Test Match Special - England complete historic clean sweep in Pakistan.

Episode Date: December 20, 2022

England won the Third Test in Karachi by 8 wickets to clinch a record breaking three nil series win. Pakistan have never before been handed a clean sweep home or away. Analysis from Jonathan Agnew, Vic Marks, Alex Hartley and Andy Zaltzman plus we hear from Ben Stokes, Harry Brook, Ben Duckett, Brendon McCullum and the retiring Azhar Ali.

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Racine runs in bowls to Duckett, who slashes that for four-through point. And England have done it. They've achieved something here that nobody's ever done. England have come to Pakistan and they've won 3-0. Emphatic victories, all of them.

This one by eight wickets. And how fitting that the captain, Ben Stokes, who's led this turnaround from the front, is out there. If someone had suggested at Hobart in January that we'll be witnessing this, England winning 3-0 in Pakistan after that debacle of an Ashes series, people would have laughed in your face.

But it has happened. It's a remarkable transformation in English test cricket, led by Stokes and Brendan McCollum. And they will start to celebrate now, that's for sure. Many of them have brought their flights forward to the early hours of the morning. There's a long time between now and then, and I think they'll enjoy themselves. And quite rightly so, what a victory. And what a tour it's been, too. What a series.

A lot of people came here. A little unsure about how it would be, the security and all of those things. Well, it's been a triumph. A triumph from Pakistan's perspective, at least in terms of administration, and the way that the tour has been handled and run. Not so much on the field, of course. But the series has passed off happily and safely. And I'm sure that many people who are listening now

might have thought about coming to this, but they'll definitely come to the next in two years' time. I really hope you've enjoyed listening to our coverage from here. The colour, the charm of this remarkable country and the welcome that everybody's had and is how pleased everyone has been that England have come here again after so long. and as a rally is going to lead everybody off now

a nice little chat with him this morning he's looking forward to playing a couple of years of county cricket he said he did smile at the Don Bradman comparison at least he lasted four balls whereas Don Bradman only two his duck and his fine linings in test cricket and he's coming over now to the England camp actually

and again we talk about the series it's been played in such a good spirit and that has very rarely been the case of test series between England and Pakistan over the years it's just been played in the best possible way hard on the field very competitive

but with a lot of respect from one another well that was fun such fun I think the way England have played their cricket throughout this test series is their job was to make test cricket entertaining their job was to go out there and enjoy it and Brendan McCollum has said to the players

why have you lost your love for the game Why are you not playing it like you're in the back garden with your family and you're enjoying it? And you can see now the way they play their cricket, they enjoy it. They're having a good time. They're travelling the world playing with their best mates and you can tell. And the way they've played it has been fantastic and you can tell that. Yeah, he did that with New Zealand. And it worked wonderfully when he was captain.

And it strikes me that in the days gone by, a lot of England players before the central contracts, they'd miss out on pakistan they might miss out on india as well it's a bit uncomfortable we won't go there well and everyone thought oh we're going to pakistan next winter i'm not sure this lot have had a great time uh and they've demonstrated you know that it's a great tour to come on a great challenge and they you're right they enjoy it in a way that is almost unprecedented comes from the top yeah yeah absolutely i mean i go back Well, I go back to dear old Ashley Giles, who we love, saying, probably to you, you know, it doesn't matter who was captaining, who was coaching this team. It wouldn't have made any difference.

Well, I'm not so sure now. It is an amazing transformation. It's great to watch. It's great to watch this team just loving it in sometimes difficult conditions, but they just love it. The rest of the world's cricketing nations will be thinking. How are they doing this? Yeah. And we've got to play them soon.

What are they going to be like? Do you think everyone, though, will be saying the same question, wait and see what happens this summer against Australia? Of course they are, because what they said before we came here, but can they do it on a flat one in Pakistan? But can they do it there? Well, they've proven that wrong, haven't it? To an extent we said that before the South African Sues.

You know, they've got a really potent bowl of time. And they lost the first test. They weren't being able to play like that, and they lost the first test. But that's because, quote, we didn't go out enough. And now there's people going, oh, well, Pakistan have had so many debutsons. Well, so of England. It's a mindset thing. They're revolutionising test cricket.

The other thing that occurs to me, just looking at the makeup of this team, it's quite a young team. You know, Ben Duckett is still his 20s, Zach Crawley, Ray and Ahmed, obviously. The senior players, however, who've been around the circuit of players, but they're quite a special band of senior players. You obviously got your captain. You've got Joe Root, you almost feel sorry for Joe Root, who went through all the agonies of being England captain and going through that losing streak.

