SmartLess - "Shawn Levy"

Episode Date: August 15, 2022

Talk about great hair… it’s Shawn Levy comin’ through from a Hungarian hotel to educate us on cinematic heft and settle-down hands. We try to quit him, but we can’t, because as Shawn L. would say: “when the tan fades, I’m concerned.” Bienvenue à MoinsIntelligent.Please support us by supporting our sponsors!See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Hey guys, get ready to get your socks knocked right back onto your feet. I don't think that's a saying, and if that's your attempt at an intro, we just lost half the audience. Will your turn? Get ready to get your socks knocked back onto your feet, because that'd be a hell of a podcast. What were you thinking about? Come on.

Were you trying to do an intro? Yeah, that was good. It's because I reversed that. Hey there. Get ready to get your socks knocked back on. Hey, get ready to get your hair blown back onto your hips. Like what? This is going to unblow your mind, right?

This is going to tighten your socks and lace up on your shoes. God damn it. Just say, welcome to SmartLess. Welcome to SmartLess. Hey, welcome everybody. Hey guys, hey, how excited are you? I will. Have you ever had apple juice and ice like this?

It tastes really delicious. Is that what you washed down your egg salad with? Yeah, a little bit. I had a little bit of eggs today and a bagel with cream cheese. Wait, wait, wait, wait. If we turned you inside out, will we just see a big American flag? Yeah, absolutely. Don't bless your heart.

Sean, so what did you start with today? You started with the bagel? What? I did half of the bagel. A full bagel. A full bagel. Half is cream cheese, half is butter. Okay.

But it's plain. It's plain, right? Make no doubt. It's a plain bagel? It's a plain bagel. Do you ever try to save the time, because you've got to slice it and put it. Just take a bite of the bagel and then just a big sliver of cream cheese. And put it both ways.

Eat that and then some butter, just straight down the hatch. It'd be faster, that's for sure. Right, because you're wasting a lot of time, it seems like. But you're a plain bagel eater. I don't know any of you. Well, why? Why are you? You're going to put stuff on it.

Why have it in there? That's like just eating straight white bread. Most people go for some kind of a flavor. No, you put the flavor in the sandwich. But have you not tried an onion bagel, sesame bagel, poppy seed bagel, everything bagel? No. No, but have you ever tried it? No, I can smell it, so then therefore I've tried it.

You've never tried it? No, I've only eaten plain bagels. I mean, it's undeniably better than just a flat tasting piece of round white bread. Okay, look, I'll try it. I'm open to it. You're 52 years old. At least. I know.

The thing I'd like to get you in on is this torture that Will has dropped me into this torture chamber that Sam Jones, our friend who directed the behind the scenes tour thing of Smart List. The special that's coming out. Yeah. Yeah. And then also one of our guests, Matt Damon, is also involved in the torture chamber. So it's kind of a smart list torture chamber.

Oh, you're talking about portal? And the only person missing is you and also Scott. I'll do it. We're doing this. Yeah. We do the wordal, quartal and octordal every morning. Yeah. And then we have to do an aggregate score and it's torturous.

Well, I have an issue with the octordal people. And listener, this is the eight puzzles. But they think of these like we get it. You're bright. You come up with these words that no one's ever heard of, but that's a hat on a hat. It's already difficult to figure out the eight words. We don't need to also figure out words in a basically a different language. Can I just say something, man?

It's hard to figure out the five letter word. Can I just say something, Jason? Good for you, man. Good for you for standing up. I need to finally speak out. I've been afraid to speak out because I don't want blowback. Hey, have you guys ever played Mafia? Remember I talked about Mafia like a year ago?

It's not a word game. Are you just doing loose association of ideas? No. I'm dead. Us finishing talking is not your cue to come up with a different subject. No, I was telling you what I was doing last night. Speaking of. We played Mafia because you guys were talking about games.

Our guest today, guys, you see that? Well, we're just going to get right into it. Are you tired of talking? Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, no, no, no. But it's just this person. They didn't even say like, hello. Because this man is a director.

What? And there are very few. Jason, I love bringing directors in for you because I just, you get all giddy and all. I just got nervous. I asked him how he sets up shots and how he lights certain angles. And he's not just a director. He's a director of some of the biggest comedies and the biggest films of all time. Incredible blockbusters.

And also has produced some of the biggest, if not arguably the biggest now television show. Certainly in Netflix history. Question mark. Question mark. This is somebody who's Canadian. This is somebody showing that Jason, you've worked with. Talk about nice hair. Hairy toes.

Great hair. I can't wait to see the outfit. There's this little giggle. I'm ready. All right. How about this guy? How about this guy? Hi, guys.

Are you in, it looks like you're in a sort of an economical hotel. It's just a Hungarian hotel. Are you in a hotel? I'm in a hotel room where I have lived for four and a half months in Budapest, which is the longest I've ever been on location and the furthest that I've ever been on location and probably the last time that I will go this far away for this long. But hi, friends. Hi, Sean.

Why are you there? Oh, you're lucky listeners. This is a good man. Yeah, this is great. Talk in. I can't wait to talk about Stranger Things. I can't wait to talk about all the movies. This is so exciting.

But Sean, I feel like there's no way we can let go today without, I feel like we at a moment, apparently in a casting session of a night of museum. Because yes, I've listened to every episode. That's right. I've already gotten into Bateman's anti-turtle neck manifesto, but I handle that off air. But yeah, you're one of the three people that can pull it off. Yeah. Well, to remind the viewers, or the viewers, the listeners that I auditioned for one of

the night of the museum's movies. Which part? And you were so kind to call me in. Which part? And it was for Napoleon, I think. Oh, huh. Yeah. And then Walk got that part, didn't he?

Who did? Walkine. It's just an inside joke. He just wrapped it. He just wrapped it. Oh, that's right. He played Napoleon. He's playing Napoleon.

Really, Scott. Yeah. Pushing away. Went a different way with it. I went in with a bunch of ideas and like a dickwad and you were like looking at me like, uh-huh, maybe you can direct it too. Oh, really? No, but I feel like, no.

