's a few encounters like this when people were kids, how they'll just kind of sit and watch you. And it's weird, man, with kids for whatever reason, they generally speaking, not always, but generally speaking, they just kind of sit and watch. They don't really, not a ton of aggression, not really, and that's not to say that doesn't happen, but I'm saying generally speaking, most people who recount encounters like you who are adults now, but when they were kids, they were talking about seeing this thing and how it just kind of stood there,

motionless. Did you tell anyone about your encounter? I mean, did you go home, tell your folks? Well, you know, I waited. I waited about three days. and I did tell my mother, and I can remember it very distinctly. She just looked at me and very patiently and, you know, very patiently and quietly with the Jedi mind tricks of a mother said, you saw a bear.

And I wanted to believe her in the horsemen. Like, yeah, I saw a bear. But, you know, I didn't see a bear. Kind of like the title of one of your episodes, that that was no. damn bear. I'm in complete agreement with that. So I did and you know I think I eventually told some friends

and you know you get the ridicule and the laughing and you know people still give me you know Bigfoot paraphernalia as a joke even as an adult over 30 years later and you know I take in stride what are you going to do but I think there just isn't

an appetite for most people that in everyday life to unless they really looked into this phenomenon to to accept that it's a real possibility. So, yeah. Yeah, no doubt. No doubt. Did it affect you at all as far as one to go out there? Or was it just kind of a weird experience that you've lent it?

Oh, no, no. Yeah, no. It made me very nervous about being out and about for sure. You know, I think after that, he just a bit more circumspect. And I have even, you know, as recently as a couple of years ago in that area, heard strange wood knocks and wood cracks and wondered, hmm, I wonder if, you know, there is a population that moves through or lives permanently in the area. But I do pay attention to my instincts, you know, when I'm out in the woods. and, you know, not that I'm a hunter, but I like to take my dogs out and walk, or I also own property near there. And, you know, I certainly, I don't want to say patrol, but I like to make, you know, know, what's going on on my acreage.

And, you know, I always, and there are days, I'll be honest, when I go out and I feel, no, something doesn't feel right. I think I'm just going to go home and not push it. And then other days it feels like nothing out of the ordinary would ever happen. So I would be not forthcoming if I didn't say that it didn't affect me. It definitely did. And I mean, that's why I'm kind of here on the show today, just expressing that, you know, this did happen. And it's, you know, it can, I think, happen to a lot of people and they just, you know, don't have a way to necessarily deal with it other than, you know, talking about it. but it definitely changed the way I think about the woods and what may be in there.

After all these years of after this encounter and kind of, I would imagine it's been on your, obviously it's been on your mind over the years, have you thought about what these creatures are and kind of what you've concluded? Obviously, there's no wrong answer to that question. You know what I mean? Yeah, you know, I think it's an interesting question. and I'm a scientist by training. I have a background in evolutionary biology.

So I think originally I thought, okay, I'll tell you this. There's what I hope that it is and there's what I hope that it is not. What I hope that it is, just from my pure scientific training in biological sciences, is that it's a relic hominid, that it's some offshoot of, you know, the group of primates that, you know, led to, you know, homo sapiens and some of the other groups that we know have been present throughout the fossil record and that there's some type of, you know, leftover vestige of that era right before our species became the dominant one on the planet. that's what I hope that it is and that it's got a high degree of intelligence and has been able to, you know, remain hidden. And, you know, that's kind of the scientific, that's the I sleep well at night kind of element, you know.

But then I got to be honest. I mean, I have looked into this phenomenon for, you know, a couple of years. I've even gone to some of the, you know, I don't want to call them conventions or meetings. And I've met Jeff Maldram. I've looked at Cass. So I don't deny that it's out there. But, you know, listening to your show and then listening, you know, and doing a lot of reading about, just, you know, ordinary encounters and observations that people make, there's this, there's just this body of, you know, evidence just based on people. experience that that seems to align, right? Like if people were making this up, right,

if this was a figment of people's fantasy, there'd be a high, there'd be a high degree of variation, right? The stories would be, you would think would be all over the board, but there's just so many consistencies in things that don't necessarily make sense. And one of those things, of course, is the debate between the eye shine or, you know, the glowing eyes. And, you know, it's not that, you know, there are, you know, examples of nature with, you know, creatures. They tend to be more microscopic and smaller that have bioluminescent capabilities. But, you know, we have to think that, okay, maybe that is a possibility with these creatures. And, you know, the more I hear the stories and, you know, there were a couple that just really

made me stop and think. And one of them was the story that you, one of your listeners, contributed where I think he was he had encountered some smaller creatures in the forest and then came back and met this woman who had them in her house, right? I remember that very vividly. I listened to that story a couple of times and I thought, well, you know, just on face value, you might laugh at that, right? And think, oh boy, this is just crazy. But there was another instance where, that was actually, I think it was on coast to coast a number of years ago about a woman from Tacoma who called in who claimed to have spent some time with these creatures and relayed this story that they are not of this planet originally. And these elements do pop up from time to time. And I think a number of years ago I might have laughed at such a thing.

