Switched on Pop - RAYE’s maximalist masterpiece is the hope we need

Episode Date: March 31, 2026

RAYE names Amy Winehouse and Edith Piaf as her artistic predecessors on the opening tracks of new album This Music May Contain Hope. Both died young, undone by the same darkness they sang about, and placing them there reads as a dare to herself. The album that follows is her attempt to find a different ending: a 17-track, 75-minute work featuring Al Green, Hans Zimmer, the London Symphony Orchestra, and over 80 collaborators, structured around the four seasons as a journey from autumn despair toward summer light. Every genre shift on the record, from Vivaldi's Winter to post-bop jazz combo to gospel choir, serves that arc: small emotional truths get cinematic treatment, most strikingly when the click of heels on pavement becomes the central rhythm of an anthem about getting dressed to go out with friends. The episode serves as a field guide to the album's vast musical language, and to the argument that hope is something you have to build, genre by genre, track by track. Links: ⁠Newsletter⁠, ⁠YouTube RAYE – "WHERE IS MY HUSBAND!"  Nat King Cole – "Let There Be Love"  Ella Fitzgerald and Louis Armstrong – "Summertime"  RAYE (ft. 070 Shake ) – "Escapism."  RAYE – "Intro: Girl Under the Grey Cloud."  RAYE – "I Will Overcome."  Edith Piaf – "La Vie en Rose"  RAYE – "Nightingale Lane."  RAYE – "Fin."  RAYE – "The WhatsApp Shakespeare."  Mark Ronson & RAYE – "Suzanne"  RAYE – "I Hate The Way I Look Today."  RAYE – "Winter Woman."  Vivaldi – "The Four Seasons: Winter"  RAYE (ft. Hans Zimmer) – "Click Clack Symphony."  RAYE (ft. Al Green) – "Goodbye Henry."  Al Green – "Love and Happiness"  Aretha Franklin – "Rock Steady"  RAYE – "Skin & Bones."  Fred Wesley and The J.B.'s (ft. James Brown) – "Damn Right I Am Somebody"  RAYE – "Beware.. The South London Lover Boy."  The Supremes – "You Can't Hurry Love"  Iggy Pop – "Lust for Life" Jet – "Are You Gonna Be My Girl?"  Mark Ronson (ft. Amy Winehouse) – "Valerie"  Charles Albert Tindley – "I'll Overcome Someday"  Prince - “Purple Rain"  Beyoncé – "Love on Top"  RAYE (ft. Amma & Absolutely) – "Joy." Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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It's free for iOS users. Nate, I've got a challenge for you. I'm always up for a good challenge. I'm going to play you a song, and then I want you to read me the lyrics. All right, I texted you the lyrics. And if you could, recitation at tempo, please.

I would like a ring. I would like a big diamond ring. Ah, let me try this again. One more time. I would like a ring, I would like a diamond, I would like a big and shiny diamond that I could wave around and talk and talk about it. And when the day is here, forgive me, God, that I could ever doubted until death.

I do, I do, I do. Is he about, about, about it? This man is testing me. Uh-huh, uh-huh. Help me. Help me. Lord, I need you to tell me. Wow.

Oh my gosh. Not bad. That was my first. I could, if I practiced that thing a couple times, I could be whoosh. I am impressed. That's a toughie. Today, Nate, you do not get a diamond ring. Fair enough.

But you do get a crown. It is your birthday. Happy birthday. Ah, so happy to celebrate you. This is clearly a, what, a metaphorical crown? I don't, you're not holding any. thing. You're not. There's no package waiting for me at the door. When you reach core midlife milestones, your presence are the presence of your friends. Yes. Welcome to Switched on Pop. I'm

songwriter Charlie Harding. And I'm musicologist Nate Sloan. We just heard Rays, where is my husband? One of my favorite songs of the moment. Major viral trend trying to say the lyrics. I cannot believe you pull that off. It's a real tongue twister. This song is so virtuosic and it comes from her fourth coming album, we are recording this on the eve of the release of this music may contain hope. Great title. Great music from an absolutely fabulous artist. This is Rachel Agatha Kean. She's 28.

She is from the UK. She is part Ghanaian, part Swiss, part English. She grew up in the church where her father directed the music and her mother sang in the choir. She first sang publicly to Nat King Coles, Let There Be Love. I know you are at Nat King Cole lover. I am. Her first song that she learned on the piano was summertime, the Ella and Louis version. At age 13, she started making music and garage band.

