Test Match Special - CWC Day 1: Stokes' stunner and Archer's pace light up Oval

Episode Date: May 30, 2019

Michael Vaughan and Sam Curran join Jonathan Agnew at the Oval for reactions to England's opening World Cup win over South Africa. Ben Stokes tells us that his stunning catch was 'a fluke', plus we hear from Eoin Morgan, Graeme Smith and Imran Tahir, who's not happy with his side's batsmen. Sam Curran explains what it's like to get an IPL hattrick without realising, and we begin our quest to find the listener in the most obscure place.

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. To embrace the impossible requires a vehicle that pushes what's possible. Defender 110 boasts a towing capacity of 3,500 kilograms, a weighting depth of 900 millimeters and a roof load up to 300 kilograms. Learn more at landrover.ca. BBC Sounds, music, radio, podcasts. Hello, I'm Owen Morgan. and welcome to the TMS podcast

at the Cricket World Cup is that question mark meant to be there? I am now honoured to declare the ICC men's cricket World Cup 2019 in England and Wales open. Trust me, you won't want to miss any of it. He sweeps in the air and strike towards Stokes

who takes an incredible, one-handed catch. It is important gone and the first victory for England has been completed. Well, what a start. Welcome to the TMS podcast at the Cricket World Cup. We're finally underway. I'm Jonathan Agney with the Oval,

where England have beaten South Africa in the tournament opener by 104 runs, and we saw one of the most incredible catches in World Cup history. Michael Vaughn and Andy Zaltzman are with me. We'll hear from Ben Stokes on that catch later. We'll also hear from the former South African captain, Graham Smith, The England test all round of Sam Curran, who's been with us in the TMS box all day to day on life growing up in a cricket mad family, taking hat tricks in the IPL and his hopes for the ashes. The TMS podcast, available every day during the cricket World Cup. So the opening match of the World Cup was won by England, comfortably enough, by 104 runs.

They set a score of 311 for 8, and chasing those 312 to win. So that, we're a bowled out for 207, so England winning by 104. four runs, highlights for England, 50s for Roy, Root, Morgan and a very good 89 from Ben Stokes. Johnny Bairsto was out for the second ball of the game. The first one that he faced, it was a lovely tactical switch by Fafte de Plessy, the South African captain bringing on the legsman at Imran Tahir to bowl the first over of the match. And it worked too with Bear Sto, he's been a catch behind. Butler made 18, Mowing 3, Wokes 13.

And some beautiful runs at the end added actually by Plunkett and Archer. Ingo, South Africa, they immediately lost Amler, hit a horrible blow in the grill, actually, from Archer. He'd retired, hurt and didn't come back for some time. He was eventually out for 13 when the score was 193 for 8, and the game was all over. DeCock play well, 68. Interesting incident when he, well, he appeared to be bold. The ball certainly hit the stumps pretty hard. The zingers all went off, the flasher has went, but the bales didn't fall off.

So he survived on 25, eventually made 68. Fanda Dusen made a hard-hitting 50 but apart from Flaqueo at the end he made 24 they chipped away England managed to nibble away through those wickets with Archer taking three for 27

Plunkett 2 for 37 and Ben Stokes who took an absolutely brilliant catch out on the deep mid-wicket boundary if you see a better catch than that throughout this whole tournament I know I accept there's still there's still six and a half weeks to go but if we see a better catch than that during the tournament

well I want to make sure that I'm there to see it because this one was absolutely outstanding one-handed, right-handed, stretching up high above his head. That is absolutely brilliant. So he had a good game too for the Quaybaud for 24. So there we go. Let's start with Sam Curran, shall we? Who's been enjoying a day out here in the commentary box for the first time?

I suspect down there in the dressing. They'll be saying job done, won't they? Yeah, I think it was pretty clinical in the end by England. Obviously, losing Johnny earlier was pretty not ideal, but then they showed how good they are as a team. Every day it seems like a different battered tone. up on their day. That's why I think, as I said earlier, none of them have got the fear of failure. I think it's a massive part of the team and obviously the boys bowled beautifully and

as you said, Joffra in the power play there brought the extra pace and ruffled a few feathers of the South Africans and obviously it's great to see and obviously a great win. Yeah, I'm just looking at Ben Stokes being presented as player of the match and quite, I wonder how much that catch will do him some good actually because he just, I mean with the ball he's being a bit understated, I think it's fair to say for a while now, hasn't Ian? I wonder how much today those runs, that catch. Ben Stokes firing at the start of the tournament. I wonder how much good that'll do in

