Test Match Special - No Balls: The Cricket Podcast - Kate took four wickets at Lord's, and there's nothing else to say about the game...

Episode Date: September 25, 2022

The day after a hugely controversial end to the England vs India series, bowler Kate Cross and Alex Hartley chat through *that* moment and the rest of the summer.

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Sometimes. Sometimes. And even maybe. But don't let that put you off with nice people. We beep them out. Like your kids can listen. Enjoy. And cross strikes in the first over.

It's Waddingham. looking for Hartley balls down the track comes scoring this time she connects it's either

six or out it's six you're six you're thank you Alex Hartley we hope you've not all forgotten

about us because we forgot about the podcast but we've been waiting for these brand spanking new microphones tap tap-tap-a-roo and we've got them we have and we're just trying to work out how to use them and watching you trying to work out where sound was being recorded was fascinating actually right what this podcast has shown me and you over the years is

that i'm not very tax savvy tech savvy you're not tax savvy either good start i can't speak I don't know how to work technology. Well, in your defense, I just spent five minutes on FaceTime to you looking for my phone. So that's the headspace I'm in right now. So who knows where these episodes are going to go? The funny thing is with that, though, is your phone, when you're on FaceTime, and do you know when someone puts it down? So it goes black.

Yeah. And you're like, I can't find my phone. I was like, oh, really? Where is it? You're like, you're okay. Honestly, and I was like, oh, I can hear it. It's buzzing. and you're on it also in true nobles fashion i hope these microphones are good enough to hear this

but i've got a wash on so right so we're back we're home we are we home that feels weird just to give everyone a pre-warning this isn't a regular thing now this podcast this is a special episode it's the annual episode that we're going to start doing where we just round the summer up and then go away for six months. So me and Crossie are both going on holiday. Crossie's going tomorrow. I'm going Thursday. So we're going to have a break and then we'll be back on.

We're having a break from a break. Right, no, we'll level with you. We just don't want to. It's just so hard now. Like when we were in the same team, I think we took for granted how easy it was and now it's just not easy anymore. No, we're going to be more organised. we're going to come up with a plan but you don't need to know our logistics about the podcast

we'll just give you an episode whenever we can yeah okay well we'll sort it out we're going to go on a little holiday and sort ourselves out and then we'll sort the podcast out um I'm not going to ask you how you are because that's the rule number one that when we're both not okay you don't ask the question it's not you meant to ask twice I'm joking right rule number one ask twice rule number two if you have to ask a third time seek medical help okay um how are you have you been i'm okay i am okay i'm better than i was a few weeks ago not going to lie um i feel like i'm really ready for a rest really ready for a rest um but i'm okay how are you I'm good

I'm so happy to be home I came home last night leaving again in two days so that's stressful and when I'm packing my bags I'm packing until like December but hey ho we move it's fine I'm just tired

like my face feels swollen well I don't think I look very well today and I'm not that hung over I'm not that hung over just very tired but going back to the being at home thing this is your life now Al like this is it it's not

it's not like you get back in December you're going to have a bit more time at home like you're then on the road again I know I know and I said someone can come and live with me because I'm never here and now the thought of them coming to live with me I'm like oh my God what's going on you know your microphone

yeah looks a bit like that little thing out of Star Wars R2D2 what's the little thing It's got a little head on it, and I reckon I could get it in my mouth. Wow. When I said I didn't know where this episode was going to go, like, wow. Christ. Right, Crossie, we've got to jump in because there's going to be people listening to this podcast.

They're only here for one reason and one reason only. The run out at the non-strike's end. Yep. What the hell happened? Charlie Dean wasn't in her crease and Deepty Sharma ran into bowl didn't bowl and then took the bales off and it was game over

I thought Deepty Sharma went over to Harman Prit the Indian captain's like are we having this are we taking this and I was like well well played mate give her a high five was like what's going on? It was definitely like it definitely looked like a plan

because Pooja went up to Deepty before she bowled the ball and we were sat on the balcony and I said Like, what on earth is Pooja saying to deep to hear? Like, I can see me talking to an off spinner at this moment of the game. I wonder what's being said. And Tammy went, I bet she's saying Mancada. Oh, she did.

