Switched on Pop - Justin Bieber’s Existential Suite

Episode Date: October 7, 2015

Bieber’s two new hits, “Where Are Ü Now” and “What Do You Mean,” showcase the prodigal pop star’s soberer side. In each, his realization of the fictive nature of relationships is musicalized through slippery piano chords and disembodied voices. But just two songs does not make a true existential suite, so we collaborated with the mysterious Breakmaster Cylinder to propose a third stanza for Bieber’s epic poem of love and loss. FEATURING Jack Ü – Where Are Ü Now (ft. Justin Bieber) Justin Bieber – What Do You Mean Justin Bieber – Boyfriend Mark Ronson – Uptown Funk Want to finish Justin Bieber’s trilogy? Listen to “Why Am I Here?” and download the track on Breakmaster Cylinder’s Soundcloud. Then, record your vocal and send it to [e-mail]. We’re looking at you Justin.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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And save your favorite spots, share lists, follow editors, and book right in the app. Download the Eater app at Eaterapp.com. It's free for iOS users. I just had the craziest, freakiest dream, okay? listening to the radio and this came on and I actually liked them. Oh, my God. Nate, it's not a dream.

This is switched on pop. So let's do this thing. I'm songwriter Charlie Harding. And I'm musicologist Nate Sloan. It's true. Justin Bieber is back. And on today's episode, we are going to deconstruct the melancholy in his new music. Because Justin is asking big questions.

He's composed an existential suite of songs that ask, Where Are You Now and What Do You Mean? The first, Where Are You Now, was produced by the DJ duo Scrillex and Diplo. I gave me the key when the door wasn't open. Just admitted. See, I gave your faith, turned your doubt in the hole. And the second, what do you mean, came out just a little bit later and has a lot of sonic similarities to the first.

So together with these two tracks, it feels like he's doing something unique in the pop landscape. taking two songs that are a far cry from anything we've heard from him before. You know, earlier in his career on a track like boyfriend, Bieber was all about swagger. And eating fondue. And generally, just seemed to be a very confident young man. Right. Now with his return, he's in his early 20s. And presumably, he's doing what young men in their 20s have been doing for generations.

reading existential philosophy. Right. Now, it's really easy to listen to these songs and want to think about Beaver's larger career arc. But ultimately, we're more interested in uncovering Bieber's mental state, his feelings of alienation, confusion, and the ultimate unknowability of the world and one another. Also, you're going to want to stick around for later in the show, because I'm going to suggest that maybe, this suite isn't over, and perhaps there is a third installment, a trilogy, if you will, brought to us by our friend, the mysterious brakemaster cylinder. Ah, the plot thickens.

But before we get ahead of ourselves, for the uninitiated, Nate is going to give us a brief history of Mr. Bieber. He is? One caveat, though, Nate, because we have so much great stuff we want to go over in the show. I just don't think we can dedicate much time to Bieber's entire history. So without saying much more, I'm going to put 30 seconds on the clock and you're going to give us the entire history in 30 seconds when you're done, the buzzer will ring and it's over. Ready? Go.

Flashback to 1994, Justin Bieber, born in Ontario. Loves to sing as a kid. Fast forward, he's a teeny bopper. He puts songs on YouTube's. Everyone loves them, including the music biz, R&B superstar Usher takes Justin as his musical protege. His first LP goes platinum led by his hit song, Baby, baby, baby, baby. Ooh, baby. Beber fever erupts, infecting millions of believers. Then everyone turns on him. They make fun of his hairstyle. He has run-ins with the lawn.

It all seems downhill for Beber until his recent resurrection. 30 seconds, perfect. Thank you, sir. So the question is, Charlie, where is Beber now? Well, I think Justin Bieber is clearly in a state of existential dread. If you listen to his most recent songs, we have moved beyond this, the Beber. fever, the platinum tweenie bopper, he is now definitely in a state of melancholy. And to emphasize this emotional state, we've chosen a few quotes from famous existentialist philosophers to lead off each section of today's show. So to begin, you will never be happy if you continue to search for what happiness consists of.

