SmartLess - “Eddie Vedder”

Episode Date: February 14, 2022

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Alright, hey, check, check. Hello. This is Eddie Vedder. The guys do not know that I'm doing this. They don't know I'm here early. I'm usually late. But, you know, they want to start this thing early and then where the fuck are they? Come on, fellas. Let's do this. Welcome to Smart Life. This is what I want to bring up. When we had dinner on Sunday, we started talking about words that we get mixed up. Like, I was, I never knew the difference between rife or ripe. Like, if something is rife or rife with, with, with information or ripe, you know, what, what is the, and then Jason, didn't you have one? Yeah, my, my big question up until a couple of weeks ago, a couple of years ago, rather,

was making ends meet. Now, I always thought that people would say that as a, well, we're just trying to make ends meet, meaning we're just trying to buy the cheapest kind of meat. You know, we're not, cause we're poor. We're trying to make ends meet the meat at the end of the cow. Oh my God. I need a new crew. I need a new fucking crew. I got that till a couple of years ago, but it's really about completing the circle, make ends meet, M-E-E-T. Now, if I'd been a reader, I would have seen this in print and known that it wasn't M-E-A-T. Yeah. Now, the more egregious one, Sean, before we move on here, Will.

Fuck it. I can't wait. This is, all of this is so, I'm so close. This is, Mr. Guest, we're getting right to you. Stay awake. So, but this is music related, so you'll enjoy this. Mr. Guest is from the musical. You know what he's going to say, Sean. So, Sean, Sean P. Hayes. Yeah, that's me. A music fan and also a music student, aren't we all? Student. Studied music. This is, this is... When we were watching the Beatles documentary together. Oh, that's right. Yeah.

We all watched the Beatles documentary. Jason Dingdong didn't understand that the Beatles, he spelled B-E-A-T. Right. Like the beat, like one makes a beat. Wait, and you knew this? Jason, you knew this? Yeah, man. I did not know that. Isn't that so stupid? The bug, the Beatles, is B-E-E-T.

Right, but I never knew it was a pun on beat, like a rock beat, like a drum beat. So you did know that the Beatles, the bug, is spelled with two E's? I do. I just didn't put two and two together. You didn't put it together. Well, listen, I can't be the only person out there. Well, no, most of those people are locked up. You know what? You know what? We're going to get, we're going to get online. We're going to get people responding to this, like on our social saying, like, I was today

years old, which by the way, that expression, fuck off. But wait, don't you think, don't you think, if you would, if you want to make it right, a comment on any one of our feeds or whatever, and admit that you didn't understand that the Beatles was a pun on the word beat and not the bug. Yes. Please join me. It'll really help Sean out. It will help Sean out.

It'll really help me out. Listen, it's good. We've got Bennett and Rob. I want everybody to, we've got Bennett and Rob and Michael here. Can they contribute as well? Just to say, what did you guys know? We've never done this before, but you guys knew about the pun. I knew about it for sure. I knew about it.

I knew about the pun. You did for real? Michael Grant Terry knew about the pun. Yeah. And Rob. Are you serious? You guys, you're not, well, I admit it. I'm going to look dumb.

Hang on. Hang on. We haven't heard from Robert Armier. Armier. Rob. How about someone else? Beatless. Beatless.

Beatless. It's like smartless. Beatless did not clear. Smartles. They went with beatless. Beatless. So they, oh my God. They, we, wait, I was about to accuse them of ripping us off, but I guess that was 60,

70 years ago. So it's a problem. It's a nommage. Oh, it's a nommage. That's what it is. Thank you. Thank you very much. So yeah.

So we cleared that up. So that's, so the Beatles. Super inspiring though. Yeah. They're really good doc. Right? Watching their. I mean, let me just say, I wasn't the only person in the room when we were all watching

that together that didn't know that the Beatles was a pun on the word. Somebody else who's in, who's a big listener of the show. She also didn't know. She was our kind host too. She was our kind host. And let's just say, we're not going to, no, you know why we're not going to out her? Because she's a friend. She's a friend.

Okay. And we're going to give you, we give you initials at least, right? No, no, no. We don't need to. We just, just say that she's a friend. She's a friend. She's a friend. She's with the capital F.

She's a friend with the capital F. That's right. It's 8 p.m. Massey TV. Well, now we know. Oh, shoot. I'm sorry. I'm sorry.

Oh, Sean, we've said too much. On 2B. On 2B. Do I have 2B? Listener, sorry for that. Okay. Mystery guest. Sorry for that.

Here comes. Here comes. All right. After this, after, after going on like this, there are going to be more like a misery guest. Am I right? Do you like the rock and roll? I love the rock and roll.

The actual instruments being played, plugged in, played loud. This isn't dance music listener. This is heart pounding, head banging, mosh pitting, stage diving, rock and roll. But his music is also melodic at times. It's rhythmic. It's complex. It's emotional. The lyrics are often poetic and complex.

In February, he will release his first solo album in more than a decade called Earthling. We know mostly from the group, Pearl Jam. He's one of our most enduring rock stars of voice for a couple of generations now. One of my all time favorites, folks, Mr. Eddie Vedder. No way. What? Hello there. It's so crazy to meet you.

This is so cool. Eddie Vedder, I mean. Hey, Will. Now, Eddie, I have it. By the way, how are you? So nice to meet you. You too, Sean. Eddie, we met once years ago at SNL.

Do you remember that? I do remember. Wait, wait, wait. Tell us about that. Why would you remember that? What happened? He took a photo of us together, right, Ed? It was the after, at the after thing.

Yeah. And it was that memorable. Just one photo with Will Arnett. It'll do it. It'll burn it into your brain. It was. No, I wish it would have went longer, but those things are sometimes crowded. But that was the highlight of the night.

