Test Match Special - No Balls: The Cricket Podcast - World Cup wins and WPL auction drama

Episode Date: February 15, 2023

Kate Cross and Alex Hartley discuss England's strong start to the T20 World Cup. Plus, a full breakdown of the WPL auction and how it's changed the women's game forever.

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Yes. But when we need to, we can do. Boy, can we deliver. As England's greatest ever bowler, you don't need to do this podcast, but why do you? Welcome to Taylenders, a Lucy Cricket Base. Thank you for us, Tallendon's, Lucy Cricket Base.

With podcasts from me, Chief Force, him Felix White, him Jimmy Anderson, matchintender Walker, distantly. Tail Enders. Listen on BBC Sounds. BBC sounds, music, radio, podcasts. Hi, everyone. The BBC have told us that we've got to issue a warning.

We swear too much. Henry does beep it out for us because he's a good man. It is actually so that your family can all listen. Your kids can listen. But we will say... Sugar. That's not a really bad one. And cross strikes in the first over.

It's what England we're looking for. Hartley balls. Down the track comes scoring. This time she connects. It's either six or out. It's six. Hello. Welcome back to No Balls, a great podcast with

Alex Hartley, you Kate Cross and I have something that we need to say before we get into this podcast and I'm going to get straight into it. Go. Ready. Sue fell over. Sue fell over.

Sue fell over. I knew you were going to bring this up. I didn't think you'd bring it up in the first 20 seconds but well done you. Happy Valentine's Day. Sue will love you. We hope you're okay. The best thing I've ever seen on a cricket field

the elegance she got up with, blew my mind. That was just going to say, for me, it was the get-out that made it impressive. It was the inchworm jump up into the standing. Loved it. Loved it. And then she said, I think I need to give her a code of conduct.

Oh, the Sue fell over. Why has it happened twice already in her? really? I don't know, but this time she's not hurt her ankle, thank goodness. I forgot about that. That was at Bristol, wasn't it? Rolled her ankle. Sue rolled her ankle. Yeah, but yeah, Sue fell over. How are you? I have, I think it's a great start to the podcast. I don't think you could have set the tone any better. I'm okay. We've had a travel day. We're now in Port Elizabeth. We've played two games of the World Cup. You've got the sh** and it's Valentine's Day. Yay, I am Noel.

How far away from needing a Joe Root-esque nappy are you? Crossier, I, I pooed my pants today. Okay, let's just leave it there. No more needs to be said. Just leave it there. I knew there was a reason I didn't text you. I knew you'd really enjoy it. Okay, we can compose ourselves.

I'm sending you a lot of love and there's not much I can say that can make your day any better or worse at this stage. So I'm just going to send you a virtual hug. Thank you. Right. I don't know where we go. Do you have got a sticky note?

Yeah. Yeah. Let's go a sticky note. out. Have you got anything? I've got something on mine because your big boss, Adam, my big boss Adam, producer Adam, dropped you in it for me today and he gave me something to put on the sticky note. He told me that you thought that the reason there was a huge delay in our second game against Ireland when Amy Jones was struggling with the foothole bit of where the wicket keeper stands was because

you thought there was a snake on the pitch. I told everybody there was a snake on the pitch There's a snake in my boot Yeah I did because There's a snake in my boot There's a journalist called Nathan from Ireland And he was in the commentary box

And he said there's a snake And I being gullible Was like oh my god there's actually a snake And you all like went away from the stump So I was like oh my god There's actually a snake And I thought it was really peculiar That one of the umpires tried to grab it

Yeah Yeah she is a snake handler though So It makes sense there. What actually happened was where Amy Jones puts her left foot, if she stood up to a right-handed batter, there is normally a cutout where the stump mic lines and the cables are all fed up to the stump, so it like sits underground and they normally fill it all in beforehand. Have you seen them do that test where they bang the two wickets together?

