Test Match Special - CWC Day 31: Pakistan squeeze past Afghanistan, and England prepare for India

Episode Date: June 29, 2019

The pressure is mounting on England after Pakistan squeezed past Afghanistan on day 31 – Aatif Nawaz and Daniel Norcross were watching at Headingley.Meanwhile Eoin Morgan joins the podcast to talk about Jonny Bairstow’s comments, Jason Roy’s fitness and the pitch at Edgbaston. Australia win yet again, this time against New Zealand at Lord’s, and we make progress in our efforts to find a listener to this podcast from every country in the world.

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World Cup. This is the TMS podcast from BBC Radio 5 Live. He's morning, that's it. The West Indies have retained the title. India have caused one of the greatest upsets in the history of all sport. He goes for it. It's over the boundary. It's six-six is in the over. And Tevin O'Brien from nowhere has scored the fastest hundred in World Cup history. Australia have emphatically won their fifth World Cup by seven wickets. Hello, I'm Simon Mann at Lords. Coming up, we'll have more on Australia's 86-run victory over New Zealand

with five more wickets for Mitchell Stark. And we'll hear from England's Captain Owen Morgan with Jonathan Agnew ahead of that vital match against India at Edgbuston. But there's only one place to start. Pakistan's nail-biting win against Afghanistan by three wickets with two balls remaining. Daniel Norcross was at Headingley. The TMS podcast at the Cricket World Cup.

Thank you, Simon. Well, I am joined by Artif Nawaz because we here have had the most extraordinary game of cricket at Headingley between Pakistan and Afghanistan. Again, a match that I think Afghanistan were expected to lose pretty comfortably. And now it's both Pakistan and India. They have got within an ace of causing an upset. On this occasion, it would have been an upset that would have been very helpful for England. But they didn't quite manage to do it. They lost in the end. Just two balls to spare Pakistan limped over the line by three wickets.

Artif Nawaz, you look like a man who's seen a ghost. Yeah, I feel like it was one of the most tense experiences maybe of my cricket watching life, right? It was so, so intense towards the end with the game kind of tossing and turning and going one way and the other way and it looks like you're done for, and then all of a sudden there's hope and then all of a sudden, no, no, you're definitely done for. No, actually, there's a little bit more hope. and it just kind of it was the most beautiful back and forth kind of narrative the game had towards the end the drama of it it was truly nail-biting truly anxiety-inducing truly something that just left people literally on the edges of their seats and jumping up in joy when they finally got the result they wanted

every fan thinks that their team puts them through a unique and special form of punishment but i'm looking at this with with objective eyes i can honestly say that i've seen quite a bit of pakistan lately and they really do seem to provide a unique and special form of punishment for their fans because there was just no reason for how that game got so tense was there no i mean they started so brightly at the very top of the game they took the early wickets you know they put that pressure on afghanistan they looked like they might go through them you know i had some sort of rumblings on the outfield i was listening to some of the fans and they were talking about oh it might be a short day here oh maybe we can knock them over for 120 150 even with the partnerships building even when

Pakistan had, even when Afghanistan had 120 for five, you still expected them to be knocked off for about 180, 190. So they actually showed a lot of backbone and a lot of kind of guile just to hang in there that kind of that spine that team had. They didn't fold like a deck ago. I dare say like Pakistan have done many on many occasions. They really hung in there and put together what on this pitch was a very competitive total with the bull moving the way it was. So it was not a foregone conclusion that Pakistan were going to chase it. I mean, I, I, wouldn't ask about it halfway. I said, I think this is going to be a very tight, tense finish. Hamid Hassan, who has been a stalwart of Afghan cricket, and I know in a game

of so many errors and so many marginal decisions, they will probably talk about the poor reviews that both sides used in Pakistan's innings. But in that, in all of that, Hamid Hassan having to limp off after two overs, feels like it just hamstrung, if a pardon, the pun, Afghanistan rather badly didn't it? Because Gulbadim was forced into using himself, he felt. Maybe if he'd used more of Shenwari earlier on, he might not have needed to. But he wanted to have some pace at the death. And it was only he that was able to provide it. And he's not really a death bowler, it doesn't seem to me.