She went to two years of the Brit School, which is a famous free public art school. Alums include Adele, Amy Winehouse, FK Twigs, Olivia Dean. Lily Young. She gets a record deal with Polydor at 17 after her song Hot Box is discovered on SoundCloud. And she spent years. writing hits for other people. Beyonce, Charlie X, X, X, John Legend.

There are lots of hits that you knew, but you didn't know the name behind them because in 2021, she goes on Twitter and says, I feel like a toilet. She feels like she's being used by her label to make music for other people to put out a constant slow singles of her own but not get to put out an album.

She follows up with a huge hit called Escapism featuring 070 Shake. I remember when I first heard this track. I'd never heard of this artist. And I just had the sense that she was really going to make an impact. This song had so much happening in it. It had her virtuosic powerhouse vocals. It had these lyrical turns of phrase that you'd never heard before and went from really emotionally intense to kind of tongue and cheek. The production combined like old school soul with contemporary hip hop. It was like a statement. Yeah. And I feel like,

audiences really responded to this. When you first heard it, you believed in it. She had a lot of self-belief because she went on to self-fund her debut album, 21st Century Blues. Wow. It dealt with really heavy themes of substance abuse, body dysmorphia, assault. It boldly crossed many histories of pop music genres. And it was a huge hit in the UK.

She's one of the biggest stars I know without a top 10 song in the U.S. escapeism only went to number 22 on the Billboard 100. Her song will be heard at the beginning, whereas my husband went to number 13. It's currently sitting at 17 as of this recording. It's climbing again. Yet she has over 10 billion streams of her songs. In 2023, she won six Brit Awards in one night making a record. In 2024, she was nominated for multiple Grammys, including Best New Artists.

And now she's bringing us her second album. this music may contain hope. It's 17 tracks, roughly 75 minutes. It's got over 83 performers, including the likes of Al Green and Hans Zimmer. It features multiple recordings with the London Symphony Orchestra. Ray loves big sounds. I'm a maximalist when it comes to production and vocals. Every bit of paint we can throw, and then we rein it back.

This is an album where she is artistically needing to find hope internally. I think at a time that we are needing to experience hope collectively. And there's a nice progression there from her first album, 21st Century Blues. Now we're entering into a moment of hope. I like that. This is an album that honestly needs to be experienced in full, no skips, no distractions.

She literally frames it as a four-part album based off the four seasons. Part one, autumn, then, winter, followed by spring and of course summer. Originally, this came from over 50 songs. So we're going to record for what, the next seven hours and talk through this whole thing? I would really like to. I think that that would be an injustice to everyone's individual experience of listening to it. But what I think we can do is serve as a maybe field guide for the various musical lineages to help understand what she's trying to say on this massive work. Let's start at the beginning.

The first song, intro, Girl Under the Grey. Cloud. Allow me to set the scene. Our story begins at 2.27 a.m. on a rainy night in Paris. Cue the thunder. Theatrix. Oh my gosh. A woman in her late 20s walks from a bar to her hotel. She is no umbrella. She is seven ngronies deep and she nurses a whole she is desperately trying to fill. Wow. Right. Wow. We have this narration. We're really kicking things off. We are in a thunderstorm in parent. She has autumn leaves underneath her feet. Ah, that's what I was hearing.

Autumn leaves. The jazz standard. And scoring the whole thing are these just classic Hollywood strings. The song sets the scene as a journey through desperation, eventually toward hope. The desperation continues on track two, I Will Overcome. It's kind of the want song for the album. The I Want song is what we call. the number that usually comes right at the beginning of a musical where our main character

basically outlines their goals and hopes and dreams very clearly for the audience. And then the rest of the musical will be us following her success or failure at achieving those dreams. And I feel like, yeah, that's a cool way to describe this. Ray is sort of outlining what she wants to happen. And there's almost like also a Greek chorus of sorts here adding to the theatricality. this call and response, she sings, and then the chorus responds to her. Yeah, I also just, I love that harp in the background.