Oh, God. I mean, it's the rules you can do it. But my thing was, it's left a real sour taste on what's been a really good series. See, I don't think it has. I think it's being talked about. Obviously, talked about quite a lot. but I think because it divides opinions so much like there's so many people on Twitter that I've seen

that have said there's absolutely nothing wrong with that it's within the rules of the game Charlie Dean was out of a crease what I think has come of it which happens a lot in these scenarios when there's a big thing to talk about is that the rules aren't quite written correctly to make it clear like we saw it with the men's world cup with like everyone then kicked off that it was done on a countback and then it's not being done, like those World Cup games now will never be judged on countbacks again of boundaries

because they realised that in that moment it wasn't quite right. Do you know my thing though? Did India really believe that was the only way they could win that cricket game? I don't know. I mean, they obviously knew they could win the cricket game that way. I was like, she might in Canada, she's mine Canada, she might Canada. So to just go back to my point, like, I think what needs to happen is there needs to be more

clear words on the rules because it's quite wishy-washy and it's all like opinion of where the bowler might be bowling when, and it's like make it clear, make it like it's back foot contact or its front foot contact or whatever it is. If the bowl is in a delivery stride looking at the non-striker, I don't think that's very fair. Well, that's, I mean, Deepty didn't, she was never intending to bowl that ball, was she? No, because she does it all the time So my thing was, right I am not surprised that there's been

a man card slash run out at the non-strikes And it doesn't surprise me And I'm not surprised it was Deepty Sharma Because she threatens to do it So, so much, like so much I think the thing about the sour taste Like, I know what you mean I know that like that is getting talked about

But if you flip that into a massive positive This could have happened six years ago In a women's game and no one would have known about it Yeah But, like, I mean the sour taste in the fact that post-game, we didn't speak about Julan Goswami once. Oh, my God. Well, she got spoke about enough during the game.

There was 17 guard of honours for her. Yeah, fair enough. Like, she had a big day, Al, like, I don't think we need to talk about it anymore. What are the chances of having a card of honor and Kate called her duck? Oh, I knew that was going to happen. Do you know, I think that that was absolutely written in the stars? Poor, poor woman. I joked on the pitch.

I was like, should we do a regard of on or off when we get her out first ball? And then we got her out first ball. Like, whoopsies. Let's move on. No, because I want to talk more about the game yesterday. Yeah, I want to talk about the game yesterday, and I'm moving it on. Okay, well, it might come back to me. To your first game for England at Lords, and you only went and got four-for, right?

You bowled amazingly. Like, you were, you're only a second person ever to get India's top four out, one, two, three, four. are you gutted at the same time? I was fuming. Yeah. Like mad, mad fuming. Because, and I said this after the game, it feels like, because we play so few games at grounds like that at Lords

where the Honours Board is such a big deal, it felt like the biggest and best opportunity I'm ever going to get, to get a five for there. And like, to be bowling at a number 11 on four for, you know, to get the last wicket of the innings. Like, it just felt like, well, actually at that point, it's probably really clear that I'm not going to get it. But when you're like, when I took my third,

I was like, I might have a chance here. And then, yeah, I think it more felt like I'd missed an opportunity, which then I was like, that's really sad to think I've got a for for England at Lourdes and I feel sad about it. And I'm gutted. I know what you mean, though. I know exactly what you mean, because I could see it in your face, right? Also, really strange, but every single ball you bowed yesterday,

I was on air, and that never happens. but I loved it. Yeah, and then when you came out to bat, I actually went on there. I was like, what is going on? But you bowled a ball, your third ball in your final over, wide outside the off stump and it got left. And I just saw you go, oh, my God's sake. Yeah.

Like, what a waste of a ball. That was literally what I was thinking, because I was trying to get deep to your off strike because I thought I've got my better chance of getting a number 11 out than better. And then she faced like seven of my balls and just didn't take any runs and so I was like, for God's sake. So then when the,

when Guy A quad was on strike, I said to Sophie like, I'm just going to try and hit her up. Because she said, you want to slip in, I went, now I'm just going to try and slap her on the pads. And I pulled on like eight stum.