So, yeah. Sean, did you come with that line? I think I might have, according to Sean Hayes, Sean Levy, a young Sean Levy said, oh, did you want to direct it too? But here's the thing, Sean, you don't know me that well. I don't do dry. Sean, you don't play dry. So I think I was going, that's like an Arnett move.

That's a Bateman fucking superpower. But as you know, and as you can probably tell already, I don't do dry very well. It did make me chuckle. But I think I'm not sure the humor came across because I was off tone. And now I've learned to stay in my lane. I like to be obvious with my humor. But while we're overseas though, let's get back to hungry. What are you doing in Hungary?

And you've been there four and a half months. I'll bet it's something fabulous. Let's hear it. It is something fabulous. And so that is kind of what gets me through it. I am doing, there was a book, I don't know if any of you read it, called All the Light We Cannot See. I don't know.

We just finished it. And this book came out, for real? No. See? I don't do dry. That's a callback. Also used in comedy. Sean Levy, just so you know, if you ever reference a book again, neither of them has read a book

in years. I read, by the way, I read three this week. Go ahead. Okay. Well, there was a book. There was a book called All the Light We Cannot See. It won the Pulitzer Prize and it was the best seller like seven years ago. And they were going to do it as a movie and I couldn't even get a meeting on it.

And then I kind of waited and waited because I'm all about the long-term goals. And I found out about three years ago that the rights were available and I chased it and I said to the novelist, what if we do it as a limited series? Because that is such, you know, in the seven years and you get all your book in there. It's exactly right. And so then I decided to direct all of the episodes myself. So I am here. It's intense.

Wow. How many episodes? There's, it's only four episodes, but it's like a 90 day shoot, which is even the, even my biggest movies are 70 day shoots. What's that? What's the elevator pitch? Like, what's it about? It's World War II.

It's a blind French girl and her father who are running from the Nazi invasion in France and they're living in a coastal city in France. Her dad is Mark Ruffalo. Her uncle is Hugh Laurie and I cast, I decided I wanted to do this with an actress who was actually blind. Oh, wow. So we did a global search and we found this, this young woman named Aria Liberte who has never even auditioned for a part and she is legally blind.

And as you can imagine, it has been unlike any shoot that I've ever done. Now, Sean, not to get into a leavey, not to get into the weeds, but so when you have a legally blind actor, what do you do about like, if you have a real specific mark that an actor needs to hit because of technical issues with a dolly move or light or something like that? Like, how do you get around that? Well, very often what we do is you put a little piece of rope on sandbags, sandbag is a tripping hazard.

I've learned that the hard way. So you literally put a little piece of twine underneath tape and the truth is when you don't have sight, you're all your other senses you use so intensely, including touch and use your feet as other things that can feel. So she finds her mark with her feet. She, when she asks where the camera is, she's asked us to, we literally will snap where the camera is because she uses sound to echo, locate and map the room. That's fascinating.

Every day is fascinating. We have this kind of 20-something playing the grown-up version of this character, Marie, and we have this seven-year-old who is also blind named Nell, who we found in a small town in Wales and she is playing the younger version. And so you've got these experienced people like Ruffalo and Hugh Laurie and, you know, it's this big epic World War II kind of drama. How is the young woman playing the blind character? She is in her mid-twenties and the younger is now seven.

So that's got to be wild for somebody in their mid-twenties, not only just an actress with sight, but an actress without sight, learning the ropes of camera, blocking, lighting, like cues, and just all of that. It's fascinating. Well, we've all had visitors come to a set at some point and you see that people don't understand this strange workplace that is not like any kind of normal workplace. So she's got that, but she's also, she's never even acted. She never even was aspiring to act.

She found out about this search from a teacher she had when she was 11 and she sent in an iPhone video out of hundreds and she made it round after round after round after round and then she got the part. Well, let me ask you this, because this makes sense. She obviously, she's never seen a film or a television program by virtue of her not having the power of sight. But has she? Thanks for putting that together, Will.

Yeah, but well, I was going to say, well, no, I mean, sometimes you got to connect the dots for me. No, now I'm with you, Will. Obviously, it stands to reason, but I was going to say, is she aware of this? Yes, what I was asking, has she heard a lot of that stuff? Is she in touch with stuff in that way? Very much. Yeah.

Like she's seen every Marvel movie. She came into this. She had, I did a movie two years ago called Free Guy that she'd seen a bunch of times. She knows stranger things. So she is very steeped in pop culture, but she's not watching it. She is, she is using audio description and she loves it, but it's just in a different way. So that's how I watch Ozark with my eyes closed.

Same thing. And so an act, well, at least I'll speak for myself. I watch what I do and learn how to be better by noticing the things that I don't do well. If I didn't have my eyes, I wouldn't be able to see that. So how does one become a good actor if you've never seen not only what good actors do, but how you look when you feel an emotion, how knowing how that comes across, how you're able to. And that's the crux of it.

That's literally, we go through this almost every day where she'll play a scene and she might play it great, but maybe she's doing stuff with their face that is too busy. And she doesn't see herself or other actors. And she's never seen a smile. She's never seen different versions of a smile. And she's not seen herself in a mirror. So it is profound every day. And so what I, what she's learned is, oh, okay, understand where the camera is.

Like we've all learned, calibrate what you're doing based on the size of your face on that screen. And the size of the lens. And she'll ask is, and I've taught her like, like mini film school book and like the some medium shot. I'm at your waist. Then we're going to move the camera and suddenly it's more head to toe so you can be a little freer.

But what I've learned also, I mean, I've directed 13 movies now and I hadn't, and Jason, I've directed you obviously, but like, I use my face to direct so much. So like, I might say cut, Jason, let's, and I'll make a face, right? And I'll indicate what I want in the next day. I got that one a lot from you. That was listener. That was a, that was a not so much face. I got that from, from Sean a lot like, Hey, great, Jason, but it's kind of, it's, it's

suggesting 180 degrees, like the absolute opposite of whatever you're doing. Can we just flip it or, or we have that. We have that. No, I prefer this. We got that one. We got that version. That's high eyebrows. We have that.