Michael. You generally look at any team's success is geared around you're all-rounder. You know, you look at great English moments. Ian Botham in the 80s, Freddie Flintsoff. Ben Stokes finding form in the first game of the World Cup is a huge boost for England. He's not been in tremendous

form with the bat, but I thought today's innings was really smart. And that's the way that I would describe the England performance was smart. I guess that's the one question that you could say this England one-day side over the last two or three years is that sometimes they haven't played smart cricket and they've allowed the opposition in by going a bit too gung-ho. Well, today I thought they played such a smart game

by just getting that number on the board. If they'd have gone for 360, potentially they'd only got 260. And they just made sure, particularly Ben Stokes, just held it in there, the slower balls were hard to hit, and he just kept his composure. You could say at one stage he was getting a bit frustrated that he wasn't hitting the ball for four. and six but he just hung in there and hung in there and it's just a lesson to the team today

that you've just got to get a score and it's just got to be good enough on that given day and it ended up being plenty but when you get your all-rounder getting 89 taking a catch in front of the masses as good a catch as you're ever going to see and then getting two for nothing off his two point whatever overs you know to have him have him in that kind of form at the start of the World Cup is a tremendous boost for the team let's go and join charles dougal who's with ben stokes well ben congratulations what a perfect start for of the team? Yeah, fantastic.

You know, there's a, I'm sure there's a few nerves kicking around this morning. I was, you know, I never felt like that in quite a long time to be honest this morning when we came into the ground. So it's always nice to get the first game out of the way, but to come away with it with a win, you know, it's a fantastic start. You say that because you've seemed ready now for not just the Pakistan series, but even longer than that. Yeah, I mean, you know, obviously we played amazing cricket over the last four years, but when you get to these type of moments, things start fresh I guess obviously we come in with some really good

momentum but there's just that extra added a bit of pressure when you come to a World Cup so to perform like we did today is as a you I think actually I think that's the best we fielded in about two or three years to be honest the all round we're absolutely brilliant the amount of runs that we saved there especially Jason Roy obviously set the standards there at backward points so to start like that is brilliant and then hopefully we can carry on from there talk about that wicket because you know we're so used to use getting three-fifference 50 plus almost borderline 400 scores so at 311 for 8 in the context of things

it actually seems like a poor effort from you but the wicket did play a little bit differently perhaps than how you thought yeah it did I think towards the end they were really really hard to get away they they bowed their player to their plans really well took all the pace off the ball and we actually didn't really know where we're going to get our boundaries from but you know it proves where we've came over the last two years that we can get up to 311 and not be disappointed but sort of I think if that That was a couple of years ago.

We might have crumbled a bit and maybe got to 70 to 80, which would have been easier to chase down. But that 300 marks always a psychological thing, especially when you're chasing. Did you feel at the halfway stage that that was a par total, a good total? How did you fit? At the start of the day, Rudy and J. Roy sent messages back saying

it's about 310 wicket, maybe 3.30 if someone gets in and goes on and gets a big one. So at halfway stage, we were happy with what we've got. Joffra Archer, he's a real fine for you guys, and especially up front with the damage he can create. I mean, yeah, it's been talked up a lot and he's handled the pressure really well. Obviously he's been spoken about by, you know, every man and their dog. But he's, you know, he's risen, he's risen to the occasion every time he's put the shirt on.

And today was another performance, which you can look at. And then, you know, the future looks very bright for him in England. I've asked five questions without asking it, but I'm going to ask you now. You catch. Talk us through your catch. I mean, that was another wonderful moment you think back to Trent Bridge. but what a feeling that must be for you to take such a stunning effort?

Yeah, to be honest, I was actually in the wrong position. I was about probably 10 yards further in than I should have been so if I was in the right position, it would have been a regulation catch. But, I mean, that feeling for about five seconds when I was facing the crowd and everybody was up cheering, it was absolutely phenomenal. Morgs actually asked me before I bought my first ball of my spell

saying, how's your heart going? You're all right, you're all right now? And I was like, yeah, I'm all right now. Do you want to hear the commentary of it? Uh, oh I am. Okay, let me put my headphones on you. Your reaction, here we go. Drink's break is done.

Pitloquire is on strike and he's facing Adele Rashid. He sweeps in the air and straight towards Stokes. It takes an incredible, one-handed catch. Unbelievable, jumping in their hair and some are plucking it out of nowhere. Well, you have to smile. What a catch. He never looked like he was going to get anywhere in here. It came in, he went back.

was going to sail over his head and he stuck up the right hand and the big celebration is followed because that is a wonderful catch it's going to take a lot to beat that in this world cup this is absolutely incredible he's a couple of paces off the boundary row he jumps in the air and summer grabs him with his right hand and he was past the perpendicular as well incredible catch to get rid of undile peckler choir should have said fluke Is it better hearing it? Oh yeah I mean it's just one of those which you know they stick on another day they don't but yeah it was an amazing feeling for that five seconds from the crowd. With the ball with batting in the field you must be delighted with your own performance today. Yeah good start you know individually it's always nice to get some runs you know I would say burgle a few at the end but you know when it comes down to you know the full team performance I don't think we can, you know, have anything bad to say about how we all perform today

because, you know, it was a phenomenal team performance. Congratulations. Well play. Thanks, mate. Cheers. Lovely interview. Well done. Charlie. Thank you, gosh indeed. Well done. Ben Stokes for a terrific game. It's nice for him to hear of listen back to that commentary too. I guess, may, go back to that point again. I mean, for Stokes in particular, who we know he's had a pretty troubled time over the 18 months, had people have talked about that. I wonder what influence it makes. Well, I'm trying to work out if it's a better catch than he took in the ashes.

