Switched on Pop - Chained to the Green Light: Katy Perry + Lorde

Episode Date: March 10, 2017

Two artists who haven't released new music since 2013 recently remerged into the limelight: Katy Perry, with her dystopian disco banger "Chained to the Rhythm" and Lorde, with the melodramatic-yet-upl...ifting anthem "Green Light."  Listening carefully, a fact becomes apparent, despite Lorde's insistence that she "hears new sounds" in her mind: there's something familiar lurking beneath both these tracks. And indeed, both were co-written and produced by key figures of the modern pop music firmament. Who are they, and how do we detect their fingerprints on the latest from these two low-voiced chanteuses? Tune in and test your acumen in a high-stakes game of musical forensics.  Featuring: Katy Perry - Chained to the Rhythm Lorde - Green Light ...and some secret songs Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Starting point is 00:00:32 It's free for iOS users. Welcome to Switch done pop. I'm songwriter Charlie Harding. And I'm musicologist Nate Sloan. Nate, we've been getting a ton of requests over the last two weeks for both Katie Perry's Change the Rhythm and Lord's New Single Green Light. And I have to admit that I was actually hesitant to want to talk about these songs at first. Really? Tell me. Why?
Starting point is 00:01:02 Well, in some ways, they're very well-trodden territory because the songwriters and producers behind These songs have been really thoroughly discussed on the show on past episodes. Fair enough. And yet something couldn't keep you away. No. Both these songs are amazing and have really surprising twists and turns. So I thought what we would do today is to host a double feature. And what we're going to do is we're going to talk about one of the songs at the top of the show,
Starting point is 00:01:30 other song on the second half of the show, and we're going to turn it into a bit of a game. We're going to break down both songs. And throughout, we're going to see if the listener can identify who wrote that and we'll reveal it at the end of each song. All right. Wow, the plot thickens. I'm way into it. Take me there. So in the first half of the show, we're going to break down Katie Perry's chain to the rhythm featuring Skip Marley. This is a dance hall slash disco beat. And it's the first single off her forthcoming studio album. It's performed really well. And I think it deserves the accolades because of the way that this song acts on so many levels. And of course, supporting Katie on this track are some amazing co-writers and producers who we will reveal at the end.
Starting point is 00:02:18 Okay, to begin, let's drop the needle and see what's going on. Please. Nate, I think this song has really gotten in my head because, as she says in the chorus, turn it up, keep it on repeat. I've been listening to this. I don't know. I think I've probably heard it like 30, 40 times now. Really? Charlie, would you say you've been stumbling around like a wasted zombie?
Starting point is 00:03:28 For other reasons. Oh. Okay, we'll get into that after the show. Okay, this song is amazing. It works on two totally different levels, at least two anyway. On one level, I think we can attest that it is a party song. Like, you should go dance at a party to this song because it's really fun and makes you want to move, right? Oh, no doubt.
Starting point is 00:03:52 Go straight to my hips. But it is also a political party song. It has references to all of our modern issues. of fake news, rising in equality, and authoritarian politics, and she leaves clues all throughout establishing this dual narrative with two very distinct rhythms. Whoa, slow your role here, Charles. Where does fake news appear in this Katie Perry dance track? We're going to get there.
Starting point is 00:04:20 That's part of my big reveal, okay? Just sit down. All right, I didn't mean to rush the reveal. All right, please continue. First part, party song. What do you hear? Well, I hear this highly syncopated bass line kind of funky, as you were describing earlier, maybe disco, guitar, these like big, beefy drum patterns.
Starting point is 00:04:44 It's very, very danceable. Yes, it has a sort of daft punky character to it, that slap bass. These rhythms are actually pretty complex. They're all kind of like interlocking and they really just compel you to want to move. They are infectious. Indeed. Second listen. What's really going on?
Starting point is 00:05:15 What are you hearing? Okay, the second listen. So that was the party side. Now we go to the political side, I guess. Exactly. Okay. This is Katie Perry. She was a spokesperson for the Clinton campaign.
