Switched on Pop - Sparkle spoke out against R Kelly. It cost her her career.

Episode Date: October 7, 2021

On this week’s episode we're sharing a story fromThe Cut where senior writer Angelina Chapin and co-host Jazmín Aguilera talk about and talk with Sparkle (born Stephanie Edwards), who first reported R. Kelly to the police for allegedly sexually abusing her 14-year-old niece. Back then, no one believed her, but following the explosive documentary Surviving R. Kelly and the R&B artist’s trial, at the end of which he was found guilty of nine federal sex crimes, she’s been vindicated. Angelina spoke with Sparkle a few times during and after R. Kelly’s most recent trial to hear about the monumental costs she has paid for coming forward. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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from my colleagues at The Cut that totally moved me. It's probably one of the most important reported stories in popular music right now. And so I want to share their work on how Sparkle spoke out against Arcali and why it cost her career. Here's The Cut. The Cut. The Cut. The Cut. The Cut. Nearly 20 years ago, when Sparkle decided to tell the world what had happened to her niece, she thought the video evidence spoke for itself. I mean, nobody was believing me. Am I crazy? Am I the only person seeing this?

What I've seen on a tape, that's what it was. And it wasn't my craziness. Had people listened to me, believed what I was saying was truth, Just listen. We wouldn't be here. But now we are here. Arkelly has been found guilty on all charges in a federal sex crimes trial. After Sparkle, real name Stephanie Edwards,

first reported Robert Kelly to the police for allegedly sexually abusing her 14-year-old niece. My colleague, Angelina Chapin, sat down with Sparkle a few times during and after Arkell's most recent trial to hear about the monumental costs she has paid for coming forward. As soon as I woke out, empty. My career pretty much shattered down the drain.

So Sparkle is a singer, and she was Arkell's protege, basically, back in the late 90s. She did a very popular duet with R. Kelly called Be Careful, that had millions of listens and was on the top of the charts. So she's probably most well known for that song. They work together for most of the late 90s. Little Diana is what they call me, Diana Ross. Little Diana. It was like everybody loves Sparkle. Sparkle's great.

She's dope. She can sing. I love the way she dresses, her hair, her dishing, everything. So it's the late 90s and Sparkle's career is taking off. She also has a niece who's looking to get into music, who's 12, and an aspiring rapper. So she thought, well, who better to help her achieve success than the king of R&B. So it was supposed to be a really positive relationship that she had set up. So in 2000, Sparkle decides to stop working with R. Kelly musically.

She wanted to make her second album on her own. And around the same time, this is 2001, she starts hearing from people inside R. Kelly's camp, former friends of hers, people who work with him, that, like, hey, your niece is in our Kelly's studio a lot. She's by herself. She's unsupervised. Nobody told her anything specific, but she just started to get the feeling that something is not right here. So I would give calls to my sister and say, hey, I'm hearing rumblings. You may want to check this out. Your niece is down here at the studio by herself. No parental guidance. She's just here, wandering the halls. And not to say that I,

I thought something was going on at that time. It's just the studio has a bunch of seedy things happening in different rooms. It could be drinking, smoking, just the whole gamut. And what would her response be during those years? Oh, no, she's fine. That's her godfather. He wouldn't, you know, everything is fine. Yeah.

And I was like, look, our parents didn't, we didn't grow up that way. She couldn't shake the worry. So she ended up calling child services and saying, can you look into this? And I did that anonymously because I didn't want, you know, people saying, oh, she's a disgruntled ex, you know, protege of our Kellys. And I'm just an auntie. I can go no further than what I really did. And because the law state, you know, if I'm not parent or guardian, then. She didn't have a lot of rights.

So she kind of just had to wait. and see what happened. Until later that same year, we're still in 2001 when she gets a call from a lawyer. Called my home phone. Don't ask me how people were getting my home phone number. I do not know. Who says that he has a tape that he wants her to see. Jesus.

I was horrified and I was disgusted. It's one thing to hear things. What to actually see things is a totally different thing. And who's this lawyer? What's his connection to the case? Do you remember how he found out about it? Don't remember. You know, Chicago, it's a big city, but it's small.

