Sasquatch Chronicles - SC EP:836 Sounds With Jim Sherman

Episode Date: March 12, 2022

Jim Sherman is a High School Teacher who searches for Sasquatch. Jim says "I had an experience when I was camping with my father. I was terrified of being out in the woods alone after dark. I started to really investigate the subject of Sasquatch. Jim has captured some of the best Sasquatch audio. I will be playing some of Jim's audio. We will discuss capturing the audio and Jim's insight on this subject. Subscribe to Jim's YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/LordCryptid  

Did the property owner or people who were there, did they ever see strange balls of light on the property? Oh, good Lord, yes. As a matter of fact, so did I. And mine was a little bit different. What I witnessed was, and they didn't tell me about it, they wanted me to experience everything. And I'm walking there, and it was February 13th, many years ago, 2012, 2012. And what I saw looked like someone had a flashlight or a spotlight that shot straight up. And they're like, you're seeing the lights?

I'm like, yes. And you're like, wait till you see the lights in the sky. They claim to have seen what they thought were maybe orbs. And even like a guy that I brought there said that he saw some what he thought were glowing orbs. All I saw were these flashes of light. It looked like somebody was bent over and had their head in the window of the deer blind. It either heard me or smelled me and he pulled his head out of the tent and stood straight up and that shocked me. They don't make people that big.

The way it moved, almost as if it was gliding across the beach, I've never seen anything move like that in my life. They were screaming at each other in gibberish. It sounded like a language and they were chumtering away back and forwards, back and forwards, back and forwards. I know what a bear looks like and there is no way on this planet, but what I saw were bears. What are you reporting? Jesus Christ, you better... Can get somebody out here.

What's going on now, sir? That son of a bitch is about six foot and nine. That's 60 foot nine, I don't know. You see a bouncer? Yes, I'm looking right here. Uh-uh. Hi, this is Carol King from Music City, and you're listening to Sasquatch Chronicles. Welcome to the show, everyone.

Thanks for being here tonight. Got a great show plan for you. Tonight we're going to be chatting with Jim Sherman. And Jim actually has collected most of his audio evidence from Michigan. And we'll be playing a lot of sounds tonight. He'll be talking about how he collected it. kind of the backstory behind some of the audio. I know you guys have heard me play some of his audio in the past.

It's really cool to have Jim on and talk about the backstory. If you've had an encounter and you'd like to be on the show, shoot me an email. My email address is Wes at Sasquatch Chronicles.com. And if you get a chance, check out Sasquatch Chronicles.com, you can become a member and get additional shows. Let's jump into it tonight. I want to welcome Jim Sherman to the show. Jim, thanks for coming on. Oh, I'm looking forward to it.

This should be a lot of fun. Yeah, I've been following you for a long time, Jim, and I think you've collected some of the best audio out there, and I'm really excited to have you on. I'm excited to play some sounds for the audience. If you want to check out Jim's work, go to Sasquatch Bioacoustic. com.

You can check out some of his work. If you go to YouTube, type in Lord Cripted, all one word. And Jim's got some amazing audio up there on YouTube. Lord Cripted, all one word. And also his book on Amazon, it's a Kindle version, Facing the Big Hairy Monkey Thing, searching for Sasquatch in the real world. Again, Jim, it's an honor to have you on.

I know from talking to you, you know, prior to us recording, you had talked about an encounter that happened to you when you were very young. If you would, would you start from the very beginning? Kind of tell us what you were doing and what happened. Oh, absolutely. I'd love to tell you because it's weird. It's crazy. First, a little bit of a clarification.

My work is put on to Sasquatch Bioacoustic by a friend of mine. A guy named Benongahela runs that site. He is unbelievable when it comes to audio. I am such a novice in comparison to his abilities. But let me tell you about why I got involved in this. I mean, this is silly. It's fun. It's been a crazy ride.

But it didn't start out that way. When I was, I believe I was 19 years old, I was traveling up north into the upper peninsula of Michigan with my dad. And basically, it was a really cool canoeing, camping type of an experience. and fishing, having a blast with my dad. There were loons everywhere. Pike were hitting everything we threw out at them. And the first night, we got a big roaring firehead food, stuff like that. You know, regular camping stuff.

Sit down in our tent. My dad falls asleep immediately. I never do. Like whenever I'm camping, I just kind of stay awake, at least for the first couple of nights. And I grew up camping. I grew up hunting, fishing, hiking. I was always in the woods. I was like a feral child.

You know, I just, that's just kind of what I did. My parents didn't worry about me and I always came back home, apparently. But this night, it was, I remember you could hear loons, you could hear the beavers smacking their tails on the water and crickets, all the outdoor sounds until right about 1130-ish. And that was right about exactly the same time as our fire outside had. completely dived down. And what happened then was from behind me, I heard something walking up to us. Now, initially, when you're in the woods, chipmunks sound like, you know, wild boars. You know, it's just kind of the way it is. But this thing behind me, it sounded bigger. And I'm listening to it. I'm like, okay, there's a raccoon coming. Okay. And then it started snapping

branches. And a raccoon's not going to snap a branch. So I immediately think, okay, it's got to be a deer. And to me, it sounded bipedal and deer can sound bipedal, particularly when they're startled and they'll walk stiff-legged and it sounds bipedal. So I'm like, maybe it's a deer behind us. But then I started to hear whatever it was behind us rustling against the trees. And I knew that the canopy of trees was about six foot high. And I'm like, wait a minute, because I knew I collected wood back there and I'm not six feet tall and I was nowhere near these. the tops of these trees, something was rubbing against them as it was walking toward me. And so immediately I'm thinking, okay, no big deal, antlers of a deer or something like that. Because I'm thinking, what could it possibly be? Don't be afraid. But I was starting to get a little bit nervous. And then I could hear it breathing.

And it was obviously something big walking up behind my tent. And that was when something really strange happened. I'm reasonably thinking, hmm, what is this thing behind me? And all of a sudden I had this unbelievable feeling of cold. Just, just weird. And it felt like you'd walked in front of a freezer and opened the door. That's the only real way I can explain it. But the problem was I was frozen.

Like, I couldn't move. I could feel this cold and I couldn't move. And I'm sitting there listening to this thing walking closer and closer by this. I can hear it breathing. And I couldn't do anything about it. I know that I tried to say something to my dad. And I couldn't say anything. Now, reasonably, fear can do this.