Starting point is 00:05:25 Roar was a frequent walkout song for Hillary. Okay, so this is like some democratic boosterism here? What are you trying to tell me? Well, I think it's quite obvious that the lyrics are telling us something about our modern political moment. I'm hearing three very strong illusions. Okay. You were asking about fake news. Well, she says that we live our lives through a lens so comfortable we're living in a bubble.
Starting point is 00:05:54 We cannot see the trouble. This, I think, is like a reference to filter bubbles and we get filtered into the various news sources that we read real or fake. Oh, the echo chamber, you mean. I like, so I like filter bubble, but there's a particular reason. because I think here we can hear both the filter and the bubble. We've got the filter on this underlying keys and guitar, literally have a thing called a filter,
Starting point is 00:06:21 filtering out a bunch of the frequencies, and the baseline has this bubbly, bassy sound. So I think the filter bubble she's talking about, we can actually hear in the sonic characteristics. Interesting. Okay, so you're saying, so first of all, filter bubble is like, as in your Facebook page filters out,
Starting point is 00:06:51 any news that you don't want to hear. Is that the idea? Yeah, exactly. Similarly, this song filters out certain sonic registers of its instruments. Okay, that's cool. Yeah, right? Okay. Okay, I'm into it.
Starting point is 00:07:03 I see what you're saying. If you need more compelling evidence, you can move into the chorus where at first it seems like we said a party song. Turn it up. It's your favorite song, dance, dance, to the distortion. Wait, wait, what? Your favorite song is full of distortion. Keep it up.
Starting point is 00:07:20 Keep it on repeat. And then she says, Sumbling around like a wasted zombie, you think you're free. This drinks on me where I'll chain to the rhythm. This song is very strict. It's kind of daft because I can't tell if it's critiquing itself. Right.
Starting point is 00:07:36 Because it is a compelling, dancey song. And yet she's saying, dance, dance, repeat yourself without thinking critically about it. Yeah. Turn it up. Keep it on repeat. Don't think about it.
Starting point is 00:07:47 Just dance around like a wasted zombie. Uh, what? Right. Yeah. It feels like the chorus is almost authoritarian. This pop song is like set to self-destruct somehow. It's metal levels are unbearable. How do you like nod your head to this as the song is telling you, yeah, that's right, you zombie.
Starting point is 00:08:09 Keep nodding your head. I think she in the chorus kind of buries a bit of that political message around the word zombie and distortion and freedom and drinking. By putting her vocals on really strange divisions of the beat, she emphasizes the wrong syllable. Right. And so the first time you hear it, you're like, I didn't really hear that allusion to, we're all drunk to this rhythm. Interesting. I see what you're saying. Though I also will point out that those are all excellent examples of something we talked about on the show before, text painting.
Starting point is 00:08:52 Which occurs a few other times in this song as well, like on the word distortion, which as you put. point out she sings distortion or something like that. Oh, she distorts the distortion. Yeah, and like a wasted zombie, and she kind of holds that bee until the start of the next phrase, so it's very wasted and weird. In the way that she sings drink, she says it with command. It's like, drink, this one's on me. Yeah, that's right.
Starting point is 00:09:25 That's an imperative drink. And then at the end of this chorus is probably the strongest one of all. are all chained to the rhythm, to the rhythm, to the rhythm. This very apparent rhythm that makes you go, oh, yeah, I hear that rhythm that we're chained to. Right, and the words perfectly align with the rhythm of the music. Yeah, exactly. So the other place where I heard of political illusion was another example of text painting, which is right in the opening of the second verse.
Starting point is 00:09:54 She sings, are we tone deaf? Huh. And what happens here? So when she says, are we tone deaf, a lot of the sounds are kind of filtered out. So all of a sudden you can't really hear them anymore. Yes, it has that sort of underwater-like quality that we've heard on Drake tracks and another artist that we've talked about on the song. But this is another example of using a filter to filter out all of those higher frequencies.
