SmartLess - "3 Presidents"

Episode Date: April 29, 2024

On our first triple-guest podisode, we let our pal President Biden bring along two friends, Former Presidents Barack Obama and Bill Clinton. Let’s get a little less-SmartLess together… on an all new SmartLess.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

How are you? It's exciting. Was getting in okay? Or was there a cavity search? There was a cavity search and it was good. Wasn't long enough, actually. And Sean went back for seconds. And they said, we don't, we never had anybody come back for a second.

You're good. It's not Thanksgiving. You're clean. He said, can I come back tomorrow to get cold leftovers? Welcome to the show. giving. You're clean. Yeah. He said, could I come back tomorrow to get cold leftovers? Welcome to Smartless. Smart. Blast. Guys, take a breath and think about what this is about to be.

It's fucking insane, you guys. Yeah. Oh, we're rolling. It's insane. Do you guys have good questions? I have a couple. Sort of. I have areas. Wait, wait, and not prep. I did prep.

I did, I thought... I had a lot of conversations with people. I've got 18 questions. Oh good, I'll just follow you. I was not joking when I said, I think it's good that we have questions, but I also want to entertain conversation and listening. Let's just make it a conversation.

And through conversation, questions will come out. Is that right? I think so. Oh boy. So how are you guys feeling when you woke up today knowing that this is gonna happen? Are we recording right now? Yeah. Yeah. Are we really? Yeah. Oh. So this is a whole different... I gotta put on my radio voice. We can say where we are because it's... After the fact, yeah. So we're here... Don't say it! No, I'm kidding. Well we're here on Central Park South

with a beautiful second story view of the park. If second story is beautiful views. Little rainy. Tree tops is nice. Little rainy. And we very rarely have more than one guest. Sometimes we have two. When were the times we did it? We had...

When you have bands on, a lot of times we have two. Like Billie Eilish and Finn. Yeah. Radiohead. Radio Billie Eilish and Finn. Yeah, Radiohead. Radiohead. Yeah, we had. Duran Duran. Killers.

Oh no, that was just Simon. Duran, Duran. The Killers. The Killers, the Pesh Mode. Oh, the Killers, the Pesh Mode, right. That was great. And so today we're doing a first time, it's a little risky, there's three of them.

But it's kind of a band full of rock stars. Bear with us. Yeah, yeah, they're like the police. Yeah. So you'll be familiar with one of them. The other two he wanted to bring along, I guess his buddies. He gets a little nervous. We've had him on the show before.

He wanted to do it again. They're guys he worked with, I guess. Yeah, we don't really do repeat guests, but we made an exception here. And we certainly don't let people bring buddies, but he was insistent. Can I just say, I'm excited too, and can I just say, we're sitting here in this hotel room, as we've already said.

It's 2024, four years ago, less than four years ago, we started doing this podcast, it was a COVID baby, as we call it. It came out of the gate with Dax Shepard. It came out of the gate with Dax Shepard, which was great. But I set the bar high with Dax. And then now here we are in New York. Four years later, scraping the bottom of the barrel.

We're looking at it with a dude and his buddies. We got Rob Armjarve. And we got Bennett Barbecao. And we got MGT, Michael the G. Terry, and we're all here in New York and it's fucking wild, guys. And I want to say to you guys, this is cool, this is one of those life moments, right?

You got to stop and like recognize it. Michael, I just want to say, Michael, how's it for you? Delightful. Delightful. That's it. Delightful, and I'm proud of us, we haven't screwed it up yet. Bennett, what do you think?ightful. Delightful. That's it. Delightful. And I'm proud of us, we haven't screwed it up yet. Bennett, what do you think?

It feels... It's amazing. It's weird, right? Wow, these adjectives are incredible. We've been saying to take a breath. Rob, Rob, yell something from over there. How are you feeling? Fantastic!

Ah, that's Rob. Rob has got amazing... We did limit them each to one word. Yeah, and Rob doesn't even have a microphone. So thank you for your contributions. We have been reminding ourselves to be present though and take a breath and take a look at it. It's pretty cool.

Now, Will came up to get a ride with my guy that I sometimes hire for like when I do a Broadway show. Who drove it when he was doing, you know Sean did a play on Broadway last year? No. Yeah. And it was called, you know Sean did a play on Broadway last year? No. Yeah. And it was called Go Get Me Oscar, I think. Right.

Right, or. And it was, wasn't it at the, wasn't it with the Topo Chico. The Topo Chico Theater. Yeah. And. Yeah, and so he came, so Will, I said do you wanna ride, because I think Jason's close, really close to the hotel. So Will came straight so Will, I said, do you want to ride? Because I think Jason's really close to the hotel. So Will came straight up.

The first thing, I put my pants on and I walked out to the living room with my shirt and my pants on. I reached in my pocket and I found money. I found like 30 bucks. Great story. But here's the best part. Sean pulls out and he turns to Scotty and he goes, look at this.

And we go, what? He goes, he's got like $31. He goes, look at all this money. And we go, yeah. And he goes he's got like $31. He goes, look at all this money. And we go, yeah. And he go, so the pants are clean. Obviously today's a big event for you. Yeah, exactly. So the dry cleaner's just, dry cleaner's just.

I haven't been here for six months. I just put these pants on. And I was like, oh, I guess I wore them out. And there was just the one pair of socks that you stole from a youngster you were babysitting? I know, you don't know where the skin ends and the sock starts. You know, it's fairly high class guests today. You didn't think you'd go with a full length sock.

And Will doesn't have socks at all. I know, but that's the way to go. I know, I should have gone full length. Shani, what do you decide? How do you decide what clothes stay here in your apartment in New York? What's the math that you do on that? I don't, I just, you know, there's like a couple t-shirts and clearly a couple pants and I mean pants is a stretch They're jeans. No, they're not their pants. Sorry. They're a stretch

They look like they're dress pants. They're a brushed cotton jegging. Yes. Thank you But they're in a five-pin cut Jason's in corduroys and a and a yeah But Jason I mean Jason looks like he's doing a whole different... But I'm also living here and I don't have, you know, President of the United States clothes with me. Yeah, yeah. You know? You look good.

I said before, you look very rugged and sexy. Thank you very much. I'm playing a guy that's made a lot of bad decisions. You know what I like about your hair is long enough that when you're wearing the headphones right now, it's keeping the hair back and you've got kind of like a soccer, like a European soccer player vibe going on. He's slowly winking at you. And the slow winks we could do without.