Hamid Hassan, he could really have done with the back end of Pakistan's innings. It's possible that that would have made a significant difference in the game. But these are kind of 1% that they go for you, they go against you. Sometimes, you know, there was a review that Pakistan had for a wicket, which was overturned on the basis of the ball umpires cool but it was you know it was

it looked like a lot of the bull I mean there's just one what I mean is like these things sometimes go for you it was that kind of a day it was exactly that kind of a day I mean let's let's like job back to the very beginning you know in Afghanistan I've won the toss

elected debate and they've done that because it was a glorious hot day I mean as everyone in England knows today is summer and tomorrow it will be autumn again the heat wave and it did materialize and the expectation was it would bake the pitch in Afghanistan who have let's be clear in this World Cup

they've underperformed at the start of the tournament when it was murky and green and the ball was flying through but in the latter couple of weeks their spinners have been given an opportunity and they've really seized it Mujib for example Rashid so you could see why Afghanistan

wanted to bat I just felt that you look at this side and you think no wonder they're not really progressing they've got all the talent but they put in their wicketkeeper at number four Ikram Ali Keehan who bats for 64 overs to score 24 runs or whatever it was.

I mean, you've got Najibullah down the order, who saves him. You alluded to it already, the backbone, the spine in Afghanistan side. But it looked like they were a team that didn't quite know. They didn't know their best openers. They didn't know their best middle order. They've had five different opening partnerships in the tournament so far. Frankly, it was kind of miracle. They made it to 227.

I mean, they did really well too recovered to that. But I think, I mean, it's easy to be overly critical of the Afghanistan team. but I just think they've lost a lot of games and that can be massively disheartening. We saw that kind of chain reaction effect in South Africa a little bit in the way that they performed and they did come back strong with that final win

but by then you could argue that the game was the goose was cooked, it's over. So in this instance I think the fact that Afghanistan pushed Pakistan so close, having lost each of their games in the World Cup so far with Pakistan coming off two really strong wins particularly the one against New Zealand. They've got

ahead of steam, they're coming in, their confidence is high, they're feeling good, even their media being nice to them for the first time and God knows when. So, you know, everything is great and they've got to take on, they've actually pushed them all the way to the limit. I think over time they will start beating India in those scenarios and Pakistan in those scenarios. I think it's one of those things you develop that killer instinct

because the difference between winning and losing comes down to those 1% to sometimes. And if you're not used to doing it, sometimes it takes a while to get into that winning, you know, that kind of killer instinct. But both sides rather threw away their 1%. right at the beginning of Pakistan's innings, didn't they? Both going for reviews that were, frankly, farcical.

The result being that Pakistan had nowhere to go, and most importantly, neither did Afghanistan. So after a rebuilding exercise, Wurjibhman, taken the wicket of Fakhazamand right at the beginning of the run chase, of the second ball, thereafter, partnership developed. But there was a clear court behind that Harris Sahel got a little tickle to,

couldn't refer it. There was a clear LBW later on in the piece that Afghanistan were able to refer. they again they shot themselves on the foot really through impetuosity with the use of their referrals but and it's a big but i guess what i want to ask you is how much did pakistan's run chase what did that tell you about the pressure of tournament play and the pressure that pakistan are under because there's there's two bits of credit to give here there's afghanistan's tremendous spinners and nabi mujib and rashid khan towards the end of that

well throughout it but towards the end of that game they made that game what it was but also So, Pakistan's decision-making, which just became berserk. We saw a couple of extraordinary runouts. So one of them, when Shadab Khan's running back to try to be on strike, he's got Imarwati, at the other end, who's just taken over for 18, and for some insane reason, he wants to get back on strike, loses his wicked in the process. I mean, this is scrambled brains, isn't that? It made terrific theatre.

Well, Shadab is technically an all-rounder, and I know he backs himself. Imagine at the other end on 40-odd not out. He might play that kind of golden innings in the end. I really do think it was very much in the balance until Wahabriah's hit that six. And he was always lining it up. And everybody knew it. The Afghanistan players knew it.

They had three fielders in the deep on the leg side waiting for that exact shot. Everybody watching. This was, we should say, when I think 16 required of 11 balls. That's right. And he aimed a big swipe off the first ball of Rush.

He'd missed it. And then we knew he was going to do the same thing. And then that just relieved the pressure. Got things down to 10 off 10. a runner ball Gulber Dean didn't respond quickly enough didn't bring the field

in quickly enough and as a result Pakistan got over the line but there were so many I mean look we could do a two-hour podcast on this match because there were so many

different separate incidents incidents where the game could have turned there was a drop catch by Shemwari there was the extraordinary pirouette miss from Asgar Afghanistan

of course in Madwasim and the ball circled in the air in what will be known in Afghanistan as that Gulbadine over because when

