Switched on Pop - How Take A Daytrip took off (full interview)

Episode Date: April 30, 2021

The story of the hitmakers behind Lil Nas X’s “Montero” Sheck Wes’s “Mo Bamba” and many more Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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It's free for iOS users. Hey, it's Charlie. Just this week, we did a total breakdown of Lil Nas X's Montero, call me by your name. And I spoke with the producer duo, Take a Day Trip, David and Denzel, about how they put together that track. In our original conversation, we also talked about how they went from meeting in school to their struggles in the early part of their career before their big first hit Mobamba with Shek West and the full story of meeting and working with Lil Nas X. I had so much fun talking with them. I just thought you might enjoy the conversation. So here's Take a Day Trip.

Hey, what's up? I'm David. What's up? I'm Denzo. We are Take a Day Trip. We make some tunes. We play some keyboards, put down some drums, just overall record makers. Just try to have fun doing it. What's the origin of Take a Day Trip? How did you all get together? I guess we'll take it back.

Kind of one, like my story and then Denzel's story and then how we connected. I was born and raised in Rhode Island. and then moved to Vermont when I was 13. And like all through high school, I was like playing piano. And I started taking like DJ lessons when I was 13 when I moved to Vermont. And it got me inspired to the idea of performing and making music as a producer, more of like an artist producer and like a DJ space. And that's what got me excited to apply to NYU, like this program,

the Clive Davis Institute of Recorded Music, kind of just we both settled in New York. that's when we really met. And then Denzel from your side. Yeah, so I was born in Brooklyn and my family moved to New Jersey when I was pretty young. So that's where I grew up. And I learned a lot of music between the internet and playing in church. So the music director of my church was this producer, Noel Goring, who did a lot of, like, a lot of like early on like 90s R&B stuff and then uh basically taught me logic and you know just

like the beginnings of production and really just like dealing with artists and stuff like that and then on the back of that I got like really interested in just learning as much as I can so I was big on just searching everything through YouTube that I could find on production which at that time there wasn't like that much stuff and then started making my own videos of like the things that I was learning and like kind of reteaching the things that I was learning. And then those videos are really what like kind of got me into NYU. That was like part of my admission process and what they were like most impressed about. So yeah. And then that's where David and I met. We were in the same program, both in the Clive Davis Institute. And at the time I was mainly DJing before starting to learn how to

produce and Denzel had a more of a knowledge and production from you know when he was just saying when he started when he was like 13 but I started DJing when I was 13th we kind of had these overlapping interests where he taught me how to produce and I taught him how to DJ along with our friend Mel de Barge who was a long time OG of ours who was also a DJ but we kind of you know swapped our talents figured out what we're both good at both me and Denzel have been playing instruments, you know, growing up since we were, you know, first graders, kindergartners, all that kind of stuff. Grew up with music in our homes, all those kind of things. So I think when we finally officially came together to really form, take a day trip, it was at first, like, the challenge of figuring out,

you know, where we're going to fit in and like who's the best at what things. And then over time, we kind of have learned each other's skill sets to a point where when we're in the studio, we don't even really have to communicate anymore. It's kind of like, there's times where I'll be like, oh, like, how about you do like, you know, you know, like cut some of the high end out of this or blah, blah, blah. And like before I'm even like able to say the full sentence, like Denzel's already doing it.

And that's kind of how our relationship has developed since, since college. It's just has been like this long journey of, you know, getting to know each other as human beings, but also as creatives and, you know, communicating both, you know, with our, with our voices, but also learning how to communicate just through sounds and just through music. And that's kind of been the journey that we've been on since 2011 when we met Welcome Week at NYU. What's the meaning behind the name, take a day trip? Our whole goal has to always been to create through experiences and really strive to learn things

and really dive into new environments and new places and meet new people and really learn people's stories and all these things and then translate that into the music that we make, whether we're making it just me and Denzel or making it with another collaborator or, you know, whoever's involved. But take a day trip has kind of been the name to always remind us that no matter what we want to see the world through music, and no matter what we want to make the world feel smaller through music. It took a minute before you had a super smash hit. I'm curious, what was the, or those intervening years like? Those years were very tough, very tough years. It was a lot of putting our heads down and just charging forward and, you know, trying to figure things out.