Starting point is 00:10:26 Also in the start of that weekend song, we heard, I feel it coming. Yeah, it has that same sort of filter quality. So are we tone deaf? And then all of the sounds disappear as if we can, longer hear them. But of course, being tone deaf here isn't about just the musical aspect of these frequencies disappearing. I think she's making, again, a political statement of, are we not paying attention to what's really going on here? Get out of your filter bubble. You've got to turn ears back on. Yeah. Now, if this is a political song, it's not very hopeful yet, is it?
Starting point is 00:10:59 No, I would say it's rather pessimistic. It might even be defying itself, right? It's saying, don't keep falling in love with poppy things which are infectious and just compel you to do something, try to be more critical. Right, right. Well, sort of an opiate of the masses vibe here. Right, well, there is a twist in this song, or perhaps better yet, a break in the chain. Okay, what's that? Okay, so the song in the chorus says, turn it up, keep it on repeat.
Starting point is 00:11:31 Right. And in many ways, that's a proper characterization. of the whole song change to the rhythm because the song is a continuous chain of chords which are more or less the same repeating themselves over and over with an exception. Do you know what I'm talking about? The exception is in the pre-chorus, maybe.
Starting point is 00:11:55 No. Yes. Yes. Exactly. Yes. It's in the pre-chorus. That little part that goes by very fast, so put your rose-colored glasses on and party on, that leads into the chorus. Yes. Right. That's the moment. So I did it. Oh, that's so satisfying. You got it. Underneath this lyric of putting our rose-colored glasses on, there's a real harmonic shift in the song, and there's also a rhythmic shift. There's a new rhythm going on underneath the vocal. And I think that the lyrics really mimic what's going on. She says, put your rose-colored glasses on, right? Which is a metaphor to make everything look pretty when actually it's all gloom, right?
Starting point is 00:12:39 Right. Underneath her saying rose-colored glasses are these sort of washy, synthy, beautiful things. I think this is the beginning of something great, a political resistance, if you will. Oh, wow. Charlie, no. No. No. You totally disagree. I totally disagree.
Starting point is 00:12:57 Well, I just don't see how putting, I feel like putting the rose-colored glasses on is just blinding yourself like you're deafening yourself to the truth around you. and in the context of the song, partying on is giving up or maintaining the illusion. Yes, you're right. That is what's happening here. So I see what you mean about the corridor and rhythmic shifts here, but I feel like that liberatory potential is illusory. Yes, you are correct, but I bated you. I said that this is just the beginning of some form of resistance because it comes back. Okay, there's another pre-chorus.
Starting point is 00:13:34 Wait, is there? There is another pre-chorus, but you're getting. all lost. Who is this song featuring? This song is featuring Skip Marley. And who is Skip Marley related to? Skip Marley is the grandson, or one of the grandsons, of Bob Marley. Who is known as the pioneer of reggae, an incredible figure in the fight against racism. Would you say a musical revolutionary? I would say a musical revolutionary. Well, I think that Skip Marley is continuing in this tradition because when he comes in during the bridge, the whole song shifts, right?
Starting point is 00:14:12 Yeah. If Katie Perry's narrative is about the 99% who are all lonely up there in Utopia, where nothing will ever be enough happily numb, Skip comes in and he says, hey, guess what's up? Time is ticking for the empire. The truth they feed is feeble. And he says that the stumbling and the fumbling, we're all about to riot. He says that people are waking up.
Starting point is 00:14:35 They're waking up the lions. Whoa, okay, so I skipped Skip is what you're saying. But what's happening underneath Skip. We've got more new chords. Do we? No, same chords. We have some new order. Same chords in a new order.
Starting point is 00:15:03 But what is that order? What is that rhythm? It's the same rhythm from underneath the pre-chorus, from underneath the rose-collar glasses. Oh, really? Okay, I didn't notice that. Kudos, kudos, Charlie. Check that out. Take a lesson.
Starting point is 00:15:17 Okay, I'm going to listen to that right now. It's pretty close. It's pretty close. That's cool. That's very cool. Okay, so his revolutionary toast in the bridge of the. this song is that promise of liberatory potential, I guess. And it's foreshadowed earlier in the song, maybe musically just to prepare our ears,
Starting point is 00:15:50 but also to say that underneath this whole world of people putting on their rose-colored glasses, there is something happening. People just aren't paying attention. They need to wake up. They need to wake up. And, of course, Skip Marley takes us there. If you aren't convinced that there is a underlying positive message to this song, you have to go to the very end, and I think I've brought you along.
