SmartLess - "Michelle Pfeiffer"

Episode Date: September 29, 2025

Fill the lighter with butane, it’s Michelle Pfeiffer. Honeywagon territory, mildewy screenplays, the trauma of stenography, and cutting Al’s finger. Welcome to the final episode [until next week]... of an all-new SmartLess. Subscribe to SiriusXM Podcasts+ to listen to new episodes of SmartLess ad-free and a whole week early. Start a free trial now on Apple Podcasts or by visiting siriusxm.com/podcastsplus. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Oh, how's everybody today doing today? I'm so good, Sean. How are you? Are we actually doing this? Are we talking, are we having a business meeting about when we're doing cold opens? I think we're rolling. We're literally rolling. This is a cold open right now. Okay, because we're not doing another show for another couple of weeks.

So, anyway, welcome to Smartless. Here it comes. Smart Less Smart Less Oh, wait, what's Suss mean? Any people in your...

Suspect. That's one of the new ones that kids are saying, right? Not new. God, you're embarrassing yourself. Riz is not new, right? That's a couple years old. Really, really bad.

Is Flexi a new one? Flexi could be good. What, like, what's flexing me? Like, flexible? Yeah. And then what did I hear was, oh, zesty is gay. Is that right?

Zesty. Oh, sure, I've never heard that. If something is zesty, Will? Have you heard the boys saying that? Sorry. Guys, I've got to keep up. We have to record soon. We're going to start the podcast,

and I just want to make sure I've got my... Watching you and hearing you get old in front of me is just astounding. You should have heard the sounds. I made trying to get out of the bed this morning. Super old. Like, you got me going.

Like a rogue fart. Just like, ugh, fuck it. All right, back. Boy, you're going to wish you had it said that with our guest. Hey,

no, is it respectable. Respectable guest to me? Yes, very respectable. Very, let's start over. She's very classy. God damn it.

I'm sorry, surprise, guest. No, it's good. And, J.B., I would say that you started me off on the whole, like, every time you would get out of your chair.

By the way, not even when you were old. When you were like 33, you'd go, ugh. You've got to make a sound to lock in the core. I know, and somehow I got into that here we go. Yeah, you do, hoit! Well, but you know what Chuggy is, right?

Chugie is a word that kids used to describe someone or something that's outdated or trying to hard to be trendy or lacking originality. Well, you're reading because you look that up. I just looked it up while you were talking. I was like, well, when you look it up, it's gone. What was the prompt? Hey, what are the kids saying?

Absolutely. Really? Absolutely, that's what the prompt was. Sean? Wait, what about how, oh, by the way, the other night at that, this is, what's today? What's today? Wednesday? Tuesday. No, today's Tuesday.

Sunday, the center seat in the front row of the play. The girl, this girl just, I could tell she was just a single ticket. Her head was, her head was, cap not. she was an arcolectic hard to get hard to get a date i don't know yeah she kept nodding off and so at the bows i pointed right to her and i just and i mouthed they go you gotta go night you gotta go nine-nigh oh shit sean i did i pointed right to her the whole cast we were laughing on stage and i'm like you gotta go nine-night are you tie-tie oh and what do is she embarrassed or she just kept looking at me

She just kept looking at me clapping. Clapping. And she didn't realize I was, I'm looking right at her. But she didn't realize it. Yeah, well, she probably has an issue picking up on social cues and grab proper rest. And definitely proper rest. It's like a very expensive nap. Yeah, yeah.

Did you maybe look at your performance? Believe me. I thought about the whole time. Was she normal or was she chopped? Did she look chopped? What's chopped means? Would you just look up with it? Oh, shit.

Oh, you guys don't have a shot. Oh, God, what is shot? This is a real one. You kind of, kind of, a little busted, a little busted up, little... You're not even reading that. No. So, did that come from Archie or Abel? Listen, I'm, look...

No, no, no, you're not getting... You're not... So, I'm in with the... Who gave you that? Archie or Abel? Dude, all of our friends. My friends and Archie's friends and Abel's from, because I hang, because we're all young dudes.

So we're kind of in the same friend group And do you guys say Hey this is a great new flavor of gum You should try it? Or you should hear it is what I usually say Spit it out of your mouth I know I always forget that I've got it going on But you always chew gum

Wait is that the Nicarrette gum Is that what it was on it? Well truth be told I've got some Zinn I've got the little nicotine pouch in Is that another word the kids are using? I'm not one Free shit I like this David Power

bar guys the folks at david um let me give you i'm going to give you in my address uh a little later in the side chat the folks at david shan anything any kind of uh hot fudge or ice cream that you need hoggandaz i love hoggandaz do you i do i can't i can't eat too we like mcconnells we like mcconnells yes we like mcconnells too as well a lot we like them a lot and um obviously Hyundai, Jamsie. Do you want to hear a quick... A quick joke? Laura Piano, Rolex, and NetChance.

Okay, guys. Wait, do you want to... Wait, a real quick joke. A real quick joke. Ready? So gross. I apologize, everybody. A dwarf psychic just escaped prison.

Come on, really? Yeah, there's a small medium at large. There's a small medium at large. I think you work on your reading of that. Okay, I heard a really quick one. This guy's going down the road. There he is. Okay, and he gets to a T in the road,

and he doesn't know which way to go. He's kind of lost, and he goes to the right, and all of a sudden his car breaks down. He goes in front, he lifts up the hood. He's trying to figure out what's wrong, and he hears it, it's the alternator, and he looks up, there's a horse there. He goes, what the hell?