We had a little corner. Well, now you get 60 minutes with this guy. Can I do a little thing about you, Eddie? So when I was in college, I was on the entertainment committee and we were in charge of getting bands to come and at Illinois State University, the greatest university in the country, you played. And I don't know if it was the same ticket as the Red Hot Chili Peppers or not. I think it was, right?

Yeah. And maybe you opened for them or was it just a double? Yeah, it was also the pumpkins and the peppers, I believe. And the pumpkins, right. Wow, you remember. And I remember seeing you. I was like, everybody in the audience was just blown away and you hadn't really become you yet and the band was just kind of on the rise, right?

Do you remember when you weren't you? Yeah. What was that like, Eddie? Better. Wait, Sean, you organized a night that had Red Hot Chili Peppers, Pearl Jim and Smashing Pumpkins. Well, we, as a committee, discussed of the band's touring, who we would go after, who we thought the student body would like to hear.

And this was at your college. God, what a school. And yeah, it was wild to see you then and how have you been? Do you remember that night, Eddie? What was the venue like? Was it kind of a hall? It was called the Bone Center. We used to call it the boner.

How'd you guys come up with that? Was there a lot of lovemaking happening at the center? No. Boy, if Will Arnett was there, I bet Eddie would remember. No. Eddie, so Eddie, before you were Eddie, were there any, were you always doing music and wanting to, planning on dreaming of being a rock star? Were there like some regular jobs that kind of put some food in your mouth before you

started successfully rocking and rolling? Oh, for sure. Yeah. I ended up doing a lot of midnight shift work, which came in handy because that's kind of the job now is that you kind of... Night work. You're not supposed to peak to like nine or 10 at night and that kind of... That lifestyle ended up working for the current occupation.

But yeah, I know a lot of waiting tables, a lot of... I really had like a passion and an instinct and a drive and all these things to... If I was going to try to write songs, I was at least going to just give it my best shot and worked hard in little bands and then would do midnight shifts and do all the making of flyers and I heard when you talked to Dave Grohl the other day and he was talking about recording with cassette to cassette players and going back and forth, I mean it's the same thing that I did and I think that comes from a desire, that's not... That was before the advent of home multi-track recording, which was in the early mid-80s,

which we finally got around to, I'm sure Dave did too, but before that it was really just wanting to be able to write a song yourself or have it sound like a drum machine or have it sound like a real piece of music even though you're doing it by yourself and I think that came from listening to early Pete Towns and demos which back then were on bootleg finals that I would acquire and hearing that one guy could kind of play everything. What about how Dave played every single instrument on that first album for Foo Fighters? That was pretty impressive, wasn't it? Yeah, he gave me that tape long before it was out.

I think it just said this side. Play here. Did you give him any notes on it or was it pretty much done? Oh, it was done. It was done. And then their first tour, it was actually Dave and Mike Watt. We were supporting Mike Watt who had just put out a great record with a lot of collaborations and so when we took it on the road, it would be me, Dave and Watt at the end of the night

as a three-piece and then Pat Smear would join us, etc. Oh, cool. And then I would start the night playing drums with a little three-piece and then Foo Fighters would play and it was like their very first tour. I want to say it was something a little insane, like 28 shows in 30 days. Wow. You know, I wanted to ask you, Eddie, about like you were saying, Jason touched on, then you touched on when Dave was talking about recording and trying to do like a real patchwork

sort of multi-track with cassette tapes and stuff and like using the home stereo, his folks' home stereo and stuff, which is so cool and just that desire to like get it out because he knew obviously he had like a song or an idea of something that he had to do it. So he had to and you probably heard us rambling on before you came on here about watching the Beatles dock together and I was, Sean will attest to this, Jason was minding his own business but I was obsessed with watching this documentary, watching that process, that creative process. It's one of the, I said to them the other night, it's one of the most inspiring things I've seen in years and years, watching that process and watching Paul work out songs and John

and watching him go through, let it be and trying to figure it out and then Ringo sitting next to him, blah, blah, blah. What I'm getting to is- Promise? Promise. Yeah, I don't want this to turn into one of those like, Eddie Vedder says on the podcast that he puts him, you know, he's like the Beatles or like one, you know, because that's what people like to do.

They want no one's listening. But what is, did you have that experience as a kid as well where you were just like, had all these ideas for songs that you just knew had to come out or like you had a vision for it? Like was that kind of coming out of you in that way, in the way that I imagined it would? We know one thing I have to say about the documentary which was enlightening and exciting for me to finally realize that I had something in common with John Lennon and that is that I'm always the last guy to show up at practice.

How about that? He was so late all the time. In common. However, I was early today. I'll be late for practice, but see, I, you know, maybe I'm a little too comfortable with the fellas in the band, but you guys, I deeply respect, you know. You were very on time. No, I'm usually late.

The guys would know this. I'm usually late because I'm working on a last minute lyric or something. We have some, I can make some progress from my side of the fence. But I think early on, I think it was just, you know, how to cross that bridge or how to build the bridge from playing somebody else's song to writing one yourself. And, you know, like our lead guitar player, Mike McCready, is just, you know, unbelievable. And I was never going to be able to do that or my interest lied into kind of communicating and getting lyrics and chords and momentum and beat, you know, rhythms and to communicate.

And that started early on, you know, and it still continues. It's still the ever moving goal line, you know, that you try to get across on a daily basis. Was it more of an excitement to get lyrics out or get music out, rhythm, melody, you know, sound, or was the initial draw more writing poetry, you know? Well, I think it's to get them to match, you know, so that the song is, you know, the song is the lyrics and the lyrics are just fit with the music, that the music means what the lyrics mean and the lyrics sound. So are you saying that rarely will there be a stack of lyrics on one side and a stack

of cool sounding melodies and it's just arbitrary what set of lyrics go with what kind of song. In other words, are they written separately sometimes in your process and then you go, oh, these lyrics would go good with this sound or does it happen simultaneously? You know, every once in a while, because I will just sit and just write to write, just write to write and typewriters or calligraphy, whatever, I'll just write to write. And then I'll bring those notebooks and pads of paper and then something comes up and then I might think that this song sounds like that one thing I might have been writing about. So you might take the one line.