But he is so obviously behind Stokes and up for it. And then you've got, actually, he comes into this category now. Mark Wood, who's 32 of a fast bowler he's knocking on. But, you know, he will also be the least cynical, most positive sort of character. So they're quite lucky that they haven't got any grumpy old pros there. They've got a selection of senior players. who will, and Jimmy, of course, I forgot Jimmy, who really is a senior player, who, you know, buy into this new non-hierarchical, we're all in it together, everyone could say whatever they like or, you know, have a voice, and play with this staggering freedom.

The last time England won a game without Anderson or Broad was before Broad made his test debut. Yeah, 2007, wasn't it? Well, not Pakistan do, because they've been beaten and they've been beaten quite severe. Really, three nil. They've got New Zealand coming. They've got all the same sort of atmosphere again, although it has been more relaxed here in Karachi. But on their go, it's quite relentless for them. Well, Azar's gone. Imam will presumably be fit and come back.

He's actually scored quite a few runs. I mean, they've got quite a few batsmen who have scored runs. Shaquille, you know, has had his first series, has looked really good. Shafix scored runs. Their problem lies really, especially on these surfaces, which don't give much. that the bowling attack has not looked very potent until Abra came in and he was a rookie from almost nowhere they didn't really have a way of getting wickets and

that will worry them but the huge difference between the teams we've pointed out through the series as the seamers you look at the spinners England's collectively 33 wickets average 37 Pakistan's 35 wickets average 35 so not a great deal of difference in England spinners were very productive in this third and final test But the seamers, England's collectively took 26 wickets at 24 and dominated the first two second innings performances for England and Pakistan seamers. 11 wickets at 65, so almost a 40 runs per wicket difference between them. I mentioned how an experience this Pakistan seam attack was and England with experienced highly skilled operators of really that's been the difference between the sides. It says it all. In years to come, when we talk about the 3-0, someone might say,

who are the spinners then for England there? How have they done it? But actually, you're right. It's the quick bowlers with high skill who have ignored the fact that there's basically nothing on the surface for them, who have demonstrated their ability to move the ball regardless, but a wobble scene, but a reverse swing. But heart, well, there look at Mark Wood, is running in on a 22 yards there, offering him absolutely nothing, bounding in, ball off. ball after ball, high speed, bowling short, bowling with some hostility. Yeah, I mean the classic way, as Aga's knows, better than I do,

but Seamus get their wickets, generally speaking, is the outside edge, Gordon, the slip cordon. Well, we haven't had a slip cordon. And I can't remember, there might have been one called in the slip cordon. I can think of a couple, or at least one, called it leg slip, but not at sort of second slip or maybe not even at first slip. So they've had to adjust, but Jimmy, Jimmy's been around the world he's got a fantastic record in recent times in the subcontinent where the

ball generally refuses to move Robinson is in a sense because he's had less experience has been staggering yeah and I like Bill excellent because it does encourage you to bow straighter yeah which obviously you have to do on these because you're not really bowling that outside off stump channel because there's no one there well they're not going to get the edge it's not a carrier to slip so there's no one there so that does at least encourage you as a symbol to bowl that bit straighter so he's bowling at the stumps he's bowling at the the pads. And the other thing they've done actually is quite old-fashioned is that they've just

dried the batsmen up. The Pakistan batsmen were willing to attack against the spinners, you know, attack the old good ball, but against the seamers they were pretty cagey. They weren't going to take any risks and they dried them up and then the mistake came or the edge down the leg side or whatever it was. So I mean that's a terrific achievement. Well, to highlight that, England's seamers not only had a massive superiority in average, but they went at 2.6 and over. Pakistan's at 5.3. three and over. What was England's overall scoring rate in this test series? That would be good question I guess you can you can fiddle around with a calculator for the whole series it's it's a

it's a I was just preparing it if I find the correct window but it was 5.5 over across three tests which is the all-time record for a series a team in a three test or more series time for the skipper Ben Stokes talking to Simon Mann three weeks ago if I said to you England to win this series three nil what would you have said hope so that'd be nice you thought it was possible to come out here and do what you've done yeah well i think you know the way in which we speak and i've spoken obviously since i've done this role is um it's almost just you know not worrying about the result um just going out playing expressing ourselves as a team and trying to give ourselves the best chance of winning and always thinking like that um so yeah i guess you know winning three nil um

