Test Match Special - Ben Stokes retires from One Day International cricket

Episode Date: July 20, 2022

Simon Mann is joined by England fast bowling trio Mark Wood, James Anderson and Saqib Mahmood to reflect on the One Day International career of Ben Stokes, who has announced his retirement from the format. We also hear from Stokes, who explains the reasoning behind his decision, with further analysis from his World Cup winning teammate Chris Woakes.

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. The Dakar Rally is the ultimate off-road challenge. Perfect for the ultimate defender. The high-performance defender, Octa, 626 horsepower twin turbo V8 engine and intelligent 6D dynamics air suspension. Learn more at landrover.ca. This is the TMS podcast from BBC Radio 5 Live. I'm Simon Mann. Welcome to a bonus TMS podcast reflecting on the one-day international career of Ben Stokes,

who's announced his retirement from the format. We'll hear from Stokes himself and also get reaction from his World Cup-winning teammates, Mark Wood and Chris Wokes, as well as Jimmy Anderson, Saki Bermood, and our cricket correspondent, Jonathan Agnew. But first, we're going to relive Stokes' finest moment in a One Day international shirt and head back to the final over of England's dramatic run-endom. chase in the World Cup final against New Zealand in 2019, when Stokes had the weight of the nation's hopes resting on his shoulders. Here's Bolt. The start of the final over. He runs in smoothly. He bowls to Stokes as a lovely full ball. He digs it out and they're not going to take a run there. It's the right decision. He's got to stay on strike. He's got to think four boundaries, three boundaries. If Bolt gets one on length, he's got to clear it over long long. If it's

full, he might be able to glide it past those four fielders on the. offside for a four. I think the only real time I sat to panic was when the first two balls are last over with dots. Five balls to go, 15 needed, bolts on the way, bolts to Stokes and hammers out again to the edge of the circle, straight to the man. 227 for eight, 15 needed. What can Stokes do, bolts on his way, bolts him, that's a length, and he heaves it away into the leg side. That's going to go for six. What a shot. I've never ever played a sweep shot off the Seema before, so I've got absolutely no idea

why I thought to play that shot. Well, well, Ben Stokes. He's the fiercest of competitors. I've faced Trent quite a lot at the end of innings. When he misses as Yorker, it's generally a full toss. That was probably going through. Honestly, I can't fully remember, but I thought if I get down and sweep it,

then can just sort of take the pace and hopefully it would go. Oh, my. 233, nine off three. In goes bolt. It's a full toss. Swiped into the leg side. They want to get two here, surely. Come on, Adil Rashine.

Run. Stokes for the far end. He's desperately getting there. Oh, oh, he's going to fall! Now, that came off Stokes. If it goes to fall, there's nothing they can do about it. That's four. There's nothing they can do about it.

Stoats is saying to the umpard, don't let it count, but it does count. You get a tell from the keeper, you know, where he stood, because obviously the keeper comes straight up to the stunts and a situation like that, and he didn't move. So I knew that I'm going to have to get out a dive here to give myself any chance whatsoever to get in here. You know, I just got to a point where I thought this is where I'm going to have to dive.

Stokes is diving for his ground. The throw hit him absolutely accidentally and ricocheted the boundary. Hit his bat. You know, you could never, ever see that happen again from a 70-hour boundary to hit my bat and go for four. It was a very unfortunate thing to happen, but you just can't do things about that. But the way that, I think New Zealand played throughout the whole tournament and the way that They are known for playing led by Kane. There's no complaints about it whatsoever.