So he goes down, looks at the car. Again, he can't figure it down. He hears, it's the alternator. He looks back at the horse. He's like, what the... So he tries the alternator, tightens a few screws, starts right up, and he goes.

So he's like, oh, man. So he drives to the nearest bar. He gets in the bar, and he says, the barman, he says, give me to a large branding. He just downs it. He says, give me another large branding. He downs it. And the barman goes, oh, ho, ho.

Are you okay, man? He goes, yeah, he goes, I was just driving here. I was lost. I hit a tea in the road. I went to fix my car. And this horse, this talking horse. I decided to go right, and I came upon this horse, and he said, it was the ultimatator.

And he goes, oh, man, good thing you didn't go left. He goes, why? Because there's a horse over there that doesn't know anything about cars. come on come on where are we going i know are we going into fucking choke hell you didn't like that because i'm already there that sucked there's a horse over there that doesn't know anything about cars where's the punchline yeah that's it that's fucking terrible we're going to leave that in we're not going to cut it because everyone needs to know that sometimes will clanks it yeah it happens rarely you didn't like you that one i love it i think it's cute stupid all right so our guest our guest our guest

A couple of pieces of string walk into a bar and they sit down on the stools and the one piece of string says the bartender says give us a couple of beers the bartender says we don't fucking serve string in here

and the two pieces of string look at each of you come on let's get out of here so they walk outside and one piece of string says the other piece of string quick tie yourself around me he goes what are you doing it just tie yourself around me come on ties itself around and they they hop back in there and they jump up on one stool

and it says give us a couple of beers You go, hey, aren't you those two pieces of string I just kicked out of here? I said, afraid not. Okay? So that's up there with your shit horse joke, but it's slightly better. That's a little...

Good thing you didn't go left. There's a horse over there that doesn't know anything about cars. Oh, Sean's laughing. Sean's just having fun. Let's see of our surprise guests enjoying some of this crap. Imagine a horse.

Imagine like, okay, you know, and it, okay. By the way, Franny is eating up Boja. Oh, no, it's Maple. She's eating up BoJack Horseman. Appropriate for her age. But apparently this is a great show. This is an animated show on the Netflix? Oh, my God.

Is it just getting going? I haven't heard anything about it. I tell you who's been going for a long time is our guest. Oh, nice. She's worked with everybody from, from, we're talking. This is Primo A-List, iconic. She's going to hate me for saying this, but it's true. Actor, she has been, she's worked with everybody from Pacino, De Niro, Nicholson.

She's been nominated for three Academy Awards. You know, she's been a queen and catwoman, a dangerous liaison. Yes, it's Michelle Ball. How did you get that? I'm not, how did you get that so fast? To the universe. Michelle Pfeiffer, reveal yourself. Good morning.

Oh, she's just late. I'm so mad. She's so bored. Good morning. What a pleasure. Good morning. You got it so fast. I know.

There's not that many incredible icons in the world, male or female. You're right there at the top. Hi, Michelle. Hey, hi. How are you? I'm great. How are you? Oh, I'm good.

Getting ready to go back to Montana. Oh, for what? For some. For some more Madison. More Madison. So, Michelle, I wanted to start by saying, first of all, I had such a great time. I did a couple days with you on the Madison, which was super fun.

He came home and raved about you, Michelle. I did. He did. It was, you know, I gushed. Aw. Fun? Wow. It was, it was, it was, yeah.

Are we talking about Will as a scene partner? No, no, Will was great. And he was very, yeah, he was an amazing scene. No, no, love, love, love the director. Love the show, love the actors. It was just. Our scenes were kind of grueling, and we did a lot of takes. We did a lot of takes.

A lot of angles, and we had, it was heavy, it was just the two of us for about two days, and we were just talking at each other for two days. Was it only two days? Was it like a contentious? Yeah, maybe three. And I was cursing at him. Yeah. Yeah.

I'm being having all of us. Thank you. I'm throwing the F-bomb around. I appreciate you not actually using the word on this episode. So Michelle, I went all the way back So in anticipation of having you on the show Which this has been a long time coming And actually we were going to have you a long time ago

And then schedule and things That prevented us from having you a long time ago And I've wanted to get into One of the things I love when I look up It says, and I wanted to ask you about this Your first television credit ever Was Fantasy Island, is that true? Oh, no way!

That's cool. What a dream. I had one line. I had one line on Fantasy Island, and I remember the line. What is it? And the line, and the episode was the Island of Lost Women. Sure.

Okay. I was one of the Lost Women, and we were all running around in Togas. Can I guess the line? Pastil. Yes. Here I am. No?

No. And it was the closer? They went to credits after that? No. That was the only episode that Sean skipped. Yeah. I was like, boobs, I'm out. It was.

It was, it was, who is he, Naomi? Wow. Who is he Naomi? And were you referring to Mr. Rourke? It was, who was it? Herbe Pellichess? I can't remember who was. And there were no men, I mean, the premises, there were no men on the island.

And so we were all, we were. They were all lusting over this one man. Who, oh, but you don't remember who that, and that was a guest guest, guest. I don't. You could, well, did you do your homework. Did you look at the credits? No, sorry, didn't say who you're sure.

Not on Wickey. I mean, it did say it. Didn't they do a lot of that? Wasn't that done like on a back lot at one of the studios? It was huge, universal background maybe? I'm guessing it was universal, but it could have been Warner Brothers. You didn't, you didn't, like you didn't fly to Hawaii. or something, right?