Thank you. That's high eyebrows. And I'll do this hand gesture. Like when Kobe used to make a shot and run back to play D and he do this settled down hand. Just the settle. Yeah. Yeah.

And so some of that would just go to, I'm like, Hey, Jason, Jason, and I would just kind of like push my palms downward to, to stuff down. This is a dramatic scene. Yeah. Easy on the comedy. Now, Sean, is it because of like, you know, Canadians are known for just being the nicest people in the world, but you have this energy about you because we had a breakfast like decades ago and you were so charming and so funny and so witty.

And you, you have this infectious joy, joyous energy. I'm sure I'm not the only person ever say that that you must so good to be around. Yeah. That, that just must create this atmosphere on set. It's just a statement. I have no question. I just, I just find you incredibly joyful. It's real too.

It's, you know, you go, you don't, you don't know how somebody, how somebody really is until you, until you either play around a golf with them or you work a long schedule on a movie because you can't hide in those situations. I guess my question to that is what, when you're filmmaking, what really gets under your skin because I can't see you throwing a fit or getting angry. Well, it's funny because a mutual friend of a bunch of ours, I heard Ryan Reynolds to your show and I've now done two movies in a row with Ryan and his favorite thing, thank you.

His favorite thing is when he's like, Oh, Sean, Sean, he's going dark, Sean, he's going dark. And the truth is my version, well, you probably have Jace, but it's like, maybe the extent of his like, guys, we got to go. We got, why are we not shooting? But I just get more absurd. My voice gets a little screechy and I use my hands even more so, but you know, I think, I mean, I know a little bit about your backstory, Sean, because I've listened to smart lists

and I just, like my mom, she liked the bottle and it was not always an easy childhood. And I just, I feel like I just willed myself towards happiness, like I'm not going to have a sad life. I'm going to have a happy life and I want the things I make to put that in the world. Was dad around growing up or? He was around and I would go over, you know, like for two days a week. And then when I was 13, I moved in with him and my stepmom and that family full time because I just, I needed to kind of be safe.

Was this a Montreal, Sean? Yeah. Yeah. It was a Montreal. So your parents were split from when you were very, very, very young? Yeah. From the time I was three. Oh, wow.

And I didn't, it's weird because I didn't even, I never even talk about that stuff because A, who cares and B, some sense of privacy. But now that I'm, you know, in the middle part of my life, I see like everyone's like, I'm doing a drama now, right? I've done a lot of comedies and, but what I've, what I've found is I just want to take feeling and put it on screen. And plus you're like an incredible dad too with incredible daughters and incredible life and like.

I've had a lot of practice. I have four daughters. Yeah. And we will be right back. And now back to the show. So you have four, how old are your daughters? They are 22 down to 11, so 22, 20, 15, 11. So it's, and a wife of 28 years.

And so it's, I mean, it says it all, are they with you in Hungary? They're not with you in Hungary. Actually, you know what? They, they, they mostly not been, but they were here until a few hours ago. And literally my wife's parting words to me when I dropped out for the airport is she's like, don't push it on smart lists. Yeah. She literally, she knows that the more I love something, and this circles back to your question

about like on set, I do tend to be pretty energetic because I love being there. I love your show. I've never, I told your producers like, I don't do, I can't think of doing press with something I love. And I've listened to pretty much every episode and it feels so authentic and funny as shit. And I'm really thrilled to be here. It's such a fit right in. Well, that's very kind of you to say, we're surprised always.

I was telling my buddy Todd and down in St. Bart's good friend of mine. We're always surprised that, that people listen to, to the show. So thank you. I will say, I want to ask you a little bit about, so you're in Montreal and how does a guy from Montreal go on to direct huge movies and be like Sean Levy for Tracy? Let's just write a lot. I know. Cause I feel like Tracy and many of your listeners like, who is this?

No. And that's okay. Cause here's one of the things, when I start to describe who it is and I start listing off your credits, then I know that immediately Bateman and Hayes are going to get it really quickly. So I'm trying to do it. So you directed 13 films, some of which are all the night of the museum movies. Yeah.

Did you direct cheaper by the dozen? I did. Yeah. Free guy. You did. The reason one was called the Adam project. You also directed stranger things. Stranger things is the, the weird, it started with a conversation with you, Jason, cause

we did a movie called this is where I leave you. And in my experience, when, when you think you're making the thing that's going to change everything, it ain't the thing that's going to change everything. Right. So true. Right. So like, cause I was the family comedy guy and I done like pink panther and she by the dozen and date night and night museum.

And I found this book called this is where I leave you and I chased it for five years and I got the cast of my dreams. It's Jason with Adam driver and Jane Fonda and Ben Schwartz and Catherine Hawn and Tina Faye. It was ridiculous. It was like a murder's row every day in the little house, Corey Stoll and no one went to their trailer. We stayed in the house and we, we just, we shot 28 days and it was great.

And then it didn't do very well. And I then had to do a panel and Jason was the moderator and I was, I was hurting cause when you fail in this job, it's public and it hurts and all of us have felt it. And I was like, Jason, I don't know if I can kind of like turn it on tonight. And he said, he goes, Hey, we made someone's favorite movie. Might be one persons, might be a couple of dozen, but this movie, the people who are seeing it and who it resonates for, they're going to hold onto it. And it was this revolution.