That's a really nice touch. This is very auspicious beginning so far. We're going to hear a lot of interplay between the orchestra and contemporary production because it quickly turns towards a very contemporary style beat with heels clicking on the cobblestone, walking drunk and alone through the streets of Paris. 500 steps left to make it to the front door. My red high heels, click, click for many two drinks, I fill my back on, threatened to weed the concrete below. Mean wants to be in Paris.

Drunken alone. Wow. There's the orchestral strings swooping around her. And then there's that programmed drum underneath, giving it that contemporary feel. So we've set the scene narratively, and she's also setting the scene. musically. It's music that's going to be both from the past and from the present and throughout she's going to constantly

make reference to all the most important genres of pop music, including some of the great artists of pop music. Woo! So she sings about critics saying that she sings about critics saying that she

reminds them of Amy and that she may succumb to the same fate that was brought on to Amy by the sharp tongue and constant derision that she received. This is of course Amy Winehouse, the artist who

is so responsible for the sole revival UK Sound of the 2000s, who was also a alum of the Brit school. She died at 27, a dark, tragic death from accidental alcohol poisoning. Yeah. Ray also, I should say, went on to collaborate with Mark Ronson, the producer who worked with Amy Winehouse. Ray made a song with Mark back in June 2025, a song called Suzanne. And so the comparisons are appropriate, both genre-wise, collaborator-wise, and I think narratively within what's happening in their life.

Even though we've just listened to like two tracks at this point, I feel like it's already capturing what I love about Ray, what I loved about her first album, what I love about the live performances of hers. I've seen. she crosses different genres over the course of a single melodic phrase. She does this with her voice. She's constantly shifting her voice. It'll become a little operatic. And then it'll become a little bluesy. And then it'll become like a little bit of hip-hop flow.

And then it'll be classic jazz, Billy Holiday. It's like she can turn on a dime like that. And as we've discussed, the music is doing something similar. It's going from, you know, jazz piano to orchestral swings to like hip-hop drums. So I feel like that might end up being one of the themes of this record. Is that a fair guess at this point? There are many themes to explore on this album. The one that I want to pursue with you is how she switches from musical tradition to musical tradition.

From the get-go, I feel like we've heard a bit of the cabaret chanson. We begin in Paris. She literally narrates the opening of her song. The chanson is a form from France that develops. in the 16th century of theatrical songs, and she makes a direct call-out to one of the great French singers, Edith Piaf, in the song, I'll Overcome.

Piaf rejected the label of the Chanson Realist who sings songs of hopelessness. Instead, she wanted to sing songs about the Joie de Vieve. She wanted to sing songs that had hope in them, like La Villon Rose. Wow. And like Amy and At home, Ray in her life. Edith P. F. struggled with alcohol. She eventually died from liver cancer. So I think

there's a lot of self-interrogation going on and making these comparisons. There's so much self-awareness to the record. I mean, we've already established that it has a sort of theatrical quality like Kappa Ray. This is a tradition where you'll have an omniscient narrator who's going to tell you what's going to happen. We've already heard that from Ray being like, here's what's going on. And we hear that throughout the rest of the album. We're going to hear her tell you about what the song are before she plays them. This song is called I hate the way I look today. This is a song about the greatest heartbreak I've ever known.

This song is called Nightingale Lane. You kind of feel like you're at a concert with her listening to the album. Totally. And I don't mean to jump the gun here, but the whole thing ends with a six-minute-long song. The majority of it is her just reading the credits of all of the people who participated in making the album. No way. And the track is called fain. Fé.

As in the end. Exactly. All right. Thank you to Grandma, Granddad Michael. My sister's Amaran, Absolutely. My co-producers, Mike Sabbath, Tom Richards, Chris Hill, Pete Clements, Jordan Riley, Tone World, punctual, Hans Zimmer and his team at bleeding fingers. I love this for a few reasons.

Not only is it like watching the credits scroll at a movie, but I'm someone who always takes the line. liner notes out of the CD or the LP. Oh, yeah. And reads every person in the acknowledgments just to see, you know, if I might learn something interesting. So I appreciate in an age where it's harder to get liner notes when we listen to so much of our music digitally that Ray is like giving us the acknowledgment as part of the album itself.

