Sunday Sitdown with Willie Geist - Cynthia Erivo

Episode Date: September 19, 2021

The world has been introduced over the last few years to the many talents of Cynthia Erivo. In 2020, the British singer and actress was nominated for an Academy Award for her performance of Harriet Tubman, after previously winning a Tony, a Grammy and an Emmy for her lead role as Celie in The Color Purple on Broadway. In this week’s Sunday Sitdown, Willie Geist gets together with the Erivo to talk about her successful career, including the release of her debut solo album and her new children’s book Remember to Dream, Ebere. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hey guys, Willie Geist here with another episode of the Sunday Sit Down podcast. My thanks as always for clicking and listening along. My guest this week has won a Grammy. She's won a Tony for Best Actress. She's won an Emmy. And she twice has been nominated for an Academy Award. She is the wildly talented singer and actress Cynthia Arrivo, born and raised in London to Nigerian immigrant parents.

She dreamed since she was. was a very little girl of being on stage, of performing, of acting, of singing, and my goodness, has she lived out her dream. She made her first name for herself in the color purple off West End production of that small theater, but when she caught wind that Oprah, yes, Oprah Winfrey, wanted to bring the color purple back to Broadway, Cynthia jumped at the chance. Cast in the lead role made famous in the film by Whoopi Goldberg, she won a Tony Award, for her performance in the color purple. She added a Grammy. She added an Emmy, and the world opened up to her. Hollywood sat up and took notice. She was cast as Harriet Tubman, a role for which she was nominated for two Academy Awards, one for her acting performance, another for the song she sang in the 2019 film Harriet. Just this year, she played another American icon, Aretha Franklin in the National Geographic series, Genius. She was nominated for an Emmy for that role. Now she's out with her first solo album as a musician. She's been on a lot of

cast albums, winning Grammys, but this is her first solo album. It's called Chapter 1 verse 1. She also is out with a new children's book called Remember to Dream a beret about a mother talking to her little girl to dream big. And boy, there's some parallels, but in her own life. Just to set the scene really quickly, before we turn things over to Cynthia, we're in a bookstore in New York city called Albertine. It's a French bookstore tucked inside the French embassy on Fifth Avenue right along Central Park on the east side of Manhattan. Why that bookstore, you ask? Well, the celestial ceiling, blue painted with stars, matched almost exactly the cover of Cynthia's children's book. So much to talk about. I think you'll really enjoy Cynthia. If you don't know much

about her, this is a great chance to learn about this incredibly talented woman who is 34, years old and my gosh her star is only going to continue to rise from here so now please enjoy a great conversation with cynthia erivo on the sunday sit-down podcast cynthia thanks so much for doing this it's great to see you thank you for having me i was just telling you for me it's seeing you again having seen you live at the robin hood benefit just crush imagine absolutely crutch it so it's great to see you so we're sitting here inside the french embassy in a bookstore with sort of this celestial ceiling that conveniently matches the cover of your wonderful children's book. Yeah. What was the inspiration for this? Why did you want to get into the world of children's writing?

Well, at first, I said no. I was asked to write a kid's book and I said no at first because I think I'm a glutton for punishment. I didn't want to to not penn it myself. I wanted to make sure that if I was going to do something, I was going to do it fully and I didn't think I had the propensity to do that at that point. So I left it alone. And one day I must have been getting ready for a meeting or something. And the idea just sort of dropped into my mind fully formed. Really? And I was really excited.

