Test Match Special - ASHES DAILY: Maxwell and Braithwaite analyse the Ashes action as Carey confides.

Episode Date: July 15, 2023

Australia wicketkeeper Alex Carey speaks in public for the first time about his controversial dismissal of Jonny Bairstow at Lord’s and we get a fascinating take on the Ashes summer from Australia all-rounder Glenn Maxwell and West Indies all-rounder Carlos Brathwaite in conversation with Daniel Norcross.

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. Bring more gear, carry more passengers, face greater challenges. Welcome to the world of Defender, with seating up to eight, ample cargo space and legendary off-road capability. It's built to make the most of every adventure. Learn more at landrover.ca. Hear every ball of every match in the men's and women's ashes live on Radio 5 Sports Extra and BBC Sounds. I'm Daniel Norcross and welcome to The Ashes Daily. Our coverage of the men's and women's ashes continues on BBC Sounds. But in this episode, we will be hearing from Australia's wicketkeeper Alex Carey

on how he'd have no issue in repeating the controversial dismissal that saw Johnny Berto given out at Lords. And we'll get thoughts on the ashes from West Indies All-Rounder Carlos Brathway, an Australia player Glenn Maxwell The TMS podcast Take the Ashes with you this summer Hear Every Ball

Live on BBC Sounds And we are in the middle of a roller coaster Ashes Summer Are you watching this series With a degree of, I don't know, jealousy And thinking, well I wouldn't mind being involved in this Or does it just look too tense and appalling? They probably help ball too fast for me at the moment The fact that they're all going bumper plans

Probably wouldn't help you either So I've thoroughly enjoyed it. I think being an Australian over here, when Australia wins the first test of the summer, it's quite a nice position to be in because I know when it's happened the other way around and England have got up in an Asher series and being the only Australian in a change room full of Englishmen, it's not a nice place to be. And you get reminded about it pretty much in all the walks of life you have. You go down to get a coffee and people are saying things and it's just gone a little bit quiet, I think.

Well, I'm sure you're giving it back because we have a similar but mirrored experience in that we get the very great honour of traipsing around with Jim Maxwell and Glenn McGrath and they are not shy in reminding us that Bazball is ridiculous that Australia are a varsity superior team both morally, physically and in every other way

but that last win for England making it 2-1 and do you think that'll make Australia just think twice about the way England are playing or did they always realise that they were going to be going toe to toe with the side that's pretty evenly matched even if they have a totally different approach to how to play the game?

I think that's the thing. You look at the first three test matches, they're so even. All three of them could have gone in different directions and I think that's just the thing. I feel like both ways of playing are working Australia's dire, dogged sort of, digging in mentality compared to obviously the craziness and sometimes randomness of

basball they've both had their times of being effective and we saw how well harry brooke played in that last innings and headingly but still not able to get them over the line it's just the chaos of basball the thought processes that are going through players heads are sort of being scrambled by how tight the competition is and it's been captivating to watch so i can't take my eyes off it I was just saying we played against Durham both times that the last day of play was happening and I was getting constant updates from the match referee who was wiring it down to the umpires

and telling me it cover and you can't take your eyes off you want to be watching it all times it's just it's great cricket to watch it doesn't matter who's batting, who's bowling there's always something happening there's always a high pressure moment that you just can't take your eyes away from so I've thoroughly enjoyed that

and I'll tell you what I can't not wait for the Manchester test. And I'm going to be home for it. I'm going to be back in Australia and I'm going to be glued to my TV at all hours of the night and pretending that I'm trying to get over jet lag where I'm just, no, no, I'm just watching the test. You know, there's time to become a naturalised Englishman

because you'd be first name on the Basbole team sheet. You know, they wouldn't have gone for Moeen Alley if they'd had Maxwell available. You're a very basball pick. Well, I think they probably still would have because my knees shot to pieces and so's my ankle. Well, England are currently playing with two geriatric opening bowlers, a captain with a locked knee,

a keeper who broke his leg six months ago and a finger spinner without a finger. So I think you'd fit in perfectly to that. Well, when you say it like that, I do have an English passport, so I might... Right. Well, on that bombshell. Now, it's not been a series without talking points.

