Switched on Pop - K-Pop Chartbreakers: BLACKPINK, Girls’ Generation, NewJeans, IVE

Episode Date: August 23, 2022

A lot has happened in the world of Kpop this summer, from Girls’ Generation sugar coated banger “Forever 1” marking a triumphant return from a five year hiatus, to the ascendance of newcomers NewJeans, whose R&B infused sounds have quickly taken over the charts. But it's the return of BLACKPINK that has lit up the world literally in pink. Get a full deep dive on the songs at the top of the Kpop charts on the latest episode of Switched On Pop, where hosts Charlie Harding and Nate Sloan speak with journalist Kristine Kwak. Songs Discussed Psy, SUGA - That That J-hope - MORE BLACKPINK - Pink Venom Girls’ Generation IVE - LOVE DIVE NewJeans - Attention SWV - I’m So Into You Rihanna - Pon De Replay Missy Elliot - Work It 50 Cent - Just A Lil Bit Taylor Swift “Look What You Made Me Do” Panjabi MC, JAY-Z - Mundian to Bach Ke Britney Spears, Madonna - Me Against the Music Justin Timberlake - What Goes Around Comes Around Snoop Dogg - Drop It Like It’s Hot Snoop Dogg - I Wanna Rock The Notorious B.I.G. - Kick in the Door Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

If you're tired of endless scrolling to figure out where to eat, same. I'm Stephanie Wu, editor-in-chief of Eater. We've just launched the new-ish and way better Eater app. It has all the restaurants we love, gives you personalized picks wherever you are, and serves up smarter search results just for you. You can find my list of the best places for martinis and fries in New York City. And save your favorite spots, share lists, follow editors, and book right in the app. Download the Eater app at Eaterapp.com.

It's free for iOS users. Welcome to Switched on Pop. I'm songwriter Charlie Harding. And I'm musicologist Nate Sloan. A lot has happened in the world of K-pop this spring and summer. We've had the return of Psi. BTS have entered a new era of solo work. And we've had major comebacks, including the return of Black Pink.

Today, Nate, we're going to do an overdue episode of Chartbreakers, where we listen to charts to see what's catching our ears, and we're going to do it K-pop style this time. We're looking at South Korea's newly launched global K-pop circle chart and Billboard's South Korea Songs chart. And we've invited along journalist Christine Kwok, who writes for Rolling Stone and Variety, and who has spoken with and reviewed many of today's K-pop acts.

Christine, welcome. Hi, thank you for the welcome. I'm excited to do this today. Very happy to have you here. Excited to be here. Okay, before we dive in, a quick disclaimer, we are not stands of this genre. We are casual K-pop listeners who love the music when our editor, Joe Lee, turns us on to the greater world of K-pop in our weekly meetings. And I think this is a chance for us to learn and celebrate.

So let's get into the music. The first song I want to listen to is by the group Girls Generation. Their seventh Korean language studio, Alam, is out. They're an eight-member group. They have a song Forever One that was released on August 5th. It's their first song in five years, and it's their 15th anniversary since their 2007 debut. Let's take a listen to Forever One by Girls Generation. Forever One is number three on Billboard and number five on Circle Chart.

I have to admit, I first teared up when I heard this song I was having so much fun. Christine, what was your reaction to Forever One? What can you tell us about it? I've loved girls generation ever since I was in middle school, and they're one of like the first K-pop groups to really stand out to me as an individual. Just like growing up in America, I never really saw like Asian artists and like girls that I could look up to as role models and things like that. So I think when I first heard that they were making a return after so long,

I was just like super, super excited as a fan to see that happen because I feel like it's hard to see longevity in groups a lot of the time, especially if it's like 15 years, like passing a decade, is really insane. Does the song speak to that return in any kind of way? I think so. When I spoke to the members, they were kind of talking about how they tapped one of the producers, I think, for their very, very first song

when they first made their debut. They wanted it to sound like original girls' generation, like truly in that type of sound that they've had all these years. So kind of tapping back into those original roots was really cool to see. I think it's such an emotional song because it's such a congeneral song, because it's such a contrast to most love songs that you hear on the pop charts, which are to the object of one's romantic affection. This is like a love song to each other.