So if somebody saw the tape before me, maybe they told him who that could possibly be. So he reached out to me in hopes that I would get my. sister and brother-in-law to take him on to represent them. He showed me that tape and I called the family, the family said they wanted to see it. Then minutes later, no, we don't want to see it, halt everything because I'm assuming Robert got to them. Her theory is that R. Kelly, you know, somehow threatened them or whatever. I mean, she doesn't know and she doesn't like to speculate, but from her experience, the door was shut and her family cut off contact. It floored me. Absolutely floored me because we were very close, like very, very close. But you're mad at me

for one. How could you not want to put this man where he belongs? And you still don't have an answer to that question? Don't have an answer. I want an answer to that. What a difficult situation, you're speaking out for someone who maybe doesn't want you to speak for them. So what's the right thing to do? I mean, I think it's a valid moral quandary. I can imagine that intertension of the, yeah, the person I love who I'm trying to shield from this won't even talk to me. Doesn't even seem to want this. What am I doing? I'm sorry, but it's like, he was the one who did wrong. would still be around a person who has violated their kid.

I don't know anybody who would be okay with that. And I'm trying to grasp, are you guys not getting this? Right. This person has violated your daughter, my niece, 14 years old, for family to not see what it is. is there. And then the kicker for me is that even in knowing what he did, you still are going to his concerts, going to his parties, going to his home. Like, you're still engaged with him. She was horrified, but Sparkle being Sparkle, she was also spurred. to action. She's just the kind of person who can't sit by if something like that happens to anybody.

I think first I called my sister-in-law because she was a cop. She was a cock-go-cott at the time. She informed me what to do and I did that. I called the authorities. Some detectives came out. I took my statement and they basically told me that their hands were tied. I don't think there are words to describe what that must have been like. I mean, you can, I won't go over it here. This is the infamous quote unquote pee tape that probably if you know anything about what R. Kelly's done, you know about the P tape. Yeah. It was mocked widely. It became unfortunately sort of a cultural phenomenon. So in 2003, Dave Chappelle comes out with the video called Piss on you. And he mocked R. Kelly's singing song.

and sort of like just overt sexuality, but it definitely, it just made light of something that was actually really serious. And the culture was not grasping the sort of severity of what R. Kelly was doing to these girls. I don't even really remember, especially when that Dave Chappelle's kit came out, it being a point or a detail that was laid out that the girls were underage. It like didn't really occur to me until much later that these were children. And I don't think that's what he was trying to make a commentary on, right? I think you really, it was just sort of like it's crazy R. Kelly has a P kink. Like that was sort of the extent.

We're mad about it. Like R. Kelly, I seen R. Kelly in Chicago. He's mad to me. Ain't no punchline of that. That nigger is mad. How are you going to make a video about peeing on somebody? Nick, how you're going to make a video about peeing on somebody? I don't even think Dave Chappelle was going so far as to say, oh, well, he likes him young as well.

Like that really, that wasn't the takeaway. And I mean, another thing, don't forget the tapes were being bootlegged. They were being sold on street corners. If VHS was going for 10 bucks, I mean, this was sort of like, people thought it was funny and kinky and something that they could just watch in their dark basements, not something he should go to trial for. It was just a really twisted reaction from the culture in the early aughts. And so it kind of, yeah, made it into a pop culture moment rather than a crime. While that is happening in the early odds eventually does go to trial. So was that trial the same trial about this tape, about this girl?

Yeah. So the 2008 trial, all the charges stemmed from this particular video of this girl. charges stemming from 2002. So it took six years for him to go to trial, which is a long time. And definitely acted in his favor because people have short memories, other shit happens. When you get the drip, drip over time, it's easy to not see the full picture and kind of process. And I think by the time he actually took the stand, the P-Tape, quote-unquote, was a bit of a distant memory. And it's an interesting trial because the niece and her parents refuse to testify.

And the fact that he was acquitted is largely attributed to their absence. So then, so where is Sparkle in all of this? Like she's watching this unfold. She's watching the court case. Was she called to the stand or was she asked to testify or anything like that? Yeah, she did testify. I mean, you can imagine all throughout this trial, how much was. Would she want to just be able to know what her niece is going through?

Her niece's parents. She's just had no access to the people who are most affected, no being able to sort of find solace in one another. And she's just completely iced out. When it did come back that he got off, I was disappointed. She was just shocked. I mean, she couldn't believe that the jury would get it so wrong. Wow. It's really all I could say was wow. I had no other words to say. Wow.