That's interesting. You might take two and then you flesh it out rarely would you take a whole page and just have it match up. So many of your lyrics are like just stuck with me and they always will be like I just know so many of them off by heart. They're kind of part of my experience, you know, especially in my sort of 20s and 30s, they were really just, they're so ingrained in my head. Like at any point, I can't, this is not a joke.

I can't tell you how many times out of the blue, I will go alone, listless, like out of the blue, Eddie, it's crazy. And what's nuts is, and Jason kind of said, like, you know, your lyrics are, you are like, I don't want to embarrass you. You're like a poet though. And your lyrics do have, and I know that your songs have so much meaning. What was funny to us was a couple of weeks ago, we had David Byrne on the podcast and I was asking him about like, you know, you know, the song, all that lyrics are like,

this is not your beautiful house. This is not your beautiful wife. I was like, whoa, what was that moment like? Like that, those lyrics are so important to so many people and they read into them and he was like, oh, it didn't mean anything. He said, he said, I was trying to sound like a preacher from AM Radio and I just kind of made it up and it has no meaning. And we were like, what?

Because so many people have like, you know, really read into that shit. I have David Byrne lyrics that, you know, it's their one step short of being tattooed on my forearm. I mean, I lived, I've lived by them, you know, be a little more selfish. It might do you some good. Yeah, you know. Yeah, but to Will's point, Eddie, do you ever like, do you ever like actually let it in the fact that, because music is such a psychological thing for people that when you grow up or what

you listen to becomes a part of who you are. And do you ever just really soak that in and realize you're one of those people that have created music and lyrics that now live inside so many people? It's kind of an unbelievable feat. He's shaking his head. No, he's shaking his head. Never think about that. It's more just, it's more thinking that if that opportunity still exists to still do

something better or, you know, current or, you know, I feel like these days or especially the last couple of years, you know, I've leaned on music, our whole family's leaned on music, whether it's been having dance parties or recording together or whatever. It's always been a positive thing and, you know, I'm still looking. I need music to get me through and I'd like to have music that may, you know, do the same for others. Maybe. I'll try.

Do you ever find that, I know that you have a love-hate relationship with fame and success like most people with an admirable level of humility, but do you ever treat yourself to reaching into that bag of accomplishment to help you through some of the extraordinary levels of pressure or anxiety, like, you know, standing in front of 100,000 people, you're about to walk out and play, like, I would imagine a normal person would need to reach into some sort of bag of something, of some sort of pride so that you don't have an anxiety attack. So at least use it for that if you won't pat yourself on the back when you don't need it.

No, but you bring up a good point. I should do that. Yeah, like, that's okay to tap into it there. Yeah. Jason, what's the bag you reach into? Can you talk about it on here? It's got a ziplock. And no.

I want to say this. I want to say, sorry, just wrap up the lyrics thing because it's just killing me. To me, one of the most sort of heartbreaking lyrics of all time is from your song Black, which I know as many years ago, Eddie, so forgive me for, again, embarrassing you, but there's that lyric that says, I know you'll have a beautiful life someday. I know you'll be a star in somebody else's sky, but why can it be in mine? That to me speaks of somebody who understands pain and heartbreak and stuff in a way that's so profound.

It's so honest and revealing. Would you start crying, Will? I'm gonna, man. No, it's like, there is a vulnerability in that, to be able to say that, to communicate that to somebody that, I don't know, man, it really speaks to, I don't know if you want to talk about that or that kind of writing a lyric like that. Does it feel exposing or does it make you feel vulnerable at all? Well, back, that was the first record.

So we didn't have anybody listening to us. So there was no reason to, when we were recording, there was no reason to think that I was exposing any kind of vulnerable side. It was just really communicating what I was feeling or to be honest, again, that was something that, that music, that the plaintive chord changes and all that, it sounded like heartbreak. So, you know, I think some of it may be based in truth or experience, but then you create a story around that or you create, and then you witness some stuff going on over here and then you incorporate that and you kind of, but in the end, you had, it wasn't just,

you know, men singing that, it was like men and women singing. And actually, it was so many, you know, back then our crowds were average age of 19 or something. We will be right back. And now back to the show. You guys, you know, made incredible and still do rock and roll music and rock, whatever you want to call it, there was, you know, guitar driven, it was hard, it was a great sound. And yet you weren't afraid, you did bring this kind of, you know, you guys kind of exposed

yourself in this way that was very, I don't know, just really accessible to you guys, because it was very kind of honest, there was something, I think that that's, you know, you connected with your audience like right from the get. And for me, I always connected to your music because of the way you guys were so open in that way. I loved that you weren't just sort of, you know, music often times, especially kind of hard rock music, was very sort of, felt very male driven. And like you said, there's much more inclusive it felt like.

You know, I was always a little bit envious of the singer and writer of lyrics in this band Mudhoney, Mark Harman, because it was so acerbic and felt so, his lyrics were pushing outward and galvanized and it felt to me like he was just protected, you know, it was like Iggy Pop or and Kurt too, his lyrics were cryptic and tough and weren't even sure sometimes what he was singing about or Michael Stipe was like protected in some kind of shroud of mystery. And I always, I always wished I was better at that at the time, but it was just the way that I was writing or feeling or, you know, I really, to be honest, I didn't know what

I was doing as far as, you know, what would happen if anybody heard it, because we just didn't think anybody really would not not not like as many people has ended up hearing it, which maybe probably made the second record a little tougher, because then you did have the thing of, of maybe people were listening, or that it would be heard and criticized and and that was probably the hardest one to get through lyrically and still have it be sure and not reacting to the future reaction, you know, yeah, yeah, yeah, all those albums are just so good and you've made so many of them and and now the solo effort, getting that done in between.