I was like, what is that? Whoopsies. Whoopsies. Oh, well, like, it was pretty cool. Like, the whole thing for me, like singing the national anthem at Lords.

Yeah, It was just like the occasion, I think, was unbelievable. And I, when I went out to bat, everyone went and sat downstairs on the bench. And not only was it absolutely Baltic, so I didn't want to go and sit and get cold. But I wanted to do the whole experience. I wanted to walk through the long room to go out to bat. And there was, there was actually like four people in there. So I was like, okay.

But it was so cool to be able to like walk down the steps at Lords. And, yeah. Did you not think I'm going to fall it? I'm going to trip. No, I thought I'm going to get timed out, though, because it feels a really long. It's not that long away, is it? It feels really long. But it's really cool.

We got to see our family's got to come up to the dressing room afterwards. So I had a picture with my sister and my mum on the balcony. And then as we're leaving the dressing room, my mum was like, oh, I fell down these stairs earlier. I rolled my ankle. What? Welcome to Lord's the Cross family. Yeah, the mum's falling down. Was your brother gutted?

He wasn't there. Yeah, I don't know why I couldn't make it, actually. Probably babysitting the kids, but yeah, he couldn't make it, which was a shame. But it was nice to have my sister there as well. So I think she was on TV and someone tweeted me like, have you got an actual twin? I cannot, cannot tell you how much the Frosties were on TV yesterday. Like, honestly, the commentators need something else to talk about. Well, did you hear what happened to my dad?

No. So my dad gets where water warden and my sister's fiancé is a member of love. he's part of the MCC so he was able to get him and a guest into the pavilion so when we were doing the anthems I could see my family they were in like right in front of me basically and my dad was there but he had a polo on like a really crappy Aldi version polo and a tie like an egg and bacon MCC tie so he obviously like what eventually what happened and what the story was that my dad hadn't been able to get in because he didn't have a tie so he had to go to the shop to buy one or borrow one of someone so he had like this really awful bow on with a tie oh bless him

you forget like because during the hundred and stuff you don't have to dress nice to get in the pavilion so obviously just didn't realize um but both times you've played at lords now cross you got fourther i know it's not it's just not meant to be is it so you say you're not going to get another opportunity but you do play there again next year against australia and in a t20 all you're not going to play that one I will not be getting my name on that on us board then. There might be some injuries. There might be.

Do you know what was lovely, though? All the girls were like get a fifer. Everyone was so pro-it. Not that anyone would have at that point turned around and gone, oh, we don't want you to get a fiver unless I was genuinely hated in the team. But they were just all so mad, lovely about it. And I think that made it all a bit nicer. You will reflect on it and say, you know, like,

very good day but it's so annoying in it it is it's so annoying yeah and it oh yeah it's just you know what right i took i took the first wicket and i was like you know what i might be on here but then i did take the first i took the first wicket in the other game and then went at sixes for the rest of the day so i was like you know what just rain it in just keep trying to bowl well and then i could talk two and took three i was like oh god i'm i could you know i could get a five for at Lords. I think maybe you were thinking about it too much and just didn't.

Yeah, it didn't. Just didn't let it flow. Well, you live and you learn. Yeah, that's true. What's next? Well, I was going to ask you about your experience commentating because, I mean, I know you've done

a bit of commentary at Lords now, but first England women's game at Lord since you won the World Cup there in 2017. It's good. I was really frustrated actually at the start of the day. I was like, why is it taking this long? Yeah.

Like, in all seriousness, I get COVID and that doesn't help and blah, blah, blah, but we sold loads out in 2017 and it should have happened sooner. But we move. It's happening again. And from what you've started now and that you're playing there, you can't go backwards. So therefore, I got my angry tweet out the way and I was done for the day. I just didn't think of it. I think it just showed us on it. Like, we didn't even need to sell it out yesterday.