Pakistan needed 48 or five with four wickets in hand, I mean, that really did feel like the goose was cooked to that point. It did. It was that over was absolutely fundamental. I mean, the area that I was kind of just pitchside watching the match, I could hear a lot of Pakistani fans making, in many, many choice terms, their dissatisfaction with Pakistan's

performance known. And, you know, in multiple languages as well, Dan, I've got to tell you, Punjabi is a beautiful language. You know, you can express yourself very nicely and subtly and quite crudely all at the same time. So, I mean, people were, that did seem like they were done and, you know, we're thinking that people are already working at scenarios with what would need to happen if we lose this game, do still qualify, what maths do I need to do? What kind of Pythagoras theorem do I have to learn now to understand what their scenarios? But, I mean, like, the fact that they did come through, the fact that they actually held in, I mean, all too often we've seen this Pakistan team fold under that kind of pressure. All too often we've seen this Pakistan team just not be able to handle it and do. a very you know they call it that that that pakistan you know that pakistan in air quotes the one that just folds and for them to just hold hang in there hold on and put their team in fourth place in that table that is very heartening it's very promising i can't imagine in under any other

circumstances that i would be this thrilled about a win over afghanistan it should be right with with the greatest of respect to afghanistan as a team Pakistan should always be beating Afghanistan. So for them to push so close and still pull out the win and for people to have the sense of satisfaction, we say always. We say always. I mean, I think in years to come, Afghanistan can only benefit from games like this and they will win some of these. I mean, they've been pipped in two 50-50 encounters and they've been pipped really because their opponents panicked a bit less than they did because they're a bit more experienced than they've played in a few more of them. But you've touched on Pakistan going to fourth on the table.

They've gone ahead of England. Their eerie sequence that mirrors 19-92 continues, loss, win, abandon, loss, win, win, win. They win one more, which is against Bangladesh. That could be enough to see them through, but it won't be if England beat India and New Zealand. That is really the equation for Pakistan. We could yet have a winner-takes-all game where Pakistan play Bangladesh. Bangladesh have still got to play India. These permutations are for then, but just,

Just on this game, once again for me, it highlighted one of the really wonderful things by this World Cup, which was the crowd, the way they were so absorbed in the match. I mentioned it on air, but when you watch a lot of cricket in England, a lot of the time, the fans, while they come along to the game, aren't necessarily 100% engaged with the minutiae of the match. Here, every run, every drop catch, every incident was greeted with blaring horns. There was absolute concentration on what was going on. There were times I've got to say today when things spilled over a little bit.

There was a documented incident outside the ground where fans scuffled with each other, which doesn't tend to happen in cricket matches. Passions got a bit heated. And at the end, we had a bit of a pitch invasion. It was quite an amicable pitch invasion. It's got to be said. It was just one of those things where people wanted to express themselves. People are urged not to do that for a whole host of reasons, and it wasn't entirely helpful.

But it does tell you something about the atmosphere here. I hope that it was fervid, it was exciting, it was engaged, and it just spilt over a little bit here and there. As it has been for all of the Pakistan matches, like the atmosphere has been electric, that noise that you hear. I mean, the only game that surpasses the noise I heard today was the Pakistan India match, right? When they came together, it was like a all different kind of crescendo at Old Trafford. But this was incredible how they can sustain themselves for seven hours. It was the hottest day of the year, Dan. I mean, you've been in this beautiful air-condition studio.

We're pitch side right in the sunshine. We've got to be in the sunshine for the correct camera shots. So we're there just absorbing all that heat all day long. And it's hot. And you just think, how do you have the energy to blow into a vooosella and a horn all at the same time? And why do you have to do it three feet from my face? Either way, it was incredible to see that energy. They've brought it every single time.

Regarding the pitch invasion, it's documented. It's made very, very clear to spectators what the consequences are for doing that. And they have to face those now. But I will say that the people that I saw jumping onto the pitch, I would have to say, probably rank amongst the least threatening-looking pitch invaders. Absolutely. Yeah, let's not overblow this. Of course.

This was not an incident of any sort of sinister, intent or malice, exactly. It was, it was excitement that bubbled up and went too far. But it was a bit like the game, really. The game sort of bubbled up and went too far for both sides. I mean, I think there'll be two shell-shock teams in that. change their chambers tonight. I think we'll be massively relieved. We saw Safra's come out before his interview

and run the full length of the ground to go and give thanks to some fans and run back again. And you don't do that normally when you beat Afghanistan. You do that because you're saying how relieved you are, don't you? This is what I'm saying to. I shouldn't be this happy, this relieved

to have, to see Pakistan defeat Afghanistan. It should be a routine. thing for this team. Obviously, with the greatest respect to Afghanistan, they've improved exponentially. They've become a much better team. But I don't think today necessarily was a reflection of how good they are as a team, rather Pakistan's, you know, kind of inconsistent, irritable, just kind of, I don't know, it's very hard to describe Pakistani cricket. Like, you run out of adjectives and you think you need to create new ones. Maybe this is what slang was invented for. But they just, they frustrate you to the point where you just think, how did you do that?

