Sunday Sitdown with Willie Geist - Chip and Joanna Gaines

Episode Date: October 27, 2019

Chip and Joanna Gaines have built something of an empire with their Magnolia lifestyle brand and sparked a renaissance in their hometown of Waco, Texas. In this week’s “Sunday Sitdown,” Willie Geist travels to Waco to talk to the “Fixer Upper” stars about walking away from the show that made them famous, keeping life normal for their five children, and their latest projects – renovating a hotel and launching a television network.  Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hey, guys, Willie Geist here with another episode of the Sunday Sit Down podcast. My thanks, as always, for clicking and listening along. I got a big one for you this week for all you fixer-upper groupies and fanatics. And there are tens of millions of you. Chip and Joanna Gaines are my guest on the podcast. Joining me in studio right now is the producer of this fine podcast, Maggie Law. Hey, Maggie. Hi, Willie.

So you're a fixer-upper... I would classify myself as a fixer-upper fanatic. Fanatic. Okay, that's the right term? Correct. Yeah. So Chip and Joanna, as you know, are based in Waco, Texas. Of course. They live there. That's where they started flipping houses years ago. That's where they got their show. That's where they've built their empire.

So I flew down there. Yeah. You fly into Dallas. You connect out. You take a quick 20-minute flight into Waco. Love it. Town of about 125,000 people, I think. And they have absolutely revolutionized the place. I imagine. Yeah. I mean, was it crazy to just drive around and sort of see. That's what I imagine on all the times I dream about. going down to Waco, Texas. Next time you should come. Is that it's just like been completely changed since they've taken care. It has. I mean, there's, you know, there's a lot of old Waco, but they have, you know, the silos, which is the head court.

So for people who don't know, Chip and Joanna bought these two old silos and they turned it into somebody described it as sort of like a Disney world for fixer upper fans where it's all Joanna's design, Chip renovated everything. You can buy all their stuff and maybe you'll spot them. They're there at the silos. And this weekend I was there, they were having their fifth annual silobration. Silobration. They did talk about that. Whoa. The silobration is like Woodstock.

It was like tens of thousands of people from around the world. They say in there they were like, we were surprised when they asked where did people come from. They were like New York, Los Angeles, like Michigan, like everywhere. And they're like, oh, we thought maybe like Dallas. I know. It's incredible what they've built. So for those of you who don't know, we get into it. It's a great conversation.

Even if you don't watch the show, their story is. Unbelievable. They got married in 2003. They had a little design shop. Joanna did. And Chip was renovating houses. They were doing that together. They got a phone call from a TV executive, basically, a producer.

The production company. Who said, Joanna, I read your design blog. I think it's really cool. She said she had like nine followers. She's like, I think I had nine followers. She's like how she found my blog. I'll never know. Lucky break.

But this executive and this producer to her credit saw something said, And we send a crew down there just to shoot with you and your husband and see what it looks like. Yeah, test. And as you'll hear in the interview, it was a complete disaster. It's a chip said. A disaster. The camera turned on and he just froze. Yeah.

He didn't know what to do. Yeah. Joanna said he couldn't speak when the camera turned on. He was sweating profusely. And he finally just bailed on her. And she's like, so now here I am, not even having any idea what to do. And she's like the introvert. Yeah.

She's like, I'm the introvert. And I have to carry this whole pilot by myself. So you'll hear there's a twist at the end when things went a little bit. better. Yes. HGTV saw something. Clearly it all worked out. And it worked out and the rest is history.

So they've got a coffee shop, they've got a restaurant, they've got all this empire in Waco. Their show was the number one show on cable news for many years, or cable for many years. And now their latest project that brings us to our conversation here is in Waco, there's this old building called the Karam Shrine Building, the Grand Karim Shrine Building. It's been there for almost 100 years. It morphed over the years into a municipal building, but only a few of the offices were used. It was a family court.

Just old and at this point, just to be blunt, like basically abandoned crumbling building. Right. That's been something of an eyesore in Waco for a long time. Okay. So Chip's driving by one day. He's like, we've got to do something with that. Of course. We got to do something.

Joanna says you're crazy. Right. But it was, it felt like haunted. Right. So that's where you're in the ballroom, right? or sort of the big hall of this building doing the interview. Yeah. So the conversation is up on the third floor, a big ballroom.

And you can see when you walk in the potential and what it used to be in the 20s and 30s of like a big have a wedding or an event or something in there. And so they're doing it. They were the ones, this building is sitting there for years and years and years. And they're going to be the ones to flip it and turn it into their biggest fixer upper, which is this boutique hotel that's going to open for a couple of years. Somewhere for all of the people to flock to wake out to stay. Yes. Yes. Myself included.

The other thing I'll say as you listen, people are like, what do they really like? It can't be as good as it seems on TV. Right. On television. And I have no dog in the fight. I have no interest in shilling for anyone, but they are exactly who they appear to be. Yeah. And I've been around them a lot on the Today Show, but when you go into their world, you spend a bunch of time around them for a day before you go on, after you go on.

They showed up in their car. They got out. And they were just what you see on TV. I love it. I mean, it's clearly why it works, you know. Exactly. People see that. And they're still mystified, honestly, as you'll hear in the interview,

about why they got so famous. About their fame. I know. They're like, we don't know. I know. We're just being us, and we're so happy that people like it. So there's a lot to hear, a lot to talk through. You fix her upper fans are just going to gobble this up.

And people who love a good story are going to love it too. So here now, without further ado, on the Sunday Sit Down podcast, Chip and Joanna Gaines. Guys, thanks for doing this. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Welcome to Waco, Texas. first time in Waco. That's crazy. What do you think? I love it. Everyone's incredibly friendly. When you're in the airport in Dallas connecting to Waco, they look at you and they say,

what do you, oh, Chip and Joe, Anna. They know, they know where you're headed. Willie and Waco is like, it's a show. It's a show. It's a show. It should be a show. Yeah. Willie and Waco. If only you had a network. Yeah, I know. Exactly. We can make some program. We'll talk about that later. So let's talk first about this space, because we are in what was once a grand ballroom and is about to be, a grand ballroom, thanks to you. Tell me about Joanna what you saw in this place, because this is a big leap. Yeah. And I would start with what Chip saw in this place, because the story of my life, poor Chip, because he always, I get the credit for it, but Chip loved this building for years. And I'm like, I don't know. That looks kind of, it just looked dated. It looked hard, honestly. It's like a big building. I'm like, let's just stick with houses. So for years, he just always noticed this building on the corner. he started kind of getting aggressive with, hey, I want to buy this thing. And I was like, Chip, I don't, we walk into it. I really was like, it scares me. Like all the carpet, it just feels

kind of haunted a little bit. I don't know. I was just scared of it. There's a few things that Chip's bought in the past that felt haunted. But, um, so I had a lot of resistance to it. It turns out that the more haunted the property is, the better deal you can get on these things. And he was like, Joe, quite the advantage. It's a great deal. Um, but finally I walked in one day just going, okay, Chip is passionate about this. I want to see what he's seeing. And I walked in and I just, I saw it. And when I'm in the other mindset of like, I don't want it,

it's easy for my mind to be like, nope, you know, I can just do that. But then when I know, I want to know what Chip is seeing. So I walked in, he takes me up to this ballroom and I could see it. I could see the history. I saw the people in here. I saw the parties that were in here. And I was like, this place is really special. And so after that day, it's like, okay, I'm all in.