I mean, we were lucky enough to go to a school that had facilities and had studios. Denzel at the time was working with two of our friends, Phil Chong and Baby Jay, and this artist named Deep Pride from the Toronto area. And they had a studio down on Canal Street that that's where we kind of got our start outside of NYU. And at the time, I wasn't really actually producing yet, I remember. I remember, you know, bringing our now manager, John Tanner's over from a birthday party one time. And I brought him to the studio. And I was kind of introducing John as like, oh, maybe I could be like an executive or like a manager type guy, like introducing him to Denzel.

And like, I led to John drunkenly telling us, come to my office. He was working at Epic at the time. And me and Denzel thought he said, come to my office like every Monday. So me and Denzel would show up every Monday and then it forced me to like learn how to really produce beats because we come in and we have to like show him a bunch of stuff and he give us feedback and all these things. And you know, from his point of view,

if he were to tell you the story, he'd be like, oh, fuck, these kids are here again. Like it's Monday. I just told them one Monday. You were doing the hustle. You were learning your craft. Yeah. We're just down to literally do anything.

Like right after we, graduated, or I guess around the time that we were graduating, we started working with this artist Rory from Atlanta, who we wanted to be on like this project that we were calling a day trip where, you know, we were going to simulate going to these different places around the world and making music like based on what we think like experiences there would be like as like a proof of concept to like really go and be able to do that. So we met him, did like a few songs with him for our project and like you know our whole mindset of the time was like you know we're not going to be like just producers that make beats and send it and then you know those two songs that we did with worry

he ended up getting a deal like in the middle of when we were doing it and then the label is like oh we'll buy those two songs for 20 grand and we're like what or even i think it was like 10 grand we're like oh what like take it like this project is done like take it we're good like we'll be able to like do whatever we want after we sell these after we sell these bees. And that's kind of what brought us back to like wanting to be producers. We're like, all right, if we are producers for long enough and make enough money, we'll have enough money to like travel around the world and like do this project. Yeah.

So that was like really the plan in between those like in between years of like, are we going to do this like project in a super scrappy way and like have $50 to go in between countries and like Eastern Europe or just make beats for rappers and like, at what point do we transition it? It was a lot of that, like just figuring out how to make money and exist in New York and pay for food and rent. One of those songs that we do with Rory was called Cigarette Song, and that led to Universal showing interest in signing us. And me and Denzel were definitely at a point where Denzel had already been a couple months out of college when we started to have these conversations with Universal. And I was just about to graduate.

it and we were both at a level. I mean, Denzel had another job at one point. We're both at a level where we're like, well, we have to figure this out now in terms of having a base of money to at least sustain us and keep us going so we can afford to rent a studio and like all these, you know, things that we really needed at the beginning of our journey. And cigarette song was the first song that gave us an opportunity with a publishing label to sign to Universal, gave us some money in our pockets, gave us a little foundation. And then over the next couple years from that point, I want to say we signed in 2015, June 2015, and then we heard Mobamba in June 2017. And then that song didn't pop off really until like a year and a half later. So we had this long period,

like Denzel was saying, of just kind of going from project to project, you know, having these moments where like, this is going to be our thing. Like, this is going to be the big break. And then, you know, something would come out or like things would get shelved or all these kind of things. We have so many situations where we had the dream in our head on a project that we're starting or beginning to work on or something that would keep us afloat and had all these moments where we just ended up disappointed, but kept learning how to push forward.

And even through so many projects, we have long time collaborates. and friends that, you know, we're still working with or are still in touch with today that are so important a part of our journey right now. But it was definitely a long, it took a really long time. Yeah. Until the first thing, like, like, actually, uh, connected. And that was MoMA with Shaq West. Yeah. Yeah. Mobamba was like our first, like, this is our charting hit on Billboard. Yeah, even after that came out, like, you know, it was on radio. And I remember that point It was such a struggle even with that song on the radio. Like I remember moving from Lower East Side or like downtown to like Brooklyn and like packing all my shit up in a U-Haul with my girlfriend and like one of our homies that was like interning for us and like literally having no money and like, you know, literally driving this U-Haul over the Brooklyn Bridge.