How did you turn what was supposed to be a foregone conclusion? Maybe it should have been a run fest. Maybe it should have been, you know, a bowling clinic. Maybe it should have been a very short game. But somehow it turned into like a nail-biting match that had every single person glued to their seats watching the action. People with arms raised in prayer. You know, it was intense.

Pakistan and Airport go ahead with this win. Go ahead of England. They go ahead of Bangladesh. I'm going to give Artif Nawaz the nightmare scenario because he's smiling so much. But it's only right that we're bringing back down to Earth. Bangladesh lose to India, let's us say. England loose to India and England lose to New Zealand.

Pakistan play Bangladesh in their last match at Lords. Bangladesh win it and they go through on net run rate. Because at the moment their net run rate is vastly better than Pakistan's. There is a nightmare for you to take to bed with you tonight. I'll take another thing to bed with me again. Just let me know. Who's number five in the list at the moment? Well, that is England

And who's number four? It's Pakistan. Wonderful. Let's leave it back. The TMS podcast, available every day during the Cricket World Cup. Daniel and Atif, thank you very much. We'll have more on Australia's win over New Zealand at Lords in a while. Plus, good news in our quest to find a listener to the TMS podcast in every country of the world.

But as Dan and Atif were saying, that result puts more pressure on England to beat India at Edgberston on Sunday. President Agnew is there for us. Well, thank you, Simon. Here at Edgebaston, both teams have been going through their final preparations. There's injury news about Jason Roy and Joffra Archer

to monitor. Johnny Bairstow's outspoken comments to reflect upon and, of course, England needing to sort their game out and win. So here's my chat with Owen Morgan. Well, Owen, here we are again and there's another crucial match for you.

Yes, it is. It's going to be a tough challenge. I'm a challenge that we're looking forward to and excited about. We get into the latter stages of the tournament and the group stage, and we need to start winning games. So tomorrow is another opportunity to try and produce a performance that, one, is good enough to beat India, but also a performance that I think justifies performances that we've put in over a significant period of time and a performance that you can be proud of.

Have you put your finger on where things aren't going right? I mean, is it purely the pitches, the conditions, the inability to chase? You've been playing on really sort of firm, hard, good chasing pitches for four years, and these are a bit different? No, I think it has been a different challenge. But we've said coming into the World Cup, we have played on wickets that have been a little bit indifferent, a little bit stoppy, potentially don't suit our A game, and that's fine. We have become a better side at playing on those types of wicket,

but we do need to be on top of our game in order to give us the best chance. to play our best cricket on those types of wickets and we haven't been playing our best cricket there's nothing in particular that we're complaining about the wickets we did plan for things like this it's just our performance hasn't been up to scratch and it will have to be tomorrow to beat India well your boss Ashley Giles has declared that's the best pitch that he's seen in the World Cup that puts some pressure on you

well that's bloody great news if it is and it's true that's great news because it'll just be down to performance and obviously our best game of cricket lends itself to quite an expansive, expressive performance and the games that we're used to playing in. So if it is, that's good news for us. It allows us to, I suppose, not fight our natural game a lot and just play. And team-wise, I mean, I was to ask you about Johnny Bearstow's comments the other day. I mean, that doesn't reflect the wider view, I assume, that he feels people aren't wanting England to win.

No, absolutely not. Johnny's obviously entitled to his opinion. As an individual, your experiences can be completely different, living at one end of the country to the other. Guys have spent a lot of time away from each other at home, so various different experiences, probably for him, have influenced his, I suppose, comments. For me, there has been an unbelievable amount of goodwill, good faith,

great support up and down the country for me individually, and I think for the team as well. I live in London where there's completely diverse cultures, races, religions and literally everybody has come up and wished us well on behalf of who they're with or just passing by in the street and it makes playing in a World Cup home World Cup so much more special and it makes tomorrow's game that much more exciting

I mean people reading that might worry that there's some sort of siege mentality in the team I mean that's not the case No, not the case at all. Not the case at all. Like I mentioned, Johnny's entitled to his comments. They've probably been affected by somebody saying something or criticism from a critic, which they're entitled to their own opinion as well. But absolutely not. I think collectively as a group, we do feel the goodwill and good faith going around.

