Test Match Special - No Balls: The Cricket Podcast - a series win in New Zealand!

Episode Date: April 7, 2024

England bowler Kate Cross is fresh off the field at the end of the tour to New Zealand. Kate, Alex Hartley and former New Zealand wicket-keeper Katey Martin discuss the action.

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. Bring more gear, carry more passengers, face greater challenges. Welcome to the world of Defender, with seating up to eight, ample cargo space, and legendary off-road capability. It's built to make the most of every adventure. Learn more at landrover.ca. Hi, my name's Eddie Hearn, and this is no passion, no point. I'm excited to be back with this new series. As always, I'll be talking to top performers about what drives them, how they gain an edge

over competitors, and whether their dedication to constant improvement comes at a cost. I love golf, I play it until my hands be. I just enjoy going out there, playing with no fear. What makes them feel fulfilled? It's not the monies, it's not the trophies, it's the friendships and the memories I've got. And does that change as their career progresses?

It's just a girl who grew up playing football, and now I'm getting pets, like, without even seeing the camera, like, it's crazy. From BBC Radio 5 Live. No passion, no point. and whenever you like on BBC Sounds. BBC Sounds, music, radio, podcasts. Hi, everyone. The BBC have told us that we've got to issue a warning.

We swear too much. Henry does beep it out for us because he's a good man. It is actually so that your family can all listen. Your kids can listen. But we will say... Sugar. That's not a sweet. He said a really bad one.

Cross comes in round, a wicket. Boulder, boulder, leaving a ball alone, Litchfield. I think it's the wobble ball, and it just nips back, it jags back, it's the nipbacker. That is a beauty from Kate Cross, an absolute seed. That is a beauty from Cross. Hello, and welcome back to No. No Bulls, a cricket podcast where we are live on Saddam Park Boundary with Alex Hartley, me and Kate Cross, and Katie Martin. Katie, welcome to no balls. I feel like I've said a lot about no balls in the last week or so, so I'm happy to be here.

And I do listen to you guys. Katie said, actually, said, no balls, if you're into those sorts of things and then paused on it as you were bowling and I cracked up because... You're ever the professional. Ever the professional, yeah. It was funny, wasn't it? Yeah, well, you know, you'll know, Crossie when you commentate. to pause when the bowler gets up halfway through their run-up, so I did. And then

in that moment, Alex's maturity really shone through nicely, or immaturity, I shall say, and what I was meaning to say is no balls if you're into, like, cricket podcasts, because as you know, I'm a big crime podcaster, I love true crime. Oh, is that? Why, we keep getting tucked in crime and cricket, right?

That makes sense, though, so, I obviously I told all alcohol are supposed to say on that side of the beach. Okay, no worries, we what... They put it to me like this, a million dollars grass. Okay, no worries, no problem. That was just live on the podcast, so it is a beer cast. It is a beer cast because, right, you've just had a series win.

The White Ferns have just won the last game. All the family, all the friends, all the New Zealand girls, all the England girls. They're all here having a drink. So we're doing sort of an emergency podcast, so we won't keep Katie too long because she's got some drinks to drink. Well, you know, I am the professional, Alex. I'll have a couple of celebratory drinks for a long New Zealand summer, but how cool is it to have friends and families over that follow you?

around the world and I know the ayesha's are coming up next year which I'm sure is marked on the calendar as well but they're really involved in the team aren't they? Yeah it's been great that really felt like a proper question at the end of a game that that was oh sorry I'm don't have to get in a commentary man I don't know but no you raise a really good point because looking around there's so many of the kids

that are here they've all got England shirts on and imagine how good that must be being one of the like it's the coaches kids obviously because none of the players have got kids yet. But it's been so, so epic for them. And I just think they won't even remember they've been to New Zealand. They'll be like, they're in the team room every night playing football or table tennis or they did games night last night.

So, so good. But yeah, it's been nice to have some support on this side of the world. May you want to have kids? No. I don't know. Absolutely not. Let's talk about cricket. So, Kay, when did you retire?