No, yeah, right. No, they flew me to Hawaii. No. Yeah, no. No, but I do remember how exciting it was, showed up for work, and there was, you know,

Honeywagon, all the rooms there. You were at a Honeywagon, for sure, with one line. For sure. You're lucky to even... Can you just tell Tracy real quick, Sean's going to his sister? Yeah, a HoneyWagon is, it's a trailer

where you, as an actor, you hang out while they're working on... But it's divided... And it's divided up into... small rooms. Very small rooms and they put you in there like a veal. Yes. It's just enough room to turn.

You can go to the restroom, brush your teeth and change your shoes all sitting on one seat. What more does one need? Nothing. It's very efficient. But I was very excited because I looked up and there was my name and a star. Yeah. They knew. Like you made it.

They knew. Yeah. Yeah. So tell me like, tell me what. By the way, it's so nice to see. I think we met a long. long, long time ago, but she doesn't remember. Just in passing, no, she doesn't remember.

But this is the first time I've gotten to talk to you, so it's such a pleasure. And what was that like when you, the first time when you, so before Fantasy Island had you been pursuing it? How did you fall into it? Like, how did you get that first job? I had taken theater in high school to avoid having to take an English class.

I think it was grammar that I was avoiding. And so I sort of fell into it. and I thought all the theater people were just kind of, you know, geeky. Yeah, yeah, for sure they are. And anyway, I just, I mean, I just fit right in. And I just sort of fell in love with it. And then anyway, graduated. I didn't think I would ever in my wildest dreams to become an actor.

I just wasn't a part of that. I'd never met an actor. I'd never met a famous person. And your family was, there was no sort of acting connection in your family. Nothing. Nothing. Nothing. In fact, my dad was not thrilled at the notion of me. Where were you? Where did you grow up? An Orange County, not that far away from L.A.

Anyway, so I was working at Vaughn's supermarket. I love it. Yeah. Check out? Check out. Yeah. And it wasn't a very good checker. I could never balance my cash register. Yeah, and those are the days where you had to type in the price. Yeah. And you didn't just scan stuff.

Those were the days, right, way back then. Get some skills. Now, did you not go to college and like study up on some, you know, tangible something you could really rely on like a real? Or were you just like, I'm all in. And if this doesn't work, I'm going back to slinging melons. I had started a trade school. I was doing court reporting. Oh, really?

Wow. And that made me crazy in the head because you have to sort of, like, learn a whole new language. Yeah. And then you have to type it out like this. What's the conographer? Synographer. Snographer.

Wait, so you know how to do that? Not anymore. But what would happen was after about a year of studying that, every time I would talk to people, my hands would start going like this. Really? Like you were typing? And I'm transcribing. Every single thing.

And it's not a quirky keyboard, is it? No, it's like a different kind of keyboard. No, it's a totally different, you have to learn a completely, different language. It's a fully different language. Did it help you memorize dialogue going forward? No. I mean, maybe. Good question, though, Will.

Thanks. I was just thinking it would be funny. I wonder if you ever lost a job. You know, you said you took acting because you didn't want to do this grammar class. And I wonder if you ever lost a job. They were like, we really wanted to hire her, but her grammar was terrible.

Yeah. She doesn't speak good. I've been, since you popped on our little screen here today to talk, it's really hard for me to hold. I have, you know, Greece too is one of my favorite movies of all time. Really? And I'm sure you get it all the time. And I'm so sorry,

but me and my sister watched it a thousand times. I know every word, every song. My sister and I. Who else is bad? Michelle was about to correct him. I'm just kidding. Anyway, I just, I just, it was a huge part of my childhood, Greece, too. And we would just watch it over and over and over again.

I know every line of dialogue and every line of dialogue and everywhere. So it's really cool that you are part of my... What's your favorite part in the film? Isn't that cool? I think one of my favorite parts of the film is a girl for all seasons, because it's so ridiculous.

I'll be your girl for all seasons. John, I'm dressed as a Christmas tree. Absolutely, absolutely. And how many... Sean, how many times have you reenacted Cool Rider on a ladder? A thousand times. Okay. I need to see...

You know, there's somebody online who did that, actually, and I reposted it. Oh, really? There's a guy who reenacts all. every scene. Do you get that a lot in your life that people just know? It's like a cult, like, classic.

Like, people... Yeah, yeah. Is that the thing people do the most from Greece to, like, going outlandish and recreating stuff? You mean... Like, do people come up and quote lines or, like, is that the one that people go,

oh my God, I love, like, Sean, like sort of fan going out? Yeah, yeah. That is... That's a big one. And I guess probably... Well, and then you've got all the people quoting Scarface, which is crazy. But mostly they're quoting Tony Montana, not really me.

And Fabious Baker Boys. Oh, yeah. What about that, Sean? Have you sung on top of a piano? Of course. I pick a nap on top of a piano. Oh, my God. I remember when that movie came out.

I love those guys, too, is so much. I love Bo and Jeff Bridges. What great dudes. And, I mean, just the best. That movie was so good, Michelle. The best. Right? And we will be right back.

And now back to the show. Michelle, like you, you could go on and on and on with all of the incredible things that you have done. Do you take the time ever privately to kind of give yourself a little pat on the back for the longevity, the amount of time you have spent in a relevant position in an industry that's famous for, or it's unpredictability, and it's so sort of fickle. And, like, you have been incredibly well-respected and sought after for probably five times longer than your average actor or actress.