So what did you know about this building? Because I went back and was reading articles over the years. Sure. It's been on the market. We can't sell it. We're going to convert it. It's empty. They're having meetings in here once in a while. Yeah, sure. It didn't really have its purpose. What did you see in this place all those years ago? You know, I've always had this kind of odd ability. I mean, the way she described it was really therapeutic to some extent because I've never heard you say it exactly that way. but for me, it doesn't take a process for me to get from point A to point what it could be. I mean, I step into a place like this, and I see past all the paint chips and all the decrepit hardwood floors. I sort of, to some extent, I mean, you know, I don't want to sound like a profit, but I go back in time to when this thing was in its heyday, and I imagine, and here's the

truth of the matter. I mean, I'm a business guy in my core, and I mean that, you know, that, not in this big shot business guy. I mean, just a small business guy. And I see this building and it becomes real practical for me. If we could buy this building and then improve it for a certain amount of money and those A plus B equal less than what we could sell it for at the end, it becomes like the simplest mathematical equation. If A plus B equals less than C, which is what we could sell this thing for if all hell broke loose, it becomes kind of fun for me. Like I know I've got to buy this building at a low enough price to then put the improvement money into the building and then for this thing to actually be worth more than what we've got in. I mean, that's it. It's

that simple. But then somehow along the way, I kind of see the hardwood floors and I see, I think, that vision that you were just describing about the people that used to actually enjoy this space for what it was back in its glory days. I can see that activity occurring in a space like this. And I just, I mean, you know, it's just like, and then it just takes money and time. and effort to get it back to that spot. And then I think that's the million dollar question. Anybody could see an old building and then put an enormous amount of money into it and then have a property that's underwater that's worth less than what the market would bear.

You know, for me, I get a little bit arrogant like anybody can do that. I've got to do it exactly opposite of that. I've got to buy it right. I've got to put the right improvements into it. And I got to know for a fact that when this thing's all said and done, there's some equity in it at the back end of it. So all that to say, it's just this is a fun one because it's a, big and it's gnarly and i think big and gnarly kind of excite joe and i and i and then when you get to see this in a year and a half from now and you see that ballroom activity that she's describing with the

people and the and the energy i mean you're going to go i can't believe i saw this before and after but off camera we were talking about you saying you walked in and kind of felt it a little bit and i want to encourage you that's unique i'd say most people that walk into a building like this would say quote unquote you are crazy nobody wants to do this and for you to say i see it you You know, I mean, you're a step ahead. Well, it's one thing to say I see it. It's another thing that's going to do something about it, which is what you all do. So I was just saying, Joanne, I walked around downstairs, some of the different floors.

And yes, it's spooky in some corners. But it's a nostalgic, too. It's from the time. So from a design point of view, how do you see yourself bringing some of that out? Yeah, you know, the fact that there's three floors and you can start seeing how, even over there, like, sorry, that's this hard. But even on the other side of this ballroom, there's this whole section where you're like, you can start seeing how this wasn't a hotel before,

but how somehow you start gutting everything and you can see this footprint of a hotel. I think what I got excited about with the hotel is, you know, obviously the lobby, like the first welcome. You walk in and what does that feel like? What is that first just sense when you step into the place? It's already, once you've been on this side of it and you're like, okay, I love the building, because that's where we are now,

it's like, oh, I can't wait for people to experience that magic when they step in, and this thing is right. And so for me, it's really just highlighting the history, the nostalgia, all the stuff that you feel, even in this kind of rough state. And then once we polish it up a bit, I think it's just going to come alive. And I think people are going to just feel like this is a really special place. But what I love about the rooms is like I get to design, you know, three or four different types of rooms. And then you just kind of mass, you know, I don't want every room to be completely different because really, to me, the highlight is the view, the trim. the windows and stuff like that, I get to put a lot of energy in like three or four different

styles, and then you get to just kind of mass it out in the rest of the rooms. I don't know. I think it's just going to be fun. I think we've always dreamed of doing either like a small motel or a hotel just because it's like we love the hospitality side. People are coming to Waco. They're coming to visit the silos. There's other amazing businesses here in town that they're coming to visit. And so this just felt like the next step of, hey, if they're coming, let's offer them somewhere to stay. Let's host them. Because we tried to host them at the farm.

We tried that. And that got a little complicated, right? And so we were like, maybe plan B should be like, you know, a small boutique hotel. There you go. Well, you, I mean, it is, you have to have vision to see this, obviously, but also this is just a different animal from what you all have done before. I mean, it's one thing to flip the houses that you've flipped and even the silos. But just from a practical point of view as a builder, did you think, like, you think, like, for a minute, all right, how are we going to actually do this?

Yeah, again, it's like if there's not an element of that, I'm not interested. So if there's not an element of I can't do this or how we're going to do this, I would argue Joe and I kind of shy away from, I don't want to say the easy stuff, because surely we're not stupid, right? I mean, do we only do hard things? I think we're a little stupid, but I also think we like to do hard things. And I think there's something about all of that that just, you know, know, there's got to be a little bit of naive, like being naive to like, let's do it.

Chip, I would say. We're very childish in that. We think that everything's possible, and obviously a few things turn out a little harder than we expected. But the fact that this building is tough and challenging, and I would even argue a little bit outside the immediate bubble. I mean, we did that with the silos. You mentioned the silos.

The silos were, you know, we've got a downtown strip, which is called Austin Avenue, which is really historic. That's where the castle's going to be. located, is located. And it just, it feels right. It's like, it's like being, you know, every town has these historic neighborhoods that have been around for a century, you know, or so. And that's kind of our Austin Avenue area. When we built the silos, it was a little bit off of that beaten path. And there was something about that that really attracted us to the property. Well, this is on the opposite end of that. So we got the silos. We got our heartbeat,

which is Austin Avenue. And then on the other side is the Karen building. And we thought it would be cool to kind of bookend each of those those neighborhoods and communities. And so part of that is even part of the challenge. Like how do we get people on this side of town to experience this part of the pocket community? And I think this hotel will become a real anchor in that. Have you guys thought about a name yet? Are you ready to go there? Are you still working on the name of the hotel? I want to call it like the Magnolia Hotel, but Joe says that there's already one of these that exists and that we would have to, you know, get into some legal battle with some guy. but I'm just like, be nice. It's a natural, right? The Magnolia. It's got to be. I wish.

Yeah, it's taken. He's got to be taken. He's like, oh, everything's for sale, Joe. I'm like, maybe it's taken. I've got numerous hotels. There's not one in Waco, Texas. Maybe we can carve out this permission. So Magnolia Hotel. All right. My favorite number is 16. So she, she was smart enough because I'm so passionate about the name Magnolia, which is the irony in that she came up with it. So it's not like this thing that I've got to have my way. This is her baby. You know, Magnolia was her original little gift shop on the, you know, the Bosque side of town and little bitty 1,800 square foot, you know, shop. And so it just has become kind of our first child. I mean, we had that little business together before we had our now five children. And so she's just become so precious that I love the name of it. But she was smart enough and wily enough to go, what if the name was like Hotel 16?

And I was like, well, there's something there. Yeah, they're like, hey, look over here. Yeah, you're very wise. Is that what it is? I was to ask you why 16. Baseball? You have a number that it was just like, this is Willie Geis.

I played in high school football. Okay. No, I'll still keep it. 84. 84. 84. It's not being taken. You have my authorization.

You have my authorization to use 84. It must be so cool, too, Joanna. Just to be in a position, you talk about having that shop in 2003, that little place, to be in a position in your life where you can drive past this building, and it's even possible

that you could do something. something like this. And you've worked hard to get to where you are. But that's a cool thing, I have to imagine. It is, you know, and it's something that we don't forget about. I think we're reminded daily of these, and I don't know if it's because we have to do that to just keep ourselves grounded of like, man, we always joke. Our favorite house was the one that was 800 square feet, and those were the sweetest times when we were really broke, like just always going back to Rital was just a struggle. Everything was hard. But there was something about that hard that just develop something in us that, I don't know, I think it just made us stronger people.

I would argue twofold. It's in our DNA. It's who we really were. So all of this hasn't changed any of that. We are still that couple that's like striving to just make it. But to your point, it's like, I'd say the variable is that this success happened a little bit late in Joe and I's life. So we already had a few kids on the ground. We had, you know, a half dozen years of marriage under our belt. You know, we had kind of grown and evolved into who we essentially were and these babies on the ground, you know how that is. I mean, it just takes out that self-centered, arrogant, narcissistic kind of part of yourself. You're like, it's all about these kids. And so I think with this new, like, chapter of our life, it's less about, oh, now we can do these things because look what we've

accomplished. And more about, I'm going to show these kids that there's nothing that's impossible. We can do hard things. We say this all the time. It's kind of a Gaines family mantra. Like, we do hard things. I've got a little boy who's a freshman now playing football. And it's just like he comes home. Our coach made us do this run and this thing.