It can work on the odd occasion. I wonder how much a pleasure this particular victory has given you because you lost the toss and you've given them a good beating, you've won it more convincingly than the other two matches. Yeah, obviously losing the toss and then, you know, obviously splitting the rolls around and which the way we were batting and bowling from the first two test matches was very pleasing. You know, obviously they put 300 on the board to start with

and then we had to go out, you know, under, well, not scored. ball pressure but runs on the board and just sort of different mentality I guess but the way that we went out there it was it was like we were just continuing on the way in which we were playing from the first two games and then obviously with the ball as well was just yet another continuation of all the good work that we've been doing so yeah winning the first two obviously winning the toss is crucial out here but then to obviously come and win so convincing they have to losing the toss yeah very pleasing Ray and Ahmed makes his debut makes it look simple takes seven 11 wickets, how do you assess this contribution?

Yeah, I mean, obviously, yesterday, you know, he bowled us to victory. You know, that spell of 10, 11 overs, taking five wickets and very big wickets of Pakistan was huge for us and being able to come back here this morning and needing 50. And then a continuation of that was that opening partnership between Ducky and Zach as well. But going back to Ray Ann, you know, 18 years old, you know, to see someone at such a young age go out and perform the way he's done is really, really exciting. going forward for English cricket, definitely nowhere near the finished article, but lucky enough to be in this environment here,

we can go out and express himself and not feel that added pressure that sometimes can come with playing international cricket. And I think he just really enjoyed himself out there. And the one thing as well from watching, you know, as he bowled more, was the confidence that he then got within himself to come to me and speak about fields and what he wanted and I just sort of let him go with what he wanted to do.

So it's a great sign for us going forward that we've got someone like that to, you know, build up and get some experience into and who knows where he can go but you know seriously exciting knowing that we've got someone like Rayan and you know obviously leg spin and batter as well so very good for us you delayed his entry into the attack 153 whatever it was what was the thinking behind that yeah we got the balls just started reversing out of nowhere really for us and and obviously you know the way in which our team is operated when the balls reversing has been has been very good

you know we've managed to to burst the game open when we've had the ball reversing so you know that's why you sort of seen me Woody and Robo operate but then as soon as it stopped going that's when we bought Rayan on because you know I felt that the leg spin of Rayan is the man who's going to come on and change the game and you know leg spinners get wickets and yeah you probably look back because he came on and got five and ten over so I do not bring him on earlier but you know he's got five wickets he's he's he's He's boldest to victory, so I don't think we can look too much into at what time I bought him on, but there was obviously a reason as to why you've seen me, Woody and Robo operate just because of the reverse swing we found.

Your coach said he's just plinking it at the moment. You know, he's after this record. He's just plinking it. I think you tried to win the game with the sixth, didn't you, which would have broken the record. Yeah. I mean, I've had this man on my shoulder for quite a while now, and he is Brendan McCullum. so he's going to be on there for another couple of months before we head to New Zealand but yeah I know we're level I do want to take it off him but yeah I knew that I would be in

for a little bit of banter when I got off the field today because I just couldn't quite reach the boundary on a few occasions so yeah how special was it for you to be out there in the middle though when the winning runs were hit we won the game so if I was there or not don't think it would have made too much difference to be honest and just a few final thoughts if I said to you know what What was the key to winning here, or what were the one or two things that made the difference? What would you say to that? Finding a way to take 20 wickets, putting pressure back onto their bowling attack at every given opportunity when we're batting. Very well done, Ben. Enjoy your Christmas and see you in the new year.

Thank you very much. Cheers, guys. There we are then. Ben Stokes. I mean, he's had a, look at his figure's modest, really. I like the way he batted today. He couldn't quite get that six. No. But he was quite measured. He was going to win the game. That was priority one. but you know what has he done was it

nine out of ten now and not easy and not an easy ten either it is staggering what he's achieved and it's just about unprecedented and I mean Andy will confirm this he's made more field changes

per match than any other England captain I'd like you to confirm that Andy I don't track field changes but I'm prepared to take a punt and say yes average of about 1.3 per ball. I reckon you could be right because do you know what he's done so brilliantly is he's done things in an unconventional way and he's changed the fields and he's had these

ultra attacking fields on four, four, balls, four, five and six when actually you normally spread the field and he's done things in a different way and it's worked for England. Let's hear from the man who I assume is man of the series. Harry Brooke talking to Simon Mann. Well Harry, many congratulations. player of the series and you've only played four test matches how does that sound yeah very good um yeah good feeling obviously to come out here and do something no other team's done before win three nil um obviously an amazing achievement for everybody and