But then like Moamba comes on the radio. I'm like, huh, that's pretty crazy. That's on the radio. But having like, you know, $500 in my account and like in 15 days. like my rent is due and it's way more than that. And even for that song, probably made like, you know, to place, it was like they gave us like five grand or whatever, you know, because it was so early on in our career to, you know, sell that beat.

But yeah, it definitely took a while for us to like really be in a place that we could like comfortably, like, buy food every day. When did that change? That changed at the beginning of 2019. Like at the time, it was like a weird, like perfect storm but just after Mobamba was like really

getting big on radio our publishing deal was up for renegotiation and we had like a couple other things in the works and I think yeah we haven't even met Lil Nas X yet but just off the strength of like

them seeing like oh wow they're really just on their own found like an artist and made a song that is like climbing the billboard charts we were able to like renegotiate like really good deal. And then the money from Mubamba started like coming in the like all at the beginning of 2019, it just like went from famine to feast almost, not really feast, but it was like comparatively at the fees. Let's get into the little Nossack story. How did you all connect? So it was beginning of April 2019. So when Momba picked up and Universal started backing us a little

bit more. We started going to L.A. from New York City, like, once a month, you know, from June 2018, all the way out until we, you know, got apartments here in like May 2019, June 2019. So, like, right before we were like ready to move, or at least like ready to have a place in L.A. It was actually probably like our last trip before finding apartments here. I remember our A&R. James Supreme was like, you know, you guys are in town, little Naz X is in town, old town road just went number one this week. It's his birthday this week. Do you guys want to have his first session ever? And all the stars happened to align that day. Did you feel pressure to follow up something big? I don't think we felt any pressure. I think it was more of just like we were curious

of what direction he wanted to go to. And because that song was so huge at the time and it came out of almost out of nowhere for the rest of the world, everyone's like, whoa, this new kid, little Naz-X. and all of a sudden he has a number one record, like, where'd that come from? So for us, like, we were really curious. We're just like, let's see what this kid's about and, like, let's see what direction he wants to go in. And I think early on, everyone was kind of looking at him as like, oh, this is the kid that's going to make, like, a black kid that's going to make country music. And that's all he's going to do. And me and Denzel had, like, our country pack, like, ready to go.

You know, we had, like, a bunch of guitar loops from our friend Rushchell, who did rodeo with us. and like a frequent collaborator with us. And then we had another pack that was just like, let's see if he wants to do something else. And I remember we hopped in the session with his A&R. West. And it was the first time West was in a room with him too. So all of us had kind of no idea what's expected. And, you know, we're getting to know each other,

all this kind of stuff. Like it's his first time in Los Angeles. And slowly starting to realize that he doesn't want to just be known as this, you know, black kid that enters the country. country space and is this one hit wonder that only makes this massive country song and then for the rest of his life is just kind of making gimmicky country records playing off of something that he's already done before at such a massive level and such and you know seeing all the success and he was like oh like I remember we played him a couple of country records and one of them was the starting idea to rodeo and his A&R west was like put that one to the side like maybe we'll back to that one and I remember he was like play me something that's like like super futuristic, like just something that is just different. And we had made this one beat and we name all our beats after food. We named it beef pasta. And I remember, Nas was like, play your most futuristic thing. And me and Denzel looked at each other. We're like,

maybe we should play that one. And like right away, he was like, that's the one, like load that up. And, you know, wrote the whole record on the spot, arranged it with us. We recorded the whole thing. And then before we had even finished the second verse, he, you know, had one of our friends, Stefan shoot this video of him. And then he posted on the internet of like the snippet of Panini. And from there, like, you know, the whole internet just reacted to this record. That whole week he recorded the rest of the seven EP. So he kind of like was jogging along the rest of the week.