And, of course, the biggest flare point was... when Alex Carey stumped Johnny Basteo. What was your angle on that? I thought you were going to be talking about Alex Carey's haircut gate or whatever it was. Well, come on to that, yeah. Yeah, I loved it. I actually thought it was brilliant heads-up play, and it was almost a bit typical of Johnny,

sort of just getting so stuck in the moment of just in the contest, not really focused on anything after the ball's already gone past him and just sort of in his own little world, and I think I saw a few, I think even, Michael Vaughan called it dozy cricket and it's I don't think it was dozy cricket I just think he was so fixated on the

contest between bat and ball that he just sort of spaced out for a second and I thought it was brilliant from Alex Carey he'd actually hit the stumps I think when you do that the amount of times I've seen him throw the ball at the stumps and miss it well that's what I thought was very skillful about to actually hit the stamps in a moment where you need to hit him

well there's a bit of footage during the rounds today of him attempting to do that September Bovuma I think in the game against South Lavriga recently. So it's not as if Baxter oughtn't to have been worn. Yeah, what did happen in that incident was that Birsto left his crease pretty much every time at the end of each ball. So sort of given Carey the idea, I'm just what he was doing. So he almost sort of telegraphed to him and to him and sort of went, I'm just going to keep doing this and sort of, well, we played, obviously I played the four-day game

down at Kent the other day and I felt like every batter, I made sure to actually watch how every bad a deal. Whenever the ball went through the keeper, every batter turned around. And before they left their crease, almost put the hand up and before they went and did some guarding. Do you think that's because of the incident? Well, I didn't think about it beforehand, but I think guys are just, all right, that's my little awakening. So there's no, there's no warnings anymore. It's the same thing if you get run out of the bowler's hand before he lets go of the delivery, I think that's on the batters. That's not on the bowler. That's not the bowler's problem if he runs you out.

That's completely on the batter. As soon as someone gets out like that, that's your warning. And then the rules of cricket take over the rest, I think. So that, because there's a very strong attitude against what is called by some people the man cat in England. But is that, in fact, it's the same in Australia. Is there not that feeling? Is there a kind of sense that it's all fair game? When you talk to English pros, it's like a line they tend to draw, rightly or wrongly.

Do Australian pros feel the same way about that? I think for a while, I don't think anyone would do it necessarily in Australia unless you are getting a ridiculous advantage. It's not like if you were three inches out of your crease at the wrong time, you'd do it. It's if you were getting a genuine unfair advantage, and it wouldn't surprise me if it started to happen more

with batters not paying attention to what's going on. So I think you're taught as a kid and even coming through the grades to watch the ball come out of the bowler's hand before you leave the crease. It's a pretty basic principle and I just see so many guys these days that are you head down looking at the other end and as soon as the bowlers sort of starts running in,

they just in their own mind they think, oh, this is about when he would release it and they don't even watch it come out of the hand. So I think it's up to the batters to just be a little bit more heads-up aware and if you don't, it's going to be to the detriment of your innings. And I actually gave a warning to one of the Knotsbatters in a T-20 where he did the same thing. and he walked out two metres before I'd even got into my bowling stride

and I turned around and looked at him and I said what are you doing you can't be that eager to face me like I was like get back in your crease don't let me ruin your day and mine and sure enough after they did he actually watched the ball come out of my hand so I don't think everyone's going to be that friendly with it I think it's going to be a bit more as soon as I see that you go on so it's up to the batters now well Alex Carey has been speaking to the media about that Lord's Best incident for the first time today. The TMS podcast.

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The TMS podcast. Watch highlights of every day of every test on IPlayer. Yeah, we've switched on to the fact that it was Bounce of Plan, And it felt like Johnny was pretty switched on to getting out the way. He wasn't playing any shots there. And when he ducked, he obviously first movement was pretty much out of his crease. So instinctively grabbed the ball through the stumps down and the rest is history, as they say. We walked off at was it tea or lunch and we got some pretty instant feedback.

But yeah, look, I guess it's one of those things. where a stumping that's given out on field is turned into a massive story. I guess everyone is entitled to their opinion and absolutely respect that. And then everyone's entitled to their opinion on the spirit of cricket as well. So, no, personally, the support that I've been given here amongst the group and not just myself, I guess the whole group's had some stuff spoken about them. But no, we're really tight. We understand, I guess, what's important and who matters,

and those guys definitely have our back. Now, there's a few chance that I was actually, yeah, humming along to while I was batting, just trying to change the words a little bit. But, no, look, it is the ashes. We've got to remember, and we've had some amazing crowds. And my first experience was edge busting, and it's probably lucky. I don't feel it on the fence. There probably would have been some words said about me out there anyway.