But I can't as a scientist deny that people's empirical experiences aren't. valid, right? And I think because of that, you know, we have to be open to a second possibility that these animals may or may not, or creatures may not necessarily be of this world. And when I say that, I mean, you know, we live in such a gigantic universe. And I think even mathematically, the probability of us being alone is really not, it's just not tenable. It's not. It's not. It's a real possibility. There's just too much, even if you do the math on the number of planets and the probabilities of life forming. I mean, it's just the numbers add up to the astronomical possibility that we are not alone, right? And so, you know, I often think about, you know, what we do as human

beings with animals that you find in zoos and different types of scientific settings, where we experiment with animals. And we, you know, mess with their genetic code. We do testing. We tag, we track, we release, we observe. And I think, you know, there may be an element of that at work. I mean, that is, to me, a possibility that has to be at least recognized. You know, I know we have no way of proving that at this point, at least to the satisfaction of, you know, the scientific community or the, you know, the greater public.

at large, but I think, you know, like John Bindernoggle used to say on your show, you know, is the society ready for the evidence? And I think, you know, that may be a case here where, you know, at least empirically we're hearing stories from people that indicate that there is a link here between, you know, extraterrestrial activity and some of these creatures. Now, have I experienced that personally? No, but I have to be open to it, you know, as a as a scientist and someone who's seen something that isn't supposed to exist. So I guess that's a very long answer to your question. No, it's a great answer.

It kind of, for me, it comes down to those two options. And I'll be honest, I used to think the first one that was much more probable. But I think the second one is much more uncomfortable because it raises all kinds of questions, not only about these creatures, but if you look at Melba Ketchum's work, which I've read, you know, her genetic reports are in line with a report that I would write in a lab. And I have to say that, you know, that was kind of an eye-opener. I think, okay, what if she actually does have genetic material from these creatures and they are related to us? You know, what does that say about us?

So I think some of these questions also may tie into why the government may have such a vested interest in keeping this very quiet and in the realm of the preposterous because it you know i've heard people on your on your show discuss that you know that okay the spotted owl is kind of the test case right for the forestry industry but there has to be something else here that's much larger than the than the forestry industry for for you know a government organization to want to keep a lid on you know a supposed you know relic primate that's running around in the in the forest so of North America and Asia and Australia. And so it really does, it makes you ask the question,

well, if we learn the truth, what's so bad about it? I mean, it would have to be on the magnitude of something that disturbs the economy of the planet, not that like the coronavirus hasn't, but it's something of similar magnitude. It would have to destabilize institutions like religion or economics that, and you know, if you think about some of these ideas,

that, you know, you start pulling on the thread and it unravels, like, holy cow, if we're not alone and there's been visitation and experimentation. And, I mean, that is going to upset a lot of human institutions that basically, you know, control the ebb and flow of our world, you know, whether it's economic or religious or, you know, even scientific. So I think it's a, it's a fascinating topic and that you're making a great contribution. And unfortunately, that just seems to be more questions than answers. But yeah, so yeah, I have obviously have had it on my mind for a while and just tried to take a thoughtful approach and try to be reasonable and not jump to conclusions. But like I said, I don't deny people's experiences in eyewitness accounts because not everyone is paranoid schizophrenic. Not everyone is a liar. And even if you took a small proportion of these cases and gave them credibility, then you still would have a whole set of questions that,

I think are very uncomfortable for us to address. Yeah, no doubt. And I think you said it better than I could have. You know, you're an educated man. I'm a caveman. But you're right. I mean, you're not. I love, you know, what you want it to be.

I'm with you 100%. I would love for it to be that. But I got about 30 follow-up questions that might tear apart that theory. And again, I could be wrong. But, I mean, I got about 30 follow-up questions that most people don't like to hear. You know, most people don't want to hear. The second theory is fascinating, and it makes more sense why the government would cover it up. I've been saying that for years, that, you know, the whole spotted owl and, you know, the forestry department, you know, and on and on and on.

That makes no sense. To me, that makes no sense. I mean, really. You know, you hear a lot of bizarre accounts. Is it people who are delusional? I don't think so. You know, I used to think people who saw. saw the eyeshine you brought up.

Well, they're mistaking that. You know, they're saying their eyes are glowing, but I mean, I can drive down the road, a deer could cross the road, look in my headlights, and it looks like his eyes are glowing, but it's eyeshine. Until I started talking to a bunch of hunters,

and the hunters would tell me, no, it's not eyes shine. Those eyes were glowing. And so, yeah, you're right. I mean, there's so many follow-up questions to what this thing is, and it would make more sense, you know, options.

and be what you don't want it to be, why there would be such a weird cover-up on this subject. I mean, if it was a monkey running around the woods, I don't see the government going to the extent that they are to make everyone hush up about what's going on. You know what I mean? I just don't make sense.

No, it doesn't. Can I ask you real quick about Melba's paper? Well, kind of your take on it. Because I'm not, you know, I mean, I'm not on her level as, and I've always loved, I've always wanted to have her on the show. I'd love to talk to her about it and just get her take on the paper. What was kind of your gut feeling reading that paper?

You know, what she wrote about the whole. Yeah, I read it several years ago. And I remember my impression was, my gosh, this is something that would come out of, you know, the labs I trained in. And what I think what surprised me was the degree of alignment. I think it was in the mitochondrial DNA, which is the DNA that we use that's passed down maternally. And I think that, I think that the science she did seemed spot on. I mean, I couldn't, you know, without being there, I couldn't spot any inconsistencies as far as I knew in her approach. And she just was reporting out what she found.

And I think, I believe that just was that, you know, if she, she, she, she, found this variation in the maternal lineage through the mitochondrial DNA and there was a divergence 15,000 years ago was what sticks in my head. But the other thing I think was that the nuclear DNA was was was not as closely aligned with the human nuclear DNA that you would expect. So I mean what And I think part of the, I don't say controversy, but the grief she has received is that there probably was an expectation that any bona fide genetic work that was done, like from multiple samples from different parts of the continent, would yield a unique genetic fingerprint. And the fact that it was so closely related to, you know, everyday human DNA upset a lot of people. But I mean, as far as the science, I was actually impressed with the paper. And I just, I thought I don't, I don't know why people are so upset.