Two years at the end of the World Cup, our home World Cup here. So it feels like a long time ago. It does not, isn't it? Yeah, roll from that into commentary, so... Was that always a plan? A little bit. Like, I'd sort of already done a little bit of commentary. It started with Channel 7 in Australia,

which is probably a lot more relaxing. They said, oh, when you're... I said, what are you after? And they said, well, just think if you're sitting at the pub with your mates talking about cricket. I was like, oh, it's right up, my alley. So, yeah, it's just... I sort of found like I've never had a summer off or anything like that,

but you get paid to talk about the game you love, and I just feel like I'm a fan and trying to educate viewers and stuff like that. So I'm probably more inappropriate than I'd like to be at times. That's why I've spent a lot of time in Hawkeye to make sure there's a balance. I have never met anyone that pester's the Hawkeye lads more in my entire life. She's like in the truck saying, I want this, I want that. Oh, Sivers got out, okay, I need to think of something else.

And she's made a group chat with the Hope Lads. It's great. But then there was one day, Max, the young lad from Hawke went, okay, it was a little bit too much today. Or at least he's honest. Well, I think it's been the greatest group chat, though. Like, we hang out lots of nights. And we actually went back to one of the Hawke Boys' room. There was a group of us that played cards.

How have you found it then, commentating on your mate? Yeah. It's tough, isn't it? I mean, you guys will know that as well. You know the environment so well. You hear different bits and pieces outside of the environment. And I'm not someone that would necessarily criticize players because I think, you know, you drop catches, you make mistakes as a player.

But if I can educate viewers around what the target or the plans are and, I guess, insights into people and what it's like being out in the middle, I reckon as you support it the last thing you know is what it's actually like crossing the line and standing out in the middle so if you can give some sort of insights into that then I think that's sort of your job done but yeah it is tough and you still feel pain

when your mates don't score runs or you know they drop catches and that but you've got to find a balance and I think I'm still probably trying to find that. Are you completely doing you're not playing domestic cricket? Oh no I haven't picked up a cricket bat to actually face it how it's not like tell me what's it good Well, as you retire, you sort of do less exercise

and you try and do exercise. We talked about this because I'm thinking, do I get a whoop to try and track my exercise? And so when you actually pick up a bat, you know, my boobs are a little bigger of late, so I'm sort of trying to work out. It's a bit different. I don't know if I can play the same shots to get around the chest.

So she was asking me to say, do I get a whoop to track my exercise? I was like, well, I had one, and it made me realize how little I did after retiring from professional sports. So my advice would be no, just get a watch. You've got a watch. Your quiet days are extra quiet when you're not playing cricket, aren't they? Like genuinely, though, you've become a bit of a big dog in the old commentary boxes of late, haven't you?

Well, I don't see myself as a big dog. I honestly see myself as just someone that loves talking about cricket. And I'm fortunate enough to be able to do this full time at the moment. And you're probably only as good as someone likes you until they don't like you, then you don't get opportunities. But, yeah, I guess for me it's like, you always hear this cricket commentary rule book and while I know there's aspects of that

I'm sort of like well if I'm commentating with you out I'm not going to be talking about left arm spin like I want to hear your insights even off him in the colour roll same as you know when you're talking to Mark Richardson about left handed batting I want to hear from them so I sort of talk

in commentary as I am as a viewer at home and that's sort of the style I've gone with I think the challenge that I've had is in cricket you get measured on runs and wickets and so on wicket keeping stumpings but in commentary in a way you measured on your personality

and I find that the hardest to deal with that's why I've always just stuck away You've got an old personality Yeah I feel like I'm such a vanilla person You know I also think you get measured as a female commentator on your knowledge And I think if you were a male player

Who'd played the amount that you had had the success that you'd had It wouldn't get questioned But just because you're a female Everyone's like the second you make a mistake They pick up on it Yeah, I think that you see the game slightly differently like the guys coming in to do commentary

and you'll know this in England a lot of the guys now are doing the females game that they actually see it differently so when you get a guy and talking about women's cricket and you hear the way they speak and you know they may be surprised about some aspects of it but it's the same we come in and see from a different perspective and that's all we've seen on TV for the years

that we've grown up and you learn and understand the game and to be able to have supportive commentary environments where the guys can talk to you about stuff and you talk about Hawk well Craig McMillan and I who's former Black Cap's batting coach literally I'm like oh look at this what do you think about that and he gets a little annoyed at me

but it's I just think you just add a different perspective and you I think sometimes it's assume knowledge and even a female doing female commentary now like sometimes we can assume that you know people know what we're talking about because we've been in there but people don't know that at home

and so I think different angles that maybe in the men's game like in test matches when everyone's right up to the stumps like I think we assume that people know at home what's going on but they don't necessarily know that so it's just going how do we educate viewers and some lady tweeted me is that what you say tweeted me whatever

sent a message and said I just learned the other day that there's two balls at one ball at each year you take it for granted yeah you just take it for granted because you do it day in day out welcome to the wild west of 1980s wrestling, a world of chair throwing, blood spilling, steroid taking, and spandex wearing. Bruiser Brody was pulling in crowds all around the world. He would burst through the curtain and fans would scatter.