I guess we love coming over here playing cricket. We love playing the Ashes and my first experience in England has been amazing. Do I love the booze? Oh, it is what it is, yeah. Just a little bit of fuel added onto the fire now which is exciting for the group to go out and play cricket and really just focus on what we can control and yeah, that's not the chance, I guess. Knowing what you know from a couple weeks ago, you'd do it all yet?

If there was an opportunity to get a stamping year, I would. What happened after that incident, immediately after the incident, was that it looked like Stuart Broad was absolutely outraged. Ben Stokes went into a zone, didn't get involved at all, and then Stuart Broad appeared to be suggesting to some of the Australian players that what they'd done was not just unsportsmanly, but was caddish and evil and mount a banker-bankery gone mad. and that they would be remembered for this

and all the booze that were ringing around. Do you think that's affected the spirit between the two teams or do you think it's all just pantomime? The ashes needed a little bit of needle and they all know that that's sort of nonsense. I think it's pretty standard showmanship from Stuart Broad. I think he even spoke about it after the game that, yeah, he might have carried on a little bit

but it actually got him into the contest. So for him, he needs a little bit of that controversy in the game to get him, up and going and even going back to when was it 2013 when he basically late cut one to first slip well off off the keeper's fine yeah whatever gets gets given not out and all of the sudden he gets into that gets into that partnership Michael Clark starts going at him the Australian start getting aggressive at him and it gets him into the contest he needs a little bit of that competition in the in the game to get him going and if there's nothing going on the game you can

almost sort of see his effect to fall away on the england side and just why it's so important for him to get those early dismissals it gets him into the game and it gets england up and going but ben stokes was just purely focused on his job at hand he was so determined to get england into a strong position and and keep him in the game how do you think it's affected the likes of pat Cummins, Alex Carey and Cameron Green, who are three of the loveliest guys in the Australian side. And I know the English love to hate Australians, but the villains are people like David Warner.

You know, you can get your heads around. David Warner is a villain, like Stuart Broad is the villain for Australians. But Cameron Green, surely not. We've got Carlos Brothwaite who's joining us here. We chat about this year's Ashes so far, with the series beautifully poised at 2-1. And I just asked about Cummins, and Green and Carey.

And those are three of the least likely villains, aren't they? Australian cricket. I just can't imagine a world where anyone would hate Alex Carey. It just makes me uncomfortable. I just genuinely uncomfortable. He's probably the nicest person I've ever met in the world. And Cameron Green's right up there as well. And then to sort of see them portrayed as a villains after all that,

it was hard to watch. But I know Alex Carey took that really to heart. I did take that very well at all, and I suppose it's just in his nature. He's normally just such a nice, well-natured person who, great manners, lovely person, very nice to everyone he meets, doesn't sledge anyone,

doesn't sort of get in the way of the opposition, just goes about his own business, and I don't think he would have ever been the villain in any walk of life, I think, in his whole career. It is a particularly peculiar Australian team in that respect, Carlos Brathaway, isn't it? That we love to create these endmet, between the two sides.

But actually both sides have got, they know each other so well from the T20 franchise cricket but the likes of you know Chris Wokes and Mark Wood. It's hard to create villains here. Yeah, but I feel when you cross the line

is just whoever bad you're playing for a Redis franchise and more importantly international. And it's kind of a parallel universe. Maxie and the Aussies coming into Tongue as the good boys and the English being the ones to be ultra aggressive and throw the

first punch as it may. So it's made for a good series, a good watch from Zimbabwe watching the World Cup Qualifers and commentating on it. Everyone was so excited to get back to the hotel to watch the back end of games, you're tuning.

You never wanted to miss anything. You always felt as though every session was going to be a session where the tight turned and it just so happened that you can never ever predict where the game game was going to go and it kept us in a little bit of a lurch for as long as possible and there's been three amazing test matches for us the contrast in stars is incredible because Australia's way of playing is almost what should be kryptonite to basball

basball is all about trying to make time in the game by batting hard in Australia are almost playing chicken with england by batting as long as humanly possible to say how hard are you going to go to try to make this a game it was very noticeable at edge baston and And England sort of maintained that they won a moral victory there because they were the only side, you know, trying to press for the victory. But weren't they just brilliantly suckered by Australia? Well, it was brilliant from Pat Cummins. I think he identified a moment in the game where he thought it was key.

