Sunday Sitdown with Willie Geist - Trevor Noah (2021)

Episode Date: June 20, 2021

Trevor Noah was virtually unknown to American audiences when he inherited The Daily Show seat from Jon Stewart in 2015. Since then, the South African comedian has made the nightly show his own, even while hosting this year from a corner of his New York City apartment. In this week’s “Sunday Sitdown,” Willie Geist gets together with Noah in a park across the street from The Daily Show studio to talk about this past year and why he’s hopeful for the future of the country after the pandemic.  Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hey guys, Willie Geist here with another episode of the Sunday Sit Down podcast. My thanks as always for clicking and listening along. Got a great conversation for you today with the host of the Daily Show, also a superstar stand-up comedian, a best-selling author, he runs a production company, he's got a foundation that does great work around the world. He is Mr. Trevor Noah. Trevor and I got together a few days ago on a sweltering New York City Day. It wasn't just that it was hot. It was your swampy, thick New York City humidity. Got us up to 102 on the heat index. Just peak afternoon hours, too. We really know how to pick the day. So it became kind of a running joke as Trevor came out for the interview in a park in Midtown Manhattan, which was right across the street

from the Daily Show studio. He was wearing a green army jacket. And boy, did he pay for that? My goodness, it was hot out there. I'm a pair of unbreathable denim jeans. That wasn't my best selection either, but we had a few laughs as we dabbed our brows and our foreheads just incessantly during the interview. But once we got through with that, it was a great conversation just to set the scene for you. Backdrop is his studio across the street from this park with a giant billboard with his own face on the side of it. You're going to hear some fire trucks. You're going to hear some garbage trucks. You're just going to hear New York City in the summer.

and imagine it all coming through the prism of sort of air that's so hot and humid you can't quite see through it. We talked about what it's like to host the Daily Show from home for more than a year now in a hoodie and also to process and render into comedy all the wild, wild, sometimes tragic news that's been coming to the country over the last year. So a great conversation always right now with Trevor Noah of the Daily Show on the Sunday Sit Down podcast. Trevor, thanks for doing this, man. Thank you, man. We should stipulate a few things for people watching and listening.

It's about 102 with the heat index. Is that what it is? I don't know. I don't know. So if we're a little dewy, that will be the reason why. But we're outside, which is good. We're outside on a summer day. And we should also say, you demanded it was a note that you wrote, hand wrote.

Yes. I have to be in front of a billboard of myself. Well, what I like is to have a billboard to remind me that I did have some semblance of a professional job before the pandemic. So I like to have that as a reminder for myself. Yeah, there you are in a suit looking very official. So let's talk about that, what it's been like. I mean, when we all started this two marches ago, you probably thought, you know, I'll be in my apartment for a couple of weeks. And now here we are, what, 15 months later?

Yeah. What is it like for you now as compared to the beginning? Have you settled into this kind of show? You know, I don't think anybody has settled into anything during this period. I think what has been interesting about this period of time is that, unlike any other time in human history, no matter who you were, you were affected by the pandemic in some way, shape, or form. Some of us managed it better than others because of the resources we had, and some of us didn't. You know, some of us took a mental toll.

It took a mental toll on us that maybe other people didn't experience. And so I think what's been really interesting is the best way to answer your question is to say, I've gone through phases. You know, there was the initial period of the pandemic where I thought, you know, I'm going to be fine. It's 21 days because that's what they said, 21 day plan. 21 days. And I thought I can do 21 days. And then I thought, you know what, it might be two months.

And then we hit that period, especially when we got into like, you know, the winter months where it was like, man, this is this is just unrelenting. It's nonstop. It just keeps on going. And yeah, the best way I can put it is I've been surviving. And I think, like many people out there, I've been coping. And then there's moments where I feel like I cannot cope. And then there are moments where I go, like, I'm fine, I can do this. But it has definitely not been a normal situation, nor do I try to make it normal.

So how do you, as a performer, your stand-up comedian, your life is in front of an audience? You tell a joke, you get the response, right? You get the affirmation, the thing I thought of was great. How do you adjust that? I'm doing a late-night comedy show where you're in a little nook in your apartment. I adjust it because I have to. and that's what's been the one thing that has saved me mentally is understanding that the situation is

therefore I have to be you know and so one of the quickest things I did with the pandemic was I accepted the reality of what I was living in and I think that's where a lot of people struggled is they didn't accept it they went when are we going back to the office when are we when are our kids going back to school when we're and it's good to ask those questions but not to live in a perpetual state of not accepting your reality and so for myself

I literally just had to say Well, what if there were never audiences? And what if you never were in a studio? And what if you never, never, never, never, never, never, act accordingly. Because what I realized very quickly was I was going to lose my mind if I kept waiting for something that was never going to end or something that might never change.