It's just, it's admirable. Don't you find it, I find it, first I'll know. I don't. I'm always surprised, actually, to hear people say that. But I also find today it's really hard to feel relevant in any way because it does feel like, you know. Everybody's famous. Everybody's sort of getting their 15 minutes.

And you kind of, so it doesn't, I don't know, it doesn't feel that way, honestly. Right, but it turns out, it seems like there's, well, there's certainly enough room for you, right? You are still doing that which you want at the pace that you want, it seems, from the outside. I mean, you've got three, you've got the Madison, you've got your show on your Apple TV, you've got a movie coming out as well, right, for Amazon? Like, you're busy. Well, yeah, I'm a little too busy.

I didn't really plan to. Look, I'm so grateful. I'm so grateful because I love acting. I've never lost. In fact, I probably enjoy it more now than I ever have because... Really? Yeah, I'm sort of more relaxed with it. I actually didn't, you know, when I had all of this work,

plus I have a fragrance company that I founded like seven years ago. And so, you know, at a time when I wasn't working all this much. So I don't really have time to be thinking about anything but the task at hand. But when I had all these acting jobs coming up, I thought, okay, okay. How are you going to manage this and have a life? Because that hasn't always been easy for me. I'm an all-or-nothing kind of girl. And when I approach things,

and I always like taking on challenges, and then I get into it, and it's sort of sink or swim. And for whatever reason, I kind of feed on that. maybe not so healthy, I don't know. But so my approach has been, this gets back to why am I enjoying it more now than ever, is I don't have time to, nor the desire to go that deep for that long and not be present.

You know, I really, I realize, you know, I have a finite amount of time left. and um i might i might announce on this show that i became a grandmother last year excellent well done i've been very quiet about it and it is the greatest right it's heaven it's it's it's it's it's heaven it's ridiculous it's um congratulations by the way that's pretty And if I had known that I was going to be a grandmother, I wouldn't have taken on so much work. But I've enjoyed everything and I'm really grateful. I mean, I've loved each of these projects.

And so the weird thing is that sort of giving up that angst about the process has freed me up. And I feel in some ways has made me better. You mean the angst about the process of. actually studying to play that character, doing the research, yada, yada. Oh, I have to know this, and I have to... Right, and no longer. You know, and I have to free a...

I have to personalize this, and I have to, you know... And yes, yes, there's a certain amount of that you have to do, and that's important. Yeah. But then, you know, and then you start, though, but there's something amazing for me about showing up and it's about discovery. Yes, and also I bet you bring more of...

yourself now than ever before. Is that correct? Yes, I think you might be right. Yeah, that's a first. For better or worse, Sean. For better or worse, Sean. Yeah, but I mean like it makes you fearless, more fearless. Yeah, I'll bet Michelle, you would say for better, right?

Because if we're doing things correctly, which it sounds like you are, you become a better and better version of yourself as you get older. and as an actor sort of by a consequence you're bringing more interesting abilities to pretending to be other people so I'll bet your work has gotten even better right? I mean do you watch your own stuff

I mean can you allow yourself to watch yourself and go that's a little bit better than what I did five years ago or 10 years ago or it's hard for me to like my work and watch it and that's the other thing is I used to see every days daily, the work before. Had to see what I was doing, had to see where I was at,

had to know, do I need to make a shift, do I need to? Yeah. And I don't. I just don't anymore. What happened? When did that change? It gradually started shifting. Actually, that was a while ago because I was just torturing myself.

So you didn't like what you were seeing or you got more confident in, You know what? I keep checking, but it's fine. Or were you doing it to punish yourself on a certain level? Do you think? I'm just very, I'm just super critical. Yeah.

Okay. So then you left it and you're like, I'm just going to be mean to myself so I don't even want to look. No, mean to my. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Because I know, no matter what I see, I'm going to find the negative.

I'm going to find the negative. And I'm going to find the negative. day and do it the best way I know how anyway I'm always going to give 110 percent I'm not going to well I guess the danger of looking at it and caring and is if you start watching that and you start relying on that you you run the risk of dragging that and your opinion of that to the next day and it affects what you do not in the way that's constructive but potentially going oh I want to avoid this this this and this, and now you're in some weird loop, you know what I mean?

Yeah, and the other thing about it, too, is that then you become, rather than something happening spontaneously because you're just going with your instincts and you're in the moment, you start copying yourself. Oh, that was really good. That was a really good moment. Ah, and you try to regenerate it. And then you're not in the moment anymore, which is what made it so good. And also what could have made it so bad.

But, you know, that thing about like a painter, like when you paint, sometimes you go, okay, but those moments where you missed led to the good moment. And it's like a painter, it's the same thing because I paint and you have your painting and you have an idea and you start painting and then you make a mistake. And then you have to go about how am I going to fix this? Well, you don't have a plan how to fix it

because you didn't plan on making a mistake. So now you have to just figure that out and it ultimately typically will end up being the favorite part of your painting. And so I think when you're creating, I think that's all part of the process. And so just... I love that you paint.

Of course you're painting. You're going to be cooler. Everything you say is just the one thing's cooler than the next. Wait, Michelle, you work with... By the way, I have a fragrance called Dave. Dave. Come on. Dave.

Well, maybe Dave should meet the David Palibar. Maybe they should be friends. The power bar out of here, we're talking about Michelle's fragrance. What is wrong with you? I do think before we move on, Sean, I really think you should track down the gal in the front row and ask her how you can fix your mistake.