It was either boom or bust. And to take on Joe Root at that time was absolutely spot on timing. It was almost like Australia had waited until that moment. I think it was day four. Like rope a dope. It was like day four on just, you know what? Bassball, they're going to give us a chance. They're going to open a door for us,

and we thought they did that with their early declaration. Or it was just like, no, no, no, we're done bad, and you can have it, even though Joe Root's on 120. No, no, you can bat. And then the door sort of closes again. You get Marnis and smudge out early, and all of a sudden that door closes again. So they're sort of almost just waiting for their opportunity

to win the game. And they bowl Joe Root and extra over, and Pat Cummins goes, here it is. That's our chance. This is our chance to win the game and gets a couple away, and all of a sudden, they just get a bit of momentum towards the back end. the drop catch off Nathan Lyon just creates a little bit more drama and they just kept finding a way to find a boundary

and you could almost just sort of see Bazball just starting to fall apart there's just little cracks sort of forming and then for them to come out and say it's a moral victory at the end of the game and for Australia not to buy into it whatsoever they just went you know what we'll just we'll take the actual victory instead of the moral one we're more than happy to be one-nill up and you can be one-nill in the moral ash it so that's fine um so I I thought it was just a brilliant set up for the rest of the series

and then to go down the Lords. I'm so glad there was some controversy because it just created more headlines. There was distraction for Basball. There was like, oh, don't worry about our way of playing. Just concentrate on this distraction. And I thought it was brilliant theatre the whole game. Well, Lords needs that, doesn't it?

Because it can be quite a soporific crowd. I mean, many of them spending time in the Harris Garden, chatting away and just sort of exchanging business cards when there's an actual cricket match taking place. at the start of every series everyone imagines well it's going to be this team against this team talk about the impact that Cameron Green's going to make on the tournament and Jimmy Anderson on English pitches

well we end up aheadingly with England winning the game in large part because the contributions of two guys who didn't appear in either of the first two games Chris Wokes and Mark Wood Wood with his pace Wokes was undeniably tricky in English conditions and lengthening England's batting order

suddenly the dynamics have changed a bit haven't they Carlos yeah I think there's a little it's probably a little bit more squad death

but in England you always think that you know Chris Wilkes top cricketer probably one of my favorite cricketers and his record

at home versus away there's a big disparity so you always think or no it might be more squad death but in England the squad death

has always been there I think it's a little bit more belief I'd probably like to see the Aussies be a bit more aggressive with the bat in general I think Cummins is a good leader and there was a couple of times especially in the half I think it was the first test

and the second test Ollie Robinson had his comments in the media as soon as he came out to bat I wanted to see Cam Green on around the wicket everybody behind two short legs and let him have it because it's a five match series which you're not pleasureed with more often or not in modern times.

And that sets the tone for the rest of the series. You think back to Headingley and how long they took to go to the short ball plan, which worked to treat at large. So I think Australia will win because they are the better team. They're the best test team in international cricket without a shadow of a doubt. But much like Maxi just said, you'd get nothing for moral victory. but I think England are getting the most out of their resources. It was noticeable, wasn't it, Glenn,

that the last pitch was much, much quicker than Edgebaston. The Lord's Edgebaston was painfully slow, very difficult to prize wickets out towards the back end of that match. And suddenly, aheadingly, everything happened more quickly. And in the nature of this bizarro series where everything's turned on its head, it's England that has the fastest bowler on either side. It's England that seems to want to play on quick, bouncy wicket.

and it's Australia who are prospering on slower, lower wickets. What's going on? Well, I think Nathan Lyons also a huge loss for the Australians. I think what he's able to do, he's able to get things out of pitches that don't necessarily happen for most other spinners. He's able to spin it on glass. He's got so many revs on the ball. He gets bounce.

And that was probably one thing that we knew that Todd Murphy doesn't have as much spin on the ball, but it has amazing accuracy. and if there's not that much help for him, England might go a little bit harder and they might try and take him out of the attack. They're putting pressure on a young player and I thought they played that beautifully. They put him under immense pressure

and actually put another question back into the Australian dressing room and then you throw in Mark Wood bowling extreme pace putting all the best players of the Australian team under pressure with raw speed, accuracy. It's all good well in bowling 150Ks an hour, but if you're still bowling full of Australia at the stumps, putting pressure on guys' defense. It just shows the quality that he is

and probably something they might have missed for the first two tests on pitches that are a little bit slow and a little bit of variable bounce, which is why the bouncer plan works so well. They needed it here. They did. At that back end, I mean,

prized out eight Australia wickets. It was noticeable. They didn't really, even though they had a new ball available, they didn't trust themselves to get wickets conventionally with a new ball. So they kept on banging it in, but banging it in at 80 miles an hour He's very different from banging it in at 90 miles and out.