You will never live if you are looking for the meaning of life. Albert Camus. Bieber is definitely in a state of searching. He is looking for his happiness. And this new mental state, we can hear in a totally new sound. First created by the unexpected DJ duo, Jack Yu, made up of Scrilex and Diplo, most famous for fathering the EDM and dubstep movement into the mainstream. Now, Diplo and Scrilex, they're trying to surprise us. They're taking this teen pop wonder and putting him into a totally new context.

And frankly, this is a song which is really surprising for radio. And at his core, yeah, this song is sullen. It's about a failed relationship purportedly about Justin's celebrity partner, Selena Gomez. Regardless, this existential nature of this song is built right into its form. Because, Charlie, this is not the typical structure of a pop song. Yeah, what do you mean? I'd say 95% of songs are verse chorus, verse chorus, bridge, verse chorus,

and maybe throw another chorus at the very end. Some variation on that formula. Where Are You Now? Seems to be doing something very different. It's very dislocated. They're just two verses and the chorus just kind of repeats endlessly. It's very odd. Without further ado, I think we should take a listen to Where Are You Now?

So the first thing I hear is that his first thing I hear is that his first thing, voice is manipulated, twisted, and in a whole new sonic territory. Yeah. Kind of quiet and introspective. Ooh, he is distressed. I gave me the key when the door wasn't open. Just admitted. See, I gave your faith, turned your doubt in the hope.

And this looping, but somehow very ambiguous chord progression on the, played on the piano. Tell me he. Where are you now? Ooh, more manipulation. High voices, low voices. Big Justin, little Justin. When you broke down, I didn't leave you. I was by your side.

So where are you now that I need you? And then we go to this whole new territory. Where are you now that I need you? What? Wait, Charlie, now we're in this dance track. Right, it feels like we have moved into a trance. And where has Justin gone? His voice is off in the distance, this reverb and delay.

It's almost like he's not even present here in the chorus. And then we're back in the ether. Okay, so this song is really strange for me. I feel like I've never heard anything quite like this on the radio. I think you're right. It's both the structure of the song and those weird effects of just, and getting chopped up and distorted, and it just feels like he's totally lost and confused,

leading with the lyric, where are you now that I need you? It's like everybody has left him. Yeah, and, you know, literally in this chorus, everyone leaves. There's hardly any lyrics, except the occasional interjection of that interrogative. But it's just being launched into a void. There's no other voices.

There's no other lyrics. sound we have is the strange tone that Scrilex describes as the dolphin sound, which is actually Justin Bieber's voice pitched way up and filtered so that it isn't even recognizable anymore. It's like his, the ghost of himself. I feel like it's kind of eerie that he doesn't really sing on the chorus. He's gone. Is it common for people to not sing on the chorus? Very rarely.

You know, one of the only other examples that kind of. comes to mind is Uptown Funk, actually. Don't believe me just why I'm. Yeah, right. You know, it's just that horn riff. Right. And so maybe this is a trend. If you look at this chorus, the Where Are You Now That I Need You portion?

Actually came earlier from the verse. So he just keeps repeating himself over and over again. Yeah. It definitely seems like Bieber is not in a good way right now. No, definitely. Isolated, confused, empty, repeating himself. I think it's time to help him out with another existential philosopher. This time brought to us by our friend Jean-Paul Sartre.

We do not know what we want, and yet we are responsible for what we are. That is the fact of the matter. Mike drop. It hits hard. I can feel my heart sink. So Justin is in a first. fallout with his partner. And in this case, his partner doesn't know what they want in the relationship. They keep leaving him. He has followed up, Where Are You Now, with a song with equal angst.

What do you mean? Yeah. Justin co-wrote this song with the same producer, a guy named Poo-Bear. Foo-Bear as a continuation of the Skrillex Diplo Epic. What do you mean? So to start us off, Nate, this is definitely a popier track, right? Absolutely. Yeah, the first thing that I hear is we're actually starting on a chorus, and then later on we get a pre-chorus. I know you love those pre-chorus.

