Sunday Sitdown with Willie Geist - Scarlett Johansson (June 2023)

Episode Date: December 10, 2023

On this week's episode, Willie sits down with one of the biggest stars on the planet: Scarlett Johansson. They discuss stepping into the world of Wes Anderson in the new film, "Asteroid City", the secret behind the success of her new beauty line, "The Outset", and much more. (Original broadcast date June 18, 2023.) Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hey guys, Willie Geist here with another episode of the Sunday Sit Down podcast. My thanks as always for clicking and listening along. I am very excited to bring you my conversation this week because, man, we landed a big one for you. She is one of the biggest stars on the planet, Scarlett Johansson. Yeah, Scarlett Johansson. She's starring in the new Wes Anderson movie called Asteroid City. I will let her explain it to you, but you get it. It's Wes Anderson.

It's completely unique. It's beautiful. It's interesting. It's a little weird in all the best ways. Has an incredible cast. And you'll hear her talk about the experience of shooting this movie with this amazing group of Academy Award winners that got together to do this movie. So a lot to talk about in terms of her film career.

We talk a little Marvel movies. We get into her star. Her first movie was at nine years old in a Rob Reiner film. And it's just been a rocket ship to the moon since then, including the movie that kind of broke her out into adult stardom. Lost in Translation, where she played alongside Bill Murray. that movie came out 20 years ago, which I kind of shocked her when I broke that news to her. We got together at the offices of the skincare company.

She co-founded just over a year ago, March of 2022. It's called The Outset. So we're sitting in her office. And when I say office, you might imagine this big skin care, L'Oreal. No, it's like a room on a floor in a building in New York City. It is truly a scrappy startup. Small group of people, and they're sitting at one of the desks is Scarlett Johansson. So she's put a lot into this.

So we get into that as well. As you know, Scarlett is married to Colin Jost, the head writer at Saturday Night Live. And also, of course, the anchor of weekend update, along with Michael Che. So she talks a little bit about how Colin Joe sort of test drove some of these products. He's a big eye cream guy. Who knew? Colin Jost, an eye cream guy. So much fun to sit down with Scarlett Johansson.

I think you'll enjoy our conversation. right now on the Sunday Sit Down podcast. Thanks for having us, Scarlett. Great to see you. I want to talk about the outset a lot. I'm here for the eye cream. Great. The Colin Jost eye cream, as I understand it.

That's how it's commonly known, I know, I know. But let's start, if we can, with Asteroid City. Sure. Which is an amazing Wes Anderson film. Beautiful to look at, as all of his stuff is. You've worked with him, but in a voice. You did Isle of Dogs. Yes.

You will remember that. But you haven't really been in one of his films. So what is that phone call like when West says, not only do I want you in the movie, but I wrote a part for you. I'd say that it was, it's like a career dream goal. Definitely. I was very excited to read a script in its entirety of his, which I never had the chance to do. And it was in the middle of COVID, right in the middle of COVID. So I was not expecting to get any calls about work.

I'd sort of, you know, just kind of had taken a bit of a pause, I guess, and was also working on the outset actively. And I couldn't even wrap my head around what filming would be like or when it would ever happen again. And so it actually was a really even more exciting phone call to get because it felt hopeful in a time that was very, you know, it was a time that felt all over the place. And so I, yeah, I read the script and I had a lot of conversations with Wes about this character. I play a few different characters in this film.

All of the cast play. We play actors playing parts in a play. And then, of course, so I play an actor who's playing an actor who's also preparing a play. So it has, there was a lot to discuss. I had to wrap my head around. So as with every Wes Anderson movie, there may be no point exactly into asking what it's about because it's kind of an experience.

But how do you describe this film to people who are thinking about going to see it? I think the film is really sort of exploration in, existentialism. It's I think a film that's made, it's very reflective of where Wes is at, I think, in his life and career. I think it has, in some ways, is

you know, the fact that it was written and developed during the quarantine time is definitely baked in there. It's very self-reflective. and I think it's also a celebration of creativity and the nomadic circus that actors create around themselves that is something that I think comes up in Wes's work a lot, that real fondness and celebration of that environment.