That's really cool. And to make such an over-the-top maximalist record, you need a lot of collaborators. And she's giving them credit. As somebody, you know, who is in control of this entire thing, she is the writer. and she's a producer on every song. The role of narration here isn't just for introduction and conclusion. It really helps set the scene. It helps emphasize the drama of things like heartbreak on a song like,

WhatsApp Shakespeare, which is a great name. Romeo Ford, he's a six to sick mother five months minimum recovery from a sweet lie to the all-out Shakespearean voice notary. Though I'd like to clarify, no one did die in the story, but I didn't side when I found out I was one of seven of the leading list. Ladies, starring in the new romantic thriller. No way. We have moved from the world of theatrics into the world of jazz. Oh, my goodness. What kind of jazz are we hearing there?

This is like classic big band swing of the 30s and 40s. The kind of thing you'd hear, say, Count Basie or Benny Goodman playing probably. Yeah. And what's neat is that she's got this giant orchestra with her. to be able to play these kinds of tracks, but it's not the only source of inspiration from the genre. She's also going to take things all the way down to the sort of the small combo size

on a song like, I hate the way I look today. I hate the way I look today. I hate the way I look today. Today it's true and it was such a shame that I looked into them. This has given me like Village Vanguard vibes. Like what do we listen to here, Nate? Yeah, this is more in the vibe of a, you know, kind of post-bop singer that is like after World War II,

folks like Saravan, Anita O'Day, Ella Fitzgerald, certainly, a small swinging group. There's a lot of interaction between the singer and the individual musicians. Unlike with the big band, the singer is almost like another one of the instrumentalists. You know, they're like they're part of the combo themselves. And it's a much more kind of intimate and, I don't know, spunky kind of sound. It's really cool. She actually lets the instrumentalists have their moment.

so yeah, she really knows her genre. Check out the solo. Oh, my goodness. Get out of here. Yes. Charlie, this is giving me life. Are you kidding me? A ripping sax solo.

Yeah. Gang vocal responses throughout. Scat, call and response. At one point, yeah, Ray and the sacks are perfectly in unison together. This is, man. Why does it excite you? I mean, obviously, I know you're a jazz scholar, but like, what about that sound? gives you that feeling.

Well, it's the sense of improvisation, the sense of playfulness. And frankly, just in general, the sense that, like, an artist of this caliber and fame is not afraid to risk it all by playing jazz. I mean, to me, that in itself is, like, such a powerful statement. And it makes me feel, like, kind of hopeful. There we go. There's some hope is arising. Maybe young people are going to listen to this and be like, hey, maybe I should check out.

Some of those singers I mentioned, Saravan, Anita O'Day, Elle Fitzgerald. Maybe I, you know, maybe I want to try scat singing. Like, what a cool, that would be such a cool outcome. Maria, you have a podcast now and you need to start acting like it. What's the first step as a podcaster? Well, you have to ask lots of questions. I'm Maria Sharpova, and I'm hosting a new podcast called Pretty Tough. Every week, I'm sitting down with trailblazing women at the top of their game to discuss ambition, work ethic,

and the ups and downs that come on the path to achieving greatness. I have a few pretty tough questions for you. Okay. Ready? Ready. Do not sugarcoat something for me. No. No.

We'll dive into their stories and get valuable insights from top executives, actors, entrepreneurs, and other individuals who have inspired me so much in my own journey. Pretty tough is your front row seat to the women who have demonstrated the power in being unapologetic in their pursuits. I hope you'll join us. New episodes drop Wednesday. on YouTube or in your favorite podcast app.

Immigration may be Donald Trump's signature issue. President Trump is now targeting predominantly Democratic cities for ice raids and deportations. Dozens of protesters clashing with immigration and customs enforcement agents in Minneapolis Tuesday. We will begin the process of returning millions and millions of criminal aliens back to the places from which they came.

But what we want to do in this space is talk about America and politics beyond the current president. So what do you most Americans think about deportation and border security, period? I think that Americans are definitely against the kind of violent displays that we've seen in the street from ICE. When it comes to the question of deportation, the answer is more complicated. My sense is that people want border at the border. They don't like the idea of having no idea who's coming into the United States at any given time. The view on immigration from the

bottom up, instead of the top down. That's this week on America Actually. every Saturday in your audio and video feeds. She's not just getting people excited about jazz singers of the postwar era. She's going Baroque. Ooh. Not broke. Baroque. We're talking Bach, Handel, Scarlatti.