But yeah, I mean, I think that it's like you say in science, the data is what the data is. It just, you know, it's how we interpret it. And it's how we, how we, you know, construe what it means, which is where it gets sticky. But, I mean, I was extraordinarily brave of her to do that. because, you know, it's clearly could be a career killer where, you know, people become a laughing stock, which is very unfortunate and I think very misguided. But at the same time, I actually think if she had, if the data had revealed, you know, a fingerprint that looked like what we expect, right? Like what, like that first option, like what we wanted to be. I don't think the blowback would have been as hard.

But I think it's very unfortunate because, you know, it's very unfortunate. Because, you know, it's fairly straightforward to right now the science, you know, when we look at comparing, you know, what we have in our genetic databases and the techniques that are used to compare DNA, because that's really what we're doing. I mean, the technology and the techniques are sophisticated, but the concept isn't. I mean, you're basically matching up one code with another. And it's the degree of closeness in those codes that tell you that there. relative distance that one species is from another. And the fact that she came so close to, you know, human DNA is, I think, what disturbed people. And it also gives people a chance to say, oh, it must be contaminated.

But, you know, if her lab is, you know, anything like most university labs, then she's probably had put in, you know, controls for contamination, right? like done done a contaminated set just to see what it looked like if it was the same and that would tell her oh oh geez we did contaminate this we have to either rerun the samples or get new ones so i think that she's been treated unfairly west but you know often if you look back at the history of science it it's full of people you know who are treated unfairly for for you know bringing forth data and observations that were unpopular and uncomfortable at the time. Yeah, and I'm glad you bring that up. I'm glad to have you look at it, you know, being, you know, a scientist and having a scientific mind to look at it, because I've tried to read the paper and I get lost in it. It lost on what she's talking about. And not so much a big foot world, because, I mean, you're dealing with, I hate to say this, but most of people are uneducated. You have like these, you know, quote unquote big names that are like, oh, you know, it's all nonsense. You know, she's a joke and blah, blah. And it's like, well, you finish high school. Yeah. It takes a little more training than that. So what are you basing this off of?

You didn't like the answer. You don't like her. But, you know, I could even see it with the science world if it comes out to where they don't like the answer. But you're right. The science is a science. I would love to have her on. I would love to have her like, dumb it down for me. My audience is smarter than I am.

But at least dumb it down for me. So I can understand where she's coming. from what what she actually found. I don't think that's going to happen, but I would love to have her on to kind of explain it because I got a weird feeling in about 15, 20 years people are going to look back and maybe have a different opinion of her, you know,

as far as what she found and what she, because she was a real scientist. I mean, you know what I mean? Prior to the whole Bigfoot world, she would be called into court as an expert witness. After Bigfoot, she probably couldn't get a job at Carl's Jr. You know, or birth.

Yeah, I know. And I don't think most people probably don't realize that to be called in as an expert witness. It's not just obtaining, you know, a doctoral degree. I mean, you have to have a degree of credibility and have done, you know, work yourself in a particular area that is well respected, as peer reviewed. And, you know, you bring a certain gravitas to the courtroom to be able to be able to. to be called as an expert witness. So they don't just call anybody as an expert witness, right?

So that in itself should speak to, you know, her character and her way of conducting science and her reputation as a scientist. And then to suddenly say, oh, one paper, you know, later, it's, you know, that's all on the trash heap. I mean, that just isn't, it doesn't, it doesn't smell right, you know. No, I couldn't agree more, man. I would be, you know, willing to bet there are other people who have samples and are doing work, and they probably replicated what she's done. You know, she lays it out pretty, pretty well. And I, you know, maybe you'll get to talk to them at some point. But I just wouldn't be surprised if some, you know, curious, curious academics out there, if they make the right connections, can get some interesting samples. And, you know, it, it, it. It's, you know, it. It's, you know, it. It. you're right. Over time, it might just become, you know, a different assessment looking back on her work.

Yeah, it's kind of cool that you're in that type of line of work, you know, as far as being scientific and having a scientific mind. And then on top of that, seeing something that shouldn't exist, you know what I mean? And you saw it when you're young. Well, it definitely, it influences, I think I'm just much more open-minded, you know, because I know, I know, I get, ribbing or, I want to call it ridicule because it's not, you know, this is the first time I've actually ever, you know, talked about it, maybe outside of a, you know, dinner table or with friends, but, you know, it does, it makes you wonder about, you know, what else is out there that we think we know about that we don't know about. So I think from a scientific perspective to have

that experience, whether it's with this topic or another one is an invaluable experience that really informs how you how you look at the world and you know what what what what what the limits to of your your abilities are right because you know we and this comes up a lot i know on your on your show about the you know everybody wants a body um if you if you knew like if if the whole world knew how you know DNA worked and how the evidence worked and you could confirm the chain of custody, so to speak, from the collection of the, you know, whether it's hair or blood or skin or scatter, whatever, you know, and you came to this conclusion, people would not question it at all, right? But, you know, I hate to say it, it comes down to the, if the gloves don't

quit or don't fit, you must have quit kind of deal where the DNA doesn't work, right? And so, you know, it's too sophisticated. And so, you know, like, you've, you've, you've, you've, you've, said many times there's there's demand for from science and from other people for a specimen for you know a body and i know that elicits all kinds of um emotions and and rightfully so i mean we don't know if we're dealing with you know an animal or a creature that's as sophisticated as we are and so then that brings in all kinds of ethical and moral questions but i mean i also think west that were kind of, I'm sure we're way past that. I mean, there's so many accounts when you look through the literature about, you know,