And so, yeah, I found as a performer I had to find a different gear, a different conversation that I would be having with an audience. Because like you and I now, this is, similar to how I make the show. I think of one person, think of one set of eyes, one almost like collective idea of a human being who watches my show.

And it's almost the imprint from all the people who came to the studio. And I go, okay, that person is here now. I'm talking to them. What would I like to say to them? Is there something, I don't want to say better about that, but is there something you've learned about doing comedy

from having to be that focused and not counting on 15,000 people in arena, roaring at a joke? Is there a different skill you've developed from doing this? Definitely. I think there's an intimacy that comes with this. You know, there's an authenticity as well. Sometimes when you exist in a place or when you exist in a space where people are constantly acting or reacting to your every move, you can sometimes find you don't know who's doing the thing.

Is the audience making you perform or you're performing and then making them an audience? When you're alone, you exist as authentically as you can. You know, because in many ways, it's almost like a murder. Right, right. It's just you with the eyes. And so what I think I've learned during this period is how to be more authentic, how to be more honest, how to be less afraid of sharing my opinion and having a conversation even though somebody's not there. Because I think in America and slowly as the world just becomes inundated with social media, we're becoming more and more afraid of having conversations. Definitely. Definitely. So, I mean, life is spring back to normal. There are a lot of shows that are thinking about coming back or have come back. How are you viewing the next few weeks or months and getting yourself back into that studio? Well, that's the first thing I've had to do is say, I'm not going back. How am I going forward?

And so, like many people who have been lucky enough to emerge from the pandemic, I've had to ask myself, what are the lessons I've learned from this time, and how will that affect or augment my life moving forward? And that is no different to the office. I have to ask questions for all of us. How many days a week do we need to be here physically? What are we doing and why are we doing it? How are we doing it?

How do I want to live my life, you know, in accordance to the show and the show in accordance to my life? How do I want to figure out those pieces? I think those are some of the things that I'm trying to figure out now. So for myself, what is the studio? What is the studio I go back to? What is the journey I move forward to? These are all the things I'm trying to play with.

But what I don't want to do is try and go back to a life as if this thing didn't happen. Right. Because I say to everyone in my life, if you are going to live as if the pandemic didn't happen, man, you're almost living in denial because this has been one of the greatest existential threats to humankind that we've seen in a very long time. And has people asking big existential questions about their own lives. What am I doing with my life? This is the right job. Do I live in the right place? Definitely. You know, battling relationships in a way. Maybe you didn't. So have you thought in those larger terms? I'm not. I'm not saying you're going to change your gig tomorrow,

but have you thought about, what am I doing with this time I have here? Definitely. I think my time has become so much more intentional than it ever was before. Yeah. You know? I realize this. During the pandemic, the thing that most people were fighting for wasn't really whether they could go to the office or not

or whether they could go to a restaurant or not or whether they could go to the movies. People framed it that way. I want to go do this. thing I want to go do this thing but what they were really saying for the most part was I want to be with people yeah you know I don't I don't want to eat alone on on Zoom with people I want to be physically in the same space I want to I want to have the opportunity for the human moments to occur and so I've asked myself those questions what is important in my life and why is it important if everything was taken away which in many ways it was then what was the most important thing for me I found

it was my friends, was my family, was the people that I loved, you know, because I think you can always create again if you have those things with you. You may not be able to create, or you may not even want to create if you don't have those support structures and that love in your life. And so for myself as a human being, that's the big question I've asked. That's, I think, yeah, that sense of belonging, I think has been so enhanced for so many people. I remember thinking, you know, you get in these ruts and you say, oh, I don't mind. I kind of like staying in. This is great. It's easier. And then the minute we would go out. with somebody or go to a part back, oh no, this is what I like.

Right. I like being with these people. But it was easy to think, okay, I can live this way. Yes. The truth is, we don't really want to live that way. Most people don't anyway. I think we want the balance. I think that's what it is. Yeah. You know, I think most of society was on this giant train that was just moving, full steam. You know, it was

flying, and you would be born and you jump onto it. Jump on as quickly as possible. Now you're on the train. Now you're trying to move from one car to the next. You're trying to figure out what this life is. never before has the train stopped. I mean stop, not slowed down, stop. Everyone, everywhere in the world, it's stopped. And now the train is slowly starting to move again.

