Sunday Sitdown with Willie Geist - Forest Whitaker

Episode Date: May 16, 2021

Forest Whitaker does not look for the spotlight, but it always seems to find him. He was a high school football star in Southern California, a talented young opera singer in college and now he is one of Hollywood’s most respected actors. In this week’s “Sunday Sitdown,” Willie Geist gets together with the Academy Award winner to talk about his career from The Color of Money to The Butler, and his latest role as a crime boss in the hit show Godfather of Harlem.  Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hey guys, Willie Geist here with another episode of the Sunday Sit Down podcast. I always love when I can bring you an interview with an Oscar winner. And today I have just that for you with Forrest Whitaker. He won his Academy Award for his incredible performance in the 2006 film, The Last King of Scotland, in which he played brutal Ugandan dictator, Idi Amin. But man, he's had a lot of life and a lot of career before and since that movie. He was born in Texas, moved when he was very very. young to California, South Central

L.A., moved next door to Carson, California, where he was a big football star. High school star, straight A student, got a college scholarship to play football, but eventually moved on and got a scholarship to sing opera. Forrest Whitaker, football star, opera. You'll hear him talk in our conversation about

why he jumped from opera to acting because he thought that was the better art form for him. Just a fascinating life and a fascinating career. His first film was Fast Times at Ridgemont High. Who could forget that classic? He's in that. We talk about his memories of that. And then just worked with all these incredible directors,

from Scorsese to Barry Levinson to Clint Eastwood. Kind of has worked with everybody. He was in platoon. In a film called Bird, which was the Clint Eastwood. He was in The Crying Game. Of course, The Butler Arrival. Then the big blockbusters, Rogue One, and Black Panther. So this truly is a guy who's done it all, and his current project is the latest season of a really good show on epics called The Godfather of Harlem, which is about a real-life 1960s crime boss, and that series sort of crosses between Bumpy Johnson's life and everything that's happening in New York in the civil rights movement, all these people he was friends with and the crossover of their two worlds.

Really good show. Always great to talk to somebody like Forrest Whitaker, who's got a lot of life to talk. talk about. He's got a lot of career to talk about. So I hope you sit back and enjoy my conversation right now with Oscar winner, Forrest Whitaker, on the Sunday Sit Down podcast. Thanks for doing this, Forrest. It's great to see you. It's good to be here with you, I told you. I just finished the first two episodes of season two, and man, right from the opening credits, it hits you. So for people who are fans of the show in season one, let's pick up a little bit of where we are exactly and what Bumpy's up to now.

Where we start off? Yeah. Well, last season he came out of prison, Mountbatross, and he was, like, trying to regain his power again in the community with the Italians and stuff. And some of the maneuvering and stuff made him kill, like, one of the maidsmen there, and that ended up getting him a five-family sanctioned for his death.

So that's where we ended, like, last season. Now he's trying to get this sanction taken off of his head. So the first time you see him, he's being pursued by some hitmen who've been sent out together. kill him. And he is able to do the French connection to partnering with the French connection to be able to like shift the balance of power back towards himself. And then the rest is a lot of worry on. Yeah, I don't want to give away too much. I don't be able to see it. But the French connection, as you were just saying, a little bit of homage to the movie

that people might pick up as they watch these episodes. I think you'll see that chase to the streets and the French connection. And in fact, this year, the French connection or that the Corsicans come and we're making a deal with them. And what happens is the guys are negotiating for the price of this heroin and I steal it with one of my fans, Method Man actually, takes the money. So what do you love for us about this guy, Bumpy Johnson, or the character Bumpy Johnson, anyway, who we should point out for people who haven't seen it was a real man. And this is a, you know, you take some liberties with the telling of his story and the characters

that were around him. But it's incredible how you put us in 1964. And what all that means in Harlem in terms of the civil rights movement and Malcolm X being in there and Muhammad Ali, Cassius Clay at the time, is pulled in. So what was so fascinating to you about not just bumpy, but this universe when you first heard about it? I mean, I think that when I was first approached with the idea, the thing that was appealing to me was the possibility of getting to explore the political life, getting to explore the civil rights movement and criminality that was going on the time what was making up society and this relationship between myself and Malcolm and that community and the

spiritual community and the political community through Adam Clayton Powell compel me to really want to do it and so what we did was we developed the script I was a producer at first I wasn't sure if I was going to commit to acting in it and then the script got developed I liked it I thought we were really on a great directory and Chris Blancato was a really great writer and So I decided to step into the project. And we've been, I feel, this last season I felt really proud of it, but this season is really amazing, actually.