And I said to Kane, and I'll be apologising about that for a long, long time. That is a freak. Three from two, but two ties it. The amount of thought and effort I put into constructing that innings and the processes that I went through, I wouldn't have been able to do five years ago, definitely not. But that comes from experience, that comes from playing, and that comes from being in situations like that similar

over the four years that we've done. had together as a one day two ties it and there'll be a super over if that's the way it stays three to win bolt goes in and bolts to stokes who hammers it down the ground they're running they're running and rashid's coming back for the second surely the throw comes in and is run out stokes is on strike can stokes hit two to win and if it goes through to the keeper wood's got to run set the stokes here at the time i says look no matter what happens i'm just going to run because if he missed it we need to get one and he just completely ignored me his eyes were like big and glazed over he was so in the zone there was probably the only

time where actually probably thought about what stage the game was at because before that it was just trying to get as many runs as you can whereas that ball was if i get out here in terms of hit one in the air and out we lose we don't win the world club here's the last ball of the match two needed to win for england bolt runs in bottles to stokes a low full toss he pushed it down the ground and wood's going to run the second here they come up to the north strikers and he's got her out of He's run out. The match is tied. Oh, he's out.

He's out by two metres, I reckon. Stokes through his back. Wood was absolutely full length, desperately trying to get in his ground. He was run out. It looked to be a fair one from here. The unpowers will check it. Oh, my word.

When I look back on that moment at the end of my career, I will be happy with my decision because I made it before the ball was bowed. I consciously said to myself, keep this along the floor because at worst, you're going to get one. Even if I hit it straight to a field on the ring, I knew you were going to get one. He said that mid-wicket was a bit squarer. So if he'd get into mid-wicket's right, just to the left of mid-on, he was back on me to get back for two. But he says he almost hit it too perfect to mid-on that I didn't really have a chance.

It's one over. Yeah, England bat first. England back first. They're allowed three bats, in other words, two wickets. And it's simply the runs. They score. The ground staff are coming out. I was still emotionally caught up and what had already happened.

I was disappointing that I didn't manage to get the two runs that we needed to win. So I was still carrying a bit of that with me. And then when I got told I was going back out to playing the Superover, I knew that I couldn't be in this mindset going out there to try and get us a good score. So, yeah, I just had to go out the back of the changing rooms at Lourdes into the shower area and just be by myself for like five minutes and gather my thoughts because I had to get out of the emotions that I was in. because it wasn't the right place for someone to be in, to go out

and try and do what me and Josh had to do. So doing that just sort of allowed me to forget everything and really focus on the next 10 minutes, which was probably the biggest stage in my career today, which is a super over in the World Cup final. And we know what happened after that, of course, England, winning that super over in dramatic fashion. Ben Stokes talking about the final over of England's run chase,

joined the World Cup final three years ago with Owen Morgan's side going on to beat New Zealand. So Ben Stokes has announced his retirement from one day international cricket. There is a World Cup next year in India, England with a chance to defend that trophy. They won three years ago, but Stokes will not be there.

And he has been speaking today to Henry Rann about his decision. Okay, Ben, I suppose the first question is, why now? Well, that's just one of those things you know. everyone say that when you know you know and you know it's obviously not an easy decision to make but there's a lot of things that you know I considered was you know longevity in a sport I want to be playing as long as I possibly can see now being the test captain you know that's where you know my sort of just everything is that for me at the moment I was always going to have to choose one of the white ball formats to to stop playing and then you know focus on the other as well as test

cricket but yeah after the first game against India at the Oval it just sort of hit me that you know it's it's going to have to be this format because not being able to go out there and give everything that I can you know I've been an all-rounder with the bat and ball and you know I must feel like I have to look after myself for games in the future is not what the England shirt deserves. It deserves 100% from anyone who ever puts a shirt on. So with that, and then also feeling like I'm stopping someone else coming to the team and progress themselves as a player and go on and create some amazing memories like I've managed to do over the last 11 years with an amazing group of players.

Yeah, and all that considered it was right times now. And so it was, as recently as that series just gone, that suddenly it all, started coming together in your mind yeah I didn't think it would be I didn't know which which one it would be but I guess when it yeah as I say when you know when you know you know yeah this is a special place for it all to be wrapping up what are your memories of coming here when playing for England was still quite some way away still a distant dream yeah look Durham gave me you know my first opportunity you know back and when I was younger on the academy and then

progressed through onto the you know to represent them First-class cricket. It's amazing that it sort of worked out this way. And Joss and Mottie were unbelievable when I told them what I was doing. And I asked if they wouldn't mind if I could play the first game in the series, as is at Durham. And that'd be my last game. And they just said, yeah, absolutely it wasn't even a doubt on their mind.