And now you have people asking, do I want to get back on the train? And if I do, how far do I want to ride this train? Why am I on the train? What is the purpose? Do I want to jump off at a different stop? It's become a really existential question that I think is good for people to ask, to be honest. No question. I mean, you've had, you think about the last year since the pandemic. For you,

not personally, but you as a host of a late night show, you've had a pandemic. We've had a presidential election, a new president, an insurrection. You had the murder of George Floyd just over a year ago. When you and I talked, I think it was about three years ago, we were in that studio, and you said something to me, you said, I think at the end of the day, the show us to be funny. However, I deliver it differently than other late night shows, got a laugh at the end. So how do you navigate those heavy, heavy, heavy issues and those heavy moments in our society and still be funny about it in the way you've been for the last year and change? I ask myself what the purpose of that funny is. And I think that's something that during

the pandemic, I've really crystallized in myself as a human being. I've come to realize that I don't use humor to belittle or to make fun of a situation. I use humor as a coping mechanism. I use I use humor to remind myself of where I wish to be as a person, you know, and that is in a place where I'm smiling, in a place where not everything is the worst in the world. And that's what I think comedy does. You know, when a child falls or a baby hurts themselves, what's the first thing you try and get them to do? It's to laugh again.

You want them to smile. You know, not because you want them to forget the pain, but because you want them to remember how they were before that pain entered their lives. And so now when I make the show, what I realize is I can use humor as a pressure release valve, you know, for the moments. And I can also use humor to almost deconstruct what is happening. You know, sometimes humor helps you because it's very honest. Yes. You know, and so what I'm really trying to do now is say to an audience, tune into my show.

If you would like to be kept abreast of what's happening in the world, And if you don't want to feel like it's all doom and gloom, because I don't believe it is. And I don't believe we can ever live like it is because if that's the case, then we've lost all hope. And if we've lost all hope, what's the points of living? I'm so glad to hear you say that. I've been talking to my kids about that the last year and a half because all they see in here is people are dying all over the world. Right. There's crazy things happening in Washington.

People are storming the Capitol building. And that's all they see and know. And I always tell them it's much more light than dark in the world. but that's sometimes a hard thing to convey. And I'm thinking about in the days and weeks after George Floyd, how you come in to an office or to your apartment and sit down and make some sense of that for your viewers. How do you begin as a staff and as a host to say,

this really traumatic thing with huge roots and big implications happen? How do you dive into something like that and make some comedy about it? The first thing I try and do is have an honest conversation. I try to have an honest conversation with myself. I try and have an honest conversation with my team and my staff. And then I try and have an honest conversation with the audience. I don't worry about where the joke is going to be.

I have an honest conversation. If you know me as a person, if you get to know me, if we spend time together, you will see even on my saddest, darkest days, there'll be a blip of comedy. You know, I don't control it really. It's how I see the world. You know, I can be having a really tough time myself. Not even at other people's expense. I, as Trevor, will be having a really tough time,

and I'll just be like, that's funny when you think about it. It's just a moment. Yeah. You know, and that's how my brain works. And so I'm not trying to even find the funny. I'm trying to find the honesty. I'm trying to find the conversations that we struggle to have in society because I think in many ways we've become a society

that's good at shouting. We've become a society that's good at the soundbite. You know, whether it's the tweets or whether it's the Facebook post or whether it's the comment on Instagram, we're really good at that. And I don't think people shouldn't have opinions

but man, we should get better at having conversations about those opinions. Because I don't know about you, but I grew up in a world where I didn't agree with my friends on everything. And that was fine. Yeah, yeah. What made us friends was that we agreed on most things.

Right. And so that's what I'm trying to do. So are you hopeful that we can have those conversations. I try to remain hopeful, but then I also know how people consume media and people who agree with you will probably watch you and people who don't will watch Fox or O-A-N or whatever the other networks are. How do we, and this is a big question, you may have the answer, how do we get back to some place where we can have conversations, where it's not just about the tweet that was a burn or that, you know, that's what politicians do now. Yes.

