Switched on Pop - THE 5TH — MOVEMENT III, Putting the Classism in Classical

Episode Date: September 15, 2020

Before Beethoven’s time, classical music culture looked and sounded quite different. When Mozart premiered his Symphony 31 in the late 1700s, it was standard for audiences to clap, cheer, and yell ���da capo!” (Italian for “from the beginning!”) in the middle of a performance. After Beethoven’s Fifth Symphony debuted in the early 1800s, these norms changed — both because the rising industrial merchant class took ownership of concert halls and because of shifts in the music itself. As we explored in episodes I and II of the Switched On Pop podcast series The 5th, the musical complexity of Beethoven’s symphony required a different kind of listening. The Fifth’s four-note opening theme occurs and recurs in variations throughout the symphony, slowly shifting from minor to major keys and mirroring Beethoven’s experience with deafness. The Fifth’s creative rule-breaking — subverting the classical sonata form in the first movement, for example — requires close listening to fully grasp. Over time, these norms crystallized into a set of etiquette rules (e.g., “don’t clap mid-piece”) to enhance the new listening experience. In the third episode of The 5th, we explore how Beethoven’s symphony was used to generate the strict culture of classical music — and the politics that undergird those norms of behavior. Music Discussed Recording of The New York Philharmonic performing Beethoven’s Symphony No. 5 conducted by Jaap van Zweden used by permission from Decca Gold. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

If you're tired of endless scrolling to figure out where to eat, same. I'm Stephanie Wu, editor-in-chief of Eater. We've just launched the new-ish and way better Eater app. It has all the restaurants we love, gives you personalized picks wherever you are, and serves up smarter search results just for you. You can find my list of the best places for martinis and fries in New York City. And save your favorite spots, share lists, follow editors, and book right in the app. the Eater app at Eaterapp.com. It's free for iOS users. Charlie, somewhere deep in interstellar space,

there's a robotic probe called The Voyager. Yeah, I know about it. It's been traveling the galaxy since it was launched in 1977, and it contains a message intended for any forms of life that may encounter it. A message in the form of a golden record. I actually have a copy of this golden record. I it so much. Wow, okay, no need to brag. Then you know, it's filled with excerpts of human language and music that's meant to represent the best of Earth, from Javanese Gamelon to Peruvian wedding songs to the first movement of Beethoven's Fifth Symphony. Oh man, what are they going to think of us? Like, what's a malian civilization discovers this golden record and we greet them with like dun dun dun dun are we the conquering intergalactic empire is that what they're going to think it's a great

question because not everyone feels that beethoven is the best representation of our species collective achievement for a lot of people beethoven's fifth symphony doesn't represent triumph and resilience but elitism and exclusion so how did this happen how did the meaning of this get so tangled over the centuries. I'm musicologist Nate Sloan, and I'm songwriter Charlie Harding. And this is the Fifth Movement 3. To understand the complicated legacy of the Fifth Symphony,

we need to go back to the story, the struggle from minor to major that begins with the first notes of the symphony, and ends with a major key triumph in the fourth and final movement. You remember Frank Huang, the New York Philharmonics violinist and concert master. Well, he has an explanation for why we still gravitate towards the symphony over 200 years after its composition.

We all feel this daily struggle, sometimes, whether it's like stress from watching your kids all day or, you know, worrying about like COVID or whatever it is these days. But like anytime you have a small victory or something goes right, you feel the sense of joy. And, you know, so it's easily relatable to this minor, major, you know, once you get that connection into music harmonically, it's very easy to feel inspired by these things. That is the perfect metaphor because my toddler's stomping feet can be like a dumbo bum bum. And when he successfully get him to sleep, it is a major victory. I love that, right? There's something timeless about this journey, this story of resilience.

And in the decades after this piece premiered, people became kind of obsessed with this story. And they turned it from like this personal story about Beethoven's own life into this kind of collective story. I want to read something to you. This is from the diary of a New York music lover named George Templeton Strong. He listened to the New York Philharmonic play this piece in 1845, and as soon as it was over, he ran home and wrote this in his journal. What visions does it not call up of triumph and victory? The march of a conquer of the world. The coronation, music of a universal monarch, the joy of a ten years captive galloping fast through sunlight and green fields. Whoa, this guy is really feeling this piece. It's a really flowery journal entry. You can hear that this symphony is becoming more than just a story of Beethoven overcoming.