these things being killed either accidentally or on purpose and then, you know, the eventual disappearance or someone abscunz with the actual body that, you know, I honestly wouldn't be surprised if there are bones and, you know, evidence either within, you know, governmental vaults or state vaults or wherever these types of materials are kept, that it's almost like we don't need to go out and shoot one. We just need to open the vault, right? I mean, the evidence has probably already been collected and confirmed. It's just that, like we said, for whatever reason, we don't know why that's not something that's

made public. So, I mean, it's just such an interesting topic. and, you know, to just say you saw one, and I was lucky to have that experience, I believe, and, you know, it's really the tip of the iceberg. And it's, you know, whether you're talking about the DNA science or you're talking about the need for a specimen, it's something that it belongs in the wheelhouse of science,

but unfortunately, you know, it hasn't been, I think, with the exception of a few folks, been taken super seriously. And so, you know, science is behind the times on this one because the people that are experiencing it are, you know, they're out in rural areas or sometimes they're very close to urban areas, but they've, you know, they've had some type of experience and they've observed it and they bring that back. And unfortunately, it can't be corroborated at this time with evidence because the real, you know, the real deal seems to be extremely difficult to obtain. no doubt wouldn't shock me if they had them in vault somewhere you're right about that yeah i mean i just i can't help to think in the smithsonian in the in the in the bowels and off the mall in Washington that there are these gigantic femur bones and cranial uh bones and teeth and you know because um you know clearly we find you know everything from dinosaurs to you know giant

sloths that lived prior to the last ice age that I mean, if these creatures are, you know, flesh and blood, as so many of yours say and most likely are, then they will leave eventually, you know, a fossil or biological material behind that can be categorized and studied. And the difference is it's just not available to the general public or the general scientific community. Yeah, I wouldn't shock me one bit, Jack, if they had bodies, you know, body parts in a vault somewhere. And I think that these things have been killed many times over. It's just frustrating when it's hard to look for answers. When you know there's a weird cover-up going on, you're not really sure why. But as far as your account goes, Jack, I really appreciate you coming on.

Thank you so much for taking the time to share your encounter and your thoughts on the matter. I really do appreciate you being here, ma'am. Very happy to help, Wes. Well, I want to welcome to the show. William, thanks for coming on, ma'am. How are you? I'm doing well. I'm doing well. I know you're calling from Nova Scotia and your encounter happened back in 2016. Kind of tell us about it. What were you doing and what happened?

Yeah, so the encounter was May 3rd, 2016, and it wasn't in Nova Scotia. It was in Alberta. I worked in oil and gas during the time and it was during breakup. my in-laws had come from out there from Nova Scotia and you know they just wanted to go travel so we decided okay we're going to take a day trip to Jasper so we went up there and you know we had a beautiful warm spring it was just very very warm you know we went fishing the night before and you know just walking around town there was elk and mule deer like life was just exploding and to kind of kind of set up the tone for it. My father-in-law doesn't really like to stop and smell the roses. So like 7 a.m. He was like, oh, we have to get up and we have to go.

We have to head back to Calgary. And so we kind of packed up. And, you know, we were heading out of Jasper. And he's speeding a long way ahead of us. And we're like, well, we kind of need to take some photos

and just kind of relax for a second here. So we pull over and there's a, there was like a lookoff. It's called the Athabasca look-off. So we, pull over and the funny thing is, is when we pulled over, I noticed all the trash was kind of thrown out all over the place

and being Alberta, they have like the bareproof trash containers, so I thought people were just kind of being lazy and whatnot, so I just kind of pass that without really thinking too, too much about it. So I parked my minivan and my oldest boy, Mani, and I get out and we start walking

because I wanted to get a nice photograph and just kind of stretch my legs. So it's about nine in the morning, and it's beautiful. It's already like 22, 23 degrees Celsius, the sun's rising, you know, clear day, and we're looking over the mountain ranges towards British Columbia. And I decide, okay, well, I want to get a better shot. So I'm going to kind of go to, like, the edge where they've kind of clear-cutted. And the way, it's kind of like steps. So you have the look off, and there's the railing, but you can go down and there's, there's like one ledge, and then another ledge. And at the ledge where it leads down to the

forest floor, I'm standing there, and I'm kind of looking. And I'm like, all right, I have my phone in my hand. And I'm like, if I just kind of move like this or I kind of move like this, I can get the, I can get that beautiful mountain in the background without the trees in the way. And as I'm kind of trying to like maneuver my way to do this, I notice like I hear this loud pop and a snap, like a large tree being, being like broken. And I look at down my 10 o'clock and I'm just like, What the hell is a big man doing down there?

And I'm looking, and it's just like, you don't really comprehend. You're just seeing, like, I didn't know really what I was looking at because just see this black figure, right? And you just think, okay, there's like a big man. And what's kind of running through my head instantly is like, oh my God, like someone from like the Calgary Stampeders or an NBA player zipped up one of those skullhoods. like over their head, right? Because you kind of had the pointed conical head and the broadness of the shoulders and everything like that.

So that's what's kind of going on in my head just through like milliseconds because you're just trying to like assess it. I didn't know what I was looking at. And then just as it kind of like, my eyes kind of like focus a little better and, you know, I'm staring at it. Like it's just like, you realize

I saw it's deltoid kind of flex. And like I looked in like the sunkeness of the eyes and everything, and I was like, oh, my God. I knew what I was looking at. And so, anyways, at that point, I, like, literally just kind of lose it. And I turn around and I start whispering my wife's name. I'm like, oh, like, you know, look, go, go, go, go, go, kind of type thing going on. And, like, really excitedly because I'm half terrified at the same time.