They just want to signal to their side that I'm fighting for you, and here's a tweet. How do we get back somewhere, not perfect, but somewhere in the middle where we can talk. So I think there are a few things that I've had to acknowledge for myself as a person. Is one, who am I talking to and why? You know, I think there are a lot of bad faith actors out there. A lot of people who don't want to have a conversation with you. They just want to, quote, unquote, own you. I'm not trying to have a conversation with that person.

but there are many people who I am trying to have a conversation with and so when you ask me how I think we can get there I don't know how the we can be collectively but to go to the old adage I'll just try and be the change you know I'll try and talk to as many people I don't agree with as possible I'll try to engage them in a civil manner you know I try and stay away from from like the straight up like bam bam you know don't get me wrong I was still going to tell jokes I'm still going to have fun with that

and if you come at me at I will come and I'll come back at you with a joke. I mean, I'm still a comedian in that way. When it comes to like hard conversations, I would like to have those more and more with people. You know, I would like to have more moments where I engage someone in a space where we know we don't agree, but we both see each other as human beings. I want to practice that more and more and more as a person. And so on a societal level, I don't think it is possible for us to ever get back to that until we look at all of the things that make it impossible.

So social media, social media fundamentally makes it impossible because it is designed to get as much engagement as possible. That's how they generate what they generate, you know? And so maybe there's a way to clean that up. Maybe there's a way to say to social media companies, hey, we're incentivizing you to find some way to make people not just enemies with each other. Stop putting these posts up of Willie where Trevor says

he wants to burn down his house. You know, he doesn't need to see that. How is it helping? him. Right. And in media, I think we have a role to play. Are we only broadcasting conflict, or are we trying to have civil conversations, you know? Because the thing that I always try and explain to people is this. You know, this is like how I think of my show. I go, I don't pretend to not be biased. I have my opinions. Yep. And I share them with people. What I hope we can start to do more of in society is agree on a reality. Then we can fight about that reality. Right. You know,

So think of it like a game of basketball. Everyone is fighting over the same ball and the same rim, but they all agree that those things are there. Then they can fight about how the game is played. That was a foul, that wasn't a foul. You know, you've got this many points. I'm going to beat you. But you're agreeing on the reality of the game.

Right now in society, we're getting to a place where we don't even agree that there's a ball. So I mentioned new administration. How has it been for you digging into the Biden administration? Obviously much different from the Trump administration, but do you approach the show differently with this man in the office? Definitely.

Yeah. Definitely. I mean, there is no lying that Donald J. Trump was, I think it was Jeff Zucker who called him this back in there's a one-man publicity wrecking ball machine. That's really, it's just chaos.

Yeah. You know? There's no denying that that's what Donald Trump brought. Now, while that, I think, had good elements because it brought people into politics that weren't necessarily,

interested before, the downside was it all became about him. And I honestly believe that most issues in society are not about Donald Trump. They're not all his fault. They're not all because of him. He might be a symptom, but he's not the cause. And so because he was really good at garnering that attention, it then made society unable to have conversations around the real issues that were taking place.

You know, and so now I'm trying to focus more on the issues than on the politics of the issues because that's the thing about America as well that I've really come to realize, especially during the pandemic, is America makes everything political. Everything is left or right. Everything is red or blue.

I didn't grow up like that. You know, I hear people all the time in America saying, well, as a Republican, well, as a Democrat, I've never said that phrase in my life because we've never done. In South Africa, no one says, well, as an ANC support, Why is a DA support?

No one says that. Yeah. In fact, where I'm from, we would spend more time criticizing the people we voted for than the people we didn't vote for. Because you elected them to do something that you want. Right. Ergo you would criticize them. Right. And I think that that discourse doesn't lead people to have real conversations.

A mosque isn't political. Shouldn't be? Right. And so how you use it in a way you use, these are things that people can decide. discuss, but it shouldn't be political. You get what I'm saying? Trash shouldn't be political. Any conversation in life shouldn't be political.

There's so many that shouldn't be political. And yet we are making it that. And so what I'm trying to do now, and Biden delivered on one thing that he promised on, and that was he's going to be the president that nobody wants to talk about. That's been great. Because now we get to delve into issues

that affect everybody. Because one thing that I think every American can agree upon is regardless of who's in office, there are still people who are struggling to pay the rent. There are still people who are struggling. They haven't seen a wage increase in years. There are still people who don't know whether their children will be able to go to school. There are still people who don't know how they're going to put food on the table. There are still people who don't know if they can afford health care. That will always happen from administration to administration. So I think it goes beyond politics. And so now on the show, I look at the issues

and then we'll touch on the politics that may affect it. But I think we need to have more conversations about what affects us as human beings. Yeah, I mean, you, I think you had a pretty good strategy during the Trump years, which you said in our previous interview too, is I refused to be perpetually outraged. You just can't be outraged every minute of every day and have a healthy life or run a comedy show. So did that help you get through those four years of Donald Trump where you couldn't look at every tweet and such a hair on fire? Yeah, definitely. You know, I think a lot of people also like to get enraged.