Good. Team-wise, selection-wise, Jason Roy, a conversation about that. How's it coming on? Yeah, Jason is progressing nicely. If there are no hiccups, we're thinking he will be fit and providing there's no significant risk to him going forward he'll be available to play. Yeah, essentially the significant bit. I mean, is there a bit of holding a breath as far as he's concerned

or not if he does play? I think hammies are such a, I suppose, difficult area to diagnose how long people are going to be out for or how quickly they can recover. Jason has recovered very quickly. there's a conversation that's ongoing between myself Trevor Bayliss and

the medical staff about if something does happen again how long it's potentially well for if it's a couple of weeks it's not a big risk if it's months then that's when question needs to be asked

but at the moment he's looking like he will be fit and the other injury question is Joffa Archer yeah Jopher is the same Joffa didn't bowl yesterday likewise Chris Wokes but Chris is not a worry

was more preference to take a rest. Jopra still has the same niggled that he has played in the last three games with. He felt it a little bit more towards the end of the Australia game. But obviously he's going to bowl today and we're going to reassess at the end of training. And again, if we can get through training today and the warm of tomorrow, he'll be fit to play.

Just a last thought. It'll be more like Bangalore here, I think, the Birmingham tomorrow. Is that a good thing in a way? Is it going to get you going? To be honest, we'd never, we'd prefer obviously the stadium to be full of our

fans but it's just not going to happen I recall a champion's trophy final here 2012 or 13 where it was like Bangalore and I think every time we do play India it is in a way game for us regardless of where we play but that's just

the nature of Indian cricket than the following that they have it is magnificent for the game it shows the level of passion and spirit and interest that it provokes around the world from an Indian of any nationality. So let's hope tomorrow is a good day for us. That's my conversation with Owen Morgan.

Lots to reflect upon there. I'm delighted that George DeBelle from ESPN Crickin. Owen, man who knows this ground particularly well, is here to go through all of that. Where should we start? Should we start with Johnny Beirstow? I mean, I think quite an important thing that Morgan was making clear there is it's not a sort of a siege mentality that's within the team.

I mean, Barstow's comments, Morgan's very keen to say, don't reflect how the team is feeling. No, I think you have to remember what Johnny Barstow's like, do you? Do you remember when he scored that century in Colombo at number three? And he roared to everyone as if he was somehow silencing his critics, of which he hadn't had any. So I think Johnny is a man who needs to invent adversaries so he can prove them wrong. And I don't think he represents the views of anyone else at all.

And it's a shame he seems a bit chippy when he does media. because actually he's a very nice, easy-going guy, I think. But I don't think his comments are terribly helpful. Well, that's the key word, I think. I mean, helpful, because people are looking at England and say, well, can they? Can they sort their game out? Can they win these two games? Can they go flying into the semis and beyond?

If you aren't hearing comments like that from one of the leading players, after all, I think people have got a right to be concerned about that. Yeah, and I think it does come at just after Owen Morgan's slightly prickly press conference. so yeah and they played slightly nervously they have looked a bit nervous haven't they look we've been building for this tournament everyone in england for four years and it's not just about the team it's about reviving interest in english cricket there's a huge amount on these lad's shoulders and a couple of times it's shown yeah can you believe actually now here we are the england are in this situation

yeah because you know we've been watching english cricket for years you kidding it's been a lot worse than this hasn't it i actually don't think they're miles away from finding their form and I still think look it's four games and they could win the World Cup I mean they're miles better than they were at the 2015 one so I'm not hugely surprised and although I'm not massively encouraged by the way they've played

I actually still think they can do it how much of a gamble do you think they're going to take with Jason Roy because they're clearly desperate to get him back hamstrings we know it's something that he's got a bit of a record with times ticking away way, I mean, do you think that it's going to push him out there? Yes. They are, and it is a risk. I do feel sorry for poor old James of Eds. I mean, how must he feel? They're basically saying, well, what about it, James, but a guy with one leg's a fellow with you. It takes me back to those

days being picked last in school. It's a situation where they are going to take the risk, if at all possible. He's been batting quite a lot in the last week. Maybe it's only in the field that it'll have to be careful. But it shows that they're a bit desperate. I mean, they do have to win tomorrow, really. I know there are scenarios. where they can get by if they don't, but really they have to win, don't they? And he is one of the best players. What is it?