So how do you describe the Wes Anderson experience? It's so cool to look at, obviously, and fun to watch. all of his films are. But on the other side of it, as an actor, what does that mean? How is it different from other things you've done? Well, I think Wes's love of that nomadic circus is really, you know, it's also represented in the environment that he creates on set. And so, I mean, I wouldn't obviously say that COVID was, I would never call it a helpful

environment at all, but it wasn't such a bad thing for how West, the space that West normally creates around his production. So we were very isolated in a town called Chinchon, which is in Spain, in an agricultural area, you know, really never left our compound where we were all staying. And this whole world was created on a watermelon. farm. So all the earth and all the mountains and everything were brought in and built, this practical set in the middle of nothing and, you know, just agricultural land. And so it just, it was very surreal, but also so magical. I mean, you would, the end of the night, go back to our hotel. The whole cast was there, whether they were working or not. There was this excitement in the air,

like what had transpired during the day and what were we preparing for the next day. We have a big meal at a long table every night that was curated by Wes, and Sue George was there playing music in the afternoon, which you may be lucky enough to walk past and, you know, pick up on. And it's just, it's just an incredible environment. I mean, it was so unique. I've never experienced. I mean, I'd say doing theater is maybe the closest thing

that I could describe it to, liken it to. It was, it's such a beautiful family that he, that he, surrounds himself with, of, you know, family he chooses. It sounds like an acting fantasy camp. Like you come down for a meal and Tom Hanks is over there and Jeff Goldblum's over here. Yes. You definitely, you know, you go to the gym. Jeff Goldblum's on the treadmill and then you're waiting for your coffee and Willem

Defoe is ahead of you. Yeah. It is. So let's talk about Midge specifically. Mm-hmm. You read her on the page. Did you get her right away? What did you think about the character?

I did not. you know, I took me a while to understand the movie or the play within the TV show that the concept is

you know, I didn't it was, you know, it took I actually had to read it a couple of times and then Wes makes this schematic which is a sort of living, it's like an animated storyboard basically that he

voices all of the characters and so it's the movie in its entirety which is when you really get it and actually when I see the movie now it totally it looks I mean it's of course it's alive in a different way

but it's sort of a perfect way of showing actors kind of what to expect in a way like what are we going to be making when it's such a big world you know and hard to understand how all the pieces go together.

My character, Midge, is a, she is a, you know, movie star. She is beloved. She is kind of narcissistic and self-involved in, I think, a way that's kind of, that's very alluring and enigmatic. And she's aware that she's constantly being watched. You know, that's just an ingredient in her life that's always there. And she doesn't mind that at all. And she's, you know, we looked at just what actors I could kind of hang my hat on.

And, you know, of that era whose career could we emulate. And I think Betty Davis was who we both liked a lot for that. Carol Lombard, you know, actresses like that. But I love Betty Davis. And I just love her, I love her whole spirit and, and her vulnerability or strength, her groundedness. Like she feels to me, you know, very authentic. And so that's who we kind of based her on. And complex, right?

So this role came to you at a complicated time for you as well, to say the least. It wasn't initially that complicated. And initially it was wide open and great. But as we waited for the window of time to shoot because of COVID and all the regulations, you know, I got pregnant. And I was very happy to be pregnant. But I knew that, you know, I had this obligation to shoot this film and also felt, yeah, I don't want to say obligation.

I mean, I was happily obligated to do it. But nonetheless, I at some point had to tell West that I was pregnant because I thought, But I guess this couldn't, maybe isn't going to push for as long as I need it to. And so in the middle of my pregnancy, I wrote him a letter and I said, I'm happily pregnant, but I'm sadly not going to be available. And I would love to help someone else prepare the role. We did so much work on it and everything. And it became a character I really loved in true West fashion. He was so excited that I was pregnant.