Like, I have this like massive bit in my pocket. Let me go finish the rest of this EP and, you know, sail into the sunset, you know. But that was the, that was the beginning of our relationship. So beef pasta becomes Panini. Yeah. The funny thing about that, too, is that me. and dens were eating at John and Vinnie's, which is an Italian restaurant. And we were eating beef pasta. Like literally we're eating beef pasta. And then the OG, you know, big g, the, you know, the g.

the g. The, you know, the g. before Lil Nas X. No way. Like, like, right across the booth from us. And we're like, wow, that's crazy that. Like, Nas is right there. We're about to go link up with Lil Nas X. And then it happens to pick the beat named after the food that we're eating for lunch, like, you know, right before the session. It was a lot of synchronicity in that day. Yeah, a lot of random stars a lot. Obviously, Old Town Road just went number one. It was his birthday that week.

It was just like, wow. And funny enough, like Montero, call me by your name, comes out right during the same time period as when we met Lil Nasax and May Panini. And also, me and Denzel released our first single ever as like a DJ group on April 8th. So everything in the month of April for some reason ends up being a special month for us. Denzel, tell me about the process of getting into Call Me By Your Name, Montero. This time last year, spring 2020, when everything was shut down, we were sending things back and forth with Nas. And we hadn't really started the album.

It was just like ideas that we were sending back and forth. And then at some point he was like, you know what? I want you guys to executive produce my album. I want to get like an Airbnb and we just start making things and going in together. And, you know, at that point, everyone was like super scared to really even see other people. So we're only going to see like we're going to go from our house to this Airbnb and back. And that'll be able to be safe like that. So we started doing that.

And then we met Omar Feddy like, you know, in the beginning of that process. Yeah, we played guitar. And, you know, really has been like a huge part of this. project as well. So one night, we were recording one of the songs that Nas had made in his house during quarantine that he recorded on his phone. And then we were just like re-recording that

after we like reproduced it out. And then in the middle of the take, he's like, wait, just record this like separately. And he's just like, call me when you want, call me when you need, call me in the moon. And just says that like randomly. And doesn't have like all the words figured out to the end of that phrase.

and then we're like, okay, cool. And then we go back to recording the other song and then we're like, maybe we should, maybe we should do something with that other thing you just did. And then Omer just like immediately just was like, oh, like, these chords could be cool over it. And then he records the guitar on his iPhone. Then we just like put it in a new session

and just loop it out for like 30 minutes, just that part. And then they just did melodies on it and like playing the bass. while they're doing melodies. And basically the entire song melodically was done just like in that 20 minute period randomly while doing another song,

which is like Nause's favorite thing to do. Like if you have to do something, it's like pressure to do something. We'll literally do the opposite for like 12 hours just to like not do it. But then sometimes it's like those offshoots end up becoming like, calling by your name or like other songs like that.

David and Roy and Omar did like a bunch of claps And then, you know, I'm at my apartment and they send it them, I'm like, oh, it's just high. Then start, like, cutting it up just from, like, voice notes and, like, placing it in. And then we had got a banjo because it would be so, it would be so funny to put, like, a banjo on this album because of, like, All-Ton Road. And, like, Naz, you know, literally wants to do nothing country, but it was, like, just funny to have a banjo. And then that ended up, like, making it on the song, too. but it was a very like serendipitous type of process of ideas just like randomly hit you and then we just like put it down and then that's how we kind of constructed that song as a whole yeah yeah it was definitely

a song that we when it was made it wasn't like it took multiple days over spread out over multiple months to you know find the final version of the record you know like a lot of the records that we've made in the past you know we'll have that one session and capture the magic in that one session. And then me and Denzel will go work on it over a collective, you know, maybe two, three days max and have a final version. For this one, it was definitely like multiple days. Like we're working on other things at the same time and not putting all our attention

on call me by your name all at once. And it was kind of just when ideas came to us capturing those moments when they came. And that was just spread over months. everything kind of happened like when it happened you know nothing was forced nothing was rushed to kind of if an idea fell out the sky

or like a circumstance where we had a studio to record in or like whatever it might be you know if we have an opportunity and like an idea comes in an opportunity we just you know put it on the record but especially I think the thing with this song was like through this process of you know spending the entire

year from last spring to now really like as we're still working on it. There have been different layers of nods that have become more unearthed as time went on. And that one was like one of the early ones where he was just able to be so much more honest and not really have to hide things

and like metaphors about what things mean. And I think really like, you know, that was one of the first times that he really was able to operate in life, not hiding like pieces of himself, you know, because like he had come out last June, but then was like doing a bunch of promo and stuff and like, you know, going to different countries and doing shows and being really busy.