Five times he's past 50 in his last six innings, including two centuries. James Vins has got 40 runs in the tournament. There's no comparison, really. But you're asking a lot for a guy who's been out, not had a proper bat in the middle, and he is a bit of a form player, isn't he? There's an expectation, but people are going to say,

oh, great, James Vince is back, right, go out and bang us 100, but he hasn't, you know, batty in a match for a couple of weeks. Right, and against a very, very good bowling attack, and I suspect on a pitch where I'll be expected to go hard quite early. Yes. Right, well tell us about that because you are Mr Edgebaston. Ashley Giles

has said that's the best pitch of the World Cup that he has seen so far. No local bias, George. Do you think he's going to be right? It depends what you mean because some people don't like pitches which are too batsman friendly but this I think at last

will be the sort of pitch we were anticipating before the tournament, the sort of pitch where 350 might not be enough. And the difference of course is just that the sun's come out and the groundsman's had an opportunity. So I know people, I read all the papers this morning, people think it's going to turn. I don't think it will. I think what happened here in 2013, the Champions Trophy final, if you remember.

That was the same groundsman, but he was very new, and I think you would probably admit he got that one slightly wrong. And now he really knows his stuff. It's a baking hot day of the summer, isn't it? And look at it, it looks absolutely fantastic already. So I think it's going to be full of runs. They're good bowling attacks, of course. I just wonder about that. England obviously want it to be a good batting track.

That's the way they play their best cricket. They are bowling gates, you know, Virat, and Roeth Sharma. It does seem a bit of a risk, doesn't it? But anyway, they're getting what they want. Absolutely no excuses. Yeah, I think it should be a very, very good batting. And that's the last thought. I mean, what this ground is going to be like, it makes you tingle, really.

And it's going to be absolutely ranned, with Indian support mainly. And that again is something that England are going to have to, well, they've got to soak that up. Yeah, of course. And it's a brilliant thing. I mean, we know that the game in the UK is kept alive by Asian enthusiasm. So that's something that should absolutely be embraced. I don't think it will be a hostile environment at all. I don't think it was at Trent Bridge, the Pakistan game.

I just thought it was a nice environment. Look, what we wanted before the World Cup started was games with context, games with consequence. We didn't want lots of dead games. So as the ideal scenario is that it's a really exciting game, and probably for the World Cup, It probably needs England to go through, I think. And actually, for the game in this country, I think we also need that. But that's a different thing entirely.

I think it's, I'm really excited by it. Genuinely, we see a lot of cricket, don't we? And you're not always excited by tomorrow's game, you know what I mean? When the result really matters, it makes it a difference, isn't they? And they are terrific sides. So it's a real feast of cricket and, yeah, brilliant, real pleasure to be here. George, thanks for much for your company. George DeBelle, of course, from ESPN Crick Info.

There we are, Simon. We're all set up here. I must admit, it's going to be a really, really, exciting day. But just those fitness tests, first of all, before a board is bowled on Jason Roy and Joffra Archer. From BBC Radio 5 Live. This is the TMS podcast at the Cricket World Cup. Agas, thank you. Commentary on that game on 5 Live Sports Extra, Radio 4 Longwave and the BBC Sport app where you can also watch highlights during the match itself. But after this game here at Lords, Australia sit top of the table with 14 points from eight games. It doesn't mean they're going

finish top but there's a good chance that they will or they're giving themselves every chance to do that with India in second place on 11 points and ultimately a comprehensive victory for Australia by 86 runs. It felt like a good toss to win from Aaron Finch and he decided to bat first on what was a used pitch and Australia sort of ground down New Zealand gradually. They had to recover from 92 for 5 with Kerry making 71 and Kowager 80. and then Mitchell Stark got to work along with Jason Berendor. Stark again with five more wickets and he's been magnificent again in this World Cup and Berendorff has been a revelation as well in the matches that he has played of late 2 for 31 to go with his five wickets against England at Lords a few days ago. Jim Maxwell alongside me and also Jeremy Coney.

Jim, I mean Australia they seem to know how to play these World Cups. They're looking good. when they get into the strangulation mode as we saw today their confidence is surging and at the moment I'm looking forward

to them playing against I hope someone like India in the semi-finals maybe South Africa will cause them a problem or two but they get better with every game. We saw their resilience today. Five for 92 to come back from that awkward

position with the most remarkable innings from Kerry. I'm no surprise there that he's got mad at the match because he was fluent, 71 from 72 balls. And Kowaja comparatively struggled 88 off 129 and Kerry dominated that century partnership, which was that the turning point of the game up until then. New Zealand had a very good chance

of restricting Australia to a total that they may well have chased. It would have been interesting and Australia made 180, 190 to see, in fact, whether New Zealand could have attacked that target with a little bit more aggression than they showed in the early part

which eventually set them back. But at no stage that their betting ever looked like it was going to come to terms with the pitch and the bowling. One real positive for Australia today is it's been all about Finch and Warner so far. I've scored a thousand runs between them, but they were out early today.