You don't even remember this conversation, Jason, but it was, I had lived and died by the sword of box office for so long. There was one metric of success, what's your opening weekend? What's your worldwide growth, right? And I made those kinds of movies and I had a good run, but that was the beginning of, wait, maybe there's other measurements of why you do things. And there's other movies that don't lend themselves to popcorn box office, you know? And there are plenty of movies that you know in the history of the cinema, if I can borrow

that term from a bunch of young actors who have no reason or right to use it, give me a fucking break. It's like, I hear a guy going, in the cinema, I'm like, you grew up in a fucking trailer in Florida, shut the fuck up. But there have been a lot of, you know, there are a lot of, I guess my point is this, Sean, if you're ever trying to figure out how to deal with getting kicked in the nuts and show business and how do you deal with it, just call me, man, because I've got tons of experience. It's almost all I've had, and I always joke that if it wasn't for bad movies, I wouldn't

have made any at all. So if you ever want to make yourself feel better, ever, just fucking call me. And you just go, oh, I'm a fucking success, what am I talking about? I just talked to Ernette, what a loser. Wait, Sean, can I ask, because you couldn't tell by his tan, though. The guy looks like a trillion dollars. You got Paul Anka type of tan going right now. Thank you.

Another great Canadian. Yeah, that's deep. But I need to fan out. But so wait, hang on, we never answered this. So you've got me. But Sean, are you going to remember your question or shit you want to ask? Yes, I'll remember. I was just going to say that at the end of that year, 2014, that happened.

I made the last night museum movie, and then Robin Williams, with whom I'd made three movies over 10 years, died. And I was just knocked out. And I said at that point, like, I'm going to say no for a while and see what happens. I'm going to have, because I've done a movie a year for a decade, and in that breath came a rival. Yes. What are my favorite movies in all time?

And in that same moment came Stranger Things. And those things changed everything and have changed everything since. I was going to mention, those are the two, I mean, Arrival's one of my favorite movies of all time. I've seen it like 10 times. I mean, have you guys seen it? Yeah, I've seen Arrival. But I want to get back to Sean, before we get into that, I want to get back to right

that moment you were just saying, that that moment changed your life. It was a shift of perspective that you had. Yes. Right? And once you were able to kind of get out, as you said, stop chasing this thing. Stop looking for that. Stop looking to measure your own success. We've talked about this based on what you do or how you do in the box office.

But more, I'm going to say no, because I'm going to find something, because I don't know anymore. And in a certain way, you just kind of, it's that ability to just let go and surrender to the process and just go, fuck it, I don't know. And also just to, like, why did you guys start Smart List? Because as near as I can figure, you wanted to see what it was like, right? The pandemic was happening and who knows if this will be something. I remember texting with Jason early on, no one knew if it would become something.

You did it because you wanted to and it seemed like it would be fun and interesting. Right here, yeah. The same thing, Stranger Things, no one wanted that show. I wasn't even in the TV business. I'm a movie director and these boys, these duffers came in with the best script I'd ever read and I literally brought them into my office and I said, I don't know what's going to happen if anyone will watch it, but I definitely want to help you get it made. I'm sure I'm not the last or the first person to say this, but it gave me a lot of my childhood

back. It was like, that's exactly how I live. Hopefully you're the last to say that, I mean, I know you're not the first, but I would ride my bike to my friend's house, we'd play Dungeons and Dragons and it was like, so cool. But so Sean, it was just another example of how keen your eye is for stuff that is going to be appealing for many, many, many people in addition to the fancy folks, because the fancy folks love all the commercial movies that you've done, including Stranger Things, but these things all get great reviews too.

So what is it about, we can just take Stranger Things for an example, you said you're not sure if people are going to watch it, but you definitely saw something of value there to push forward and want to champion it. So what was it about that show and your eye in general that can find the populist thing that also is married to kind of the sophisticated thing? Well, I think the populist thing is if it has a theme that I think everybody wrestles with, that's what I say yes. So Stranger Things, yeah, it was about a missing kid in another dimension, a monster, but it's

really an anthem to outcast. That is about the AV club, the people who don't fit in, who find each other and their connection is their superpower. That's everybody, every human has felt at points, whether as kids or teens or as adults, like, wait, where is my place in this constellation of people for whom life seems so much fucking easier? And when I just have a feeling that a lot of people can relate to an idea, to a theme, those are the ones they said yes to, like I said no to Free Guy five years ago when

I read it as a script, but when Ryan read it and called me over and said, look, I'm not a big gamer either, but it's about someone who feels helpless in their world. It's about an actual literal background character living in a world that is shitty and they feel powerless in it and considers that maybe they can do something in it. That's the theme of Free Guy. That's why I did Free Guy. The gaming stuff helps sell it, but it's not why we made it. So I'm always looking for theme, and that's what it was on Stranger Things.

I love that. Such a great success story. It changed so much. It came along at the right time. Where is Stranger Things now? It's second to last season, question mark? Yes. In fact, by the time people are listening to this conversation, we will have launched

volume two of our fourth season. So we launched seven episodes called volume one, and we're doing only one more season. You're going to do another season after this one? Yes. We are doing season five, and that will be the last. Wow. That's super cool. Are you going to get in there and direct any of those?

Always. Always. Every season you have. Correct. Every season I have directed episode three and four, and some of it is superstition. But it started off, the idea when we sold it to Netflix was the Duffers wanted to direct all of them. And they were directing the first few episodes, and it became clear that they were never

going to finish writing the season. So I basically said, I'll come to Atlanta where we film, and I'll do a couple of episodes, go hibernate with the script. So I came in, and I ended up doing episodes that, you know, the Christmas lights episode in season one. Yeah, yeah. There are moments that, I mean, I've never directed horror, but what I love about the job, it's probably what you do too, Jason, which is, okay, what tone does this story

want? Yeah. Right? There's some directors like Wes Anderson or Baz Lerman, where their stamp is the same on everything they make. Right. That's not the kind of director I am. I'm going to change, the free guy looks different than the Atom Project.

Right. Looks different than Night of the Museum. So I'm always, and I learn new visual muscles, or I gain more visual muscles on stranger things, and ever since then, two episodes a season, and that'll be the same thing next year. That's so cool. So cool. It's that Spielbergian type of cinematic approach that, you know, your stuff has always

looked great, but there's a muscularity to the way in which those duffers established kind of that cinematic heft. Well, do you know what it is? It's interesting, Sean was saying it brought back a certain period of his life, me too. The duffers were born in 84. So for me, I'm doing a nostalgia trip, right? But their show, what they're doing is the movies of the 80s that they watched on VHS in the 90s.