Yeah, well, that's, yeah, yeah, I have seen that. So that's how they test the stump mic, that's got nothing to do with this story. So Amy's foot must have like uprooted one of the wires So she was like I'm going to trip over here and look like an idiot So they came and fixed it And that was all that happened There was no snake Like not a miniature snake

Not a big snake, there was just no snake Well I quickly realized it wasn't a snake When they started hammering the wire back into the ground It would be a savage, savage way To kill a snake on live TV But there you go yeah yeah that yeah it was it was a good rumor but never let the truth get in the way of a good story never never do um so i took a drink out to everyone at that point because there was so many

delays yeah like we bought six overs and we were 48 minutes into our innings it was just a shambles in that island game so i took a drink out and i just looked around and i was having a chat with amy and nat the siver brunt um danny wyatt was bowling leg spin at the end that amy jones wasn't not the snake end, the non-snake end. Danny, so Danny's doing that. Sophia Duncley and Catherine Brunt are having a dance off and Sophie Eccleston had rugby tackled Lauren Bell to the ground while Sarah Glenn just stood over

and watched them. So I was like, hmm, I think everyone's switched off for a minute. Don't think everyone's concentrate, just as Ireland are absolutely smacking it as well. And you're thinking there's a snake on the pitch? Yeah, yeah. Well, it can happen. My sticking out, there's only one thing on there.

But yesterday, I saw something that I've never seen before on a cricket field, and it wasn't a snake. What was it? The way you carried the drinks in a tray, like you had 15 margaretas. I am Tray Lady. Yeah, it's like you had 15 margaritas. Did you like my floppy hat yesterday? Yeah, I did like the floppy. I got the red floppy on.

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, Tray Lady. Tray Lady is a new thing that our S&C, Ian Durant, is brought into it. I don't really know why we're doing it, but we just make drinks in cups instead of them having to drink out of their water bottles because I think it makes them drink more because they think they're drinking something else, but it's the same thing, just in a cup.

Well, my thing is the cups are only half full, so maybe what if you needed more than one? They have more than one. There's a few of them that had a few more than them, than just the one so yeah i don't know why we do it but i think it just looks funny the thing with the tray though that we had was um it was actually a food tray that ian had just gone and found and you know when those big like the spaceship container things that you have when you got a lot of food yeah so you just taking it out there and put the drinks in it so well it did it's very harry potter

anything from the trolley we'll take the lot right oh well i didn't think i looked anything like anyone out of Harry Potter, but I'll take it. Glad I got some of their time. Anyway, anyway, the World Cup has started. Let's get into the World Cup. The World Cup has started. You girls are flying. What is going on with the batting?

Love it, don't you? Yeah. I am refreshed from this England side, and I am so excited to watch every single game. It's funny having the press talk about it now, because we obviously were trying to do all this stuff in the West Indies just before Christmas and one man and his dog was there watching and reporting on it. And now people are seeing it at a World Cup.

So it's not that new for us. We've obviously been trying to implicate this kind of play for a few months now. So it's nice to see, like, I saw your quote saying something about if this is how we're going to play, then you're really excited to see where this team could go. So yeah, it's been nice to get a bit of feedback on what we've been up to, really. Yeah, John Ball to stay, baby. Well, it's nice that John came on last week and obviously explained his thinking

and we got some really lovely feedback on his episode and obviously now people have started to see what we're trying to do so I feel like we've somehow stumbled across like doing this podcast quite well and in the right order, which we don't often do. Yeah, no, we planned it really nicely. Yeah, we know, we knew. We knew.