And they're half winks too. They're more lid squeezes. That's so gross. So you guys have... Do you have important questions loaded? Do you have fun questions loaded? I have a little bit of both. A little bit of both. You've got some important questions loaded? Do you have fun questions loaded? I have a little bit of both.

A little bit of both. You've got some policy questions perhaps? Yeah, mine obviously have more to do with relations with Canada. Sure. Right? Sure. Is that one of the borders we're closing? I hope not.

You know, because how are we going to get all our stuff across, eh? I'm still moving cigarettes. Fuck, I don't care. I'm mulling some of that sticky BC bud through the interior. I'm coming down through Fernie, BC, eh? My brother found a good path last year. Let's see what they have to say about that. Sure, I want to hear what they have to say. Yeah, I wonder, I'm sure they don't want to get into the micro of policy and stuff like that.

They're not, they're, I'm sure they would, they'd like us to find a middle ground between drive time radio and some hard-hitting meet the press conversation. Yeah, but I mean, I can't, I don't know how to formulate those questions. Well, you know what's interesting is that the three of them obviously are very connected and they they're all sort of from the the same sort of class Of Democrats in that right that they they were around Obama was a rising star You know President Biden's been around since the 70s Senator, etc

Obama came up as this young star in the early 2000s Nobody will forget his fiery speech at the Democratic Convention in 2004. How amazing that was. So they're all part of the same. Clinton was a governor and, yeah. Clinton was a governor and then he was a superstar back to back. Arkansas, right?

Yes, Arkansas, good, Sean. Thank you. But back to back of President of the United States. So they all, I think, have very, they're similar, my point is they're similarly minded when it comes to sort of policy. Yeah, yeah, for sure. Et cetera. Well, it's cool that they all are together.

I don't know that I've ever seen that or witnessed that. Yeah, I mean, I don't even see George W. and his dad together. Didn't they? But didn't the three of them get together for the last election a bit? Didn't they sort of?

You're thinking of the three tenors, I think. These are not... By the way, we have to do them. We don't do the three tenors right after this. I quit. We should just start, let's start the interview mistaking them for the three tenors. So when do you guys, have you been in rehearsals long? Because the Radio City show tonight should be getting

the acoustics. We're so excited for the sound. What's your warm up like? Will there be solos or do you guys just sing all the songs together? You guys are slimmer than I remember opera singers. And your accents are fantastic. Really tremendous.

Yeah, exactly. Well guys, I'm honored to be here, not just with them, I'm honored to be here with you guys. Likewise. This is an eventous occasion, not just in the podcast, but in life. Yes. Tell me your name. And I'm sorry, be here with you guys. This is a tremendous occasion, not just in the podcast, but in life. Yes, tell me your name. And I'm sorry, it's Will, it's still Will.

And I'm really psyched that I get to be here with you guys during this. Likewise. It's not lost on me, not to pat ourselves on the back, but just to say briefly, very proud of us that we haven't screwed this up yet, and that Mr. Biden called us again Yeah, and wanted to do this again wanted to bring his friend like it was just so so flattered and humbled and yeah

Yeah, that's it's crazy. Did oh to all of it. Here we go. It's a it's an all-new super presidential Smartless Oh, smartless. All right, I'm over there, right? We're just gonna come in and adjust the microphones, too. You're welcome. Yeah, thank you. So headphones on, yeah? Yeah, headset's on. So, can you grab those headphones right there, please?

Okay. And I'm gonna swing this in a little bit. Ah. Thank you, sir. You're welcome. Mr. Clinton, have you done any time, Mr. Clinton, in Lake of the Ozarks? Oh, yeah. Right?

Because that was just, that's in your neck of the old woods there. Yeah. I spent a lot of time. I've been to every voting precincts in the Northern Arkansas Ozarks, and I have, I had one of the presidents of Walmart sure came from a little town In the Ozarks near the lake of the Ozarks and I went up they had a day for him I don't want up there once I can hear fine. Okay, so I've most around up there Oh good, but was that whatever a vacation spot for you?

No, I didn't take any vacations up there. I was working up there, but I was up there all the time. Here's your home with beach tiller. That's a big spot for folks in that part of the country. Oh yeah, it's breathtakingly beautiful. Yeah, yeah, that lake gets a lot of work. Judging by your show, Jason, seems like a pretty dangerous part of the world, too. Well, we didn't really spend a lot of time in there.

Yeah, we didn't spend a lot of time with the nice part. Not much of a show in that. My family vacationed there once when I was a kid, and everybody got drunk. What a surprise. I still remember when it was all illegal. We had a sheriff from up there that had a jail where the cells were all below level.

Below the water level? No, below ground level. So they were all pot forms. Uh-huh. When it was all still illegal. He made a hell of a lot of money doing it. That's crazy. Is it legal in Missouri and Arkansas yet?

Are you planning a trip? Sort of. But when it's all illegal. He did it. But I think... You basically scout out every state. It's like, can I go here, is this okay? Well it's a sequel, you know, we've done the old.

Funny, we're going to Missouri. It was more fun when it was illegal. Uh huh, yeah, exactly. Well, I love doing it. You should have had me writing some of your scripts for you. I was gonna help you. I wanna start by, you know, first of all, this is huge for us.

And what a massive honor it is to be sitting with the three of you looking at us. It's so bizarre. Crazy. We're wondering. We're all wondering how we ended up here. I'm sure. You've got questions for your staff. And your questions are only going to grow as to why you did it, as we get into it.

And we were saying earlier, four years ago, we started this podcast during COVID as a way to kind of connect with each other. And we ended up connecting with a lot of people out there. And for us, it's a real thrill to be here. Did you ever get Trump? Uh, we- Couldn't make his deal. No, we're letting other people get him.

Yeah. Well done, Will. Thank you. Very bravo, bravo. But it is, it is momentous for us, and especially during this time that we're in right now, to have your time, so we thank you for your time. Yeah, yeah, yeah, this is huge.

How do you all know each other? I'm kidding. That was my opening. But it is, I mean. I've worked for both of them a long time. Yeah, I know, I know. It's not the first time that you three have combined forces to really kind of

do what we all need you guys to do, which is keep you in office. But does it strike you as like, how is it even necessary to have half a president campaigning against the other guy? It is shocking to me that it takes the amount of effort to be competitive against someone who just, in my opinion, is just running for the wrong thing. Well, lots changed. Lots changed in how you communicate. Lots changed in information

and so much disinformation out there. And, you know And it's really, and it's hard to communicate even today when you do accomplish some improbable things. And but he... Well, and I'll say that Mr. President, not to cut you off, but you have accomplished a lot of incredible things. And all three of you did in your presidencies,

did amazing things. President Clinton, you did in your presidencies did amazing things president clinton you Left this country with a surplus which is the first time it had been done in a number of years President obama, you passed the affordable care act really started to tackle social issues President biden, you know, you look at the job your jobs numbers you look at The way you're battling inflation, which is not been easy. And you've done it with a lot of headwind and you've had a lot of people, a lot of voices and a lot. And we live in a time where there are a lot of voices.