Friendship. And there's something so disarming and refreshing about that that I also just, I mean, I don't know if I was getting teary, Charlie, but I definitely felt all the feelings. I feel like one of the things that for me made this song so compelling is the way that this enormous, over-the-top, totally maximalist's chorus, begins with this really steep, melodic descent that then slowly builds itself back up over and over and over again.

There's something very satisfying and perhaps even connected a little bit to the message of, like, we're all getting back together, we're in this forever, like we might have been a wave for a while, descent down, climb back up to the top. Right here, big jump down. Slowly build up. So satisfied.

Right, so jumps up and then it goes down. And then it climbs back up. That's a beautiful melodic metaphor for overcoming adversity together. There might even be a sign of that adversity in the music. Just as we're coming into the chorus, there's this very dissonant note that you think shouldn't work. And yet it's such a... It's so perfect. I knew you were going to tune into that, Charlie.

that's so funny. I also heard that and jumped out of my seat. I was like, what is that doing there? If it ended right there, it would be the tensest ending to a song ever. But we get the sweet resolution of endless forever love, forever one. So much fun. I want to listen to the section that takes us out of the bridge of the song where all of the sudden girls' generation explodes in. to what to me sounds like the world of hyperpop. There's like these sparkly synthesizers, like descend, and then there's this enormous chorus of voices. Christine, we're neophytes to the world of girls' generation.

Are they known for being musically innovative like this? Because I'm hearing they're pushing a lot of boundaries like Charlie and I were hearing in our innately nerdy way, dissonant notes in these hyperpop excursions. It's very dexterous the way the members pass vocals back and forth between each other. Is this like a hallmark of girls' generation? I would say they tend to be very innovative with their music and because they've just been around for so long, they've had a chance to experiment with a lot of genres. One song that stands out to me from their discography is I Got a Boy, which came out in 2013. That was one of the first K-pop songs that

mixed maybe three or four genres into one song. I think this song just making it like a spectacle almost in a sense because it's their first and so long is kind of the traditional K-pop, candy pop type of sound, but adding an extra layer of fun that you can almost visualize without even having to see the music video. It gave me chills. I was in tears. That's what I'm talking about. All right, pull yourself together, Charlie, and let's get to the next song. All right, Ives Love Dive.

Ives is a six-member group debuted in December 2021 from Starship Entertainment. They've got a viral hit on TikTok, nearly a quarter million videos made with the song Love Dive. It's got over 370 million views. And it's currently number five on Billboard, number four on Circle. Let's listen to Love Dive. I love this song. I think it's one of the most repeated songs on my own playlist. It's just so catchy. My brother loves a song. My sister loves a song. All my friends love the song. It's just been like really interesting to see such a viral hit come from a newer group and kind of resonate with my friends who are older than all the members.

And it's fun to see that. I'm hearing some very daring production here and a sharp contrast to the girls' generation track, which was very maximalist. Christine said it was kind of a spectacle. Every second of space in that song was filled with some sound. This by contrast is very dialed back. There's a lot of space. There's a lot of silence. And I feel like the members get to really inject their personality and attitude into those spaces and gaps. Though in the chorus that we just heard, their voices are all sort of produced and roboticized in this very compelling way. I think it really matches the bit of the lyric that I'm able to catch here. catch here.