So it's very nice to them, very nice for me to know that I'll be playing here. Because when he played two games here for England since the start of playing, so yeah to walk out wearing the England shirt on this ground where everything's that for me is very special do you expect to find that quite an emotional experience uh I don't know I have to wait and see I guess but I guess it because I've still got the other two formats now that I'm going to still be playing in and putting all my efforts into it's you know it's not like I've never playing again so but yeah it's just knowing that I won't be in this format anymore with some unbelievable people in that dressing room who I played so many games with.

You know, that's the sad side of it all. But on the other side, it's now I know that, you know, I can give my 100% to the test team, as I always do, and now 100% to the T20 side going forward rather than what I felt like I was doing was 100% test, 50% one day is 50% T20s because I was trying to look after myself for, you know, longevity and stuff like that, which just, yeah, didn't sit well with me. You've spoken about an unsustainable schedule. What do you mean by that? Well, I just feel like there's just too much sort of cricket rammed in

for people to play all three formats, you know, now. It's a lot harder than what I think it used to be. I look back when I was doing all three, it didn't feel like it was just jam-packed and everything like that. So, you know, obviously you want to play as much cricket as you possibly can, but when it's making you feel tired and sore and you've got to look towards, I don't know, five, six months down the road of what you're doing in the here and now,

it's probably not the best thing. But yeah. Should it be a bit of a wake-up call to the authorities that players are having to pick and choose and think about what they can commit to, considering the amount of cricket there is? I don't know, I guess so. I mean, look, you know, obviously the more cricket's played, the better for the sport.

But obviously, you want a product that's of the highest quality. You want the best players that are playing as much as you possibly can all the time. And, you know, it's not just us or me. You know, you see it all around the world now where teams are having to, you know, rest some players in a certain series. So then, you know, they feel like they're getting the break. But, you know, I just said, but not cars, but you can't just fill us. up and then we'll go off and out there and then wait to be filled up again. You know, it's, yeah.

I mean, you know, we had a test series going on and then the one day team had a series going on at the same time. Yeah, that was a bit silly. For you, 50 over cricket has had one remarkable high. Is that going to be the moment that you will be able to look back on and think, you know what, I gave that format everything? Yeah, look, obviously that one day final, lifting that World Cup was an amazing day. but I think it goes back further than just that one day

that four years we had as a team after from 2015 that whole ride that whole journey that we shared together to get to that one day that's what I'll look back on not just that day everything that we managed to do before that the records we broke the way that we changed 50 over cricket for everybody that four years is what I look back on

and then that resulted in in us lifting that trophy in 2019. I've had some amazing memories with some amazing people in that dressing room. So yeah, nothing but good memories along the road, there'll be some ups and downs, but I've thoroughly enjoyed the 104 games that I've played for England in this format.

It's been incredible. How confident are you in the success of this England team going forward in 50 over cricket? Very, you know, they've got a leader in Josh Butler who epitomises everything that we want to be as a white ball team. You know, he's got the experience of being vice captain to Owen for a number of years

and he gives everything he can. You know, he's a very selfless cricketer, selfless man and a selfless captain. And he's going to drive this team forward in the same way that Owen did, but in his own fashion. You know, he's going to impose himself with his personality in the way that he wants. and everyone who walks out on the field

and the Joss Butler will give him everything because he's a man that you follow by the way that he plays the game and he's just respected by everybody. Did you think about making it a temporary decision and perhaps leave the door open for ICC events? You obviously think about stuff like that, but what I don't want to be doing is saying,