And then just like everything stops. And everyone got so much time to really think about themselves and like how they fit into the world. And I think, you know, around that time, because of everything stopping and him being able to just, you know, we just like go to the mall. He would just like hang out with his friends or like go meet up with someone or like go on a date.

for something, probably for like the first time in his life, like, it just instantly started translating into songs. Because of that, we always, we had a feeling from the very beginning that it was just special, even just personally, not even a thing that climbs the charts, but just like, this is like a special thing. Did you all have any sense of the impact that the song would have on its many different levels of impact? He would always be like, he would say, like, this is going to be a more.

moment. Like you guys literally do not understand. And we didn't, like, we had not even seen a video until it came out. Like, we watched the premiere with everyone else. But I feel like he had, you know, so much of the entire thing planned out in his head. And from a song standpoint, we're like, wow, this is like really special. Yeah. But, but he did, he did break down some things with us where he'd be like, okay, this is like the idea I'm thinking for the video. And like, he would send us like, you know, briefs and like all sorts of stuff of like, you know, he writes. And all his treatment and then brought the treatment to the other person who directed the video and they worked on it together and all those things. And he was bouncing ideas off of us as that process was going. So there was things we were aware of when it came to the stripper pole and like all those kind of things. And like the Garden of Eden and stuff like that. And he let us know too.

He's like, you know, you guys are going to see me in a way that you've never seen me before like all these things, you know. And like be very like proud of it. He's like, I'm going to show my bros like this other side of me. you know, like all that kind of stuff. Kind of like, you know, hyping us up like, oh, this is going to be amazing and like this is going to be a moment, like a new era. How did it feel when the song broke and sort of took apart America for a few weeks? It was incredible, you know?

Like for me and Denz, like we knew what the video was going to be about, but we both on purpose were like, you know what? We kind of want to, we kind of want to experience this with the rest of the world. But from like a social standpoint, I feel like I didn't even really know that so many people were not going to be. able to like grasp it, but it was interesting to see like all the conversations start happening on Twitter. And we would just go through like reading all the threads and seeing like the back and forth. I think that, I mean, it did that so well in how it inspired conversations that were never had before for like certain people and like expose them to like new ideas. And not and Nas knew the controversy around, you know, bringing religion into showing himself

going down to hell and giving Satan a lap dance and all these things. But really the message behind all that is like, this is a kid who grew up in church. This is a kid who was told from a very early age that one of the biggest sins is to be gay. You know, and you will not be forgiven for that and you will go to hell for that no matter what. So he essentially just made a music video saying, well, if I'm going to be gay and I'm going to be open about my sexuality and be fully myself, then I'm going to shoot a music video of myself going to hell. and living it up, you know? And he knew the conversation was starting. He knew it would piss off a lot of people, a lot of people that aren't quick to realize the actual true message behind that music video and what it's actually saying and how that relates to so many people that are afraid to be truly themselves because there's so many things in the world that tell someone who is gay or someone who is a person of color, you know, so many things that you can't be something or go someplace because of who you are.

he knew from the start what this would stir. And at the end of the day, like, you know, when this video came out, like this kid was just like smiling, you know, just so happy. He's just like, this is exactly what I wanted to create because it's waking a lot of people up, you know, and it's forcing a conversation for so many people that may not have realized that some of their ideas and thought processes based on a religion or your parents or a mentor or whatever might be the thing. teaching you a certain way, that sometimes not all your beliefs might be the best beliefs

when we're simply talking about allowing everyone to love who they want to love. He's so good at mashing up all of our expectations, just like larger mass media cultural expectations and finding some way of surprising us and saying something important. And within that context, I feel like musically what he's so good at is finding ways to work with folks like yourself and mashing up different genres and styles to give our ear something new. I'm curious on this track, what are the kinds of references that you are building in, either intentionally or as you hear them now? This song is really built around like a harmonic bass of, you know, the song is in Phrygian.