I'm excited to even watch some of the episodes again. It's pretty interesting. I confess I didn't know Bumpy Johnson until season one of Godfather Harlem. Did you know much about him when this project came your way? I mean, I hadn't known because he'd been in a couple of depictions before. Like there's a character. Lawrence Fishwin played Bumpy Johnson. And what's the name?

I can't remember the name of the film right now. I can't remember it either. And there was a couple other portrayals where you see him. You see him in American Gangster. A number of different things you get to see. But that's what I knew about him. What I didn't know about him was the power that he wielded in the community, his philanthropy in the community, his intelligence,

and also the strategic person that he was to be able to survive for like four decades doing what he does. And I think we explore that really well. I mean, the show explores that. It explores family life, particularly, too. You know, his family life, his wife, his daughter, his granddaughter, how he's trying to protect him and live the American dream. Because in some ways he's like saying, you know, with Malcolm by any means necessary,

you know, to be able to live the American dream. And that's what he's doing. And it means that he has, he's able to latch on to something that allows him to, like, rise out. out of the barrel, the crab barrel, and get to the top. There's something despite what he's doing, being a sort of this criminal mastermind and the head of a crime organization, that's incredibly charming about Bumpy.

Did you see something in him as a character when you were reading that? Does there have to be a little of that for it to appeal to you as an actor? Yeah, I mean, I have to see the whole person. I mean, Bumpy is somebody who's loyal. who's loyal. He's somebody who cares deeply about his family,

cares deeply about his men. And I think that's, all of us can relate to that. All of us can relate to having a rebellious daughter or different problems at home and how to structure that. And then being stopped, there's somebody trying to block you from being able to achieve your successes, you know, that are rightfully yours in his mind.

He wanted to be a lawyer originally. He applied to, you know, City College in New York, you know, to try to be a lawyer. And he was turned down because, race and different things of that nature. And so here he finds himself, what options does he have? And this is one of the options that he sees. He's a real viable option to be able to rise.

And he does it. It's when you think about a New York mob story, your mind goes to Goodfellas, or it goes to De Niro and Pesci sitting at a table somewhere. So it seems to me you wanted to take this other piece of that story. And as you said, American Gangster does that, too. of what was going on in New York City, just a little farther north, in terms of crime families,

and who was wielding power in the city at that time? Did you want to shine the light on that part of it? I mean, I think that was really interesting, like this sort of battle, struggle for power for the livelihood with the Italians. You know, I mean, it is a mafia story. You know, it has just, it just has great depth in the way it explores it, you know?

And one of the things is to be, able to see who can be the head of this empire. And that war happens between himself and the other mafia with the five families. In the way his family is like the sixth family. The relationship between Bumpy and Malcolm X and Adam Clayton Powell and all these fascinating real-life figures at the center of the civil rights movement and that place in time when they're trying to get the Civil Rights Act and the Voting Rights Act would come later and all the things that were happening at that time.

It's this great stew of culture and what's happening in America, not just a mob story, really. But why was that piece of it so interesting to you as an executive producer to be able to elevate that piece of the story? I think that was one of the most important pieces of it. When I was trying to decide about doing it, it had been done a few times, Bumpy Johnson, in different ways. The thing that was attractive was that we were going to be exploring the politics of the day in the civil rights movement and activism. I mean, in this season, there's, like, unbelievable, parallels that were already built into the story, you know, that because a lot of the problems

that were happening during that time are still prevalent today. And so we do have a strong political movement inside of the film in the 60s with civil rights and with Malcolm. And the riots, Harlem riots occurred during that period of time, as well as the Fruitstand Riot that also like created the Harlem Six. You know what I mean? So all these things were going on. And when you explore them, you get to deal with the culture.