nah, don't play that, and then when saying an ICC event comes up, yeah, because this gives us an amazing opportunity for someone to come in, get experience and then hopefully go and win that World Cup again like we managed to do in 2019. You know, it wouldn't be fair on anybody who gets that opportunity with me now not playing this format. To then just all of a sudden be like, oh yeah, I'll come back. You know, it's not what it's about, you know, it's someone else has turned now to go out

and try and progress themselves as a player in this format. You know, the talent that we've got sitting on the sidelines at the moment is something as well that I looked at saying that him there would be out here giving Josh absolutely everything and you know I've not been able to do that over the last three games unfortunately and just finally it says quite a lot about test cricket that you're showing this commitment to that format of the game and clearly the start you've had as captain and the way it's gone you're loving it yeah test cricket's always been you know the absolute pinnacle for me it's you know that's where everything is for me now with obviously being test captain it's

even not more important but it's a lot more to think about so you know that's where that's where that's where I wanted the longevity thing to come in because I want to be playing till I'm 35 36 at least and I spoke with Stuart Broad and I asked him I said when he stopped playing whiteball cricket is that a huge reason as to why you're still playing now and he said undoubtedly yes so hopefully when I'm still playing at 36 I can look back on this moment here and say like there was a big reason as to why I'm so able to get out on the park and represent England and test cricket. Well, that was Ben Stokes, speaking to Henry Moran before play today.

We heard Ben Stokes talking about that final ball of the World Cup final. He was batting across with Mark Wood, who's alongside me now. What are your thoughts, Mark, about Ben Stokes retiring? Were you surprised when you heard the news? Yeah, I was surprised. I was sad more than anything, I would see. the fact that I'm not going to play with them in this format again

at the age you're at, I didn't expect him to stop I mean you don't expect him to stop at all really stokes you if I'm honest but yeah I just feel a bit sad to be honest that's my overriding feeling on it it's just I thought that he 50 over World Cup and want to defend that and I know he's a legend and icon

probably across all forms but you know when you think back the World Cup final that's iconic isn't it he'll always be remembered for that. So it's a sad day that he'll not be playing this format anymore. The right decision for him, though, it seems. Oh, yeah, I can understand it. You know, you don't want him to give 80% in test cricket,

80% in 2020 and 80% in 50% of us. I think the kind of guy that he is, he has to give 100% in absolutely everything he does, whether it's training or playing. And with the schedule, it just seems a bit mental to think that, you know, he could be throwing everything into it as a test captain, and that's a completely different team for the ODIs. and he can't get there

so I think the scheduling has probably made the decision easier for him. For me, I think if you think back to maybe even a year or two ago like if he wasn't captain, maybe then he would have stuck at it a little bit more

but seeing what's happened of his good pal Rudy and knowing that by the end Rudy was exhausted and seeing other nations and other players do it and you know choose different formats it's probably just helped his decision

to know look he can can still give 100% test match cricket, still give 100% in 2020, but this is the one that has to go for him. You said there that players aren't like cars. You can't just sort of fill them up with petrol and sort of send them back out again. Is that perhaps the biggest message yet

about the cricket schedule that it needs to be looked at? Or is it just one of those things that actually, you cannot play across three formats? There's enough cricket for everybody in a way. You have a big squad and a squad of players you can feel your team. but actually it's just unrealistic to expect one player to play all three formats. Well, I'd like to play all three still.

Obviously, I say that as a man that is currently injured and has a poor injury record. But, I mean, I would still love to try and defend that 50 over if I could. I think it is becoming harder with the schedules. You just, you can't, there's no way I can go from bowling 25 to 30 overs trying to bowl 90 mile an hour you know for four or five days of cricket and then two days later I'd be playing 50 over cricket and then three days later another series and then 2020s

then straight back into test matches it's just not going to work so I sort of I understand why he has stopped I totally get it I just feel sad about it it's not a criticism of him or anything and actually I respect him as a person not just as a cricketer to be brave enough

to make that decision and say look this this is going to prolong me career this is going to make me better in the other former So you've got to say fair enough. How much does it undermine England's defence of the World Cup in 14, 15 months' time? He was such a pivotal member of the side that won it. It's going to be hard enough as it is, going to India to try to defend it. Yeah.