Yeah. I had sort of realized that I, the thing I was doing was something that I could share with other people, which was to see all of the dreams that I had in full detail. I write a list every year of the things that I want to happen or the things that I want to do, the dreams that I have and I'll try and fill it with all the detail and all of the times, the places, the people, the colors, all of the things, just so I can see it really clearly. And I thought that if I could create something that felt simple enough to read to a child so that they start understanding that their dreams are really valid, doesn't matter how big

they are, they can still happen, but what makes it even more real is the detail. So that's where this book came from, right? the idea that you can have big dreams, but if you fill in the details, they're more likely to come true. That's what this is about. And that's what's sweet about the story is the little girl has, I won't give it away,

the little girl has to keep going back. She has to continue dreaming to fill in those details. And it's a beautiful story of a mother and a daughter. Yeah. And I imagine you drew some personal inspiration there. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, my mom, whenever I would have like an idea of what I wanted to do or what I wanted to be,

the only thing she would say was wonderful. But you've got to work hard and you keep, I hope all your dreams come true. I hope it all happens. Just keep working hard. Just be the best that you want to be. And I never was not encouraged to keep dreaming. None of my dreams were invalid with my mom at all. And so I'm lucky enough to be one of those kids who had a mom who wanted to make sure that I was always dreaming big and doing the things that I wanted to.

I remember when I went to, I didn't tell her that I applied to drama school. And I had dropped out of college to go to drama school, but I didn't tell her until I got in to drama school. And when I told her that I got into drama school, the only thing she was upset about was that she couldn't help me. Because I had sorted everything. I'm one of those kids that, like, I could figure everything out. So I had my school fees. All of those things were done. I had figured out how to fill in the forms for the loans, for the school loan, all of that stuff.

And then I told her, I'm going to drama school. She said, I didn't get to help you. I've got to figure it out. You help me enough to know what I wanted to do. It seems like your mother gave you the encouragement, but also the honesty to say there's some work behind every dream. It's okay that's great to have the dream, but here's what you're going to have to do to get it.

So with performance, with singing and acting, how early did that begin for you? I started singing when I was about five and then realize that you could play parts. You could be different people, tell different stories, probably when I was about nine or ten, something like that. And I was fascinated by the way that I could, one, make people smile and laugh when I was sing

and make people smile enough if I could play someone else or I could be someone else and discover different places and discover different people. all and I just was fascinated by the creativity of it all. So I was very young when I discovered that I could do all of that. Yeah. I don't know that I knew I was doing it well. I just knew that it felt really good and people seemed to like it.

You know, because it's sort of, it's very simple when you're that young. When I was five, the first thing I did was sing silent night. I don't have any clue if it was good or not. I suspect it was, given your talent. Yeah. I just know that when it was done, people were clapping. and smiling and it was great. I thought, well, I'll keep doing that because that seems to make people happy,

so I enjoyed that, yeah. You seem pretty focused for a kid. I mean, a lot of kids at nine or ten or eleven years old are like a little of this, a little of that, maybe I'll be this when I grew up. It seems like just reading your story and hearing you that you pretty much knew at an early age, this is for me. Yeah, and I don't know how or why. I don't know why.

I just, I really had, like, I know, connected that something, felt right when I was making music, singing or performing in some way. It really was something that felt very of me. And I don't remember a time when I didn't want that, except for when I went for that weird stage that we go through when we're teenagers and we're really unsure, we want to fit in with everybody else. I was really the only kid in my school, like my class, my year that was very much about performance. And I wanted to sing, I wanted to act, I wanted to do all of those things, but nobody else wanted to do that in my class. I was part of, you know, a class of a lot of brain boxes. So if I wanted to be a scientist, I probably could have been a

scientist also. And I felt really odd because that's not what I wanted. But I just sort of, in the end, grew out of it and realized that that really was what I was. I perform, I sing. I danced at one point. I act. And that's my way of telling stories. What was the moment? Cynthia, where somebody said to you, you said that you didn't know if you actually sounded good singing Silent Night, but were someone whose judgment you trust and said, you have a gift, and you should use this in a way that puts you up on a stage? Ray McKin, when I was 15, I did a production, it's like a youth production of Romeo and Juliet. Young Vic.

Young Vic, yeah. And she, I remember I went to the audition with a friend. I don't even think I intended to audition. But when I got there, she was like, fill in the form, you should just try. And I did. And then I ended up playing Juliette. And Ray McKin was the director of this.