Fear can paralyze a person. But I was thinking rationally and I just couldn't get myself to move. then whatever it was behind me, I looked back because I was laying on my back. I leaned back and I could see something large like the size of a dinner plate maybe pushing up against the back of the tent. And I could hear this thing breathing. And I thought, oh, crap, it's a bear. And that's its head pressing up against the tent because that's the only thing that I could think of.

and I'm unbelievably scared, but I could hear everything. I knew what was going on. And so finally, what I did was I was able to kind of reach up, and I can't remember if it was my left or my right hand, but I reached up and tried to punch at this bulge thinking that maybe it's a deer, maybe it's a bear or something. I just don't know, but that's all that I could do to be able to move. and I struck an object that was not solid.

I mean, it was, it felt like a hand. It felt like a hand was pressed up against the back of the tent. It wasn't like a bear's skull that I thought I was hitting or a snout. It was something that gave. The moment that I struck it, not only was I no longer like frozen in place. I could feel everything because there was like a wave of heat. It was really weird because it was hot. But I hit back and whatever it was made a, like a breathing out of air and then stood up and hit the branches again.

I knew exactly how tall those branches were. It was about six feet. And then it slowly and bipedally walked away. Now, that was scary. The issue was that happened over the course of three. different nights. And we could, I was a, I told my dad about it and he's like, well, did you bring food into the tent?

He thought it was a bear. In the back, I like, I scraped away all the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, nothing could come behind the tent. I put, I put, I'm not, I put, I'm not even, I put pungy stakes back there, because I was so scared. That was on the second night. After the second night, I, I, I sharpened sticks and put them down there so that no, nothing could nothing could come behind the tent. I'm getting a little bit worked out right now. Something also, it was only one, through things.

And that was what convinced me that it was not a bear. Because bear just don't throw things. They really can't. And something was getting chucked because it was walking around. It was disconcerting. But it would walk away, throw something. I never saw what it threw. I have no clue.

It could have been a rock. It could have been a stick. I really don't know. But after the third night, rather, I told my dad, I said, can we go home? And we did. We were supposed to be there like five nights. But what that did for me is it created this unbelievable fear that really only manifested itself when it started to get dark.

Like driving at night, no worries. Hanging out, whatever, no issues. Walking on a, you know, a college campus, you know, because I was in college at the time. at night, no worries. When it really struck was any time I tried to go camping or any time that I went hunting, I'd go in a tree stand. It would get dark. I'd come down before it was dark. I just, I wasn't able to do the stuff that I enjoy doing. And so this went on for years and I just finally decided, you know what? Who cares? I don't need to hunt anymore. I don't need to camp anymore. And for more than 10 years, that's just the way it went until finally, and my wife encouraged me, which is crazy, I started doing research and found out that other people have had similar incidents.

And they thought it was not bear related, but possibly Bigfoot related. And I started doing that research. And I'm like, wait a minute, whatever this was, it was hanging behind me. was swishing branches back and forth and eventually broke them down. That's primate, aggressive, territorial dominance-like behavior. And I'm like, okay, that's creepy. And the more I researched it, the better I felt about it. And it almost felt like I was taking control of this fear.

And so finally, I came across this website. It was a BFRO. And I'm like, BFRO, what the heck is that? And I found out that they had, you could go on a, a Bigfoot expedition. I'm like, that's the stupidest thing I've ever heard of. I'm in. I'm going.

And I did. And I went on my first Bigfoot expedition, met some of the coolest, most open-minded people, had a creepy experience, got scared, got lost occasionally. But what it did is it completely changed my mindset. And I realized, I'm out looking for Bigfoot, and I'm sleeping like a baby at night in a tent, because I want to have an experience.

I'm no longer afraid of it. And oh my goodness, did that turn things around? And then I just started going crazy researching. And then I was asked to be a researcher for the Bigfoot Field Researcher's organization. Had a blast doing that. And so then I got involved in the audio collection and just it's just spiraled from there. But it all started because I was literally just scared. I really appreciate you sharing that, Jim.

That's a pretty cool encounter. I was always curious what got you into this, you know, and going from, you know, being terrified to collecting some of the coolest audio, in my opinion, that the Big Four World's ever seen. It's very cool. The whole story is fascinating. And, you know, a lot of people after they have an encounter, a lot of hunters, hikers, they never go out again because they're terrified.

and in your situation, you overcame it by kind of investigating it, wanting to learn more. And I respect that very much. You know, during your encounter you were just talking about, you mentioned it got cold, kind of an unnatural cold. What do you make of that? See, that's a weird one. And I can't really figure out what that was. The reasonable person in me thinks that, you know,

I was petrified. I was scared. And that was fear. Other people have, and I've done a lot, I've done research on this. It's interesting. A lot of people told me, they're like, no, dude, you got hit with improv sound, which is sound at very low frequencies, which can actually cause a paralytic effect in animals and people and things like that.

Do I know that that happened? No, I really don't. And was I hearing any noises apart from breathing? And the answer is no. But the issue is you can't hear infrasound. But usually it accompanies a sound that is audible. Like an alligator can produce infrasound as they growl. Elephants produce infrasound.

And they actually hear it through their feet, which is very odd. whales produce infrasound and it coincides with their regular calls. And so what we can hear is not everything that's out there. Just like it's kind of like a dog whistle, except that's a super high frequency. And so there are things that are going on that we just, we don't know. We do know that militaries have used infrasound to incapacitate people. and you can use it also as a form of crowd control. You can hit people with infrasound,

and depending on the frequency you use, you can give people a sense of unease, nausea, or all sorts of fun stuff that you can do. So it is, it's possible that that's what it was, but for someone like me, I was probably just unbelievably scared. Yeah, and who could blame you a gym? I mean, really, you know, a lot of eyewitnesses after they have an encounter, they don't want anything to do with the woods.

I've talked to many hunters who, they quit hunting. Hikers, they quit going out. People just, they're afraid of it. And what I respect so much about your situation is you really started looking into it. Do you think that, you know, kind of having the knowledge of looking into it is really what helped you overcome the fear of wanting to be back out? in the woods? I think it really came down to meeting a bunch of people who had had similar experiences. So I didn't feel like there was something wrong with me and I was being particularly cowardly

or something like that. Because I'm not going to lie, that really bothered me that I had this fear of the woods. I'm like, what is wrong with me? And so meeting these other people who are like, yeah, it scares the head. got to me to be in the woods, but it's invigorating. And I'm like, really? I'll try it. And actually going into the woods in my mindset saying, I want something crazy to happen to me. And no longer worried that it would happen. I think it really made a difference with me. And after like I said, after I had my first Bigfoot expedition and things like that,

once the crazy thing is I started hosting Bigfoot expeditions like in the upper peninsula of Michigan and things like that. And once I was, this is so crazy, but once I was in charge of a group of people that were behind me relying on my abilities and my map reading skills and my ability not to get killed in the woods or something like that, that changed things because it was almost like I became a teacher. I'm a teacher in real life. I teach high school history. And I just changed it to, I'm no longer the person that's afraid of the woods. Now I'm in the person who's collecting evidence in the woods so I can teach people. And hopefully they'll be able to go in the woods

and have at least an interesting experience and maybe even collect some data that's useful or some kind of evidence because that's just fun. If we can collect cool evidence, I mean, audio evidence is the stuff that I just like to do. But if I can help people collect evidence that that maybe might prove that we're not all like lunatics and weirdos and stuff like that, that maybe there is something to this, I mean, that's just that then we all win and have fun in the process. Yeah, we're going to play some of your audio tonight, Jim, and some of my favorite audio, actually, and I've played it over the years and I'm so excited to have you on, man.