And my question is, considering the amazing work that all three of you have done, and especially the way you're doing right now, President Biden, it's so difficult, the messaging is getting is so tough to get the message out there because there is so much noise. What can you do? Just keep talking about it. You just keep, you have to connect with people as to how they're being affected, why it's happening.

And you know, one of the things that really startles me is I'm optimistic. I'm genuinely optimistic. And starting to break through. There's so much we have an opportunity to get done in ways that these guys set up and we're now gonna be able to close down. But for example, when we got elected, we were told we couldn't get anything done.

We couldn't get anything passed. Well, we got a little thing called a billion, $300 million to rebuild our roads, highways, internet. We got the chips and I've traveled around the world and said, why don't you come and invest in the United States of America? We got $650 billion invested offline. And on the Chips Act, we got about $56, $70 billion. And they're employing people.

And it just start, it takes takes wealth to kick in though. But are they, it seems like they're only watching certain things, reading certain things. Everybody's so siloed in the way in which they receive information. Could it be as simple as you, and you've got very smart people to suggest what it is that you do, but could it be as simple as just granting an hour to Sean Hannity and sit down and go, you tell me why the people who follow you think I'm not a good president. And just answer his questions. Call his bluff.

I mean, because the information, the facts are all there. It's particularly for that group of people, what you do is so much better suited than what the other agenda is talking about. So is it just a matter of just getting on that network? I don't get it. First of all, you guys are exactly right. Joe's got an unbelievable record of accomplishments. If you had told me that the unemployment rate after COVID was gonna be back down to 4% or lower. Yeah, lowest in 50 years, isn't it?

Absolutely, and if you had told me that 15 million jobs would have been created, that wages are higher now than they were pre-pandemic. Yeah, and the most jobs created in history, correct? In this four year period, yes. have been created, that wages are higher now than they were pre-pandemic. And the most jobs created in history, correct? In this four-year period, yes. In this four-year period, you've got African-American unemployment, right, which is always higher than the general population, the lowest it's been since record-keeping on the issue was

taken. So Joe's got a strong message to tell. Jason, you're right. The media environment's changed. During Bill's presidency, during my presidency, you already had Fox and Rush Limbaugh and so forth, but it was still going through basic broadcast TV, and the average person was still kind of getting a mix. Some

dissenting views. Part of what happened is that whole ecosystem moved on to social media and once it's on social media and it's on an algorithm and everybody's just getting their news selected essentially to suit their biases, penetrating that is real tough. It is very hard. But what do you say to the people who say on the other side the same thing? Well, you know, I would argue that actually

they've got some legitimate points in the sense that, you know, there's a side that doesn't recognize conservative thought or isn't respectful to some traditional values that they care about and so forth. The difference though is, and Jason touched on it, there's a difference between facts and opinions. And the one thing that our side

still pretty much sticks to is the facts. You may not agree with whatever's in the New York Times or whatever's on MSNBC, but generally they're not going to just make stuff up. And look, I was in office in 2016, and I would have loved to pretend that the election outcome wasn't what it was. That was painful. But we said, well, here are the facts, and there's a system of government that transcends

that is more important than whoever wins this particular election. We're gonna abide by those facts and stick with democracy. And that is a shift that's taking place. Now, last point I'd make though, because Jason was asking, what do we do? I think Joe's point is right, and that is, you just keep on showing up and delivering the message

wherever you can, however you can, and if you talk to folks enough, all of us, Bill, Joe, myself, all have the experience of going to places where we may not be the most popular person. People may have some preconceived notions about Barack Hussein Obama. Mm-hmm.

Right? Jesus. Yeah. But if you show up and you make a human connection with people and you talk to them. Right. We'll be right back. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. So I just got back from the East Coast, where I'm fortunate

enough to have some very good friends that live there, but also good friends that live here on the West Coast as well. So, you know, talk about social battery, right? Your social battery can get drained so easily because you want to see all the people that you love and all the people that are important to you. But you do have to kind of schedule time for yourself.

So the balance of like the desire to see your friends and the guilt of not seeing them, but also needing your rest to reset yourself from the trip, right? It can be so easy to ignore our social battery and spread ourselves thin, especially with social gatherings picking up after the winter. What's the right amount of socializing for you

and how do you recharge? Maybe you thrive around people or maybe you need some more alone time. Therapy can give you the self-awareness to build a social life that doesn't drain your battery. If you're thinking of starting therapy, give BetterHelp a try. It's entirely online, designed to be convenient, flexible, and suited to your schedule. Just fill out a brief questionnaire to get matched with a licensed therapist and switch

therapists anytime for no additional charge. Find your social sweet spot with BetterHelp. Visit BetterHelp.com slash Smartless today to get 10% off your first month. That's BetterHelp, H-E-L-P dot com slash Smartless. Smartless is brought to you in part by Audible. Audible lets you enjoy all your audio entertainment in one app. You'll always find the best of what you love or something new to discover.

They offer an incredible selection of audiobooks across every genre, from bestsellers and new releases to celebrity memoirs, mysteries and thrillers, motivation, wellness, business, and tons more. Audible is your destination for thrilling audio entertainment with highly anticipated new releases and next-to-listen recommendations for every type of thriller listener. As an Audible member, you can choose one title a month to keep from the entire catalog, including the latest bestsellers and new releases. You know, I'm a huge Steve Martin fan, one of the reasons I got into the business. And I read his book years ago called Born Standing Up. And then when I saw it on Audible, I was like, oh my God, I have to hear Steve read it. And it's fantastic. And it's even

better than reading it. You get to listen to the guy, one of your idols actually read his book that you love. It's such a good book and such a fantastic, clever title. Born Standing Up, I love that. New members can try Audible free for 30 days. Visit audible.com slash smartless or text smartless to 500-500. That's audible.com slash smartless or text smartless to 500-500 to try Audible free

for 30 days, audible.com slash smartless. We're brought to you in part by ZipRecruiter. So summer's coming up, that means a bunch of outdoor concerts, I'm gonna go to the Hollywood Bowl, I always go there. I go there a lot to go see John Williams every year. And it's really, really hard to get tickets, so I always try to get ahead of the game

and order them really, really early so I can get good seats. Because I want the best, right? I want the best tickets possible. And when you want the best, you have to act quickly or someone else will get it instead. It's like if you're hiring for your business, you want to find the most talented people for your open rolls before the competition scoops them up. So what's the best way to do that? ZipRecruiter. ZipRecruiter finds qualified candidates fast. And right now you can try it for free at ziprecruiter.com slash smartless.