Narcissistic. My God, I love it. There's something really resonant about their voice being super processed and sort of made up that connects with this idea of like, I'm just going to be as over the top and as narcissistic as I possibly can. And I'm just going to embrace it. It's a very potent moment. And then they burst back into song and you hear their voices. Christine, one thing I'm curious about is that you mentioned it's fairly unusual for a group like

Girls Generation to have a 15-year-long career in the world of K-pop. And here you also said that I've maybe unusual for them to have such a big hit as such a new group. Could you say a bit about how career length impacts music and K-pop? I would say that I am seeing that a lot of groups are kind of promoting longer these days than I think used to. and maybe groups will break up due to drama or conflicts with their label or anything like that. But these days I think there's a collective effort to stay together as a group. And I think members do see that there is power in staying together. There's a couple of groups who may have left their long-time label,

but they're still promoting as a group. There's groups that have left their long-time label and had to start with a new name and a new kind of concept to kind of shed away from their original group that the company owns the IP for. But I think the standard from what I've seen is typically groups will sign on with an initial seven-year contract. And then from their members will reevaluate and see if they want to renew. But just from a fan perspective, it's always awesome to see groups stay together and work together. Because part of what makes K-pop so appealing is like that group dynamic and the relationships you see that the members have with each other, which is really fun.

For my third chartbreaker pick today, I want to listen to a song that goes in a totally different vibe. It's by the group, New Jeans. They're a five-member group. They're a new group. Makes sense. They're called New Jeans, not just the pants, but also like sort of saying like the new generation K-pop music. Their debut single came out July 22nd, and it is doing so well.

The song is called Attention. It's captured our attention. It's currently number one on Billboard, number one on Circle Chart. Here's attention. This track is a jam. My goodness. The whole EP is just so good. Before we dive into a musicological analysis of this track, Christine, because there's much to unpack.

What can you tell us about new genes? What should we know about this group? Like Charlie mentioned, they're very, very new. I think the youngest member in the group might be 14 years old, so they're also very young. I think it's interesting to see such a young group do so well so early on. And I think we're seeing more and more of that in K-pop in general. New jeans is all everyone's talking about these days. So I'm glad that it's doing well on the charmed.

the whole EP is interesting and has a lot of fun songs. Despite the youth of this group, the sound feels very retro, kind of throwback. And if I know my friend and collaborator, Charlie Harding, he's got about 15 references dialed up from the early 2000s for us to listen to. Or I don't know, maybe I'm wrong, Charlie, are you hearing any specific references here in attention? Well, attention just is steeped in 90s R&B. They make it contemporary, but there's something about the smooth, jazzy chords and laid-back feel. It reminds me of almost like SWV, their song, I'm So Into You. Just really rich harmonies, laid back.

It's got that swing, that new jack swing rhythm. Okay, so it's not early 2000, it's mid-late 90s. Can we listen to the very beginning of this track? because there's a beat switch. So first of all, what is, I don't know what this sample is. It sounds like some kind of group chant or something, like maybe kids on a playground. I love it.

And you hear it and you think, okay, this song, the downbeat is at the very beginning of that sample. It's like da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da. But no, New Jeans is tricking us into thinking that's the downbeat of the song, because in fact, when the beat dropped somewhere else entirely. Two, three, four, one. That gets your attention. Just a very savvy mood.

All these, I mean, when I listen to all of these songs, not to generalize, but they all start in such dramatic ways. Like, I feel like these songs are really trying to grab your attention as a listener. And I wonder if that's the more cynical part of me says is that because it's such a crowded field and these acts are trying to find any way to like stand out amongst the competition. Could that be an explanation for the hooky intros that we hear in all these songs? Yeah, they've been more experimental with a whole release of this EP.

I'm not sure how familiar you are with their album rollout, but their CDs, I believe, actually come in like a cute little cross-body bag that fans can buy and it's like circular shaped of the CD actually comes in the bag. So they've tried new concepts with even just like the album packaging and even like their outfits and the concept of everything is just so well thought out and planned, which I think was worked in their favor in terms of trying to break into such a crowded space. They did some daring stuff. They really caught my attention because the first time we hear their voices, it's in this very dissonant diminished sound. Right there?