And she just pulled so much energy and gave me so much space to do this thing. She made it feel very real and serious. She took it very seriously, took me very seriously, and I felt like I was seen. And she never let me. me go. So she was always like, well, make sure that you're doing that. You read Shakespeare. You should read this. You can come to see this show. And I lost contact with her and then

bumped into her again when I was like 20 years old at the Stratford Theatre Royal. And I was doing this youth actors company. And I didn't realize that she was the director of this youth actors company. And the first thing she asked me when she saw me at the foyer was if I was training and I didn't know what she meant. And she said, what, going to drama school. I said, I didn't know those things existed. She said, yes, they do and you should go. And I was like, what, where am I going to go? She said, you should go to RUD. I said, what, Darada?

She said, it's the Royal Academy of Dramatic Arts. And I said, no, I'm not going there. She said, why? Because that sounds like I'm not going to get in. You said it's called the Royal Academy of Dramatic Arts. I'm not getting into that place. There's no way. And she was like, that's ridiculous.

And we're going to fill out the application form. And we're going to, and you can come and do this class. I was like, I'm not filling the application form. That's ridiculous. I'm not going in. She's like, well, here's the thing. if you don't fill out this application form to go to drum school, you're not doing this course.

So essentially, I filled it in against my will. Not to go, but to get into this young actors company. That's why I filled in the application form. But if I didn't fill in the application form, I never would have gone to drum school. That's incredible. Because I got in. It was the only place I applied to.

So you got in obviously a very prestigious school. That's why you didn't think you'd get in. Now you're in. And now I'm in. And I'm learning about Shakespeare and learning about the Jack Bees and learning about the classics and learning about myself, actually, finding out how much, because drama school is a bit of a struggle.

You have to really sort of know who you are. Because there is a moment where there's a weird sort of like breakdown period. Like we take off all the staff and to find who you are. But actually I realized that I didn't need a breakdown as such. I needed to sort of be confident and understanding of who I, really was. Like I loved music. I love singing and that's part of who I am. So I'm going to keep doing that. And I love finding pieces from August Wilson because that feels like it was connected to me. And we weren't doing as much. And I've found this one speech from seven guitars and

fell in love with it. And that sort of like was like a key. My acting teacher, Deaconan, Instead of, because we always, as young black actresses, we are often taught to do the strong black woman. That's what we end up being given. That's the trope we end up having to follow. But my acting teacher saw the opposite. She said, I don't want you to do that. I think your strength is your vulnerability. So what I want from you is to pull back all of the layers and to be able.

open and vulnerable, because that's when I think you're the most honest and you're the most present. And if she didn't, she changed my life by doing that because I started looking for something different. I started looking for what each of these characters needed, wanted, missed, lacked. And that helped me understand each of the people I've played. And so that's, that's what I am now, someone who is unafraid to be vulnerable in front of others. And that helps with all of the things that I do, really, I think. And it's amazing to be able to point to a moment when you realize, oh, that was it. Yeah.

That was where my whole life turned, my professional life turned. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And obviously that vulnerability came to the color purple for the first time before you brought it to Broadway when you were in London. Yeah. Again, getting lead role. Yeah. What was it like to embody that character the first time? Such a emotional piece, such a beloved movie and novel.

what was that like for you to step into it? It started at excitement because I don't know why. I knew it was coming to London, and I knew I needed to play that part. I just knew it. I didn't have any reason. I didn't have any, now I know the reason. But when it came, I had no idea why it was so,

why I needed it so much. I was like, I want that role. I need to do that. That's the thing I need to do that. That's the thing I need to do. And I was like, I'm fighting for it, going after it. And I fought and fought and fought. And finally got this role.

And to stand on that stage singing that song, it's like a meditation. Every time you sing, I'm here. It's like a meditation for yourself to realize you are present. You belong. You're supposed to be where you are. You deserve to be where you are. And that was a gift that I was given with this particular piece.

to be able to sing to state, I'm here. That was a, the show was a gift, is a gift. I don't think it's stopped giving since I did it, really. It just every time I think, I can't possibly give me any more, it gives me something else. Even if it's, when I pass by someone in the street and they say, I saw you in color, purple, and it changed my life, that's a gift, you know,

and I still get it to this day. And you were saying it was off West End. It was off West End. It wasn't... Little tiny show, little tiny theater, 200-seater. It wasn't... It was sold out every night, but then it was 200 people. Right.