Got your eye on a rockstar candidate? ZipRecruiter's invite to apply feature lets you cut the line. Once you review ZipRecruiter's list of the most qualified candidates for your job, you can easily invite your top choices to apply to encourage them to apply sooner. Amp up your hiring performance with ZipRecruiter and find the best fast.

See why 4 out of 5 employers who post on ZipRecruiter get a quality candidate within the first day. Just go to this exclusive web address right now to try ZipRecruiter for free. ZipRecruiter.com slash smartless. Again, that's ZipRecruiter.com slash smartless. ZipRecruiter, the smartest way to hire. And back to the show. It makes your job harder, does it not? Or I'm asking you, when you wake up in the morning and you have people who say that they're opposed

to what you do or what you believe or whatever, and yet you still have to govern and serve them no matter what. And it seems, right? And the other guy, he has no problem throwing anybody who's not with him under the bus. Look, when I got elected, I said I'm gonna be president for everyone.

We have put more money into red states than blue states. Not a joke. Across the board, across the board, there's more money total invested in the red states and the blue states. Yes. Not a joke. Yeah, yeah. Across the board, across the board, there's more money total invested in the red states and the blue states, because then I'm gonna be president for everyone. Do they know that? Well, I think it's beginning, but whether it did or not,

I have an obligation, it seems to me, to take care of the country. That's the job. But it's beginning to sink in a little bit. And you know, you have, like for example, did you ever think you'd see, these guys are great speakers, they're great presidents. Did you ever think you'd see a state of the union like the two I've had?

No, no. Yeah. Frankly, a little shameful. As the newest American here. Yeah. Because I'm Canadian, Rich. Yeah, I remember that. Yeah.

You know, Canadian, well, as the newest American here, because I'm Canadian originally. Yeah, I remember that. Why are you so proud of me? Well, I got a Canadian brother-in-law. Canadians are interesting, because they sneak up on you. You remember that movie, Invasion of the Body Snatchers? Yeah. Like they look like us, but you don't really know. Wayne, I saw you at the Raptors game back in the day. Actually, I love me some Canadians.

I'm always looking behind me when Will and I are walking, just like the third and then the Canadian. Is there, there is, and I don't mean to sound cynical with this, but there is a bit of a show element that the other guy seems to really relish in. He loves being and saying things that really attract some views, some clicks, like, you know, he's a fun show to watch, I'm sure.

Like the nicknames. Now, I know you three are uniquely qualified in keeping things classy and elevated and keeping respect around the office and the job, et cetera, but is there ever a thought of how one might be able to tack slightly towards the show to sort of combat that a little bit? And you're starting to do it

just a little bit, President Biden, and I think it's really like people are loving it, you're sort of giving it to them a little bit. Now, I know that's not, you know, some sort of contrived calculation you're making, but is there... It's a response. Yeah, exactly.

But is there any thought to like... It's working though. It's time to kind of pull the gloves off a little bit and if they want a show, we'll give it to them. Well, I'm not so sure about the show, but I think if they want the truth, we'll give it to them. Yeah, amen. And just go straight at them.

Look, you know, like I said, at the gridiron dinner, you know, we'll give it to them. Yeah, amen. And just go straight at them. Look, you know, like I said at the gridiron dinner, you know, this guy came up to me, asked me if we could borrow some money. That's a great lie. And I told him, Donald, I can't help you. All kids decide we can make jokes about it. But the end result is, look, we all know every major world leader. And I think one of the reasons Barack asked me to be vice president, I had some foreign

policy experience. And I've known these folks for a long time. I go to all these conferences that we all know. And Bill just came back from one on his own. Great help to us in Caribbean. And you know, almost every single time, not a joke, guys, whether it's the G7, the G20, all these heads of state, they'll wait till they can get me alone and grab my arm and say, you've got to win. Because quote, my democracy is a state, their democracy.

Let me, since I'm not directly involved, I'll give you an example that I just had. Not very long ago, I went to Prague, Czechoslovakia, to celebrate the anniversary of the decision to expand NATO and include the Czech Republic and Hungary and Poland. And they know what it's like to live without democracy. They know what it's like not to be free. They know what it's like not to be free. They are adamantly in favor of President Biden's support for Ukraine. And they think we did the right thing to expand NATO.

And they know it's Russia's fault, not ours, what's happened in Ukraine. So it was amazing. All of them came to me and said, please tell me you're not gonna put us through all this again. what's happened in Ukraine. So it was amazing. All of them came to me and said, please tell me you're not going to put us through all this again. Yeah. Yeah.

Please tell me America's not going to run away from the world again. We need you. And in Poland, which is a very conservative country, culturally, religiously, they just voted overwhelmingly to throw out the old party because they thought they were too close to the Russians and put in the government that you dealt with when Hillary was Secretary of State because they support a free Ukraine. And I just showed up, man. I didn't go there to do a, they like me because I was with them in the beginning, but they

are worried about tomorrow. I think Bill's point and Joe's point's important. You know, look, we all know America's not always lived up to its ideals. We got our warts, we got issues. But we do set the tone around the world. And part of what happened before Joe got elected during that four year period,

folks around the world started feeling as if the ideals of human rights freedom democracy that nobody was looking after that nobody was promoting that nobody was minding it and People like Putin became emboldened and you saw the Chinese and and even countries that were democracy start backsliding because they do still look to America as an example of what they hope a multiracial, multiethnic, multireligious big country can look like,

that maybe people can still get along and act decently towards each other even if they don't all look the same and don't all talk the same and all come from the same place. That's what makes America exceptional. And if you start getting into a situation in which we don't believe our own declaration of independence, if we're not acting on behalf of the things that we say we stand for,

that has ripple effects all around the globe. And these guys are exactly right. I just came back from Europe, and every meeting I had, the only thing people were concerned about was what's gonna happen in this next election because they understand what the stakes are. I'm sorry, just on that point President Obama, were you were you surprised during those five years of the last administration how quickly that protection and passion for democracy was diluted? How prime

the country was to just sort of dissolve and and get lazy with it and let it go. You know, I will say, and Bill saw this begin to happen during his presidency, it then accelerated during my presidency, I have been surprised that there haven't been guardrails inside the Republican party. Trump didn't surprise me. No.