Starting point is 00:16:20 All right, so at the very end, we have this outro that goes, it goes on and on and on and on. It goes on and on and on. It goes on and on and on. But at the same time, many of the singers are starting to break free of the chain to the rhythmness. There's more singers. There's a chorus of people, and many of them are sort of singing out of rhythm
Starting point is 00:16:42 from what had been established earlier in the chorus. But take me to the very end. What goes on there? So at the end of this repetitive on and on, the background instrumentation slowly fades out and we're left with just acapella vocals. Could you say that their voices have broken free? You could. You could. But I have to say, Charles, usually I'm right there with you, but I'm still a little skeptical about this one.
Starting point is 00:17:19 Really? Okay, okay. I hear this as another one of these kind of searing indictments of the formulaicness of popular music that kind of dulls us into a acceptance of whatever chaos and travisies and crisis are corroding the world around us. It goes on and on and on and on, just like music goes on and on and on. And these choruses go on and on and on. As long as we're listening, we're just going to tune out. everything around us. So the song is completely recursive. Well, or it's a Roershark blob and tells you
Starting point is 00:17:55 if you're an optimistic person like Charlie Harding or a nihilistic, fatalistic, Russian existentialists like Nate Sloan, I guess, or Nathaniel Slininsky in this case. Okay, so we both love the contributions by Katie Perry and Skip Marley. But who else is underneath this song? Well, I know the answer. Am I disqualified? No, pretty sure. Okay, this song is co-written and produced by a very familiar figure to us.
Starting point is 00:18:31 One, Max Martin, and one of his cadre of collaborators, Ali Piami, and drum roll, SIA, SIA, the one-named pop songstress. So, yeah.
Starting point is 00:18:47 And at the top, I was saying, I don't know if I want to go into the song, because it does a lot of the things we've heard before, We've obviously covered Max Martin's material relentlessly. I in particular think that this is almost a follow-up to Can't Stop the Feeling, the Justin Timberlake song, that we talked about in episode 38. One is Can't Stop the Feeling, the other change to the rhythm. Both of them are basically about not being able to stop dancing. Interesting, but kind of the light and the dark side of those two.
Starting point is 00:19:25 Yeah, one's for the movie trolls and the other is about. authoritarian issues in modern politics. Okay, so I think it's pretty cool that you just said that because I actually had my own dark side, light side theory to this song. Really? Not with Can't Stop the Feeling, but with a song from another one of these collaborators, Sia. To me, chain to the rhythm is like the dark side of Sia's cheap thrills. Oh, okay.
Starting point is 00:19:50 Tell me more. Well, in the same way that Can't Stop the Feeling celebrates hitting the dance floor. so does cheap thrills. The chorus of that song is, I don't need dollar bills to have fun tonight, as long as I can feel the beat, as long as I can keep dancing. Cheap Thrills is a song that celebrates pop music
Starting point is 00:20:09 and the liberatory potential of just like losing yourself on the dance floor. Chained to the rhythm, on the other hand, explores the dark side of that pop fantasy. And if you'll bear with me for a moment, I would even go one step further to say they have a kind of sonic pivot because the chorus of chain to the rhythm sounds remarkably like the verse of cheap thrills.
Starting point is 00:20:38 Really? Yes. Okay, so chain to the rhythm. The chorus goes, turn it up. It's your favorite song, dance, dance, dance to the disocheon. And we go from our root note to the fifth below and back. and at the start of cheap thrills when she sings Come on, come on, turn the radio on.
Starting point is 00:21:09 It's Friday night and it won't be long. Come on, come on, turn the radio. We have the same exact interval. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's so cool, huh? Chain to the ribbon, we have da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da. And then in cheap thrills, we have
Starting point is 00:21:30 da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da. It's a very similar melody, right? It's the inverse. It's like the same, but it's the inverse. It's the light in the dark. It's the inverse, you're right. You start up on chain to the rhythm. them and you start down on cheap thrills.