But then, at the height of his fame, he's gone. In the dressing room before a match, Brody was knifed in the abdomen. This is a story of unreality. Misdirection, fakery, rivalry, revenge, and ultimately death. He pushed the buttons hard enough And one of the buttons pushed back Nobody is ever going to know exactly what happened I'm Adam Hills

Join me for Sports Strangers Crimes The Ballad of Bruiser Brody Listen on BBC Sounds We've had an email So we've gone a bit off-piece with this podcast But we are in the middle of the cricket pitch This one is called cricket crimes with Katie Martin Oh yes, okay

So it says hi Kate Hi Alex Kate and Kate In the hopes that Katie Martin has indeed agreed to be a guest and her interest in turning no balls into a crime podcast, I've taken the liberty of doing some research for you and found some historical cricket crimes. Here's the details of the ultimate cricket crime. Right, these are actual...

It's an actual cricket crime, isn't it? Oh, she's deleted it. I've just... I've just... Oh, no. Why are you shaking your phone? Is it... Because that one does it? I've just lost that email.

Do you know one thing that's not always... legitimate crime, but I think wicket keepers and short sleeves as a crime. Oh, that is a crime. Do you know, do that means? Crime against cricket. Okay, the first one. Cricket, a crime. It's not generally known that cricket was at one time regarded as a crime

and that those who played it were liable to fine and imprisonment. Such, however, is the case by an act of Edward V. 1V, is that 5? Yeah, I think so. Oh, don't ask me. Four, that's four. One V is four. Is it? It was prohibited because its popularity threatened to interfere with

the practice of archering. Any person indulging in it was liable to a fine of £10 and two years imprisonment. It was not until the establishment of the Hamilton Club in England in 1748 that the law was repealed. How do people find this stuff? They deserve standing. That's from February the 24th. Friday the 24th of September, 1926.

Tell me you played an ODI today without telling me I'm nowhere. Okay, then there's the crime of women playing cricket. Here we go. Oh, here we go. This is probably written three weeks. We were on to something. Yes. Here's the opinion of one of the greatest batters in history,

which was Englishman Jack Hobbs in 1931. Women at cricket. According to the famous international Jack Hobbs, women will never be able to compete at equal terms with men in cricket because they cannot pull their arm back to throw like a man. He admits that women have shown an enormous interest in cricket since the war. So it was a crime because we couldn't throw. Really?

Well, that's right for you. My throw was my best bit I just called me pick it up You never stopped it enough to throw it So there you go Cricket and crime you wanted it Yeah I feel like I mean that's great

I feel like this could be a thing You know A monthly or annual Annual crime against cricket What would your What was your So I'm talking about keepers with no You know sleevers

What's your biggest crime in cricket Bowling in a hut Really? Yeah I hate the spinners Yeah And I taught at least Perry Warming up

With a hut on the other day And it went out on socials Mine is the LBW when it pitches outside, like, why is that not out? It should be out, because it's hitting the stumps, even if it pitches outside leg. I also think a ground that doesn't have a clock on it. That's silly. Yeah. So then I don't like a ground that's got a clock on the sight screen, but then it's got a normal clock that's wrong.

Like at Lincoln and Christ Church, the clock that you meant to go with is five minutes behind the screen. Oh, that's just... And then you're like, well, which crop do you look at? Yeah, that's no good. But see, mail finishes by saying, sadly, though, cricket crimes aren't consigned to history. as we speak, Afghanistan women are banned from playing cricket and the national players had to flee the country in 2021 when the Taliban retook control of the country.