I mean, I like- He was the natural conclusion to me. Is that why? No, I mean, you watch Trump's campaign, you watch his career. Yeah, he's never changed. If you know anybody who's- He's a huckster.

I mean, he comes from New York. There's nobody in New York who does business with him. No, he has no money. Lend him money. No. He's not considered a serious guy here, but. So I wasn't, I was surprised he was elected, but I wasn't surprised in terms of his behavior. I did expect, and I suspect Bill and Joe,

you'd agree with this, that there would be some folks in the Republican Party who would say, no, you can't go that far. You can't start praising Putin and saying that his intelligence is better than the US intelligence agencies. Were you surprised that there were 60-some million people that bought it and voted for him and then did it again? Well, I think that we can't discount

the fact that the world's changing quick. And when the world changes quick, people get scared and they get confused and we had a historic recession in 2008, 2009 where the financial system almost collapses. We end up having, we'd obviously already gone through 9-11. You got globalization, you have suddenly people feeling as if they're losing manufacturing jobs. Some of the towns that, in Illinois,

where I was representing, Arkansas, where Bill was working, you see people starting to feel like they're losing status. Suddenly, you've got the internet and social media and people are being flooded with all kinds of stuff and they don't know how to sort it all out. And when people get scared and concerned, then the appeal of somebody who says, I'm going to make it like it used to be

where you don't have to worry about it. And, you know, men are men and women know their place. the appeal of somebody who says, I'm gonna make it like it used to be where you don't have to worry about it. Men are men and women know their place and that message can sometimes have some appeal. Look, again, I love this country. I am so... You better. I'm Canadian. It is the best country in the world.

You've only been to two countries. But... But it's... He watches CNN International though. It's true. I've been to Canada and the US. No, I agree with that. And by the way, it's a phenomenal country.

When it's at its best, it is the best. The rest of the world looks to us. Absolutely. No matter what you say, no matter how you characterize it, there's not a single country in the world that does not think we're the single most consequential country in the world. Not a single one. Including our enemies. Including our enemies. I mean, across the board. Especially.

If there's a problem around the world, you know, if there's a natural disaster, if there is a crisis, nobody's calling Moscow or Beijing expecting them to help. Right. Everybody's looking to Washington. But beyond that, here's the deal. Look, think about it. When Trump got elected, he said he's gonna go America first, America alone. He, look at who he talks about his best friends being,

Kim Jong-un, North Korea, and I'm serious. Jack Nicklaus. Hey listen, he won two golf championships last week. The regular championship and the senior. I told him when he won, I told him he came into the upstairs oval and we bumped into each other and said something about playing golf. I said, look, I'll give you two strokes if you carry

your own bag. Hey, do you know this? President Biden, do you know that Kim Jong-un, he had 18 holes in one once? Yeah. So we're not far off that with this guy. I'm looking forward to your guys' merch coming out. I've seen holes in one once. Yeah, so we're not far off that with this guy. I'm looking forward to your guys' merch coming out.

Go ahead. Do you guys have an apparatus, a mechanism whereby you can contact one another like this without anybody connecting to that? Like a bat phone? It's called a smartphone. Do you have one of these? What I mean, can you do that? Great.

Do you guys text each other? Yeah, I mean like emojis. I don't text much, but we pick up the phone and talk to each other. I love that. With no one else listening and no one else connecting the call. We can't be sure of that. We're not positive of the cyber side. But does President Obama, like he picks up and he goes, hang on, I add president Clinton Yeah, I'm gonna merge calls. That's a little too advanced, right? You might need a 25 year old aid to help on the merger thing. It all I love somebody else

I mean one plus one plus one makes ten with you guys So I just I want to know like do you all miss something specific about the holding office? Obviously except for you because you're in office, do you guys miss something I miss not having office yeah yeah yeah look look everybody talks about Air Force one yeah sure marine one yeah it's pretty convenient I won't lie but I'll tell you the thing I miss the most is you remember those music concerts I used to do at, you can basically invite anybody. Yeah.

Yeah. And you have this concert. And I mean, we got Stevie Wonder. Yeah, yeah. Paul McCartney. Everybody will show up. They'll show up. I'll bet they'll still take you home.

And they've got, they do these rehearsals the night before a lot of times, and you can kind of sneak down, and you can just sit there and watch. You know, Mick Jagger practicing with B.B. King or something on a blues night. I do miss that. That's so good.

I miss the fact they don't play a song when you walk in a room anymore. Sure. Oh, we should have done that today. I was lost for three weeks after I left office. But let me tell you something serious. This is one reason that I so badly want President Biden to be reelected. What I really miss is the job.

Not doing it. I'm glad. I believe in the two-term limit strongly. Yeah But what I learned was on the worst day When nothing was going right and problems are everywhere there were still something you could do They would make somebody's life better. I love there is no job like that on earth I love that and I want somebody who appreciates that I trust And I want somebody who appreciates that I trust To make the most of that every day. Yeah, because they'll be bad days No matter who gets elected, but he'll get up and he'll start thinking about that

And I think his opponent will be thinking about himself Who I can who I can get even with you know who I can send away who I can get even with, you know, who I can send away, who I can manage. His judgment is... Joe Biden will make the best of the bad days. And the team that you have assembled and your comfort with deferment, you know, you're... I don't know, for me personally, I just, I love leaders that have the confidence to hire those that they respect, that might make them a little nervous. And also not to think that you're the, that every idea you're gonna have every,

you know, we've had people like, we had leaders like that in the middle part of the last century, who were put into government by presidents of old, and they made a lot of decisions that they thought that they were right about, and they were terrible people. And when you let somebody, when that happens, when you think that you've got all the answers,

is the moment you don't. I think. Like Ron Klain, bringing us out of COVID, like it's just, and on and on and on, the way in which that you've surrounded yourself with the absolute best this country has to offer. I made a commitment. I have an administration that looks like America.