He said, how long do you think you're going to need post-birth? And I said, I don't know, maybe like, I guess eight weeks or something. So on my eight week postpartum date, I was flying to Spain and with my young, you know, eight week old baby and Colin. And so that was another added piece to the experience that was so, it was wonderful. I mean, it was so wonderful. It was challenging, but it was also completely unexpected. and, you know, I felt so fortunate and grateful to be able to so be able to participate. And, you know, and then I got to bring my infant baby to the table

and could be held by Adrian Brody and Will Mufo and Brian Cranston and everybody else. The stories he will have, his earliest babysitters, all Academy Award winners. That's right. Yeah, that's right. That's incredible. Yeah. Was it difficult, though? I mean, long days on set with a newborn. It was difficult because we had shot, so all of my work got backloaded,

and Jason Schwartzman, my co-star, was doing all of the work without me, and then filling in when I got there. And so it was just a relentless workload. And Wes's dialogue is, you know, and his work is very verbose and very specific. and so it was a lot to repair with everything else that was going on. But I don't mind, you know, I don't mind. I like, I loved, I like the challenge. And again, I was living like a dream come true.

As you say, there's kind of a meta element to it, which is you are an actor, obviously, playing an actor, playing an actor. Yeah. Did you bring any of your own experience to it as someone who's well known? and, you know, that have eyes on you all the time? Did you feel any of that? Yes, definitely. I think, I mean, now it feels like everybody is aware that they're, or everybody feels they're being watched or observed all the time,

I think just based on social media and how, you know, the different ways that people live their lives now. But, I mean, I, I guess my experience of feeling the eyes on me is predated the social media. stuff. So I do, I do, you know, I think all actors are, you know, hyper aware of being watched or, you know, hoping to be noticed. And, you know, I, I, that's a part of both of the actors that I play in this. You know, they, they take, they love, love the dramatic pause. Right. Yeah. The movie's being incredibly well received already. I think you got a big

ovation it can, which is always the first test, right? Is it nice to be a part of something? Obviously, you've done it many, many times before, but that has so much energy around it and buzz around it, and people say, oh, did you hear about the new Wes Anderson movie and the whole look who's in it and the cast? That's got to be fun to have such positivity around a project like that. Oh, yeah. I mean, I've been really fortunate enough to work on projects and with directors that have had this kind of built-in buzz and excitement. You know, it's, you know, working for Marvel for 10 years. People were always wanting to know, you know, little secrets and, you know,

wanting to know plot details and casting, you know, surprises and all that stuff. And it's so fun to feel like you're part of, yeah, something that's eagerly anticipated. and Wes, Wes, his career, his art has that kind of, you know, has built such an amazing fan base that is just,

you know, there's, whatever your impression is of the movie, there's always something to take away from it. You know, his work is so, uh, it's just so impressive.

And I, I think, you know, as, when you go into something like that, you're yeah it's it takes some of the stress away you know well you're so good in it congratulations thanks it's amazing hey guys thanks for listening to the sunday sit down podcast stick around to hear more from scarlet johansen right after the break welcome back now more of my conversation with

scarlet johansen okay so let's move off screen now and talk about the outset the outset yeah so you're just over a year in officially yes to this adventure that you've been on yeah how's it going? Something completely different than you've ever done before. It is. It's a completely different industry, a whole new group of people. It's been great. I mean, it definitely is, you know, it's work that when you have a business where you are producing something, developing it, producing it, sourcing it, you know, putting it together, packaging it, storing it, distributing it, all of those pieces. You know, there's, they're challenges, unique challenges that come with every step of that process,

but it makes getting the product in your hands even that much more rewarding. And when you talk to people that are feeling this transformation in the way that they look and how they feel about themselves subsequently, that is awesome. I mean, it's such a, it's, it's, it's really makes you feel. like it's worth all of the hardship that comes with having a scrappy startup like this. And it is that. I mean, we were talking before we started, but some of your friends and colleagues in the acting world who've done things like this. They say exactly the same thing. This is real work. This is not putting my name and my face on something. Like, this is a

second career and it requires a lot of your attention. It does. Have you been surprised by that? Or were you expecting that and you've confronted it head on? I don't know necessarily that's surprised is how I would describe it, but I definitely, I could not have anticipated how relentless the work would be just to, you know, continue to, you know, be out there and, and, you know, play with everybody else. You know, it really, you have to keep pushing just the same way you do to get a movie made, you know, because that's your, you know, nobody else is. is going to aid you with that. You really have to be like the, your own,