You know, it's a small theater. And it wasn't... And I wasn't looking for a huge West End. I just wanted that show. I would have done it in a back alley somewhere. That was the show I wanted to do. Yeah. And it changed my life.

And because of your performance in London, all of a sudden you get word, okay, it's going to Broadway. Yeah. And Oprah's in... involved and it's going to be a big deal. Did Oprah come to you and say, we want you to come with us to Broadway? How did that leap happen for you? Yeah, so I was, it was the first night, it was opening night, and he'd gone really well. And one of the producers at the, like the party, the soiree thing afterwards, said,

would you go to Broadway with this afterwards? I thought he was joking. So I laughed at office and said, oh, if you have me, that'd be nice. Thank you so much for saying that. and didn't think anything of it. And a couple of weeks later, I get called into the artistic director's office, and he says, very seriously,

this show is going to Broadway. We're just looking for a theatre. And I thought, oh, that's nice, I'm sure. You know, theatres might not come along, when I find one. So I was like, that's nice that you're thinking of taking it to Broadway. I hope it happens.

It would be great. A theatre appears. So we found a theatre. We're definitely going to Broadway. John, my director, John Doyle, does not want to do it without you. So you'll be going with it. I said, that's lovely.

Thanks so much. You're still not buying it. No, I'm not buying it. I'm not because like, how often does this stuff happen? It doesn't happen at all. So I'm like, okay, I'll believe it when there's a ticket in my hand. Yeah. But at this point, we start working through the contract.

I'm like, okay, so this might be real. This might be real. Okay, great. And then it's the day I'm leaving. And I'm going, oh, my God. Oh, my God, we're going to Broadway. This is actually happening. and I'm moving across the ocean to do this show

that I really thought I was only going to do a couple of months in in this small little theatre in London and I'm moving to another country to do this show. I just was so overwhelmed by it, totally overwhelmed. Because I had never experienced anything like this. And you're sort of watching from the... the outside, like, this is so surreal. This is an actual, like, dream come true. You know, when you watch, like, TV shows and they, this happens, the show happens, and they take it

to Broadway, and they bring the, and you think, that's, it's a, it's a film. Like, I'm watching a film, I, but I'm in it. And, and that, that's what was happening. I just, I was so beyond grateful, so beyond please. And, and it was, it's sort of like, that moment, I'm like, oh, that's, that's why it felt so right. That's why I was, something. was calling me to do this piece. And then when we hit Broadway, the response, just wild,

just unbelievable, people from all walks of life, finding a commonality in this piece about this woman whose strength goes beyond her are unbelievable. And to this day, there are people who,

I saw it three times, I saw it four times, I saw it 20 times, I saw it 27 times. It's like this was like people was home for a little bit, which for me was amazing. It was like, we used to say when we were doing the show that it was like church for people. Especially on a Sunday morning when the first lyric of the show is, it's Sunday morning, so make a joyful noise. And that's the first thing people would hear on a Sunday when they came to see this show.

And I just thought, what a special thing to be able to bring a bit of peace, a bit of quiet, a bit of joy to people, a meditation and understand. some clarity for some people because the story, though it was written about the 40s, 50s, it still resonates with people now. And I thought that was really special because there are women, men, kids in that audience who understood innately who Seeley was and what she had gone through, and connected with it deeply. And so they would keep coming back because they felt seen. I love that.

Do you remember what it felt like on opening night when the curtain went up and you were standing on Broadway? That must have been the moment where it's like, okay, this is real. Yeah. You didn't believe it for all those weeks and months. Yeah. Now it's happening. What did that feel like? It just like the room reverberated.