It's like, baby, how'd you think this was going to go? You know, we do hard things is practical when you're out doing a bear crawl as a freshman on a football team, you know? And it's just like, for us, this is a hard thing. And I wouldn't be interested in it if it was any other way, you know? And it's a lesson you can teach them that you worked for it. that you ground your way from that little shop to where you are right now. And I think back to the little shop, when I think about that, you know, we couldn't afford

flooring. So Chip was staining the plywood. Couldn't afford signage. So he, like, rummaged old letters that literally made up the word magnolia and surprise me. It costs like $150. Is that that original sign? Yes, that's the original sign. I was looking at a picture of it today.

I did that. I need it. When I was done with that, and I'm no artist, but I literally was like, back to my point about this building, it just reminded me of a piece of art. and obviously subjective, and here I am an idiot, what do I know? But when I see this building, it reminds me of a piece of art that I'm desperate to get back to its original glory. When I built that sign and put all those odd letters together, I mean, you know, I think arguably you could argue that it was corning. Yeah, the A at the end is actually a G upside down.

Don't look too close, but there's some things. There were some compromises we had to make. But it was so sweet. But the point that I'm trying to make, and I'm not doing a great job articulating this, I would say that the drive. Dreams that we had back when we were so broke and they revolved around a 30 or 50 or $100,000 house were as big to us then as this is to us now. And I guess that's the point I'm trying to make. We were dreaming big.

It was just a different way. Nobody would have looked at it and said, oh, that's a big dream. But to Joe and I, we're like, well, it's a big dream when you got 50 bucks in your pocket. This is a big undertaking for a couple that has $50 to their name. And then you look at this big deal. And you're like, hey, I mean, we, you know, this could sink a ship, you know, in like the financial sense. But that, something about that drive for us is part of the magic. It seems to me you two have always had that, even when you were a little bit broke, when you wanted to start that market and chips.

And you said, I don't know if I should do this. I don't know if I know how to do this. It might fail. And Chip with the same mentality, said, go do it, Joe. Go do it. Chip was just born that way. and I was born the opposite, which was like, I'd like to just stay in this little cubicle and be safe, the rest of my life. She kept showing me these CDs.

If we put this $50 in this CD in 10 years, this will be $59. I mean, that was exciting. I've got a much more aggressive financial plan. You're going to love this. Now, look, it could equal $50 becoming $0. There's lots of ways this ends that way. But if we play our cards right, our $50 will become more than $59. in the CD you're talking about.

So I don't know. I think just being married to the guy, it just rubs off on you. And then when you're on this side of it, you're like, oh, it's more fun this way. And there is risk. And even back then when it was the risk of buying that little building

and putting inventory in it, I even know what I was doing. I was like, I sure hope this person buy, you know, just even learning, like, you buy something for this much. You sell, I mean, I was learning everything. Just business basics 101. I was not, this was new to me.

But once you're on that side of it, there's just something. It's a contagious thing. And so I'm glad I'm not. But be serious. If you could go back and be the safest person in the world. Every now and then I still wish I was in that cubicle, punching the clock. I'm like, I'm out of here.

I'm going to the mall. All right. Fair enough. Fair enough. But you say it's more fun. It is. It is fun. But there's always that thing because it's not my natural instinct that fear is always creeping in.

Like, oh, what if it's this thing? What if it's, there's always that element of if I fail, then what? And when I told Chip that, you know, in 2003, I want to do this shot, but Chip, if I fail, then what? He's like, oh, we get back up and do something else. And when I heard that and almost had the freedom to fail, I was like, oh, well, if that's the scariest thing. Right. Even if it was a financial thing, his fearlessness really kind of just set me up to say, okay, I think we can do it. And, yeah, we have failed.

There are some things that we've done that we look back and like, well, that was a stupid idea. Sure. But I think even in the failure, just the value that we learned, not in the money side that we've lost, but the value we learned from that to then take into the next thing. It's just that's invaluable. So for me, it's like you're never really losing. If you're going for it and you're moving forward, you can't lose, even if it doesn't something you're, even if it isn't something you're doing long term, just that lesson and everything you're learning in those opportunities, I think are the most valuable things. When you were just saying all those things, my heart. just burst. I call him coach. He's coached me. Forget coach. I'm talking about like in a much more romantic sense. Yeah, he wouldn't try to be a coach. Like I could see crew having a little sibling. Oh, geez. And me being like, I love this woman. Right? Willie. I didn't bring it up. Another subject. Chip pushing the agenda here. Chip will, I mean, when I'm 50, Chip's going to want more kids. Just know, this is going to be like the headline forever. Joe's pregnant again. For the record. We've gotten like almost like, ah,

about this. Every time we have a child, it becomes like a national news cycle. So sadly, now I'm like, babe, business is down. Wait, I mean, we need to bump our productivity, our profitability. I mean, we might need to have another child here. I don't see another out here to get this much media attention. Part of the business plan. Chip with children is like, there's never too many. I'm like, Chip, I think we've got enough business. I think we're good. That's how Chip is with children. And he's like, I just think we can keep having him. I mean, I think Chip just loves a full plate. I love a full plate.

It helps when you don't have to carry the child about 10 months, right? That's a little easier to be aggressive on something like that. That is a much better position that I find myself in. It's just saying when you come to Waco and you walk around, even in the airport, there's a brochure for the Chip and Joanna tour. There's all that going on. There are these sort of like historic spots, and one of them is the tire shop where the two of you met. your father's tire shop.

Are you serious? Wow. Wait, that's so cute. Who's doing the tour? So there's a whole tour. Yeah. I appreciate Willie bringing this to our attention. We'll send out some cease and assist letters after this.

Can someone call the airport and have to remove that tour? There's one of the tire shop? That's so cute. Wait, it doesn't include the one where you lost your virginity, does. Hey, you know. It's not that kind of a tour. I don't know. Come on.

Is the farm on there? I don't think so. No, I don't think they're. violate your privacy. I don't have a tour is this. But for people who don't know where this all began, began in your father's tire shop when you were getting your brakes fixed. Is that right?

And is the story true that like that day you said, oh, she's the one? I feel like that was more your thing. He's like no. No, it was not. No, it was my thing. You wish it was my thing. I'll be completely clear. Here's the thing.

There was this family business, this tire shop you referred to, and they had a family photo like some family business. do behind the cash register. And there were these beautiful three Stevens daughters. So Jerry Stevens and Nan Stevens, my precious mother and father-in-law, had these gorgeous three daughters. And I would just look at this family photo and be like, man, if I could find any three of these young ladies, I would just be like the happiest person on the planet. So it was definitely like in that way. But when Joe and I struck up a conversation, she's always been like a bit of a fly on the wall. I mean, it takes a little bit of effort to kind of draw out like her heart and her personality and these kind of things.

And I'm sort of opposite. You know, I'm like my personality and my heart are like right on my sleeves so you like it or you don't take it or leave it. And so it took a little bit of dancing as I was pursuing Joe for her to kind of open up little by little. But I can definitely say the more she opened up, the more I liked it. Now, what did you think, Joanna, when he says, I saw your picture on the wall and I just had to have you. He always just a creeper. The first thing he said to me, because I did these local commercials for my dad. I'd hold my hands like this.

I was just hurt. But I did these local 30-second spots for him. Do one. Do it. Do you remember? Come on. I remember at one point I said, we even give you a free ride to work. Oh, my gosh. I do remember at one point I had the line of like, we'll even change your lugnust for you.

And all the radio stations. That's when you want his heart. And be like, I think she just said lugnett. Maybe it's so funny, right? when you said that, I got the chills back to my 20s. I was like, Dad, were you writing the script? You don't have your daughter say, well, you even change your lug meds. Sorry.

How old are you at that point? I was like 16. Oh, my gosh. I worked for my dad for 10 years. Right. And I was going to take over the, that was, you know, he had three daughters and I wanted to be the one that was, I'll carry on your name. So I was training for that. I mean, from a dream perspective, she was this girly girl, but in this real mascot.