That's right. That's the love letter they're doing. That's right. I'm doing a love letter to my high school years. So right. Right. And it's interesting that we have different access points, and now my stepmom who's in her mid-70s loves the show and so do my daughters.

And that's the unicorn thing about Stranger Things is the demographic crossover. Let me ask you something about comedy, because, you know, obviously you're a pro in it. And what do you do when you get somebody on set that you, an actor, is there like a trick to you or some kind of exercise you do when you take a quote, non-funny person or like somebody who's not known in comedy and try to- This takes me to my question about Ryan Reynolds. You know, why do you keep working with them? He's just a scene killer.

You just go into the editing room and you just go, okay, let's rework it. Yeah. I've had actors who you definitely go in the edit room. You're like, fuck, I got to save this one. I got to save it. But- But somebody who's not too strength isn't comedy. Oh, no, I've had it.

Like, look, I would love to be in this. Well, by the way, hey, you're pretty really nicely. There are some fucking people who are just not funny and you have to make them funny. Here's what I've learned, guys. I have learned this repeatedly and I so want to give you the famous names as examples because they're really famous in their phenomenal in their, in their own like lane. But here's what I know. You can get a great dramatic performance from a comedic genius of an actor.

We've all seen it. We've done it. We cannot make someone unfunny hear the music if they are tone deaf. And I've literally, there was an actor on Night Museum where I'm like, no, no, do you hear, like, take, take the pause. Like, buh buh buh buh buh buh. And then, and then that actor would go buh buh buh buh buh. No, no, listen to me.

Buh buh buh buh buh buh buh buh buh buh buh buh buh buh. And it's literally on, on Free Guy. That's what you get. Jody Comer had never done comedy. And we got the name, guys. No, it's not Jody Comer because she ended up being great because she's really funny. She's really funny. But here's how she, for the first few days, she was like, Jane Fonda was on our movie

This Where I Leave You where she's watching the funny swirl around her and she's like, where do I fucking get my boat in this river? Like it's, it's moving too fast. How do I get my boat in the water? And with Jody, with Jody Comer, I said, you're like an accent, Savant. I've seen killing Eve. You're like, your ear is insane. That's how you think about comedy.

It is, it is sound, it is inflection, it is rhythm. Hear the rhythm, hear the pitch. That's where you'll find the funny. And she's working with Ryan Reynolds and Taika Waititi and Utkarsh and Butkar who are all such Jedi masters at funny that she used her ear. So I'll usually, Sean, sometimes they cannot be saved and I'll cut around them. Or I just won't go to them for comedy. I'll literally go, you're the backboard.

Everyone just keeps shooting. This is the backboard. Their name is X. They happen to be in a scene with you. But I try to find some way. That's my career. That's my career. Funny, funny, funny.

And then cut to Bateman for reaction. Leave you, leave you, slow down. Because Sean's writing all this down. He's trying to. He's not. It's not funny. So slow down. And he got the last bit, right?

And so just listen, Sean. All right. You just play it back for yourself later, Sean, when it's released. I love, you know, we always joke around. We talk about it sometimes, not even just in work, just in life. People who aren't necessarily that funny. And by the way, I'm not saying that we are the fucking end all, or we're particularly funny there.

You're extremely funny. I'll say it because you can't. You're super. No, but I will say that again, like there's always somebody funnier, but people who aren't necessarily funny, they come at you sometimes because they think like, oh, you guys rib each other. So they, all they do is they come at you really hard in a really weird way. And I was doing a tennis match once, a, one of these things that you were playing in the

match. It was like a charity to raise money for the US Open and it was me and Farrell against a couple of guys. And one of the guys, this is a long time ago, so I feel confident, but maybe he'll know. And all he did was just come at Farrell so hard in this way that I kind of looked at him and I was like, geez, he's like, yeah, what the fuck, man, take your foot off the gas because they had that their instinct. And I have seen it at work before a couple of times too.

And it's really awkward. And you're like, man, just cool it. Just don't know. I had this somewhat recently where an actor was like, like, no, no, but I'm like, just stop trying. Just I'm begging you. Yeah. Stop trying.

This is not your thing. It's your youth. I think that's like young. That's how I was probably in that audition with you or probably in lots of auditions or whatever. You're just so young. You're just like, I got to try really hard. And you don't know.

Yeah. But Sean, your attitude is different there. You're actually trying to do something. You're not trying to, you're not doing out of fear. But you know what else it is, I think, and I talk about this with my daughters a lot. I think that at a certain point, we all want to have an idea of who we want to be, right? But we are each given certain gifts and we are lacking certain skills. And at a certain point in life, you have to look at what you are and you have to distinguish

it from what you want to be. Because no one ever got to a happy life hitting their head against a wall if it's not dovetailing with the gifts they have. And I do feel that maybe this is like the best therapy, but it took me a lot of years. Like I remember after night at the museum, I wanted to do a dark drama. And I remember Chris Columbus, who was a producer at Night Museum, he said, why are you running from the thing that comes easily to you? Yeah.

Because it doesn't feel like you're doing anything. That's right. That's right. That's exactly right. But it's actually, you know, you've just identified the thing you're natural at. Enjoy. Yeah. But you know what, it's weird too.

I don't know if you guys feel the same way. I feel like this age, it's almost like within, you know, I'm 52, it's within the last two years. You don't look it, man. Thank you. You don't look it. You don't look it. But when that tan fades, I'm concerned.

You look 70. Yeah. You are. You are? I woke up this morning and I already felt like a fucking loser. But I think it was quite honestly, it was 50 that made me realize all these things and start to, and all these things, these hangups that I had, or these ideas, or the story that I would tell myself about myself, I just started to change it.