Starting point is 00:21:44 Whoa. And it tells you about the progression the song is going to go in. I think we've gone way too deep. Okay, should we swim back up to the surface and take an ad break here? Yeah, let's take a moment. And when we come back, we're going to get into Lord's new single Green Light. See you there. Attention, Spotify.
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Starting point is 00:23:00 in the second half of the show. A lot of people have been making requests on Twitter for
Starting point is 00:23:05 this new song called Green Light. And so I went on my phone, I opened up my music
Starting point is 00:23:10 app and I searched Green Light. And the first thing that came up was this flow write a song.
Starting point is 00:23:15 Give me the green light. I was like, okay, I guess that's what people learn to these days. It's got this fun slap-based, daft-punky feel with Clarence Clemens like Sax feel. A really kind of fun track, but I didn't know what people were talking about. Why green light? And then did you find the John Legend song Greenlight after that? Give me the green light.
Starting point is 00:23:45 I didn't know. Well, there's many green lights. many decoy green lights out there. Well, it turns out the latest green light, and one of the most compelling, I think, is Lord's new single off of her upcoming album, Melodrama. Oh, is that the title? I didn't know that. I like that.
Starting point is 00:24:03 We've waited a long time since her 2013 album, Pure Heroin, with its hit song, Royals. And now our favorite young Kiwi singer has really grown up. At 20, she's gone through her first major heartbreak, and she's evolved her songwriting. and I think that we can hear both of them in this piece. And like chain to the rhythm, Green Light has some really compelling twists and turns that are cleverly deployed by both Lord and her fellow songwriters, who again we will reveal at the end.
Starting point is 00:24:35 I think what we need to do is drop the needle and get a sense of what's going on in Green Light. All right, hit me. I do my makeup in somebody else's car. We order different drinks at the same bars. I know about what you did and I want to scream the truth She thinks you love the beach you're such a damn liar Those great whites they have big teeth
Starting point is 00:25:14 Oh they bite you that you said that you would always be in love But you're not in love no more did it frighten you How we kissed when we dance on the light of floor On the light of floor But I hear south in my mind. Nate, I just want to start with what are your first impressions of the song?
Starting point is 00:25:48 You know, I have to say, while I'm similarly Gaga for this track, as I am chained to the rhythm, I might have one reservation, which is the chorus of this song lighted me up like a Christmas tree, but the verse doesn't really do it for me in the same way. Ooh.
Starting point is 00:26:06 The pre-chorus I love, too. Okay, okay. But in its way, it's still successful because it brings me down and then the chorus is in a way such as surprise that it reels me back in. Well, before you convince yourself that it's actually a good song,
Starting point is 00:26:18 I'm going to take you there because I think that the opening serves a really strong purpose. But we said, okay, first listen, you were like, I don't know about this verse. We open up when we've got these dark minor chords that really have an ambiguous harmony.
Starting point is 00:26:33 We're not really sure where the home key is. It's hard to know, is this a minor song or a major song, right? I do my makeup in, somebody else's car we order different drinks at the same bars
Starting point is 00:26:50 that's totally true if it is a major song what major key it's in that's I totally see what you mean that's true and then with these chords another thing going on is that we don't really have a supporting rhythm right there's no drums and the piano is oftentimes syncopated hitting the beat
Starting point is 00:27:06 in weird places yeah so we're kind of thrown off it's very unmoored yeah unmoored is great lyrically we get a sense of where the song is heading. She says, I know about what you did and I want to scream the truth. She thinks you love the beach. You're such a damn liar. That is a great line. You know what? You're right. All right. Maybe I'm softening on the verses here. Maybe you're right. There's some interesting stuff going on. It's very imagistic. Earlier, she's talking about driving in the car and putting her
Starting point is 00:27:36 makeup on and they're getting drinks in different bars. It's a very visual lyric here. And it suggests that this is going to be a sullen breakup song, maybe a la Adele. Yeah, I'm definitely getting that vibe. Acoustic piano at this point is like, screams Adele. So, yeah, I'm with you. We've actually heard this technique from Lord before. Do you know what I'm talking about in the opening of Royals? Let me send my brain back to 2013, the opening of Royals.