and the engine of your own machine. And so, you know, but that's how I, that's how I wanted it. And my co-founding partner, Kate Foster and I, we both had that drive and excitement and curiosity. I mean, she had done it previously with her own startup. And for me, it felt like this opportunity to approach my creativity in a different kind

of way in an industry that I'm very passionate about, but, you know, had to navigate from the start, you know, just fresh. So we definitely didn't make it easy for ourselves. But it's, again, it's a labor of love. We have an incredible team here. And everybody shares that same passion. You know, it's exciting. Fun bit of trivia. Kate and I shared a parasailing boat on vacation. Caribbean last year. No. Totally coincidentally. We just saw each other again for the first time since we were up in like a harness flying above the Caribbean. Whoa. World pals. So what compelled you to take on this challenge? Because as you said, it's real work. And did you see something in the beauty industry that you thought, I think there's maybe a lane for something different? Or what did you

want to do with this? You know, I have for, you know, since I was probably 12, 13 years old, have struggled with acne. I was, you know, had working skin forever. And when I was younger, I, you know, was very much, it was all about sort of stripping away your skin and, you know, cleaning your skin and getting rid of this dirty skin and all these different system, multiple step systems of how you could, you know, basically resurface your entire face. And I think just years of using all of those actives and trying to find a solution and feeling really blue, frankly, about, you know, and self-conscious about the texture and quality

of my skin, at some point I thought, you know, it was like, I have to kind of just stop everything and just try something else, which was just using very, you know, clean, moisturizing products and stop like stripping everything away. And that's when my skin completely transformed. And through that process of feeling having so much woe and and you know, um, concern about my skin, like I learned a lot about skincare. And I became very passionate about it and interested in it and other people's skin care and what they were doing. And so it really was something that I was, I always, you know, I was, I was very interested in pursuing but didn't

know how to get in. I just knew it was something I didn't want to license my name. I wanted to do something that was reflective of my own, you know, my own routine, my own findings and create a line that was transparent and was accessible. And, and, and, and, that's how it started, really. And then I met my co-founding partner, Kate, and all the pieces came together. It was like I knew I needed my producing partner. And there she was. And so then we just took the plunge together. But of course, it was during COVID. So that had its own unique. You really put all the barriers in front of yourself. Let's make this as hard as possible. Yeah, right. Yeah, didn't foresee that, actually, like most people. Yeah. But, Yes, it, you know, everybody that knows me, all my close friends and family were not surprised at all that I was developing a skincare wine. They were just waiting for the products to come out. So when people are shopping, they're going through Sephora, which I know you guys are there, right? Yes.

What is different and unique about this? Because, man, if I walk in there, I don't know where to begin. You know what I mean? Right. Yes. And that's what's different about the outset. I think, you know, very much, you say you don't know where to begin, you can begin with the outset. It's a very, when I say accessible, you know, not only do we, is it an accessible or affordable luxury, I guess you would say, but the price point is fairly accessible.

But you are also, it's very clear what the, you know, what the ingredients are, how to use the products. you know, it's not, we were conscious of not making something, you know, there's so much fatigue, I think, out there with just the noise in the space and what product follows what and what active is not working with what other active and all of the stuff. We say our products play well with others, you know, it's like if you're looking for a cleanser, you're looking for a prep step, you're looking for a moisturizer, that's, you know, you're going to find that at the outset, and it's going to be gentle on your skin. It's going to be nourishing.

It's good for all skin types. It's, you know, we didn't make it easy for ourselves by creating a clean skin care line because, you know, it does eliminate a lot of those ingredients that are quick fixes, you know, like mineral oils and petroleum and, you know, things that are really, you know, not great for your own skin and for the planet. but effective quickly, you know. So that's made it a little bit challenging for us. But again, we like the challenge. We want as many people to be able to participate in the products as possible.