I mean, every person that you shook hands with at the tire shop had dirt underneath their nails. And I was kind of that kind of guy. I mean, I was a real blue collar, hardworking dude. So, I mean, me and these guys were shooting the bull. And then her mom struts around like the Queen of England. She's got these three beautiful daughters that literally have just come back from like a manicure running this tire shop with their dad. And it was just, I mean, for me. I always love being at the counter because a guy would walk up.

And I was like, okay, what size tire are you needing? And they would look at me like, okay, well, can you get someone who can actually? Honey, can you get your dad? Tell me what kind of car you have. And I'd be like a 235, 65. Like I would, I loved the challenge. Right? You feeling it?

I know you're a happily married man, but I mean, that doesn't get you a little excited. You're not living. I could sell a set of tires. Will you stop? I'm not trying to get him in trouble, but that's exciting. Yeah, I just get. Okay. That's what I'm saying.

But I'm telling you, I knew about cars. And I, because in my mind, I'm just going to run this place. So I better, you know, so that was like my school. So for Chip, it was one. One day I was walking out and he's walking in and we just bump into each other. And he was like, hey, you're that girl on the commercials. It was like, I thought I was a dreamer. I'm like, oh, Lord.

I mean, you talk about a real fantasy. I looked up at the family photo thinking maybe the person that I thought was on the family photo was going to be removed and there she is in real life. But it was really her and then I confirmed the photo was still had three daughters. And I was like, what the freak. My prayers have been answered. So at first I was like, this guy's kind of just one of those typical. And so I sat because I was like, now what?

So I just sit out there. Even as a somewhat recognizable person, when people do that to us, it's always this eye roll thing. And so it's just like, I thought it was the most original, unique comment I could have possibly made. And I hear it every day when they come into the shop. So in my mind, it's like steer clear of that one. So I was just kind of like, but then he started asking really interesting questions. And I realized this is the first time I've had a conversation with someone where I feel like, I'm actually getting to know myself better because it's like,

that was an interesting way to ask that. And so we just ended up talking for like an hour and a half. And he left. And I thought, oh, that was just a great customer. That sweet. Then the next day, I'd get on my desk. Chip Gaines called. Here's his number.

And I was like, oh, stalker. You hung around the tire shop for an hour and a half. Just chatting her up. Just chatting her up. And I mean, you know, back in those days, I didn't have a lot going on. So an hour and a half was definitely I had some time on my end. Businesses. Oh, poor Joe. I kept telling her, I had all these businesses. I had a little wash and fold business. I had a lawn business. I had a fireworks business. I literally had all these businesses.

And so because her dad ran a profitable business, she assumed that I having three of them meant three times the profit. And I was like, babe, all of these are not for profits. None of these make any money. But she didn't know. I mean, I carried this pocket. I always had all my money. Because he didn't really have like a bank account. So all his cash was. So our first date, he like stands up. And I'm like, what's this guy to pay for the bill? Pulls out this wad of cash. Which now is like, it was like $1001 bills and then like a $20.

And I was like, the dude's loaded. Little did you know that was every dime he had was in that pocket. You're so dumb. You felt for the oldest trick in the book. It all worked. All the moves worked. Look at you now. I mean it.

I had all the money I had in the world was in your pocket. pocket and it wasn't in this goddy arrogant thing I wasn't like this you know this New York mafia type that was like out flashing it around I just really always carried a lot of money in my pocket I had employees that I was always having to pay in cash in some cases and I was always trying to buy something you know for a discount so if you've got a little cash on your pocket somebody you'll sell you something for 50 bucks instead of a hundred you know I just kind of always had this cash reserve and I remember that date and I stood up because you couldn't really you can't sit down and take out $879 in cash.

It's odd. In singles. Yeah, it falls out on the ground. It looks like you just came back from a strip club or something. And so I had to stand up, and I was trying to be respectful about it. So I turned my back to it and counted out the money. But she got... Caught my eye.

I think that was part of the show. You're saying it was a practical question. That was the show. It was part of the show. And it worked. And it worked. Look at you now. Look at you now.

Oh, that's so funny. So I'm just leaping ahead to the show. So you're cruising along here. You got started some businesses. You're doing pretty well for yourselves. And then you get a phone call from HGTV. What was the connection there? I know you had a design blog.

Yeah. And by design blog, it was literally like nine people that followed me. So I don't even know how anyone saw the pictures. And it was one of the houses we were living in. And it was just the before and afters. and someone from a production company, High Noon, who works with HGTV, her name was Katie. And she called my cell phone and said, I saw these before and afters. I see you and your husband work together.

Hey, what do you think about if we came to Waco for a couple days? It's been a week with you. And shot stuff. And I was like, what? And so I called Chip, and this is a true story. He said, do not call that person back. It's a scam. How much did they say you have to pay for them to film you?

And I said, I don't think they. This is sad because it's a scam. You talk about like my instincts because I'm like a live or die by my instinct thing. So this building, I've got these gut instincts. You watch it'll play out this way. I mean, for the biggest opportunity of our lifetimes. It was like a dumb and dumber moment. I think we're going to go that way.

Oh, I mean, I was adamant. And Joe was like, I think she's telling the truth. I was like, babe, she didn't say anything about sending her $5,000 in advance. Because I went honestly, in all honesty. In high school, I was reached out by like this face shot. What would you call it? A headshot? Yeah, like a modeling agency.

And so I went to the mall. I didn't know. I go. They take pictures of you in your underwear. Fame? I didn't know what was happening, baby. It was a lot of yes sirs and no maims. I was just there along for the ride.

And then at the end of this production, which you think, like, you're so hot that you're going to get this, like, opportunity of a lifetime for, like, modeling Paris. Or at the time, it was like. Or for pennies. Donnie, not Donnie. Mark Wahlberg was like a full deal in New York. I was hot. And I literally saw it.

I was like, maybe, maybe. And so when you get to the end of it, then they're like, well, $500 today. And then equal payments of $500 for, you know, three months. And you're like, I don't have any of this money. How am I supposed to do this? And I was positive that these two things were somehow synonymous. But Joe, I'm glad I did talk to me off the phone call. If you've got nine people following your blog for some big production company.

For sure. How in the world did she see that? Yeah. So it was a, and then they literally a few weeks later they come in. And they were legit. I mean, all the equipment and the sound guy has been with us for now, you know, seven years. He's been consistently with us. And I remember him.

His name's David. And he had this sound little bag. And he sat out on our curb. And I mean, it was 6 o'clock in the morning. I'm looking out going, what is this guy doing? And he was sitting there messing with this sound equipment, kind of getting ready for the day. And real quickly, it went from this. This has to be a scam to, wow, what an opportunity to be a part of something like this.

And they rolled in with the cameras and the sound equipment. equipment and Joe and I were off to the race. And it's a crazy thing I have to imagine for them to put a camera in front of you and say, okay, be TV stars. Dude. Be funny. Be charming. He was the worst.

He was the worst. Willie, I didn't know this. I had an actual phobia of cameras. But before you've seen a snake, you don't know whether you have a snake phobia or not. And this dude rolled up with these big cameras like this and this red light pops on this thing. I mean, it's like a Volkswagen on this guy's shoulder. And he was like, hey, tell you. tell me your name. And I was like, I mean, it was just like instant. I thought he was joking. I was

scared to death. Like, look, you have to like, hey, stop talking. I really thought this is going to be the chip show and I'm really introverted. So it to me, it's like, Chip just carry it. And I'll be in the background like, hey, he making pancakes. She, he literally stopped talking. He went behind the camera. He couldn't breathe. Had an anxiety. It's true story. I got behind the camera. And before, you know, we all became friends-ish after a few days. It was a great experience. It's great people. And as we were rock and rolling, I was behind the camera going, hey, now tell me, what does that button do? Like, when you push that, he was like, well, that's zooming in and out on the show you're supposed to freaking be in you more.

And that was your way to get out of the shot. And so I'd be like, so Chip and I like this house because it was just like the worst. We were like, the worst. We were in these like fights. Joe and I are like mad at each other. I'm like literally giving me the stank eye. Like, you better get back over it. Because I have all these kids that are around me.