Is there a dominant thing in your life now, I'll bet it's family and just generally just us having the privilege of getting older because the only other alternative is death and you're starting to absorb a lot of different things. Is that what's fueling your change in sound to the extent that there that there is one. I mean, I know I'm sure it's vastly different than what you guys do with the band, but what is what's the main thing that's driving what sounds good to you nowadays and what you're writing about? You know, I think I went down to Los Angeles to participate in something called Vax Live.

It was put on by Global Citizen and a lot of great people coming together to encourage people to vaccinate right when the opportunity was being afforded and encouraging pharmaceutical companies, etc. to make the vaccinations available to third world countries, etc. So it was a great endeavor and and then I just happened to bump into a guy that I had come to know over the years a bit named Andrew Watt and kind of producer musician and we've been friends for a while or just kind of acquaintances and I just wanted to go see a studio and and we hung out for a couple days and just immediately started writing. So I think what was informing some of this new stuff was just a new collaborator, a new studio

which is a little home kind of spun basement and just working with some another guy, Josh Klinghofer, which has been working with our group with the when we go out live playing the new record, which was two years ago, which we haven't toured on yet. Can't wait for that. Called Gigaton. So so Josh was in the fold and we just started hanging out and then and then we actually it was going so well we had the rest of the guys come down and then we started doing some real jam songs as well just in this new atmosphere and new feeling and and that went really well

too. So I think coming out of COVID it was it was like an antidote to all the isolation. But what's affecting your taste nowadays? Is it is it your sensibilities of being adjusted mostly with your with your with your family dynamic and your tempo there? I think well, certainly that's part of the fabric, you know, of, you know, nothing makes you feel more grown up and being a parent. Yeah.

And having kids now that are, you know, becoming young adults. And it's not already there and it's a house of badass women. So, you know, I think it comes from in place of humility and responsibility and always looking out for, you know, their world. Let me ask you something just about I was going to say, Eddie, sorry, Sean, just before you, I know that you mentioned that you like your buddy had a little basement studio. That's I'm in my new little basement studio anytime. Eddie, I just know I don't want to embarrass you, Sean, Jason, stay out of it.

Yeah. Eddie, anytime, man. I got like a little vocal area. Look how inspiring that environment is. One microphone. He's all set up. I got two microphones too. Sorry.

I turned to him. Yeah, man. You know what? Well, I'm going to send you to see that blank space right there. Yeah. I'm going to send you a nice ukulele with a holder. Just put it right there. Yes.

I think I should send you all of ukulele. Look, Jason, you got a space for ukulele. Right there. Right there. Bring it. Jason will send you a signed headshot. Yeah. I can sign a eight by 10 for you.

Happy to be right up there. Yeah. You look like the dry cleaners of the Oakwood corporate housing. But speaking about that, you just pointed to your guitars on your wall. Do you, I don't even know how many instruments do you play? And what's the one instrument that you don't that you wish you did? I wish I could play, I mean, I can make, I can get a sound out of a violin, but I wish I could actually really play one or maybe a cello, like a fretless stringed instrument

with a bow would be. Is that because you love classical music? No, but I don't mind it. But I think you could. Sure. It's fine in the background. You could do some interesting. I'm a big fan of this guy, Warren Ellis, who plays with Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds and

just Nick Cave. And Warren had a band called The Dirty Three, which was all instrumental back in the day. And we almost called this podcast that. That's amazing. The Dirty Three. By the way, it would have been good. But they were incredible. And it was all improvisational.

And he's been a huge inspiration to me all of my life. So was there as time went on, you know, Pearl Jam, I think was formed around late 80s, early 90s, right? Or something like that. 90, 91, yeah. Yeah. And as time went on and technology improved around music, did that help? Did that hinder?

Did you embrace it? Were you like, screw that? Were all acoustic? Like did that influence you in any way? We're analog. We're analog. I think that I think technology is great. I still, my goal has been, or I think the group kind of agrees, using the technology to

do what we've always done, but maybe do it more efficiently or quicker. And to be honest, it probably doesn't sound quite as good if you don't do it right onto tape, like two inch tape, like we used to analog, et cetera. But I just think you can get lost in the technology. And so, but if you can comb through it and distill the technology to do the simple things that you used to do with the old stuff, I just feel like nothing can really make the music better than just playing well and writing well. And that you can do with anything so we don't need all the extra stuff.

But you can use the technology to just make it go a little quicker and maybe sound a little bit better sometime. So you guys don't feel any pressure to sort of keep up with what I seem to see as somewhat of a trend where this integration of electronic sound with the more sort of traditional sort of amplifier, music, guitar. You've never sounded older, Jason. I know. You've never sounded more out of touch than this moment.

And you've sounded out of touch a lot. I'll name the two other groups I listened to, Radiohead and Wilco, where they take sort of an electronic sound and they infuse it into some of the, is that something that you guys play around with? Do you feel obligated to? Is it interesting to you? I think if I was better at it, I think sometimes I'd be inspired to do that. And then that entails reading like manuals and figuring out how to work these knobs.

And I'll buy this. I'll read about a guitar pedal that Ed O'Brien from Radiohead used, or I'd watch him use it and then realize that you need to spend a lot of time figuring out what the knobs do. And I wanted, I'd rather be writing or doing something that I could write about. Yeah. Hey, Eddie, I forgot to ask you. Can I just ask you really quick? I keep going back like, oh, man, I've always, because these are things I've always wanted

to talk to you about because we only talked to each other for like 90 seconds. Well, I'm so happy to be talking to you now. Yeah. 15 years ago. He's been waiting since that phone call. I got my list out. I have like a whole Eddie file. But God bless you.