society, police, relationships within the police department and with us, how the government is trying to set our futures for us and what choices they make when they get to pass a bill like Adam Clayton Powell does. So we'll get to walk on a lot of different levels and at the same time dealing with, like I said, bonding and friendship and family. And I think it's just got a lot for everybody. When you talk about the parallels today, there's that moment that really stayed with me in one of the first two episodes when you're talking

to the French head of his operation and you say we're both outsiders to this country. The difference is you came here by choice. Somebody brought me here. I don't know why, but that really stuck in my chest and made me think about the parallels you're talking about. Yeah. I mean, in a way you see, you came by choice but I came by force. I mean, my ancestors were brought here

on a boat without their permission. And here we are, and we're trying to fight. And I'm still trying to and all of us are still trying to break through this oppression, that's suppressing the people of color of the black race, you know, in particular. And we explore that in the show, we explore it from a, in a real internal and personal way. Like my daughter, you know, has gone and made a large journey

from moving and joins the nation of Islam, and we get to understand a little bit more about that entity and what it meant to the people. And then we're looking at my wife, who, who, is dealing with the feminist movement at a unique time. She started to get involved with that and started to get into the politics of the voting rights acts and trying to make more people

vote, bringing people out to vote. So all those things were a big part of the taboochery underneath the umbrella of this mobster story, or mafia story. Did you, as you studied Bumpy, did you start to sympathize with him as a man and his plight and what he was going through and see him immediately as something more

than a kingpin of a mafia family? Well, you know, any part I play, I usually, I would always kind of look for the human part of the part that connects with me. Then when I connected with me, then it's hard to, I know I played, when I played I played I mean in Last King, I also looked for it, had to find a place inside of me that that was him and his reasons and his desires. And with Bumpy, there's just a lot of understandings that came along from doing this part about, about, about what when people live by certain rules and when those rules are broken, what are the consequences of that, you know? And if this man can continue to live by his moral structure or in his way, his own code. It's not necessarily a code that for us, he's all the things, he's a chess master, he's

a poet, he's a, but he's also a mobster, he's also a murderer, you know? And that's fact, you see him do that in the show a number of times, you know. At the same time, when you're watching him, you start to relate to him because you can relate to his struggles, you can relate to his failures, you can relate to him being pushed around by the more powerful entities and harassed by the government itself. So I think that relating, and then with the family involved in all of that, you start to care. What do you hope people who watch this series take away from it? I mean, it's fun. We start there. I mean, there's violence and there's drugs and there's power and there's all the things you want out of a great story about the mafia

But what do you think is a bigger message that people should walk away from the show with? I think that people have to fight for what they believe To try to live a decent life and I think The show speaks about that trying to achieve that I also have to give you a shout out for your French. I told you before we started You can chop it up a little bit with French. Did you speak? French before? No, I talked to Chris and I think we should let him speak French because he was in prison for a long time and this is what different things that he learned. So we'll see. We'll see if

you speak Spanish next year. It also was a good side to show like I understand what you're saying. I can speak all the languages. I can play your game. Like Bumpy's in here on that. Also the music. I know Swiss Beats is the executive producer for music on the series. And I was saying to you earlier, without giving too much away again, opening the first episode with DMX, which was incredibly powerful given the scene and the music. How important you think the music is to this show, because I love it. Yeah, music's the massive, it sets the tone. It also sets a little bit of like the correlation between Yustra and today. Because what it was to try to find in a contemporary voice, you know, what is the challenge, what are the struggles?

And it's these same struggles, and you just oppose them with the things that we're doing in the film in the past, and you start to realize that that's the heartbeat, the same heartbeat that's been going through as people have been trying to rid themselves of oppression and stuff for years. So I think Swiss does an amazing job. He's an amazing artist, and he's been able to mesh those things in, I think, a beautiful way. There's something really cool about, I know I'm in 1964, but I think I'm hearing Nas. While this is all happening, I'm hearing DMX. Yeah, DMX.