It was so crazy. The end of that show, the end of that first show, and there was a standing ovation that was just there. It just went on for ages, for ages and ages. And I just, I was in tears. I was beside myself because I just thought, what an amazing thing to be standing in the middle of a dream and like looking at people witnessing it at the same time. It was just amazing.

If that's the first time I was like, we're doing this. It's real. There are people who are living, breathing here and watching this with me. It was It was amazing And then not only you standing in the dream But you're so good in the dream

That you win the Tony Award For Best Actors So it just keeps going and going and going That's what I'm saying This thing just kept It just kept giving back Because it's one thing to go I want to do this show

In this little theatre In London And for it to then be Oh okay I'm doing this show That I thought it was just doing in London On Broadway Well amazing I've made it to Broadway.

I'm doing the show on Broadway. That's it. But then you get nominated for a Tony. And I'm like, I didn't know that was possible. I didn't know that I would be able to get to that point. Then the Tony happens and you win the Tony. You think, oh my God, this has happened. And this thing that was just like a little, like a goal of mine,

this thing that I really wanted just for the character, just for the woman I got to play. has turned into this, this moment that I get to share with people on this stage at an award show that I've only ever watched from home before. Now I'm a part of it and I'm on the stage and I get to make an acceptance speech on behalf of this person that I get to play every night. It's wild. What a beautiful moment to be able to thank your mother on that stage. Comes back to the book, the mother-daughter.

I think she got fans that night. She was standing and she blew kiss. at the stage. I was just like, of course she will. And everyone was like, your mom is so cute. Oh my God, we love her. I'm like, yep, she knows her's fine. That's good. But I mean, that must have, I can't imagine for her to have supported your dream back we're talking about when you're nine or 10 years old. And to see, talk about a dream. See your daughter on that stage holding that trophy with everyone standing and applauding. Yeah. Well, how did she feel? She was very, very happy. It was like the queen of the moment. She's very proud. It was so awesome.

I didn't see it when I was on the stage, but when they played it back, I saw her do that. I was just like she looks so resplendent and lovely and happy. And she deserved that moment just as much as I did because we both, you know, had worked really hard to get to that point. And it was also the first time that I got to say, I'm fine, I'm okay. You don't have to worry about me anymore. I'm going to be okay. It was really nice to be able to share that with her. And boy, were you right that you were okay?

because now you're Cynthia Arrivo, Tony winner. Yeah. And everyone wants you in their film or their show. And so the world really, I imagine, opened up to you, including to play Harriet Tubman. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Which, my gosh, you were nominated, of course, for an Oscar for that.

When you heard that offer, I mean, talk about taking on an icon, an American icon. Yeah, yeah. Did that feel heavy to you? Did you think about it for a long time? What was the... I thought about it. I knew that it was a massive responsibility,

and I wanted to make sure that I was ready enough to do it. I was still in the color purple when they offered it to me. And I was like, I want to get to the end of the color purple first before I say, yes, let's do this. And when I got to the end of the color purple, I just sort of thought, I felt like I was well equipped to tell the story both physically and mentally, because it's a feat to do both of those things.

That's what it requires, a mental stability, and a physical's ability in order to be open enough to tell that story. And I felt like after the colour purple, I'd readyed myself to do something like that. And I just wanted to make sure that people saw her as the human being, because we know that she's a superhero. Harriet Tubman is an icon and a hero like no other, but I wanted to make sure that people understood that she was a young woman

first who had once desires. She was in love. She fell in love. She fell out of love. She was heartbroken. And that's really the reason she went back. The first time she went back, she went back for her husband. You know, and I loved the idea of being able to bring her humanity back, make her human again,

so that people understood that it wasn't an easy thing for her to keep going back. It wasn't ever easy. Every time she went back, she put her life in danger. simply because she didn't want to experience her own freedom on her own. She wanted others to experience what she was experiencing. That was the thing that I was chasing after. Being able to tell the human story of Harriet Tubman was my raison d'etre for that film. Did that feel like pressure at all?