It just looked like. my gosh. It was so bad. I mean, really, the kids were holding on to her leg because they're terrified. They were having many. Just walking through the house, pointing out features of this remodel we had done with two kids on each leg and a husband behind the camera asking the camera operator what certain buttons of his equipment were, you know, do. So three days into it, he came to us and was like, hey, guys, we don't have much. So listen, we've got to figure something out. Can you, Joe, will you surprise Chip with something? And then I didn't know this. They go to Chip. And they're like, hey, for this, last day we're here, can you just do something to just get a little more emotion out of your wife? Chip, can you surprise Joe with something? And Chip, you don't ask Chip to surprise me because it's like, I bought you a hotel. This building was a surprise to some extent, wasn't it? I rarely tell Chip my dreams now because he just goes and gets it. And I'm like, why didn't really mean that, though?

I didn't really. But so Chip, they asked him to surprise him. I come up with this dumb idea that's like, oh, I'll do a frame about all the houses we lived in and it'll be like the addresses because we had money. So it was like 20 bucks. It's going to be like a picnic, Willie. She was going to give me this thing at the end of a picnic. But I was like, that's the surprise we can't afford. Chip was like, oh, I got a surprise. He literally gets online, has been looking at a houseboat online. So sight unseen. Because we're in between houses and so I was thinking, hey, the family on this houseboat would be funny. Like we live here for the young kids on a boat. None of them could swim. I know. Good thinking, Chip. None of them could swim. He like pushes by now.

buys the thing. The next day, only and only the way he can do it, it rolls up so they surprise me. We've got a blindfolded at the lake. And I think we're about to have this picnic moment with the sunset, and we're going to surprise each other. And I'm blindfolded,

and he takes the blindfold off, and there's this semi-truck and this boat with all these holes in it. I mean, it literally looked like it had been shipwrecked. It turned out it was not seaworthy. And I was like, oh, and Chip was like, ta-da. I did. I said to die. This real insecure way I go to-da.

Because I know how much money we have. I mean, I did all the numbers for our business. I knew how much we had, and we had $20, and I just bought a frame. He bought this boat. So I'm just mad. So what happened to the boat, the houseboat? The boat, we got into a tiny legal predicament, and we lost. So we got to keep the boat.

Turns out if you buy something, it's like the buyer beware thing. I didn't read the tiny print, but the pictures were from like 1988 when the boat was pristine. It was dirty. I did get done dirty, but we broke out of the shell because now we're in this boat that we can't afford. I've had to rob Peter to pay Paul and, you know, whichever one I owed the money to was like, you know, at the house. And so here we are in this boat. And I'm like, dang, this is not the boat. I agreed to buy. And it really wasn't. This was not part of the surprise. This is part of my surprise. And so, but as Joe got off the, because she kept saying, send it back. And I was like, baby, send it back, where? We own this boat.

It's like, this is a, we own this. Well, and the semi-guid couldn't drop it because it didn't float. So I'm not joking. He was going to put it back at the dock. So it was at the dock, but he's like, it won't float. So if I let this thing off, it will sink. So he, the semi-guy is like screwed because he's like, I have a boat that won't, we had nowhere to put it.

Right. So we had to literally on the fly, build this little temporary platform for this boat to sit on on dry land. It was like Gilligan's Island. I mean, this thing just sat awkwardly, not in the water because it couldn't float. And all that to say, but my point is, Joe and I started rocking and rolling. I get this guy that I bought the boat from on the phone, so I'm wearing this dude out. I'm talking to the guy's boss who owns the trucking company that brought it to us. And I'm like, you've got to take this back where it came from. My wife's going to leave me. And I've got these kids. I adore. I mean, this is terrible. And he's like, I don't care. We're

dropping the boat no matter what. But all this happens. And it's sort of all of a sudden that red dot on that guy's big Volkswagen camera kind of disappeared into the backdrop. And Joe and I, I'd say for the first time, we're kind of ourselves. And as Chip was arguing, I went in the boat because I thought, oh, it's a done deal. I have to get my head around it. So I start imagining what it can be. So I'm like, okay, so listen, if we're going to live in this. So then I start seeing it and start getting a little excited. I didn't tell Chip at that point, but I was like, this could kind of be fun. So I start sketching, daydreaming. It's just I don't want to be surprised anymore. But that's how it kind of, that's how it happened. And so did you feel that in the

moment like, oh, this is working now? Or were you just being yourselves? Yeah. And later, you said, oh, this works. The cameras were gone. And it was now problem solving. We got to figure this out. But the funny thing that happened, we did not feel it. Then I felt devastated because I, like, it hit me like a ton of bricks, like the last day of this filming thing, I blew it. Like, I thought this was going to be fun and romantic. and the surprise really wasn't to screw us. It was to be, this is a fun project and we can take it on. But it was not that. We really got screwed and Joe and I are having to manage through that total natural organic disappointment.

Now, kind of force-fed organic, for sure. But all that to say, and we were just, I was devastated because I was like, man, Joe wanted this. I blew it. I thought this was going to work. It didn't. And so finally, we get off the boat and we walk towards the truck. and this guy's got this camera on us the whole time, and he's walking backward, shuffling, shuffling, and we're like,

and I literally, in complete disgust and defeat, I was like, well, hopefully that made for some good television, you know, almost like screw you kind of thing. And this guy puts his camera down, big old smile, he goes, bro, if we do our job, you just landed yourself a reality television show. Did you say that? Just like that.

And Joe and I both got the chills and we're like, wait, that? What was interesting about that? I just got screwed. There's no way I can ever make this 15th. thousand bucks back. How is that entertaining? And his point was just, hey, y'all were natural. You were yourselves. You forgot about the camera. You know, all the normal stuff that you would think about prior to buying a houseboat happened because of that freaking houseboat. So I tell my friends

and I actually do this little seminar, I only charge people like nine or ten bucks. And I teach him about like how really bad things can be really smart if you just filter it through the right circumstances. I actually wrote a book. You should do a whole book on all the stupid things that just were stupid. Baby, what, I did write a book and did that. But those were, like, stupid things that turned out good. What about the stupid things that were just stupid? Well, that's what I'm saying.

I wrote a book. I don't mean to go on and on about myself and, like, brag all the time. But it's called Capital Gains, the Smart Things I Learned, Doing Stupid Stuff. And this is a perfect example. It appears stupid to people who aren't smart enough to decipher stupidity versus geniality. Yeah. Genius. That moment was the houseboat, which got you, the sheep.

gets to the success over five seasons of the show, doesn't it, where you could just be yourselves. Because people are like, why is that show so good and why is it so popular? There are a bunch of shows where people are renovating houses and they're likable enough people, but there's something different about your show, obviously given the response to it. Are you able to put your finger, Joanna, on why it took off the way it did? No. I can't. I mean, you're gorgeous, So that might be something. That's not something. I even, because when we think about ourselves.

If I were at home watching television, I'd watch a show with you. Because you were the creeper who loved the three sisters behind the register. Maybe if you had a show with your two sisters, I mean, the ratings would just skyrocket. Maybe I was dragging this thing down all these years. But Willie, driving here, we both are like, can you believe Willie Geist is in Waco, Texas? I swear to you. It still. Look at you.

It hasn't settled in that people would come from New York City to interview us in a, you know, broke down building. Like, it doesn't, and I don't ever want it to sink in. I don't ever want it to become normal. Like, you think once it's there, then it's just, I want to stay in this place of like, I don't get it. Bewilderment. Yes, and even with the show, we don't know what, you know, I'd like to say there was just hope. There was, you see these families, you see these projects that just, looked daunting, they looked hard, and that's when we love to step in and say, hey, let's help you

see the finish line. Let's help you get there. And there's just something about that that I feel like people resonated with. There's just hope in the show. There's the hope of seeing what it becomes and not just the house. I think it's just, you know, how maybe we problem solved together, but even seeing these families knowing we can walk away and now they get to settle into their home, I don't know. I think there's just something that's so special about that. But again, as far as like putting my finger on, no idea. What about you, Chip? You thought about it at all?