I feel like I'm meeting a celebrity because I've admired your work from a distance for such a long time. I mean, you are able to get some of the coolest audio I've ever heard. Let me ask you, when you go out to these properties and you're investigating for the BFRO, is there a property? Is there a couple that kind of stand out to you that really this many years later you still think about? Yeah, as a matter of fact, there are some weird ones. For instance, the first investigation that I ever did on my own was in Hillsdale, Michigan, which is the southern part of the state of Michigan and in Irish Hills area.

It's just beautiful. But these individuals who were super cool guys and they were audio guys. That was their job. They worked with sound. And so they had all this cool gear that I'd never even seen before. You know, I show up with like a Sony ICM recorder and stuff like that, you know, which is kind of like my go-to. But I get there and they start to tell me these weird things that are happening. And they share audio.

And I'm like, okay, this sounds interesting. And what I would hear is howling. And I'm like, okay, well, that doesn't sound like a coyote, which is the normal. It doesn't sound like a dog. And then the next thing is a human. You know, somebody making the noise. And because of shows like finding Bigfoot and stuff like that, people are out playing and howling all the time.

And so you got to sift through that. But there was just some weird stuff going on. For instance, this is so cool. What we were able to do is I played bait one night. And I went out alone, completely blacked out, no, not even a red light or anything like that. And I walked around this huge property in, you know, past derelict houses, which is quite scary, by the way, and into fields. And what they did is from this command center, which was so cool, they would follow me with

these shotgun microphones and I was miced up. And they could hear everything. And they would, and I had an earbud in and they would just talk to me. And they're like, okay, are you at such and such a location? I'm like, yes. And they're like, okay, there's something to your right. And so I'm like using, you know, I'm trying to figure out what's going on because I knew I was just, I was a target. You know, anything out there was looking at me.

And, you know, I'd walk around and they would tell me, they're like, there is something following you on the road. We can, we've picked up footsteps. And it was just creepy. And so that, we used to do that kind of stuff. At the same location, we actually pumped out real live infrasound. And the way they produced it, I can't really effectively produce it. But the way that they did through their sound system is that we put up these really cool speakers and they played a vinyl record of humpback whale sounds that also had waves hitting the beach,

which causes infrasound also. And so we were pumping out infrasound. We could hear the whales, but we couldn't hear the infrasound. But the dogs would freak out. the coyotes would freak out. And then we recorded whale sounds coming back to us one night. I got a phone call and they're like, listen to what we recorded. And I heard humpback whale sounds.

It's like, woo, woo, stuff like that. And I'm like, okay, it's the whale sounds we've been playing. And they're like, we haven't played whale sounds in a week. And they're like, we recorded this last night. Like, what? Something, I don't know what it was, was mimicking. wail sounds back to us. It ended up getting a little bit too creepy there for one of the guy's wives and because something started slapping the garage, even during the daytime, really

freaking her out. So we put up a bunch of game cameras and motion detecting lights and it all stopped, which seems like a shame, but you listen to your wife because if you don't, you'll be in trouble. The other one is, I mean, there's plenty, but the other one that is just the craziest was in, also in Michigan, which about the central part of Michigan, I'm showing you on my hand, but there's no video here. But the central part of Michigan in Isabella County, I received some audio from them, which was just crazy, like to the point where I'm just like, okay, I think maybe these people are hoaxing me, but I'll show up because I talked to them and they seemed really legit. And so I showed up and I'm like, okay, well, I'm going to put a recorder out here. This is kind of what I do. I don't make a lot of noise when I'm in the woods ever. I just don't unless like I'm bringing a ton of people out and I'm trying to make it fun.

And then you call blast something like the Sierra sounds or something like that and see if something cool happens. Maybe hit trees because otherwise being in the woods listening for Bigfoot is being in the woods sitting there really, really quietly. and it's not that exciting at, you know, sometimes. So you've got to spice it up a bit. But so I'm out there and it gets to be like 12, 15 a.m. And I'm like, okay, I got to go. And then I turned off my recorder. And I'm like, okay, thanks guys.

You know, I'll see you later. Nothing really big happened. You know, I went out in the woods, picked up my other recorders. And that was when I was hit with a growl. And I say hit because it felt as if like I'd taken this. like a speaker, put it up against my chest and like fired up some Pantera or something like that. I'm just like, you've got to be kidding me because I could feel it reverberating in my chest from, it had to have been at least, oh my goodness, 75 yards away, considering where I was standing.

So something was able to throw a vocal at me that I could feel, which was weird. And I didn't have my recorder on. because I just turned it off and I was a novice. What we then heard was two vocalizers that were almost echo locating each other. One growled really loud. And then as it, you could hear them walking, not walking away, but they were getting, the sounds were different. You could tell they were moving away because the sounds were quieter.

And then you would hear this, woo, and then, further away, they were talking to each other, almost like they were leapfrogging one another to get away from our location. And I actually gave you a copy of that. Those are the singing howls because they were just so weird to record, like in person. I'm standing there with my recorder and I just got hit with this growl and it was just unbelievably freaky and scary. And then I had to drive home for like two and a half hours. And so of course, I turned on my recorder, which had been sitting in the field, and I start to catch these other just weird howls and growls and stuff like that. No one knew I was going to this location. You know, it wasn't like,

it just wasn't public knowledge. And I wouldn't, I wouldn't understand why someone would be out there 75 yards away from me hitting me with this incredible sound. And I don't know how someone would do that. So that was just odd. And so that's why I kept going back to that location. And then my friends who lived there, who used to live there, they've subsequently moved, used to record every night. And so for years, we have just so much data. And it's so fascinating. I learned a lot. And I learned also that I don't know a thing because there's just so many more questions than I had answers. From wood knocking to banging to rock clacking to weird things that sound almost like voices, just got some weird stuff. So those are the big ones. Those two are really, really important

in keeping me interested and excited about the audio aspects of Bigfoot research. Yeah, and I'll be playing some sounds throughout the show. I know you talked about the Isabella County, kind of that singing vocal that you heard. And I've talked to eyewitnesses before and I've played your audio. I was like, is this what you heard? And nine times out of 10, they'll say yes. Let's take a listen. Again, I've played that for people. I was like, hey, is this what you heard? And nine times out of 10, they'll go, that's exactly what I heard. And it reminds me of like when a singer is warming up. I've seen Freddie Mercury do it. But that's that that's kind of what I envision.