Because that is such an important American story and had been told in such a big way on a movie screen before. Did you feel like, I want to get this right for history? almost? I want to get it true. Yeah. Yeah. Because who knows what right is. Sometimes what my idea of right is not what someone else's idea of, it's, you know, subjective when you're watching it. But I really wanted to be as truthful, as true as possible when I was doing it. So that is the pressure. How true can I be? There's no video footage of her. There's no audio footage of her. You only know what you know because of what someone else wrote from her words because she couldn't read or write.

but when you read all of these things, you look at little things like the fact that she loved strawberries and she loved fine china and she loved all of those things, you'd start to learn a little bit about her. So she liked the nicety. She liked wearing pretty clothes. She was also really strong. We know that she was five foot.

So I knew that, well, five foot one. I'm five foot one. She's five foot. I'm literally just an inch taller. So we were both small, but she was really strong. And being physically fit is something that I live every day and so I knew that that's something that could connect us. And, you know, I knew that she would sing, use music to communicate,

which is a thing that I know very innately, that communication for me, music is another way to do that. And so I thought, well, if I understand these parts of her, I can inject what I know of it myself into who she is and put that on screen, hopefully. So that was the pressure of connection, connecting the whole thing to make a fully realized person. Yeah.

And you put that vulnerability in her that you were talking about before. Absolutely. You clearly were not scared off from American icons because you took on Aretha Franklin as well. You're like, how big can I go? Who else you got for me? I know Aretha was a hero of yours in so many ways. Yeah, very much. What did it feel like to play that role?

That, it was, there were some daunting moments. You know, learning her habits, learning her vocal choices was always an interesting thing because they're actually not predictable at all. It depends on what the song is and how she felt on the day she was singing it and the version you happened to be doing. I was fascinated with her because she's such a singular person. And the life she led was not always roses and flowers, but the way she channeled what. she experienced into her music, into her writing, was really special. She was connected like no other person to the music she put out and somehow managed to be able to make what she had work with everybody that she worked with.

The idea that someone could do her own vocal work, do gospel, soul, and then do a song with George Michael and Annie Lennox and Lauren Hill. and it was ongoing. She had no, there was no end to what she could do. So there is sort of like this sort of, I hope this is okay. I hope I make her proud when I'm doing this. Because I really did want to, you know, she's one of those people that really does deserve to be celebrated just because of how much work she was able to put out and how many people she connected.

You know, one of those artists that's known around the world by almost everybody, doesn't matter where you're from. I could ask someone in Germany about Aretha Franklin and they'd know. It's either you know respect or you know Chain of Falls or you know her with the Blues brothers or, you know, something. And then there's the geek like me who knows all the other in-song, you know, Skylark and the beginnings with jazz. and she just seemed to make space for everyone who was different. You know, it was incredible.

And you're nominated for an Emmy. I mean, these awards just keep coming in. Academy Award nomination. You've won Emmys, you've won Tones, you've won all of these Grammys, obviously, as well. What has this last, gosh, let's call it six years or so since you started on the color purple been, like for you personally? I mean, to be sort of shot out of this canon and everybody knows who you are, I imagine your life is. changed exponentially. What's that been like for you? Really crazy. I, you know, in the first sort of couple of years, I sort of was sitting in the

middle of this world when like, what on earth is happening? How is this going so fast? And then I've sort of been teaching myself to be as present as I can. So really and truly, I sort of just go with the flow. Whatever comes across comes to me, I sort of let happen. I sort of want to be there when it's happening. I don't want to be there afterwards. And I had a habit of sort of, oh, it happened. Oh, my goodness. That happened.

And now I, the thing I desire is to always be there when it's happening, present, when things are new and happening and being able to appreciate the moment. And nothing is old for me right now at all. Nothing is not a surprise. And so I think I live for the surprises and I enjoy them very much. And I think I'm going to hopefully be that way into my ripe old ages of 60s, 70s, 80s, 90s, hopefully. And I hope I keep getting surprised by what opportunities come my way because I am every day. Yeah.