You know? Okay, straighten out your performance and stop putting people to bed. I totally will do that. I totally will do that. Wait, Sean, can't you get in serious trouble? Like, if you're on the stage and you break and you like start talking to the audience,

Isn't that sort of like a time? He hit fuck it 10 years ago, don't worry. He's been trying to get fired off an Oscar for it. No, no, I noticed her dozing off for the first hour of the play while I'm in it. And then I waited until the end of the, at the boughs, when everybody's clapping. Oh, it wasn't in the middle of your performance.

No, no, no, no. Was it the applause that woke her up? I think it was the applause that woke her up. That's funny. That's funny. When I come next week, I'm going to bring. a pillow is it sounds like that's what i need to do wait uh michelle i was going to ask you you know you've worked with so many great directors over the years i mean some just some of the all-time

grades and were you was that a time and was there a time when you were just director-driven or has that shifted what do you what do you look for when you're when you're deciding now director's super important i mean initially you just want a job and and and then once you start getting work and then it's like obviously just choosing the best of what is put in front of you and hopefully you're able to get, you know, pickier and pickier as you go along.

And then, yeah, when you're in a position where you have that kind of choice, it's a tough one, like, is it script? Is it director? I mean, a lot of, I've seen really talented directors make, I would not maybe masterpieces, but great films. out of not so great scripts.

Yeah. And then I've seen maybe in the wrong hands a really great script. Just. Yeah. So. In some ways, I think I would, if I had to choose, I would say director. And then I think the part is, you know, does it kind of just speak to you? I mean, for me, I can hear it.

I can hear it. I can see it. I'm very visual. Does it matter if it's the lead or 7, 6, 7, 8, 9? down the call sheet. If it's a direct-of-year-old... Six, seven, eight, nine. Well, listen, now you're getting in a honey-wagon territory.

You know, I recently have, especially like, you know, working on a Marvel movie or something, and you have a tent on the stage, and you're in a costume, you can't pee, you know, you can't go to the bathroom in unless you... And it's... You know, I've had to beg for a honey wagon size room. I'm like just, I just need a place to go sit

and work on my stuff that has a little tiny toilet you know? Right, right, right. And couldn't have been half years so. Right, right, right. Let me ask you something, this might be like we don't have to go there if you don't want to, but having your breadth

of work over literally decades like amazing work one after another, have you seen a change for the better in either roles for women from the beginning of a career to now or how being a woman in the business has changed at all have you experienced any of that yourself

or have you just been like no it's been I've just been sailing along before you even answer that here's one thing that I just find incredibly impressive about you and you don't have a lot of company in this you have been able to have your talent as an actor overshine your extraordinary beauty from day one, which extends into, you know, I would imagine,

so many interesting roles now as one gets older, the roles get better, and since you never traded just on your looks, there's no end of relevance there. Like, it was always about the talent with you. That's right. That was so delicately walked through and so impressive. I'm in deep sweat.

You're so close to trouble on either side. He is teetering. I'm like he is so teetering on the edge of this. Did I make it? Did I shut up in time? So impressed. Wow. I was just more to the point. It was beautiful. How does it feel being an aging actress in Hollywood?

Why don't you just say it, Sean? No. No. Michelle, I was going to say that I think that you're even cooler than you are, Which is saying a lot. That is the truth. Am I cool? I always feel like. I'm such a nerd.

Very, very cool. Like, pick your scandal in the news, in the news over the last 40 years about this business that we're all in. And a lot of the times it has to do, not all the time, but a lot of it has time to do with women and how they've been mistreated. It's so bad. And so I didn't know if you could speak to that. Shana, you try to get headlines for us? No. Oh, no.

Did he get out of the dark water and get it? The shallow, turquoise. Yeah, we just got out of the deep end, Sean. Now, there you go, diving back in. Wow, that was a lot to unpack, guys. So where do you want me to start? This is your time. How are the roles seem to you?

Better or worse? Well, you know what, they're better, but they're way better. There's so many, like, and mainly that's due to television and streamers, and there's just, the bad news is there's, like, a ridiculous amount of content out there and maybe too much you don't know what to watch a lot of it not so good maybe

but that's always been the case right in our industry and now and so and I feel like I just feel like so much of the good work like the majority of the good work is being done by women I mean extraordinary work

by women and on television I agree and so it's keeping us all working And then I also feel like in terms of performers and entertainment, there has never been a bigger appreciation for women of my age. Yeah. Yeah. And that's super exciting.

And so, yeah, I've seen. But that's what I kind of mean. It's like I don't think that was the case there are 20, 30, 40 years ago, 50 years ago. And you couldn't do TV and movies. Yeah, for sure. Right, right. let alone right right that's a great point you couldn't do a commercial god forbid you should do some you you should sponsor a product or something you will never work again in the movies right like michelle

like when you were making like let's say like 88 it was 88 you made dangerous liaisons or and you're making all the and you're getting nominated so you're nominated for an academy more academy award and then you call your agent you go i'm going to do this tv series they'd be like what are you out of your mind right exactly right and not even that long ago you know i remember like about Oh, maybe 10, maybe it was it 10 years ago. I was talking about, I don't know, I got offered some TV show. And I'm, well, you know, I don't know, that's kind of interesting. And they're like, no, you know, if you do TV, mm-mm.