And that kind of resolves. But it's really tense. And it's so satisfying to me how when you finally get the chorus, there's kind of this like move away from dissonance. And everyone's just singing the root happily. Everything feels totally resolved. There's a lyric in there that they sing about getting butterflies and taking them to paradise.

And I'm like, yeah, that's exactly how I feel. This song is such a. Bob. Also, those CD bags that Christine mentioned are available online. Oh, I'm going to get myself on right now. Can we use the company card for to get a couple of these? Let's do it. All right. If they're not sold out already, I know it's a hot item these days. All right. Do you want black, white or red? I can do black and you can do white. And I'll do a red. And Christine will do red. There we go. Okay, we've got our merchant hand. A lot of fun music on the charts. We have a song that we need to talk about, which is not yet on the charts, because it just came out.

today as we were talking. And it is my favorite release of the moment. We'll check that out right after a break. Attention, Spotify. Has yet got a new Good Girl Jasmine Absolute of Carolina Herrera. A fragrance intense with character curman and addictivo. Imagine a jasmine emvolventy,

tofu caramelized, and tonka-tostada. A combination that seduce from the first instant and leave a wella. Good Girl Jasmine Absolute, hypnotica, irresistible. Discoveringlao and let's envolver for his sensia. Immigration may be Donald Trump's signature

issue. President Trump is now targeting predominantly democratic cities for ice raids and deportations. Dozens of protesters clashing with immigration and customs enforcement agents in Minneapolis Tuesday. We will begin the process of returning millions and millions of criminal aliens back to the places from which they came. But what we want to do in this space is talk about America and politics beyond the current president. So what do most Americans think about deportation and border security, period? I think that Americans are definitely against the kind of violent displays that we've seen in the street from ICE. When it comes to the question of deportation, the answer is more complicated. My sense is that people want border at the border.

They don't like the idea of having no idea who's coming into the United States at any given time. The view on immigration from the bottom up instead of the top down. That's this week on America Actually. Every Saturday in your audio and video feeds. Christine, the group Black Pink have a new single out. Seems like this is a pretty big deal. How come? Because it's Black Pink.

Say more. They're just on another level, I think. I was surprised as a Korean-American, I mean, K-pop has just kind of been what I've listened to my whole life. Growing up and through high school and college and whatever. But I was actually talking to some coworkers yesterday, and a lot of them were saying Black Pink was the first K-pop group that got them into the genre. And now they're listening to all these other groups.

And with BTS selling out stadiums and K-pop becoming more and more mainstream in the U.S., I think Black Pink is also one of the forerunners in that space for the genre, as we know it today. I think Black Pink played a major part in bringing that mainstream in the U.S. So I think this release is a major turning point for the group, especially. Black Pink has been around since 2016, but they only have one official studio album that's full, link out right now. So it's been years since the album has come out, but they haven't had any new music to listen to. So this is a major time in Black Pink's discography for sure. Okay, so we're talking about the song Pink Venom. It's the first single off of their new album Born Pink, which they

launched with a global campaign called Light Up the Pink, which included setting up monumental light art installations across five continents, including at the Brooklyn Bridge, London's marble arch and Tokyo Tower. So let's listen to this global sensation pink venom. It's so interesting to hear the backstory to this release because when I hear this, I'm like, wow, this song slaps. It's like the personality and attitude is just like coming through the speakers. It feels like every lyric is in my mind delivered with a sneer.

And if I didn't know kind of the stakes of this release, I would just think, oh, this is just, you know, a chance for this group to leave it all on the floor of the recording studio. But thinking about this in terms of the arc and the importance of this group, it's like, whoa, no, this is, there's a lot writing on this. And this is, this song is maybe them saying, like, we're back, we're here, and we're just as powerful and undeniable as we ever were. something very commanding about having a chorus like that where everything breaks down. It's almost a quiet moment, but it's a very hard hitting moment. Christine, if there was one aspect of Black Pink

that you think made them such a popular group, such a gateway group for so many people, would you be able to identify that? And is it something that we hear on this new release? I think it really comes down to like the music and just the sound of what they put out. It's unique, but it's also not too unfamiliar, I think, with what Western audiences might be used to hearing. It's definitely like striking in a way, but also not too unfamiliar where it's unapproachable, maybe. You had mentioned that girls' generation were known for mashing up lots of different sounds and genres within a single song. And I hear a lot of that going on in Pink Venom. This feels like a masterclass in like 2000s era hip hop and pop music.