And I was just, I didn't, I was just like, everybody, you know, my mind's running a mile a minute. and I remember, oh my God, I got to go look back at this thing. And just as I look back, I guess it smelled me or heard me or something. I just saw the tail end of it. And it's kind of funny. It was just like how West Droud described when he heard one running to the woods. It was just that bang, crash, smash, boom. And it was just gone.

So I'm like standing there. I'm like, what the hell is going on here? And the people behind me with my wife are just kind of staring because they heard. what was going on, but they couldn't see it. And I'm like, oh my God, oh my God, oh, my God. So I grabbed this big rock, and I just whiff it, like as hard as I could. So hard, my, the interior of my deltoid tore a little bit. And I just tore this big rock, and I just was waiting.

Nothing happened. So anyways, my son was because he booked it and get in the car. And my wife's like, get in the car, get in the car, get in the car. And the kids can sense the tension. and they're crying and she's like, what did you see? I'm like, you're not going to believe this. Like, I saw Sasquatch. I saw a big foot.

She's like, don't say that. Don't say that. I was like, don't tell me what. And we're like snarling at each other because the tension's high, right? Like she's like, stop scaring the kids, blah, blah, blah, blah. And we're driving down the road. Like, eventually like we, like, I just went into like, it's like my focus and everything. I don't know.

Like I was going through shock or something. So we pull over and we eventually find, eventually find, Don's parents, and we pull over, and they're sitting on another look off where there's a hostel, you know, like a little wooden hostel. And I get out and I throw up and they, you know, I'm just like, you know, they didn't see me do that or anything, but, you know, we kind of go in and pretend to make nothing happened. And it was just really strange because we're only like three, four kilometers down, maybe

five kilometers down from where we saw it. And there was like, you know, this yuppie warrior couple with their mountain-equipping co-op gear, having their, like, nice little, like, alpine adventure there. and just like, oh, how are you guys today? Like, did you see any wildlife? I was just like, completely like, how are you? And I'm thinking, like, this animal's still creeping around.

Like, it could be, it could pop out at any second. So I was all stressed out and, oh, you know, eventually we, like, I calmed down and everything enough. And we're driving. My wife says to me, we're out going to Calgary by Canaanaskets. And she says, everybody heard whatever it was down there. And when they saw your face, you just terrified them.

And she's like, did you throw a rock? I was like, yep, I did, don't. She's like, okay. And she's just like, well, don't ever ask me to bring this up again. And don't ever, don't bring it up to anyone else because I don't want to talk about it. And we kind of just left it at that. And I kind of sat on it and didn't really tell anyone for, a little bit, but I ended up calling the

Hidden Wildlife Department, or Hinton Wildlife Department, and talked to a young fella and gave him my report, and he kind of just like, wow, like, you know, we get a couple of these, but, you know, I'll record it and whatnot, but he was like, I really don't know what's going on.

You know what I mean? type thing. And I kind of left at that, like, at that, and then I was getting ready to go up to Cinearral Horizon. We were doing a fly-in, fly-out. like just a shutdown at the big tar sands place up there and I remember right an hour before I left I got a phone call from I was a 613 so it was from Ottawa

and someone from their natural resources Canada called and just said hey Mr. Brown blah blah blah blah and I was like yes and basically it's just like you know like you know you're not really crazy but shut up and don't tell anyone and just kind of like we preferred it you know you didn't really speak of it too much and like you know there's more detail we talked

Will at length a little bit more, but that's basically how it was. And it was just, it was really kind of one of those shocking things because I really never, I mean, I like to entertain the fact of that, but I never I never in the, my wildest streams actually imagine they

really existed. Like, did they say did they say why? Why do you be quiet about it? No, they didn't. It was just kind of more like Canadian politeness. Don't rock the boat, I think. You know, like we've got this you know there's tourists and stuff like that and i suspect there's all like there's a lot of competing and trust of that but i mean i'm the last person that wants to get

to speculate on that kind of thing because you know i don't know like the government at the time i think they didn't want oil and gas exploration either out that way so if they wanted to use that an excuse believe me they would have jumped on it but for the most part i think it was primarily just, you know, like, but let's be polite about all this. Yeah, now I hear you. How far away from you was it, Will? And can you describe the face?

Did it kind of look your direction? Yeah, well, it was the distance. So I'm actually just at Grand Lake right now. So I'm looking, so I'm going to pinpoint. So I'm looking at a rock. And I'm going to say it's the same distance. So a little less than 100 feet at my 10 o'clock and then down maybe 30 feet.

So enough that I could, like, you know, There's no way I was mistaking it for a human or a bear or anything like that. Like the face, I sent you the like a picture, but it was more hominid. Like I guess the best word I could describe it is nylotic. And your listeners can kind of do their own research and kind of extrapolate what I'm mean by that. What was the word will? Nylotic. So just it was basically, you know, I've seen people.

Like, it's funny because I'll be out and about, and every once in a while I'll see people, and I'll see specific features like the sunkenness of the eyes and things like that, and I'll be like, it will remind me of it. But it looks like a primitive human, like, you know, broadered australes and sunken eyes, and a conical head, right? And that's kind of, like, that's what kind of stuck out to me, because if I close my eyes and like, like, just think of, like, the most basic shapes and everything of what I saw. It was like, you know, like, just kind of like triangle, like, long, skinny rectangle for, like, an abdomen, like shoulders, broad, broad shoulders, head sitting on shoulders, not much of a neck.