Really? It was Woody and Matthew McConaughey with True Detective, I remember, was the big, like, oh, wow, these guys are. Oh, they changed the. Yeah, I think McConaughey had just won the Oscar, like five months earlier for Dallas Byers Club maybe. And that was like, what the fuck is going on? I really feel like that was. And before that, obviously, Fincher doing House of Cards on Netflix, too, like just

sort of launching streaming as a place where filmmakers go. So, yeah, it is really, really exciting. You don't think it was me doing the sitcom The Millers after I did Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles? Well, maybe it's, and let me tell you this, this BoJack thing that I'm hearing is coming on soon, right? Yeah, I feel so responsible. When you say tons of bad stuff, I'm like, God, I'm so responsible. Oh, trust me.

Trust me. We've all got our meeting heroes. I've done my share, bad stuff. So then what, so now you're sitting here, you're kind of, you're kind of in the catbird seat because you get to kind of pick and choose. You can do whatever you want. You can do TV and film, and you've got a new appreciation for it. And as you said, you've kind of relieved the pressure of making yourself.

crazy. So when you look at, and, I guess now being a grandparent, now you're a grandmother. Yeah, domestic life is, and it's zenith. Is life work balance the most important? Is that the first decision? Yeah. Yeah. It is. And, you know, now, but it obviously wasn't when I committed to do all this work. I didn't know I was going to be a grandmother then. And, you know, I thought, wow, it's my time now. I can go do what I want to do. Yeah. We'll be right back. And back to the show.

How good are you and your husband at working out this balance? Because that's a tricky part too, because you're both incredibly busy. He's very busy as well, yeah. Yeah. For my sister, for Tracy. Yeah. Please, Sean.

For my sister, who might not know your husband is David Kelly. Oh, okay. I got to say, he's been amazing. And I said to him when, again, all this work was coming up, I'm like, I'm like going to Montana and Texas for four minutes out of the year. I'm like, okay, I am not doing this unless you're with me. And don't say you're with me and then come for like a couple weeks and then go away from him. No, no, you're with me. And he's been with me. And I couldn't have, I couldn't have, because he can ride anywhere. Right, but he's doing, much more than right. He's directing, he's producing, he's doing different stuff.

Show running. He doesn't direct. Well, sort of by proxy at times, yes. Maybe, no. Well, he's pretty, he's pretty, I just worked for, I just worked with him for the, I just worked for him, with him for the first time really on Margot's Got Money Troubles. And I did, it was so fun. And I was very, I've never been really eager to work with him because,

I so cherish my marriage and sometimes that's the kiss of death to work together and don't be on the cover of People magazine together because you'll be divorced next year. Oh my God. So, I mean, how many times have we seen that?

Right, 100 times. So it was nerve-wracking as it approached, yeah? Did you guys lay down any sort of like, listen, this is how, you could trigger me if you do this, and I know that I may trigger you if I do it. Well, he sort of set a boundary early on

when I was asking maybe too many questions. Do you really think she'd say that, David? And he's like, you know, I think that's a good question for the director. After he did that a couple times, I'm like, okay, I get it. I get it. And that was actually really good. But the truth is, this character is so well written. It's like I was born to play this part.

Really? She is like a real housewife of Fullerton wannabe. I grew up in Orange County. Yeah. I love, love, love her. Her name is Cheyenne, and she works at Bloomingdale's in the cosmetics department. That's brilliant. And single mom, Elle, Elle Fannie is my daughter.

I didn't get it. No, no. You can move on, John. I just found out. Anywho. So, it was, and also, gosh, how often do you get to work in Los Angeles and stay home? Yeah. I don't know where you guys live.

Will you, I don't think you're... Are you shooting? You're not shooting. You thought you'd go in Montana at shooting. But I'm not shooting right now. Okay. I'm going to Montana. When you worked with David, it was in L.A.

It was in L.A. Right. Got it. Okay, great. So, Michelle, I, sometimes I do this and I ask people who have, as Sean said, such a wide, sort of huge breadth of work, is there a role Is there a, not a role,

maybe a role, role and or film that you did of one of these great films, is there one, do you have a favorite? And it's okay. I don't. I mean, I have,

I have a few that are of my favorites. But it's then it's bad if I don't mention some and then the director's going to be like, oh, you didn't mention mine. Let's assume that you love them all. Let's assume you love them all, but you love one.

No, there's the film that I actually love the most, and then there's the performance that maybe I don't hate. Right. And then there's the experience that I have the best time on. All three, all three. All three. All three of those. Experience would be, I think, a toss-up of married to the mob,

and honestly, Margot's got money troubles. It was just a ton of fun. And my favorite film, maybe Baker Boys, maybe. Yeah, yeah. So good. And that might be my favorite performance as well. Oh, double did. As well.

Might be. So famous, too. I think that would make a great sequel, like, where are these people? Yes. Right? Oh, yes. That's a great idea. And I can't get Steve to do it.

So, anyway. Just say David will take care of it. Yeah. Can I ask you, can I just nerd out just for a second? Are we going back to Greece soon? Yeah, Greasy just because I never got. Just like a couple questions because I'm never going to happen again in my life. Sorry, Michelle, this is where we take questions from fans.

Go ahead. Go ahead, caller. No, like, what was it like knowing how big the first one was? And then were you like scared to do this to be in the sequel, to be like, oh my God, Greece was such a. a massive thing. No, come on. It was a big deal to me as a kid.