And you guys point out it is for the guys, too. In fact, a large share of your products are sold to men, right? Yeah, we do. We actually have a large male customer base. And I think that's because the products are so. It takes me probably two minutes and 33 seconds to get out the, you know. Speaking my language. Yeah.

It just, I don't want, I don't, it's not my thing to have fuss with that. I have other things that are fussy, namely two children and a whole other career. I don't want to be spending that time in the bathroom. So is it true that Colin is a big proponent of the eye cream? Yes. That's his thing. Colin was our eye cream connoisseur. I never used eye cream before.

And, you know, Kate and I were talking about. our hero products. What do we want this line to look? She said, and then we do the eye cream. I said, I don't, I've been told I'm supposed to be using eye cream. She's like, Scarlett, you're not using eye cream? I was like, well, I want to learn. You know, and Collin uses it every day. And so I thought, well, why don't, since, you know, it was during COVID,

and I didn't have so many people to test it on in my, you know, it had to be this small vicinity. Collin became our eye cream expert. Wow. And I got him to switch to the outset eye creams. And he looks great. He's never looked better. So youthful. He is. He's like de-aging. It's very annoying. He's radiant. He is. Drives me crazy. So where do you go with this from here? I mean, it's going really well. You're going to make this new products. Is there a whole other wave coming?

Yeah, we have. So we just are dipping our toe into international shipping. And so we are now at Colt Beauty in the UK most recently. And because we're such a small startup, we have, you know, it's hard. It's been, you know, there are obstacles to being able to ship internationally, but we found that so much of our, so much of the traffic on our site was coming through the UK and Australia that we're like, all right, we've got to take advantage of this. We want people to be able to use it everywhere. And so that's a big deal for us. And as far as product development, we are constantly developing. being new things, but it takes us a very long time because we have, again, these very, we've set

the standard for ourselves high. So we've been working on our SPF, which should be available, you know, in the not too distant future. And that also is a long, long process of doing SPF and stuff. You learn all of this stuff. I bet, right? It seems so easy on the shelf of the drugstore. You have no idea what went into it all. No, definitely. And you want it to take that long. Yeah, for sure. Definitely. For sure. Well, that's amazing. Congratulations. Look at you. You're doing it all. It's incredible. I mean, yeah. Yeah. Just, you know. Yeah. I mean, I'm so always feel like I'm forgetting 700 things and, you know, I got a lot of plate spinning, but I have an amazing, amazing support network and, you know, that's, that's very important. We all have to lean on each

other. Yeah. And with a toddler at home, I mean, it's all very impressive. I mean, you know, there's, I definitely, I'm sure I left like the oven on or whatever, but, yeah. Your son will take care of that. Stick around for more of my conversation with Scarlett Johansson right after a quick break. Welcome back now to the rest of my conversation with Scarlett Johansson. You mentioned being 12 or 13, being a kid, and I think that's around the time you started when you're growing up somewhere down the street here in the village, thinking about being an actress, is that fair to say? With musicals being the first temptation or something you wanted to aspire to, is that fair to say? Yeah, I mean, when I was, well, actually, when I was 12, I had been working.

So I started working when I was like seven and a half, eight. Right. And the half is very important, seven and a half. And I know that because I have an eight and a half year old. But, yeah, by the time I was 12, I had done, I was, I just finished the horse whisperer, which was like a massive. It was a huge break for me. And, yeah, I always, I was one of those. singing dancing kids. I think probably partly because I'm one of four kids and you try to,

you know, you got to get noticed. Yeah. Or else you get forgotten. Yeah. Yeah. That's right. So you got put on a song and dance. Yeah. Definitely. I was like, I'm young. I'm cute. Look at me. Don't forget to feed me. I'm just good. Um. So how did that translate though from singing and dancing in the living room to let's get you some auditions? Like clearly they, your family encouraged it, right? Yeah, I remember my older brother, Adrian, who's eight years older than me, he had a friend in his school, was doing commercials and different kind of work. He had a talent manager that was a kid's talent manager. And the mom was friends with my mom. And she said, oh, you know, maybe your kids would want to meet the talent manager and see if maybe they want to be represented or whatever.