I have more women in my cabinet. I have more, I've appointed more black circuit court judges than every other president combined in American history. I've kept my commitment about putting a black woman on the Supreme Court. I've had an opportunity to go out and get the best people. And by the way, I sometimes pick the phone and ask these guys who they think are the best people and by the way I sometimes pick the phone and ask these guys who they think are the best people and I'm looking for people that that most of all though not just are good

But care about what they're doing whereas the other guy is only hiring people that won't talk back You know and that's like I talk back. Yeah What are those things that you look back on because the other guy is? As we know, no capacity for this, and President Obama, I'll start with you, what are the things that you think about that keep you, are there things that you look back and you go,

geez, I wish that had worked out a little bit better? Not necessarily regrets, but things that you would wish had- Handing off the baton in 2016, definitely. But I think Bill's point is the right one, which is when you're sitting in that office, you are essentially a relay runner. You've taken a bunch of problems

from the previous president, and you're working through them as best you can, you're running the best race you can, and then you hand it off. During that time where you've got the baton in your hand and you're running, if you are focused on every day, can I make things a little bit better? Because you're not gonna make them perfect.

There are too many problems, they're too hard. If you make them a little better, then a lot of people are helped. So the Affordable Care Act wasn't perfect. We didn't get everybody health insurance. But we got- It was a big deal. Tens of millions of people.

Really big deal. We got tens of millions of people. You can say the real quote on the show. It was a big fucking deal. We got tens of millions of people health insurance. And my successor tried to kill it. Didn't succeed because it was starting to actually work. You get it passed on to Joe, and what does he do?

He then takes what's already in place and builds on it. Expands the subsidies so that more people can start getting on it. Expands Medicaid so that more people can get on it. And so with all the changes he made, you know, healthcare in America is still not perfect. There's still folks who are having a tough time. But what has happened is that even more people

have gotten coverage, and now Joe caps insulin at 35 bucks, which means that people who've got diabetes and really desperately need help, they're not getting price gouged. And he's negotiating with Big Pharma to make sure that drug prices are affordable the way they are in Canada. And so what you get are these incremental steps.

You're never satisfied, to answer your question, Will, you're never satisfied when you leave, because there's always gonna be a bunch of stuff that's undone. But I couldn't have done the Affordable Care Act if Bill hadn't made the efforts he did around the Children's Health Insurance Program. And Joe then builds on us.

And that's what you're hoping for each and every time. And let me say this, last point I'll make. It's not always just Democrats. George Bush and I had a huge number of differences. But he set up this program called PEPFAR that provided drugs and support and help for people in Sub-Saharan Africa and around the world who had HIV

in the midst of the HIV AIDS epidemic. And because of his program, millions of lives, tens of millions of lives were saved. And we then built on that program. So it doesn't just have to be a partisan thing. Part of what you want though is somebody with Joe's decency and basic focus on the American people and who have a sense of responsibility to say,

all right, I've inherited some stuff, some of it's good, some of it are problems, what more can I do? And that's the attitude Joe has. We'll be right back. We get support from State Farm. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. When you hear those words, you can feel good knowing that State Farm is there to help you

feel supported with the coverage you need for your car, your home, and even boats, motorcycles, RVs, and other things that matter to you. When things get complicated and you need ways to get help, State Farm gives you options there too. Maybe you like to handle things in person or on the phone with your local agent, or you prefer to do it on statefarm.com or on their award-winning app. State Farm lets you do things your way. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there.

I'm Afua Hirsch. I'm Peter Frankopan. And in our podcast, Legacy, we explore the lives of some of the biggest characters in history. This season, we delve into the life of Alan Turing. Why are we talking about Alan Turing, Peter? Alan Turing is the father of computer science and some of those questions we're thinking about today around artificial intelligence.

Turing was so involved in setting and framing what some of those questions were, but he's also interesting for lots of other reasons, Afro. He had such a fascinating life. He was unapologetically gay at a time when that was completely criminalised and stigmatised. And from his imagination, he created ideas that have formed a very physical, practical foundation for all of the technology on which our lives depend. And on top of that, he's responsible for being part of a team that saved millions, maybe even tens of millions of lives because of his work during the Second World War using maths and computer science to code break. So join us on Legacy wherever you get your podcasts.

I'm Alice Levine. And I'm Matt Ford. and we're the presenters of British Scandal. And in our latest series, Hitler's Angel, we tell the story of scandalous beauty Diana Mosley, British aristocrat, Mitford sister and fascist sympathiser. Like so many great British stories, it starts at a lavish garden party. Diana meets the dashing fascist Oswald Mosley. She's captivated by his politics but also by his very good looks. It's not a classic rom-com story but when she falls in love with Mosley she's on a collision course with her family, her friends and her whole country. There is some romance though. The couple tied the knot in a ceremony organised by

a great uncelebrated wedding planner, Adolf Hitler. So it's less Notting Hill, more Nuremberg. When Britain took on the Nazis, Diana had to choose between love or betrayal. This is the story of Diana Mosley on her journey from glamorous socialite to political prisoner. Listen to British Scandal on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. Hello, I'm Emily, one of the hosts of Terribly Famous, the show that takes you inside the lives of our biggest celebrities. Some of them hit the big time overnight, some have

to plug away for years. But in our latest series, we're talking about a man who was world famous before he was even born. A life of extreme privilege that was mapped out from the start, but left him struggling to find his true purpose. A man who, compared to his big brother, felt a bit, you know, spare. Yes, it's Prince Harry. You might think you know everything about him, but trust me, there's even more. We follow Harry and the obsessive, all-consuming relationship of his life. Not with Meghan, but the British tabloid press. Hounded and harassed, Harry is taking on an institution

almost every bit as powerful as his own royal family. Follow Terribly Famous wherever you listen to podcasts, or listen early and ad-free on Wandery Plus on Apple Podcasts or the Wandery app. And now, back to the show. So then what are the issues coming up that people are focusing on that you believe are the wrong things or they may be the right things, and what should they be focusing on? I think they should be focusing on a couple things. And number one, we're going to, in the second term,

God willing, we're going to make sure that we do something about gun violence in this country. Yes. The idea that we allow assault weapons to be sold in magazines with 100 rounds, it's just bizarre. Well, President Biden, I'm so glad to hear you say that because that was going to be my other question,

which is the Democrats never said we want to take your guns away. Absolutely not. You never said that. No, by the way, we got to be smart about what's going on. You just don't need to kill a deer with an AR-15. The Second Amendment, which I, when I taught law school,

the Second Amendment wasn't absolute ever. You weren't able to have a cannon when you were, you know, the side of the, you know, the liberty is water with the blood of patriots. I mean, that's a bunch of crap. Well, it kind of brings us back to… Mr. President, we have a listener question that he already knows about, but if you want to read it to him, it's a listener call-in question. Uh-oh.