at Trent Bridge. Oh, okay. I'm trying to work that. In the gully, yeah. Yeah, in terms of difficulty, I mean, I wouldn't have even dared dream to go for a catch like that. The fact that he was out of position,

he's admitted that himself, he was out of position by a few yards. It's the way he makes it look so easy. You know, to try and kind of return your arm the other way and catch a ball in it to go straight in the middle of his palm, and then to roll over, and it's still to stay in his hand. And then he springs up as if it was like

the easiest thing in the world to do. I mean, that's what, great all-rounders can do. Aren't some people that's a bit special? They could just do a moment of magic like that. Agility, awareness, everything around, that catch was special. You know, and he is a special cricketer.

They just have this knack, those kind of cricketers that can just do things on the stage like this. It's a World Cup opener. You know, grab the headlines. You know, make sure that you are the picture the next morning. You know, England have played great. The team have played tremendous. But really quality all-rounders,

just have that knack of doing things that many of the players can't even dream about doing. If you do practice this boundary catches, don't you say? I mean, you often see you're right there on the boundary edge. You're aware of where the boundary is. I think on that point, Stokesy is always the first one to fielding and the last one to leave as well. He's kind of, everyone says he does do everything 100% the whole time. And probably fielding, he does it 110%.

He chucks it from the boundary during training at 1,000 miles an hour into the keepers and that kind of stuff. But you've seen that and Stokesy does it so often that it's almost like a normal. everyone's going to see that as the best catch it's probably going to be the best catch in the tournament even though it's the first game but um now stokesy is pretty he's pretty special and um those are the guys you want in your team who changed games like that as for when he said in the middle of the world cup final stokes he's going to be taking the ball scoring runs taking catches and those moments change games and win your world cups i mean the way that he's been trying i mean he's a hard trainer sam just mentioned he's always the the first out there the last

where it's with the batting hand, the ball in hand and in the field. He is training so hard, whether it was in the gym. You see him on Instagram at night, he's in the gym. You know, he has got this focus about him at the minute. You know, he's got this look in his eyes, this look in his persona, that this is his moment. You know, there's times in your career that you know that this is your moment to really, really show. It's only young, but you just feel that whatever happened in Bristol's gone,

he's learned from it, he's become a more mature person. and you just feel that this next six weeks we've got Joff Farach who's going to be a superstar I can see that quite easily but you're all rounder the middle of the engine room to win major tournament it's your engine room and the one individual

that's in this England team's engine room is Ben Stokes and what a start he's just made Imran Tahir is now with Charles Dagnall yeah Imran obviously not the start that you would have wanted today for your campaign where did it go wrong for you today I just think that personally it was a good wicket

So to be honest with you, I think we did a great job to stick England 300. I thought it was going to be 370, 380. But we did really well as a bowling group, I think. But obviously there is, I think, lack of a little bit concentration from badders. But I mean, that's how it goes during the game, I think. But for me, I think if we just bet it in 40, 40 overs, three down, we had a very good chance. And I think we had a chance today, but I mean, obviously, good.

Obviously, the way they came back, England bowlers, obviously, they bowed really well and fielded really well, so our credit goes to them, really. I mean, you say about the plan for Johnny Bairstow and for Jason Roy, I imagine, to open with you. It's a role that you've done before in whiteball cricket, both in 220 and now in 50 overs cricket. Might we see that maybe continue over the course of the summer, or does that depend on the opposition that you face? Yeah, I think it's depend on how we plan opposition and every opposition. like you mentioned so look I did I did have opportunity and it was a plan and I did bowl in couple of games with the new bowl so that was a practice for me which helps always a help and then yeah just been doing practice with a new ball but look

obviously that's not sure but I think we've got a guys in our teams Dale Stey and Lungi and Robada who can bowl 145 to 150 so don't need me to bowl with a new ball but look like I said if it will be a plan against any opposition I'm there to obviously put my hand up and be ready to do the job what team required for me. We still enjoy your celebration so much and how long and how far you ran after that first wicket. Congratulations personally today but commiserations on the result. Thank you very much. I appreciate it. Thank you. I always like to hear a bowler giving a battsman a bit of stick. Don't hear the batting you. I like to say you know if the batsmen

could have just batted to the 40 over three wickets down. They've got a little bit of a muddle I thought to that. I didn't you a selection-wise? I think they were agreed on that. You know, okay, you lose a key man. You lose Dale Stain. I mean, I don't know. But did they take the right options?