And the things I was worried about or cared about, I don't care about anymore. I don't know. It is one of, I'm right at the, I'm 53, and it is definitely like, there's a lot that's shitty about midlife, but there are some things that are really fun. And the two that I found is acceptance, God willing, some fucking acceptance of what and who you are. And the other is I do find, Brian talks about this sometimes when we're on set, because like, we'll walk on and I can, I can block that scene and know my shots in about three

minutes now. It did not come that easy and that smoothly a decade ago and you get a competence at your work as you get into midlife that is, I'm finding it enjoyable, like really enjoyable. We'll be right back. And now back to the show. Your work ethic is just incredible. The amount of work you're able to put out and at a high level, do you think that's part of it now even more so that because you're so confident with what you're doing, you're

so comfortable with what you're doing that you can take on so much because Sean, your output is just stunning. I mean, your company is just, just thriving. Do you feel, I bet you don't feel overwhelmed, I bet you don't feel like you're under servicing anything. I rarely do. I mean, the whole goal, especially once I had that like 2014, 2015 moment where I was like, oh, wait, I can't control outcomes.

So I better stop living for it. I better stop living for box office as if I can control it. That was always a fable process. You cannot like, you don't know if your movie or show is going to do well. You do it because you believe in it and then you better goddamn well have fun while you're making it. Yeah. And enjoy the people that you've hired to work with.

Yes, and that's definitely, that's definitely where I've been at the last several years. I've had people look at me funnily when I, because I've sort of said something similar where I said like, if I'm going to do something that's going to take me away from my family and my kids, which is obviously that stuff becomes more and more into focus of like, of course, it's more important than anything else. So if I'm going to do it, it better be fun. And I have had people in a professional setting be like, look at me kind of strangely like, oh, that's important to you to have fun.

It's work. I'm like, no, no, no, no, no. We don't get another crack at this. This is it now. You're in it now. There is no, it's not like, and then I'll do this. And then I'll do the thing. And then I do it.

No, no, it's now. It's now. Yeah, for sure. It's now. For sure. And what are you waiting for? Yeah, to do that. But Sean, to that point in everything you said earlier about just kind of reaching middle

age and kind of figuring out who you are and staying in your lane or kind of veering off just ever so slightly, but still kind of staying in that on the same road, at least. Just looking at what you have coming up, you're like 17 things in production as a producer. Are you one of those personalities that has to have all of these things going, or are you reaching a point in your life where you're like, you know what, I have to find balance because that's what I'm kind of talking about a lot for myself. Balance about like, yes, to Jason's point, you have this company that's just massive and doing all of these things, but are you afraid of downtime?

Because I'm just reaching that point where I'm figuring out that balance. I used to be, I'm not anymore, this long location gig crystallized a lot for me. And I think we're making something special, but that's still five months that I missed of my daughter's life. And to your point, I mean, I think you put it so beautifully, like, it's happening right now. The thing that you're planning for and goal, you know, goal creed, like, it's it. This is happening.

And this is all part of it. So, and that's the other, I don't know, Will, I think you have some kids who are maybe teens and I don't know, with the ages, Jase, I think years are a little young still. But that was a big part of that 2014, 2015 crucible moment where I, my oldest was in 11th grade, I think. And I was like, wait a second, they're not going to live with me forever. Like that was a revelation. Yeah.

I somehow never thought about it with terror and the heartbreak of, oh, these years that we are a family together, they are finite and they end. And that changed things too. You know, this summer, so I'm out on the East coast in the summertime, because when I'm not in St. Bard's, I'm in East Hampton and I'm sorry, I'm just, I'm just sorry. You guys should know I'm going for douchebag of the year, so I'm trying to say as much as I can at once. I think you just locked it.

You just locked it. I don't know. But, but no, actually, you know, when I drive a GMC pickup, I'm out here because I'm also kind of a contrarian. Well, is it professional grade? Because if it is, that would make sense. Obviously, it's professional grade. Yeah.

And it's got the multi-pro tailgate, which was developed by GMC. Wow. What? Or professional grade. Sound just like the guy who does the commercial. But the point is this, so I'm out here and my son Archie, who's 13, he, he said to me like last week, he goes, hey, can I borrow your, he was like, I'm going to go work out. And I said, okay, which has become like kind of a new thing.

And he's like, hey, can I borrow your shoes? And I said, sure. And then he's 13 and he's wearing my size 12 shoes. And I don't know why that it felt like such a, like a bucket of cold water on my face. I was like, my baby is wearing my size 12 shoes. Wow. What? And I just wanted to hug him and like keep him small and just be like, oh, what the fuck?

Yeah. Yeah. It, starting at, at fifth grade, they actually start to be like, I'm not kind of good. I got, I got, I want to hang out with my friends this weekend. And like, and then when, of course, when they're 18, they're just gone. And then they come back once or twice a year if they like you for some holiday visits. But other than that, their, their next stop on the family run is with people they haven't even met yet.

And those are going to be their family. Yeah. That's great. And it's just like, I literally just put Franny on the plane this morning for camp in Europe for five weeks. Literally, I had to get up to look in on her because if she's probably close to where I am right now, I can pop over. I can hover if you want.

Yeah. If you're near Amsterdam, get over there. Oh, she had to go to Amsterdam first too. She kept saying I need to go to Amsterdam. Yeah. You got to, you got to fill up the backpack. And so, but I'm, I'm, I'm trying to train myself to, to be okay with, with kissing goodbye and enjoy life.

Go ahead. You know, how was the goodbye though, Jay today was, I mean, was she excited to go? She was. She was awesome. She was very brave, very happy, you know, nervous, but, but on it, she's got coping skills. She, and that's the, that's the thing I think is all you can really hope for is to try to build them that, that healthy, you know, decision maker on top of their shoulders.

And then with a good dollop of self-esteem, yeah, because the way that they expect and feel worthy of being treated in the world, yeah, that's what we're trying to build. Right, is that, that, that they go out there and they, they find relationships that, that deserve them. Yeah. And that they don't settle or think they should settle for less. Yeah. Right.