Okay. This is unusual, but I think I know who it's from. We have a caller here. Mr. President, I'm assuming he's talking about Mr. President Biden here. You have done so much for this country in the past three short years. You've been the architect of an incredible bipartisan infrastructure deal. Under your leadership, America has been running a white hot economy.

Inflation has been plummeting and unemployment remains in an all time historic low. But like so many Americans, I dread the possibility of having to listen to the grating voice of a narcissist man child on our airwaves for God knows how many more years. He's a bully that can barely manage his own personal, his personal own life, I have a feeling this is about me, has the strangest tan, no that's Will,

and he takes golf way more seriously than any adult man should. So Mr. President, my question is, now that you're sitting directly across from Will Arnett, is there anything, is there nothing you or Congress can do to get him to shut his big fat mouth? I'll take my question, my answer off the air. That's Justin T. from New York City.

Justin Theroux. Justin Theroux, sleeveless. We don't know if it's Theroux. Justin, there are certain powers. Justin Theroux. Justin Theroux, sleepless. We don't know if it's Theroux. Justin, there are certain powers that are beyond the presidency. And that's well beyond my presidential power. I asked you, President Biden, last time if you'd make me golf star, and you never answered me.

I had to call Trump, and he wasn't sure. I want to know, like, Well, I just wanted to say, we're kind of back where we started, which was the whole idea of the messaging and what's good for people. And we're all so hung up on, are you Democrat? Are you blue or red? Yeah, but that's what the campaigns are for.

Look, the average voter wants to do the right thing. But how much bandwidth they have for politics? I mean, they've got to pay the right thing. But how much bandwidth they have for politics. I mean, they've got to pay the bills, they've got to take care of the kids' health care, they've got to make sure the school business is alright if you have children who are school age. I mean, there's just so many things they have to do. That's our job.

That's partly why we're here. That's why you're doing a public service by asking us questions and letting us... That's what why we're here. That's why you're doing a public service by asking us questions and letting us, that's what campaigns are for. It seems like- That's what you have to use them for. It seems like they're sort of making it sort of this binary choice between social issues

or pocketbook issues. And if you're gonna go for the social issues, then you're gonna take a hit on the pocket. If you're gonna vote for pocketbook issues, you're going to take a hit on the pocket. If you're going to vote for pocketbook issues, you're going to lose all the social issues. Like I... But that's not... But here's the truth. The truth is, almost all the rational positions on social issues and on those issues that

are like unions, for example, they all, in fact, grow the economy if you do the right thing. They grow the economy if you do the right thing. They grow the economy. The economy grew under Bill, it grew under Joe, it grew under me. And the reason it grows is when everybody's got a stake, when everybody's making money. Morale. When people are getting paid decent wages, they have decent benefits, they feel better, they go shopping, they might even listen to this podcast.

And so. They gotta be pretty bored. But the point is that American economic history shows whenever prosperity is broadly based, and all of us ran campaigns with this basic premise that if you give everybody a fair shot, everybody does better. So this whole idea that we gotta somehow make it

great again is a fallacy, it's such a joke. Well you gotta fill them with fear. Because we've never been in better. And please, my next question. Die Hard, is it a Christmas movie? I'm kidding. President Biden, if you could resurrect one person from the past to come hang out in the Oval Office,

you update them on the current state of things, what's their advice? Who would you bring in to give you some perspective on? It'd be hard choice for me between Lincoln, because we are such a divided nation and how he dealt with it, and possibly Roosevelt. But look, I think the country is in much better shape than we're talking about it. Not out of me.

It is. We have the best economy in the world, the strongest one in the world, period. Okay? Everyone, if you know how China's going to eat our lunch, notice who China's coming to talk to all the time now, right? The idea that Russia was going to eat our lunch. Notice who China's coming to talk to all the time now, right? The idea that Russia was going to... I want to tell you a quote. I got a call from Dr. Kissinger before he died, about 10 days before he died.

And I asked me to give him a call. And I called and he said the following thing. He said, you know, he said, not since Napoleon has Europe not looked over its shoulder at Russia with dread. And then you guys came along, you strengthened NATO, you expanded it, and that's changed. You've changed it all. Well, this guy's changed it all, but he doesn't care. He doesn't care.

And that's what the rest of the world looks at, is do you have any interest in our concern? And can you imagine us being able to avoid a European war? Can you imagine us, why the hell we set up NATO in the first place? Can you imagine what we're, I mean, there's, it's just, he has no sense of anything. He doesn't believe in anything, we know that, right? There's no. Well, he believes in one thing.

He believes in selling what he's gonna benefit him personally. Right. Well, and I do think that there's one other thing. You were talking about, Jason, social issues versus economic issues. Why is it that sometimes things look good, but people don't feel good all the time? Part of it is, as I said before, things are changing. Folks are nervous, but underneath all the polarization that people are getting through TikTok and social media and cable news, Bill's point about the average person

just wanting to do the right thing, they actually don't want folks arguing all the time. They're really not looking for sort of a Death match, you know on every single issue They'd like to see people be treating each other decently right they don't want to go to Walmart and argue with our neighbor About whether they're or if you're a little league right and area center your kids soccer game right and you got the parent next to you you want to talk about kids little league, right, and you're sitting at your kid's soccer game, and you've got the parent next to you, you wanna talk about kids and soccer. And I do think that underneath all this demonization and anger that people make money off of,

and that gets a lot of clicks, people do want to see some decency right and common sense and I think Joe represents that and his administration represents that and and and if we can Break through You know all of us doing the work of a campaign just to remind folks of What Lincoln called the better? angels of our nature, then I think we're going to be okay.

But the challenge we've got is anger and resentment and calling people names gets more attention. And we do have to, one thing we do have to, I'm not sure, Jason, that in order to do have to, one thing we do have to, I'm not sure Jason that in order to do the show, the performance you talked about, that it has to be pugilistic, that it has to be hitting the other guy in the nose. It does have to be entertaining.

You know, I mean, you do have to be able to, you know, build Joe, me, you know, when I'm doing okay, you know, it's about telling stories that people can relate to, because people can't relate to facts and numbers and figures as much as they can relate to stories. And to personal experience. And personal experience.

That's what people relate to, and that performing by telling people stories, reminding them who they are, what family means to them, And that performing by telling people stories, reminding them who they are, what family means to them, what it means to struggle and overcome. Joe, what he had to overcome in terms of getting where he was. Bill, a master storyteller talking about what it was like growing up, single mom, Arkansas.

And those are the things that really, I think, resonate with people, and if we can get more of that, instead of the kind of name calling that we're seeing out here, I think we'll do okay. Right, right. That's the way you let people know you understand what their concerns are. Look, I mean, think about it.