it's all put towards our hard work and uh and we've been phenomenal this trip what's been the difference for you out here because i've been out here a couple of times now it's uh it's it's quite lucky that i've started my test career here obviously knowing the pitches knowing quite a lot of their bowlers and then adapting to conditions as quickly as possible. Obviously the pitches have been slightly different a couple of pitches with spun

but yeah the way I play and the way the team have been playing I think I fitted pretty well at the minute. I mean you look a banker in the side now after four test matches but you took essentially Johnny Berstow's place I heard you say the other day that Johnny would come back into the side

and replace it. I mean Johnny will come back but you're not going to be moving out of this side are you? That's not my decision to make but yeah I think obviously Johnny's a phenomenal player and I'm pretty sure he'll get back in the side could you would you be happy moving around the order I mean could you open for example yeah I'd be happy to move around the order

I just want to play cricket for England for as long as possible so it doesn't really matter for me where I bat I've still got a job to do and I'm still going to back the same way I have done what about the achievement of coming if I said to you three weeks ago you're going to win the series three now what do you've said to me I'd probably believe it to be honest the way the boys are playing Stokesy said last night

the amount of belief that he has in everybody and the amount of belief that everybody has in and each one of us is phenomenal and yeah I think I think I would have said yeah I agree what about Rayhan Ahmed's debut in this test match I mean

it's almost like everything that happens this England team at the moment seems to work yeah it's phenomenal we're always taking the positive options obviously Ray's a very positive player. He's a leg spinner, so he's always looking to take wickets, and then with the bat, he showed

he wants to try and wag it, so he's fit the category quite well, and obviously a dream debut for him. What about for you now the IPL auction at the end of the week? Are you really desperately keen to play in the IPL if you can? Yeah, absolutely. It's a competition that I've

always looked at. I used to watch when I was younger. It's probably the best, well, it is the best franchise competition out there. So hopefully I get picked up. If I don't, then so be it. But, yeah, I'll be watching closely. And what about between now and the next cricket you've got? What have you been doing?

Is it rest or are you going to be back in the nets working hard? No, I'll be resting. I'll be having quite a bit of family time, a bit of Christmas. A bit of food at Christmas, obviously, a fair bit, actually. But no, yeah, family time, downtime, chill out. Well, very well played and congratulations. Thank you very much. Cheers.

All the best, sorry. What a series. Harry Brook had 300 and a score of 87. He's averaging 93 at a strike rate of 93. And let's hear now from Ben Duckett then, who has also been speaking to Simon Mann. Well, Ben, this has been a remarkable autumn for you, hasn't it? Come to Pakistan, did well on the T20s and great success in the test series. Did you have that belief you could come here and do that? Yeah, I'm definitely enjoying batting out here.

Yeah, obviously the success in the T20s definitely gave me a bit of a boost. And I felt confident coming out here. knowing what to expect. But, you know, against a decent attack, you've still got to go and put the runs in. So I'm delighted that I stuck to my game throughout and went well. Did you try to win the game last night? I'd be lying if I said no, yeah.

I think we definitely gave it a go. I think if it wasn't for a few reviews in a couple of wickets, we might have got closer. What about the team success here? I mean, Threena in Pakistan, and that is a significant achievement. Yeah, you know, it just feels strange. it feels like we've won pretty convincingly

so I think it's probably something that we'll look back on as a squad and probably realise how incredible it is to achieve what we have done but yeah it just feels strange we're just trying to enjoy our cricket you know playing a certain way which is clearly going very well

different sort of challenges ahead New Zealand and then the ashes I mean can you personally play in that same aggressive positive way against different sorts of attacks in different conditions? I certainly try. Yeah, I mean, you know, that's kind of my role.