I mean, I would argue if it's not her being hot, then it must be me. You being hot or just you in general? Just me in general. Yeah, back in high school, back when I did that headshot thing, absolutely me being hot. But now, I'm pretty self-aware. I've seen myself in the full-length mirror, and I'm like, no way is anybody tuning into this because I'm hot. But, you know, funny and charming and... I mean, you ran through walls.

Rustically handsome. I like that. Could work. But why, how the show resonated. I don't know, we've been asked that question a lot, and we almost always turn it back to the question asker. Like, I don't, you would have a better opportunity answering that question than for us, because for us, it's like watching family videos of yourself.

It's like, of course you're in love. with the family and the video that you're watching, but other people watching that wouldn't be equally as interested, you know? So I think part of the two guys is your humility about it. I think, honestly, maybe it's because you don't have a TV and you don't even know the impact you're having, maybe. I'm sure you feel it when you go to silobration and you see the crowds that come into town.

But that must be a crazy thing to know that people from across the country and around the world are flying into Dallas, catching a connection to Waco, to come and buy things at Magnolia or maybe catch a glimpse of you too. Sure. Is that just a nuts proposition? We were yesterday.

We were at the silos and I was looking down and I was like, Chip, I'm going to go walk out there. He's like, what? I'm like, I'm going to go walk out there. I want to go meet some people. So we walk out, walk out with a few friends. And I asked people where they're from. And it was L.A., New York at Lina. And I'm sitting there going, what?

Like people planned an actual weekend trip to come here from all over the map. There wasn't, I really thought it'd be like, San Antonio, Dallas, like close. Sure. And it was people from all over. And I think I left that when I went back upstairs. Like, this is crazy that people would come to this event, even celebration. The fact that they'd come, drive here, fly here, make plans. And it just be a thing for them, I think just was really, it felt like, wow, this is special.

But it's a crazy honor. And I think that that's, you know, you say humility and I appreciate that because from my perspective, specifically, it's like, I've never been a humble guy. You know, that's not a thing that you'd naturally assume about me. But in this experience, it is so humbling because you really know there's something about these folks coming to town to get a glimpse of us to your point, experience some of the things that we've built. That's just, it becomes like a complete honor.

I mean, it's just like you feel a whole lot less about, I want to beat my chest like King Kong and more like, I want to thank people. I want to say, thanks for watching the show, man. That meant the world to us for us to put ourselves out there in that way. And on Tuesday nights, Joe and I would go to a friend's house, hold hands, have popcorn, and watch it just like everybody else was watching it. We'd watch and go, this is cute, man. This is a great, fun show about a family.

It just happens to be about our family. So, again, it makes sense that we like it. It makes sense that my grandmother likes it. But why does everybody else like it? And that's the part that every Tuesday night we would leave just going, I cannot believe people are watching this. This is mind-boggling. And it just kind of, I don't know, sets us up in a really healthy place to where we just feel extremely thankful.

And then there are these crazy moments along the way. We were talking about the last time I saw you was in April at the time 100. So you find yourselves a builder and a designer from Waco, Texas on a list with heads of state and Taylor Swift. Stop. And activists. Stop it. Athletes. And there you are in that same room.

and Taylor Swift looks up and points at you guys because she wants to meet you. Stop. How do you process moments like that? You can't. Yeah. We couldn't. He's trying to. What's the lady's name that would always make people cry in the end?

Barbara Walters. She called and gave me a list of questions. Oh my gosh. That hurt in a real, like, little boy kind of place. I mean, Willie, we walked into this room. We knew we were invited. I mean, we knew that we were technically supposed to be there. This is actually a funny story.

We get out. We're in this. line of basically limousines. You know, they're just vans, but, you know, you kind of feel like, you know, a limousine at a prom kind of an event. So you're getting dropped off. We have to wait in line, obviously, is each individual person that's been invited to this thing gets out of their car.

And so here we are, and we get pulled up. And the first guy I see, did I tell you this? Do you know who the first guy I saw? Okay. So the first guy I see when I get out of my little van is literally ninja, the gaming, like, legend. Well, I only sort of know the guy, but my kids are like infatuated with this dude. So I see him.

He's got this purple hair. He's got his beautiful date on his hip. And I was like, oh, my gosh, there's Ninja. I'm going to go get a picture with this guy. So I go get a picture, Joe and I and Ninja, send it to my boys. All the kids are freaking out about this experience. You know, Merrill Streep's there and here my kids are geeked out about Ninja. But all that to say was just like it set in really quickly and very overwhelmingly.

that it was like, what are we doing here? I felt like we had crashed a wedding, and we were like kids, and we were like, oh, don't let them see us. Oh, the whole time. I forgot how to speak English. We forgot a lot of things. I think the second we stepped out of the van, we saw all the people that, like, take pictures. And we were like, in my mind, literally, I'm like, oh, they're not going to be like,

who are those two jokers? So we step out and they start saying her name. I'm like, oh, gosh, they know us. They're like, hi. Then we get to this moment of like red carpet. And people do they yell at you. Chip and Joanna. Yeah.

So I'm literally thinking. And oh, we know some people in New York. So, Chip's, like, trying to make icon, like, find the person that said his name. Like, Chip, let's keep walking. But then we get to that moment where there's the red carpet. And I said, oh, I don't want to do that. Let's, I wanted to go the other way. And she goes, this is the only way in.

And I go, oh, crap. So we had to walk on the red, no one trained you on, like, how you stand, how you don't smile or smile. Well, tell them about that, that girl. Oh, Sophia Bush. Oh, yes. She was adorable. So she and Joe become kind of, you know, Twitter or Instagram friends. So sweet Sophia hangs out with Joe and teaches her like how to stand in these certain ways,

which felt, everything just felt awkward. But it was precious watching her do that. She was giving you the poses. She was giving you the poses. She was giving this hip thing. And right when she did it, I was like, you do look hotter somehow. How is that? Hotter than, hey.

Well, she did. She took out her makeup and made a few little modifications to Joe's beautiful face. And I was like, where is Sophia Bush in our life? Did you have your poses too, Chip? No, she was like, there's nothing we can do with you. She did. She poses, like, arm up and just like, hey, we made it. Hey, have you seen the Saturday Night Live skit to where Chris Farley falls into that, like, like, dining room table?

She was like, if you could do more of that, we might be able to get you out of here. I was like, I can do that. So everything was just overwhelming. Like, well, this is, this is a different caliber. Like, this is two people from Waco. We just didn't feel. We just felt, A, we weren't prepared. Like, we were literally thought, this could be a fun party.

And then the second we said, we were like, oh, shoot. We were not prepared. a big deal. Somebody asked us a question about what art had inspired us over the last six months. No, I would never ask Chip a question like that because I knew he couldn't. He was like, oh, what Twinkie did you eat last? Wait, can I tell you though for real? I think you did interview and you said if you could say one thing on stage and speak on it for 60 minutes. This is the funny, this is true. This was a good one though. And I've been messing with her for Mark. So in my mind, T. Jacks with me. So in my mind, well, I'm my, I have blacked out. So even seeing you there

Black, out. Was really like, oh, home, Willie, please help us. Take us away. She said she tried to hug you in this really odd way and that you were a little put off by it. I don't know. But you asked a question in my mind is just blank. And I'm not feeling super. At this point, I'm like, what are we doing here?

You look gorgeous. Well, thank you. But I should have felt confident. I was blank. And so you said, if you could talk about anything. And not prepare and do it for an hour. And I said confidence. But I didn't mean like on being.

confident. I meant, I meant, like, confidence in who you are and what you're meant to be, but I only stopped at confidence. Confidence. And I was like, oh, yeah. You could just randomly give an hour speech about confidence. And Chip, after that was like, huh, confident. But I didn't mean the confidence. The rest of the deal, I'm doing my push-up braw going, oh, confidence, oh, look at me, I'm freaking hot. And I was like, what is wrong with you? We'll give you a pass on that one. That was a crazy night. I can't remember what I said. I do remember when you came in. We had our little Today Show corner.

Okay. And I could see you guys just go. Yeah, exactly. We saw someone new. We hanged out here for a little bit. We were going to leave. Yeah. We wanted to just party.