And like, I think every song that we've had in the top 10, oddly, has been Phrygian in the Frigian mode. which is how would you describe frigid, like what is it, what is sort of it's like a quality mode is like if you play as a scale, it has almost like a Middle Eastern or, you know,

Moorish or Spanish, like that entire region kind of like harmonically is very Phrygian based. But then Mobamba obviously not being like something that sounds like Flamengo, but it definitely does still borrow from it.

But it definitely causes tension. It's like a tension building scale and like group of notes to use together. Yeah, I mean, well, Bamba's core progression used to be called like the devil's tritone for a really long time. It was like a band progression. And a lot of what you see of how that song made people react is that it's just how Denz is saying. It's just tension is constantly building. Like the whole record, like, you know, the core progression is constantly looping. as, you know, it's in just tension.

Like nothing ever really fully resolves. Right. And the same thing with Call Me where it's like, you know, it just goes up a minor second and then back down a minor second. Up a minor second, like causes tension and then like kind of eases it by going back down that minor second and then just like literally repeats for the entire song where it's like always pushing and pulling on on your emotions. Were you thinking about that tonality as you were sort of imagining,

like there's this like Satan worship happening in the video. Like are they are these things connected? I'd say and this is something that we've, I think through the periods in between like graduating college and like being able to fully support ourselves, we had to learn how to do things very specifically and like with extreme intent in a way where you know, we're working with this artist who has this goal.

and they want to achieve this thing. So like, how do we put all of our cards together to achieve that goal sonically and harmonically and drum-wise and genre-wise? So I think it's not something where we're like, oh, well, let's write something in Frigian today. But just having, like, certain things in our back pocket where we're like, oh, like, if we want to cause tension, like, this is what it sounds like, if we want to ease tension, like, this is usually what that sounds like, or even just identifying, like, that is our intention to do some of those things. But, yeah, definitely wasn't like, oh, this is something to, like, definitely dance on the devil to. But it was definitely, like, something that, you know, the entire song was built on, like, building and releasing tension.

David, I'm curious. Any other sort of stylistic references, either with instruments or other things that are going on the production? Yeah, I mean, everything for that. The most part was hilariously recorded with just through our iPhones minus the banjo. But we wanted this record to feel very live, you know. So when he, you know, was in the booth and was like, I have an idea calling what I need. And then Omer immediately was like, oh, here are the chords for it. From the jump, our collaborators, like, you know, are in the same pocket of like a world that we like to create within.

me coming from classical piano training, Denzel coming from the jazz world, and then being such fans of music, and then us being able to play around with that bass. And from layering in, like, claps and, you know, stomping on the ground with, like, our feet and then stomping on the ground with our hands, like, creating kick drums. And, you know, all sorts of things are just like, you know, when this record was created, we're like, oh, like, there's something about it where, like, it could feel like we're in, like, a drum circle, like, around a campfire.

all these kind of things. We're all like clapping and having fun together. And we're like moving together and like we're grooving together with it. Let's make the whole production around it feel like we could do this like in a circle together like clapping along. I feel like a lot of things that are like, you know, like David was saying that that riff like definitely invokes a visceral reaction just as well as like the claps. Like if someone were to clap behind you like unexpectedly, it would definitely cause like,

you know, you would at least turn your head and it, you know, causes attention, like, people clap for celebration. Like, you know, all those things kind of like, you know, there's so many organic elements from the guitar to the claps and the banjo. But then in the second, well, in the chorus going to the second verse is crazy, distorted, like, 808 that comes out of nowhere, which, like, you know, grabs your attention in a different way. but, you know, is very familiar to people who listen to hip hop a lot, you know, and that, you know, it pulls you in a certain direction. And even the banjo, usually you never hear a banjo playing in Phrygian or like any harmonic minor or like anything like that. The way it sounds, like when you play a banjo in harmonic minor, not seeing someone play