I recommend your listeners check out Alison Mitchell and Tracy Holmes coverage of these incredible Afghan women. Thanks for always taking, talking about the hard things in amongst the laws of life, Maddie. Afghanistan is a hard one, isn't it? It's a really difficult one. I saw East just go really well about it at the Cowderale lecture. Yeah, I mean, it's not a great situation in cricket

and it's one of those fine lines without not having enough information about what's going on but I think everyone should have an opportunity to do whatever they want to do whether it's playing cricket or other sports or opportunities in life and I guess we're fortunate enough that we've been able to do that in our life

and we're opportunity to be involved in the game that we love and that's just what you want out of people in life or respect them with the situation that's going on so yeah I feel for the Afghanistan girls but I'm looking forward to hopefully getting them supporting in Australia at the Ashes Oh yes, that would be good actually And before we let you go

Because I promise you 10 minutes And it's been 12 minutes Normal for us, yeah Yeah, exactly We're just chin wag The whole night You know we've been banned On commentary together at

Oh yeah Yeah, because we talk so much Probably not about cricket either You know, you're just talking before About like you're only just out of the team And you're commentating on your mates and stuff So we had commentary on today But normal it's always on mute

And you were chat Al you were chatting And someone was like Can someone turn Alex Hartley off please No because you're bad But obviously because we don't don't want to hear the analysis, we want to just, we use the TV to see the replays. And then someone came in, they were like, why is Alex still on? Oh, I mean, that's fair enough.

Fair enough. I didn't actually do much there. Anyway, where do you see this White Ferns team? They've obviously won one of the T20s, one of the ODIs. You've gone above Pakistan now in the ICC table. Where do you see New Zealand in relation to, I guess, the best teams in the world? I honestly think New Zealand are five years behind in terms of seeing the benefit of the investment and you can't underestimate

the impact of New Zealand A I talked about this. When I first started in New Zealand A was in 2000 and I was 15 and in 2009 there were nine people in that team that made the World Cup final, the two finals against England and Sydney and then the T20 World Cup and

at Lords as well in that same year and I think it takes time to get those benefits and it is on the back of having the experienced players around you'll know Kate by being able to have Catherine Siverbrunt in the team and learning off her from her bowl and how much that can help you as well. So I think it's important over the next couple of years to keep those senior players around

to support the youngsters. And the hardest thing for the youngsters, I believe, is the fact that there's more media coverage, there's more social media. People now can form an opinion because they're seeing it. And the challenges that come from that, the amount of messages they get DM saying, you know, you should retire, you're useless, you're this, you or that. Like the difficulty of that, I think, is more accentuated now because they're getting that exposure. so I think they'll gain confidence from this series

and the fact that there were times where they were able to put England under pressure it's going to be challenging in India and Australia come here as well I think New Zealand play Australia three times in the summer Oh good so yeah there's a lot of opportunities as well that come from that So as long as the group stick tight together And they're really clear on what they're trying to do And any noise that come around it is just part of playing international cricket unfortunately

And it's good that teams get judged I think It's just how players can deal with that as well It's playing enough cricket as well, isn't it? I think it was really good that the A team came over and played against your A team. I thought, like playing in different conditions, our girls got to go over to India before Christmas as well. You know, it's like you've got 25 players to pick from. That creates competition and it lifts the standards.

And I think that if the team in the next two years can go, we've got 20, 25 players that we realistically know that can come in and out of the team, even 20 players, then it goes, as a player, if you're in the white ferns, and you get in your butt-bitten by someone, you know, that are in the A squad, then you actually automatically have to lift your standards. So it's around how we can continue to develop that. On the mic? I think Tammy Belmont's on the karaoke.

I can recognise that voice from a mile away. Katie, you've been a belter. I'll let you go. Have a beer. Good look with the IPL. I know you're going over there. It's been a pleasure working with you. Are we seeing you in the summer?

Yeah, I'll see you in England. I'm lovely. So what I'll do in between now and then, I'm going to come up with, I'm going to listen to your point. podcast. I do listen to it, but I don't even have much crime. You don't want to listen to a crime podcast, and I'm going to collate all together. Next time we see each other, we're going to come out as new cricket crimes.

Before you go, I've got a question for you, which we tackled on the podcast last week. Do you think marriages are more likely to have success if you do not share a bedroom? No. I feel like the intimacy factor is key. I will say one thing about this job is, I don't know how you'd maintain a relationship because you're away so often. I brought plus one with me Exactly You know he's been

You know Have you heard the story That he's on our cult sheet Is plus one Plus one yeah I love Aaron He's a good boy I don't know where he is actually

He's around in the mingle He's mingling somewhere No no I like I like the fact that you can be in the same bed together It's very foreign for me I'm single for a while I feel like if you start sleeping in separate bedrooms You just become mates

Friends Yeah no one wants No one likes your friends I know Yeah exactly That's the kind of stuff that we're Yeah I think separate bed dreams. You like that? Yeah, I think I need my space.