Hey, guys, thanks for listening to the Sunday Sit Down podcast. Stick around to hear more from Cynthia Arrivo right after. the break. Welcome back to the Sunday Sit Down podcast. Now more of my conversation with Cynthia Arrivo. There's an amazing new chapter starting a couple of days from now with the release of your first solo album. Congratulations. Thank you. It's hard to believe it's your first album because we've heard your voice for so long and loved it for so long. So how exciting is it for you to be on the eve of this moment in your career? Very, very exciting because it's been a long time coming and I've taken my time and I've waited for a long time to be able to pen my own album and put my own music out and take some bravery to not be scared about what people might think about the music.

I just hope people connect with it, really. I'm really excited. I'm really excited to be able to say, this is my baby, this is my album, these are my songs. And I hope that people want to hear it. Yeah. To be just you. Just me. singing through a character.

It's not a cast, something, it's just to you. So when you sit down with a blank page and say, okay, this is me, this is my introduction really to the world as a solo artist, how do you begin that process? What did you want to say?

I wanted to say that I have loved, that I've been hurt, that I want to be in a world that's open to everyone, that I see people, the people I've come across, the people that I've loved, and loved back, the people that may have hurt me, but I forgive, all of those things.

I wanted to share how I feel about my mother. I really wanted to thank her as well. Like I've wanted to do a song that was for her for a really long time. I could never find out, you'd never figure out what it was supposed to sound like and then one day it just sort of happened. And I'm really pleased that it's on this album now. Yeah. It's a lot of, there are a lot of stories about what I've been through and what my life is like and some of the people I've met, some of the people I want to meet and haven't met yet, yeah, yeah. I was listening to it this morning and I don't, not that you need to classify it, but I don't even know, there's R&B in there, there's jazz, it has all these beautiful

different note, the blues, has all these different notes. So did you, was it exciting to be able to sort of sample all these different sounds? Yeah, because I think that's sort of how I'm made up, you know, and when it comes to music, My mother used to play all sorts, all sorts of music, whether it be in the house or in the car. So at home she had, I remember there's like a record holder. She's got this, it's really cool. It's like a wooden record holder. And it's sort of ornate and carved.

And there's a pink record in there by Diana Ross. It's got blue writing on the front. There's an album by Bob Marley. There's an African artist in there called Peter Shina. There's loads of different types of artists. And then in the radio, in the car, she would play a radio station called Magic FM. And that has everything from the Eurythmics to Peter Gabriel,

to Aretha, to Patty LaBelle, back to Kate Bush. And then you're listening to Erosmith, and it's Adele, and then it's Mary Jane. So that's sort of like the small sport of music that I was listening to, and I would go to my cousins, and we'd be listening just at R&B, be brandy faith Evans and you know that's all that I was listening to constantly just a different different types of music all day long and I loved it all and so I think that's just sort of become part of my

DNA and so when I was writing that sort of naturally happened I'd have something that feels a little bit more country something that feels a little bit more like R&B something that feels more like classical pop it just happened that way just because there was a part of who I am Yeah. Yeah, it's very, that the mix of it is the beauty. Yeah. And isn't it nice not to have to choose in your life? Yeah.

You can be on Broadway. You can be in a film. Yeah. You can make an album. You can do it all. It's lovely. It's lovely. And I'm glad I'm giving this.

I've been given a space to do that. Yeah. And not everyone has the talent to do all of those, by the way. I'll say it for you. Thank you. Congratulations on all your success on the book, on the album. And we can't wait to see what's next for you. Congrats.

Thank you so much. Nice to see you too. My big thanks to see you, Cynthia, for a great conversation, her new album, Chapter 1, Verse 1, is out now. And her new children's book, Remember to Dream A Beret, hits stores on September 28th. My thanks to all of you for tuning in. If you want to hear more of these conversations with my guests every week, be sure to click subscribe so you never miss an episode.

And, of course, don't forget to tune in to Sunday today every weekend on NBC. I'm Willie Geist. We'll see you right back here next week on the Sunday. Sunday Sit Down podcast.