Do you think with that or did it really not make the most difference? You could point the finger at that, but, you know, I think they've got to look more so in terms of the 11 that played. Could they have batted better? I thought they were very good in the field. I thought Faf Dupacie was excellent as a captain, tactically getting it right within Rantahir.

His manoeuvres around, the field was excellent. You know, with the batting hand, I thought they panicked a bit too soon in the middle. at J.P. Doom and he came out, he hit a nice four and then all of a sudden he'd get caught long off and you think, well, you've just done the damage by getting the boundary. So there was some sloppy batting in the middle, which, you know, I think maybe

that's what someone like Geoffer Archer can do to a team. Don't underestimate the fact that these players might think that they have to gamble a little bit sooner against other bowlers because they know that Joffar Archer has got more overs to come back with. So that's what a bowler can do to a team. His pace, his accuracy, skill.

You know, that cherry on the top of the cake that we keep talking about, Joffera, it's one big cherry. You know what he can deliver for England. That pace and that first spell they were rockets. It makes it look so easy too isn't he? He really does a... It's such a lovely rhythm. I love that a hard show. I wish I could do that but now it's pretty special

to see something like that. You see all the England players obviously love having him in the team. It was obviously he came in quite late but you can't argue with somebody of that calibre in class. He's shown it on the world stage for a few years now and obviously it's obviously England's gain the next couple of weeks

You know this group very well, Sam. What do they be saying now, do you think? I mean, you know, they've won, that's great and fantastic, but they'll be looking at one or two areas? I think they always probably look at the negatives rather than the positives even when they do win games. So obviously I reckon, I don't know if there's many negatives from today's performance. They're pretty clinical and they're pretty laid-backed dressing in terms of

now they're probably just having a quiet beer and congratulating the guys that did well and probably preparing for the next game on, I don't think it's next week, Monday maybe. Yeah, Monday. But, yeah, Morg's is pretty laid back about how he does it. You were clutching your microphone there in a slightly demanding way, Andy Zaltzman. What have you got to announce?

Just a few stats coming out of today. England, since the 2015 World Cup, have now 159, lost 23 and tied one. And since 2016 at home, they've won 30 and lost only four with one tie, and averaging a fraction under 50 per wicket with the bat, going at six point five runs per over and it's a rare win for England against a top eight side in World Cup cricket in the last six World Cups England have won only five of 22 matches

against top eight ranked teams so a welcome a welcome win for England in that regard and South Africa have not a great record on this ground they've now lost three of their ten matches here so so they've won 30 and lost four yes so since the start of the 2016 summer.

Yeah, that's an incredible record, isn't it, really? I mean, that must be up there amongst the best runs by any team of all time, surely, to lose so few games. Amazing percentage, isn't it? Yes, and that's at home, and there's been a lot made about how good they are chasing. They've now, at home,

won eight out of their last 10 batting first as well, so either way, that's tough to beat. One of those four was that semi-final against Pakistan in the Champions Trophy, and you know, from what I see, it's going to come down to those semifinals. You know, who do England getting this? I can't see how they don't win enough games to make the top four with the quality that they have. And can they produce the performance like we've seen

today, which was smart, clever, calm. Ben Stokes said they were quite hardworking too today. They were good today. To be one for one and Bear Stowe out, I mean, and they could have gone, oh, this isn't quite what's supposed to be happening at all. You could sense they were a little bit nervous. You could sense in the warmets around the group, just speaking to a few of them pre-match. It was a different conversation to what we were having, you know, last week against Pakistan. understandably it's the World Cup and you wake up with different kind of vibes and feelings and now they've got the first game out of the way and won it and won it well I can only see them gaining more and more confidence and it will come down to which semi-final venue they play. Does it happen in Manchester or Birmingham? What kind of pitch? You know, from what I've seen today, we thought this pitch we're going to have a lot of moisture and we're kind of concerned about the green grass. A lot of the pitch are going to be like this. They're going to be dry, spin's going to play a massive part, slower balls. But with that new ball, when you've got some someone like Joffar Archie can bowl bounces like that.