And I've been single for so long that I don't think I'll be able to share a bad anymore. Maybe that's Sariza now. Great question. That's maybe a crime in itself, but life crime. Life crime. Life crime. I actually met someone today that came up to me. I love the podcast, Sherabad.

I was like, thank you. You should just get a Super King bed. That's the way to go. You know that they're there. Yeah. Very true. Thanks, Katie. Thank you, I appreciate it.

You can go. Thank you. Thanks, Katie. Crossy Series win. Series winners. Welcome back to the team. Thank you very much. I played some cricket now this winter.

I've doubled my amount of winter matches in the last week. Yes, get in. You've also bowled amazingly. I've done all right, yeah. First game, I felt like I probably bowled my best. I felt like I bowled okay today. It was just hard getting wicket. It's so far, but it's so well.

So annoying when your friends do well as well, isn't it? Because you also, like, I'm guessing as a part of you, because you just spent so much time with her, wanted her to do well. Oh, no. But then she's, like, got 100, and she's won the game with a six to bring up her ton. I mean, she was class.

And she'd been injured as well, so imagine what the series would have looked like if she'd have been able to play. Might have lost. Yeah, we might have done. But you didn't? We didn't. We've got the series win.

We actually just spoke in the dress room about being a lot better at celebrating wins like that because we've come off disappointed that we've just lost that game, but actually we've come to New Zealand out of the eight games that the teams have played. We've only lost two.

And that's a really successful thing to do. on foreign soil against the team that have just played a lot of cricket from the back end of their summer really sorry if you can hear Tammy squealing by the way I don't know where to go now yeah so I think we've got to get better at being enjoying that success but

it's not easy to win away from home doesn't know who you play it and also obviously the focus is so heavily on T20 cricket with the World Cup being at the end of our summer so then one day cricket has kind of been put on the backboneer a little bit and we're playing in five matches for T-20s and three for the ODIs. So the championship points are obviously so crucial now

and you can't, even if you've won the series after two matches, you've still got to try and win the third game as well. I know, because you could have gone into second today. Oh, could have been. Yeah, but that's okay. South Africa. Yeah. It's all right.

You've still got everyone else. We've still got a lot of cricket to play. Yeah, we've got Pakistan in the summer. It's only four weeks away out. I know. I have an international summer at home. It's starting four weeks. And New Zealand come over in 10.

It's like what is going on. So they're all like wrapping it up going on. That's the end of the summer. and I'm like, it's the start of ours. I'm really looking forward to the English summer though. Like, I feel like I've just started playing some cricket now. I am watching this rugby world getting thrown around your head, don't worry. I'll save you if it comes this way.

But yeah, I feel like I'm ready to play some cricket now. Just started, and now I'm going on a little holiday again. You're going on a holiday. This is why we've had to do it on the outfield of Seddon Park because we're both separating tomorrow. We are, but then I'll see you next week at home. Yeah, perfect. Crossie, well done.

Two series wins. Thank you. You were brilliant. in the ODIs he took consistent wickets here we go who's going to come ruin our podcast no one they're just leaving that ball I think they're intimidated by us have a lovely holiday with your mum

you too with your plus one thank you right don't forget to email us on noblespodcast at bbc.bc.c.combecko dot co.combe noblespodcast at bbcc.combec.combecow. It's so good they said it twice. Bye everyone Sorry about the background noise but it's quite cute bye

bye Boulder, Boulder, leaving a ball alone, Litchfield. I think it's the wobble ball, and it just nips back, it jags back, it's the nipbacker. That is a beauty from Kate Cross, an absolute seed. That is a beautiful cross. Right, we've got another. guest. We've just been interrupted by none other than Lily Finch, the one that's been pestering us to come on this podcast. So she's actually been wearing a Charlie Dean shirt.

Yeah. Because do you know? Alex has just disappeared. She's been wearing a Charlie Dean shirt all day and now you've got a cross 16 shirt on. I'm actually really mad at you because you said I was your favourite and now and now you've got a cross top on. Are you just telling your mum to be quiet because you're actually on the podcast? Yeah. Um, I say, I told Crossage is my favourite but Alex is really my favourite. You don't. Yes, right! Bye!