DMX was in the title song originally in season one. And that's when I got a chance to meet him actually during that time. And I was really impressed. It's music and he was a person as a fan. And then this year he was also wanted to do this song for us. And this is before the sadness of the loss of him in our life.

lives, but he contributed a great deal. I'm so interested reading your story for us about how you got where you are. Because when you look at your childhood, you look at a guy who's born in Texas, moves to South Central LA, then to Carson, and was a football star and a straight-A. student and an opera singer. When's the last time you sung an aria? I don't know. It's been a long time.

I used to sing once in a while just for fun. I like some of the old Italian songs, you know, songs. But where did that come from? Where did the singing come from? That kind of singing, I mean. That came from Willie when we were in school. That would be the offering for the groups, the singing group was using that classical voice,

magical music, and things of that nature. So we joined the magicals to sing, you know. And so there was an interest from there. And then I started to grow. And I became a singer. I got a music scholarship for voice. and did my first, like, kind of a light opera, I guess, the Beggars Opera,

it was just kind of precursor to the Three Pony Opera. And then I went back off to conservatory that study acting and support. By all accounts, you were good, but you made a choice at some point, you said, okay, maybe this isn't what I want to do with my life, I want to become an actor. What was that decision like for you?

Well, I felt like that it's a pretty square box of an art form, generally. It wasn't gonna be reaching the people that I grew up with, there are the people I wanted to speak to too. I wanted a broader reach of what the messages would be to the people. And so I decided that this wasn't the way to go, that it's better to try to express that through acting.

And fortunately, I was able to continue school. They'd give me a scholarship, so to study acting as well. So I was able to maneuver that. I bet you still can nail an aria in the shower. I don't. I don't think so. I sang in this little movie recently, a beautiful movie called Jingle Jingle. Yeah.

Yeah. It was a musical and I had a great time. It was like one of the best experiences I've had working on film my whole career ever. That was a fun movie. We interviewed him a couple of months ago. We talked him about that. David? Really good.

Keegan, Michael Key. Yeah, okay. Yeah, it's incredible. Really good. Do you remember how you first experienced movies growing up? Yeah. I mean, it was a big deal for us because we would go to the drive-in theater. Actually, I think it was the Vermont Theater.

And that's where I first watched movies for decades into my life. I mean, I never went to a walk-in theater, you know, until I was, I don't know. Must have been like in my teens. Really? Yeah. What was it about the drive-in and your family just loved it? That was two things. I mean, one, and you all come together as a family, and you get sit in the car and you get to it.

And the other was it was cheaper because I think you only have to pay, like, one feet. Exactly. And then your whole family could come in the movies. Throw everybody in the car. So that was great. And I did that, you know, I paid all much to that in a movie I directed. And I made them build like a drive-in. Like it was a movie Hope Floats with Sandra Bullock.

Yeah, yeah. And there's a scene which she goes out on a date and it's at a drive-in theater. So we built the theater because we were always like, you mean there's no drive-in theaters in Texas? So, but we built it. I think they've made a little bit of a comeback. sort of a nostalgic drive-in theater. And by the way, the last year or so, it's the best way to go see a movie.

Hey, guys, thanks for listening to the Sunday Sit Down podcast. Stick around to hear more from Forrest Whitaker right after the break. Welcome back to the Sunday Sit Down podcast, now more of my conversation with Forrest Whitaker. You started working pretty quickly for us. I mean, you were, I think you were 19 or something when Fast Times at Ridgemont High came along. Yeah.

So you were in the game. What do you, as you look back on that movie that a lot of people love so much, what do you think when you see it or when you think about it? When I see it, I just, I just, it's hard, you know, it's hard for you to imagine it's me, actually. He's got his like red jumpsuit on and it looks like a warm-up suit and so cocky and so young. It's such a long time ago. But it was the beginning of a lot of our careers. It was a beginning of Sean Penn's and mine. Nick Cage, Jennifer Jason Lee, all of them.

We were all these young actors that were launched in that movie. Was that experience in the success of that movie? Did that encourage you to say, okay, I can do this for a living now? This is going to work for me? Or did you feel like you were still clawing your way up through the ranks? After I finished that movie, I was in LA studying acting and I decided I didn't feel I was ready to be put on film. I didn't think I was good enough at that point.