I said before the time I think the bounce is going to be a massive ball in this World Cup. Pacey bounces because these white balls aren't swinging, you can't just run up and lob it on a length because you're going to get dispatched. You're going to have to have the variation of pace and that pace element that archer can bring with the new ball and push them back. Then that fuller ball actually becomes a threat because a batsman's weight will be possibly on that back foot. So when he then throws the fuller ball, it might be that you get ZellBWs and bowls or snicks because a batsman's not getting his head back into the ball.

having that as a captain it's an absolute joy to wake up to when you're the skip and you you know Geoffrey's a lot of the ball too it's marvellous I've got one more niche staff for you here we go 16 catches today that's the joint third most in the World Cup match

15 of them by field is only one catcher by a wicket keeper and that's the most catches by fielders ever in a World Cup game and the second most ever in a one day international win over 4,000 matches that's more than a niche step that is very nice so that's a top of the top of the range step

um how Tom be feeling is he's in there is in the squad it's it's it's always so hard when you're not actually quite involved isn't it but yes you'll take your time I suppose it's probably I think it's much rather be there than on a on a flat one at Becker and playing the county grind I think so I think um now as we said earlier he's all the bowlers are going to get a game here and there and um as I you'd much rather be in the dress here and being involved in World Cup than playing four-day cricket for your county team because this only comes once every four years and it's probably the only time that he'll play a World Cup in England. So I think if any cricket in the county circuit was to be carrying drinks in a World Cup,

you'd probably take it. I think what's important with winning early games if England do that, you can get yourself into a position of potentially resting players and making sure that you've got everyone a game, come the semi-fathers in case someone goes down injured. That's what winning early in these kind of tournaments can do for a team. and the likes of Tom, the likes of James Vincey's kind of players, Liam Dorson, you know, that's just waiting in and Mark Wood, they will get games. But it's important that England win because then you can just rest the ones that haven't been playing,

then they have been playing and get some opportunity out in the middle. Good to have you with us, Sam. Thanks, much indeed. Hope you've enjoyed it. Yeah, it's been great. Thanks for having me. It's a dance idea from up here, isn't it? Runs, wickets, galore. I can finally experience with you guys when you're telling me what I'm doing wrong.

From BBC Radio 5 live This is the TMS podcast at the Cricket World Cup Well let's hear from the England captain Owen Morgan Then he's with NASA Hussein Owen first game after all the hype and all the build-up You must be thrilled with that performance Yeah delighted to be often running in the tournament I think when you put in a performance like that

On top of it it's more satisfying than normal I thought we were very good today I thought we fought ourselves individually and as a batting unit throughout the whole of the first innings Both South Africa's good bowling and the wicket didn't allow us to get, well, execute our plan A, which is try and score quite a considerable total. But I thought the maturity and smart cricket that we played, I thought, chose probably our improvement in the last two years and our experience as well. And everybody that came in sort of agreed that the score that we had put on the board was both competitive and probably above par. Because people have accused you maybe are flat track bullies and he get 370, 380.

When it is sticking the pitch and you have to work out a good score, you did that really well. How impressed were you with Ben Stokes, for example, down the order? Yeah, extremely impressed. He's at a full day out today, Ben. Even that catch and the outfield is absolutely outstanding. So to have a match winner like that in your side and he is a day out, obviously, lifts absolutely everybody. And I thought the bowling unit really did get off to a great start. and continue to learn from watching the first innings,

watching the South African guys the way they executed and what they did, and then learn from it and then put it into place in the second innings. Talk about match winners. You found one with the ball in Archer. That was some spell. Slowish pitch to get it through like that. Slowest pitch, he bowled fast and accurate. And it's outstanding for a young guy just starting his international career. He's taking everything in his stride at the moment.

Everything we're putting on his lap. He's improving every day. so that's very exciting. One thing that often tells where a team is is their fielding display. That was outstanding today. That will give you a lot of pleasure. Yeah, a huge amount of pleasure. It's an area that we're always trying to improve on.

We won't have days like this every time we go out, but certainly we're looking for match-winning contributions in the field. You know, the odd run-out, the odd catch. And if we drop it or miss it, that's absolutely fine. We're looking to be or experiment in the field. Well, every experiment is working. on Monday, good luck with that.

Thank you very much. Thanks, Seth. So what are the South Africans thinking? The former Captain Graham Smith has been speaking to Eleanor Oldroyd. All our fears kind of came true today, I think, up against a really strong team in England and, you know, bowling depth and options are there. Some of the selection things that South Africa were debating. But, you know, the balance and the batting, I guess, is the weak part for South Africa,

and you're chasing 300 against a very good England team, just never really looked in it. Do you think that they gave themselves the best best possible chance though with the way they bowled against England. Well, England bat really deep and have a lot of options and I think once that platform was there at 100, 100 odd for one, you know, South Africa really needed to get a clump of wickets. I think they stayed in the game. They were professional, they were neat, they were tidy without really like setting the world a lot. But, you know, I think South winning in toss would have hoped that they could have had England like 30 for four,

something which would have given them a real hope. But once England got 311, it was going to be interesting to see, you know, if all our fears about South African batting line up was was real and yeah they never really got anything going number three team in the world though you talk about the fears about South Africa is it to do with the fact that it's not been the happiest history for South Africa in this competition no no I don't think it's got