Oh, yep, there it is. There it is. Wow. That is Vivaldi. Vivaldi. From the four seasons. Four seasons? Why are we doing four seasons? Well, this album has a four seasons like.

concept to it. So that's very appropriate. Which season is this in Vivaldi? Is it winter? I'll give you a hint. Yeah. This song is called Winter Woman. Yeah, yes. And so this is the winter part of Vivaldi's four seasons. Can I just spit some quick facts about Vivaldi?

He's such a fascinating character. He was this violin virtuoso of the 18th century. They called him the red priest because he had this like voluminous bright red hair. And at one point in his career he was studying to be a priest, spent most of his time in Venice, where he led a group at the Ospedale, made up entirely

of young orphaned women who were some of the best musicians in Europe, and many of whom went on to have their own spectacular careers as virtuoso performers and composers. And his writing for strings and concerti especially was super influential, including on our friend Johann Sebastian Bach. So, Vivaldi, very cool to hear that in this Ray track here. Okay, so what is she doing with Vivaldi? She is using the sound of winter to

reclaim a sort of pejorative term used about women. So often women can be called frigid, icy, or cold. And she is basically saying the reason why I might have to put on this cold personality is because

of the things that have been done to me and I will put on a big winter coat. Even when it's somewhere outside to protect myself. She also, I should say, came out with her first EP in 2014 called Welcome to the Winter. So it's part of a larger world building. Vivaldi is very earned, I think, in this moment. But it's not my favorite classical moment on the record that hands down goes to ClickClack Symphony featuring Hans Zimmer, the great composer of every film score you've ever loved.

Are we going to get a bram here, Charlie? Ooh, there are no brams. Okay, so let's just break this down for a second. Okay. We've got send the call out, send the call out. Calling all my baddest woman, it's about to go down, click, click, click, click, clack symphony. I need that. So the song starts with her narration that says,

do you know the odds to be born on this earth are one in four hundred trillion? I conquered those odds, yet I can't conquer leaving this house. And this is a song about sending out an SOS signal to your girlfriends. Wow. Pick a dress, pick a time and an address. We're going out tonight. And the chorus continues by saying that, you know, her legs are hurting, but her back is still arching.

And this sound reminds me that it's going to be all right. The act of getting together, getting dressed up, even in heels that might hurt, they are worth it for the collective sound of the click, clack on the cobblestones that we heard a reference to earlier on which she had set up because, you know, Of course, she's going to do that. And we're going to go experience some joy even when I'm having trouble getting out of the house. How do you back that up with a score by Hans Zimmer? What?

Fuck, I was watching Interstellar all of a sudden. Except the whole time you've got those click, clack, click, click, clack, the click, clack symphony going along. The stilettos on the pavement. She's so good at taking the most relatable idea. Yeah. You know, of like, I don't want to leave my house, but I know it would be good for me. and like turning it into something that is just so transcendent and like epic and majestic. It's a really cool transformation.

This is the most over the top dramatized way of saying, hey, you want to go out and like hang out? Like I'm having a tough time. She has turned this into a heroic act, almost a political act of getting out, being strong, even when things are getting you down. You'll never be able to hear heels on pavement the same way after this, will you? So there's orchestration all over this album with hints. Hans Zimmer. Hans just has one track on the album. I just keep picturing like a rapper, like, you know, little John being like, you know,

Usher and Hans Zimmer. Anyway, what were you saying? What was I saying? The orchestra is all over the album. It's not all classical music. I don't even quite know what to call. call the orchestra on the final track. Fé.

It's giving maybe... I don't think you're saying that right. It's fain. Fan. Fent. Fon. Fent. Fent.

Fent. I dropped high school French very early. Fenn is giving Mary Poppins chimchimmy. It's very fun. God, this stuff just pours out of her. My God, it's like, what is going on in her brain. It's so rich and complex and so entertaining. I don't know. This is, this is really unique. She's going to use the orchestra in every way you can possibly imagine.

One of the great performances is her live version of the song Nightingale Lane, live at Abbey Road with full orchestra, brass band, everything. I highly recommend watching it. But you can hear the way that she uses the orchestra on that track is very different from what we heard with Hans, very different what we heard at the end. I'm elevated. The screen, the screen didn't freeze. I just,

I, I'm, I'm in a state of shock. That is powerful. It almost goes into like power ballad. There's a power ballad on here that I'm not going to play for you because you have to go experience it yourself that I think is a direct nod to Prince and Purple Rain. There's also dance music on here.