it, you would think that it's like a Ood or a sitar or something. But then it kind of like then starts to draw a line across. it's like, oh, all these things are actually very much more connected, like a banjo, you know, from the south or like a sitar from the Middle East and the Ood, like all these different instruments are not really that different. It's just like the way that people, their experiences change the way that they played them and, you know, now they're characterized in like different ways, but there's so many like interconnection between all these things that like are interesting to think about. And how it's perceived is so interesting because it's like,

obviously there's a ton of layers, but from like just straight musical standpoint, what he's saying is one thing, but below that, like you're saying, there's a lot of, you know, only being from Israel

and bringing in a lot of those melodies, but the song is number one on Spotify and Israel, and it's also number one in Saudi Arabia, which is like, you know that it's not, because of the lyrics, you know, there's like other things that people are connecting to

that are like, oh, like, I'm familiar with this for some reason. And then that's like the entry point for some people. Whereas like in other, it's just interesting to really think about like in other countries. There might be like different entry points of, oh, that's what I really like about it. Like I'm sure, you know, hip hop fans listen to like the 808 and it's like, oh, that's my entry point. And then you kind of like explore everything else that's in there after it. There seems to be a lot of intentionality in the way that you think about your production,

which makes me think about this little Twitter kerfuffle that happened a few years back between the producers A-Track and Zed. And A-track was saying your song, Mbomba that you produced, was excellent. And Zed came in saying, nah, I don't really like this. Like, clearly it's just made for the club. Like, I only make music that I really like.

And then you all hilariously chime in and start quoting the actual chords and music theory behind what makes Momba such a smash. You know, like we definitely create on feeling first. But if you ever come after us and say we're not legitimate producers, we will tell you the core progression. We will let you know that we know how to make music, you know. Obviously, you know, I don't want to start any beef and no offense to Zed.

Like we're big fans of Zed. And I understand in that moment, like, you know, the way the hip-hop genre is perceived. and a lot of producers in the hip-hop genre. I think a lot of people look at hip-hop producers of people that might not have all the music knowledge in the world, you know, or, you know, might play an 808 out of tune and, like, have no idea that they're playing an 808 out of tune, even though that adds so much character, just so many records, you know?

And I think in that moment, we really just wanted to prove to the world and really stand up for ourselves, like, hey, we are black producers in this space. Like, yes, we made a really big rap record, but we're not going anywhere just because of where this song might fit in a category. At the end of the day, we love making music, we know how to make music, and we're going to be making music for the rest of our lives. And we're going to be making music with people that we truly love and truly cherish and truly feel an important voice to the world.

And that's always been a big goal of ours is really changing the conversation around black producers in the pop space, especially for this general. generation and really showing people that, oh, no, we can play ball as well. And we're here in this space as well. And yes, we're going to make a song go number one as well. And we're also going to do it twice and we're going to make sure they both debut. Exactly. So, you know, it's just a little warning.

Don't come out our next people because we love making music and, you know, this is what we love to do. And we really want to show the world that black kids can do this too. Because I feel like, you know, we through just life have studied so much about music just because we love it so much, regardless of it being our career. There's just so much that we personally dive into and we could spend, you know, months just listening to spaghetti Western music and just figuring out why it makes you feel a certain way. And I think just that approach, you know, you break something down for its intent. And I think the genre of pop music, you know, like pop is just popular, you know, switched on pop is just like a study of popular music. But pop the genre to me is really just like an intent to do something specific because really like, you know, Max Martin was making just like a mix between multiple genres and created what many people now think is like the pop genre.

but like is Drake you know going one two and three on billboard any less pop than I Kiss the Girl by Katie Perry like it's not any less pop so I think you know our outlook on music and you know all these genres as a whole is like really just based on like intention and then like as David was saying showing that yeah we are two black kids that love hip hop music but that doesn't mean that we can't do things with intent behind it. And that's what we're always going to continue to do. Thanks guys for sharing everything. I really appreciate it.

Thank you. This was great. Yeah, it was great being in practice. Be all guys.