And I really appreciate sharing all this. So you're out of this property. You're collecting this audio. It's fascinating to me. You know, even you were playing, what did you say, whale sounds?

And they were mimicking whale sounds back. I mean, that's a very difficult sound to mimic. Yeah. And to do it loud enough to hear it for a long distance. And I kept, I just racked through my brain. I'm like,

okay, somebody's got to be, you know, messing with us. You know, because Occam's Razor, the simplest, it's the simplest answer. But it's like, well, there shouldn't be any people at that location because it's just woods. And why would someone take a, you know, a stereo system out there just to mess with us? It just seemed weird.

And then you look at it on an audio spectrogram and you're like, that's, that's just in a weird location. It just doesn't, it's not in a normal range for a person. It's not in a normal range for like a coyote. And that's the type of stuff I look for. I'm like, is this a coyote? Is it a wolf? Is it a person?

Is it a coy dog? Is it a hybrid wolf? Any number of critters. And even when it comes to simple things like porcupines make the weirdest noises that you've ever heard. If you've ever been alone and heard something, it sounds kind of like a mumbling whisper, it's probably a porcupine because they make these creepy noises. and bear make noises and big cats make creepy, creepy noises.

But here's the deal with a cat. If you hear it, you're fine. It's the ones that you don't hear. Yeah, I guess if you hear a cougar, you're probably okay based on the way they attack and stock use. So if you don't hear it, you're in big trouble. I want to play this next piece of audio. I believe you got it from the same property as the singing type vocal.

Let's take a listen. And Jim, tell me about this piece of audio. You know, that one was a weird one because it was the same location. And what was crazy about it is that's the one that we call the goat man, just because I come up with names for things so that we remember them. And what was happening was they had goats that were in heat. And goats that are in heat, I'd never realize this, sound like the spawn of Satan.

And they make these crazy noises. But what was happening was the goats would make these noises. And then from in the woods, there would be similar-ish sounds. And they're not the sounds of a deer or an elk or something else. This is something different. It almost sounds almost like something's trying to talk. And it's so weird to hear it. And it's very creepy because if you're in the woods.

now that one I was not present. That was captured on a long duration recorder. But I have heard that in the woods. And it's just weird because it sounds almost like someone's trying to communicate. And you just can't quite get what they're saying. And that's creepy because it doesn't sound like an animal that you're used to. You're just like, okay, you run through the normal critters and it's not one of them. And then you're like, okay, well, it has to be a person or something like that.

And even that's creepy. Because if there's a person out in the woods in the middle of the night, what are they doing there? And what are their intentions? And how well armed are, you know, am I right now? You know, you start to get these weird thoughts because something out there knows that you're there and they're trying to communicate. And that's just weird and creepy and scary. In the same locations, I'm not even kidding. we had something that was trying to sound like a horse that was in the woods,

but it just wasn't quite right. It was so odd. I'm not even kidding. I went so far as to look at it. I did some research on the town and where people lived because I'm like, okay, I want to find out if maybe there is a person. I look to see if there were deaf people that lived around there because some of the sounds almost resembled a noise that a person who can't.

hear and has never heard might make if they were attempting to communicate. I looked to see if there were special needs people who lived in the area, who might be making noises that were just different and non-communicative. I tried everything to figure out what the heck was making these noises. And every time I would go into the woods, like, well, I'd hear these, these howls and I'd beeline through the woods, I couldn't, they would immediately stop. And so eventually it made no sense to go into the woods looking for them. So I just kind of, when I was there, I would just kind of sit around and they would happen around me. And so not only would I record them when I wasn't there, but things, weird things happened

while I was there. And so that's why I knew that the people that I was with were not hoaxing me. because you never know because they were sitting right next to me while weird things were happening. And sometimes it wouldn't happen at all. You know, you'd get nothing. And sometimes you would get something. And so what we found was that usually we would get some kind of audio about twice a week at night, which is pretty darn active, frankly. The most active time seemed to be April for whatever reason.

I still don't know what it was because I never saw. what was making the noises. But boy, over a number of years, we collected a substantial amount of audio and data and stuff like that. Stuff that I just haven't even made public just because, you know, it's like a howl. Oh, there's the howl again. You'd hear it so many times it wasn't a big deal. Whereas, like, if you're in the woods and you hear a howl, it is a big deal. But we were just getting it so frequently that it lost some of its coolness.

until it happened when it was live, then it never lost its coolness because that was just creepy. Yeah, I bet. I bet it's a whole different story when you hear it live. You mentioned weird things were happening on the property. What kind of weird things were you experiencing out there? One of the strangest things was that the property owners talked to me and they said, you know what, we've been putting food out for, they had a name for whatever was out there, and they called them squishes. Just happened to be what they called them instead of like Bigfoot, Sasquatch, ghosts, or whatever, they called them squishes just to make it more friendly so that it wasn't scary so that they could go about their regular jobs because they were farmers. And they said, hey, we've been putting food out for the squishes.

Is this a good idea? And I said to them, I'm like, hey, listen, if you're putting food out, eventually you're going to get something. that you don't want there. Bear will come by or something. And you just don't want to do that because you have a farm with animals. You don't want to possibly bring in a predator. And they're like, okay, so they didn't. But we had a recorder set up and they'd forgotten to turn it off.