I thought what we could do is walk through a couple of the different sections and think about what are some of the cultural touch points that they might be drawing from. We'll start right from the very top of the song. As soon as it started, I was like, oh my God, the song is so good. I watched the music video and I don't know if you've had a chance to watch it, But it starts off with Chisu playing a Korean traditional instrument called the Kalungo. So that string sound that you're hearing, I'm assuming, is that instrument unless they're just kind of making a different visual. But I love when they tap into kind of traditional Korean element to their songs.

That's so rad. That's that plucked stringed instrument. That's one of the very first things we hear in the track. I love that they're using traditional sounds because it provides maybe some counterbalance to the track's reference points that are very much grounded in. American rap and hip-hop. But even the way that they use those traditional string plucks feels like a nod to 2000s which often borrowed string sounds from Bollywood in the Middle East and elsewhere. You can hear it, for example, in Missy Elliott's Get Your Freak on.

Jay-Z did a remix of Punjabi MC. You can even hear it in Justin Timberlake and Britney Spears. but similar kind of sampling vibe. Here's the black pink again. I think these are definitely coming from different cultural references, absolutely, but the sort of tone, timbre, and effect as they're being used sound very similar to me to some of these past tracks. What's cool about the black pink track is that unlike some of these other examples,

it's an instrument being drawn from their own traditional culture and sort of being remixed in this way. So it maybe has a resonance that. resonance that some of these other tracks wouldn't have in terms of its cultural impact. I think there also is a Bollywood sample in here as well. Where we go from the intro into the verse? Hard to say. Right.

No, but you raise a good point, Charles. That does sound like a sampled and processed Bollywood string section right there. So we have a cosmopolitan set of references. Wait, we haven't even talked about the almost, it sounds like a schoolyard taunt in the background. Black pink. I love it. It's so good. Pink.

Right, that's a snoop dog interpilation. How about in the first verse? I feel like we go into a totally other world of references. You've got a notorious BIG reference. Check out this one. That one really had my brain itching. Does that sound familiar at all? I got nothing.

I don't know. Scratch that brain itch. That's Ponderey replay by Rihanna. Now I hear. one by one, two by two. It feels like a little lyrical nod, and it's got a similar vibe. That totally went over my head. I mentioned Missy Elliott earlier.

I feel like there's a real throwback moment that happens after the chorus, which is very much in Missy Elliott's world. Here it is in Pink Venom. Got that G-funk whiny synth, and here's Missy Elliott's work it. Is it worth it? Let me work it. I put my thing down, flipping, and reverse it. That high, whiny sands.

synth. It's a staple of G-Funk and I can hear it in both these songs. So in the music video for that verse, they actually are kind of wearing more of 90s-esque fashion. So I wonder if that's also a visual nod to the era that they're referencing in the song. Right. So there's even a visual nod. Interesting. And then there was the chorus that hooked us right in to sound that I know so well. This simplified vibe where the whole song kind of like sucks in and then you just get this really powerful, intense moment. Does that sound familiar at all to you? Stop making us look bad and just play the track, Charles.

Yeah, I think I'm behind on my musical references. I'm like trying to think. Listen, I think they even give us a clue. It's in the pre-chorus. Did you hear it? Are you referencing Taylor Swift? Look what you made us do, Taylor Swift. Got a similar kind of vibe where the whole song expands and then just goes and sucks right in.