Oh, Trump tweet, you know, it'll be like, oh, Trump tweeted this. It's like, yeah, but you don't have to look at all his tweets. Oh, Trump made this joke at a rally. Yeah, he made that joke to his people. You don't have to get angry about everything that the person is doing. I would always say to people, think about what's offending you and what's affecting you. There are two separate things, you know. I would even say that it even happened with comedians in and around that time, you know?

People were getting angry at comedians and they were like, how can you say that? How can you say that? How can you say that? And I don't think people shouldn't be held accountable. Don't get me wrong. But I also think people have to ask themselves sometimes in life, are you allowing yourself to become enraged by things that are not happening to you necessarily?

You're going to go out of your way to find a thing that somebody said, look at what this person said in Thailand on the train. Is that going to make you angry now? Right. You know what I mean? You're living in Ohio and you're going to get angry about what someone said in another country on another continent to another person, man, we cannot live like that. And so what I learned to do was ask myself, what is affecting us and what is just offending us?

The things that are affecting people, let's deal with those issues. Things that are offensive, you can have fun with them. That's comedy. You're right. The most important point is there are entire groups of people who it serves them well to be outraged at all time. That's how the rent gets paid for a lot of people, perpetual outrage. You're also going back and doing stand-up.

I understand. You've got a tour coming up. Yes, I am. What's the plan there? Is there one yet? Yeah, there is. I'm excited, man. This has been the longest period since I've started stand-up that I haven't done stand-up.

And so I actually was going to wait a little bit longer. And then I did a show with Dave Chappelle and Chris Rock and Michelle Wolfe at the stand in New York. It was a surprise show. Dave Chappelle said, come and watch a show. And then he tricked me on the next thing I was on stage. And so, man, he was like, why aren't you on stage? And I said, I don't actually, I'm waiting. He said, man, it's time.

Let's go. And what I realized even in that moment when I was on the stage, I didn't have anything prepared for that moment. I didn't have an idea. But you know what? It felt like home. And I could feel the audience was starting to learn how to be an audience again. We were all experiencing this thing together.

And that's why for myself, comedy is something I can never let die. Because how many times in life are we going to experience or how many times have we taken for granted? a space where hundreds or even thousands of people can come together for the purpose of laughing, Willie. Laughing, having a good time, enjoying themselves. Not there to fight, not there to argue about which team should win or shouldn't win, not there to cheer about politics, but just to laugh. Man, I didn't appreciate it as much as I do now.

I've always loved it. But post-pandemic, I appreciated more than ever before. And so I'm getting back on the road. I'm excited to be doing shows again. I'm getting ready. I've got my show and I'm preparing things. It'll be a little bit of what's happened, a little bit of nothing, which is great. I'll be telling jokes about, I don't know, 16th century England, you know? Topical stuff.

Yeah, I'll be glad to take a break from politics. That's what I miss about stand-up as well, you know? I used to do shows where, like, I would have, like, people who would be like, I'm Republican. People would even say, I don't like your politics, but I like your comedy. And I was like, well, come to my comedy then. Come to the show. Good enough for me, right? Hey, man. We're human beings at the end of the day.

We're going to have to live in the same world. So if we can't find spaces and places where we can interact with each other, then we're doomed. Yeah, and you've also got the film coming up, Born a Crime, which I was looking back, that book, sitting on the New York Times bestseller list literally for years. You never could have imagined, could you? When you said, I'm just going to sit down and tell my story, here it is, that it became this phenomenon. No. I told the story and I shared an experience, I think I shared my story, I shared a story of a mother and her son,

and I shared a story of a country coming out of one of the craziest periods in human history, which was apartheid, and trying to establish itself as a democracy. I honestly did not think in any way, shape, or form this would become what it is today. You know, I didn't think people would be still reading the book years later. It would still be on the New York Times bestsellers list. You know, it would be the number one audible book of all time. I didn't think that. I didn't think kids would be learning it in school.

Yeah, they are. My kids have read it. My kids have read it. They're middle school, middle school age. And now your mother must be pleased that Lupita's playing her. My mom was really happy, yeah. My mom was really happy. I bet.

Yeah. I bet. She was, um, what's interesting. So my mom doesn't care for celebrity at all. She doesn't keep up with it. She doesn't know anything about it at all. She was just happy when she saw the picture. My mom doesn't know who Lupita is.