38 for two and Australia is still won comfortably. They've still got a score together as well. Well, and Smith went too. So you have to say congratulations to Alex Carey, who is batted with as much confidence and form as anyone from the Australian team when he's been called upon in this series. So that's the most satisfying feature for Australia and the fact that Kowaja did get the chance to play innings.

You could almost say thanks to Warner and Finch for not putting on a big score today because Kauajan needed that time out there. So from a sort of preparatory position of what's to come, it was a very good day for Australia. But with the ball, they're showing more and more evidence of a team that's got the variety and the strike power that's going to be very hard to get on top of unless it's an absolute belter of a surface to battle.

Jeremy, New Zealand at times with the ball were good, 92 for 5 Australia, but that is quite a tough defeat to take, isn't it? It's a big defeat, 86 runs. It damages their net run rate. It might not come to that at the end of the group stage. What did you make of New Zealand today? I think they missed a trick with the handling of the attack, the strategy, if you like, once having a...

at side like Australia at 92 for 5. You never let your foot off the throat and you bring back your fast bowlers and if it means that if they're not got out at that point that means if lesser bowlers remain perhaps towards the end of the 40 to 50 overs, so be it. At least you've had a crack at it.

I've seen it time and time again they get away on you and things like that happen. So I thought that was just poor management of the attack actually. There is a growing concern, I think, about the spin component of New Zealand playing on slower pitches. They're just not doing the job, the two spinners that were selected. Santner has picked up four wickets for 213 runs at this stage, and New Zealand would have liked him a great deal better on these surfaces

that he would have picked up more wickets and created more opportunities. He'll be very frustrated. He only bowled three overs today. went for 23 runs so seven and a half and over and it was because he was swept Kawaja got stuck into him with the reverse sweep so did Kerry so either his line was not quite

or he wasn't either prepared to zero it in on the pads or he's got to do some things and learn how to cope with that because he is not I mean if he doesn't bowl for New Zealand are they going to use someone like Santner so do he went for sixes today he's been kept out of the team until today

and suddenly he's thrown probably a game late really he should have been playing at Edge Bunsen and he wasn't successful there and so you know so he wasn't used so he came he was brought in here didn't work so suddenly the captain again has left to bowl 7-0s and bowled 7-0s for 25 even though he hasn't bowled

so there is a whole issue surrounding that and how New Zealand going to approach that spinning component in the rest of of the matches confronting them. So management and spin bowling. I thought Ferguson did his job okay. Bolt was okay today. I thought even de Grondon went for only sort of fours, but he shouldn't have opened the bowling. Frankly, young Ferguson, the virile fast bowler, should have been used. You know, I mean, he had bowled, say, someone like Warner out when he went to Australia, just with a bit of extra pace. Why don't they give him a crack? You can always pull him off and then

bring in de Grand Dom. I think they do things the wrong way around. The TMS podcast available every day during the Cricket World Cup. Right, Jim and Jeremy thank you and his Altzman alongside me. Now you're not happy. That man in the match award is going to another batsman. I'm slightly less unhappy than I was

the other day when Finch got it in the Australia-England game when clearly probably Stark should have had it and maybe Berendorf today. Both of those, you could make an argument for Berendorff's two early wickets shaping the game. But Kerry did bat very well, particularly in the context of the game he hit 11

4s in 72 balls one every 6.5 deliveries there were only 24 other boundaries in the entire match everyone else scored a boundary every 20 delivery so he scored boundaries three times as often as everyone else so it was a strikingly good innings albeit only 70 odd

on the scorecard but Stark 5 for 26 and not mad of the match seems a little bit harsh I guess he didn't bat very well did he for his golden duck. His stats as we keep talking about are completely

extraordinary. He's got 24 wickets in this tournament. Three more will take him past Glenn McGrath's 26, which is the most ever by bowler in a World Cup. He had 22 in 8 matches in the last World Cup as well. So 46 in 16 matches. Only one other bowler has ever taken more than 35

in a 16 match streak in World Cups. They're almost mind-bending his stats in this tournament. He's taken, that was his, at the 18th time, he's taken forfe in one lane to national cricket in 83 innings. Of the 13 other bowlers with 13 or more forfeers, they've all played at least 160 matches. He has a truly extraordinary force in this format of the game.