She went into a depression. She had some health issues. She was diagnosed with early onset diabetes from all the stress, ended up in the hospital for five days and was just really in a dark place. I mean, felt really hopeless and felt like what's the point in speaking out? Nobody's ready to hear this. And it really cost her her career. and her family. They were lonely years. Even in those 10 years estranged from my family, look, I found myself homeless at a point. So, you know, I

spoke and took all of the backlash and would do it again because I don't give a fuck. I'm sorry. Excuse my language. Please lay it on. I don't give a fuck

who. has anything to say about it. I did what was right in the right time. I didn't wait a day, a month, a year, or five or ten to speak it. I wanted it to be known. So I kind of think of Sparkle as one of the OG whistleblowers with R. Kelly. I mean, there's obviously the journalist at the Chicago Sun Times who has broken open this story and, made it really widely accessible to the public. But Sparkle sort of alongside him was always saying, R. Kelly abuses children. My niece was one of his victims. And this video is not funny. I mean, this is criminal evidence. And she's really been ringing the alarm bell for the past two decades

and faced some very, very serious consequences for doing so. Industry people. People took their boots and their skirts and they hiked them up and they ran for the hills for me. You can feel it. You can feel the, okay, they're not going to pick up the phone. So let's not call them. That's what I felt everybody did. What's that gift where you see Homer Simpson go back into the grass? Really?

They were like, oh. And that was hurtful for me. They're not going to pick up the call from you because they want that relationship still. Just in case he doesn't get indicted or anything. So let's keep that relationship going. Coming up, R. Kelly is brought to justice. And Sparkle is vindicated. But at what cost?

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your period of in the trial.combeer in shopify.s in the 2008 trial Arkeley was acquitted. So all those people who just wanted to

bump and grind to his music sort of had a legal excuse to do so. I mean, you could say whatever you wanted about the guy, but the law came down and absolved him. So I think for a period of time, like the next 10 years, it was kind of up to the

individual person, what they wanted to do about his music. So Sparkle became prominent again, I would say in 2019 when she was part of the lifetime documentary Surviving R. Kelly, which was explosive. It, you know, garnered a lot of attention to the case. And it sort of shook viewers into having to really look starkly at what these women were saying, because they had all these firsthand interviews with all these accusers telling awful stories of being abused by R. Kelly. And it revived the narrative of, hey, did he illegally marry Alia, who was underage at the time? Nobody talked about it. Yeah.

That was pretty fucked up. He got her a fake ID. I mean, all these details put together. Okay. Now the people see that I was telling the truth, speaking the truth. Yeah. And, you know, as a human, you want the vindication. They can't give me enough of vindication of the shit I've gone through.

That can only come from God. Trust me and believe. Because at the drop of a dime, they will flip-flop on you in a minute. Every time she'd spoken out up until this point, it had been Sparkles a liar, sparkles a disgruntled protege, sparkles a clout chaser. And finally, after the documentary, yes, she was still getting that hate, but it was complimented by young girls, young women, sliding into her DMs. saying things like, I wish you were my auntie. I wish you were my protector. Thank you so much for speaking out. I had such and such horrible thing happened to me. And I wish I had someone like you in my life to, to, you know, be my defender. Wow. So I think that that was a, that was a turning point for

her. There's more tapes. Yeah. There's more people who've come forward. Yeah. Thankfully. And they don't just have to rely on my testimony or my words, you know. Did you kind of feel like you were carrying the torch a bit of this? Yeah, I honestly did. I felt like it was just me and I had to cover my niece because nobody else was. Right. And that's how I felt the loneliness of that. I don't think folks wanted to hear it.

they weren't ready. They didn't want to hear it. And my brother, another brother of mine, he would always say to me, look, Seth, if they don't give a fuck about their daughter, then why should you? Why do you keep fighting this fight? Because I have to. I don't know anything else but to keep fighting because I know this is the fight. right thing. This is about my family. And it's always been about my family. It's never been about him.

Because like I said, I will lay down again in front of that Mack truck and take it all over again. I laid down on the ground for my niece and for these young girls. The 2019 documentary surviving R. Kelly helped lead to the criminal charges against a singer. In that film, several women came forward with their detailed allegations of abuse. including sex trafficking and racketeering. Now he faces more criminal charges in Illinois and Minnesota. So this trial was much more wide-reaching than the first one. So the first was very focused on child pornography and this one tape.

And the trial that just happened involved charges called racketeering and sex trafficking. So essentially the prosecutors were trying to prove that our Kelly was the head of this elaborate trafficking ring that used his fame, that used his employees to entice young girls and boys into his orbit, who he then sexually abused and transported across state lines. So it was very, it was kind of going after the whole system of it, rather than to say this is, you know, specifically child abuse or child pornography. And racketeering comes with a very serious sentence up to life in prison. So you can really see how the federal prosecutors were trying to nail him down as best they could.

So you sat down with Sparkle again once the second trial reached a verdict. So, yes, I reached out. Hi, Angelina. Hi. Hey, tell me, how are you doing? And Arkelly was found guilty on all counts, which is remarkable, given that he was acquitted a mere 10 years ago. So it really shows, I mean, the power of having those firsthand testimonies.