That wasn't the point. Like, to have 15,000 in or whatever the number was to watch that game was another example of if you are to play at grounds that hold more than 3 or 4,000, there's a chance more people will come to watch. Yeah. Yeah. And it is shifting, like you said, the ashes. Like, we've not even spoke about the ashes yet, but that announcement was unbelievable, I thought.

Well, Trent Bridge, the Oval, Lords, the Ageus Bowl. Edgebaston Edgebaston Crystal Thornton Lester Darby So those grounds in itself We saw the crowds in the Commonwealth How amazing they were

Edgebaston So like that's probably going to be guaranteed Brilliant crowd Oval After work Get people down You can't go backwards Things are only going to get better

And yesterday's crowd And yesterday's game Like nobody left but it was so exciting because it got so close and it proved that you don't have to score 300 for it to be an exciting game. I think a lot of games have been like that recently at lords, hasn't it? It's kind of shifted.

Because even if you think about the men's World Cup final, that was like 240 plays 240. It wasn't a high-scoring thriller, which actually that World Cup had been at every other ground, basically. People were knocking off 300, weren't they? All the 100 games were real low as well. Yeah.

The Birmingham of Phoenix nearly defended 18. Yeah, gosh, that was a bad day The other bit of Lord's, tell me at Lords without, telling me you're at Lord's news was there's a sparkling water tap in the dressing room so I brushed my teeth with it because I was like, I'm at Lords Started cleaning my invisible line out with sparkling water

You got caught so many times putting your teeth back in on the telly yesterday Is it? Yeah What in the drinks break? Yeah Yeah, it is tough Al It is a life change

I've said it to a lot of people It is a life change But I think my lisp sounds better Oh my God I was literally about saying It doesn't have your lisp anymore Yeah I definitely got more used to it

Yeah Your tongue's like touching your teeth We had to say Our final goodbye To H2 fingers yesterday Because they are officially Not touring with us anymore

They're still going to be in the role Until about December But they're not going to be on tour anymore. So sad. Really sad. Like the team is not going to be the same without them.

It's actually not. Like, I know people say that all the time, but it's genuinely not. Like, I was thinking, even like walking into the press box when I'm not on air, like, what am I going to do? H isn't there? Like, what are you going to do on in the evening when you don't have your best friend's got, second best friend's got for dinner with? I remember when someone retired from the England team and Robbo was in charge and

he was like girls no one's died like sport moves on that is professional sport it just moves on and i was trying to explain to hen the other night i was like we're not going to move on like whoever comes into that role unfortunately like they've got so like such big shoes to fill that it's going to be barely basically impossible for them to do it yeah yeah oh it's madness madness good luck tilly because you've got a big job to well i don't know who's going to be doing it but anyway I've got a best friend on tour up for grabs so if someone wants to adopt me then they can do yeah right bloody out you got 10 minutes should you do some questions how do you know we've got 10 minutes because up the top left corner

oh there it is I was wondering for a timer I think if we run over a little bit than this one it'll be all right we're not putting out for four months someone tweeted us actually being like just check in have you done a no balls can't see one since the end of all I genuinely do. Yeah, I'm happy to apologise for this because we've not even really been great on social media. Been a bit busy, had some stuff going on. But would also just like to say huge, huge, huge thank you for everyone this summer who has either said that they love the podcast as like got the flask, got some, like just so many people, so so many people are talking about the podcast now when we're at cricket grounds. And it makes me more proud than when

people talk to me about cricket. Oh, yeah, I know exactly what you mean. Like, I'm really, I'm really grateful when people mention the podcast, so thank you everyone. And sorry that we've not put one out. We've ignored our own tough times. Hi, Alex and Crossy. I'm on the train back to Bournemouth after a really disappointing end to what was an excellent day at Lords.

Well, Bald Crossy really well deserved. I thought of the only way to salvage any cheer for Charlie Dean's truly excellent knock, another no-balls quiz. Oh yeah? Three in ten. You have ten seconds to name three. Oh gosh, okay. A Henry-style timer might be needed head-to-head.