Lighten up a name. Oh, he's smoking. Well, he's smoking. Go ahead. I don't smoke in my studio. This is breakfast. Why not? Well, if you're going to have Eddie over there, you're going to have to allow smoking.

Of course he can. He was kidding. So hang on. So I don't know what year it was, but you and a guy who I've known for a long time, Bill Janowitz from Buffalo, Tom. You know Bill. I love Bill. Great guy.

Great guy and great band. And you guys played their song. Taillight's Fate, yeah. Oh my God. Have you guys, Sean and Jason, have you guys seen that? Taillight's Fate to Black. No. Have not.

I want to say it now. Can I YouTube that? That was cool, right? You were in Boston doing that where everybody, you know, and you guys knew the song. I mean, did you and Bill know each other for a while or what was the deal? I think we played one show with them, I think in Boston back in maybe 91. And I had already had their record or CD at that time. And that song used to hit me and I remember the first time we ever had a tour bus and looking

out the window and feeling very tragic amongst all the newfound success and having that song really hit me. And then years later, I used the word Taillight's in one of my songs. Next time I saw Bill, I said, hey, you know, I was going to call you, but I used that. I used Taillight's and I apologized and he says, oh, don't worry about it. He goes, you know, I got it from Keith Richards. So what is the song about before they make me run, I think, either that or when the whip comes down, something about Taillight's Fate, but yeah.

Wow. Why do I remember you in a Red Sox cap? Is that a cap you wear often? Are you a Red Sox fan? You're a baseball fan, aren't you? I have an affinity to the Red Sox and partly because of the history and the glory of that old building, which is Fenway Park. And then I grew up at Wrigley Field.

So the old buildings and baseball and the smaller feel are kind of in my DNA. And then the third oldest ballpark is Dodger Stadium. That's right. My beloved. So yeah, so it's the Cubs that are your, that's your team. Yeah, but I feel like I can like the Red Sox because it's American League, you know. Yeah, yeah, I got you. Talk to me about the difference between recording in a studio where you guys have multiple tracks

and you can really dial in, you can do your vocals a million times once the music is laid down or vice versa, I'm not sure what the, what the sequencing is there versus when you get together as a group and you play live and you know that you're, there's no net under you guys and you're feeling and hearing the momentum and the sound of the music at the same time the audience is. Do you leave yourself open to a completely different experience there and allow the audience to drive and inform the mood there, what songs, what order you're going to play, how you're going to play them?

Is it participatory like that or is it pretty siloed? No, for sure. I mean, that's what makes our job harder, but we've done it to ourselves and that's what people like to, apparently like to see us more than once or more than once in a weekend or more or 10 times on a tour or something because all the shows are different and I think that comes, we have our crew, we've just been a big family for 30 years and you know if I were to do the same thing twice they would know it and I like to entertain, we like to keep them entertained and on their toes and I think they respect that and that

level of respect and feeling like we're all part of it and everyone's going to have to be on point for the whole night is part of why we can make changes or we do things I call audibles for feeling something's happening or the other thing is being able to stop a show. Yeah. Have you ever cut a show short because the audience wasn't as responsive as you'd like or didn't come back for an encore because you're like, you know what? We're good.

You know what, Sean? They don't deserve it. I shouldn't say this, but we probably end up playing longer on those nights because we're going to get them. We're not leaving until we fucking get them. I get that vibe. I get that. Is there a city that's tougher than others or a country that's tougher than others and

the opposite as well? Is there an easy lay somewhere? Well, if I could take it out of that vernacular. Please do. Yeah. Please save Jason from himself. The crowds in South America are just, they will sing guitar solos. They will sing in unison.

100,000 people will sing the guitar solo. That's great. They'll also, there'll be 5,000 people outside of your hotel room at one in the morning singing the song and singing the guitar solos. That's great. I'll bet you LA and New York are tough crowds. They used to be. Yeah.

I think they used to be. And I think back in the day, we were more concerned about that or look, we were spoiled at some point. So if people weren't being riled up, we'd want to rile them up even more or something. But I just don't think we care about that as much anymore. And we're there to just play well. And I mean, we're there to, you know, communicate and the other thing is making a big room feel small and intimate.

And that's always kind of the goal. And you just never know what can happen and creating a space where other things can happen. It could be some kind of crowd interaction or some interaction within the band. But just being open to that and grabbing it as opposed to having like a scripted out thing, which would kind of be amazing. You could do longer tours if you just kind of knew that you got up at two, you had a workout, you went to soundcheck, you did the set, you went home, you did the same thing the next night.

I mean, you could really fit in a lot of shows. It would be easier. Got up at two in the afternoon. That's a wake up at two in the afternoon. Well, because you stay up until five in the morning, you see. Good Lord. This is a good tough question. It's like, do you have a show or experience or a festival or like a moment that you felt

like was kind of that kind of rose above there. You just felt so connected and you're like, you look back on and go like that moment. That's the one I'm going to chase. I mean, it kind of happens a lot, you know. Yeah. Same. Shut up, Will. No.

Eddie and I are both artists. Shut up. We're artists and you're a robot. Have you ever seen promises promises? It was on Broadway. Have you ever seen Sean in promises promises? Have you ever gotten scared because you opened your mouth and because you were getting sick, nothing came out or, you know, you had no voice or whatever caused you to do a lesser

performance than you hoped for. And what did you do and how did you handle it? Well, I used to stress out about that stuff more, but now I think it's just, you know, relax, get through it. You know, there's things you can do. Well, you would know. You can change your breathing. You can do certain things to get it out or maybe you have to sing one certain line at

a lower or do a harmony octave or something. Or just talk it. Or Jeremy spoke up in class today. Point the microphone at the audience. Is that what you were going to say? You do the, yeah, let them do it. Hey, you guys do it. Right.