Now, I've got to ask you about the other conundrum Australia have surely got, which is, and you, as both of you as all rounders, be able to speak to this, having brought in Mitchell Marsh, and he's got one of the great Ashes hundreds. I mean, that was such a knock. 118 of 118 when almost no one else was getting a substantial innings in that test match,

notwithstanding Ben Stokes' thrash at the end of England's first innings. He also contributed with the ball, And yet Cameron Green was this great hope at the start of the summer. Is there a way of playing both? And if not, who are you keeping for Old Trafford? Start with you, Glenn. Well, I'm not sure I should comment on this. I'd love to see them both play.

I think they're both absolute superstars. I think Cameron Green's got a little bit of point of difference to Mitch. I think he's a little bit quick out. I can go through those spells, as Carlos said before, bounces around the wicket, put some pressure on. the England batters. Mitch is more of a pitcher up, try and swing it,

put some pressure on the front foot defence and put pressure around that off-stump. So they're completely different bowlers, but I think what Mitch has in his favour, he's probably our best player of extreme pace bowling. We saw the pull shots he was playing off Mark Wood, 50 metres in front of square on the leg side going miles back. There's not many people in the world

that can do that consistently against high-quality fast bowling. And he's certainly the one in Australian cricket where it's very well known, you do not drop short to Mitchell Marsh. Like, you just cannot physically drop short. Doesn't matter how much pace you've got, he will be all over you. So how do you... He changed the momentum of that game. How do you leave him out?

And how do you leave him out after that inning? And if you're not leaving him out, are you getting Cameron Green back in? Well, my answer is I'm not leaving him out, point blank. So it's between Todd Murphy and Cameron Green. Oh, so you are. So perhaps have no front-line spinner and rely on Travis Head. potentially, but Old Trafford Spins, isn't it? Traditionally, so Todd Murphy probably would be eking ahead of Cam Green.

Look, he has a fantastic career ahead of him. Any doubts that or any questions that were being asked after a couple of Australian summers were answered in the IPL or vice versa. So you know that there's a fantastic talent there. However, you don't want someone coming into the team and thinking they have a play unchallenged. to you've got Mitch Marsh in the team now. It doesn't mean he'll be there for the next five years.

Cam Green could very well be there for the next 10 years. But now he has to continue to work hard day in, day out, and push Mitch Marsh to reclaim that all wrong the spot that everyone thinks should be given to him. I think that's good for Australian cricket. No one deserves a play. None of us have done enough that we deserve a selection. So that's that competition is good, I reckon.

I think this is a little bit left field, but I think especially against Basball, you can actually probably get some overs out of a guy like Marner Or I think you can actually play on the ego of Bazball a little bit. I think as a part-time bowl when you come on against Basball, they're thinking instantly in their head, this has got to go for more than 15 runs and over. So if you set a one-day field and go,

let's see if you want to milk six singles and it over. We're still going to try and attack you. We're going to expect you to try and take on our boundary fielders. And at Old Traffat, if there is any sort of variable spin, a little bit of bounce, whatever it might be. Manus is a good enough bowler. He still gets some revs on the ball. He still can bowl a decent legy.

He actually might not be the worst option, I think. Knowing Marinus, bowling seam, leg, spin, asking, he were trying to ball left. He was trying to ball left. I'm going to go for another even more left field option, which is Australia are 2-1-up. If they draw this next test, they retain the ashes. And there might be a bit of weather around.

The forecast is a bit iffy. Why not? Dangerous. That is. Why not have four seamers and Todd Murphy, but your four seamers are green and Marsh and Cummins and Stark or Stark or Hazelwood. So you've still got four seamers, you've still got a spin option,

but you bat all the way down. I mean, if it's Stark and Cummins, you basically, Tom Murphy can hold a bat, then Murphy's at 11 in that lineup. Cummins at 10, Stark 9, Green 8, well, be Cary 8, wouldn't it? But Martian Green at 6 and 7. And, you know, Australia don't have to make the running.