Alex, think of past the bomb, but name three things. Okay, are you ready? Ready. Name three ways to cook potatoes. Boil them, roast them. Fry them Nice Name three words

To describe the podcast Fun Mad Unique Non-existence Vacant Name three things You'd wash up

A bread knife My cup And anything that's dirty Name three things in a TMS Coms box Alex Hartley Henry Moran and Charlotte Swift

Melissa Story Nice Name three things in an ice cream van A flake Alex Hartley and Mr Whippy Name three cricketers You wouldn't want to be stuck in a lift with

Alex Hartley Deepty Sharma Charlie Dean Do you say, before you do another one? Did you see that Dino did the fake man card in the Rachel Hayo Flink game? So good from Dino. So good. So good.

And finally, named three bowlers you'd love to hit for six. Alex Hartley. Delis Shearie. Elise Perry. And I'm going to have to say Chevali Verma because she got me out. Oh my God. I forgot about this. You have got her out.

Every single day you fold at her, right? And then she only went and got you out. I know. It was really bad. So it was quite funny yesterday. She was, there was just a moment where I think it might have been drinks and she was just on the floor doing some warming up. And I was next into bat.

So like the TV's on her warming up. And Frey Kemp walked in from the balcony. I was just like, oh, Chevali's warming up, crossy. Match up. Like, cheers. Cheers, kempie. go and do some school work kempie oh god right your turn

oh yeah i forgot about that hi alex and kate long time listener first time emailer for a late birthday present for me and my dad we managed to get tickets to watch england women against india in the odi for our first women's game and our first game at lords the crowd the atmosphere and the heartwarming send off

for jule and goswami were brilliant crossy well done and getting your for we were cheering you on hoping that you'd get a fifer Now for the elephant in the room It's not really an elephant in the room Because we've kind of already talked about it But we'll go anyway We weren't too pleased

In the manner Charlie Dean was run out At the end of the game We like many others felt It was unsportsmanlike You can change the pronoun if you wish Regardless of it being legal Like the rest of you Charlie worked bloody hard to keep England in the game

And we were cheering her on the loudest from the mound stand She deserved better and deserved to reach 50 I just wanted to express our disappointment at what happened and I'll support for Charlie because we think she's still brilliant as all the rest of you are. We look forward to the next women's game next year and hope to attend more games in person. That's from Henry and Lee.

There is no question there. The other thing I do want to say on this is that I actually thought Sam Billings' tweet was quite good how he said that it's within the rules, it's within the rules, but it's not, how did he word it? He worded it really well. Yeah, I would go and see all these tweets actually.

they're really good about it all. Yeah, I've read them all. I think, yeah, it's within the world. I love to you. Anybody listening? Oh, right, I was going to say, I've read it. I can't remember it. Let me find it.

Just while you're finding that, speaking about people going to Lords for the first time, I was on the plane back from the wedding that I went to, extremely hung over, and there was a guy sat next to me who lives in Spain, but because England women were playing at Lords for the first time, was flying over to watch. Amazing.

How good's that? They must have bear cash. Well, yeah, true, but class. It's well within the laws, but not in the spirit. Yes. And I think there needs to be the warning moving forward, basically, and they need to clear up the rules on where the front foot lands or where the bowlers bowling from, whatever.

Just make it really clear. Yeah, I'd like a warning. I'm going to man-cad you. I do you know what? Do it. I actually, I wouldn't do it personally. Well, I would do it as like a bit of banter. Hang on, just kidding. Come back. Hi, Kate and Alex. My name is Claire.

I've been dragged along to Lord's Cricket Ground today. Current time, 1.14 by my mate Alice for her birthday, emotional blackmail. Turns out cricket is quite fun to watch. And you're having a phenomenal match, Kate. So phenomenal that I will return to watch you play again. Anyway, hope you continued playing well. Lots of love Claire Wells. P.S.

I had cataracts at the ripe old age of 30. You read that like you've got cataracts. Well, I thought it said characteristics. Cataracts at 30, wow. That's an LBW. It is a little bit weird that. It's unusual for sure. Yeah, it is.

Here we go. Dear Kate and Alex, love the podcast. I was at Lords yesterday for the first time. It's also the first time I'd watched a women's game in person. It won't be the last, already planning next summer. Lovely. Well, bowl crossy, it was an absolute pleasure to watch and made the day memorable enough without the dramatic ending.