But she was just like, because my mom hears about things from people in the street, which is hilarious for me. So someone will come up to her in the street and be like, wow, you're going to be in a movie. And my mom's like, what? Why? In a movie, where? Where am I in a movie? And then she'll phone me and be like, I'm going to, you put me in a movie. And I'm like, no, you're not going to be in the movie.

I'm making a movie about our movie. book and our life and she's like oh okay okay and so i'm like someone's going to be acting you and she goes who and i go like oh lu pizan young one she's like who's that i'm like okay i'm gonna send you a picture and this is her and i sent her and she's like oh okay no i'm very happy i'm very happy i'm very happy i'm happy that it's an african woman because i'm an african woman and i was like did you think i was going to ask julia roberts to play you like what where does this come from but my mom is just like man she's just simple and living her life that's awesome that is incredible What does she think about all of this?

Not just the movie, but we're sitting in a park with billboard on the side. Not much. No, I mean this in the humblest fashion possible. Sometimes people think I mean in a bad way. But my mother doesn't care. My mother's happy that I can pay my own rent. My mother's happy that I have a job and I'm living my life. And one of the most important things she actually judges me on

is how other people respond because of me. You know, so she'll go, hey, I met a man who had cancer and his daughter and him watched your comedy while he was going through chemo and they laughed and he was in pain but it really helped them. And they told me this in the street, thank you. And I'll go, oh, cool, did you also like that comedy? She's like, I don't have time for that.

I just wanted to say thank you. Wow. So she's always not graded me, but rather my mom has always drilled into me how I affect people is more important than who I am in the world you know fame can go away like this fame is one of the most frivolous things

that can never happen to you as a human being you know you're famous today nobody knows you tomorrow yeah so if that's how you judge yourself in life then then you know your life is always fleeting whereas my mother has always gone how do you make people feel who are you as a human being and that's good enough for me and so for her

she never celebrates like a like a Hollywood achievement. She celebrates like a life achievement. You know? So she'll go, wow, you did the Grammys. Congratulations. Then I'm like, oh, you watched the Grammy? She's like, I don't even really know what that is.

But people told me it's a big thing and I'm happy for you. Well done. I'm very happy for you. But that keeps you humble too. That's great, right? Yeah. It helps less than humility. It helps me remember that this is not the most important thing in life.

It's a blessing and it's wonderful. But this is not the only thing. thing that should matter in life. That's a good perspective, because as you say, it goes away, you better be rooted in the right stuff. So if it goes, you still have that. But what about for you personally to walk into the building with a billboarded New York City and the side, given where you've come from, everybody's read the story in your book, do you ever stop yourself? And we'll go, wow, I can't believe how this is turned out. Here's the truth of it. The truth is, it's a gift and a

curse. Everything in life, I think, has its gifts and its curses. on the one hand obviously coming from a life where sometimes in my family we didn't know if we would have food on a day to live the life I'm living today I'm like man I can't believe this is insane you know I can order a mains

and a starter if I want that's one of the biggest things where I go I've made it I'm not even lying I'm not even lying I look at the menu and I go I have both and I really still go man I'm blessed I'm really blessed and then there are times when I see a billboard or I see a poster

and I'm like, that's me. That is insane. That is me. I can't believe how far I've come and I'm happy because I've brought my family with me and I've brought my friends and my community and I've been able to help people because of that. That's a gift.

The curse is the fact that you have a billboard. You know what I mean? Like people take this for granted. If I'm in a, let's say I'm in like a, I'm in a line somewhere and something goes wrong, someone spills something on me, someone kicks me, whatever. I can't just be like, You've just got to breathe.

Because if you're not careful, someone's going to take a video and be like, Trevor losing his cool. But we should all be allowed to lose our cool, Willie. Yes. But I, because if I'm not careful, then the thing. So it comes with its curses. Yes. You know, because you, I think you lose a little bit of your, of the way you would live

if you weren't, like, surveilled. Of course. You know? Like, you get to the point now when, like, when you eat, you're like, is someone taking a picture of this moment? This is how I eat. Hmm. Small bites.

Nothing too big. this is how I eat. Because you know the one time you're like, that's the picture they go, you get what I'm saying? Oh yeah, of course. It's one of those things. Well, you're surveilled more than most, too.

I can still walk around and shove a cheeseburger in my face. You've got a head on a swivel. Keep your head on a swivel. Was that Grammy's experience? Cool? I have to say of all the award shows, with all due respect to the others, that was the one was like, okay, they figured it out.