We heard at least 11 witnesses share their stories of being abused, horrible things about being trapped in rooms, about being raped, you know, about being bullied and harassed and just made to do incredibly degrading things and basically treated like child sex slaves. So I think for a jury, that level of detail, that volume of witnesses coming forward is just so undeniable and has such a power that the first trial lacked. People think it's a happy day, but it's not a happy day. You know what I mean? he does face between 10 years in prison to a life sentence. And I'm happy with the verdict because I didn't get to get that verdict when I was the first

to sleep up and out regarding him. And nobody believed me. And he'll probably people probably still don't believe even if you know what I mean. There's some crazy people in this world. I'm not happy to see. as the world would probably say another black man going down. You know, I never would want that. But, you know, if you do what you've done,

then you deserve what you get. And then that's that. Has Sparkle had any conversation with her family since the trial has ended? She hasn't. She would like to, but she's just not in a place where she can reach out to them. last time she did that over the summer, there was a death in the family and she reached out to her sister. When we did come back together, I did ask my sister different questions and she would evade the questions. And her thing was, God, God forgives. She's really gotten the message that they don't

want that contact. And at this point in her life, she's at a place where if they want to come to her. She'll receive them. And I think she wants to mend that relationship, but it's not the kind of thing that she's going to initiate. But she's thinking of her niece. It is incredibly painful not to know what her niece thinks or feels. And I think she does hold at hope that one day the now woman, I mean, her niece is now in her late 30s, might say something to the fact of, hey, it took me a while, but I am glad that you spoke out. And, you know, we know that she now is is cooperating with federal investigators. So there's some indication that, you know, she might want justice to. She might one day want to speak out, at least in a legal context. So that's given Sparkle. That's kind of the only

clue she has that maybe her niece supports her speaking of as well. You know, what's really striking to me is just we often think about these kind of crimes as things that only happened between, you know, the criminal and the victim. But really, like, what this shows is that these, these have huge ripple effects. It's like it broke up a family. It destroyed Sparkle's life. Like she, like, she didn't actually get personally victimized, but indirectly, she absolutely did. Like, just trying to do the right thing completely changed the course of her life. You know, for 20 years. Like, it's not just the victims. Like, these crimes have. huge networks of harm that they cause.

And I'm really glad that we're having these conversations, but it's so daunting. Yeah. And I think we all, it's uncomfortable, right? Because none of us are above it. Like, most of us aren't sparkle and most of us can't say, yeah, I stopped listening to his music as soon as I heard the charges. Like, I remember just listening to Ignition thinking that was a great song, dancing to my friends with it, being whatever, 16 and,

completely oblivious to the wider crimes, not thinking of the victims. So it's both a cultural reckoning and a personal one to think of like, yeah, how did you engage with these artists at the time? Were you laughing at Britney Spears? Were you listening to Our Kelly? You know, we all have to sort of revisit our place during those moments and be honest with ourselves about where we were at. And the answers can be really ugly. Yeah. And in fact, it's kind of, sad because it's almost become the documentary revisiting a traumatic past has almost become a genre of entertainment now. And I mean, maybe that's what's going to make it, maybe that's the self-policing system that will evolve from this. But I guess that will remain to be seen. But at least for now,

you know, there's some justice being done. It seems only right that in this time when we all have Netflix adult brains that the only thing that snaps us to attention is the fifth Britney Spears documentary or, you know, the Lifetime series on R. Kelly. But it is true. And, you know, you could argue this trial would not have happened without that documentary, without Sparkle's voice. So, you know, she does have, she does have that on her side, knowing that very well she has prevented more, more girls, more boys from being abused. I have to see this assignment through. And I think that's the takeaway for me is the strength to carry this on my back alone

without a Me Too, a Time Sub. I wish there was something like that back when. And even with the Me Too now, I didn't even know that Me Too was for, for black women. We are so marginalized as women, like, for our skin color. It's like we're the bottom of the bottom. And for Robert to just have targeted black girls and women is another testament to how we aren't given a fuck about.

And I don't understand that. Our Kelly will be sentenced for his crimes in May. There are still several other federal and state cases against Kelly pending. The Cut podcast is made by me, Jasmine Aguilera, B.A. Parker and Nur Bucidi. Mixed by Alex Higgins. Edited by Jolie Myers and Hanna Rosen.

Our executive editors are Hannah Rosen and Nishakurwa. The Cut podcast is made possible by the team at New York Magazine. Subscribe to their work at thecut.com slash subscribe. I'm Jasmine Aguilera. And thanks for listening. Thank you.