There is definitely rap flow and hip hop swagger. But the other two genres that I think are most important. important on this album are soul and gospel. Yeah, I mean, I was going to say polka and heavy metal, but that, that seems more appropriate. So, well, you mentioned Al Green. Are we going to hear some of the reverend now, or is that in the gospel part? We're definitely going to hear some soul Al Green on the track Goodbye Henry. It's my pleasure to say that all the way from Memphis, Tennessee.

Wow. Together, ladies and gentlemen, for Al Green. Hello, how are you? It's nice to build a microphone. With a story to tell. Wow, he sounds great. That vocal. You know, this said something about the kind of kid I was, I guess,

but I saw Al Green live at the Beacon Theater when I was, like, 16 or something by myself. What? And it was an amazing show. There was something really funny, I remember, which is that. that he, at one point in the concert, he reached into the piano and took out a red rose and gave it to a woman in the front row and the whole place a lot.

We were like, oh my God, that's so sexy and romantic and cool. And then as the show progressed, he took out about 40 more roses from the piano. And we're giving that, I mean, half the audience had a rose by the end of that show. That's so cool. It was, but yeah, he's, I mean, he's one of the great singers ever.

And he's not someone we've heard from in a long time, I think. No. I mean, I think in a certain way, she is giving Al Green a rose. I mean, one of the great legends of soul music. She even makes a nod to his lyrics in this song. Al Green, of course, sings the song Love and Happiness. There's a sample of Aretha Franklin's Rock Steady. It forms the foundation of her song, Skin and bones. And that's not all. James Brown is also on this record. Here is damn right. I am somebody, a track that he did for Fred Wesley and the JV's. Can't ask me say, are you somebody? I said, damn right, I'm somebody. What do you say when I say? Are you somebody?

Damn right. I'm something. Hmm. Lynn Collins, Miss Collins, are you somebody? Yes, right? Well, she is. She's a lady. Mr. Ray, are you somebody? Mr. Ray, are you somebody? Serves as the foundational sample of her song, Joy. Cool.

Mr. Ray, are you somebody? Mr. Ray are you somebody? Mr. Ray are you somebody? Whoa. All right, we're going to get gospel. We're not going there yet. So she's bringing in so many great soul artists of the past. One of my favorite tracks here, though, is something original.

It sounds like if the Supremes made thriller. It's a song called Beware the South London Loverboy. Beware The South London Love a boy Yeah Huh Yeah

You know Everyone at some point In their musical career Has got to use That baseline That baseline originally Comes from You Can't Hurry Love

By the Supremes There might be a precursor I'm sure there's a precursor But that's always my favorite James James James James Jameson Play on the Bass Iggy Pop

does it on Lus for Life. Jet did it on Are You Gonna Be My Girl? And of course, Amy Winehouse did it on Mark Ronson's track, Valerie. And here is Ray doing it on the South London Lover Boy. Beware the South London Lover Boy. Where the hell's my husband? Do you? Please, please, please.

Musically, this feels like a compliment to where is my husband as well. It's got this powerful groove and this like minor chord swells and yeah, these bluesy vocals. Yeah, this is cool. And it's a song which is a warning to other women of like, watch out for that guy who is suave, showing up in a black car, promising all these nice things with nice words, not a safe guy. Watch out for him. And she offers that warning a number of times. One of those times switches this song up into a totally different genre.

And I need some help identifying what we're hearing. All right, girls, wherever you're listening, in your house, in your car, walking home from work after dark, I need you to repeat after me. Stay wary, girls. It's scary out there. Stay safe. I'll dance. Wow. It's kind of like a detective private eye kind of thing.

Yeah, that's a good description. I was going to say Van Morrison Moon Dance vibes, maybe. But there's another really cool thing happening, which is something you rarely hear in pop these days. And a cellarando. Oh, yeah. We actually speed up the temple slowly as we move out of that, you know, Detective Noir breakdown back in to the Valerie Can't Her Love-esque Motown groove, which is just another little auditory. treat for us. Oh yeah. There are songs on this record that beyond just changing time also modulate all over the place. There's one song on here. I'm not going to, I'm not going to give it away.