Kind of a weird smile on its face. Yeah. It's one of those things, you know, like, I want to call it. caution what I say just because, like, I'm, like, you know, I didn't see it for very long. I know it just looked like a primitive, a primitive man, if you can imagine, with broader features and a conical head. Yeah. Yeah. Basically what everyone's face talks about.

Yeah, no, it's fascinating. You got a chance to look at it. Well, no, I got it a good enough look at it, but you don't, I didn't, you don't, I didn't process it. I didn't see it long enough to be like, oh, look at the, look at the flared nostrils and the, and its teeth looks, you know, almost horselike, you know, like, it was, it was good. It was long enough to see, like, okay, this is what it is, but to analyze it and kind of start, like, really searing it into my memory really deep. Like, it's just the adrenaline and everything starts pumping. And at that point, you're just kind of like, whoa, you know. But, yeah, it's definitely, like, I think we discussed before. like it's definitely like a relic hominid, you know, it's, it, there's an ancientness about it. And it is funny, I do see occasionally, and people, I will see people that have its features. And it will just kind of, it will just call it, give me pause. And I'm like, wow, you know, like those things, those features have continued down the genetic lineage for, you know, like,

thousands of generations, like wherever we split off from them, those features still are present. So I find that quite fascinating, and it caused me to think about it an awful lot. What do you think the creature was doing? Do you think it was already there and you just kind of ran into each other? Or what do you think it was going on? I think it was there earlier in the morning.

And it was definitely into the garbage can. And because the guy who called me from Ottawa had said, like people had reported seeing it. in the garbage and it had run off. Like, that's the guy for model from the 613 had told me about that. But it was definitely there. And that's what's so crazy.

It's like, it was literally just sitting in the tree line, just listening to all these tourists come up and, you know, take their photos and everything like that and was just kind of hanging out. And that area was packed. I mean,

Alberta, like Calgary's a very young. Like, it's, like, it's like Alberta, Calgary, Calgary, Edmonton, and Red Deal, that whole urban area, like everyone has a big disposable income and is really active. So people go to the mountains, right? And, you know, Jasper is beautiful. And it's just like this park in that right now, just there's people everywhere. And there's, like, there's hiking trails, a couple kilometers in from where I saw it. You know, so that's kind of like what really kind of sticks out about it, the loosenness. is like, you know, it was just kind of, it was around, but it was able to kind of just not really,

like it was just, for some reason it decided it was there and it wanted to go to the garbage can. Oh, and I remember now, it did kind of look kind of like it was, it had a rough winter. Like, it didn't look as healthy as, you know, you think, like, we always think of like it's this big, burly animal that's like, you know, king of the mountains and everything like that. nothing, nothing can cause any harm to it. But this guy, this guy had a rough winter. His stomach was kind of distended, and you could just tell it wasn't going to be around too, too, too much longer.

It had a couple, it maybe had a couple years left or something like that. Or maybe it got the flu really bad or something, or cancer or something. It was hurting. That's one thing I did. I do remember that much about it. It had seen better days. Yeah, that's kind of a fascinating. detail, you know, and I've heard some witness to say that.

You know, when they see it, it looks like you hadn't eaten in a while, looked a little rough like it had been through, like you said, a couple rough winters. What made you throw the rock? Was it just more or less like, get out of here? I wanted to see if I could, I wanted to see if it would respond. Because like I only saw for like, you know, like three seconds, maybe four seconds. And I was like, I was like, oh my God, like, one. Like, I'm terrified, but I'm still like, well,

I'm not going to get this opportunity again, so maybe we'll throw the rock back, or maybe I'll hear it run again or something. I just wanted to engage with it again, which was probably a terrible idea. It was a terrible idea to do that. It didn't seem like a lot. No, I mean, I'm not breaking your balls. I was just kind of curious on why you throw the rock. You're like, get off my lawn.

Like, you're yelling at kids on your lawn. Get off my idea. Yeah, I think. Yeah, no. No, they're, uh, yeah, it was just, you know, you just, oh, Like, I had my thumb on the part of the camera, which was, like, click, you know, take photo now, take video now. And that was the last thing on my mind. I don't, like, I kind of understand why people who see them, like, why we don't have enormous amounts of video evidence.

Like, I do understand that now because it's just like, you're not, you don't expect to see this. It's not supposed to be there. I mean, that's, that's, you just don't think, like, all these people. all these armchair quarterbacks who are just like, you know, I would have done this.

It's like, no, you wouldn't have you would have. You would have cried like a little girl. Like, like, don't,

don't give me that. Like, yeah. This thing could have, even sick, this thing could have like pulled my arms out. So,

yeah. Would you want to see another one? Oh, hell yeah. Yeah, but I'd want, I'd want to have like an M-14 or something

or a shotgun with slugs. Yeah, that's a, other question I want to ask you, well, let me cut you off. That's the other question I want to ask you. How big was it compared to you?

I mean, I realize it wasn't, you know, Arnold Schwarzenegger on steroids, but I mean, as far as tall and compared to you, how big was it? It was over, it was definitely well over eight feet tall. I know that much. Like, I, and it was, it was broad in the shoulders, but its arms were very long and lanky. I don't want to, like, the guy, when I remember, I sent the email to the guy who sent the email back from the Grand Cache Wildlife Department,

he kind of bungled it all up. But it was over eight and a half feet tall, eight feet tall, I don't know. And, you know, it was, it was, it was muscular. Like, you could, like, probably, like, you know, it didn't have, like, even, if it had 10% body fat, you know, it had a mile. It was definitely, you know, they're big animals. It's powerful. Like, they've got very large muscles. Like, they're healthy. They're built environment, and their bodies definitely allow them to do that. Like, you can see,