anything to do with that I just think it's up against a very good England team and you know I performed on the day really I mean it's just it's been a skill thing today and I think you know South Africa you know we'll beat we'll be teams and hopefully we'll get something going in this World Cup but playing against the favourites in the first game of the World Cup they've looked

to, you know, a lot short to Gallup than England. It's a long competition, though, isn't it, though, with, you know, eight more games to play. Where do you think they can finish? Well, South Africa's three games in seven days, and two of them are up against the favourites, with England first and then, obviously, India, you know, around the corner and Bangladesh in between. So, you know, there's still a lot of cricket, as you said, it's about remaining even, you know, not getting too high or too low, depending on the results, and staying focused. And, you know, they can get a win against Bangladesh and get into the competition, you know,

There's no reason why they can't qualify for the semifinal. And what did you think of the way that Faf de Plessy rotated his bowlers in that England innings? I thought he kept him well. I thought he tried to stay ahead of the game, you know, using key players at key times to try and pick up wickets. Because that's the only way you can control a really deep, powerful battle lineup like England. I thought he had a good day. I think if anything, you know, South Africa could have done a little bit better in the run chase. I think some of the shot making, decision making at certain times has let them down.

But, yeah, again, so the big question mark will be for the rest of the tournament will be this balance of the team. team against and the batting liner. And looking ahead, of course, Dale Stain's still to come back. He is. I'm a bit nervous about Dale. I mean, you know, just that shoulders niggled him a little bit. He's obviously broke it before. So, you know, we'd like to see him playing. I mean, you know, he's just such a key member.

Also adds a bit more sting to that bowling lineup. So, yeah, let's see, you know, saying game three. So let's see if he can make it. The TMS podcast at the Cricket World Cup. So the England or round of Sam Curen's been with us in the test match special box today. Sam, welcome to the TMS podcast. I actually used to play against your

late father, Kevin, but there are three Karen boys playing after all. They're all very different. It is weird, obviously bends out and out battering at Northampton and then Tom's ball's right, eye ball left so I think my dad and mom

growing up probably just wanted us to be totally different so there's no arguments against each other. But you can probably say we've copied a lot of of international players growing up in the garden and things like that but um we're very competitive i mean i did know your dad pretty well he he was he was a competitor and you can see that in in your eyes and tom's eyes and so on i can imagine there must have been some interesting games in the garden definitely i think that's the natural spirit i've brought every family that's got three

boys and love sport are always going to be competitive a lot of a lot of fighting in the garden in terms of if i was out or not if you hit out the tennis court or something you get given out but everyone loves hitting sixes so you always had to take the take the hit and six and out as they call it but yeah it is I think now is we probably not as competitive as we are well we are obviously competitive on the wicket but at home and stuff it's more of a bit of friendly banter between us and why did you play that shot what are you doing there silly all this kind of things but do you help each other you and Tom particularly I mean with England set up yeah we do I think obviously he plays in games that I don't plan and I play

playing games that he doesn't play and so it's just feeding off each other's information like he went to the IPL the year before this year and he brought back experience so that he led on to me going into my first IPL so things like that does really help but um it's just good having a brother who does the same thing so you can get lifts to the ground and things like that it's actually there's benefits away from the game rather than actually on the on the pitch but um now it's all it's all good obviously we probably you're very similar are you I think we are yeah we've got all got very similar interests. We love playing golf on the outfield and golf and just golf in general and mess around chipping in the garden and things like that. But it's all good. It's great

to be especially today. Obviously Tom didn't play but first World Cup in England for him and his first World Cup as a player. So hopefully he gets a go and he can show the world our goody is. Well your dad of course played in the 83 World Cup and I mean that amazing victory over Australia at Trent Bridge did you know anything about that? Have you read anything about it? Did he used to talk about it? I mean, it blew people away, really. And that generation of Zimbabwe's actually I knew very well.

I played club cricket out there and coached out there. Duncan Fletcher was my club captain and so on, of course, was captain of Zabal. But then David Houghton, all these sort of names. Yeah, I think, obviously, it was a long time before I was born. So obviously, I didn't really know much about it as growing up. But as I got older, you read books, you look at pictures, you watch old videos that with those blurry screens and things like that.

It's a lot different to now. But I think when I was in India, actually, a lot of their local Indians knew a lot about that World Cup. I think it might have been the 87 World Cup. It was in India. Well, the 83 was the one when Zimbabwe beat Australia. Yeah, so it's all just good to look back. It seems like ancient history for you.