You had like five or six other people you had to get to. And Joe and I literally would not leave your little. Well, those are like two minute things, which is a weird thing anyway. Okay. But I wanted you to be able to hang out and get a drink or something at least. We needed some shots. But the truth about that night, and I said this to you earlier, is there were as many people in that room. impressed by you and looking at you as you were there. I mean, Taylor Swift, what was the gesture?

Stop. Show me the gesture. And literally did it and I could see the heart clearly. And I was like, it's like me. I don't really know how to do this naturally. Now it's not down there. That's for sure. Well, you know, with the like, look, I'm pregnant and the guys behind the girl. I suck at that. Mine's Joe's always like, that's like an octagon. Because your fingers are tiny. Oh. Well, babe, you don't have to go into all that. Well, show Willie. It's okay. You talked about some other things. Well, all I know is we've got five children. Everything must be all right in some way. Go ahead. Keep going.

Sorry. Well, you didn't have to be personal like that. I tried to hurt a dark place there for a second. But Taylor Swift walks in. The air heart. Not to you. No. Didn't have a break.

Even as I saw her, I literally was like, oh, my God. She did air heart. It is as dorky as we are. We're like, I wonder who she's air-hearting. And we look behind us. And we're like, wait, there's no one but me. It was a sweet moment. It was amazing.

And I mean, the, the, the energy that Taylor brings with her. I mean, you know, as powerful as all those people, I mean, the rock. The rock is not, but, you know, 20 feet from us. And when she walks in the room, all the oxygen gets kind of sucked to her little environment. And the rest of us are just like gasping for air. I mean, it was really fascinating. For her to do that thing, I don't know how I didn't faint.

I did not get an air heart. You did clear. I think you're exclusive air heart for the games. knew it. And it's, when she did that to you, I literally was like, Joe's going to make it. She's going to be like a big deal. And I'm going to be like her, I don't know, I'd be your like road manager. Carrier bags. Yeah, carry some stuff. Which is what you're doing at the hotel. Is that my understanding? The bell hop. I'm going to be the bell hop. And even the perfect little red thing, I mean, back to my point, I saw something like that at the front of this hotel. The first day I laid eyes on it.

I could see the elevator operator. I could see the employees bustling. I mean, I could see the employees bustling. around. I mean, it really did feel like a step back in time a little bit. Stick around to hear more from Chip and Joanna Gaines on the Sunday Sit Down podcast, including how they tried in the middle of their meteoric rise to superstardom to keep life normal for their kids and their plans for their own new television network. Welcome back to the Sunday Sit Down podcast. Now more of my conversation with Chip and Joanna Gaines. So how do you give in what we're talking about right now in the way your lives have changed? How do you keep it normal for your kids?

Yeah. Because I think you've done a great job of that. I just don't know how you've done it. You know, I think when you ended the show, you said part of it was to just kind of circle up as a family and focus on that. How do you, the range of kids is 14? 14's our oldest and then one's our youngest, yeah. How do you keep it normal for them when they're at school

and they're Chip and Joanna's kids and all that? How do you work on that? It's nice that all the kids are homebodies. And I don't know. It's not like we instill that. It's just they naturally love being home. I don't know if it's just the farm and that you have everything that I think any kid would want on the farm. You've got the animals.

You've got the land. You can just go outside and be a kid that I think being home for them is their favorite thing. So it's not like they want to go out a ton. And even when we go out, we always, we're in the car and we're like, hey, if, whether I'm in Target or at a restaurant, you know, hey, if people come up to us, remember they're coming into town. Like we always explain it to them. They've come into town to come experience the silos, to see Waco. and, you know, since they're coming for this, we have to, you know, hold on, how am I saying this? You can help me.

The fact that they're, the fact that they're coming into town for this, we're going to be pleasant. And we're not a, I wouldn't. You'd be gracious. Plan B, plan B, abort. We always talk to the kids. No. And we're going to be like, we only sort of hate you. I would say the kids do.

They'd always get, because we think we're normal and then we walk in. And all of a sudden, the kids kind of peel back. because we don't love people taking pictures of the kids, and they kind of go do their thing. And I started realizing, oh, you know, if they don't understand the heart of this, then they just, like, why are we doing this? So it now becomes a thing where when we, before we go in anywhere,

even if it's at the silos, it's like, hey, these people have come here. So we're going to host them well. And if I run into that target, hey, and I need to take a picture, you guys just, it's almost like we've tried to make it normal for them, that this is our new normal. And once you explain the heart and the why behind it, they get on board. It's just when we weren't.

They were confused and a little bit scared. Like, why is this lady touching my face? Right. You know, now they understand it. And it is something that I feel like they've adapted to. And, you know, they're just, I think they've just, the way they've handled this is they're kind of like our heroes. Like you just watch them and they're like, kids are just resilient. They're tough.

They're also kind. And they don't have a million filters. They have to filter things through. They just see it as, that's a person who wants a picture. That's fun. You know, it's just, I don't know, they've handled it so well. seems like an extension of work to them to some extent. When we're out and something like that happens, they just realize basically mommy and daddy

are working when we go and do these pictures or if we chat with folks for a minute. But, you know, I appreciate you saying that we've done a good job because we have to have done a good job. You know, when this is all done with those kids, we'll trade all of this and move to some mountain cabin in Tennessee tomorrow hang out with Taylor Swift maybe. I don't know. But before we look up and find out that what we've done here has somehow adversely affected those kids. And to your point, it's definitely that they know that this is not, you know, average or not normal, quote unquote, but I would argue our life wasn't going to be

average or normal regardless. So this has definitely amplified that and made things a little bit more complicated. But for us and the kids, it's just like, y'all, it's us. It's us versus the world. Gaineses do hard things. We can make it, you know, no matter what, if we'll kind of stick together. And I think that somehow the backbone of some of those philosophies that we've instilled in these kids back when we were just completely broke, I think we'll prove. And here's the awesome part of this. I mean, you know, the proof is not in the pudding. You know, these kids got to go to school and go graduate from school and go to college potentially and go off and start their careers and become family people of their own. Then we can step back and say,

we did it. You know, the proof's in the pudding, where now we're still in the process of this whole thing. And I think just the fact that we know for a fact, if any of this stuff were to make it impossible for us to raise these kids, right? We would abandon it, and I think they know that. I think they feel that. Well, you showed your priorities when you walked away from the most popular show on television to make your family a priority. I appreciate that. Yeah. That wasn't an easy decision. I'm sure. We wrestled with some council. for lack of a better term, that sort of helped us articulate, do we want to do this or not? And I would say the overwhelming majority of those people said, you do what you want to do, but make no mistake.

When you turn that television show off, all of this other stuff will come crumbling down. And Joe and I knew that that was a very real possibility. And we both said, our kids, our marriage, our life is worth all of this stuff basically going away. and we kind of mourned it. I mean, it was a sad season where we were like, I think this is going to be over. And instead, when we turn the television off in some irony, the exact opposite occurred.

I mean, we got invited to that Times 100 event a year and a half after the last episode it aired. So how we are still relevant in that way without the television show really speaks volumes to that us being real to who we were was more important than that television show being broadcast to millions of people every week, you know? And that's encouraging.

I mean, I think if we could all take the lesson, and Joe talks about this in the magazine, it's like if we would all be who God made us to be and actually walk out in that, I think the world would be a whole lot better place. But the problem is we all become who our parents wanted us to be, or we become what society tells us we have to be. You know, instead of who we were supposed to be,

and I think that the television show was a bit of an example of like, hey, who we're supposed to be is not on television for a season. And this is probably all going to come crumbling down the second we make this decision. And for that, ironic and complete opposite reality to have occurred is pretty powerful testimony to just be yourself, man. Being yourself is more powerful than whatever it is that everybody's telling you you have to do or you're supposed to do, you know? Any of that make any sense? Yeah, it's very well said. How's my hair? Good. Good. Your hair's hanging in tight. All right, good. Well, you did the opposite of kind of go away and have it all crumble down. You've got your own TV network now,

Joanna. I mean, my goodness. It launches next year. When he says that, it's the opposite feeling that I have about Taylor Swift. The one is like, oh, stop. I'm so excited. The other was like, oh, stop. So much work, so much stuff. So when they came to you and said, we don't just want to give you another show. Here's an idea. We want to give you 24 hours a day to play with. What was your reaction to that? That whole process, was interesting because stepping away and kind of reevaluating, hey, what are we doing? What are we supposed to be doing? That period of time was so good for us and our family. And then, you know, even if there was anything on the table during that time, we'd say, we don't want to hear about it.