They'll want one of your children or something. So we all went. I was extremely excited, obviously. And I'd been asking my mom for years, like how to be on, I wanted to be on stage. And the only person they wanted from the talent agency was my older brother, Adrian. Yeah. So that was, it was cut deep. Yeah, that's it.

It did. I was devastated. It was awful. And, yeah, that was my first big career rejection. Right. At age what? Seven. That's tough.

Yeah. It was, but it was good. me though. It like felt it. Actually, what it confirmed was that it was something I really wanted to try. And I remember my mom saying, you know, this is a big investment. We have to get you headshots. And I have to, I have to, I have like no free time. I'm going to have to, you know, make time to do this. And she's like, you have to really want to commit to this. It can't just be like a little thing you do on the side. I wanted to do it. I was like ready to, wanted to audition. I wanted to, you know, to try it out. And so that's how I started. And I booked a KitchenAid voiceover commercial.

and then I booked a Rob Reiner movie, and then I started working pretty regularly from that time. And it was a time also where you, you know, casting directors would go, they'd see kids in the East Coast and they'd see kids in the West Coast. And so there was this network of casting directors that if you, you know, were prepared and doing good work and they would keep you in mind for other things. And so I really have a lot of those incredible casting directors, you know, from New York and, you know, to really thank for my, for launching my career because they

gave me opportunities to read for directors and have a chance of getting cast, you know. Yeah, so you do, you're in a film of Rob Reiner movie, you're in a Robert Redford movie, things are really happening for you. Do you feel like the big leap was lost in translation, which was 20 years ago, the summer, by the way? Whoa. You believe that? August of 2003.

20 years ago? I think that's wrong. No, it came out 20 years ago. Can you believe that? I don't want to believe it. But did that feel like a significant escalation in your career? It did. And it was also reflective of the fact that I was, you know, becoming that I was a young woman at that time, too.

So it, it sort of, I mean, I was 17 when I made loss in translation, but I, you know, soon after that was 18. And, you know, no longer needed a chaperone on set. And I was then, you know, it was, it was transformative in many different ways. I forgot how young you were when you made that. I mean, 17, you're just, you're a high school kid, basically being thrust into this world. Was that a hard thing to have that many eyes on you and to be treated now as an adult effectively after that movie? I mean, I think just being that age is hard anyway. It's just a painful time, I think.

I mean, I had a lot of fun, but it's still, you know, you're so sort of, you know, you're self-involved, I think, in a way that can be really, can be hard, you know, because you just don't, you're, you don't have the kind of vocabulary of a, you know, or perspective of an adult, you know, but you're, but you're in an adult environment. I mean, I was used to being, of course, around a lot of adults because I'd been working for such a long time. But it definitely had, yeah, it was, it was, it was, could be a kind of lonely time, especially making the transition. I'd grown up in Manhattan. And so I was now working and living in L.A. And that in itself was a hard, you know, the reality was very different being in L.A. and being, you know, needing a car to get everywhere and not having the, I don't know, the kind of this crazy energy that New York has where, you know, you're constantly surrounded by,

and sometimes it's relentless and overbearing, but you're surrounded by, you know, life and it's a very vibrant place all the time. So that was, that was hard. You're a New Yorker. I'm a New Yorker. Yeah, always will be. Yeah. Yeah, definitely. Which is why it must have been incredibly cool to come to Broadway, which sort of brings it full circle, the song and dance, and the performance in your living room with your family. Not only to come to Broadway and do Arthur Miller,

but to win a Tony Award, that must have been thrilling. It was thrilling. It was so, I couldn't believe I was doing a play with Liev Schreiber and then to be doing Arthur Miller with Liev and have our production was so incredibly received and feel, totally welcome by this amazing community I admired for my entire life and feel that thrill of being on stage every night

and the unexpected, you know, have that, it just is so exciting and makes you feel like alive, you know, and to do it with, again, with Arthur Miller's words and the complexity of that story. It was, it was amazing, just a dream come true. I was interested to read too that it sort of like rekindled your enthusiasm and love for acting and performance. Not that you've lost it entirely, but you were sort of figuring out Hollywood and all that. And you said, oh, yeah, right.