It's a story of anyone who listens to this, of society like coming together to move forward, to go from minor to major, so to speak. I can also even see the sort of strive of empire, colonialism, industrialism, all those things, which have sort of that same built-in narrative of triumph and conquering. It feels very resonant with that historical era of Western Europe. You're right. This piece and Beethoven become the soundtrack for a new bourgeois class. But hold on to that because we're going to come back to it a little later.

Everyone starts to want to write like this. They want to start to write like Beethoven to express their innermost emotions through abstract instrumental music. You know, to tell stories in the language beyond that of words. Beethoven kind of becomes the patron saint of artists in the 19th century because he's innovative, because he broke all the rules like we saw, you know, dropping ovosolos wherever he pleases, expressing himself. This is not a puritanical symphony. You know, I say it lightly, but it's worth noting.

It's like it's bold to express oneself. It's countercultural at that time. can see why it's attractive to people. There's a painting from 1840 that captures Beethoven as this countercultural icon. Wait, this is beautiful. What are you seeing here, Charles? Oh, my goodness. Okay, so we are in a parlor. Uh-huh. There are many, it looks like inebriated men, a few women, and they are in their fanciest coats and puffy collars. They're surrounded by drapery. And they are all encircled around a piano with one man playing.

He looks totally transfixed. He's looking out the window. And off in the distance on the horizon is a marbled statue of Beethoven glaring down upon all of these revelers. It's godlike. You nailed it. I need to give a little more context here. The person sitting at the piano, that's Franz Liszt, the Hungarian composer and virtuoso. Hey, List.

He might be improvising on, you know, a theme of Beethoven, as was his want. Oh, interesting. That's very beautiful. I didn't know that List had an electric jazz piano back in 1840. Okay. I may have taken some creative license here. And we have some other luminaries of the artist scene here. We've got Alexandra Dumas, the author of The Three Musketeers and the Count of Monte Cristo.

He's sitting on the left. And we've got George Saund, the French author who took a male pseudonym and dressed like a man famously. She's hanging out on the chair there. So we've got like some real heavy hitters. Absolutely, yeah. And like you said, they're all kind of looking to Beethoven for inspiration. As we move into the 20th century, Beethoven's influence continues. He's used as propaganda for the Third Reich.

He's like this, you know, expression of German nationalism. But he's also used by the Allied forces as a kind of code word. Really? Yeah. This fifth symphony, da-da-da-da. It has an opening rhythm that corresponds to the Morse code for the letter V. Which stands for victory, and it's why the BBC would open all of their wartime broadcast with the beginning of the fifth symphony.

As a coded message that we're going to use the Germans' own favorite composer to win this war. Wow. Love this. Oh, my gosh. The Axis and the Allies fighting it out trying to claim rightful ownership of this music. It's meeting. It's history. Right.

Again, you can see the symphony is kind of what you make it. You know, you can put your own interpretation into this narrative arc. And people continue to do so in the latter half of the 20th century. And I think one of the most perfect examples of that comes from the 1970s film, Saturday Night Fever. when John Travolta walks into a nightclub to the sounds of Walter Murphy's, a fifth of Beethoven. It's so good. You know, when you put the Fifth Symphony on the Moog bass and the clavonet,

it feels like it is just timeless. It's contemporary. It's new. It's fresh. I love it. And it doesn't just seep into the world of, of disco. Yeah.

We could make a Wheel of Fortune style game where we had all these different genres and anyone we spun to, you could find a version of Beethoven's Fifth in that style. Like you want Beethoven's Fifth salsa? We've got it. You know what's cool about this version is that the main rhythmic motif, the dun-da-da-da-da-da becomes subservient to these salsa rhythms, which suits. propose this whole new rhythmic language onto the symphony. Yes, which is kind of similar to the Nigerian Afrobeat version.

Ooh, that is cool. That's sort of derivative of the disco version, but it's a whole new thing. It is very similar to the disco version, yeah. Who knew that Beethoven played with polyrhythms? Did I hear you say you wanted a bluegrass version of the fifth symphony? You know, I love the banjo. It's not a very well-kept secret that we used to play in a bluegrass band, but there's something about when you do a bluegrass cover of something, it just feels instantaneously like a parody.

No matter how Virtuaic that version was. Beautiful. Then I'll be very curious to hear what you think about our final example, Beethoven meets heavy metal. I'm not even surprised. Metalheads love dipping into the world of the Baroque. They love Bach. I'm not surprised

that they like the Fifth Symphony, too. You know, I was thinking about what all these covers and commercials and memes about the Fifth Symphony might have in common. And I was thinking that they all play off

the seriousness of this music. They're so enjoyable because they seem to poke back at the sanctity and the kind of holiness of this Fifth Symphony. I kind of want to say about the bluegrass.

Like, when you hear it on a fiddle, rather than like a concert master violinist playing the fifth symphony, all of a sudden all the seriousness just turns into laughter. And that makes me want to ask, how did this happen? Like, how did Beethoven become the symbol of seriousness and solemnity and kind of everything we think about classical music today? I guess it has something to do with his eyebrows and his hair on those wild marble busts of Beethoven that you see. It just looks frazzled like he's just, he's windswept and everything is amiss in his life.

That's definitely part of it, but I think more so it's forces beyond Beethoven. It's the listeners who conspired to turn him into the poster boy of classical elitism, that story after the break. Maria, you have a podcast now and you need to start acting like it. What's the first step as a podcaster? Well, you have to ask lots of questions. I'm Maria Sharpova, and I'm hosting a new podcast called Pretty Tough.

Every week, I'm sitting down with trailblazing women at the top of their game to discuss ambition, work ethic, and the ups and downs that come on the path to achieving greatness. I have a few pretty tough questions for you. Okay. Ready? Ready. Do not sugarcoat something for me. No. No.

No. We'll dive into their stories and get valuable insights from top executives, actors, entrepreneurs and other individuals who have inspired me so much in my own journey. Pretty tough is your front row seat to the women who have demonstrated the power in being unapologetic in their pursuits. I hope you'll join us. New episodes drop Wednesdays on YouTube or in your favorite podcast app. Immigration may be Donald Trump's signature issue.

President Trump is now targeting predominantly democratic cities for ice raids and deportations. Dozens of protesters clashing with immigration and customs enforcement agents in many We will begin the process of returning millions and millions of criminal aliens back to the places from which they came. But what we want to do in this space is talk about America and politics beyond the current president. So what do most Americans think about deportation and border security, period? I think that Americans are definitely against the kind of violent displays that we've seen in the street from ICE. When it comes to the question of deportation, the answer is more complicated. My sense is that people want border at the border.

They don't like the idea of having no idea who's coming into the United States at any given time. The view on immigration from the bottom up instead of the top down. That's this week on America Actually. Every Saturday in your audio and video feeds. I want to introduce someone you may have heard of. Hello. I'm Wolfgang Amodeus Mozart. You've been talking about Beethoven for like an hour.

and you haven't mentioned me once. What does Wolfgang have to do with this? I asked Mozart to read us a letter to his dad, Leopold, in which he talks about the premiere of his symphony number 31 in Paris, because I think it tells us a lot about how classical music used to be before Beethoven. You just called up Mozart. I've got him on speed dial, NBD. So what's the letter say?

Behold, the symphony began. In the middle of the first Allegro, there was a passage which I felt sure must please. The audience was quite carried away, and there was a tremendous burst of applause. But as I knew, when I wrote it, what effect it would surely produce, I had introduced the passage again at the close.

There were shouts of de capo, Decapos. Charlie Decapo means again. It's like people are yelling. Play that again. Right now. Again. And should be wrong.

I'm not finished. Sorry, Wolfgang. Ahem. The Antente also found favor. But particularly the last Allegro, because having observed that all last as well as first allegro's begin here with all the instruments playing together and generally in unison. I began mine with two violins only, followed instantly by a forte. The audience, as I expected, said hush at the thought beginning.

And when they heard the forte began at once to clap their hands. I was so happy that as soon as the symphony was over, I went off to the Palais Royal, where I had a large ice, said Rosary, as I had bowed to do, and went home. I asked Mozart to read this letter because I think it shows us that classical music before Beethoven was more like a rock show. Right? There's people yelling. Yeah.

There's people shushing each other. There's people bursting into applause in the middle of passages. That would get you kicked out of a concert hall today. Yes. In fact, if you go to an orchestra today, you might be. required to read something called the Symphony Concert Etiquette Guide before you attend. Get out of here. Okay, what's in the etiquette guide? It tells you what kind of clothes you should wear? Jeans and Tevas? They say business attire. Okay. It directs you to unwrap your lozenges ahead of time. Okay.

I didn't know that was a problem. Unlike what Mozart described, it has very specific rules about. clapping. It says if you're listening to Beethoven's Symphony number nine, which has four movements, it is appropriate to clap only after the last movement. You can look at your program book to find out how many movements a piece has. Usually there's a 15 to 30 second pause between movements. So in the case of Beethoven's Science Symphony, you know you're hearing the finale after three pauses. If you're unsure you can wait for the rest of the audience to clap before you join in. Oh my gosh. So if you're feeling moved, wait till the end of the fourth movement. You can't have any emotive experience during this incredibly emotional roller coaster of a symphony.

Yeah, you know, that last sentence of this concert etiquette guide says so much. It's like to listen to this music, you have to know the rules. And you have to behave in a certain way. The Philharmonics percussionist Kyle Zerner told me that he wished the audiences gave more feedback, the way they did back in Mozart's day. In a weird way, I kind of wish it was like that. Typically, in an orchestra concert, even if I felt it didn't go that well, usually we get a pretty decent applause at the end. So there's this radical shift that takes place within the concert hall.

Is it because of Beethoven's Fifth Symphony? That's what I'm not understanding here. I think it's that the popularity of the Fifth Symphony introduces this new way of listening. So in the decades after the premiere of the Fifth Symphony, if you went to the concert hall, you'd find that it was a vastly different space than the one that Mozart would have been used to. It was a place where they used a word called zitz-fleish. I'm sorry, that one's not in my vocabulary. That means like sitting flesh. And it's a weird word that describes how you are supposed to stay perfectly still in your seat.

You're not supposed to tap your foot. You're not supposed to clap your hands. You're not even supposed to nod your head. You are supposed to sit in silent communion with this godlike composer. So what changed from Mozart to Beethoven? How did we get this rigid, rule-bound classical culture today? I asked our friends, the classical music critic, James Bennett, why there are so many rules when you go to see classical music?

I think the best way to really think about that is the role that so-called genius plays in this discussion of elitism. It's almost as if we go to listen to this music in these quiet halls of sanctified music. It's holy, it's almost like we're going to worship at the altars of these classical gods. And I can really not think of any other setting in which that kind of, that kind of, of musical communion and reverence is expected. Oh, this is interesting. I like this comparison. The fact that we're even going to buildings

made by famous architects, everything about it is almost religious-like. We're bowing down to these great intellects of art and music. And like in religion, there's a certain set of rituals that you have to enact when you go to the classical concert hall.

They're not necessarily, even obvious. There are all these unwritten rules where you have to go check the etiquette guide in order to follow along. Exactly. It's almost as if it's not just about appreciating the music. It's about showing whether you belong or not. Whether you know how to listen the right way.

And James Bennett has some pretty strong feelings about those rules. It doesn't make any sense. I would never want to go to someone's home and be like, we're going to go listen to this music. By the way, change your clothes. You know, sit on your hands and like don't get up to go to the bathroom. It's going to be like, you know, be easy on the drinks before. And when you have all of this stuff together, everyone acting a certain way around the music as is expected, it's like, it seems like it's part of a club.

I feel James here I mean I love going to see the orchestra and yet when I do like it throws my whole life out of order because it's the only place that I ever go that actually starts perfectly on time and if you're like one minute late

they throw you out it's like I don't know what shoes to wear I don't know what exactly I'm supposed to do I wear a jacket I don't own a blazer do I need a blazer? I never feel like I fit in because even though I'm on my way slowly

to middle age, I'm still like extremely young for the space. It feels so guarded by an older generation and I'd never know if I even belong there. Well, just make sure you unwrap your lozenges in advance, okay? I want to know when that became a problem. I hear you and I hear James. It's almost like there's two sides to the legacy of Beethoven's Fifth Symphony. You know, on one hand, it's a symbol of overcoming and resilience. and inspiration.

And on the other hand, it's used to create this narrative that turns classical music into a culture of exclusivity and elitism. And there might be an even kind of darker part of that story too, in which the symphony becomes the soundtrack for a new class of self-made white men. It becomes the marker of their belonging and their individuality.

And they use this symphony as a way to police who belongs to this cast and who doesn't. If you can understand this harmonic journey from C minor to C major, if you know how to behave in the concert hall, then you're welcome. And they're not so subtle about who is allowed in this symphony club and who's not. Remember at the very beginning of this episode, we heard from that New York music lover writing in his diary about how this symphony is, you know, the source of all freedom and joy and wisdom in the world. Yeah, I'm going to guess that maybe later on in his diary entry, it is not the case that this is the place for equality and every person to enjoy.

This is how he would have preferred that the orchestra dealt with members of the opposite sex. Quote, All women shall be gagged by officers duly licensed for the purpose before they're allowed to answer a concert room. If that won't answer, then there shall be a sentry with a ball cartridge stationed at due intervals about the room with instructions to shoot the first female that opens her mouth. Oh my gosh. And now I think we can see that this idea of like, oh, be quiet in the concert hall. It's not just about we need to appreciate the music.

It's like we need to shut up the people who we don't want to be part of this world. And of course, it's not just women. Like nearly all other institutions, the symphony has been a site of outraked segregation for black Americans during the Jim Crow era. And it's no surprise that black audiences continue to be excluded today. Often in the name of written etiquette and unwritten cultural norms, these kinds of aggressions are something that James Bennett encounters as a black critic working in these spaces. like in a recent experience he had while reviewing a classical concert. I was taking notes

and during the end of the piece and we're all applauding the guy that I'm sitting next to him and he's just kind of like I enjoy the concert but you're writing, you're taking notes, is getting on my nerves

and it's disrespectful and you should be mindful about how I feel as I'm doing it. And I'm like, all right, man, like, what the... I was like, I'll try to write quiet or keep my elbow. tucked into my side, but there's not much more than I can do about it.

And then the ensemble does an encore. I'm still taking notes, obviously. He looks over to me. He's like, I don't understand what you don't get about me telling you to stop. And then he's like, who do you work for? Do you work for the times? I'm going to call the times up tomorrow and tell him to fire you. And I was like, okay, great, do it. This is wonderful. I did not and have not ever worked for the New York Times. So it was a feudal chase for him. But, like, yeah, I mean, it's stuff like that. It happens, like, all the time. And I don't want to say it rolls off of one's back or that, you know, I don't care.

But it's very revealing. James's story kind of breaks my heart here. And, you know, even though he wasn't reviewing a Beethoven concert, what he's describing here is a culture that was created by Beethoven's legacy and the legacy of this piece. and it's a culture that tries to divide and exclude, even as the music itself is all about resilience and overcoming. It teaches me a lot about how the language of manners and etiquette is really often the language of exclusion.

It gives permission for all kinds of aggressions and microaggressions to persist in these spaces to push people out. to not let them have their experience. And in this specific example, I think it's particularly utterly absurd because if we're there to enjoy the genius of a work, perhaps taking notes on it is a great way to get to understand and appreciate it. Yeah, I agree. And I think that brings up a really provocative question,

which is in 2020, are we still going to keep celebrating this composer? Are we going to decide that maybe it's time that we'd be. break up with Beethoven once and for all. That's next on the fourth and final movement of our series, The Fifth. Switched on Pop is made by Nate Sloan and me, Charlie Harding. We're produced by Megan Lubbin, Bridget Armstrong, mixed edited and engineered by Brandon McFarland, social media by Abby Barr, and our executive producer from Ashok Kerwa and Liz Kelly Nelson. We're a member of the Vox Media Podcast Network. Thanks to Jen Luzzo, Adam Crane, and all the members of the New York Phil Harmonic. And also, huge

Thanks to our Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart, the actor Phoebe Knightheart. Recording of Beethoven's Fifth by the New York Philharmonic used by permission from Deca Gold. We're posting lots of fun stuff on Beethoven and Fifth Symphony on social media. We're at Switched on Pop on Twitter and Instagram, so chat with us there. We apologize to everybody who saw the New York Times crossword puzzle spoiler, which happened just magically to align with our series. And Beethoven's Fifth was a major clue. That was bad, Charlie. Charlie, I did not. Just for the record, I did not approve of that. That was all, I'm just going to throw you under the bus there.

That's fine. Check out the final episode of the fifth coming out this Friday, anywhere you get your podcasts. And you can catch it on our website at switchdown pop.com where you can find the whole series. So until then, thanks for listening. Euforia of Calvin Klein, the new collection elixir, three new elixires perfum intense, solar, magnetic, bowl. Pulsed in the banner, make the quiz and discover your fragrance

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