We don't want to, we're really trying to just regroup, relax. We don't want to hear off, nothing. We just, we want to kind of things to stay quiet. And then when that year kind of ended, we would look at all these opportunities and some were just like really, like do a show here in this category or do this. The network thing was like, oh, that's too, what a network? Like that's a huge honor. But we were just thinking, do we do another fixer-upper type thing? But when the network, that thing just kept coming back to us like, that's a lot of work.

And I kept thinking about the magazine and how involved I am with that and how that's an everyday thing. I mean, that's why I go to work right now. It's just like how we get this magazine. How do we roll it out? Every issue, I kept thinking the network's going to be like that. but on stairways. And so, but for whatever reason,

we both just thought, hey, it's not about us. It's not about having 24 hours of Chip and Joe. It's about, hey, there are so many people out there

that have these stories that need to be told. They're authentically doing things they are passionate about. How do we get that somewhere? It's no, we didn't want it to be about one show over here,

which was kind of the same. When you do the math, you're like, that's a lot easier. That's a lot, still a huge impact. And that just involves, us, it's quick and easy. This was like, oh, that's going to be hard work. People were saying,

don't do it. You know, literally that was the one, that was the big scary monster that said, don't touch that. But of course, you tell us that and we're like, well, interesting, let's look into this way. I don't say, here we are again. Yeah. Sure. But with the network, the idea that now we get to highlight these people that are doing things that they're passionate about, that they're just, something about that, I think, made us, we just got excited. Like, this isn't going to be the Chippin' Joe network. This is going to be, yes, we want to some stuff, but we also think there's so many great stories to be told. And if we get to have the platform to tell those stories, that's a huge honor. Absolutely. And we looked at it as a business.

You know, it became a business deal for both of us. And the business, I would almost say, was incubated in the magazine. And watching Joe come to life, building that magazine every quarter, was a real fun thing for me to experience. Because again, she didn't have to be on camera. she didn't have to do the dog and pony show. She literally just sat in an office, thought about each of those pages, poured her heart and soul into the content, and then by the time you got a hold of the magazine and you thumb through it, that same feeling, I think some people felt with the show, I felt reading the magazine as a layperson. I mean, I just sat there and thumbed through the magazine going, I don't know,

there's something different about this. I love it. So my point is, as I watched the business evolution occur with the magazine, it really became pretty clear to me that we could translate this to a 24-hour cable network. And I think that, to Joe's point, there's stories that we're dying to tell. There's people that we've already met that we're like, y'all, it's terrible, Willie,

because I'm doing, like, everybody that's the, like on the inside of y'all's business industry, literally are like, Chip, don't tell people that. Because I meet people, and I'm like, listen, man, I don't want to go on and on, but you are going to be stupid rich. I mean, you were going to be crazy rich, fame, all your wildest dreams are going to come true. And that's just from our experience.

I mean, we can't speak for everybody, but trust me, this is going to be an amazing deal. You're going to make a good TV executive. That's what they tell you. Oh, my gosh. Everybody's like, you're being just like everybody else in the industry because you know that's a lot. Remember when that headshot person told you, hey, come to the mall? It's going to be this amazing experience. You're sounding a little bit like that good. But all that to say is just like when we see these stories, we're like, this is going to work, man. I don't think that story is being told that way, and I can't wait for our network to be able to communicate those points to the audience.

And I think it's going to be a huge hit. I cannot wait. It's almost like I hope the cable industry survives long enough for us to launch this freaking network, because if we do and if it does, I think this is going to change things. I think people are going to look at television differently, and I don't mean to say because of what we've done for television in that way, But I just mean, I think that the authenticity piece has been messed with. You know, you watch every show and it's about a doctor or a lawyer or a crime thing.

And it's like, great. I'm sure there's a market for that. But, God, there's got to be a market for just a sincere, true story about a sincere, true couple doing some real thing. And even when I say couple, it doesn't have to be a couple. We've got examples of people that are just doing things that are completely unrelated to design or construction. you know, maybe entrepreneurialism or something that they've done for a community. But it's just like we can't wait to tell these stories. And I think that that piece of the equation has just been desperately missing from the market.

And I think back to even your question about the hotel, like when we step back and we can see it, like the original intent of this place and what it was and just the ballroom and all that stuff, I think for us, we love that back to the basics thing. Like, what was it back then? Even when we bought the silos, we stood on the grounds and said, what did this place, what was the life that used to be here? What can we do to kind of bring that life back? I think with television, when you think about the original intent,

I think of my dad in the 50s sitting around with his nine brothers and sisters watching, you know, whatever was on then. It was the Ed Sullivan Show. Sure. And that was time well spent. It was family. It was together. It was watching the tube and turning it off and going to bed.

Over time, it's become, I think, just something very different. And now where we're sitting today, it's you've got your computer, you've got your phone, you've got your, there's so many different things that now people are watching these things in all different corners of their, it's no longer about, let's get in front of the television as a family, let's be together and let's, you know, have this moment together as a family or as friends. And I think for us, we want the network to feel like it's time well spent. When you come to this channel, which sounds so weird, when you come to this channel, that you leave, not feeling sick like you've binge watch something or like, but instead going,

I want to go do something now. I'm inspired to go risk. inspired to go do something I'm passionate about and that it was time well spent, whether it was with your spouse, your kids, by yourself, that it just feels like, hey, there's just something here that feels different. Well, we talked about why your show works. I think it's that. It's the fact that I can sit with my 12-year-old daughter who loves you and wants to be you when she grows up.

And my mom, who's 73 years old and has decided she's moving from New York City, Waco, Texas, because of the two of you. But that's your point is a family can sit and watch a show and learn something and feel good about it. I'm sure you'll succeed. Congrats on everything, guys. I appreciate the time. It's always good to see you.

Thank you. Great to see you. You guys are the best. Amazing to have you in Waco, Texas, Willie. My big thanks to Chip and Joanna, a gracious host down in Waco, Texas for a great conversation. And Maggie, it doesn't make for interesting podcast listening, but we should point out the minute we finished that healthy interview,

well, let's just say Chip and I went to break a bunch of stuff. I was going to say, I think you got to live out a personal dream of yours. I did. Demo Day. Demo Day. I have to do Demo Day. I love their show. Demo Day is my favorite part of the show where you just break stuff, tear it all down, rip out the cabinets.

Take a sledge hammer to some walls. Yes. I love it. So very casually, Chip and I walked in. There was a little kitchen area in this building. He took a hammer, loosened up these countertops for me. Love it. And he said, get in there, Big Dog.

So what does that mean? He goes, just get in there, big dog. And something takes over you on Demo Day. And I just got a nice low base. Okay. I got underneath it. And I just plow. Good for you.

These countertaps up over my head and slam them on the floor. And I think we both screamed like a couple of animals. And then after that, because we're 10-year-old boys, we each had hammers. And he goes, hey, let's go find some drywall and throw hammers into the wall. Of course. And I was like, oh, the dream continues. And it was what you'd hope it would be. It was the two of us throwing hammers at walls.

He took out a Sharpie and made a target on the wall. Like axe throwing. Yeah, it was like ax on. We threw hammers. Love it. And Joanna was standing on the side with like a coffee. And she was just like, y'all are so dumb. Like that was, it was like the show.

I feel like, yeah, that feels like living out a dream, honestly. She was like, Chip. Willie didn't come all the way to wake or to throw hammers at walls. I was like, oh, yes. No, but Joanna, I did do that. That's why I'm here with all due respect. Maggie, thanks very much. I hope you guys love the conversation.

My thanks for tuning in this week and every week. If you want to hear more of the full-length conversation, conversations with my guests every week. Be sure to click subscribe so you never miss an episode. And don't forget to tune in to Sunday today every weekend on NBC. I'm Willie Geist. We'll see you right back here next week on the Sunday Sit Down podcast.