Starting point is 00:28:05 Yeah. Okay, so Royal starts with just Lord's vocals and a drumbeat. And ambiguity about happy stuff. song, sad song, right? We don't really know what key we're in yet. I've never seen a diamond in the flip. I cut my teeth on wedding rings in the movie. Yes, is it major and minor? Yeah, that's totally true. Okay. Interesting. Well, like Royals, we get an answer, but the song evolves way more than Royals does. It really goes into a whole new territory and suggests that maybe the song is about something else. And I think we get a glimpse at this change right with this weird lyric that I was
Starting point is 00:28:48 saying earlier about the breakup. She rhymes the words car and bars. I do my makeup in somebody else's car. We order different drinks at the same bars. And then in the next line, she rhymes the words truth and liar. Or I should say she's a liar because she doesn't rhyme. It's very jarring, right? I know about what you did And I want to scream the truth She thinks you love the beach You're such a damn liar
Starting point is 00:29:25 Yeah, yeah That is a kind of shocking moment And just when it happens We start to move into the pre-chorus Those great whites They have big teeth If they bite you That you said that you would always be in love
Starting point is 00:29:40 And we get more voices We get more sense of what key we're in It turns major and the whole song starts to go in a different direction. If I can interrupt for a moment, what do you make of that first line of the pre-chorus, those great whites, they have big teeth? Well, on one level, it's a reference back to the beach
Starting point is 00:30:04 and going down to the beach, he hopes that he'll get eaten by a great white shark. But it's also a reference to teeth, to a smile, like someone grinning. And there's all sorts of mouthy metaphors She later says something along the lines Does it make you nervous how we kissed When we dance on the light up floor?
Starting point is 00:30:23 So I think the teeth and the grin She actually talks about teeth and royals as well I cut my teeth on a wedding ring So she's really going deep And these multiple references back to her earlier material I think as a setup to take us As I said in a totally different direction Fascinating
Starting point is 00:30:44 The underlying themes of Mastic in the work of Lord. We're just going to give that as a dissertation topic to anyone listening out there. You can have that for free. That's yours. Maybe give us a shout out in the acknowledgement. But otherwise, just go and run with it. I'd like to be third author, please.
Starting point is 00:31:02 Okay, don't get ahead of yourself. I'm with you there. And some amazing rhythmic development here, the way she sings, oh, they bite you. I thought you said that you would always be in love. The way that sudden, rapid rhythm really comes out of no. nowhere out of the very placid verse is really exciting to me. Well, she's building expectations here, right? We get more lyrics, faster words, everything's growing, and she's definitely trying to lead us somewhere.
Starting point is 00:31:30 She shifts us into the chorus, and what the heck happens? I mean, every dance on the light of floor, on the light of floor. But I hear sounds in my mind. I mean, everything changes. We get our house piano. Yep. We get these, like, all of the sudden, these abelient vocals. And by the time we get to kind of the repeat of the chorus, the second chorus,
Starting point is 00:32:02 we have these amazing, not only the, the beulient main vocals, but these amazing backup vocals kind of responding and answer. Waiting for it, that dream light, I want it. We have this incredible forward propulsion. Yep. out of the kind of just rhythmic miasma of the verse. And we have a chord that we have not heard before, G major, which just sends us harmonically, at least reeling,
Starting point is 00:32:36 completely puts us in a whole new world. It's a super strange choice. She could have done it really differently. Coming out of the pre-chorus, there is this obvious movement from D. to F sharp minor, to E. Yeah. And the 95% of songwriters in the world probably would have landed on an A. It has this beautiful resolution.
Starting point is 00:33:08 Right. The root of this song, the tonic, the tonal center. Instead, they don't choose the tonal center. They choose this bizarre, the call subtonic chord, the G, the chord just below the A, not giving you the resolution that you want. And how does you support that in her lyric? She's literally hearing brand new sounds in her mind. She's hearing brand new sounds in my mind.