but no two from two what's the mood like in camp the mood has been a strange one which will probably bring us very nicely into the next part of what we want to talk about on this podcast but um mood on the first game was obviously nerves first world cup game we've done a lot of prep but no amount of warm-up games ever prepare you for the first game

there's fireworks and anthems and big flags and little kids that you've got a walk hand in hand on the pitch with so there was a few nerves around but we got a good win I thought we batted unbelievably well. Bowling a little bit rusty, but don't want to peek at this stage of the tournament. You want to be peeking in a week or so. And then the mood in the camp yesterday against Ireland

was like nothing I've ever felt before on an international game of cricket because the WPL auction happened and it was madness. Yeah, well, we might as well get into it right now, haven't we? Yeah, I think we should. should. Women's cricket had the first ever women's Premier League auction and it was Carnage. Chaos. I couldn't see much of it because we handed

our phones in when we got to the ground at like 1pm so done two hours of the auction but it sounded like it was carnage. Unfortunately Crossie you didn't get picked up your name didn't pop up like your name didn't even come up on the screen well neither did yours. I know like what's wrong? We're actually We're actually noblesly unwanted podcast right now. Yeah, what I bigged myself up for for the day, right, was to Alex Hartley to come up and everyone saying no,

and it go unsold and me take a picture and be like, that's cool. But to not even have my name come up, I was a bit flat. So I was speaking this morning at breakfast to the Indian manager who is very behind the scenes in the BCCI, there's a lot of planning with like tours and he's been in charge of the WPL and stuff like that. So he's in the know. So I said to him, I was like, Marif, why didn't my name come up?

What's the go there? Like how does it work? Because I just think I was so naive going into the whole process really. You see the men's and you kind of just see that Harry Brooke gets picked up for a million, but you don't really know how it works. Yeah. So he said that basically when all the names go in,

every team says like 50 names, that they're interested in potentially buying. So of that, then it whittles it down to like 409, whatever that final number was that went into the draft. Then, of those players, there's marquee players who are people who like four or five teams have said they're interested in. So they're then going to have the bid war.

So there you smitties, your sophies, your Nat, Sivabre Bruns, you're Asgardner, et cetera. So they come out first. So that's how they do the running order. So then when they had the lunch break, the people after that only had like one team, or two teams express an interest. So that's why they were lower down in the order.

So that's me and you out, unfortunately. Then, once that happens, the teams then at the lunch break get to see, they go through the rest of the names and see if they're interested in anyone. If not, then the unsolved players can come back in. So that is what happened. That's why we didn't get our names pulled out. And that is why me and you will be in England in March. So we got rejected at lunch.

We got rejected quite savagely at lunch, yeah That's right, I can deal with that Because I was never going to get picked up anyway And maybe you by the sounds of it No Well, it was a funny one, wasn't it? Because we both were like, we don't, We had no expectations going into the day

But then coming out of the day I was like, I feel really drained And it was so, honestly The atmosphere in the dressing room was so weird And we spoke about it as a group That we're not going to let it affect The International Game Because that's the priority, obviously.

But then how do you not let you, like that affect you? Like, Nat went for 300,000-odd thousand pounds. How is that not going to affect you? Nat Siverbrunt went for 320,000 pounds. So if I also went for 180,000 pounds, which I think is a steel, by the way. Absolute steel, yeah. So how did, because those two knew before the game and Dunkley,

was there any reaction from them, or was it like, okay, let's not react? So we'd all had a chat as a group about how everyone individually wanted to deal with it. So basically we put a thumbs up or a thumbs down on the WhatsApp group, whether we were willing to talk about our fate effectively. And I think that then opened it up to allow other people to come and talk to you if you'd given either the thumbs up or the thumbs down. But no, nothing was really said.

Like you obviously wanted to congratulate them, but equally you don't know if they'd seen it. Like you don't want to be the person to break the news. So you didn't want to say anything. but then there was this huge elephant in the room because that's the second most expensive cricketer on the planet right now, female cricketer on the planet right now. So yeah, it was just a bit like tiptoe, a bit walking on eggshells, you don't want to upset anyone, you don't want to break news to anyone.