It didn't feel zoomy and it was so well done. That was so amazing. I've just got to get there I give credit to the team who made it happen I was lucky to be a part of the team and I was lucky that they brought me in early enough You know everyone at Viacom CBS was like hey we need you to jump onto this early because Ben Winston who was producing the whole thing He was executive producing he said we're gonna do this yeah, you know and and it was great to have the artists I've never experienced anything like the Grammys and what I mean by that is not that I haven't experienced a star-studded event not that I haven't experienced a glam even No, it felt from this, it felt this. You know, seeing the human side of artists.

Yes. You know, seeing, seeing Dua Leeper just enjoying a song from somebody else, you know, like seeing Bad Bunny enjoying a moment somewhere else, seeing Cardi B, just like going like, oh man, I'm going through my routine. But it wasn't big. It wasn't, it was less performative and more authentic. And I really enjoyed it. I didn't expect it to be like that, but I think it was.

And I'll cherish that experience forever. I wonder if they stay with that, because, I mean, like you say, to watch, like, oh, there's Harry Styles sort of in the shadows, but he's singing along to Billy Island's a song. Right, right, right. Oh, this is, it was a different, it was very cool. It really was. It was very well done. Hey, guys, thanks for listening to the Sunday Sit Down podcast.

Stick around to hear more from Trevor Noah right after the break. Welcome back to the Sunday Sit Down podcast. Now more of my conversation with Trevor Noah. We were talking about George Floyd and how you handled that situation. You were out on hiatus when he was murdered two maize ago. What were those couple of weeks or those days like for you as it sort of stewed in your mind and you figured out how to handle it? When George Floyd was murdered and when we started to witness America in one of the most tumultuous

periods we've ever seen, I was actually grateful for the fact that I wasn't on air because I now didn't have to react to what was happening, but I could observe. I could listen to people. I could see what was happening. And I didn't have to immediately say something about or even feel like I had to say something about it. And I think what that does for you as a person is, It gives you pause to contemplate not just what's happening, but why it's happening, how it's happening, and how you respond to it as a human being. Which is funny enough something I think social media has robbed lots of us of. We love the instant response now. And it's fun. Don't get me wrong. In many moments, it's fun, you know.

But what's also scary about it is we go with our first instincts. We go with our first thoughts. You know, we do before we think. And so when that happened, I mean, the biggest, the biggest emotion I had was sadness. You know? Like, I see a lot of people now who try and create a martyr out of George Floyd, and they go, like, man, what George Floyd did and what, no, George Floyd did nothing, what was done to him. You know, he didn't choose to be a martyr, nor did he want to be, nor should he have been. And so when I was experiencing this, as many other people were, you are.

asking so many questions about life. Why is it so hard for us to have honest conversations about policing in America? You know, why is it hard for us to connect as human beings in and around a life that was lost? You know, why does it have to feel like acknowledging the lives of those that were lost means you have to diminish those of police officers?

Why is all of this happening? why are people failing to see the humanity and others? You know, and so in that period, that was the one thing that I kept on thinking was, do you understand what level a community has to get to, to the point where they're marching in the streets and protest? Do you understand what level people have to get to be there? And so for myself, I felt like, I felt like I could not only observe, but then process and then try to articulate.

what I could see was happening in the world just by listening and observing the people that were going through it the most Even listening to you talk about that both sides ism is obviously a dirty term and that's not what you do But just hearing you say this terrible thing happened did you also think about how hard it is to be a cop or the job they have to do Is that a place you try to find in general not not I'm not even specific to that but in general say hey let's find the common humanity here Well, here's the thing that I think sometimes people are robbed of in American conversations is people don't like to look at the cause in this country, you know? America is a country where you'll see a thousand ads about a medicine that you should buy to treat a symptom. But a lot of the time people are not thinking about the cause. Oh, your joints are sore.

Oh, your stomach is bad. They don't think about the cause. Here, take this pill. Take this pill. And then you'll take this pill for the side effect of that pill and this pill and this pill. But what is the cause? you know, if we don't think about the causes, we're always going to treat symptoms

and we're always going to deal with the side effects. When we get down to the core, I've been lucky enough to have conversations with police. I've had police tell me, hey man, the structure of the thing we do is always going to be fundamentally flawed. If you design a system where these people have to generate income for their cities,

are you creating a system to protect and serve, or are you creating a system that is punitive and designed to extract money from those on the streets. And I'm not blaming individual police. I'm just saying we have to look at the structure of that. What is the purpose of that and how are we doing it? How do we even determine punishments? Oh, they pull you over, they give you a fine.