Is it a huge loss for England? It's a big loss, obviously, him and Morgan are huge loss. I mean, I blame Josh Butler. He's getting rid of people left right in Sunner, isn't he? No, I think, look, it'll be anything. any team without Stokesy and it's a big loss. It was a big loss without Morgie. I thought obviously he was,

what captain would defend that, but obviously he's not going to be there. Now we're off probably one main player or our best player. So yeah, it's a huge chance, but it gives other people opportunity. We've got big depth in across England white ball cricket at the minute. So it gives someone else a chance. But nobody fills Stokesy's shoes, really,

when you think about it. Like, who else is going to bat ball and feel like he does? yeah it's tough yeah it seems like an absurd question in a way isn't it are England going to miss him of course they're going to miss him a player of that quality but I suppose if you can't give 100% if you feel you can't give 100%

to it you know perhaps there is a player there some like Liam Livingston might step up not quite the same sort of player because he spins rather than bowl's pace who actually probably possibly can give a hundred percent to it yeah and I think that was the main thing I got

from what he said was that he wanted to be able to the team everything and like you say if he can't give 100 percent that would play

it on his personality as much as anything else he wouldn't just he wouldn't accept it if he was

let or feels like he's letting the team down in some way he definitely wouldn't be I mean

even 80% of Stokes he is more than enough but he would feel like if it's not

his best or what he can give on the day is his best then he certainly wouldn't want to just keep pushing it

for the sake of it So it's not something you would consider doing because you want to play as much as possible? Not at the minute. I mean, I've missed enough cricket to want to say, oh, well, I'll just play one or the other. I think at the minute I've got to get my own priorities right. Stokes, he's got that luxury because he's England test captain plus. He's played so much cricket through this last period that he can almost say, look, I've worked hard for this and I've seen myself going through the 2020 route and one

else because he'll still be a huge part of that it's not like he's giving up one day cricket i just feel like the test i just feel like the test competency has played a huge role in this um he if you take over the test match job it isn't he's not just a test match player anymore he's got all the other stuff to deal with and be a part of and that energy will take away from that as well so he's going to have to have more energy to do that job than just you know what he's had before. So that's probably where it feels like it's just I guess doubling it down a bit if he plays

everything because it'll not mean that he's so energetic so Ben Stokes like I guess if he if he does everything. What is all that stuff behind the scenes? Just give people an insight into what you have to do as test cap it's not just about going out there and leading

the side on the field and obviously trying to produce dominating performances as well what's all that stuff behind the scenes? So it's just the Well, pressure has one, but the other thing, it's like team selection, making sure everyone's okay training patterns, training plans, getting the right people in place off the field. You know, Rudy was doing so much at one point where it was just like,

he's just not just the captain on the field. He's almost like a second team manager behind closed doors. And eventually that just wears you down, you know, when you've got to, you're trying to build a good team culture, you're trying to get plans in place, you're planning ahead for the next series. COVID hit, all that kind of stuff. You could see, I mean, COVID won't be

hopefully an issue for Stokesy, but you can still see that there might be issues that cropped up for him that will take his gaze away that aren't just on the field. There'll be other stuff behind closed doors that he has to look at. You know, he's got himself as a brand as well. He's not just Ben Stokes

you know, cricket. He's got these other endorsements and himself. You know, he's got other things that people want his time and things that. So he's got to just spread it out as best he can. Yeah, and that's a good point actually, isn't it? You don't see all those other things.

You're sort of required to do as England, Captain, all the events you have to turn up for because you are the figurehead of the English game. Yeah. Just on, you heard you talking there about the World Cup final, you were out there for the last ball. I don't know whether you replay it back in your mind. Never.