I went back to conservatory and I left LA, went to San Francisco, to study at a conservatory there to try to like get better before I was put on Doom. That's incredible discipline for a young man who probably had opportunities in Hollywood to say I'm not good enough yet. I'm not sure I've heard that before. Usually people dive right in head first. No, I did. I mean, that's the way I felt about it. I remember Sean spoke to me once about it, this movie Bad Boys and I was like, you know, I can't do that. I gotta get ready. And you know, go do some more training stuff. And boy, boy did it work.

I mean, you go on this run from 86 and 87 with platoon, Oliver Stone, Color of Money, with Scorsese, Good Morning Vietnam, with Barry Levinson. What was that like as an actor to get sort of that education from that run of directors? It's pretty amazing because they're all like, they're all quite difficult.

from each other really different, but they're fueled by passion and you get a chance to see, like, keeping a singular vision towards your passion and your work really create something amazing. I mean, Scorsesee, you know, he was more, you seem to be really detailed oriented and stuff and wanted to be precise. And, you know, David Fincher, you know, was like really knowledgeable, not just about the acting, but about the camera and stuff. And Clint Eastwood was able to create an environment.

that allow things to flow without any breakage of movement. They were all different. You know, Oliver was like madly and passionate about like this story that he was trying to tell. And I was, you know, fortunate to get a chance to work with a lot of some really great filmmakers, you know. You mentioned Clint East with Bird where you won the best actor award at Cannes. Yeah. Still a very young man. Yeah.

What was that experience like? Maybe that was the moment you felt like, okay, now I've, now I'm an actor. I've made it. I didn't really, I was trying to figure out if I should be doing this as the destiny, as it was part of my destiny, for a long period into my career. So even after Kahn's and stuff, I was still questioning. Even my family was still like, you want to go back to school and be a teacher? Really?

Yeah. You come back from Kahn with the Best Actor Award and they say you should be a teacher? Yeah, at that time, nobody was paying attention. Nobody knew that people didn't understand what the Kans was even. Right. Right. No, I was trying to find a way. And it wasn't until that, I think, maybe about last king, then I really start to say, okay. Really? It took you that long. Yeah, it did, actually. I was always trying to figure out if I could get good enough.

I was, this thing where I had talked to this man, and he was kind of a spiritual guy, and I was telling him that every time I took that part, I mean, I'm still seeing myself. I mean, I can't disappear, I can't transmutate, I can't change it, you know what I mean? And he's like, well, what makes you think that when you're doing it, that it's not real, you know? You know what I said? It's not because it wasn't until Last Kingdom. I like when I was able to change my vibration enough to be able to, I think, shift the characters to the degree I wanted to. And I haven't done it a lot, you know, I've just continued to work. You think you know something and you got a handle on it.

And then you try to repeat that thing. When there was like magic of the unknown before, you kind of, you're not doing it. It's not real. It's like chasing yourself. That's so amazing because the last king of Scotland is almost 25 years into your professional career and you're saying that's when you finally clicked in. What was it about that part when you said, okay, I think I got this one now? You know, I remember I was going to be.

a couple of guys with me, you know, Daniel, and we would always be going around. They lived, they'd been living in Uganda, they lived, that's where they were from. And when I was going around with them and stuff, we would go do everything. Like I go to the mosque, I go to the ocean, I go to this place, I go to the tombs,

I go into the, you know, it was going on. The entire time while I was shooting the movie, I was working on the character, but I continued to try to experience more about being African and stuff. And at one point, they said, you've done it, you're, there's no one else to show you, you know. And then they said, they said, I know you don't want to go on safari,

but that's a part of Uganda too, you know? And I was like, all right, we'll go. Anyway. They were out of things to show you in Africa. That's incredible. Well, you know, from what they thought I needed to know. Obviously there's much mystery to the place. Did you feel like when you were making that movie for us that this is something special?

I mean, your wildest dreams can't go to the office. I know at that moment, but did you feel like, wow, this, not just my performance, but with this film, we're doing something uniquely good? I thought, so, I mean, I thought what I finished, I just said, I've done all I can't, and I can't do more. So if I'm, if I'm supposed to do this, then, then it'll manifest itself. And if I'm not, then I'll know. Yeah. Well, it did manifest itself when you were standing up on that stage holding the Oscar.