You got to go find it that may modulate more than Beyonce's love on top. It just builds and builds and builds and builds. Oh, that's a tease right there. Oh yeah, yeah. No, you got to go hear that you got to go listen to this one. But maybe we can we can leave today with a trip into the world of gospel. We heard gospel at the very beginning in the song, I Will Overcome. This is, of course, her take on the U.S. civil rights anthem, We Shall Overcome, which was originally a hymn called I'll Overcome Someday by Charles Albert Tinley, who was a black Methodist minister and the founder really of gospel music. We have gospel in here.

We've got the background chorus. We have this call to this song, which was popularized by Pete Seeger and Joan Baez and the counterculture, quoted by Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. as a. song of hope. And yet she's kind of playing it in this dark, minor, personal place. In some ways, it doesn't feel gospel at all because it's not about the communal. It's not about the congregation. It's about Ray. And so it's really appropriate then that the album takes a very different turn towards gospel towards the end on a song called Joy, which features her sisters, Alma, and absolutely backing her up. begins with a four to the floor dance groove with that James Brown sample.

I mean, we have come full circle. We've got the Trinity of Sisters singing joyfully in this four to the floor, drumbeat, gospel choir. You know, ordinarily, I am kind of repelled by albums like this. I'm going to be totally honest. I tend to gravitate towards albums that have a really coherent sound throughout. This is not that, right? as we've discussed in depth. Every track has something different.

And then within each track, there might be like three or four different things. Yes. And yet my predilection for coherence, it does not apply here. Because what I'm realizing through this conversation is that there's a coherence in the lyrical themes, in Ray's voice being this anchor throughout the album,

in the way she creates this theatrical experience. And so as a result, any time where I might be kind of feeling like, oh, there's too much happening here, it's all warranted because this is more than just an album. It's like this cinematic experience that you're listening to. It's a musical review of all of the best things I want to hear. And basically the only question I have at this point is like, how are people going to experience this album themselves? Are they going to listen to it from front to back? Are they going to, you know, home in on certain tracks? Like, that'll be kind of cool to see, I think,

whether this demand that sort of attentive listening that has been lost, frankly, from a lot of album-length works right now. Or will it find a way to exist in this ecosystem we have of, like, deracinated single tracks, just, you know, circulating? I feel like this album is going to cross. Rush live.

Oh my gosh. So I'm already like, where do I get my tickets for the, this music may contain hope tour? Because this is going to just bring the house down. I'm really glad that whereas my husband has served as a hook to bring people in, I want more people in the U.S. to be paying attention to Ray. I think in some ways her music is big and over the top in a way that is not necessarily always easy. It demands sitting down and listening to the entire thing, I think. You want to go all the way through.

I got to experience this in a big listening room with a bunch of other people in an early preview and everybody was dancing in their chairs and clapping between songs, hooting and hollering. I recommend that kind of listening environment if you can. And I just think that this is that kind of album like Lily Allen's West End girl, an album that takes you all the way through a relationship meets like Rosalia's Lux, the over-the-top orchestration, you know, multi-genre powerhouse maximalist albums. This is in those traditions. This is in those traditions. and if anything that really gives me a hope is that in this moment of conversation about how do humans belong in the world of music making when we feel like we're being replaced?

Nothing is replacing this. This is the most virtuosic, most practiced, performed, but also loose and improvised. It is the most human album I've heard in the longest time. And I think it contains a good deal of hope. I would like a ring. I would like a ring. I would like a diamond ring on my way to figure. I would like a big a dinosaur

and then I could wave around and talk and talk about it and with the day say, oh, it's hard man. It was pretty good. Wow. Switched on Pop is produced by Raina Cruz, edited by Alyssa Up,

engineered by Brandon McFarlane, illustrations by Arras Gottlieb. Video by Nick Rips. Our theme song is by Zach Tenario and Jossi Adams of Arc-Iriss for a member of the Vox Media Podcast Network, which is production of Vulture, which is part of New York Magazine.

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You can also, while you're there, hanging down on the switch on pop.com website, grab some merch. I'm currently, you know, decking myself out in T-shirts, getting a lot of compliments on the T-shirt, FYI, Charlie. Oh, nice. I'm rocking the mug.

Let's see. Do you have the board shorts yet? I don't have the board shorts. I have the bucket hat, but I haven't worked up the courage to wear it yet. So let's see. And what else? We'll be back.

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