I remember the thing that really kind of clued me in that this wasn't a guy in a hoodie was a deltoid muscle. And you saw all those, like, striations. Like, when it, because it had the tree in its hand and it just kind of put it down. But when it did that, you could see the, like, you know,

the deltoid was the size of a, like, a basketball. So it's like, okay, this is a big animal. It's big. It's big. And, yeah, like, I, like, I don't know. It's just, I'm just confused again, as we've talked about this before in our correspondence. Like, I, for these things to, it's just, there's a whole lot of unanswered questions. It's just like, you know, how do these things, like, have breeding populations and how, how does it survive in the mountains of Alberta or British Columbia?

and like survive just chewing on like burbows and you know like eating like a dead like mountain goat or something or you know what I mean it's just like how does there's just so many unanswered questions for me it's just kind of it's yeah I'm fascinated by it and I want to see another one but I'm terrified to see another one because it's it's like it's a monster you know what I mean it's like remember Beowulf? Remember Bayelwolf? Yeah, of course. That 3D and they had Grendel. It's like that, right? It's like you walked into the woods and you saw that. It's just like, what? The letting hell. It's just

it's crazy. It brings you back to being a kid, right? Like where you're like carefully, you're walking through the woods with your buddies and you're like, oh my God, a transosaur is going to pop out any minute now. Except it's real. Yeah. Yeah, they definitely shouldn't exist. I get where you're coming from. You know, how do

They survive. I'm like you. I have a million questions that doesn't seem to be any immediate answers to any of them. So it is fascinating that they're running around. You know, out there in Canada, too, there's a lot of people that seem in that area. There's a lot of famous cases from Jasper of encounters out there. Yeah, there's a lot of famous cases in Jasper of people running into these things. And you'd mention kind of a caveman or kind of a relic hominid.

Yeah. Is that kind of what you think? that they are? I mean, I don't, I think, like, you know, I come from a scientific family,

so I kind of want to, I want to give us an answer, but I think they're homogenous. It's just by the eyes, and the fact they're walking on two legs, right? But anything other than that, I mean,

not everything, we don't have, like, you know, like the fossil record next to, like, a stream bed and it's covered with silt, right?

So for us to kind of, you know, for us to kind of nail down, oh, this is where it belongs and everything like that. I don't know if we're ever going to have any answers. But, you know, I firmly believe that they are closer to humans based on what I've seen than, you know, maybe what's depicted. I'm listening to your show, a lot of guys down stealth talk about,

ones that look like chimpanzees and stuff like that. So I think the ones up here, maybe they're just close to that. Like, just from my experience, right? Yeah. Yeah. And they could be breeding with humans. I can't see why they couldn't have kidnapped

people in the past and stuff and all this stuff with missing 4-1-1 and everything like that I started going down that route and I just stopped

I was like I don't want to go here I'm like nope now that I know they're out there I'm like no no I'm going to remain ignorant on all of this I am just like I'm going to just continue to live out here

Nova Scotia and go to the beach and eat fish and chips. Yeah, I hear you. I mean, you know, you bring a good point. People can snicker at that, but you know, down here in the States and Native Americans talk about that, and even your First Nation people up there in Canada talk about that.

We had a guy named Sunny. We had a guy named Sunny who was a driver, and he used to drive us from the frack, because I was, we were fracking. There's a big area there in Alberta, and I think between Rocky Mountain House, and like, you know, like Dawson's Creek, British Columbia.

And one of the, he's a Cree boy there, and his name was Sunny. And I remember he kind of mentioned, he's like, oh, yeah, they're around, you know, type thing. I remember I brought it up with him after, like, I'd seen it just kind of being like, what do you kind of think about this? And he was just kind of matter of fact. He didn't really know too much, but he was just like, oh, yeah, they're around. Best to the Steve Malone.

Yeah, he could, they kind of have that attitude, right? Like, you know, like, they're here. We don't, like, we don't know. we don't have some sort of like magical clairvoyance where we can read their minds any better than you type thing right but they're definitely they're definitely in the like it's just I think there's I think because the one thing that kind of goes on set is how much like we've we fracked the living hell out of like what can only what can be described as their habitats so if you go by like fox creek white court grand like GP grand cash hinton you know it's just Massive, massive. I mean, you guys have big wilderness down where you are, Washington State, but northern Alberta and northern British Columbia, that's just a massive, massive, like, forested area. But if you look on Google Maps and you start looking at all the wells, all the frack paths and stuff like that, I'm quite sure that they're ticked off. And there's that video of one throwing a tree.

And I'm almost certain I was either by, I can tell by the kind of like the soil, because you recognize it, It was either near Rocky Mountain House or by up northwest of Grand Prairie there near an area called Raycroft between Dawson's Creek in that area. And so they're definitely, they're definitely, because the oil and gas exploration there is like, it was very intense. And they feel like, you know, like there's large trucks running around and they're logging that area and, you know, it's loud and everything like that. And so I suspect they're probably not too thrilled with it. I wouldn't be. Yeah. And that's kind of like, I mean, you could do, I mean, if you were a graduate student and

you kind of had a set on you, you might be able to get some money to kind of study the effects on the wildlife of fracking and stuff like that. But yeah, I don't know. It's just, it's a very interesting. And there's so many unknowns, right? And I don't want to say like, you know, like it kind of like the one thing that kind of keeps me from kind of getting more involved with this is like you kind of hear in that, in the like the Sasquatch Bigfoot community. There's so many people who were kind of like they argue over this and blah blah blah. It's just like, look, you know, we don't have a clue really what's going on here.