Everybody's gone through some tough times, but one of the, they want, my dad used to have an expression, I swear to God. He said, Joey, a job is about a lot more than a paycheck. It's about your dignity. It's about respect. It's being able to look your kid in the eye and say everything's going to be okay. And there's a shot of it. That's what three of us have tried to do. We've tried to, we're not, if you, look, if you want to be, if you can earn a billion bucks and you do it legally, great. I'm a capitalist, fine. Just start paying your damn taxes. You know what billionaires pay in taxes? By the way, we have just one

example that you're extreme. We have a thousand billionaires in America right now. If they paid a 25% instead of 8.2% what they pay now, just 25%, it raised $400 million over the next billion dollars over the next 10 years. We could take care of childcare, which increases productivity. We could take care of elder care, which increases productivity. Yeah, let's do it. Well, screw 25, why don't they pay 40? Well, look, here's the deal.

That's what everyone else is paying. Now who's Canadian? Yeah. That's what I was thinking. No, but I'm just making the point that you don't have to be extreme in anything to get this done. Don't forget that Trump's dad once said,

get that family out of 14G. Hey, listen. Listen, if this comes out, and it's helpful at all, is there a chance that the three of us could be on a bill of your designation, President Biden? Maybe a special $250 bill or something? Something like that. With our dumb faces on it.

Yeah, I think it should be. Think about it, don't give us an answer. We'll see you at the inauguration. $3 bill. $3 bill. Thank you. Well, I've been called as inauguration. $3 bill. $3 bill. Well I've been called as queer as a $3 bill, but anyway. Honestly, listen, we've taken up way too much of your time. You gentlemen are very, very busy.

We thank you. Really, really cool. It's just moving to be part of the three of you. Thank you so, so much. Really important. Thank you, guys. We had a great time. Thank you.

Have fun tonight. All right, guys. Wow. Oh boy. That was cool. That happened right there. I'm very proud of us for keeping it together, keeping it classy. How are you guys feeling about it?

That's crazy, right? Yeah, I feel like I'm in good hands, right? When I'm around those guys. Absolutely. Boy. Anyway, that was a real privilege for the three of us. I hope our listeners enjoyed that as much as we did, irrespective of your political affiliation.

Being able, you know, three knuckleheads like us sitting across from three leaders of the free world is nothing the three of us ever expected we'd be able to do. So thank you guys as listeners for enabling that. How about the Secret Service people on the way in and on the way out? Sean was disappointed because he had heard, he was having the impression that we were gonna have a visit to the Secret Circus and he thought that that was the thing.

He thought that there was a secret, yeah. And so he thought. I'm sorry, I bought peanuts. I got like that. And he said he wanted to see bears riding bicycles. I'm like, I could see that at home for free. Hell. Wait, so let me ask you guys, were you nervous?

Because at the beginning of it, I remember saying, I thought I'd be more nervous, but because they're so relaxed and I feel like, you know, they just speak so freely, you feel like you connect with them, that the nerves went away a little bit. They're very good at disarming the folks that are sitting across from them.

They were very chillaxed. I found them to be very chillaxed, and that's how I describe them. But then when I wasn't talking, I was nervous. I was listening to you guys. I gotta say, I felt pretty chillaxed. I know, you know what I mean? If you say it one more time, I'm gonna hang up.

I'm gonna shut the computer. I just want it back. I want it back in the, I want people to start using it. I think it was you that explained to me what the Netflix and chill phrase is. I never knew what the hell that meant. It annoyed me quite a bit. But then, was it you that told me it's code for having sex?

Is that right? Well, I don't know if I wanna get into more like the fact that you're a dad or that we're back in 2017. I don't know which one I wanna hit first. You know what I mean? Yeah. By the way, have you guys heard this band Public Enemy? Fuck me, man. You're killing me.

This is a group. You're killing me. I do want to say with the presidents, it was incredible. You know, and I mentioned this too, which was that the one thing that you can't deny, no matter where you are on the sort of political spectrum, if you will, is that under President Biden, the jobs numbers have been incredible. And I think that he has earned the moniker Joe Jobs.

Joe Jobs. He is, to me, he's Joe Jobs. That is great. That's great. Joe Jobs. Yeah. Joey Jobinstein. Sure, sure, sure, yeah.

Whatever you want, Joey, whatever you want. Yeah, Joey Jobs is great. I love that, Joey Jobs., sure. Whatever you want, Joey, whatever you want. Yeah, Joey Jobs is great. I love Joey Jobs. Well, because what? Unemployment is at a 50 year low, right? I think we covered. The economy's at an all time high. It really is.

Meaning, good. Inflation is gonna work itself out, but that's not his fault at all. That was something that, the COVID and the whole, all that other stuff, I'm not smart enough to describe. No, and we never went into that recession that they thought would happen

and that a lot of that was due to supply chain stuff, issues, et cetera, et cetera. So we're definitely back on, but the one thing that you can't argue with is the jobs. Like it's just irrefutable, right? So again, I don't care where you fall. I'm not saying he's better than your guy or your guy whatever I mean he is but what I'm saying is whether you're Republican or Democrat you need a job and he's he's the guy that's

Bring it. Yeah, he's Joe jobs. So you have Joe jobs So you have Obama and Clinton and then we use this one before but it's Go ahead, Sean. And Biden! Biden! Joe Jobs! Smart. Less. Smart.

Less. Smart. Less. Smart. Less. Smart. Less. Smart.

Less. Smart. Less. Smart. Less. Smart. Less. Smart. Less. SmartList is 100% organic and artisanally handcrafted by Rob Armgerve, Bennett Barbicoe, and Michael Grant Terry. If you like SmartList, you can listen early and ad free right now by joining Wondry Plus in the Wondry app or on Apple podcasts.

Prime members can listen ad free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at Wondry.com slash survey. Back in the 90s, Pepsi and Coca-Cola were in a heated race to try and win loyal customers by any means necessary. But when Pepsi launched an ambitious promotion that encouraged people to buy Pepsi and redeem points for prizes, they overlooked their own fine print in a major way. I'm Misha Brown, and I'm the host of Wandery's podcast The Big Flop. Every week, guests join me to chronicle one of the biggest pop culture fails of all time. Like who at Pepsi thought it would be a good idea to advertise that people could earn enough

points to redeem a military jet as a prize? They never imagined somebody might actually try to snag it. But a 23-year-old did. And suddenly, Pepsi owed him a jet. Follow the Big Flop on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to the Big Flop early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus.