Test Match Special - #40from40: Sir Elton John

Episode Date: May 28, 2020

Music legend Sir Elton John speaks to Jonathan Agnew from his piano stool in 2006. Look out for a musical interlude featuring Freddie Flintoff!

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Boundary on BBC Sounds. Hello, this is Jonathan Agnew. Welcome to a very special edition of our 40 from 40 podcast series, celebrating 40 years of view from the boundary interviews. Now, this interview is one that so many of you have asked us to dig out of the archives, and it really is one of my favorites. It's very rare to speak to a guest away from the commentary box. Prince Philip was one of the more notable examples, and here's another.

In 2005, English cricket, of course, reveled in the glory. of Ash's success, and it subsequently emerged that one of the team's dressing-room anthems during that series was Sir Elton John's Rocket Man. Well, 12 months later, in May 2006, England or rounder Andrew Flintoff invited Sir Elton along to a charity event where he would join him on stage to sing the England team's favourite. Well, the gig, part of Flintov's benefit year, was at Battersea Park, and I popped along to speak to Sir Elton on his piano stool. Well, he's without question, one of the most significant musicians of Britain has produced. He sold hundreds of millions of records in a career that's lasted more than half a century.

And he began by telling me of his early cricket memories. I was at school when I went to grammar school and we played cricket. And of course, growing up cricket with Dennis Compton and Brian Statham, Freddie Truman. When I was at grammar school, they were the two England fast bowlers. And Compton and Cowdery, Edridge, all those people. they were heroes, they were great British sporting figures and so you idolize them I mean, I mean, cricket commentary in those days

was so exciting, it was like boxing commentary and Truman's coming into a bowl now and he's, you know, the descriptions were so fantastic the great thing about radio was that you could imagine it and I always love listening to cricket on the radio and always do, I still like listening to it on the radio do you want to listen to now? Yeah, I kind of put the volume down on the telly and put the commentary up on the radio

because it's, I don't know, it's something it's always been more magical on the radio for me. And that sold the game to you listening in those days. And also being able to play it at school as well. What did you do, they're asking? A batsman rather than a bowler, definitely. I'm quite an aggressive person,

so I like to, it's always fun to hit the ball, I think. But presumably, music took over then. Music was always my first love. I mean, I come from a very sporting family. My cousin was a footballer with Notting Forest. He scored the first goal in the 1957 Cup final against Luton and broke his leg, his name was Roy Dwight. And my other cousin used to play for Fulham.

I used to sit on the touchline at Fulham when I was a very young boy in the days of Bedford Jezard and Johnny Haynes. And so I come from a very big sporting family, love tennis at an early age, took up tennis. Extraordinary that when I was at school, tennis was not allowed that it was a girl's sport and the boys weren't allowed to play tennis. And yet, and we always wanted to play tennis and hockey, because hockey was such a great sport, but it wasn't you weren't allowed to. So the summer was always nice because rugby was the...

sport in the winter and I didn't like that too much because it was too rough but summer was always good because you can play cricket and I like cricket a lot did you actually get to see any of these heroes you go along to the lords no I didn't no just listen to them on the radio and they became heroes through radio it was astonishing it's like peter brough and Alci Andrews became heroes through the radio and so did all these people that became larger in the life and the descriptions as they were coming into bowl or coming out to bat were extraordinary and and then television came in and of course and you saw these people actually doing it and it was just even more impressive.

Any are Dwight's innings worth mentioning? I don't think so. I mean, I did score, actually I did score 24 at Lords. I played in a couple of charity matches. I played in one at Lords when I had green hair and I walked through the long room and I had the looks that I got as I walked through the long room and it was the longest walk out to the crease I can ever remember of so I thought, please let this end. And I got to the crease and I thought, oh please let me sort of one run and I scored 24.

And that was okay. And the next week I got so carried away. I said, yes, I'll play again next week. It was from the Vic Lewis 11. And I played in Richmond or Barnes, and Robin Jackman got me out first ball. Down to Earth of the bump? Yes, exactly.

He's a decent bowler, though, Robin. I heard him commentating the other day on the South Africa game against New Zealand. Lives life well, that's Robin, and he's living a comfortable life down in Cape Town. 82, 3, that's when you really, I suppose, your love for cricket became more widely known for those of us who followed the game because do you latch on to the 82-3 tour there

down in Australia? Or did you happen to have a tour? I was the first tour that I really latched on is when we won the Ashes. 86-7? Yeah. And I, going down to Australia and New Zealand quite a lot as I did,

I used to love hanging around with the cricketers and the Australian cricketers and the British cricketers. And they were so much fun. They're more down-to-earth. Go out for a drink with me, even go out to dinner, we had a lot of fun. Got up to a lot of fun. mischief together

and then of course when we won the Ashes at Melbourne on that boxing day was one of the greatest nights I'll ever remember and one of the most drunken nights ever remembered and it was such a great occasion and it was so great to be part of a team

that had won the Ashes and to actually have been there and seen it it was quite an extraordinary memory and I must have always gotten on with the Oz's and always gotten on with the English cricketers. There's something about as I say hanging around with cricketers that I really really

like. They're very, very funny. We used to organise Australian. When we played in Perth, we did concerts in Perth and Dennis Lilly would organise with Rodney March and Australian 11 against the British 11 out there. And I remember Alex Stewart was playing club cricket. He was, yes. Yeah. So it shows you how old I am. That's right. It's the sum of the Perth he was. David Gow described you as England's head groupie actually on that tour. I was pretty, yes. But he better be careful because Some of the names that those cricketers earned during that, they better, I could blackmail them easily. I mean, there were Alan Lamb, David Gower, Ian Botham, and Bob Willis.

I quite remember them in New Zealand, at Auckland. They were going to Pakistan. They were not happy. We'd be going to Pakistan. They've been away from home quite a lot, and then they were off to Pakistan. So that night was quite rowdy as well. Was that the infamous sex, drugs and rock and roll? I think that was that tour, yes. I remember Bob Willis being carried along a corridor, because he was so drunk.

And it took about six people to carry him. It was like seeing Gulliver being carried along this hotel corridor. But no, cricket has always been, for me, poetry in motion. It's a bit like I love baseball in America as well, because it's that sort of game. Interesting. So you can actually see the connection between you two. Yeah, there is a connection there. It's a very poetical game.

It's a very complicated game. The only way you could learn cricket is by watching it or playing it. And you can never describe the rules of, you know, it's so complicated, you just have to watch it. And how I learned baseball was to watch it time and time again on TV in America. But those two games are very similar in their poetical kind of way. And it's always great to watch a cricket match. I find it so relaxing and so, you know, I prefer test matches to one day, as I have to say. I'm going to ask you about that, because there's part of you that I'm sure is very traditional,

although sometimes you don't necessarily use that image publicly, but you are more of a traditional cricket match. Well, I like One Day International's quite a lot when they first started. I just think there are too many of them now. And I think wear out the players, and I think their cricketers are playing too many games. And I think the test matches are far more interesting. It's far more of a chess game. I mean, you know the format for the one-dayers. You get a lot of runs, and you try and beat that a lot of runs.

It's interesting sometimes, but I honestly do believe that test match cricket is far more interesting and far more worthwhile. It's far more relaxing as well. It's the man who wore pink shoes, I think I'm right in saying, when he posed for your, was it the cover of the greatest hits two? Yes, I have pink tennis shoes on, was it? Yes. Not terribly traditional. Not terribly traditional.

No, I mean, I am a traditionist in some ways, but I do think that you see the best cricket in test match cricket. Yeah. To go back to that photograph, it's quite a brave decision to make, wasn't it then, to have a, for you to have a cover photograph of you in cricket whites above from pink shoes. Because America had no idea what cricket was. No. Or either, was it perhaps? No, it was just, I just wanted to do something like that.

I mean, cricket not being sexy, not being sexy. But I think cricket is a sexy sport. It's a very sexy sport, and so is baseball. You just have to get into that kind of mindset. I like the fact that you can play for five days and no one can win. I mean, the Americans cannot get that together at all. But for me, it's just, it's, you know, I've been watching the test matches between South Africa and New Zealand recently.

And it's far better than watching the one days. the one dayers. I mean, there was one day as on TV yesterday between West Indies and Zimbabwe. And then, but I'd rather watch the other one. Thank you very much. I'd rather watch the new bowlers come through from New Zealand and from South Africa and the batsmen. It's, you think, you see more potential that way. You're here for Freddie, of course. What did you make? I mean, last summer was just so special. Was there? Did you go to the games? I think, no, I didn't. I was on tour. But it was probably one of the most exciting sporting occasions I've ever witnessed.

between and the thing that really touched me more than anything else was the mutual respect that the two teams had for each other and the sporting way it was carried out the Brett Lee innings for example it was astonishing and the games were so close except for the first test which England got pummel in and you know the one we run by two runs I mean I remember watching that I couldn't bear it

I was in the south of France and I was on the phone to Michael Cain saying, for God's sake, and he said, I can't look, I can't look, because Michael Kane is a huge cricket fan. And that, it was an extraordinary, I don't think we'll see another one like that for a long time. Two very evenly matched teams. And a great cricket, great cricket all round. What I liked about it was the tempo which the game was played. There were three or four hundred runs being scored all the time. And it was fun. It was entertainment. And yet it was great cricket. It was great.

bowling, great batting, and two teams that really wanted to win. You mentioned the spirit. I know you love football too, obviously, but would you like to see football played in the sort of the cricketing spirit? Well, the thing I love about, say, in Spanish football is when you watch Spanish football on TV, when they do foul each other, they pick each other up, and there's always a... Ronaldino plays the game with a grin, and I like that, and Etto's like that, and it's nice to see that element in the game. It's sport is enjoyable, it should be enjoyable to play. Whatever sport you play, you should go out there wanting to win. And if you don't win,

then you should accept it in the best way possible. I learned that when I became chairman of Watford Football Club in 1973. I wasn't a particularly good loser. And you have to be gracious. And I thought the thing that touched me last year about that test series was, yeah, it was hellful leather and, you know, everyone wanted to win. But in the end of the day, the mutual respect that the two teams had was just, it was very touching. It's interesting, is it? Because Steve Waugh, former captain has said publicly that he thought it was that and the sort of the friendliness that the Australians showed to England that actually cost them the series. It's always as if they're going to go the other way again, perhaps, and we go there in the winter.

Well, I mean, sledging, I mean, there's always been the rivalry, but I mean, I've, but they always go for a drink with each other after. They're first in the dressing room afterwards. That's part and parcel of the game, but I've been there. As soon as the game's finished, it's in the other dressing room for a drink. That's, you know, that's the way it goes. And listen, I'm sure, you know, there was a lot of mini sledging going on in that in that way but it's you know it it it was it was terrific to see the English team competing at the level of the Australians which too often we haven't done because the Australians have an incredible team spirit and an incredible will to win and an

incredible professionalism of the way they do it and I've always admired that about Australian sports teams in general and last year I think with Duncan Fletcher being the coach and with Michael Vaughan the captain and with Freddie coming on and playing such a great role the emergence of Peterson the bowling the bowling of Jones Harmison and Hogard in different spurts was fantastic it was it was like the old age it was so exciting you talk so passionately about this Elton I mean are you a frustrated sportsman would you would you I think every singer every every musician I've ever known would like to be a sportsman really

and every sportsman I've ever known wants to be a musician it's always it's sod's law if you you can't be one but it's there's there's There's a great parallel between sport and music because I think they're both great levelers. I mean you could go to a park and kick a football around and people say can we join in and you don't know them and when you're on stage playing to people you don't know and they're singing with you with you. It's a great feeling of like you're together with all these people and I think that sport and music more than anything else bring people together, especially on a religious basis.

I mean when I've played in Northern Ireland I've played to Catholics and and Protestants together in that place where I played, and that's the only time they're allowed to be together. But they've been drinking in the pub. It brings people together, and sport does that too. And some of the banter you get at sports is fantastic. I mean, some of the crowd at Wofford has come out, you know, the crowd come up with some incredibly funny things.

And it's, for me, it's my life. Music and sport are the two things that have always been anchored ever since I was a child that I loved. The problem is, of course, that sports will have a shelf life, don't they? They know 35, 40, if they're really lucky, buffets. That's the end of it. That's the thing. That's the thing.

I mean, golfers have it a little bit easier because they can play on until they have seniors now, so they can play forever. And a cricketer can play into his 40s. A footballer really can't unless you're Teddy Scheringer or the Milan back four. No, it's a sportsman have a shelf-living. Because county cricketers up until even so, not even on the same page. scale as anybody else i mean they play cricket because they love it and i think that's so great and you see you know you watch a counter game on tv or or a sunday afternoon game on tv and you see new players come in and never heard of and there's something 23 24 with a boy who was um playing for

surrey the other day to the best uh is it down yeah he looks very young and he took two great wickets and you think god there's a name for the future maybe and i bet he's not getting paid hardly anything no but they're playing because they love it and i just think that's so great To be able to do something you love Like when I first joined a band I did something that I loved And we earned 15 quid a week And we had to pay our own petrol money

Our own accommodation Look after our equipment And I don't think we could have made any money But we loved it And we didn't care about it Because we were so happy To do something that we actually loved So happy

And I think There's something beautifully romantic about being a cricketer And there's something so graceful And I think it's camaraderie And I don't know It's just a wonderful thing. I envy cricketers like that.

How do you keep yourself fresh? I mean, it's one thing for a cricketer to go out. You might, as you did, get naught one day or 22 the next. You're singing the same version of the same songs, I suppose, and have been for a long, long time. How do you sort of keep yourself? Every performance is different. No matter how many times you sing the songs,

every innings is different. I don't have the psychological, you know, like when a play hits a bad patch. And you know everyone's going to hit a bad patch sooner or later. And it happens to writers of songs. You write songs sometimes over a couple of years that aren't as good as you've written before. And you know that, do you at the time? In time, you know it, because you look back and think, well, that wasn't as good.

And a cricketer will go through that, and it's sometimes so psychological. The sport is psychological. And being successful as a musician is psychological. You have to keep yourself fresh. You have to keep yourself on your toes. You cannot coast. I do that by listening to new music, listening to new artists, encouraging new artists. not listening to old things

listening to new things it's the young people that keep you on your toes and you know that's how I keep myself fresh with sport with cricketers it's just you know if you've got the talent

the talent's there it's having the mental capacity to go along with it I think and you must agree with me there so many people have the talent they just don't have the mental capacity to couple the talent

and the mental capabilities with it that's absolutely true I mean there are great performers on test you know in County Creek like Mark Ramprakersh, who's never really done it. And Chris Lewis, you've got all the raw talent in the world. It's such a shame. It's never quite come together at a test match. And I've always been a fan of Mark Ramperechus.

Ever since he was one of the youngest players ever to play for Middlesex. And do you keep playing the music? You still keep creating yourself? Oh, yeah. I've just made a new album this year in my 42nd or 43rd, I think. You always have to create. I mean, I'm either writing musicals or film music or doing different things to keep. challenging myself. You can't rest on your laurels. You can't look back. Even though you play the old standbys because people want to hear them, you have to look forward and you have to

produce new things. Otherwise, you will go stale and you will be just doing it as a machine. And I could never do that. Must mention these venues. They're off on tour, aren't you? I do cricket grounds. You are. Canterbury, Durham, Worcester, Taunton, Hope. That's great fun, is it? It's going to be fantastic. I mean, I've never really played a cricket ground before, except in Australia. I played in Perth and played Sydney and Melbourne. Do you play in the round, as they call it? No, I'll have a stage at one end. Canterbury is going to be great, because I've never been to Canterbury cricket ground.

I've been to Worcester. I think you came to Worcester. With George Harrison. Indeed, and Eric Clapton. To see Ian Botham and I was playing for Leicestershire. Yes. I just came to see me bowl out of them. Yeah, it was a Sunday game.

Yes, I remember. Yeah. It was a beautiful day. And it's a great, one of the beautiful ground to Worcester, don't you think? Beautiful, absolutely. What's your favourite, Canny cricket game? Oh, Grace Road, Lester. Have you been?

No, seriously, what is your favourite group? I think Worcester had been. And Canterbury, you haven't been to Canterbury, you'll love it. A bit of a thing about the tree. Yes, but it might be... It's a bit like Wrigley Field with baseball. You must go to Canterbury to see a cricket game. It does Kent.

That's a lover. Brilliant. Now, come on, Freddy tonight. You're going to sing with him. For start, Rocket Man. Are you a bit surprised that he chose Rocket Man? I was very... I read it in the papers, and I just thought,

oh my god that's very nice it's always flattering when someone picks one of your songs and rocket man yeah i wouldn't i can't wait for him to actually sing it tonight to make an absolute fool of himself i think we will do yes i mean i think everybody's just jumping at the bit mind you looking around here tonight how many people it's like a like you'll see 1,300 people move quite quickly when he starts singing i suspect yeah as long as that's 30 people 100 people don't move quickly when i've seen i'm good mind but yeah well freddie will clear that floor quicker than anybody. Have you rehearsed?

Have you rehearsed? No, not a rehearsal. Jim Carey sang it with me once, unrehearsed, on stage in Los Angeles. And that was quite something, I can tell you. But Freddie, I think, will probably beat Jim. Right. Well, we're going to listen to it. But first, Selton, thank you so much for joining us.

Thank you for the band. Top men. And listen forward to a good summer of cricket. Ladies and gentlemen, please give a really big warm. Welcome to my guest performer. Andrew Flintoff. by then. I miss the earth so much.