And you can hear something that's bipedal. It actually sounds like, frankly, it sounds like a person walking up to this big blue rain barrel that they had used to set food on. and whatever it is walks up to the rain barrel, you can hear it breathing, and then it starts to physically bang on the barrel, and then it walks off. And that's odd. You know, number one, a neighbor, why would a neighbor walk up to a rain barrel, you know, on someone else's property and bang on it because they're mad that there are no more sugar

beats? I don't know. That's just, that's weird. Another thing that was weird just happens to be in the same location is that when one of the owners would leave, they had, there was a main house and then like a working house and then the barn. When one of them would leave the working house to go to the barn, you could hear them because I had recorders all over the place. You could hear them walking, open up the barn and shut the barn door. And then in the distance, you'd hear like a just a light knock. then when they left the barn and went into the house or the working house thing,

you'd get a like a home run knock from the woods as if something was eyeballing them and going, oh, okay, we're in the clear or, oh, look, you know, they just went into the house. Granted, of course, that could be really creepy neighbors, but there weren't any neighbors that had a permanent residence within a mile. And so that's just because I looked, I checked. And noises were coming from weird areas. I will tell you that with due diligence, I did find one area of the property a mile away where there was a guy who was really interested in Bigfoot and he would make calls into the woods. And so I got a hold of him, contacted him so that I could coordinate when he was doing things so that I would know

to discount anything coming from that area, which is just odd. But the last thing I wanted was two weird researchers knocking and yelling back and forth to each other because that's just silly. And so I was able to basically discount anything that came from the northwest corner of the area. Yeah, that is interesting, especially your due diligence to find out, you know, what else is going on around the property. I don't know that too many people do that. Did the homeowner or anyone who was on the property, did they ever talk about seeing strange balls of light?

Oh, good Lord, yes. As a matter of fact, so did I. And mine was a little bit different. What I witnessed was, frankly, and they didn't tell me about it. They wanted me to experience everything. And I'm walking there, and it was February 13th, many years ago, 2012, 2012. And what I saw looked like someone had a flashlight or a spotlight that shot straight up.

And I saw it. And this was in the woods because we were in a field. And I'm like, that's odd. And then I saw it from a different location. And I said to them, I said, are there game cameras out there? And they're like, no, that's our property. Because what I was thinking was maybe it was an old fashioned game camera that had a flash that had somehow gotten pointed upwards.

because it was definitely shooting upwards. And they're like, you're seeing the lights? I'm like, yes. And you're like, wait till you see the lights in the sky. And I'm like, oh, and I never saw that. But they claim to have seen what they thought were maybe orbs. And even like a guy that I brought there said that he saw some what he thought were glowing orbs. All I saw were these flashes of light.

In fact, I have a video on my YouTube channel of, of a star scintillating, flashing in multiple colors. But just before we saw that, we were seeing the lights. I just didn't get the lights on camera. And then I started focusing on the really weird star. But yeah, they saw lights. I myself have seen in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan, I've seen particularly a single red light that was responding to me

in an intelligent manner, meaning it was like I would move, it would move type of a thing, which is just odd. And I wasn't the only person that saw it, luckily. But yeah, they saw, they claim to see lights all the time. Can I ask you, Jim, you know, probably five years ago, maybe six years ago, I would get people who would contact me who have these creatures on their property. And at the very end of the conversation, they would go, oh, and by the way, I'm also seeing these weird lights flying around.

around and I'd be like, what do you mean weird lights flying around? And they would describe, you know, anywhere from a softball to a beach ball, sometimes bigger, these weird lights flying around. And I call them balls of light. I think a ghost orb is something very different. But what I started finding, it was very common when people had these things on their property. They would also talk about these weird lights they started seeing. What's your take on the lights? No, that's weird because normally what I would say is, I would say, oh, you're talking about like a St. Elmo's fire or a ball lightning or something that is that that's known and understood or maybe it's a phosphorescent fungus or maybe you've been ingesting certain fungi or something like that, you know. But the more that I've seen, my goodness, the more I'm open to all the weirdness. Now, not all the weirdness. I take some of that back, but I like to add, it's all data to me.

And so if someone says, I saw a flash of light, that's part of the story. And so I take that into consideration. And if I were to discount that immediately, then I'm doing a disservice to the research. And so the more that I see and the more I see it that I don't understand, the more I'm like, okay, there's more to this than I get. And so could it be a coincidence that this stuff is happening, possibly, or is it people that are in tuned to what's going on outside because they're looking for something or because they've had an experience have their eyes open at different times when the rest of us are watching TV or something like that. might it be people that are just that that are more in tune with nature because they're out there more frequently or like my friends they're farmers so they're out late at night and stuff like that and maybe what's going on in my backyard right now i'm missing because i'm in my basement bunker or something like that and so um i'm not sure what's causing it but i've received more and more reports of that type of thing even um like what looks at like, which this is silly, but like glowing eyes and things like that. Why would something have

glowing eyes? It would seem, you know, to really make it difficult to see at night, you know, and something that produces its own light. That seems really odd. But I will tell you that I have seen, you know, a red light that frankly looks like a, like if you puff on a cigar, it was that kind of a red at night. It wasn't producing like a like a like a, it wasn't a flashlight, but it was something that was definitely glowing. And it was ducking back and forth near a tree as I was walking up to it. And other people saw it and then something ran away. And after it ran, and you could hear it physically running through the woods and it wasn't trying to be quiet. And then something was angry enough at us that they throw up through a big rock into the river that

was right there. And so this is just. odd. A year later, I was in the same location with a bunch of friends on a Bigfoot expedition because we do weird things. And I saw that same red light. And I said, and this was in the middle of the night. And I said to my buddies, I'm like, do you see that light? They're like, yes. I got on the radio and I said, Bernie, who was a guy who was there, you're going the wrong direction. Because frankly, I thought it was someone with a red headlamp on. Whatever it was heard me and stopped. And then I get a call on my radio that Bernie was still at the campsite. So we were all present and accounted for, but there's a red light of some kind in the middle of the road. And it stopped

when I started talking about it. Now, I'm about 50 yards away. So what did I say to my group? I turned and said, cover me. I don't know what they would have covered me with, but that's what I said because that's what you say in situations like that. And I ran toward whatever this object was and it ran into the woods. I got myself to where it was and I said, is this about where it was? And I used my head lamp to try to like finding Bigfoot the size of it and stuff like that. And then it then it decided it was going to actually take off. Whatever this object was was only about 15 feet away from me in the woods. And then it took off. It hadn't gone far. That was. That was spooky. But the cool thing is other people saw it. And it wasn't one of us.

It was a weird red light, but it was attached to something big. I don't know. I really don't know. And because I don't know, I can't discount what other people are seeing because I've seen some pretty weird stuff too. Yeah, I admire you, Jim, for your attitude towards it. You know, it's something you don't, it's refreshing. You don't find it very awkward. with quote unquote bigfoot researchers but the fact you know it's all data and why not include

all the data maybe you can use it down the road the lights do get reported a lot and you were talking about the glowing eyes that gets reported a lot too i've had hunters who have seen that you know experienced hunters who were like this was an eye shine these eyes were glowing and it's like what do you do with that um i want to play this other piece of audio that you sent me i believe this is This is from the same property. Let's take a listen. The same, that was the night where we got hit with, where I got hit with the sound. And that was just a longer clip with the singing howls in it.