Oh, I really do. In a lot of ways, there's less contrasts between that plodding piano verse and dance chorus. But still, there's a number of elements here that also, serve to disorient us. Right. To mirror the fundamental instability at the root of this relationship. Which is a really lofty way of saying that off the bat, we hear this ticking clock, a not so subtle metaphor that time is ticking on his relationship.

Well, Charlie, if you can't say it loftily, why say it at all? I think you've been reading a bit too much existential philosophy. But nevertheless, I agree. This is a sibling of the earlier song, once you start to get into it. Where are you now and what do you mean are cut from the same cloth? Starting with this chord progression played on piano and then the build to a dance song with a big four on the floor bass drum. From the very start, it's clear that these songs are connected, that what do you mean is part two of Where Are You Now is part one. And the first clue that I get is is that piano.

So I don't know if you heard it, but what's going on in that piano is we're actually starting on the, almost the exact same chord. The songs are pitched just one step away from each other. But we'll just say they're basically in the same key.

And that first chord you get is a C major. But we're actually in the key of G major. We're not starting on the home base. We're starting at an ambiguous place. And the chords both start on this ambiguous C major. and then end back on C major again.

So we actually have almost a non-resolution in the chordal progression just as we're getting non-resolution in the relationship where he's saying, what do you mean? All your words are so confusing. You're not clear about what you're saying. Charlie, your musicological musings amuse me to no end. I love that. That is beautiful.

Yeah, this C-major chord is at such a distance from our G-Maj. major route that it unsettles things. We want to get to that G major, but Pooh Bear doesn't let us. He won't take us there. So the piano just keeps on repeating and repeating. And thank you. I do think that the apprentice may one day become the master. Whoa. So not get ahead of ourselves here. Okay. Anyway. Maria, you have a podcast now and you need to start acting like it. What's the first step as a podcaster? Well, you have to ask lots of questions. I'm Maria I'm hosting a new podcast called Pretty Tough. Every week, I'm sitting down with trailblazing women at the top of their game to discuss ambition, work ethic, and the ups and downs that come on the path to achieving greatness. I have a few pretty tough questions for you. Ready? Ready? Do not sugarcoat something for me. No, no. We'll dive into their stories and get valuable insights from top executives, actors, entrepreneurs, and other individuals who have inspired me so much in my own journey. Pretty tough is your front row seat to the women who have demonstrated the power in being unapologetic in their pursuits.

I hope you'll join us. New episodes drop Wednesdays on YouTube or in your favorite podcast app. Immigration may be Donald Trump's signature issue. President Trump is now targeting predominantly democratic cities for ice raids and deportations. Dozens of protesters clashing with immigration and customs enforcement agents in Minneapolis Tuesday. We will begin the process of returning millions and millions of criminals. aliens back to the places from which they came. But what we want to do in this space is talk about America and politics beyond the current president. So what do most Americans think about deportation and border security, period?

I think that Americans are definitely against the kind of violent displays that we've seen in the street from ICE. When it comes to the question of deportation, the answer is more complicated. My sense is that people want border at the border. They don't like the idea of having no idea who's coming into the United States at any given time. The view on immigration from the bottom up instead of the top down. That's this week on America Actually. Every Saturday in your audio and video feeds. So we start off with this plotting piano that leaves us unsure what's happening in the relationship.

And this idea of failed, broken communication, what do you mean? I can't understand what you're saying. This lyrical idea is at its height of musical metaphor in the chorus when we hear this wild high-pitched synthesizer, which I kind of think sounds like a pan flute and a voice merged together. And every time he says, what do you mean? The synthesizer comes back in and it goes, you know, that thing? And it's like there's this call and response. He's saying, what thing, Charlie, one more time? Oh, right, right, right.

Okay, got it. That thing. So it's like it's calling back to him. What do you mean? And then it's almost like someone is singing back to him, but we can't understand the words. So is that, that's like the musical embodiment of his partner who is unable to express themselves. Exactly. Wow. Charlie, I love it. So this song is all about romantic vagaries. this communication difficulties in a relationship. And I feel like if where are you now almost feels like the post-breakup song, maybe in its poppier, slightly more beat, hopeful sound.