Yeah. I went to, this is like three, four years ago, I went to Berlin with the guys from U2 and with Bono and Edge and those guys, and I went to see them do a show. Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. What do you mean you went to Berlin with U2? You're on the plane? I wasn't on the plane. I met them there, but I was hanging with Edge and Bono in the South of France.

They lived in the South. And I was working down there, as you know, and we were hanging out. They're great guys. They're great. They're great. They're great. So we go, baby, and that is drippiest. Oh, are they?

So anyway, so you're on tour with U2. Go ahead. I met them at the show, but we're, you know, whatever we were up. So anyway, I go to the show, Bono loses his voice. Like three songs in that show. I was at that show. Oh, and you took over. And I took over and I gotta give the audience what they want.

And people didn't notice. Wait, what happened to Bono? Was he sick? They canceled the show, man. It was almost like he inhaled like a chemical or a smoke thing. And it just shut down his vocal cords. It just, that's what I heard. Yeah.

That's exactly right. They had this new smoke. The people who were doing the, whatever, does that fall under pyro? I guess or whatever. But scary though, right? I mean, those are those, I've had that moment too. Like as, because we all performed where you go like, oh, shit. Is this the thing?

Yeah. Is this the moment? You know what I mean? Eddie, what is the guns to your head? You can only do one thing for the rest of your life between the two, making music or surfing? Making music. Okay.

But you do love the surfing. I've, I've, you know, look, I'm, I'm at an age where I can't serve as big waves as I used to. And so I've had my fill and I've got a couple of nice pictures of me on big waves. Do you get out there with Larry Hamilton at all? I used to. Yeah. I haven't seen him in a while.

But yeah, he, you know, he invented so many of the things that people now do on the water. You know, he'd invent something, you know, stand up, he'd invent toe and surfing with his friends and then move on to something else and then invent standup paddle and then move on to something else. Now he's foiling where he's, you know, three feet off the water and foiling through it. So we, I've been lucky enough to be with him and be taught by him. Yeah. What, what is it?

If the, if the waves are X amount of feet high, that's too high for you to paddle out. What is it? Well, nowadays I would say, you know, I'm not going to, a 12 foot wave is a lot of water. Good God. But, you know, I've been on. Charlotte Jason, Charlotte, have you surfed? No, look at me. No.

No, I know. Jack Johnson is the best surfing musician. Oh really? I mean, he grew up right there at Pipeline. He's incredible and great, great person, great family. Now, have you, have you done the Laird Hamilton workout with him in the pool there? I have, yeah. That stuff.

Can you explain to our listener what that is? What is that? It's just a series of exercises that you do underwater thinking that, you know, you're getting used to your body under duress, underwater. So when you, you know, it applies to surfing. And so you, if you have like a major wipe out, you're used to like battling underwater. And it might just be, you know, you have a swim mask on and you're carrying some weights and you hold your breath and then you just do laps under the pool.

You know, you'd see if you can do a couple laps or be under for 90 seconds, then come up and get another breath and then do more. Or you just, you go to the deep end and you push yourself up, get a breath, go down, push yourself up, get a breath, go down. The cool thing is the heavier the weights, the faster you go down. So that's kind of nice. And that's just, you know, they used to do it years ago that the Hawaiians would go swim down, pick up a big rock, you know, run for 30 yards and then come up and get a breath

and then do laps. Just to train themselves. So Larry's probably the closest thing to a human fish we have today. Would you say that? Human Kelly Slater. Yeah. Yeah, they're Kelly Slater. Great golfer.

Great golfer. Do you play, do you play golf, Eddie? I do not. All right. You know what, Eddie? I don't either. Eddie, were you doing the, were you doing the cold plunge stuff too? Did you get into that?

He's, he's, he's an expert at that. I've got the Puget Sound so I can jump into that and that's, that's fairly cold. I might someday. I feel like I haven't needed it quite yet, but I'm certainly getting there. Just take a cold shower. I love it, man. I do that cold thing too. I'm super into it.

And we will be right back. All right. Back to the show. I want to know, Eddie, you've worked, you worked with so many people, legendary, huge names, too many to list. Is there anybody you haven't worked with that's on your dream list? Outside of you. You've got an appointment with Will at the studio.

You know, it's just this life and music. Grow would tell you the same thing if he hasn't already. It's just been such a, such a huge, incredible blessing and growing up loving music just about more than anything. And then knowing the music and then getting to know the people that made it and inspired you to begin with. And then when you're, then when you become, you know, close friends, that's, that's just a whole another level of, then it, then it kind of changes.

Then, then you're just friends. And now you don't even think that that's, you have to kind of remind yourself that, oh, that's, that's the guy that kind of raised you musically. That's what Jason and Will think of me. Can you talk about your, your, your co, your co-bandmate on, on Mrs. Mills? Yeah, I sent, I sent Jason a song yesterday. It'll be out in February with the rest of the collection of this new stuff. On Earthling.

Let's listen to a clip. But you had a special, special guest star there on Mrs. Mills. The song asked for it. And it was a song about a piano. And there's a song, a piano, and it resides at Abbey Road. And it was interesting to hear that Paul McCartney tried to purchase it to have it. Because I think it was like the Lady Madonna piano. A lot of songs were, and they called it Mrs. Mills because it was left behind by a woman,

Gladys Mills, who used to write kind of English pub songs and sing-alongs. And her piano was left and they call it Mrs. Mills. And it's still there because they, they refused to sell it to Paul. And, and we had our own Mrs. Mills in California, the same model, Steinway. And the guy I was working with, Andrew, he had Elton John in there playing Mrs. Mills. Paul came in and played Mrs. Mills because they recorded a song together. And we did a couple songs and he played the shit out of Mrs. Mills. And then Stevie Wonder came in and Stevie was playing Mrs. Mills.