I miss my wife. It's lonely out in space. I'm such a timeless flight. It's going to be a long, long time Touchdown brings me around and get too fine I'm not the man that they think I am at all Oh no, no, no I'm a rocket man

Rocket man Burning on a screws up here alone It's going to be a long, long time To touch down brings me around again to fire I'm not the man that think I am at all I'm a rocket man Like a man, I'm burning out of the shoes of parallel. It's a fantastic night.

You know, to have somebody, Ike Elton John, one of my euros, singing at a benefit function in front of those people. I think it's something that they'll remember for a long, long time. And I know that I will, it was a fantastic night. And yeah, the singing didn't go too well, but I'm sure you've heard that. But it was unbelievable. Did you give it your full voice, Freddie? I was a bit sheepish, to be honest. I got up there, and to begin with a farozo, a bit of stage fright.

And then, luckily, Elton's got such a powerful voice. He managed to drown out my drivel I was singing. Why Rocket Men? Why was that such a special song for you? I don't know. I've been an Elton John fan for a while and listened to a lot of his music. And the thing with me is, if I listen to a song and I like it, I listen to it over and over and over again.

again I just I kill it to be honest and I played it in the dress room and kept playing it and the rest of the lads started playing it and through last summer during the Ashley series it became like the team anthem and it seemed to when that song was played it reminded you of good times because the times you had an edge blast and then Trent Bridge and moving on to the oval you know it made you smile and feel quite good about yourself and is it are using it this summer or have you killed it I don't know yet to be on myself we have to have a look and see what's on the iPod and have a word with the lads

hell alone and I think it's gonna be a long long time so touchdown brings me around again to find I'm not the man that think I have my heart I'm a rocket man I'm a rocket man I'm burning out of seas on hell alone Well, I think it's going to be a long, long time.

Freddy. It's going to be a long, long time. Yeah. Well, I quite sure Freddie wasn't as effective a singer as he was a cricketer. Wasn't it great here from Sir Elton John? That's an interview that I will always treasure. Well, there's so much more from the archives, available for. from BBC Sounds. There's lots more to come. Look out for this from the Oscar winning director, Sir Sam

Mendez. Test cricket, of course, is the thing that I love the most. As any true cricket felt, I believe, must do. But for me, the way that test cricket is being played has changed, you know, because of the developments in the game, and they've changed for the better. You know, I look at a player like, you look at a player like Steve Smith or a player like Ben Stokes, and they're looking to score of every ball. They've just, the intent is there you know and the era

where I fell in love with the game was a completely different so they were waiting for runs well I've got a very interesting I wonder if you know this stat actually

this is where I really I really prove my geekness which is that you know as a reader of many Frindle's score books of the 70s at early 80s Jeff Boycott

a man close to your heart batted in the 78 79 series which was let's face not an exciting series it was a six match series and it was the packer so it was a very denuded Australian team but he faced more balls

than any other player in the England team in that series he faced over 1,100 balls how many boundaries do you think he scored well I've got a bit of a stat that I think this is involved as well because I know that at one period I think it was on that tour he went 530 something balls that hitting a single boundary and that wasn't obviously in one game

but there was a string of that so that I think is in the same run so I'm going to go four six six boundaries in one thousand one hundred balls now it didn't seem it is quite appalling yet but you think you'd make one the two down through third man how can you not score a boundary

you know and you know you look at it now and you'd be disappointed if even alister cook who was hardly a dasher went a hundred balls without scoring six boundaries let alone one thousand one hundred and you know the game is just totally shifted now there wasn't anything particularly strange about that I mean boy can't had a bad series even by his standards in terms of boundary hitting

but you know you had Gower and both of them and they weren't hitting they were hitting 20 boundaries in the series and that is completely changed and I think that's largely down to 2020 and I just think it's very very exciting now and the

speed at which look the game is always perpetually full of potential you know the you're talking about people changing matches in an hour you know a test match could be turned around in an hour and I only witnessed that

happening maybe two or three times in the whole of my test cricket experience up to that point, which was, you know, let's say both of him in 81. You know, he came in at Old Traffat, which for me was the great innings of that series. And, you know, Tavore scored, I don't know, 10 runs while he scored 120. And he totally changed the game in an hour. And I think that that is happening almost once or twice a test match now. And that makes the game of chess cricket for me much more exciting. So to make sure you don't miss anything for Test Match Special, do subscribe. on BBC Sounds. Classic View from the Boundary on the TMS podcast.

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