But you could hear the, you could hear it. The cool thing was when one of my friends goes, Jim, they did it again. Because I was getting into my car and I didn't hear it. and they had heard this vocal. And so then I walked up to them and that was when we got hit. And the crazy thing was you can also hear when she actually gets scared because you can hear her. She goes, like that. And then there's also an expletive in there that I think I cut out in that version.

I hope I did. And that was me because, and as a teacher, I try not to swear a lot. But this one was so freaky and scary. And it went on for a total of about 20 minutes. I condensed it into what you just heard. But it went on for a while. And it was freaky because something was screaming at us. And it's bad.

It's interesting when it happens to you and you're alone. It's scary. When it happens that there are other people, around, then you feel less crazy because other people are hearing it too. And I'm not going to lie, in the longer version, there's actually, you can hear a cat meow. And it was, I'm listening, freaking out hearing this. And this pesky cat like rubs up against me and meows. And I about came out of my skin because I didn't know the cat was there. Okay, and getting yelled at in the woods is a little bit spooky, so I got scared by a kitten. But hearing that kind of thing is just unbelievable and

for, I mean, it really is unbelievable. And so you have to think, okay, who's hoaxing me? Who's going through all of this trouble at least two times a week to make some really scary noises? And it's going to take a lot of technology to make that happen, because this isn't just someone putting their head in, you know, a big metal bucket and howling, there's some real stuff going on here. And even when you hear, uh, there's, there's double howls that I have recorded where you'll get a howl that starts and almost sounds like a second howler begins, but it's the same creature making two different sounds simultaneously, which for a human is possible if you're trained. You know, you can, you can do that. I can't.

But for something in the woods to be able to make multiple sounds at the same time is just odd. And so we just, this one location, I happen to capture some of the best stuff, in part because I had some of the best equipment out there and the best people helping me. And then I sent this information to really good people who helped me clean it up and stuff like that. But my goodness, those are nights that you just don't forget when, because there are so many, many nights that you go out and you hear a twig snap and you're like, oh, you know, and I'm not one who ever says, oh, I heard a twig snap. It's got to be a big foot. That's not me. You know, I, I hear a twig snap and I'm like, okay, that's probably a deer based on the size of the twig, blah, blah, blah, you know, but my goodness, every once in a while, you hear some things and you

just can't explain some of that away. And, and, and, and, and those are the nights that, that are worth going out and hiking, I'll tell you. Yeah, without a doubt. And when you hear it in person, when you're there on site, it's very different from hearing it from a recording. It'll wake you up real quick. Everyone knows the Ohio Howl that was recorded back in, I think it was 93 or 94.

Matt Moneymaker got it. And it's a fascinating audio piece that he got. But what strange is, you also got. got one in Michigan in 2012. Let's take a listen. And I think I said 2012. That was 2011 in Michigan. And Jim, I want to share this with you. This is from 2012 in Maine. This next one is from 2019 in Granite Falls, Washington. And Jim, I'm curious of your opinion. I know it's an opinion and that's what I really want is your opinion on this whole thing. You know, for such an elusive animal, it makes me wonder why in the world would they make this sort of vocal? Because you could

almost pinpoint exactly where they're at. What are your thoughts on that? You know, it's interesting because even like the one that I recorded, I'm just like, this has to be a person doing this, just because it kind of sounded like something you might here on like Bobo doing or something like that. But it was when it was recorded that was weird, it was recorded on a remote recorder that I just placed in a field and then left it. And I never heard the howl. Like physically, it might as well not have occurred because I didn't hear it,

except I recorded it. And so that makes me think it's a little less likely unless someone was out there just randomly at the same time that I, was out there. But because other people have recorded similar things that are just weird and loud and long, if you're a, if you want to be an elusive, like let's say an elusive primate and you don't want someone to know where you're at, making a loud and a long call like that is probably not the thing that you would do because someone can locate you because it's, because it lasts for a long time.

And so I've always tried to wrap my head around why any animal would do this. And I'm like, okay, wolves will howl, but they don't care if people know where they are. And coyotes will howl and talk to each other. They don't care if people know where they are. But the thing is, you can see a wolf and a coyote, and they're in zoos, and people shoot them. And you can get clear video and cameras, photographs. of those critters, but why would something like a Bigfoot do something like this? And that is something that I just can't figure out. And so initially, I'm like, maybe some of what people are recording

are bears. I know that sounds crazy, but bears will make long noises like that, but normally not that long. And so that's odd. There are those who believe also that that might be something like a different creature altogether. Dog man, when to go, who knows. But I've never been able to figure out why a creature that's trying to hide would make a noise like that unless it felt like making that noise was important at the time. I'm just trying to wrap my head around it. Like if you believe that there are bigfoot out there, you know, if you believe in Sasquatch and stuff like that, might a Sasquatch want to maintain territorial dominance? Just like a great ape would.

You know, and say, hey, this is my area. Stay out. Okay. Just like humans will put up big fences and we'll put up no trespassing signs and stuff like that. Maybe that might be an idea. Maybe it's a, I'm here, where. are you type of a thing. Who knows?

Because I've received Knox back and forth that are from different areas and different volumes and stuff like that. Maybe that's a kind of a location thing. But it just seems silly that something it's trying to

hide would make so much noise, but maybe whatever it is has gotten away with this for hundreds and hundreds of years and hasn't been captured effectively yet. Who knows?

But yeah, that's a, that's a head scratcher because I just don't get it unless it's like literally a dominance thing or a, hey, baby, I'm lonely type of a thing, which I really hope that's not what it is because if I'm out in the woods and I hear that, I'm just not interested. Yeah. You don't want to go running towards that, Jim. No. Yeah, it's trouble you don't need, brother. I want to play this one.

This one is the Romulus goat man. Let's take a listen. This was just outside of Detroit Metro Airport. There's a huge area of woods there. And the reason that there are woods there is because you don't want planes going over populated areas when they're taking off a landing. But also there are metro parks there. In Michigan, we have like the Erie Metro Park. we have the Kensington Metro Park.

They're big wooded areas where you can go out and ride your bike and cool stuff like that. Well, this lady was, this is really cool. This lady sent me this audio and said, hey, you know, I heard that you do audio analysis. Can you tell me what you think this is? And she sends me this stuff and I'm like, I have no clue what this is. This is some crazy yelling and screaming. And then she sends me more clips and she's like, well, here's the deal. I've been finding these weird footprints and I think it's homeless, deaf, Amish people.