That's why I've been picked to try and put the attack to them at the top of the order. You know, am I going to score us consistently in England? You know, maybe not. But the one thing I want to do is when I do get runs, go and get big runs and put some winning positions. And what do you do now? What's ahead for the next month or so before New Zealand? I've got a bit of a bit of a break, actually. So, yeah, it'd be nice to spend some time at home and just relax.

well happy Christmas and very well played and you thank you very much he had a very good series isn't he Ben Duckett and he played actually the role precisely he was selected to do sweeping reverse sweeping absolutely pain to bowl out for the spinners perspective yeah yeah well if you pick Ben Duckett that's what you pick him to do that's what he does you know in his day job at Nottingham's show probably he's a natural aggressor but he's also got the maturity now he obviously played for England about five years ago and had a rough time in the end but he's gone back he's honed his game but more

importantly he's worked out what his game is and not to have that when he first played for England you know there's always should I play my natural aggressive game or should this is a test match and it gets confusing but now he's absolutely clear in his mind and that's why he picked him if you pick Dom's Liberty you expect him to essentially bat time if you pick Ben Duckett you expect him yeah to take the bowlers on whoever they are and he's he's so clear in his mind that that's what he'll do feels to me that it's quite an important series for him in New Zealand he's going to show that he

can yeah open the batting against a ball that's moving round again I got we've got an eye on Australia and therefore there's two important test matches for there are it's it manganoo in Wellington they can be day-nighter yeah they can be very flat pitches though if I were New Zealand actually against this England team you don't know what to expect but I'd try and get some fairly spicy pitches. They've got some good seeds and see what happens then. They won't change the English approach,

but, you know, they might get a few hedges along the way. I mean, it would be fascinating, actually, to sort of compare and contrast how New Zealand go out here. And whether they try and emulate what England have done in approach, certainly in the field, they might do. And compare how they get on against the same Pakistan side to how England have dominated here. I think teams will naturally take on that more aggressive, you know,

role now because they've seen that it's successful. And there's a fine balance. Of course there is. You've got to be aggressive and positive without being reckless. And I think England are getting to that stage, but they are still learning about it. But other teams, I think they're going to have to take it on. They're going to have to, you know, up the run rate a little bit,

be more aggressive with their fields, be funkier because, I mean, Ben Stokes and Brendan McCleham now have proven that it works. Well, the other thing that is fascinating, and I've always thought this, actually, is that when attacking batsmen come off, you've got all these great bowlers around the world, but even the great bowlers, if someone keeps hitting their good balls for four, they'd learn their bad ones, they're a bit mystified, and they start to bowl worse as a consequence.

And there have been times, I think, where we forgot that. You know, it's a bit like when Pakistan had been facing, Jimmy Anderson in this series. They don't really try to attack him in any way. And that just, I mean, Jimmy, he's not going to bowl any bad balls. And he knows if he doesn't do that here, they were just going to play him and play him. So he's never going to concede any run. So he might bowl 20 overs and only get two wickets, but he's only gone for 32,

and he's controlled the game. So it'll be fascinating to see this lot when they come up against, you know, more spicy conditions and better bowlers. Cricket is such a funny game, isn't it? You know, you've got somebody like Mark Wood that steams in, bowls the ball at 97 miles an hour, and a batter goes, nah, not playing that one. Don't fancy hitting that one.

Well, this England team don't play like that. They go, pace on the ball, let me hit it. They don't, not face anybody as quick as Mark would, but they're changing cricket. Jimmy Anderson runs in, and batters leave ball after ball after ball. And it's like, he's thinking, what am I doing? Well, it's the point in this,

where now England are completely changing that. They're going, we're going to play at every ball, We're going to hit the ball into the gaps, and it's working. You do need the personnel, though, don't you? I mean, Crawley, Duckett, Pote, Root, Brook, Stokes. They're all aggressors, really. You've lined that up with Abdullah Shafi, Sharmuessoud, Azar Ali, Barbarazam, Soshaquil, I mean, they are just different players.

They are different, and you wouldn't have said that they are necessarily better before this series started, because there's some raw players in that England set up. I mean, and the other amazing thing, really, is that, you know, before we set off for the last two, three years, England have only really had two batters that you could trust, which was Joe Roop and Ben Stokes. And neither of them have scored many runs at all. And yet they've still

scored stacks as a team. That is quite exciting. But it'll be more interesting, or be interesting how they respond if we do get some spicier pitches, whether it be in New Zealand coming up or next summer against Australia. We'll hear from Brandon McCollum shortly. Yeah, well, we've sung his praises,

but I think I'll just go back one's time. I mean, Rob Key has paid a blinder since he took over in his own quiet way. It's the independent thinking to just go for that man and persuade him to come. When everyone was saying, well, you know, Gary Kirsten's been round with the ropes, he knows the ropes. He would be a very sound choice. But to go out there and decide on Brendan McCullum. And then also he probably may have needed. and persuading to come, to excite him to come.