After that dive, never again. Because he had the chance to biff that ball into the stand, didn't he, off Trent Bolt. but he said they're very explicitly I just needed to keep this along the ground to make sure we at least got one I mean great thinking but I still blame him you know

he'd been hitting full on Yorkers sweeping him into the crowd for six he gets a full toss he knocks it down the ground I mean it was great thinking at the time really I mean I'm only joking great thinking that it's just the execution if he could have gotten it a little bit wider of midwicked just to mid-on's left

I might have had a chance but he nailed it directly at mid-on and I just couldn't get back yeah he sort of dead battered it to sort of mid-on because the long on field were out to come in then you might have had chance to get up and down how much were you at your crease as he bowed that ball I actually wasn't at all that I'll tell you why actually as he was running in which is it's mental

but when you're under pressure you think about a million things so I was thinking don't get man-catted make sure that you're on like the good part of the pitch to run on make sure you turn and you sprint and you dive like all these things were going through my head well actually I could have maybe pinched a couple yards if I'd been switched on but I was so you know, nervous that I didn't want to, you know, mess it up.

Well, it was just as well you were run out because it gave us the superover drama as well. Thank you. Cheers. Thanks, sir. This is the TMS podcast from BBC Radio 5 Live. Thanks to Mark Wood, England and Durham teammate of Ben Stokes, reacting there to the news that Stokes will no longer play one day international cricket for England, following his decision to retire from the format.

Well, we can also hear from fellow England fastballers, Jimmy Anderson and Saki Mahmoud who've been offering their reaction to the news. I don't think I was that surprised. As Ben touched on then, he's someone who wants to go out there and give absolutely everything to the cause. And I don't think it would sit well with him

to think I've got to try and just, I can't bowl my full 10 with the ball. You know, just bowling four or five overs a game and not being able to throw himself around in the field like he does. I think that, yeah, that's probably his main. main reasoning behind it. I did think at some

point, you know, when he became test captain I thought someone like him who's a proper all-rounder can win games with bat ball and in the field, you know, something would have to give. I may be surprised it was this soon after getting the test captaincy, but I think it's a sensible decision for him.

How about you, Saki? He was someone who's very desperate to play for England every occasion you possibly can. You presumably can understand the decision of someone who's that deep into their international career with the arms on them. Yeah, for me, I think it's slightly different. I'm obviously trying to make my way in and play as much as I can, and I think it's different for Ben, who's, you know, this is a 105th ODI, but the pressures and the scheduling that we have these days, you know,

you'll finish a test match two days later. There's an ODI starting. And if you're thinking about what's happening in the future, Ben is someone I've always found who thinks about, you know, he's very in the moment, but if he's thinking about looking after himself with the future, then it's not right for him. Yeah, it's one of those decisions you can understand Although there is a World Cup next year You just wonder, I don't know You wonder whether they might knock on his door

About a month before and say He's fancy playing in the World Cup I don't know whether that's absolutely it or not Jimmy's shaking his head Yeah, I think this is it I think You know, again, Ben's someone who When he makes a decision he sticks to it

He's not someone who's just going to say Oh if he wanted to just sit out oldy eyes For six months he would have said that But this is a definite end for him in this format and as I said I think it's a really sensible decision from him we'll still see a lot of him in an England shirt with a test test team and T20s so it's not all doom and gloom I don't think it would be really good for him and as he said prolonging his career you're listening to the TMS podcast from BBC Radio 5 live Jimmy Anderson and

Saki Bermude there with reaction to the news that Ben Stokes has retired from one day international cricket, 11 years after first making his debut. We can get some further analysis now with another member of that World Cup winning England side in 2019, Chris Wokes, speaking alongside the BBC's cricket correspondent, Jonathan Agnew. This certainly won't have been a knee-jerk reaction from Ben. I'm sure he's giving it a lot of thought. And I'm sure what, you know, what Agers have said there has probably come into his thoughts as well with regards to his family life, spending time with his wife, Claire, and his

two young children, I think that's probably coming to it as well. And, you know, I think he said in his statement that it was, you know, unsustainable to kind of play all three formats. I think obviously taking on the test captaincy now will probably have had a big, big knock on effect in terms of what that job requires. It will come, you know, he's the sort of man that will be all in on that test captaincy and he'll be wanting to give it his all. And I think he probably feels that he needs that little bit of extra time, which

hopefully him knocking ODI cricket on the head will now give him to be able to focus on that and obviously T-20 as well. So the quotes, Jonathan, from Ben Stokes are really interesting. He said, as hard a decision as this was to come to, it's not as hard as dealing with the fact that I can't give my teammates 100% of myself in that format anymore.