No, it's a really good question. And, of course, I was terrified. Yeah, but you were so good in it. You were so good. You know, but, you know, look, it's John Travolta, Olivia Newton, John, and, you know, and it was, you know, the first one, and it was amazing and such a cult following

and so successful. And then you got me and this kid, and Mack, they don't know who we are, and they're taking out ads that say too hot. And I'm like, don't say that. What if they don't think I'm hot, okay? Like, don't tell them I'm hot. Anyway.

So it was, it was, it was, yeah. Was it fun to make? Yeah, dancing and singing. I loved all that because I do love to dance and I love to sing. But I don't consider. Stop sweating. I don't. It's so, we could see you sweating.

We can see the town. just below the frame, Sean? God damn it. Fuck. Cool it off, man. As soon as she mentioned Maxwell Colfield, it just exploded. By the way, you know,

I wanted it for you and I stayed for Maxwell. A couple bars, Sean. It was really more about Max. Name a song, I know I have a lot of words. Opener. Give us the opener, Sean. Medley. No, what's the opener?

What's the opening song? School's out for, no, is it school? It was about a school. Oh, God, I can't remember. The Ramones, isn't it? School's up for summer? Yeah, no, it was this. It was this.

That's right. That's right. Shaking it up. I still have my bowling ball. No, you don't. I do. And the bowling ball case. We're going to scone on tonight.

That's it. We're going to rock, we're going to roll. We're going to bop, we're going to bowl. We're going to scorn, scorn, scorn, scone. Oh, God. So good. I love it. Yay, well done.

Michelle, do you grab a little keepsake from every single job? Yeah. Not always. Not always. Sometimes there's not... You have the dress from Baker Boys? You know, I don't. Oh, are you going to get that dress?

I have some of the costumes from married some mom. I don't always keep them because... What about a script? They just take up room. Do you keep the script? I keep my scripts. Okay, so you've got a stack of them like on a wall somewhere? Do you have them like bound and stuff like that?

No, they kind of got mildewy. Yeah. And I've been trying to clean them. Do you archive stuff? No, I just... No, I don't, I just don't have time. It's all up here, right? Yeah.

Yeah. I like that. I like that you don't. I do want to fall up before we let you go, because Jason obviously has a time crunch. Yeah, he's a hard crunch. He's got to get out, man. Because he's got to get up. And Jason, by the way, I was meaning, I was meaning to say, I'm sorry, maybe are you going to a doctor to address your gastrointestinal issues?

Yeah, well, you know, the back is so stiff when I get up in the morning. It just sometimes the valve gets a little loose. I understand. Yeah. Damn it, man. Michelle understands. Okay? We're all chopped a little.

We're all chopped, baby. We're all chopped. That's a good T-shirt. We're all chopped. Great show. Great show, by the way. Chopped. Wait, Will, you had a killer closer.

Go ahead. No, not a killer closer, but I just want to ask you because we briefly touched upon Scarface that became this huge, of course, iconic, film, Brian DePama, you and Al Pacino.

I didn't care for it. We have a rogue Italian critic in the back of the theater in the process of getting kicked out. Finally a question about Scarface! So, you couldn't have imagined I imagine what the cultural impact that

Scarface had and continues to have to this day. I mean, it's just, it's phenomenal, right? We're talking about remaking it, right? Or doing another? I think they're, I did hear something about that. Was it a television show or was it a new movie? I forget, but I did, that was a couple years ago, no? Yeah, yeah.

It comes up every once in a while. I think Universal and Anton Fuqua, maybe. I mean, I didn't have any idea it would become sort of a culture phenomenon in the way that it, and in the way that it did, too. It became this sort of cult kind of following. And so, and that was, and that was, boy, that was really intense for me. I think, I want to say the shooting went on for six months. It went over, like a couple of months.

And I was playing a Coke addict, so I was not eating. Oh, yeah. And I kept getting skinnier and skinnier. Jason, anything? The crew were bringing me bagels and kind of, and. We're going to have to reshoot about 20 pages. Will you please eat something? Well, and then the scene at the end, you know,

where she's in the restaurant and, like, kind of strung out and at her worst kept getting pushed and pushed and pushed. And that was the scene where I really wanted to look my worst. Anyway. And it was also very, other than Mary Elizabeth, Master Antonio, like, we were the only women. And it was these, you know, it was like guys, you know. It was like, and gangster guys.

And, you know, machismo, and they were all kind of, you know, a little bit in character all the time. Brian to Palmer, right? So, and Brian, yeah. And I was 20, I was so young. I mean, again, the last credit. I was 23. I think the last credit I had was Greece too. Wow.

And I just didn't have a lot of experience under my belt. And I was terrified. Wow. Every night, I was terrified. Mm. So. A lot of that was in Florida. right

no let's see a lot of it was in L.A. Oh yeah? Most of it was in L.A. on stage and we did some

Florida location stuff but terrified terrified because of the newness of your career yeah? I didn't feel

worthy I didn't feel like I had the chops I didn't have any experience behind me I had no I had zero confidence

and Al will admit this want me for the part, and I auditioned, I think, for a couple of months for it, and I knew he didn't want me going into it. Really? And one of my favorite stories is when I actually made him bleed

during my screen test. How so? Wait, how so? I think, okay. Don't you want to just end there? No. No. What a story? It's a good cliffhanger.

God damn it. Okay, so I'll try to make it brief. So I'm having to audition. First of all, I come in, I do a great reading for Brian De Palma and the casting director. And I was like, it just was a good, it just happened to be good. Then they want to bring me back to meet Al.