I mean, it's a big punt. He was not the obvious choice back in April. He wasn't. He was a real outsider. Maybe he'll do the whiteboard, because he's been frankly good at that. He thought more differently than that and got him. It was an exceptional choice.

Yeah, yeah. It really was. I mean, Matthew Mott was perhaps a little more obvious because of his success already. Yeah, yeah. But Brandon McCullum was just untried, untried in this form of the game. But it confirms what I've always thought.

Actually, if you're England top coach, it's not about technical stuff. It is about mind. That's where dear Peter Moore struggled. He was a great county coach, but he was always putting pressure on him in a way. The main thing that the England coach has to do, because the scrutiny is so great, is take that pressure off, and he's done that brilliantly. Not many people have managed that. Right, as promised, let's hear then from England's coach, Brendan McCullum, talking to Simon Mann.

Well Brendan, how do you sum that up? Yeah, obviously incredibly satisfying. I think it's been quite an incredible three and a half, four weeks for this side, not just on the field, but I've seen some real growth and camaraderie develop off the field as well. And, you know, you walk away from this tour saying we've achieved something really special and this group will never forget it. So a really awesome three and a half weeks. I mean, coaches often say, you know, we're always learning.

What have you learnt from being here about your team? team, about some of the individual players? Oh, you learn a bit more about them off the field because you kind of spend a lot more time together as well than in the subcontinent, especially when you've got some security restrictions around you. So you learn a bit more about what makes guys tick and kind of how they like to spend their social time

and who they kind of hang around with a little bit more. So all that's great information for when, you know, you're having to have conversations with guys around skill or pressure situations. So I've learned a lot from that point of view. I thought these guys were good anyway, so to see that talent come out isn't necessarily a lesson as such or something I've learned, but it's just confirmation of how good these guys really are. And I also learned I guess I've got a really great job.

Did you play, in your view, perfect or almost perfect cricket for the conditions out here? Good question. Look, I think if we look at all three test matches in isolation is probably the best thing to do because I think every ground, every condition is challenged us in different ways and some challenged us tactically, some challenged us technically, some challenged us mentally and you add in all the other mixtures of guys were incredibly ill right throughout this tour and there's been battling that and being away from home and security restrictions, etc., which have actually been okay.

and you think to be able to then play the style of cricket we have in each three of those situations you'd say we've got it pretty close there's always room for improvement we've got it pretty close I think yeah I wonder where that room is for improvement though you've come to Pakistan and won 3-0 yeah no we're happy we're pretty happy with that so and actually I think Pakistan played some excellent cricket as well you know it's obviously they'll they've been criticized a little bit but you know what I think both teams have played a series which has been incredibly watchable and there's games all three of those games could have gone

either way there's some defining moments where some of our key players stepped up and and got the job done for us but you know I think Pakistan still played some some good cricket as well so good series three nil was a great result and some memories created forever which is fantastic you've had your first look at Rehan Ahmed in international cricket what were your observations probably the same as everyone else is he's got a real future I think he's a guy who has been on the radar of English cricket for a little while. It took some courage from Stokesy and a few people to thrust him into this opportunity

and the more that we are prepared to do that, then the more we can discover how talented people are and how much they can grow on the big stage as well. I think the important thing for Aaron is that we continue to look after him. He won't be in every squad. I encourage him to play as much franchise cricket as what he can as well and get as many experiences around the globe and playing with different players

and playing under different coaches and playing in different conditions and whatever we can do to try and increase his ability to learn within the next few years is going to definitely help him. His skill's not a problem, his attitude's absolutely brilliant. We've just got to get as much experience into him as we can and that's not just a test level but it's in leagues and things as well so couldn't be happier for him and I think they'll give quite a lot of kids motivation around

England as well that you know if you work hard enough and you've got some skill and the game is your passion you can actually achieve it maybe sooner than what you thought so he's in the IPL draft tones to me as if you're actually really keen for him to be picked up if that's possible it'd be great yeah it'd be awesome if he did I don't know I've been involved with the IPL a couple of times sometimes it works out for guys and sometimes it doesn't but look I think why not? Why not get an opportunity to go and play under different coaches

and different captains and rub shoulders with different players and pick up those experiences? I mean, what 18-year-old kid anywhere else in the world cricket is going to get those chances, so I think we should encourage it. I know there's a bit of time to go until the Ashes but do you see him being part of an Ashes squad

or an Ashley's team? You guys do this all the time, man. Let's just enjoy 3-0. We're talking months down the line. I suppose it's your assessment of him as the cricket what you've seen, you know, could he play in that sort of big stage? Yeah, why not? I think, you know, what we're seeing here in this game is he's a fully-fledged international cricketer

who has ability to make a difference in games when games are on the line. That's a rare talent, right? So, yeah, let's deal with that when the time's right. But, you know, if conditions suit, then he'll certainly be in the conversations here. How do you get Johnny Basto back in this team? Well, as soon as he's fit, he's back in the side, no doubt. But again, we'll just work that out. down the line.