Starting point is 00:33:51 Very cool. There is a really jarring harmonic shift just as she is declaring her intent for new sounds, which we can, I think, hear both as literally a new sound for Lord, a whole new sonic palette, something we wouldn't expect from her, which is a good choice in a sophomore release. Yeah. As well as new sounds here could be a new relationship. She is looking for that green light to pursue a new relationship.
Starting point is 00:34:21 Yeah. Or to go out and be on her own, new experiences. Wow. Okay. So kind of like a triple layer cake in the chorus here. Yeah. Okay, is it time to play the game? Who wrote that? The minute you said the big drums leading into the chorus,
Starting point is 00:34:39 I think if you're going to pinpoint a moment that you could use. to identify the composer, producer of this track, that would be it. Yeah, who is the crowned prince of studio anthem smashes? Wow, Charlie, are we seeing some kind of, in comparing these two songs, potentially seeing a certain kind of passing of the torch? Is the new guard arriving here with Lord on Greenlight? It's drum roll Jack Antenoff. Yes.
Starting point is 00:35:11 The now ubiquitous. Jack Antinoff. Yes, Jack Antonoff supports Joel Little and Lord in penning this song and doing production on this work. And we've heard many of his pieces on our show in the past. He's responsible for a lot of Taylor Swift's work, both the duet with Zane. I don't want to live forever.
Starting point is 00:35:31 He also worked on Out of the Woods. And I actually think that this style, this anthemic quality, where we begin with something hushed, maybe ambiguous, and then move into something which is grandiose over the top and everybody has to sing along to. I don't want to imply it's formulaic, but I will say he really cut his teeth, metaphor. Teeth metaphor. Okay, okay. On the song, We Are Young with his band Fun. Oh, yeah. It has that same feel, right? Yeah, yeah, totally. It opens up with an A section, which I think on another
Starting point is 00:36:11 episode of our show we described as almost has like a musical quality, like musical theater quality. Give me a second eye. I need to get my story straight. My friends are in the bathroom getting higher than the empire state. My lover she's away. And then in a hyperbolic shift in the chorus, we end up in what could be a queen-like anthem song.
Starting point is 00:36:35 So a real pivot from chorus to verse, kind of this cathartic release that. that the chorus gives you from maybe perhaps a very somber and even melodramatic verse. It's a super smart technique. Because if you started with the chorus, you would have nowhere to grow to. It's so big, everybody's singing. All the synthesizers are filling all the space.
Starting point is 00:37:07 When you start from almost nothing and then you build to that moment, it's that much more powerful. I feel the rush Charles when the drums come in and that unexpected subtonic G major chord drops the background vocals kick in. It's intense. Yeah.
Starting point is 00:37:23 But then, with chained to the rhythm in the rear view, I think, oh, but is this just the rush of a drug that's not good for me? Charlie, well, I don't know anymore. Maybe pop music is bad for us. Oh, stop it. Well, thank you for taking me on this journey, Charles. I learned a lot about a song I love and I learned to love even more a song I liked. So that didn't seem like a waste of time to me.
Starting point is 00:37:48 Thanks. It's always a pleasure, Nate. This episode of Switched on Pop was produced by me, Charlie Harding And edited by me, Nate Sloan, and The Amazing Bill Lance. Our design is done by Luke Harris, and Switched on Pop is part of the Panoply Network
Starting point is 00:38:03 where you can find lots of other great shows. Tell us about what you're listening to, what you're hearing at our Twitter account, Switched on Pop or Facebook, same name, and we'll also be posting there shortly a Spotify playlist full of our favorite Martin Antonoff Furler. That's Cia's last.
Starting point is 00:38:21 and Amtros. Jams. You can find more episodes of Switched-on-Pop on iTunes, where we'd really appreciate it if you left us a review, preferably in rhyme. None of those lord off-rhybes. Whoa. Just raised the stakes.
Starting point is 00:38:36 I did not see that coming. We'll be back again in two weeks. Until then, thanks for listening. Thanks for listening.

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