As a similar style, baller to yourself, I often have discussions with my captain when playing on a ground with a slope about which enter ball. So I was interested in your thoughts on how you made your decision yesterday and for the other grounds with the slope you play on. Would also be interested in Alex's thoughts from a spin bowling point of view.

Thanks and go well over the winter, Josh. Josh, we'll get back to you in one year while we try and figure out the answer to this question. Well, yeah, it's a really interesting one because, so I don't swing the ball, so I think it's a little bit easier for me to bowl at either end. You bowled some speeds yesterday, by the way. Thank you.

I think the argument and where I bowled, so I didn't bowl at my preferred end, necessarily in the last two of games because Canterbury's got a slope and obviously Lord's got the slope but we went off what the other opening bowler is biggest strength is so like for Lauren Bell

to be swinging the ball away down a slope is more beneficial than her trying to swing one up the slope maybe. Yeah. But I actually thought that the end that I bowled at yesterday was really beneficial to me because when you are bowling against the slope

so I was coming down it so the ball for me that would naturally knit back in it makes you hold your action and I actually text Finney long time friend of the podcast to obviously he's played so much cricket at lords and I was like what end should I bowl that and he said bowl at the pavilion end because it keeps you stronger in your action yeah okay that's interesting yeah um but I was just going to say I actually think there's benefit to both ends and I think obviously in 50 over cricket you're probably going to bowl at both ends um but yeah I'd just try and start with what you feel most comfortable in your

action with. I was speaking to daggers about which end Lauren Bell should bowl from. So she was bowling from the pavilion end as well as an in-swing bowler so the ball comes down the hill. But he said she should bowl from the nursery end because when she's bowling in-swing, wasn't Lauren Bell at all. Who was your in-swing ball yesterday? Freya Kemp. Must have been Kempi. Well, Freya Davis was bowling away swing and in-swing to the lefty. I'm really confused, right? I don't know which bowler it was,

but Daggers were saying they bowled from the wrong end because if you're bowling in swing from the pavilion end, you, to a right-hander, you can't get an LBW decision, which was proven with the review that was taken and it hit him outside the line. But if you, as an in-swing bowler, bowl from the pavilion end, you are then bowling in-swing, but then the slope will take it away. So when I bowled at Canterbury, I did basically the opposite of what I did at Lords.

I had to try and nip one in up the hill, which is obviously just more than anything going against gravity. But you're still able to do that. So I think it's just worth remembering, going back to the question and why we're talking about this, it's just worth remembering that actually sometimes the slope gets in your head more than it needs to. And if you're just running in bowl, your best bowl and try and hit the stumps, then natural variation will happen because of the slope. And if you don't know, the batter certainly doesn't know. So, yeah, try not think too much about it,

but I would just bowl from both ends in the warm-up and just be prepared and, like, prepare yourself for how you bowl, that you might need to just change a line of what you bowl from each end. I actually think there's been loads of really good discussions about this with the ends that Jimmy and Broad bowl from when they play test cricket, because they often go against the grain of what you think would be, basically the conversation you had with daggers, they kind of go against it and they have success.

so yeah great success great success um guys again we are so so sorry that it's taken us five weeks to get this podcast episode out but you know what we gave you a race dressed as lanky so forgive us we will do one within the next five weeks

no you're going on holiday I'm going on holiday we'll do one when we get back we are actually we're on we're on time off now we've got three weeks off so it's definitely not going to be in the next three weeks. We're an annual leave. We are. We'll put that in. Should we put it on the email address so that people get a reply saying we're on annual leave? Please keep emailing us for we're an annual leave. On noblespodcast at BBC.co.com.com.com.com. It's so good. They've said it twice. I hope you enjoyed the quality of these lovely microphones. Bye, everyone. Bye.

And cross strikes in the first over. It's what England we're looking for. Party balls. Down the track comes scoring this time she connects. It's either six or out. It's six. There are loads of ways to listen to BBC sounds. You can enjoy your favourite shows on most smart speakers.

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