I think you don't try to crowbar anything and I think you just let things unfold and when the time's right you make decisions you need to make and if they are tough conversations and tough decisions then so be it but it's a much better place to be than scrambling round for bikes. So like we're the guys who have been here, the guys who played throughout the summer, Johnny Stuart Broad, you know all the boys Jimmy's who's obviously gone back, all the guys who have been involved right throughout the summer and right throughout this series have brought into what we've been trying to achieve and I think.

thank them for all of that and maybe not all of them will be a part of it moving forward but whatever happens we've we've created some memories which hopefully everyone that's been a part of it will be able to take with them and what do you do now as a new zealand tour in february what what your plans for the next sort of month or so play some golf spend some time with the family maybe drink a few red wines and enjoy enjoy the summer until uh till their boys arrive in new zealand and i'm looking forward to showing them around new zealand and hopefully we're able to get the get the chocolates over there well very well play Thanks very much indeed.

Thanks, gosh. Cheers. Well, there you go. That's fairly typical. Brendan McCullum Fair, really. Let's give you a little bit back in a gentle, humorous sort of a way. Simon persisting.

They're perfectly valid questions, of course they are. But the coach's perfectly happy at the moment. It's to dwell on the 3-0 win here and everything else will take care of itself, which is kind of the way he deals with things. So reaction from England there. How about Azarelli, a rather sad, final appearance for him,

a fourth ball duck. and he's been reflecting on that and his career with Simon Mann. Well, as a career in just a moment, but first, how do you reflect on this match? Obviously, you know, it's quite disappointing the way it ended. Obviously, we wanted to win the game, but I think England were too good again, this game as well. So, heads off to England, the way they played throughout the series, and we couldn't answer every challenge they threw at us. we couldn't answer each and every of them.

So, yeah, they've been playing very good cricket. And we had played good cricket in patches, but we couldn't capitalize on the occasion where we could have stepped up and get ahead of the game. We had our opportunities. We couldn't take them. How surprised have you been by England out here, their approach, the way they've played in these conditions?

No, I'm not surprised at all. We all knew that they're going to play like this, whatever the conditions are. So, yeah, but we didn't play well enough to counter that aggressive approach. But I think, again, if we could capitalize on the opportunities we had to win games, the result could have been a little different. Yeah, because that second test match was so tight, wasn't it? Yeah, it was very tight.

And at one stage, we were looking really, you know, good to win the game. that spell from wood was made the difference we got a couple of set batsmen out so that was a main turnaround there and also in this game also we had opportunity we got four or five wickets quite a decent time and we had 150 round 150 lead to go they were still training for 150 so we we could have got a couple of more wickets there we could have been ahead of the game unfortunately it didn't happen Do you think the way England play is an example to other teams that they could play like this or they might try to play like this? Obviously, the game always keep changing.

We have seen ODI cricket change. We have seen T20 cricket obviously making impact as well. Obviously, England has taken an initiative in some extent that they started this. But I think the other teams will obviously look at it and how they can. learn from it and also you know what how they can adapt to these these these tactics as well so I think it will take time for the teams to do but I think England is very well equipped for that as well so it's not just playing this brand of cricket it's also having the capability of doing this I think England have chosen a team who can do

that and if other teams can do you know can select a team like this and who can play aggressive like this and have the skills as well. So I think they will be able to do that. But I think it will take time for every team to do this. But I still believe every team has their own strength. And if they play at their best, they can challenge any team. Let's look back at your career. How difficult was this test match to play for you?

Because you weren't in the last game. You come in for one game. You know it's going to be your last match. There's all sorts of presentations around it. Can you actually sort of focus on the cricket? Yeah it was quite emotional obviously but you know I wanted to play in front of obviously the home crowd and the last game I wanted to obviously play a hundred test matches but this was my last season which I have planned it wasn't happening

so I thought like it's better to call it a day and obviously I was available for the selection so I you know but I was I was quite emotional but I felt quite at ease as well. So yeah, it was a mixed feeling but it's always good to get that, you know, on it from our cricket board and the team and the fans and, you know, I got a lot of messages on social media as well. So yeah, it was amazing feeling to get, recognized the work, what I have done throughout my career. So, you know, it felt really nice. How proud are you of what you've achieved in your career? Obviously, very proud. I started as a leg spinner. You know, I played.