So, you know, a sensible decision, but also a humble decision. Yeah, I mean, he does have some fitness issues. as we know with his knees and various other parts of his body and he doesn't always bowl his full allocation for example in 50 over's cricket but I just think he's got so much on and he's got so much cricket on

that something has had to give and you know Chris knows better than I do but I don't think that cricket absolutely rules his life he's very much a family man and I think there is that aspect of it because of that commitment I was made mentioning about the length of time to travel, to play a couple of warm-up games, to play a five-batch series. That is a month gone to play five games. And I just think that we will see more,

because another point about this is, of course, that these days your modern international cricketer doesn't need to play every format financially. They get paid well enough, playing test cricket or T20 cricket or whatever it may be, and the franchises and so on. A few years ago, you needed to play every single game that you possibly could in order to make a decent living. Well, that's not the case anymore. And you can be more choosy about it. And I'm, I'm not surprised that he's chosen that format, which does feel that it's kind of running out of steam anyway, if I'm honest. It's not, no surprise at all, because of course it now keeps the door open for the franchises. Chris, having you is great because, of course, we can talk

about, you know, his fantastic innings all day. But not only have you been there to see them, you've been behind the scenes as well, of course. So, you know, when you think about, you know, When you think about, you know, Ben Stokes, one-day internationals, ordinarily, I wouldn't guess what the standout moment is. If it's not the World Cup final, I'll be surprised. Yeah, I mean, it kind of, the question answers itself, doesn't it, really? I mean, I look back on that tournament, and, you know, I was looking back at a few clips on social media earlier, and he had an incredible tournament with the bat, not just obviously produced what he did in the final,

which was remarkable, but and effectively got us over the line single-handedly. the end. But it was just, he had a great tournament from start to finish with the bat and some of the innings that he played. I think there was a knock at Sri Lanka when we actually lost the game where he nearly won us the game single-handedly again. So, you know, it's an incredible tournament. Yeah, I think my obviously big ODI moment for Ben is obviously the final and the way he kind of, you know, dragged us to that Superover. And then obviously still to do what he did in the Superover as well was just typical Ben Stokes. But yeah, what I mean, what a player. I think the way I look at it is there's players in international cricket, which are

obviously, you know, the international game is full of good players and very good players, but there's only a very, very small few that can do things like Ben Stokes does and has done for a long period of time. And, you know, we're obviously very lucky to have him as an England team, as England fans. And he is the man that can deliver moments which you remember for the rest of your life. And, you know, I've certainly played in a few games which he's delivered that. So, incredible player and incredible guy to be around as well. How small is that group, Chris, of one-day players that Ben Stokes belongs to at the top of the game? Yeah, I mean, I think it's tiny, really.

You know, you think of greats of the game. You know, in general, they're guys that do it across all three formats or all three formats now. Maybe back in the day it was only two formats, but you look at guys that can adapt across the game. You know, whatever skill is required, they can adapt. deliver those magical moments and Ben's certainly obviously done that that group of players

that do that are very small particularly in the Whiteball game he kind of thinks so that you talk of the likes of A, B, De Villiers those sort of guys that have done it over a long period of time

and as I said across all three formats but Ben for me is obviously an amazing white ball cricket and it's a bit of weird one because it feels like we're talking like he's completely finished

but obviously he has so many for us to see Ben's stoked. So, yeah, it's not all doom and gloom. The TMS podcast from BBC Radio 5 Live.