Why did we decide that a fine is the correct thing to do? People will be like, it's fair. Who is it fair to? You know, it creates a system where those who can afford to pay fines can carry on living their lives. Those who cannot are now trapped within a system that will keep them spiraling further and further away from the society that everyone says they don't want to be a part of,

when in fact they do. And so in these things, I think we don't have honest enough conversations. If you're sending police out there to stop and frisk everyone, what do you think is going to happen? Right. You know? And so now in the private rooms of the police, they tell the police you have to do this.

If you don't do it, you're fired because you're not meeting quotas, but then in the public people chastise the police. But that's why we talk about it as a structural thing. And that's what I try and do as a person is, I think the problem with even the term both sides is that it implies that there are only two sides. And that is not how any object is. We're not just looking at, every angle tells a different story.

And I think we're supposed to be doing that. You know, if policing were an industry, of policing were a profession where there weren't so many other things that were going wrong in it, I think we wouldn't have the suicide rate that we have with policing. These are the issues that I look at. I go, these are human beings as well.

Why are police going through this as well? And it goes back to the tribal conversation we were having. And that's the problem. You're on that side, you're on that side. You like the cops. You hate the cops. But there's two worlds. And so that's why I go, why don't we have more structural conversations?

You know, when you're looking at what is the police and why is the police, you're not trying to dismantle the person. You're looking at the structure that they themselves are a part of, something that is hurting them as a human being. I don't think that any human being should be put in the position where they're going out shooting other people. There's a reason police have to go for counseling after that. It's because it's not the right thing for us to be doing. And then for communities to be subject to that, what do you think is going to happen?

You're just having a loop. It's a never-ending loop. And then you don't have an honest conversation about it. Oh, this person was killed. This person shouldn't have been killed. Is there a way to do it without just killing people? Oh, you're anti-cop. No, I'm not.

I'm pro the cop. I don't want that cop to ever have to take somebody's. life. Let that be the final, final, final, last resort where we all as society go, man, something failed here. We failed this person or we failed that police by putting them in that position. Until we have those conversations, we're not having conversations. We're just shouting talking points at each other. See, this is nuanced, Trevor. You can't do that in America. Last thing, I've got to ask you about your collection of goodies. Every night, go in there, there's some different color or rainbow, whatever.

it is, how many hoodies do you have? Everyone asked me this and I'm afraid to count. Because I think what happened is, so first to understand the hoodies you have to understand life. I'm at home. I don't know when I'm going back out into the world. Hoodies are what I wear at home. Sure.

I love hoodies. Yeah. This is just my life. Okay? Yeah. I'm going to be making a show from home. It's like I'm not going to wear a suit. I'm at home.

Right. I don't want to feel like I'm, no, I'm at home. Right. We're all in sweatpants on our zooms, et cetera, et cetera. That's why I dressed the way that I did. then I was like man I'm running out of hoodies because I thought it was going to be 21 days right so I had to buy a few more hoodies and then I had to get a few more hoodies and then I had to get

the next thing I know there's just hoodies there's just hoodies everywhere there's hoodies in every nook and cranny of my cupboard this is hoodies everywhere we're showing up everywhere but in many ways the hoodie has become you know the uniform that I've done for this period of time it's become you know it's become my little safety blank it's become my thing where I get into a mindset I go okay it's time now. Go and do this thing. You put it on. And it's how I've created a sense of normalcy in a world that is completely abnormal right now. And so that's really all it is, is me going, okay, how do I get to, you know, just step into the zone. What's that moment where I go, okay, I'm doing this now. And that's,

that's what that's become. It's become my ritual. It's become my, you know, non-spoken conversation with the audience. We're still in, we're still in hoodie land right now as people. And I can't wait for the day when we're not. Well, that's coming pretty soon. But your audience, be disappointed if you come out in a suit now. They want to see those hoodies. Oh, maybe, you never know. Maybe I'll find, maybe I'll do hoodies on Tuesdays and suits on Wednesdays. That's what I mean about, I'm not going back. I'm only going forward. There you go. H hoodie Tuesdays. You never know. Thanks, man. My big thanks again to Trevor for a great conversation for really hanging in there through that heat and through all the New York City noise. Always appreciate his time and his thoughtfulness.

The Daily Show, as I mentioned, will be on hiatus for a few months this summer, but we'll return on September 13th. My big thanks to all of you for tuning in again this week. If you want to hear more of our conversations with my guests every week, be sure to click subscribe so you never miss an episode. And of course, don't forget to tune in to Sunday today every weekend on NBC. I'm Willie Geist. We'll see you right back here next week on the Sunday Sit Down podcast.