What do you mean? Is actually more like a prequel to where are you now? Possibly. I don't know if I really see these in a narrative continuum, but more just constellations, sort of expressing similar. feelings of unknowability and angst. But okay, sure, prequel. Okay, yeah. Okay, different articulation of the same feeling, if you will. Either way, it's indisputable that these songs emerge from a similar emotional place and a similar musical place, right? Absolutely. So, okay, so you're saying these songs are, they're cut from the same cloth. Right. So tell us how is it that these are actually

a deliberate continuation of each other, not nearly a carbon copy. Let's bring in another existential philosopher to help guide us through your question, Charlie. And I quote, There is always some madness in love, but there is also always some reason in madness. Nietzsche.

Okay, so... Yeah, we went to Nietzsche. I'm going to, try to pull back here, you're saying then that there is some sort of deliberate similarity, some reason behind the madness and these two breakup love songs. Yeah, I mean, we've talked about how lyrically these songs are definitely echoing each other. They're both questioning. They're both questing.

They're both querulous. They're both other words that start with QU. What I'm trying to say is that both of these songs are trying to figure out how we relate to one another, how you can know anyone and how you can know them. Is Bieber doomed to be alone? Are relationships real or are they fiction? Like Nietzsche said, there's always madness in love. How do you know if you're sane or not? So as these songs are dealing with probably the same relationship and,

and a similar state of turmoil, Justin has given us all these hints, these sonic similarities between these songs that say that really they're part of a larger suite, they together form a greater composition. So I'm hearing a couple of things that sounds similar between these songs. What are you hearing, Nate?

Well, you know, talking about this piano progression and what do you mean? Right. And the ambiguity that comes from it, starting on the C major chord, the subdominant chord, the fourth scale degree? Yeah. Where are you now?

It's doing the same thing. Yeah, so both these songs are using, as we talked about, a very similar piano material. In fact, they're using the same four chords, C, a D, an E minor, and a G. And both songs use these chords just in a slightly different order, but they both start and end on C. So, Charlie, can we listen to the Where Are You Now,

piano progression? Okay. And now can we hear the what do you mean piano progression? The chordal material is so similar. They could almost be twins of each other. So it's as if he started with the same color palette, the same chords. And he just played with them and manipulated them slightly such that they took on their own personalities. I think another musical through line between these two songs is how in each of their choruses, Bieber poses a question, where are you now? What do you mean? What do you mean? And then is answered by some weird sounding instrument. That doesn't really make sense, you know?

It's not like, what are you trying to say to me? Right. It's almost like we have this other, if Bieber is the narrator, his partner is answering him, but at a distance, lost in the woods, and we're just getting the total quality, but we can't hear the words. So we've got the piano.

We've got this strange, lost synth sound. And finally, the thing that is an obvious connection between the songs is these vocal manipulations. We've taken Justin Bieber, and we have time stretched him. We have cut up his words. We have pitched his vocals so high that they become unrecognizable. He's dissociated.

His identity is exposed for what it truly is, not something static and concrete, but something always in process and endlessly mutable. Yeah, it's heavy. So I loved Where Are You Now when I first heard it. And when What Do You Mean came out, I was so excited because I felt like it was a perfect, successful sequel.

And then I started to ask myself, amongst all of this sadness, is there any redemption for Justin Bieber? And I started to wonder, perhaps there's a missing link, a third song. What would Justin Bieber's trilogy sound like? What has been left unsaid? Before we explore that, let me just interject one more existential quote from our friend Dostoevsky. Much unhappiness has come into the world because of bewilderment and things left unsaid. Oh, much unhappiness is coming into the world.

We can't afford to leave this unanswered. So what you got? So I reached out to one of my absolute favorite producers in the world, The Mysterious Breakmaster Cylinder. Our listeners might have heard Breakmaster's music on other great shows like Reply All and This American Life. Well, I reached out to Breakmaster on Twitter, and I said, hey, what would happen if Bieber had written a third song? And so the two of us came together and we produced the third installment in Braylor. Bieber's Existential Suite.