Yeah. Well, Jayce, I can tell you in your case, you're lucky because she's got a great head on her shoulders and she's a great kid and she's going to be okay and you're going to be fine. Yeah. She's an awesome kid. Objectively. She's an awesome kid.

Thank you. Yeah. And the camp goodbye is just warm up for the, the eventual college goodbye. That one is brutal. Yeah. I've done that twice. It wrecked me. Even the college tours, going, just driving around and seeing the places where they are

going to be going, even two years before they go, I'm going to be a disaster. It's such a cliche. I realize that, but I mean, that college tour is a real kind of watershed memory builder, but the goodbye, because now they don't live with you anymore and they won't again. They might, but, you know, in some ways you hope they won't, but that's, yeah, I mean, it's just all these kinds of, you realize all these moments are, they're not going to be reclaimed. So you better be savoring them now at work, at home.

Hey's, hey's, you're lucky, your dad left when you were young because you didn't have to go through. He didn't, you spared him all this shit. He was, you know, now Sean, Sean, do you worry that you're going to gas and run out of, run out of steam right at the moment that you're an empty nester when it's like, it's time to get to work cause you don't have to worry about the kids back at home and, and being like, I worry about that. I worry about like working super hard while they're still at home and then running out

of gas and now the house is empty except for me and Amanda. I mean, if I, I have a thousand other terrors, the gas tank feels full every morning. Like someone snuck in and refilled it at night. That's how, and that is, and I know I feel really lucky about that. And by the way, Sean, the, the dad backstory is, if anything, it's given Will Arnett comedy gold. I feel like he doesn't miss any of those pitches. I love it.

He hits them all hard. And it's for like over a hundred episodes now. So on behalf of all listeners, thank you, dad, thank you for giving Will Arnett such honor. Thank you, man. You get to, you get to put a face to all those jokes. Oh no. I don't know if I want the face.

I don't know if I can handle it. That's so funny. Yeah, by the way, anybody can make a joke on any subject, but try making a thousand jokes on the same subject. Good fucking luck. Bring it. Fucking bring it. Oh my God.

We do a bunch of stuff on food too, which Sean, I know you and I have gone round and round on, although you're naturally beautifully thin and narrow. Just like a little, look at a little hummingbird. I know why you're so in shape. Yeah, you do. You have the body of a Frenchman. Yeah. I, I don't know what, I mean.

Yes. Just take it. I've heard these things. I'll take it. Thank you. You and Ryan. But, but no, speaking of Ryan, I literally. What's, what's craft service look like on a set with you and Ryan and the caterers?

Is there's a salad bar set up every day, right? I'm not big on salad, but I do get super bitchy if I don't eat protein every three hours. I have learned this about myself. So this is where I go for the douche award. You and me are neck and neck now, Will, because one of, one of the, one of the job duties if whoever's my assistant on a movie is you got to get protein in my body every three hours or the whole crew is going to pay the price. Is this plant protein?

It's plant protein. Isn't it? No. It's like, you know, the Ryan Hugh diet. It's like the chicken, the boring chicken breast, maybe the sashimi, it's like, go ahead. Go ahead, Will. I know.

Oh, he doesn't know about. Yeah. This is on the tour. Okay. Which was, which was. We don't want to. We don't want to, we don't want to ruin the job. No, no, no.

You will not ruin it. It's got four or five uses in it. Guys, uh, you know, I was going to make something else, but I got, I got Japanese food instead. Sashimi. It's a joke. Yeah. But it's an evergreen.

I feel like that one's an evergreen. Like, I feel like I've heard them laugh at that joke on this show before. Yeah. And it's still landing. It's still landing. But wait, do you ever eat like crap food? Do you ever like? I love sugar.

And if I start, I'm like, if I had a bag of, uh, like caramel corn right now, I would finish it. Like it's my job. Yeah. And like, if I'm, when I'm in an airport, especially if I'm alone and I'll get like one of the, you know, the mega size M&Ms with peanut butter in it, forget it. What is your number one? Well, I want to go around the horn because I don't actually know this.

What's everybody's number one dessert? If you could have only one, like your top, the list go dessert ice cream. It's always hang on. It's not your turn. Oh, I thought you pointed at me. What the God, not only you can't even wait, you can't wait to get it out and you can't wait to get it in. I mean, Jesus.

I'm partial to a creme brulee. I like, I like a good creme brulee, but again, I'm not like a snappy top with, I like a little crunch shop. I like to work through the crunchy surface to get to the mushy innards. Yeah. That's my go to. He gets that real methi lighter when they, yes, even better if they do it at the table. So I see someone working.

Sean's still dying from, can't wait to get it out and you can't wait to shove it in. How many times has Scottie said that to you? Wait, Bateman, go. Yeah. You're not a big dessert guy either. I can't even imagine you eating dessert. I do. You want to know how douchey and terrible is.

I do like carbolite. That's the frozen yogurt with no sugar, no fat, no dairy. I have no idea what it is, but it's cold and it's colorful and you can eat it with a spoon. It's so, by the way, that's so fucking lame. One of the first times Jason and I, like over 20 years ago, he was like so excited and he goes right down on Crescent Heights and Beverly. Remember that place in the fucking mall? Yeah, sure.

And you were like, well, let's go get the fro yo fro fro go go or whatever the fuck you called it. And it was like, it was like plastic. Yeah. He's like, isn't this great? And it's nothing. Right? And I'm like, no, this is fucking disgusting.

No, it's disgusting. Listen, I'm not, I'm not, I'm not above admitting, I love dessert and I love ice cream like Sean. I like Hayes. Sean Levy, what, you're in Hungary right now. Tell us what do you do in your free time there? Tell us like any kind of crazy stories about the, I wish I had crazy stories. But I did have, I did, no, I definitely fought the blues here a bit.