11 first class game as a lexpillar then becoming a batsman and played that long for my for my team and never been dropped from the test score which was a big achievement for for that longer period of time and I think I feel really proud of myself and I feel really proud in terms of you know my family the way they supported me and they are very proud of me as well so yeah I can't thank all my deal enough for what he have given me. You said you started as a leg spinner and you went on to be a major batter. I'm just thinking of Rehan Ahmed for a moment. He's starting your legspin. He says he's a batter who bowls. What did he make of him in this game? Yeah, definitely a great start for him. Obviously playing first

test match, getting a fifer. And I've seen his betting as well in country cricket. He can properly bat. So I wish him all the best. And all leg spinners are good batsmen as well. So I'm sure that he'll he'll do well in batting as well. But at the moment, when he should enjoy his fifer and let's see what life throws at him, you know, what challenges comes his way and I'm sure he's very, he has potential to excel in his career. Worcester now for you in the county championship? Yeah, definitely. You know, we have, I had an amazing time last season, so I'm looking forward to it and looking forward to seeing them all again.

Well, really well done on a fantastic career and thanks very much for talking to BBC. Thank you very much, yes. So we're going to start wrapping up from here now. Let's start with this little favourite memories. Or why will you remember this tour, Andy Zaltzwin? What's your lingering memory? I mean, from a purely statistical point of view, probably from England.

Inevitably. Setting a new record for fastest run rate in a series of 5.5. Fastest, a collective batting strike rate from a team in a calendar year, despite a slow start, 65 per 100 balls. That's a three-test minimum on that. It's only the fourth time England have won a whitewashed opponent away from home in a test of three or more series of three or more test matches in Sri Lanka four years ago under route New Zealand in the 60s, South Africa and the 1890s.

So a very rare occurrence, but I think the highlight for me was that period when England's bowlers, it's been a joy watching England in the field, that ceaseless invention, that constant probing for weakness in the opposition and trying stuff out for that period when England's seamers bowled out Pakistan's top three with three beautiful deliveries. Jimmy Anderson's one to Riz one in particular. He could have written to him a week in advance, telling him what that ball was going to do,

and I think it would still run the odd stump. And his reaction afterwards was quite a song. Well, Victor, I think it just has to be the first day of the series. I mean, we knew they were going to go hard, but to get 500 in the day... When Andy's main lead caught fire... Well, there was that. But I was thinking more of the firepower from the bats.

Alex, you've enjoyed us. I have two for me just proves to me the type of leader and the type of captain Ben Stokes is when Harry Brooke ran him out here and he said don't worry it's okay and then when they've just done the trophy lift there and he's given the trophy to the debutant Rayan Ahmed and he's gone to the back of the line I mean I mean for me I just think that's just just shows the type of team this team are it's not about Ben Stokes it's about everybody you know they're a team they enjoy their cricket and he's an unbelievable leader Yeah, that is very true. And I've got a point to Stokes, I think, on, I think the last day of the first test, his captaincy, when they bowed Pakistan out, the sun going down, all of that. I thought his captaincy on that day was absolutely brilliant, fields that he set, the bowling changes that he made. And England winning as well, without sundas going down against the clock. We always like a little bit of that here on test mat special. And alternatively also, I think the sight of that goat on the motorbike. live for quite a long time that might live for a while as well there we go the live cricket continues from tomorrow there's more action from the BBL don't forget Australia South Africa that starts on Boxing Day that's a test match and our coverage of that starts on Christmas night from all of us here it doesn't feel very Christmas here at the moment but it will do in 24 hours time when we get

home wishing you all season's greetings of course happy Christmas and a very Happy New Year to you all. Ben Stokes are now requested you to call your team and this trophy will be handed to you Ben by Ms. Asma Yusuf, the winning trophy to the winning captain Ben Stokes for winning this series against Pakistan. Three games to nil from Pindi to Multean to Karachi. A well-deserved win for Ben Stokes and his men in writing history. First time Pakistan has been handed a clean sweep at home all away. This is the TMS podcast from BBC Radio 5 Live.