And I started thinking about how this piano preferred not to be owned. She just wanted to be there with all the, all these fantastic men were laying their hands all over her. And she liked it that way. So that's what the song's about. And it did have kind of a beatlesque feel to it, a feel. And we thought, speaking of fills, we thought about, you'd kind of go for a Ringo-type sound on the drums. And then we were able to reach him and he was joyfully contributed and made it into something really, really special. So we got to sit and record and play with Ringo. And it was just a real education.

Do you like it? Oh yeah. All three of those he sent were just, genuinely meant what I said. I could listen to these on a loop for a week straight to not get tired. How the hell do I get wasted on Bateman? Bateman doesn't appreciate anything. Eddie, I wanted to finish, we started the whole thing with me recounting the time that I worked at Illinois State University. Yes. At the concert with you.

Let's go back to that for sure. No, wait, because I wanted to finish. Because you grew up in Chicago? Yeah, I grew up in Glen Allen, Illinois, summer of Chicago. That's west of Chicago, that's... Correct. Yeah. You were in Evanston, I think.

I was north, yeah. You were about the same distance. Anyway, I was at this concert. It was, again, it was you, it was Pearl Jam, Red Hot Chili Peppers, and Smashing Pumpkins. And so, and you, I was, I weighed, I weighed like 70 pounds, and they let us in the front row, and I worked with the security. So when you did the body surfing and jumped into the crowd, I am the one who had to keep everybody off the stage. So they wouldn't rush it, and I was like... Wait a second.

I was 19 years old at 70 pounds, thinking I could hold back a crowd rushing the stage to get to Eddie Vedder. And let's not forget, super, super gay. Oh, my God. Oh, yes, you pointed out super. I wore a cape, I was so gay. Oh, please. A cape is a security. Oh, God.

Oh, boy. So the question is, Sean, the question is... Did you feel safer knowing that Sean was there? Exactly. Did you feel safer? I do remember you by, you jumped into the crowd, didn't you? Didn't you used to do that? Yeah.

Yeah, that would be a nightly occurrence. And then the chili peppers would play, and then I'd do it a bunch more, just for fun. Are you still doing that when you guys are going out and playing those huge venues? When's the last time you jumped into the pit? Trying to think. Jill would not be happy. It was fun in the 20 movie or whatever, the Cameron Crow Pro-Damn documentary. There was maybe a four-minute thing of just all the montage of me jumping in and watching my young kids react.

That was pretty fun. Did anybody just grab your junk one time? Oh, Sean. Sean, this isn't like the bushes behind the pit. What do you think he's jumping in the pit, you dumbass? I'm just all about crutch grab. I mean, they had to have. Actually, maybe that explains the calluses, but yeah, so maybe...

Yes. Calluses. Are you close to rescheduling your dates that you owe us on the domestic tour? I think I said there were two there for the forum in Los Angeles. Are we close to resetting those? Yeah. Yeah, I think we're going back to Europe in the summer, and I think there's been some that's being announced in the States hopefully before that. I'm not sure if they've been announced, but that's the plan.

Okay. Don't make like you don't know us when those come out. Come on, guys. Yeah, man. I don't think you know how much I like you as well. Well, we're going to be all over you when you get out there. Oh, my God. Are we all over it?

Let's speak about your... I'm going to body surf over. Are you going to... The band. Where the t-shirt says, please grab here in an arrow to your junk. What... Talk to me about scoring movies briefly or longly however you want. Your work with Sean Penn is fantastic.

Is that something that you enjoy doing? I mean, you're mostly writing songs for those films as opposed to scoring to picture. Yes? Question? Yeah, I think Sean is really the driving force behind all that. I feel like the ones that have meant the most or anything at all were really just the Sean ones. And working with Sean is great, as you know, because he can be as much as he's my older brother. And we're so close, but he's still a terrifying individual.

And it will really bring out the best in you. And even lyrically, if you've ever been out with Sean, he might at three in the morning kind of recite a Dylan song with nine verses and do it perfectly. And so when you write, you want to give him something that's worthy of reciting at some point. He's just been a great collaborator. And this last one we did, Flag Day, that came out just a few months ago, is just another great experience. And his daughter is just incredible in it. He's incredible in it. Your daughter participated as well, yeah?

Well, yeah, I love the story because she was just a stand-in vocalist. We were writing songs, Glenn Hansard and I, the great... I love that guy. Irish singer, person, Irish human, Irish earthling. But he... we came up with this song. We really wanted Sean to hear, but we didn't have our female vocalist for another week or so. And so I just asked my daughter to come down and give it a whirl. And she doesn't spend a lot of time saying, you know, she's shy about it and very humble and just kind of enjoys it. But she came in and I played it for Sean and it was something about her voice and the vulnerability of it and that it was just kind of perfect for the song.

So he said, not only do I like the song, but this version. And there was also great symmetry because it was him and his daughter and then Olivia as well. So it was a great experience and then the craziest, coolest thing which we could have never predicted and even a week before had no idea what happened or three days before. But Olivia came up and sang on stage when we played the Ohana Festival with all her uncles, you know, in the band, you know, from Glenn to Chad Smith to Josh and Andrew and all these great players. So it was kind of like she had the perfect wave and she surfed the shit out of it. She sang great and that was a big thing to be in front of people. Eddie, speak a little bit because you just talked about Glenn Hansard, who I'm such a fan of his music. I'm so happy that you guys, the idea of you guys working together for whatever reason makes me really, really happy.

Tell me about your relationship with Glenn and how that came to be. Tell it quick, the crazy thing, or I mean, it came from such a tragedy in a way because he was playing somewhere in Oregon. And I read about it the next day that during the set, some young man who obviously had some deep, deep issues, walked away from his girlfriend, left her in the crowd. Next thing you know, he was jumping from the back of the stage onto the stage and killed himself. It happened behind Glenn. Glenn thought maybe an amp had fallen over. It got even more hectic because it was a one, two lane burrowed into the venue like a winery or something. He was there with his group's well season and all the crowd had to stay put so they could get emergency vehicles in and out. So everyone was kind of watching this thing happen.