I actually was watching that again this morning and there's this great moment when you get up there. Everyone stops clapping and you go, hold on. Let me just get this moment and you just work sort of quiet for a couple of seconds. What was that about for you? I wanted to experience it being with these people in that moment, you know? And now I like walk past it. Be so overwhelmed that I can't even feel it, you know, that I'm feeling this motion of exultation and not just a moment of fullness. So I was looking for that, you know, connecting, yeah. And then to be able to thank your parents going back to that childhood that we talked about a minute ago, what was that like? I can't imagine the pride and the emotion that must have been going through you talking about your parents as you stood on that stage.

Yeah, I mean, it was cool because my mom and dad came, you know, so they were there. And I just, there's an opportunity to be able to thank them for things they've done for me, you know, sacrifices they made for me, you know, so that's what I did. I don't think most people realize, too, for us, what a prolific director you are and what a good director. And I knew that. I said to you, when you sat down here and you started checking the cameras and the lights, by the way, Scorsese did the same thing. Okay, so we're here and we're here.

Good, good, good. But you've, I mean, waiting to exhale. There's a ton of, yeah, you've got this all figured out. But waiting to exhale, and there are a bunch of movies that you've done in music videos. What do you love about directing a movie different from acting in one? You create the whole universe outside, you know, not the inside, the outside.

And you get a chance to hopefully help people rise to the greatness in themselves when you're working. the greatest part of who they are. You know, the actors and the crew, they feel like they're reaching upward together. And that's kind of cool. Is it ever frustrating as a director when you're not in the film saying,

ooh, I wish I was doing this, that scene, or I think I could do that a little bit better? I used to be like, the only time I would get like that would be like, they can't figure out some problem that's like it's so clear, you know what I mean? And I just go sit in my trailer and just wait till they tell me you ready. You directed, I mentioned waiting to exhale Whitney Houston in that movie and the music video that went with it as well.

What was it like being around her and her gift, her talent? She's amazing. I loved her. It was like really special because, you know, she put someone to trust in me. You know? See, I hadn't done that many films and I had done any. You know, really, I did it one for HBO. So we had like a real understanding and I think a connection in that way and then that's why I ended up doing the video and stuff and continue to know her as time went along. Do you like to mix up directing and acting?

Because as you say, directing is a huge lift. Not that acting is not, but you're just responsible for your role. directing everything's your role yeah I kind of like puts but direct because directing takes me a long time you know a couple of years so I kind of pushed to work to the side for quite some time I think I may do start directing like in a year or so a couple years but it just takes too much time yeah yeah you've we're talking about Godfather of Harlem and parallels to today and doing meaningful work that explains what's happening in the country now

Same could be said for the butler or for Fruitvale Station. Is that the kind of work you've always looked for? Are you more focused on that more recently? Obviously Fruitvale Station is flaring up again right now as we sit here that's telling us something about our country. Yeah. I mean I think Ryan's a pretty brilliant filmmaker and he told that story beautifully. It's a really important story about the abuse and brutality of the police and when

happens and occurs and tries to bring you inside of it to understand it. You know when I met him as a young film, well he was in college and he had an idea and but I can see that he had this sense of purpose and to be able to carry it through so we started to work on it with him and he made this I think really important film I think he's done a couple of important films I think his other film Black Panther is also a very important film for the culture and empowering for people. And so I was fortunate to get a chance

to be able to at least see that in the beginning and now out of the world seeing it because of his work. When you watch, we're in the middle of the George Floyd trial as you and I sit here right now and another shooting in Minnesota a few days ago.