And I'm like, there was a pause. And I'm like, okay, this woman is pulling my leg. Homeless, deaf Amish people. And I'm like, okay. And I played a lot. I'm like, what are you talking about? And it's because she was hearing this type of stuff that sounds. like the person might be deaf, but it seemed like they were speaking a foreign language,

which she just said was Amish. Okay. But also the fact that they would, whatever it was would hang out in her barn at certain times. And then she started getting like weird things placed on her porch. And she went out and they were big, she said there were big ex of exes. of trees placed on her trails in her back, and she'd move those. And when she would move those big exes made out of trees that were blocking the trail, whatever it was that was making this noise would pull up some of her smaller trees and flowers that she had planted and put them on her

porch, as if something was angry that she had dared to move their big X type structures. But that's just some odd audio. And we never figured out what it was and I lost contact with the lady. But yeah, that's some odd stuff. But that's a completely different part of the state, but making noises that are similar to ones that I'd heard in central Michigan. And that's what's fun when you can start to compare audio from people that couldn't possibly have had any communication with each other. like at all and who's going to hoax using the same type of audio it's it was just weird and so

that's the kind of detective work that makes it fun that is really cool you know i assumed it was from that same property and the fact that it's not makes it even cooler uh you know it's kind of like what i was talking about with the ohio how it's like you recorded that in michigan i have one from Maine. There's one from Washington. I've been sent one from California. So it's really cool to take that audio and kind of compare it. And I'm curious where this piece of audio, if it was from that same property or not, but this is my favorite piece of audio that you've ever recorded. Let's take a listen. In Isabella County. And what was so cool about it was these are my friends. And they recorded this just because they were hanging out with some friends near, and it was, it wasn't even night yet.

In fact, in my video on YouTube, you can actually see a, like a speeded up version of, because they just took a video camera and they set it down on a post and they just recorded it the whole time, because something was, was interacting with them and they were yelling back and forth to it. And it was fun. And, you know, you might sit back and go like, oh, that sounds, that sounds like a fox. Or, oh, that sounds like it could be a bobcat or something to that effect, or an owl. And all of those animals will make sounds that are similar. And owls will respond. Like if you call to a bard owl, they will respond. And certain birds will respond.

And so initially, when I'm listening to that, I'm like, okay, it's some kind of bird that they're talking to probably an owl or something to that. effect. And then like you mentioned, all of a sudden in the background, there's something that's very different. And it's like, whoa, what is this? And what are these other strange noises? And it's weird because they're in two completely different locations. And having then been to the property, I know exactly where these sounds were coming from. And, and they were too distinct differently. locations. And so it's just, it's just weird. And you know, it's just kind of, it's fun and crazy. And the only reason that this was sent to me was because I started doing research on the audio and I started to put it on, if your listeners have ever been to the BFRO's website,

I used to research and post my, my reports. And I started adding audio. to some of the reports because they they were it was fascinating to me and other people then would hear the audio and so then they would request me and so it kind of snowballed and so I started to get more audio sent to me just like it happens to you um you I mean have had so much more experience than than I ever have you know us interviewing people and speaking with people but um but that was how I got kind of hooked on the the audio and it just it just kind of went from there. And frankly, the bulk of the stuff that I'm sent is pretty easy to decipher. You know, you get something and I'm like, oh, that's a bardal, you know, just because you've heard it.

And I've been in the woods forever. And so you recognize noises. That's a, that is a, that's a house cat. Oh, that would be, you know, a bobcat or something like that. But my, I will tell you every once in a while, like these, you hear things, you're like, oh, or when you get a vocalization, that comes with something different like a wood knock or something that's just not normal, like lights. If someone says, hey, this happened to me and there were some lights, it just makes it more interesting. And those are the things that intrigue me the most, the weird stuff, the stuff that's

out of the ordinary, because then you have to, then it's harder to figure out what it is, and it's just much more fun. Yeah, I appreciate your insight on it, Jim. You know, it's one of those things. Audio is so cool to me, and I'm amateur when it comes to audio. First time I heard that, that last one I just played, I was like, wow, it sounds like the Ohio Hal there in the background. You've been out to these properties. You've talked to eyewitnesses. You've put up, you know, recorded sounds. You've done everything you can on these investigations. And one thing I find strange, the minute you put up a game cam, you can have. footprints, you can have the eyewitnesses right there, you can have all the audio in the world. You put up a game cam and it stops and I have not been able to figure out why. What are your thoughts? You know, the easy answer is that they don't exist. I mean, that's the easy answer because you, then everything else must be a misidentification. All the other eyewitnesses have to be, oh, it was a bear or you're just seeing things or what you're hearing is a coyote or something to that

effect. And that is an easy answer because we should have really good game camera images of anything that's in the woods because I have game cameras out all the time because I have property in Michigan and I always have my game cameras out. And yeah, dear, dear, know that the game cameras are there. They can sense them. They'll walk up to them. They'll sniff them. They'll see them. and eventually they don't care. A bear will go up and they'll sniff them. I think it's more because it just smells different, but bear don't seem to care if there's a camera there.

A deer are more intrigued. But I can't answer that one because you should be able to get, you should be able to get a dumb Bigfoot at some point that's just not paying attention. Or maybe a juvenile bigfoot that's mad at mom and dad and rushes off in a huff and isn't paying attention to where it's walking or something. Because then you start to think, well, then they must have these extraordinary senses or powers or something like that. And I just, I can't fathom that either. Just like, why are we not?

I mean, you have your cell phone, which is extraordinarily good. I mean, they're really good cameras. And why can't we get a good picture? What we end up getting is blown up stump squatches. and stuff like that, which is frustrating. And I've attempted to try to take pictures of things that I've seen and what I used to do because I'm kind of weird. I'd always have a camera while I was driving.

And whenever I would see an animal on the side of the road, I would attempt to take an effective shot of it, a video or a picture, to prove that it was possible. Like you see a rabbit, take a picture. And I would get good pictures of a rabbit that jumped right out in front of me. and so I should be able to, if a big foot were to jump out in front of me, I should be able to get a relatively clear shot of it. And it's just not happening in part because people are scared. If something big that's not supposed to be out there jumps in front of you, that can be scary.

And taking a picture might not be the first thing that you're thinking of. That's in part why I like audio, because it's more idiot proof, which I need at times. I can just have the audio running all the time and I don't have to do anything. You know, I clean it up later and listen to it. I don't have to push a button or anything like that. You know what I mean? So I don't know why we can't get game camera of elusive creatures because we can get game camera footage of a moth flying by my camera.