Yeah, it does. It's a long time ago, but it's obviously great, especially now. Ben's playing in Northampton when my dad played for many years as well so it's pretty pretty nice connection there that he's bringing the family name through again at North Hunters which which is really proud moment for our family and obviously hopefully one day we'll all be playing for the same team together which will be the dream no that would be brilliant I think I did tell you on the last tour that as a batsman Sam I was a complete coward okay I mean I was I hated facing fast bowling and the reason for

that is this rather nasty scar that i got inside my lip here not wearing a helmet i wasn't wearing a helmet it was a friendly game in harari and a very unpleasant vast bowler called kevin curran bowled be a bouncer and hit me straight in the mouth and i was carted off and never be bowling bounces when no one's going to helmet on he bowler bouncer at me and i was stitched up by by a nurse in hararee hospital that's the competitive spirit of the family coming through there you go he had to put it in It was a friendly game. And I never got over it. Unfortunately, it actually rather shattered my confidence.

So he always used to have some good humdinging arguments. I've heard a lot of stories that he was very competitive. Very competitive. I think that's where we probably get our competitiveness from. Yeah, but a good cricket. I mean, you have got some footage you've been playing, have you? Oh, yeah, of course. We look at things and try and, obviously, growing up,

he always tried to make us do his action and all these kind of things. But I think Tom mentioned the other day as well, he probably looked up to guys like Brett Lee and some guys say he's got a similar action to that but obviously that's I think why we've seen bowlers because he was seen bowlers but always in the garden throwing balls growing up and things like that so

you seemed like Brett Lee to me that day it might be flattering him a little bit you'll take that as a compliment no I think he would let's talk like the IPL then because that that experience for you to go there as a marquee player at the age of 20

that's a bit of pressure on on young shoulders isn't it I mean, to go into that tournament, there's so much expectation. How did you feel about that when you turned up? Yeah, it was. I think it was when I went out there, obviously, it was my first time playing cricket in India. So the first thing I went to jump... First time ever been?

First time ever being in India. Wow, okay. I had heard a lot about in terms of, oh, it's a great place in terms of the crowds and things like that. But I didn't think you can really imagine what it's like until you get there. I've landed in, I think I flew into Delhi, and then onto Mahali. I walked out the airport, got in the cab, and back in the hotel, and it's just fans everywhere literally and I was just like this is weird I'm a nobody I don't even these guys were like asking for selfies and things like that and they're just

ever since the day you arrive in India and they know you playing cricket there they just want to be involved it was a lot of expectation going into the competition but I almost went there with an open mindset that I've never been to India let's give my best shot and see how we go and I think I play my best cricket when I'm not overthinking the game I think if I'm worried about what people think and what people are worrying about the outcome. I'm just trying to go there with the mindset of watch the ball and bowl the ball the ball. Yeah. The first game didn't go very well.

Joss, I played against Joss and Stake. Joss actually got hold of me a bit in the first power play. So it's more of a welcome to the IPL, Sam. I had a bit of banter with him, but nice. It was great. The amount of players you get there that are world-class is pretty special. The local Indian players, the young guys are. I was amazed with the way these guys hit a cricket ball,

the skills, so many mystery spinners you face spin. If you could bat for two days in the nets and got these net bowlers keep coming at you. And it didn't start great in terms of personally, but then found my feet a little bit and managed to end on a good note. Youngest person taking a hat trick for a start. That was the second game, isn't it?

Yeah, against... Well, come on, talk me through that because that must have been incredible. But it was at Mahal. Yeah, so we're playing Delhi. they need about 30 off 28 balls but we thought the game was gone and one of our local guys

got a run out and it almost changed the game. That Rishabant is a local Indian guy's really really good player. He played in the test team last summer. He managed to get 100 here actually at the Oval. I actually didn't know I'd got the hat trick when it happened. The noise was literally the loudest thing I've ever heard

and I looked on the screen and it said hat trick and I was like, oh wow, I was in the moment How do you not know you've taken a hat trick? I got no idea I was defending 15 off the last over and I got a wicket and obviously I was only worried about the runs so that was just a bonus the main thing is we ended up winning the game

and it was just a great place to play cricket I've heard so many stories about it but the love for cricket in India is insane and life itself life as an IPL player for you for an overseas player you presumably can't just pop around the shops can you? I mean what

are you sort of almost hold up in a hotel You do spend a lot of time at the hotels. Luckily enough, the hotels are pretty nice, so you do get to go down by the pool and things like that. But now, there's not, you know, you play games that start at 8 p.m., so they finish at one in the morning and you get back, by the time you're in bed, it's 3 o'clock. So I think that's the thing about the IPL. It's very, everything's done so late, and your adrenaline, you get back to the hotel, you can't get to sleep, you still think about the game and things like that, but a lot of travel days and It's an amazing tournament.

I think the thing that makes the best thing is the players they get there are just the best players in the world in terms of the strikers, the bowlers and I think that's why it's probably the best 2-20 tournament. It all gets to know each other pretty well. I'm thinking of the Aussies and the Ashes

and so on. I was interested to see Johnny Bearstone and David Warmer back together. The little bromance. Well, exactly. It seemed like it. I'm sure you got some stick for the photos that were flying around.