What do you think when you watch this happening all over again? I think the cycle of abuse and suppression and stuff has not been stopped, you know. And this sort of separatism and racism and stuff has to be dealt with the decor in some ways. The question is how you do that, you know. The protests, I think, brought it to people's minds in a way that, the uprisings, brought to people's minds more clearly about showing the frustration and dissatisfaction and the fact

that we won't allow that to come forth, you know, continue to happen. And now I think there's a vanguard of people that wouldn't allow it to happen if there's any way they could stop it. So we're willing to step up and do so because they did. It's really sad, you know, it's been happening since I was a kid. I mean, a few people on my street were killed by different individuals and different authorities, you know what I mean? And so how do you fix that? When people have to continue to be vigilant and move forward in their way to be able to try to push forward the problem and to clear it out,

there's going to be a lot of trauma that's gone on the nation because of that as well as obviously the trauma that's occurring because of COVID-19 and stuff. And so there has to be some form of healing that happens and occurs as well to those who are still suffering and struggling through this plight that the African-American community and people of color have gone through for since the beginning of this nation, since the Indians and the natives, the natives were here and were abused and discarded. So you just have to find there are different ways. Are you hopeful that we can do better? It's frustrating, obviously, to watch this happen again and again and again. But are you hopeful that the more we know about it, the more we acknowledge the problem together as a country, that we can do something about it? Yeah, I'm hopeful.

I mean, I'm hopeful because I see the youth standing up and rising up and speaking out in their voice. And I recognize that those will be the ones who are taking our places and the nation may like some people. slowly through its loss of individuals and the new youth coming up, but at least have different points of view, hopefully, in a lot of different places. I think that people are not just standing idly by and watching things happen, that they're trying to record it, speak about it, protest it, set up places to do it. And I think one of the things that also has to be set up is places of trauma, because I think people have been struggling with this kind of trauma for decades and decades,

decades. And so how do you heal while you like still continue to fight? And I think that's a question to be answered. That's a good message. You mentioned Black Panther being a part of that experience, which again was such an important movie culturally, but also just such a wild success internationally at the box office, which much of been incredibly gratifying. What was it like to be in the middle of that sort of hurricane? It was a phenomenon at that time. I mean, yeah, I mean, it was, because it's an important film in so many different ways. It was great to be involved, you know, to get to, I mean, I just came in for a short period of time. They were there for a long period of time, Ryan and this cast, an amazing cast, Daniel and everyone else.

But I had a feeling while I was doing the film that it was something unique and special. I felt it was going to be as successful as it was. I don't know if I understood the cultural depth that it might have for the community. You know, but I definitely felt there was magic that was happening that was going to, the people were going to see it. You're going to care and like it, you know. I interviewed Chadwick in the middle of that. He'd just come off a plane from South Korea or something where he was promoting it.

And he just plopped down across him like he was in this whirlwind. He was enjoying it. But he just couldn't believe. what an event did it become and everyone was so fascinated by it and was talking about it what was your experience like with him with Chadwick Bozeman I mean I had a lot of respect for him I think he's a really talented actor so it was really great to get a chance to do scenes with him and work with him and stuff he's really kind and open and explorer of like things you know

so I got a chance to do a number of scenes with him and that was really that was great because I find them to make a great contribution to humanity. Is it funny for you to hear that you've reached the point in your career, you've won an Oscar and you've done everything you've done in your career, to hear young actors say, I want to be like Forrest Whitaker when I grow up, I want to have the kind of career he's had where I get to act in good movies and be in good movies that also turn out to be blockbuster movies and I can direct a little bit and basically do what I want to do. Do you feel like as you start to look back at all the things you've done, you've kind of

done it your way? I mean pretty much I've kind of made the choices that I felt where it was in my career. That's probably been ties where I was taking care of my family and I didn't, maybe I did something I might not want to. But on a whole in the 90s, I probably kind of stuck to what I believe. I think for most of your career you probably have actually. Try it. Congratulations on the new season of the show.

It's so great to talk to you for us. Thanks. Great. Nice talking to you too. Thank you. My big thanks again to Forrest for that conversation. You can catch new episodes of Godfather of Harlem Sundays at 9 p.m. on epics. And my thanks, of course, to all of you for tuning in this week. If you want to hear more of my conversations with our guests every week, be sure to click subscribe so you never miss an episode.

And, of course, don't forget to tune in to Sunday today to see the Living Color. versions of these interviews every weekend on NBC. I'm Willie Geist. We'll see you right back here next week on the Sunday Sit Down podcast.