Why can't I get something that's much bigger than that? I'm just not sure. And I've tried things. I've tried hiding my game cameras inside trees. I've done all sorts of weird stuff thinking that maybe they're seeing it. Maybe they're smelling it. Maybe they're hearing it. And hiding them inside coolers that were full of food just because I think that's damn funny.

Something might open up a cooler and look in. That wasn't successful. Raccoons. I'll get raccoons. But so I've given up hope for game cameras. They just don't seem to be working for me. but boy do I know the deer on my property. Yeah, that is the weird part that we can't really get them on game cams.

I mean, every once in a while, you'll see someone who has a game cam where it's been messed with. And you might see a shoulder, that sort of thing. But as far as getting a clear shot on a game cam, it's just bizarre to me. And you have more experience with this than I do. But I've gone out to people's property and you're like, okay, I got great footprints. I've made casts, got some great audio. There's, the eyewitnesses are right here. This thing seems to come up every freaking night.

But for some reason, it's like you can't get it on camera. It almost feels like you're chasing a ghost at times. And, you know, even being out at people's property, you're like, okay, this thing is 8 to 10 feet tall, 1,000 pounds, it's showing up every night. If a grizzly bear was doing the same thing, had the same behavior, you'd be able to find out where it was sleeping during the day. and that's the other weird part is no one seems to it seems like they show up do their thing and then they vanish it's bizarre you know i ask everyone on the show jim and i'm curious of your opinion

um and there's no wrong answer but what do you think that these creatures are you know when when i was a kid and i was like watching in search of and mysterious monsters with peter graves and reading books and things like that i figured it just had to be some kind of a i thought it was a relic hominid of sorts, like a Neanderthal throwback or something to that effect. And I'm like, it has to be that. And then it morphed into, well, maybe it's a, maybe there's a flesh and blood critter out there that we just haven't seen. But man, I'm telling you, where these things supposedly exist, like I've got a big foot

in my dumpster and he gives me gifts every morning. that that that that obviously some of that gets to be too much and and so right now frankly unless there are some special powers like like bigfoot is an alien or big foot is a is a ghost or something like that it's really hard for me to think that this is this is terrible and i have and my friends are going to hate me i'm just not 100% sure if they if if if they truly exist as people think they do. I know that sounds crazy, but even though I've had experiences, I've seen

some things, my mind has to see something more to be 100% convinced. Then people are going to say, well, have you seen the Patterson Gimlin film? And I've spoken with Bob Gimlin, and he's the most trustworthy person I think I've

ever talked to. I immediately believe the guy. But I'm just not 100% convinced because I can see things that really exist, like a great white shark. I've never seen a great white shark in reality. I know they exist because people have good evidence of it and things like that. But I want Bigfoot to exist.

I really do. But I just, I need more evidence. And that's what I'm out there doing to try to find more evidence so that in my mind, I know what's out there. And boy, are my friend's going to be upset? Because people that I have 100% trust have seen these things. And I believe them. I believe that they've seen these things.

I just haven't yet. And so I don't know. It would seem like it would have to be a flesh and blood type of a thing. But if it were, I should have them on my game camera. I don't know. Yeah, and I appreciate your answer, Jim. I mean, it's an honest answer. Dr. Benernogle used to always tell me, you know, we have great trace evidence of these things existing.

We don't have great evidence. We have great trace evidence. And I know at times it feels like you're chasing a ghost. And, you know, my opinion is I don't think we're chasing an animal and I don't think we're chasing an ancient man. Something isn't quite right here. And I haven't been able to put my finger on it, but something is very wrong here. You know what I mean? Oh, seriously.

And that's why we have to be open just to more things. It's here's the thing. I figure I'm crazy enough to think that there's a possibility that there might be a big foot. So why not think, you know, maybe maybe there's more to it than even, than even I would think. You know, maybe some of the stuff that years ago I would have scoffed at like the lights or glowing eyes or stuff like that. Who knows?

Because what I'm doing, I've got some evidence, but I don't have anything that's certainly perfect. And so, uh, so we just have to keep our eyes and ears open and try also to, and one of the things that's really difficult in, in, in what we do is like new people will come in, and they're terribly excited and old people like me will shoot them down immediately. And I try not to, but like it happens. And it's just someone who's interested and they're like, oh, I didn't know that people have already discussed this photo or something like that. And we should look at this more as we should educate people because then we'll all learn more about it. And it might be someone who just happened to be maybe listening to one of your shows and had never thought a Bigfoot before and then has an incredible experience.

But because they listen to your show, they can, they have a camera ready or something like that. And they're open to the idea. Who knows? but we have to be much more friendly in the Bigfoot community, but we don't need to attack one another. That's just, that's just silliness. And so, and that happens. It's obviously going to happen because there's,

there's, there's pride in the Bigfoot community, and there's people that get jealous, and then there's money that gets involved and stuff like that. So I say, if someone comes up to you and asks questions, answer them. you know if someone says that they've seen something and you think it's really weird just be just listen to them and then the other thing is we all need to be open if someone says to me hey what you what you're listening to there dude is a cat all right and i'll be like interesting i've already looked into that and i put it on a spectrogram and it's and it doesn't fit i have to be more open to someone saying what my

stuff is isn't what i think it might be and and and that's that's my responsibility is well. And so I think we can just all be a little bit nicer to one another. I sound like some kind of crazy hippie just then. No, I don't think you do at all. In fact, I've been saying that for years. You know, there's there's too many damaged people, too many, too many huge egos in the Bigfoot world. And there really is no justification for any of the egos, trust me. And he used to really frustrate me because, you know, most of these 90% of your Bigfoot researchers spend more time trashing another Bigfoot researcher instead of talking about Sasquatch. It's like, tell me something interesting about Sasquatch. I got my own problems. I could care less

what you think about this guy. And I really wish it would change more to what you're talking about. And I've been saying that for years. And I really enjoyed having you on the show, Jim. I mean, it's something to where I've always wanted to have you on and I've always admired your work. I think being an amateur audio guy, you know, with the podcast and hearing what you captured and now hearing the stories behind the audio. I can't thank you enough for coming on. I know for the audience out there, go to YouTube. Subscribe to Lord Cryptid, all one word and I'll include a link.

Jim, it's been an honor to have you on the show. I really enjoyed chatting with you. Thank you so much for coming on. Thank you. It was a lot of fun, seriously. And that's it for tonight, everyone. Remember, if you've had an encounter, shoot me an email. My email address is Wes at Sasquatch Chronicles.com. If you get a chance to check out Sasquatch Chronicles.com, you can become a member and get additional shows.

Until next time, everyone. A little infinite line, gerile, an epiphany bring the shore to life.