I can hear the TikTok mashups already. I love when they kind of do that on TikTok, but I can hear it already. Like, Rose's part where she references that lyric and then it kind of mishes the two songs with either a beat from one song and then the melody from the other. One thing that occurred to me is that obviously Taylor Swift doesn't originate this kind of a sound. and I tried searching for potential inspirations. And it brought me back into the world of hip hop. I think there's a certain vibe that we get from a song like, drop it like it's hot. Drop it like it's hot.

Drop it like it's hard. Drop it like it's hard. Or maybe 50 cents just a little bit. Then I'm going to get sure of the air and I'm going to let her know. All the nigger really needs a little bit. Not a lot, baby girl, just a little. There's a way in which pop artists draw from hip hop and take these chorus moments that when superimposed into a pop song feel like the energy has dropped but capture your attention with this rhythmic intensity. I'm persuaded by your analysis, Chuck.

Oh, thanks. Taking a step back, we've heard so many different voices, so many different reference points. I want to see if there's anything you feel like is happening amongst these chart breaker picks. Is there anything that y'all are picking up, any trends, ideas? inspirations. I think a reference to the past is definitely clear in all the songs where like I think Love Dive by Ive and Pink Venom, they're all kind of referencing like 90s, early 2000s, maybe or just like the more muted sounds, even with attention by new genes. And then Girls Generations Forever One is also a reference back to the past, but through a different lens almost, more of like that pop and

pink and fun vibe. So it's interesting to see that all the songs we talked about do, reference past sounds that seem familiar, but kind of update that sound to make it feel more of the times today. How about your free, Nate? I think the thing that connects these four releases that I hear is this sense of bold experimentation, of collapsing multiple genres into a single song, into passing lyrics back and forth in this incredibly dexterous way. It's music that really demands your attention.

And I've come away with a new respect for these four K-pop groups after this conversation. Yeah, this is some expansive music. It represents the past, the present. There's a little bit of everything in it for everybody. There's a lot of fun for me to go back and listen to these songs. I'm definitely curious to hear what listeners are listening to in the world of K-pop, what they're enjoying. Please share that with us.

And Christine, I want to thank you so much for joining us for this episode of Chartbreakers, K-pop style. It was a pleasure speaking with you. Thank you so much for having me. This is really fun to do. And I hope I was able to bring some additional insight to the conversation. We listened to music that brought me to tears. I couldn't be happier. I hope you have a chance to like really get into like the music videos and the performance videos and the dance practice videos.

There's just so much that comes with each song's release. That makes it a fun time for the viewer as a fan. Switched on Pop is produced by Rihanna Cruz, engineered by Brandon McFarlin, edited by Jolie, community management by Abby Barr, illustrations by Iris Gottlie. Our executive producers are Nashok Karwa and Honour Rosen. of the Box Media Podcast Network and a production of Vulture. And I also want to say thank you for research help from Will Daly, Andrew Moranz, and members of our Twitter community, Melanie Cohen, Matt Linder, Jen Hurley,

Renan Lodin, and Galhazore. You can find more episodes of Switched on Pop anywhere you get podcasts. Oh my God, podcats? I want podcats. Oh my God, that is our merch, Podcats. I think we should trademark that, incidentally. You can find more episodes of Switched on Pop anywhere. you get podcasts and our website,

switchdownpop.com. We'll be back next Tuesday with a brand new episode. Until then, hit us up on Twitter and Instagram at Switchdown Pop and tell us what your favorite K-pop chartbreakers are right now.

We'll catch you on Tuesday, and until then, thanks for listening. Convierte your passion in a business with Shopify and bathe records of ventas with the form of pay with a better conversion of the world. Has heard you been?

The mejor conversion of the world. The incredible system of of Pago of Shopify facilitates on your site web, in the social and in in any place.

That is music for your ears. No, you'll be more waltas. Your business will

a super-exit with Shopify. Empecies to a period of a month in Shopify. Atr. .