Wow. First of all, kudos to you and the mysterious Breakmaster Cylinder. Charlie, this is just an amazing track. And I love it because it really feels like we are in the same territory as where are you now and what do you mean? How did you and Breakmaster Cylinder create this? Can we talk to him or her? Well, yes and no, because actually I produced the entire track with.

Breakmaster over Twitter and Dropbox, and Breakmaster's identity remains a mystery. So Breakmaster said that we could speak through an interpreter over the phone. Breakmaster. Hey, how's it going? Breakmaster, thank you so much for joining us. So my first question is just what was the number one musical element that you focused on in order to create continuity between your song and the other two Bieber tracks? Well, the first thing I had to recreate was that bouncy sense. with the parallel intervals. Once that sounded about right, then the rest could sort of fall into place.

The bass is pretty round and typical, and the piano is a piano. How did you strike a balance between keeping these similarities intact, but also having this song be new and standing on its own just like these other songs do? Right.

Well, I think the chorus is a chance to get weird, right? But this was mostly imitation. I wanted that blast of dubstep bass, and I really enjoy detailed glitchy transitions. But if we weren't trying to mimic this style so completely, it would have been weirder. Justin should really just call us when he's ready to drop his glitchy Prague pop Yeez-Ius album. So what did you learn about these Bieber songs? Where are you now and what did you mean through the process of creating the third member of this trilogy?

That I like them. So does this song have a name? Wow, that's a good question. and it's not up to me, but there are just so many options. What's in the soup? What's with your hair? Who did your nails? What's all this meat?

Why am I here? That's deep. Sartre would be proud. Okay, last question. Where's the vocal track? Yeah, Justin, where is it? Actually, the spooky dolphin flute is a short clip of his voice from an interview he did, just heavily manipulated.

I copied Skrillex and Diplo's process, so it's been vocoded, time stretched, repitched, and distorted. This is wrong, Pooberry. Yes, no vocal track intentionally left open. That's because we have a challenge for Justin Bieber. So if you know Justin Bieber, please tweet at him and ask Justin to finish the track. We would like to see a resolution to his trilogy. or if Justin you're listening, you can go and download the track from our website,

Switchdownpop.com, and lay down your vocal. And if you make something hot, please send it to us at submissions at switchdownpop.com. Hey, and listeners, if you have your own vocal track, we'd love to hear it. The gauntlet has been thrown. Breakmaster, it was so much fun collaborating on this track together. Let's do it again, and thanks for joining us.

Thanks. I'm really happy to be here on your show. Man, Nate, I am just definitely feeling like We need a resolution to this existential suite because it has brought me back to my early 20s. I'm going to my bookshelf. I've pulled out Nietzsche. I've pulled out Camus. I need a resolution. I need to know the answer. My friend, you may have to accept that sometimes in life there is no answer. But remember, even in the darkest moments, there's wisdom to be gained. As our friend Albert Camus wrote,

There is no sun without shadow, and it is essential to know the night. So next time on Switched on Pop, we're going to do something a little bit different. We're going to hate listen to the top 100 and find the songs that make us crazy. This is definitely going to get ugly, but we welcome your suggestions. For the worst songs in America, tweet them to us at Switched on Pop. Let us know the songs that drive you bananas. Our show is written, produced, and edited by me, Nate Sloan. And me, Charlie Harding.

Our design is done by Luke Harris. And our hot new Bieber single was co-produced by me Charlie Harding and by the mysterious Breakmaster Cylinder. Thank you so much to Breakmaster for collaborating on this awesome track. You can also hear more great work of Breakmaster on this crossover of two of our favorite shows, Song Exploder and Reply All, where he breaks down his method behind his musical madness. We'll link to it on our website, switchedonpop.com. As always, thanks for listening. with a

t'empsychic. And, your period of month in shopify. . s, bar records.