I don't know. Now, I'm pleased to say we're making good progress in our attempt to find a listener to this podcast in every country in the world. After Scott Reed and Charles Dagnall went through the list of countries we still need last, like mangling most of the pronunciations. We've been in good form, getting a few more ticked off overnight. Akish Kolkar, I wanted to email in and announce my support from Kuwait, having finished a three-week project here for work. I'm so glad to be back in London in a few hours

to watch the England versus India game on Sunday. Also, Swadine Sangram Swain and Lionel Hooper have got in touch, who were also listening in Kuwait. Novi Paulson says, I'm flying to China, but I am over Afghanistan. listening to the podcast. Does that count? No, it does not count. However, Anshuman Mahanti,

who refers to himself as the nomadic Indian, says, I was recently on a trip to Afghanistan. I listened to your podcast from Masari Sharif, which is a few hours driving the capital of Kabul. So yes, Afghanistan is now being ticked off also says Anshuman, India is going to win the World Cup. Stated as a bald fact, we could all now go home. Well, I thought Australia were winning about a couple of minutes ago.

They got a good chance for both of them have. Christopher Calabocerosi. I'm on my way to Sautomi and Principi, I think. In the absence of a radio-stroke television, I'll be relying on the daily podcast to keep me updated with the tournament. The route to Sautomi takes me via Lisbon and Accra in Ghana. Whilst I believe these countries have been ticked off, I'll be sure to be listening to the latest podcast when we fly over Benin.

Well, we're not counting Benin, apparently, but we are taking Sautomi and Principi. Yes, airspace, I'm afraid, does not count. Chris Hogg has just sent us an email entitled Vanuatu podcast listeners with no words but a picture of himself in Vanuatu. We are taking that. That is now ticked off this Vanuatu where I believe Prince Philip is a god officially. Isn't he a god everywhere?

Well, not officially everywhere. No, that's probably true. David Watt, just been listening to your latest podcast and your continuing search for listeners in all the countries of the world. I now have access to my emails and have just returned for a wonderful holiday with my wife to celebrate a significant birthday for me and our 30th wedding anniversary we were touring the Baltic states

Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania highlighted in bold. The last country is I believe still on your rapidly diminishing list. We've ticked off Lithuania. Not anymore. Tom Giles, I'm currently listening in Helsinki, Finland where I'm having a quick weekend break. I remember

Finland was on your list of missing countries for weeks and I was hoping I'd fill the gap, but unfortunately it was not to be. However, I may still be able to help you. You can't give up on these things. best friend is Uruguay, and I know Uruguay is on if you're missing countries. His parents are currently back in Uruguay visiting family, so could this

incredibly tenuous link count towards your total? Not unless you make them listen to this podcast. Then yes. None of them are cricket fans. Well, just ditch them for your life. They're not worth having, cluttering up your busy time if they are not cricket fans. And I highly doubt,

continues Tom. I highly doubt they will listen to the podcast. Their loss, so this could be as close as you get. No, no. Make them listen. reduce them to cricket and change their life for the better. For the last time, it doesn't count unless they listen to the podcast in that country. Chris Turner, formerly of Grimsby, living in Singapore and working in the shipping industry, I've enjoyed the podcast and your challenge to cover the world off with listeners.

An idea to get the Marshall Islands ticked off, make an appeal for a crew member on board a Marshall Island flagged vessel to drop you a line. Indeed, make a plea to all sailors listening to let you know if they just happen to birth in any of the countries. if that's possible. Good idea. Any sailors out there. Hello sailors get in touch. That's going old school, isn't that? For the early days of cricket touring, huge great ocean voyages. The Australians should be away from over almost a year when they came here in the 19th century. And we'll have to do that again in the future, won't we? When we can't fly anymore because the problems with the... Oh, I'll use teleportation. I just email players across the world. I'm pretty sure Chris Gale must have played at least one 20-20 league by Skype, hasn't he? So, we have just 33 countries out of the 193 UN member states left, including Uruguay, Grenada, Haiti, Tonga and Venezuela, and still the elusive North Korea.

Yeah, that doesn't entirely surprise me. No. Because if you were listening, you might not even better contact us if you're listening to North Korea, I don't know. Yeah, there might be an absolute deluge of surface mail stuck at Pyongyang sorting office. They fail to let it get through. What is this? TMS must be some mysterious espionals organized. And they listen to it. They must think all these numbers.

some kind of code and let me let me let you into a secret they are right we've only got 14 days left of the world cup no don't say that and we got quite a few countries still to tick off but we are making rapid progress england against india don't forget that listen out on sunday it's a big match in case you didn't know goodbye for now the tms podcast at the cricket world cup download and subscribe via the bbc sounds app for a new episode every day Thank you.