And anyway, over the course of two months, I just get worse and worse and worse because I'm just afraid. Yeah. And by the end, I'm bad. And I don't blame him. He just, he's like, I'm bad. And Brian finally comes to me and says, When, you know, you know, Dahl, it's just, it's just not going to work out.

I'm like, I know, man, I'm sorry. Because Brian really wanted me. This is what's wrong with the audition process? Is it just, the stakes get so high you can't do good. Yeah, as disappointed, well, you know that fear is the worst, is an actor's enemy. It's just as completely undermines you. So as much as disappointed as I was, I was so happy to be done with it. So, like, at least a month goes by

And I get a call, they want to bring me into screen test And I'm like, oh, so So I show up, and I don't even give shit Because I know I'm not getting this part. Sure, yeah. So when you get them. That's sexy indifference. So show up.

It was my best work of the film. Of course. And it's that restaurant scene where I, explode at the end, and I swipe the table of the dishes, and glasses break, the dishes break, cut. There's blood everywhere. Uh-oh. And they all run over to me to see where I've cut myself.

Yeah, your hands. Well, I didn't cut me. I cut Al. Wow. No. Wow. I thought, well, there goes that part. And he's just staring at you.

Anyway, actually, I think that was the day he was like, yeah, yeah, yeah. Really? Your womb. I think, yeah, she's not bad. Charlie, yeah. And so, wait, wow, so was it, did you cut him bad and? I cut his, I think I cut him in the finger or something. Wow, wow.

And you went for it. You went for it. That's why, yeah, I love that. I love that. Wow. There's the lesson. Yeah. There's the lesson.

You got to give a little less shit. Yeah, and if I went for it more, people wouldn't fall asleep in the front row. Exactly. Once you start breaking some glass, you know, make them say hello to your little friend. Make sure the front road's bleeding, Shawnee. Come on.

So before you show up, you know, to do your performance, just that's your mantra. I don't give shit. I don't give a shit. I'll cut everybody. Oh, don't worry. You watch the performance. Just cut them all.

That's covered. Well, he's chewing. Yeah, Michelle, thank you. We have taken up, again, way too much of your time. And Jason is late for his meeting. Thanks, guys. That's all right. It's really fun.

Michelle, what a pleasure. Thank you so much for doing this. Huge pleasure for me, too. You're the greatest. It's such a thrill. Such an honor, truly. Thank you so much for having me. Thank you.

Thank you. Have a great rest of the day. Okay. Until I see you again. Bye, bye, bye. Am I supposed to do something? Do you slam your laptop, closed and disgust? Okay.

Bye, bye, bye, bye, bye, bye, bye, thanks. Well, Will. Okay, okay. So I pulled it off, huh? I pulled out of pretty. Pretty, pretty nice. Yeah, no kidding. Did that cost you any money?

Like, you gotta, you gotta pay to get guests like that. I mean, she, I mean, God, how great is she? I love her. Cool. Yeah. I know, I know. I am cool. She's great, like.

Did I seem nervous? No, that is, wow, what a cool lady. I know. From the talent and the looks and everything she has, she's just a cool thing. Like so down to earth, so cool, just, it's just amazing. Got it all. And then, Jason, you did put it really well,

which is like, or was it one of you talking about... It was probably me. About how she's such a great performer. She's such a great actress, that that is the thing that shines through. Yeah, you always went for the acting, and the beauty was just sort of just a great little sidecar, as opposed to, there are some actors, male and female,

that people do go to see like, oh, look, I want my handsome movie star, you know, and I just want to, yeah, you know, and then you leave. And it's like, you know, there was no performance stays with you, but you like the eye candy. She's just like, she's an incredible actor. Do you think that was okay that I brought up Greece 2 so much? Oh, we'll cut that out.

Yeah. All of them. Oh, we'll cut all, most of your stuff. By what measure do you mean okay? Like it was embarrassing. No, I know. Like, I couldn't tell you. I mean, embarrassing for you and it was awkward for her.

Yeah, she was clowning you the whole time. Yeah. Yeah, that movie was so huge to me. No, we don't need more. We don't need more. No, I'm actually jealous. I never saw that one. I saw the first grease seven times in a row.

Just sitting in my theater chair with my sister. Just a couple weeks ago? Out in the valley. This was, what? We were probably 11, 12, something like that. Well, were you like sharing a bag? What was going on? The only reason we left is because the lighter ran in a butane.

So we're like, well, let's get the fuck out here. This is out in the West Valley in the early 80s, and it was cheap. Stuff was cheap. So, yeah, yeah. There's no way, there's no other reason you would stay and watch it seven times in a row. the theater's cool you don't want to be sweating while you're tweaking out there in the valley

let John and Olivia just kind of serenade you while you just watch it again watch it again watch it again that is hilarious oh and you watched it that many times before you said oh god

well I listen to the hard out yeah before I turned to my sister it's like somebody grabbed the wheel of a bus like somebody in a passenger just reached up and grabbed the wheel. My stop. What? What?

Say goodbye? Yeah. Oh my God. Wait, well, Sean, if you were to say bye in a grease

type of song. Oh, here we go. How was that? Bye, bye, bye, bye,

bye, bye, bye, bye, bye, bye, bye, by,

bye, bye, everybody knew their role. Yeah. Everybody knew their role. Smart. Nice. smart less smartless is 100% organic and artisanly handcrafted by Bennett Barbico Michael Grant Terry and Rob Armjarf