I have to admit, like it's just, it's a long haul. I've been alone for most of it. I've had so much goulash and it is as it sounds, right? Like that's just kind of, that should be an adjective for how it's been for fun. Yeah. You're pretty East there in Hungary. Yes. Eastern European is a different look.

There's a palette there, literally that is a little bit grayer and. And you feel the history. You feel centuries of occupation and you, yeah, so, but I did. So I finally rose, wait, I am a happy person. Why am I not happy? I got to go places on the weekend. So I went to Berlin and there I did have a wild weekend. I did exactly what you imagine in your head.

You would do. And like age inappropriate. I was with my brother, we went to a club till 4.30 a.m., like that, that was the song. Yes. Exactly. Right. That's weird. The clubs in Berlin.

I mean, what I kind of noted, like there's no aggressive kind of creepy vibe is just everyone is actually there to listen to that beat, the chasing and do it this mouth freakishly well by the way. And just dead. I started as a beatboxer. I love, I love Berlin. I'm with you. I love Berlin.

I think it's one of the great cities. It's so much fun. Yeah. Great restaurants. How much longer? How much longer do you have there, Sean? One day. Truly?

This is literally one day more guys. Wow. I'm like, I'm flying through this because I have my last day of shooting tomorrow and then we moved to France for the final two weeks of shooting there in France and then back home. Where in France? Are you going to be in Paris? Are you in the countryside?

No, we're in the country. We're in the town where the novel is set called Semelo, which is right in Brittany on the coast. It's the westernmost coast of France. Beautiful. So we're shooting there. It's beautiful. These huge ramparts in the ocean, massive beach and it's where this actual event happened, where the Germans occupied it and the Americans came over and they bombed the shit out of

the town in order to liberate it. And that's kind of the part of the story that we're shooting. Oh, that's awesome. Sean, we have taken up way too much of your time. I love it. Thank you so much for delighting us. You are. You're absolutely delight.

In every way. You've delighted us with your art, like I said, and you've delighted us with your presence here today and your character and your perspective. Yeah. And you're just a great guy and so happy for you. And you seem so happy legitimately, which is all your success and Sean is always a great hang on or off work. Uh, I mean, buddy, uh, more, please.

Lots, lots more. Well, I, I've loved chatting with you guys and I love your show. I'm such a fan and hopefully I can tell sweet and I didn't push you hard and blow the whole thing. No, you're great. You're great. You were incredible. Truly.

Thank you for having me, fellas. Excellent. Thank you. I miss you, Sean, a bunch, buddy. Hurry home. All right. Bye guys. Love you, pal.

Bye, buddy. Bye, buddy. Bye, bye. That guy, I can't, Sean Laney is just one of my favorite people in the whole world. You know, I try to quit him emotionally and spiritually, you know, because he doesn't live here anymore. And he does. He literally got 17 projects in development.

It's crazy. I know. When Hayes, you were saying like his, his attitude and his energy is so sort of infectious. And yeah, it is, it's infectious and it's so buoyant and upbeat and kind of, you know, like I can imagine what that must be like on a set with a personality like that that's just always supportive. Never, it's never like, you know, I don't know if that really worked, you know, kind of like attitude, you know, you don't want to be around that.

Let's go again and suck less. Yeah. He does never, you'll never hear that from him. No, he's, he's, he's happy and capable. Like that's like a great combo. Is a great combo. That's a really, yeah. I love all the stuff in the middle about like all, when I was, I joked around, I was like,

this is the best therapy session because he's, and even you will were like, it's down, now is the time. I love that to just do what you want to do. Like the only person holding you back is you, that all that kind of stuff. It's one thing to know it. I mean, to, to, to hear it, but you have to incorporate it. It's the next. It's the hardest.

One of the great things that we joked a lot about my, my dumb vacation, which was, it should be noted the first vacation since before COVID. Yeah. I'm glad you did that for yourself. You and Alessandra deserved that. Yeah. And we, you know, it's been a crazy two years and the baby and he was born prematurely and all the stuff, just all the stress and we kind of let it all go.

We were down there. You guys haven't been just the two of you for like ever since January, since before COVID. And again, I know that's like, oh, poor boohoo. There's a lot of people who were like, I've never fucking been away. So any couple needs to have just one on one time. Yeah. And I will say when the great things was, we were, we talked a lot about it and I was

like, look, it is fucking now life is happening and you got to like get out into it and, and start speaking up. I want to go back to the things that you guys, that you guys said, no more, no more dinners and restaurant. I like to go out to dinner and restaurant still. Yeah. Yeah. Well, we just did it as a family last night and a man and I said this morning, it's like,

let's just say, I literally referenced you, Will. I said to a man, I said, let's, let's do it. Arnett's family was like, no one in, no one out on Sunday. Like just any day of the week, it's nice to just commit to just having that bond or just taking a walk. Yeah. And by the way, Alex Arnett, my mom will be so happy to hear that Sunday night, nobody in, nobody out is still alive.

It's great. Yeah. It is great. It's so important to have those moments. And we have, we all have a lot of, look, we, you guys are my family. You guys are my extended family too, and, but we need those moments with our kids and our significant other where we sit down and we're just kind of quiet with each other. Yeah.

Super important. My dad just lived by that. Did he? Yeah. Who was, who were the people he was doing it with? Yeah. They were folks that didn't mind the long drive. No one in, no one out.

Locked the door. Did you think he just drove until he ran out of gas or did he have a destination? Like what was that? I'm not pumping at the next station. You in the back. What was your name again? You're going to do it. He loved hitchhikers.

He sure did. Oh, but you know what? He was nice to, the way he left was nice. He didn't, it wasn't a long like, you know, thing like, well, it was just a really quick bike, nice, nice, nice, Sean, smart, smart, smart less is 100% organic and artisanally handcrafted by Rob Armjolf, Bennett Barbaco and Michael Granteri smart loss. Our next episode will be out in a week wherever you listen to podcasts or you can listen to it right now, early on Amazon music or early and add free by subscribing to Wondry Plus

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