This is what I love to do. Yeah, yeah. I think I was sort of, I felt like I was at a crossroads at that time because I, you know, Lost in Translation had come out and girl with a pearl earring. And, you know, I'd been able to work on match. point and I did, you know, a lot of really, I did some very exciting work, but then kind of came into a time where I was, I don't know, I just couldn't, I felt like the work that was out there for me anyway was not, it just was sort of uninspired and I didn't know, I thought, oh, I can't,

I don't want to do work that's uninspiring. I would rather do some other thing. And that's when the chance to do view from the bridge came out and came, you know, came to me. And it was, the work was so intense. And working opposite, you know, Michael Christopher and Jessica Hecht and we have Schreiber. And it was so visceral that I thought, oh, yeah, this is another level of performance. You know, I can, I have like, my muscles haven't totally atrophied. There's something there, you know. And to get the energy of an audience. affirming for you that you're doing something right, right, up there. I remember, I was so scared before the opening, you know, of our previews and Leav and I

were on the stage. I said, oh, my God, just feel like everybody's, the eyes are on me and waiting for me to misstep or whatever. He said, no, no, no, you're forgetting that everyone has come here. They took, they got a babysitter. They had a nice restaurant reservation. They put on their clothes nice. They took a taxi here. Whatever. They came to. They bought this expensive ticket. They're sitting here with you, with us, you know, for whatever, two hours. And they want you to succeed. That's what they're hoping for.

They want a night at the theater. And that was such a gift that he gave to me because it completely changed my way of thinking and was so empowering. Take some of the pressure off, right? Release a little bit. Yeah, when you feel like people are wanting you to succeed, And that to me is that's the pressure that I thrive on is that, you know, to deliver, but, you know, in that context. And then it's the same year, I think it's the same year as the play that Black Widow and Iron Man too come along, right? Right.

By a twist of fate all of a sudden, now you're in the Marvel universe. So you're at this crossroads. We're like, I don't know what I'm doing to winning a Tony and now you're in a Marvel movie. and then a bunch that came after that. Right. What did the Marvel movies, and Black Widow most recently, due to your career and your life,

just in terms of, like, joining this world that people are so invested in and so many people are aware of and watch it. Yeah. How much fun was that to be a part of? It was, I mean, I had done Iron Man too, and then we were making, you know, that was already,

I didn't know whether I would be accepted, by the, you know, by this massive fan base that was already there from the first Iron Man and then from the MCU. And I had, or actually at that point, there was no MCU. It was just Marvel. But, you know, I didn't know what the, you know, it was kind of new territory. Also for Kevin Feig and all those guys at Marvel, because they were now working independently, you know, the studio.

And so just feeling that the audience was interested in that character and what else, you know, could, there could be, what was her story, you know, how does she fit into this world? You know, knowing that there was an appetite for her after that film came out was, that was great. You know, I didn't, I was certainly not expecting it. I was hoping for it, but not expecting it at all. It was a relief. And then to make Avengers, again, it was, you know, none of us, it was so early days in that genre. I mean, the way that it was then just the beginning, you know, of how, of that size of franchise and all that it became. I mean, we were on the set of Avengers going, this is either going to be, we're having an amazing time with all these incredible actors.

And yet we don't, you know, this could be really awful. I mean, it's so crazy you have. I remember we're going, there's a Nordic god, we have a mutant, this like rich playboy, you know, turn robot guy. I'm a Russian spy. It was just like, this is a recipe for disaster. Somebody that's been frozen in ice and comes up. It's like, I don't know. This is so goofy.

But then, you know, it was just. We didn't have that vision for it. And Kevin Feigey certainly did. and here we are. I've talked to some of your friends from those movies who say, like you go to your first Comic-Con and you're like, oh, this really means a lot to a lot of people. All of a sudden, you get like, okay, we better be good and thank God they happen.

Yeah, yeah. I mean, it's been, the evolution is, I can't imagine any other capacity that I could be doing that. Work over 10 years playing the same character and getting to have, you know, really dig in. And with the culminating in the standalone Black Widow, which was just the best experience. I mean, every day I came to work, I was so grateful to be there and have been a part of that whole creative process from the beginning of understanding what is this move. Okay, now that we've come 10 years, like, what are we making? Why are we making it? Does it have a purpose?