I don't think so. But I guess it is that sort of atmosphere. But I mean, the ashes for you now. I mean, that's, you know, you only got a little niggle at the moment, haven't you? But you'll try going off. I mean, that's your sight now, is it? Yeah, definitely. I think, obviously, first of August of the first test,

so obviously we're to try to put in some county performances for them to get into some form, hopefully. And, yeah, I think there's a game against Islanded Lords, the test match. So hopefully get selected for that. But I think that's the pinnacle for any players playing test cricket in the ashes. It's pretty, in England as well. It'd be an amazing.

some hopefully after England are World Cup winners that's the main aim but um ashes is obviously in the back of my mind but trying to take one game at the time okay Sam thanks very much look out on tomorrow's podcast for a fascinating insight into Adil Rashid's bowling we've got Josh Butler to interview him on the psychology of leg spin so Andy Zaltzman's with me was the first match you saw involving Sam's dad Kevin it was yeah 1983 right the World Cup went to Tumbridge Wells oh yes where I grew up up for the only exciting thing that's ever happened in Tumbridge Wells in fact and Zimbabwe were playing India and Kevin Curran opened the bowling with Peter Rawson they reduced India to 17 for 5 for a have the real trouble

Capald Dev made an incredible 175 not out and that turned India's campaign around and they ended up winning the tournament so yeah the four times I've well the first this is the fourth World Cup I've been to matches at and the team that I've seen seen win in the first game has gone

on to win the tournament each time. So, you know, that's the kind of power I wield. Yeah. This is now in the bag for England. Well, that's actually, yeah, that's rather good, isn't it? Now, look, we often get emails on TMS saying that people are listening from all corners of the world. Today, we've had emails for people in Greece, USA, Borneo, Germany, and we want to find

the most unlikely place that people are listening to this podcast. So preferably not in a cricket playing country. Email us with where you're listening. TMS at BBC.co.com. Put podcast, if you can, in the title. So TMS at BBC.co.com. UK, put podcast in the title. Any thoughts you've got on the least cricketing place

that you could listen to this podcast? I've got one or two. The Kremlin? Or even the White House. Yes, that might be unlikely. I know that we have had listeners aboard nuclear submarines sort of patrolling around

in random parts of the world Right, that's not what you want to hear if there's a particularly exciting game going on, is it? Well, no, and not if they sort of suddenly disappear. But also, actually, we have had, I know, emails from, there's a very obscure weather station down on Antarctica

where people will go and sort of hide for months and I think it's always dark and they've got the cricket crackling through. So that's a sort of thing. A bit of history of cricket in Antarctica, isn't? I guess you've got natural sight screens, which probably helps cut down. You do?

You play with a red ball? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So that's the sort of thing. Where are you listening to this podcast? And I don't know if there's a prize or anything for the least cricketing place that you come up with. But send us that email TMS at BBC.co.com.

Put podcast in the title. How do we prove it? How do we prove? Oh, you can't prove. They are actually where they are. You can't prove anything in the world these days, Agas. We just have to accept that. We'll accept you at your word.

Finally, Andy, I have here a very crumpled envelope because everybody who takes part in the TMS podcast during this World Cup is going to be involved in a sweepstake to guess, I suppose, who the leading run scorer is going to be. Toughers has done quite well with Ross Taylor. I think someone's already got Kane Williamson. It's a horrible-looking crumple envelope. Go on.

You've got to pull your name out of there. I don't generally have very good luck with some. sweepsecks. I did. Referees in the Football World Cup last year and my refre didn't even give out

a single yellow card so it was a huge disappointment. Well, let's have a look. Go on, delve in there. Oh, you've taken two, but you're going to take that one.

Take the first one. Yeah, you're taking the first one. It is Babba Azam. Oh. Of, uh, got a shout. Yeah. I'm not sure they're going to go into the latter stages.

I might not play all the games, perhaps. Okay. Shall I pull mine out? Here we go. I've got, I've got, um, I've got, oh.

You look very pleased with this, I'm quite pleased with this. I've got Aaron Finch. Right. That's a definite potential. I think it's probably going to be an opener. I'm quite, I'm not upset with that. Opener or Coley.

I'm not upset with that. So, there we go. That's our sweepstake. What's a suitable prize? We'll leave you the listener to think of a suitable prize for the winner of this particularly silly sweepstake. I'm quite pleased for that. I'm stuck it away so no one can steal it.

Hi, this is Josh Butler. Thanks for listening to the team. TMS podcast at the Cricket World Cup. I don't really listen to it because I enjoy the Peter Crouch one more. Terlenders is all right, but if it's any good, you can also email the team on TMS at bbc.co.uk. Put podcasts in the title and explain the rules of cricket to them. Laws of cricket.