You know, it's I don't know. I'm not going to pretend to know. I saw it for a little bit. and like they're obviously living creatures who you know live and die and suffer and have pleasure and all these things and they're very they're very comfortable in their environment they're they must be yeah to avoid to avoid like you know to avoid man to this point not have a specimen dragged in like it it at least that we know of they must be pretty, they must be pretty, they must know what they're doing.

I mean, that much I know. Yeah, no doubt. I just don't know. Like, and I don't want to say I know. Because, like, again, it's a humbling experience. Yeah, it's very humbling, very humbling. I don't know.

Bigfoot community arguing, that must be a Canadian thing. Everyone seems to hear the long down here in America, so you guys need to work on that. Yeah, I guess so. I guess so. I guess so. it seems like to me it seems like you know it's one of those things where i can't quite figure

out like if if these if these things are pretty predictable and there's areas like and i i assume there are where they're fairly common and i you know i i can't see why if you just didn't put you couldn't just bait them like like it man seems to have uh a pretty, I don't want to say facts, but if you look at like crows, or you look at like raccoons, or you look at any of these animals that become adapted to, like, living next to people, like, I can't see

why Sasquatch, if you put out a can of Coke or, like, a sting of, like, malt liquor or something like that, where you couldn't get one or one individual to just be like, ah, eff it. I'm just going to get, like, I really like, I'm going to, like, develop the same habits. You know, like, I like sugar.

You know what I mean? Like, where's that sugar? You know what I mean? Or something like that, to kind of get flush one out. If you just like literally put a two-liter thing, a pop out in an area long enough, maybe one would be like, you know what, I don't care anymore.

Like, I'm just going to walk out in the middle of day and grab one. If you really want to pull one out, something like that, because I, I'm just confused how we, like,

with all this research and everything like that, how we haven't really just been able to kind of coax one out. Because, again, they're like, they're like high-calorie foods. Well, yeah, and there's a,

I mean, I can give you a long, answer to that, but there does seem to be some weird, uh, they're not quite as tricked as you might think. It's harder to trick them than you think. I guess not. Um, I mean, I was like, hell, put out some pot brownies and, and then I'll, you know, a bag of chips and I'll, I'll come back in about an hour and I'll track this thing down. But, you know, then, then you think, do it? I wouldn't be surprised. Well, then you think, do you really want, you know, a thousand pound animal stoned out of his mind, going toe to toe with you? Probably not.

Do you know what I mean? It wouldn't be, you know what? I was joking around with my buddy. And I was saying, you know what? It wouldn't surprise me if somewhere's on Vancouver Island, some hips, some like surfers or some hippies rolled some massive joint ones or something like that, just left it on like the park bench and went to go swimming or something. And the thing was watching them and took it off. And God only knows, you know.

Like the world's a crazy place. And I like to kind of look at it like, you know, through rose-colored glass. And I like to kind of imagine, like, you know what, if these things really are kind of watching us from a close distance and stuff like that, I'd like to, you know, I'd like to see what kind of interactions, like the funny, like interactions that have actually actually happened and stuff like that that that never get reported or no one really even knows about, you know. Like, I can only imagine if you wrote a book about, like, if you could actually really interview some people and stuff like that and really kind of, because I imagine there's so many people who, I was reluctant to come on and talk about. It took me a while to kind of want to do that. Yeah, and I'm so glad that he did. I'll tell you a funny story. One time I was talking to this guy from Kentucky, he's a moonshiner,

and he had come out to his still, and this thing had been drinking out of his still, and he said he thought it was pretty much hammered when he got there. And he didn't know what it was. He had no clue what the thing was. And I guess he had been drinking out of his drinking his moonshine. and that thing would have been Jim Leahy drunk that thing would have been black out drunk you would think you'd think so those Kentucky boys know how to cook up that

moonshine man they're like honestly those are entertaining things that you know that that happen and I look again I like to think I'd like if you could collect stories like that that would be hilarious but I don't think that's the kind of like you know habitual like behave like you know if they're around humans right and they're around humans in a fairly urban area. Like, you imagine, like, a Sasquatch, like, got too close to an I-hop dumpster. I mean, that thing would eventually just, you know, it's cholesterol to be through the roof. Type 3 diabetes.

It would just be like, remember that seed from the Simpsons where Homer had the helper monkey and was wearing a diaper? Yeah, I do. It would be like, pray for mojo. It'd be on the news, it's like this large Sasquatch was found. with a swollen liver and stage three diabetes. Oh, it's good. I'm watching the bass boats now. They're all kind of coming in here.

Yeah. We're going to get a good weight. What are the questions you have, but I'd love to answer them, but I don't know. No, no, no, that's it, man. You go enjoy the bass fishing. I wish I'd love to swap places with you, but...

Oh, I can't believe about the lockdown, but I'm sorry. Yeah, yeah. You better be wearing a mask, by the way. Oh, no, you're Canadian. You're probably... like here in Nova Scotia everyone's just like yeah what what what coronavirus you know what I mean yeah we're all at the beaches and you know just doing our thing but sounds nice yeah I hope everything's going well out where you are you know come on out and visit us sometimes it's beautiful

here oh I don't I don't think we have any Sasquatch New Brunswick guaranteed uh but here I don't know I don't know but keep in touch um I will there's anything any other questions or No other questions, Will. Enjoy your time out there in Nova Scotia. I hope you have a great time. And thank you again for coming on. Well, no, thank you very much for, you know, like talking to me. So it's time you kind of letting me go I'm not crazy.

That was awesome. You take care of. I like, cheer you bye. And that's it for tonight, everyone. Remember, if you've had an encounter, shoot me an email. My email address is Wes at saskwatcherronicles.com. Until next time, everyone. Love is still low and you want it bad.