And, like, can it deliver? And then getting from that to the finished product, it was like, it was, it was, incredible, you know. Are you aware of at the time, or do you think about now that young girls looked at Natasha, looked at Blackwood and said, yeah, that's my superhero. That was a big deal to a lot of people. It was, it was, I think, because there weren't so many, you know, super, super heroines before that had totally delivered and that were fully realized characters.

And, of course, that character became even more fully realized as, you know, with each installment. I wouldn't say that in Iron Man too, she's really like, there's a little something in there, but it's still, you know, very gendered. And, you know, she has that kind of femme fatal, you know, vibe about her that's not, you know, that feels, not that feels a little shallow, to be frank. But then it was, I was able to to work with. my director and and make, you know, really make a character that was very fully formed. And I think

that's why young women are, are attracted to her is because she's a real person. You know, she's flawed or she has her own perceived flaws and she's, you know, she's struggles with, you know, her own feeling of identity and belonging and, you know, and she, that's, it's great. to see that that's what, you know, young women are looking for. They want to see themselves reflected, not just a fantasy version of how a young woman's supposed to be. Yeah, it helps that they're fun, good, easy-to-watch movies, too. Like, you're just in it from the beginning, right?

Yeah, totally. Okay, I promise I'll stop the waltz through your IMDB page here. But I do have to ask you about 2019 when you were nominated for two Oscars at the same Academy Awards with marriage. story in Jojo Rabbit. What was that experience like to be sitting there knowing you're in two categories and that you've given two performances that close together worthy of being in those awards? It was, I mean, I, it was wonderful. It was so exciting also to be there with Tyca and to be there with Noah and our cast who had

all, you know, have been nominated. The films had been nominated. So to be able to have that experience of going, not just myself, but with the whole cast and our creatives and everything, is, one, it was fantastic. I mean, I had a great, great night. And, you know, I had never been nominated for an Academy Award before. And so to be nominated twice, it was like, yeah, it felt like, I mean, it was, it was hard to process, actually. I still have not processed it actually. You're still working through it as we sit here.

I was like, oh, yeah, that is pretty cool. No, it just, yeah, it was, it was amazing, you know. And also, strangely, there was, like, no pressure because you're there with your whole cast and creative. I don't know. You just don't kind of expect to even be there. And so to be there with the two is just really something. I was so proud, you know,

and I'm really proud of the work that we did on both of those films. too. Do you think about as you pick movies, okay, I did a Wes Anderson movie, I've done the Marvel movie, I've done these Oscar-y movies, do you think like that, or do you just say, here's a great director I want to work with, here's a great script, I'm going to do it. Are you strategic about your career? Yeah, yeah, definitely. I think, yeah, I am. I am. I think that's a, it's sort of exciting part of it is the strategy and the building, you know, building it, you know, so that you have, so that you're surprising yourself, you know, with the, with what is, you know, what you

dedicate your time to. It's, it's so hard to make a movie. I mean, it's, it's so hard. And, you know, of course, it looked, you see the finished product and it gets picked apart by everybody and you know but you know making a bad movie is just as hard as making a great movie it's like doesn't get any easier or less and so um you know you really do want to be strategic about you know how to build the whole your whole career while still doing work that is fresh you know and and feels challenging as you know you don't want to see the same performance twice I mean, you just don't want to do it. Well, some actors might.

Yeah. Some actors might. Just run it back. Yeah. But I don't think I would like to do that. Well, whatever you're doing, it's working. So great job. Thank you.

Thank you. My big thanks again to Scarlett Johansson for a great conversation and to the team at the outset for opening up their offices to us. My thanks to all of you for listening again this week. If you want to hear more of my conversations with my guests every week, be sure to click follow so you never miss an episode. And don't forget to you. to tune in to Sunday today every weekend on NBC.

I'm Willie Geist. We'll see you right back here next week on the Sunday Sit Down podcast.