Anyways, I was able to get his number and reached out that next day just to see how he was because we had gone through some stuff with the Ross Gilda thing, the concert where we had our own extra large dose of tragedy. So that's how we met on the phone. And then I called the next day and checked back in on him and they decided to keep playing, which I think for them was a great idea. And that's how we, our friendship started. And now we're again just brothers and I just love the guy. That's so great. Every day I get to see Glenn is a good day. Let me ask you a final question.

We will let you go. You've been very generous with your time. This is the dumbest question of the morning. Do you want me to ask it? You're going to pretend Sean texted me and asked me to ask you this question. Oh, that's nice. It's really nice. And it's a final Pearl Jam question.

Does the title of the band mean what I think it means? Go ahead and go. No, no, don't put it in my mind. Tell us what you think it means first. Well, I'm going to wait until he gives a little color on it. There's a slight grin on his face, listener. Well, the thing is I don't really know what it means. So you could be right.

I think you do. Okay, there it is. Can you explain the grin? It's just a ridiculous question. It's a ridiculous question. It is. Thank you. Eddie better.

What do you think Pearl Jam means? I think it means whatever it wants. You know, first of all, Eddie better just clowned you, dude. You just got clowned by Eddie better. I think it means, can I say what I think it means? Go ahead, Sean. I think it means when a couple who is deeply in love with each other. This is very nice way to start.

Have an intimate relationship. Okay. And they have a leave behind during an intimate encounter. There's an organ scream. There's an organ scream. And what you get is Pearl Jam. And then you write music to it. You're talking about a dick barf?

Whoa, bro. I don't know what I mean. Which was the other option for the band name? Dick barf was the original name. Pearl Jam knew it. Fucking dick barf. It didn't clear. It was already taken.

Oh my God. Did you guys hear about the Guar show? You know, Guar. Speaking of great band names. Did you see that they were playing a theater and they had somebody crowd surfing. And by the time he got pushed up on the stage, he had lost his prosthetic leg.

No. So everyone had to scramble. And then they stopped the show. See, this is the good thing. Any singer should be able to stop the show. Anybody running the show, any promoter, should have a kill switch and be able to stop the show. It's just something you need to do.

And I tell you, when the leg comes up from the back of the crowd, it gets passed up just the leg. It's just fantastic. Filled with Pearl Jam at that point. By the time it gets to the front. Do you think that Eddie and I could play brothers? Do you think that I've had that in a bunch? Yeah.

I was thinking about that early on. That's a compliment to me, by the way. It is. Yeah. Are you guys resisting the urge to just sing Eddie's songs? Yeah. I've been trying not to go out for a solid hour now. I keep wanting to go like, I don't mind.

Keep it together. No, don't do it. We're about to get away with it. Okay. Eddie. Eddie. But it's on the table. Sorry.

I just can't fucking. Man, I love you, Eddie, dude. I love you. You're a beast. And until we see you in Inglewood, please be well. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you for doing this.

Such a pleasure and an honor to meet you. I got some. I really, really love you guys. Thank you. Man. Likewise. Thank you, Eddie. Be well.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. And hopefully we see you soon. Much love, fellas. All right, Eddie. Bye, buddy. Bye.

Bye. You guys are welcome. Okay. You're welcome. I just walked on. There's about half a dozen true rock stars in this world. I agree. There goes one of them.

Wait. How do you know him, Jay? What are you? I just, you know, he doesn't know me. He doesn't know me, Sean. He doesn't know him at all. But I requested and he was nice enough to say yes. That's so nice.

I met Eddie. I met him at SNL like, like 15 years ago, maybe longer and longer. It was like, yeah, 15, 16 years ago. This was the photo that he remembers so clearly. Yeah. He took it. And it was like the first, it wasn't whenever it was before the iPhone and he had an actual camera.

And I was on 8H right after the show. We hung out after it too, but we were in the thing and I was just waiting at 8H to talk to somebody and Eddie comes over. He had a briefcase with them, which was funny. No joke. And then he goes, and they just performed on the show. And then he goes, hey, do you mind if we take a photo? And I was like, what?

And then he produced, he's got a camera. He's just been taking photos. He asked you to take a photo with him. Yeah. Good Lord. And it was, I couldn't, and then I went and talked to him and the rest of the guys at the after party, like Mike McCready and those dudes, and Mike McCready was a big arrested fan.

Oh yeah? Yeah. And we were still on the original, on air on the original Fox version. You know, the more guys that are like rockers, the more, because you know, growing up, you only see them in videos. You just hear their songs. You just assume they're like testosterone filled, tough guys are going to kick my ass. Then you meet them at like the heart of gold, gentle giants, like the sweetest.

That's what I meant about Eddie's music, about his vulnerability to his music and the way that made it. It's so interesting. There was power and emotion that matched the weight of their musical sound too. And it's okay, Sean, to what you were saying, it's okay for men to be vulnerable in that way and express themselves in that way. That's what a real man is. I couldn't agree more.

And I don't know about you guys. I mean, he just said it. And I said it to him. And I say it to you guys all the time. You know, there was a, it felt like it wasn't okay for men to say, I love you to their friends. Right. And I say it all the time. It's really important.

I love you. I love you too. And I think it's so true because it's like, oh, it's too scary to say that. No, it's not. It only makes you evolve. Sure. And I mean, and- Fuck you, Jason.

Well, I'm just saying in the past, you know, it used to be like, if you said, I love you to a man, people would think that you were gay or maybe even, bye. Bye. Old school. Bye. Smart. What? Smart.

What? Smart. What? Smart. What? Smart. What? What?

What? What? What? What? What? What? What? What?

What? Hello, I'm Joe, Michael Grant Terry, and Rob Armjurf.