They're 2-1-up. Yeah, and if there's anything that Australia needs there's probably a few extra runs at the moment. I think, although I'd be very surprised if Marnas and Steve Smith missed out this test. I think they're both extremely hungry. I think that nine-day break would have done him good. It probably wouldn't have done Michael Divenuto,

the batting coach, any good. He would have been a busy man over that period, and they'll be super focused and ready to go, I think, come Manchester. We obviously know Steve Smith made a brilliant double hundred there in 2019, so he'll be hungry and excited to get back to that ground. No danger of David Warner being left out I mean it's starting to come a bit dark

The way Stuart Broad comes on and nicks him off He's had a couple of useful contributions Not at least at Lords where The time he batted was as important as a run as he scored But there's no danger that they might think Well we can leave him out and rejig the order Find a different open Wow it's a big question

I would suggest maybe Lavashane Marnas will do anything when Do you want to go Glenn? I certainly do not want to go. That would be the answer to Baswell, wouldn't it? Let's get a guy who hasn't played a test in, what, six years. Well, he did it with Mowen Alley, didn't they? So why not?

That was fair enough, though. Moen Alley, bowling beautifully. We really enjoyed him being back here at Birmingham for the four games. He was here. I think we were four in, and then he came in, started winning the toss, and we lost three out of the next four. So we escorted, we dropped Mowin back down the test side and off he went and don't come back yeah he uh no he was always welcome back but

it was just it was so good to actually see him get put up to number three as well i think that was actually a really bold and correct decision from do you think he'll stay there for the old chapid test i don't think he will but i think in a second inning's position like that where they've clearly got a motive to how they want him to play and how they want him to take on the conditions i think it's it's a nice way to get him to the game i think that's seven or eight he he he's sometimes looks yeah like he's

I'm batting with the tail or am I hanging around where if he's at number three he's like you know

what I've got a free license to bat however I want and if he plays a bad shot no one no one better's

an eyelid and I'll try a spaniant works we think of this era on the Owen Morgan

he talked think about Morgan Butler Stokes all the heroes that are casted

and I look at Chris Wokes Moynali Liam Plankett the ones that don't get

the plot but always do the dirty work So you probably won't remember this Chris Walk's test when everyone talks about the 2023 Ashes, much like Simon Jones is the afterthought of the 2005. But those men are as integral to the way that England play

and how successful England have been. So if Moenali needs to go about at three, he's good enough, he will be successful because he finds a way and he's that man that is flexible enough to do anything at any time and he wants to do it for the best of the team. So I wouldn't be surprised if to do it again, if he's the person, as he didn't in the last game, to actually want to do it and push for himself to do it.

Predictions, not really predictions, but how important is a chasing to basball, Carlos? Because it's interesting, isn't it, when Ben Stokes says, we're going to chase? Yeah, I think it's a comfort zone. Good in white ball cricket, excellent chaser. He's never feel as doing anything is beyond their remit. And with the bat in red ball cricket,

they think they can employ that same approach. And when you think about it, you set the field back, you just run easy tools, very fit, very athletic, very skillful. And if you bring the field up, I mean, there's the same for every team. But you look at the way England player, whiteball, cricket, how successful they have been, and they employ that exact tactic in the fourth innings of a test, the belief and the skill set and the level of thinking they have,

and the flexibility and the confidence that they put amongst our dressing room there's no reason why they are as successful as they are however with ball in hand is a little trickier I'm not sure if they are skillful enough as a unit yet minus obviously Anderson and Broad

to be able to win games in the fourth innings especially without our main spinner having to bring back a moin alley so that's why they're chasing is it Glenn yeah I tend to agree with that I think without their first choice spinner available for them and to have that confidence in someone to bowl

25, 30 overs on the final day and either hold up and end or create some chances, I think it just makes it a little bit an easy decision for them to chase but I suppose the other thing is what if they have to follow on in the second inning they've just ruined their whole

techniques in the first place, so Australia had never enforced the follow one. Not a chance. The TMS podcast. Watch highlights of every day of every test on eye player. That was Australia's Glenn Mackey and that Men's Ashes series resumes on Wednesday with Test Mat Special back on air at 1025.

Before that, we have the climax of the Women's Ashes with the ODIs on TMS on Sunday and Tuesday, plus TV highlights on BBC 2 from 11pm. And plenty to check out on BBC Sounds, including The Ashes Hour, hearing how TMS described classic Ashes moments. No Balls with Alex Hartley and Kate Cross and Tail Enders with Greg James, James Anderson and Felix White. F1. Red flag? Red flag. Directed to the pits.

Red flag. Red flags to slow down. What? Are they restart this? I can imagine they will. Get expert analysis and reaction with five lives check at flag podcast. The applause is going to Max Verstappen who crosses the line. F1.

Available now on BBC Sounds.