So yeah, weird day, really weird day. Really weird day. And then at the end of play, some people knew, some people knew, some people didn't know. Some people knew that they hadn't been picked up. And I spoke to one person and they were like, I'm just really like a bit gutted and a bit embarrassed. Yeah, well, that's, I think when we've never had this before in women's cricket, probably not even in women's sport that I know of,

that somebody in a country that you're not in, people sat around a table, get to put a physical value on your head and say, I think you are worth this amount of money. Yeah, yeah. But let's talk about the positive, shall we? What a day. What a day for women's cricket? Unbelievable. I mean, the first player to go out, Smitty Mandana, go in for, what was it, 3.2 crore, like set the tone

and just like, I knew it was going to be amazing after that. I mean, I saw the video of the Indian team celebrating with her, almost like they couldn't believe how much money she went for. But she actually told us, well, not us, but we heard a rumor that she thought she'd go for 300 grand. She went for $340,000. I heard a rumor she thought she was going to go for $500K,000, so she's actually not pulled in as much.

Do you reckon she's disappointed then? Maybe. But to try and put it into perspective for people, the women's salaries in the 100, the top bracket is $33,000. Yeah. Smitty Mandaner is the top paid in that, or was last year in that tournament.

she's now earning 10 times that amount in this tournament. Yeah, here's one for you as well. These players are going to earn more in one tournament than Lydia Greenway earning her whole career playing cricket. It's just crazy, isn't it? Like we knew it was going to throw women's cricket and even women's sport to an extent into a completely different stratosphere.

But I don't think I knew, like I think we might have spoke about this on the pod, but I didn't think I knew what the money would be. Like I had an idea and an English. but I just didn't think I'd allow myself to think it'd be that much. Yeah, I mean, it is so, so good. And the best thing is, there's only going to be more teams added. It's only going to get bigger and better. We can actually follow it as fans and not have to worry.

Yes. So, who you're supporting? So we had a little Twitter spat, didn't we? Not a spat, but we had an exchange on Twitter, and you can support RCB because you have a team and you support the men's RCB team. Chen and I do not have a women's team. So I said I was going to support the team with the best kit.

However, I've still not seen the jerseys. So I don't know which team I'm going to support yet. Okay, you have refused to support RCB, even if their kit is the best? Probably going to refuse to support them, yes. Because I want to support the same team. But I really want to stick with RCB because I'm loyal in that. But they've not been loyal, have they? They've not picked me up.

The fans are loyal, though. You can't take anything away from their fans because they picked you as their second highest chance. pick. They wanted me above Harmon Precourt, above Elise Perry. The only person I was behind was Healy, I think. Speaking of, Steele, what did she go for? 60 grand? Yeah, yeah, Steele. Do you know what was really interesting before we go upstairs was watching coaches' faces, because I watched every minute of it, watching coaches and franchises faces about people. So it'd be like, do you want Joe blogs?

And they'd be like, no, not, not, not, yeah. And like, it was really, really peculiar. So with Healy, there was a certain franchise that were like almost forced into bidding for her because the owner wanted her, if that makes sense. Right, okay. The owners have a lot of say, actually, don't they? I was surprised by that.

I thought it'd be more the coaches. Yeah, she didn't end up going for that team. She ended up going for someone else. but the coach was like, nah, nah, nah, and the only just went, yep. And I was like, oh my God, what is going on? That's interesting, that's really interesting, actually. But yeah, I mean, the only other thing that, not ideal, was that it's in the middle of a World Cup.

And obviously, obviously the BCCI are going to look after the Indian players, so it wasn't on a game when India were playing a match. But hats off to like our players being able to go out there and represent their country in a World Cup against the team that I've beaten Australia in the last two weeks so it could have been a banana skin game like I'm just so pleased

that we managed to kind of swallow a tough pill and get through what was actually a really tough day yeah yeah and me quickly on the World Cup where you're at what's next before we go into some questions questions so yes

we have arrived in Port Elizabeth now, so we flew from Cape Town here. Is that how you pronounce it? We play here on Saturday, so it's currently Tuesday, so we've got a couple of days before our next game, I know we play against India, and I think that potentially you might be able to tell me better than this, but that potentially decides who tops the group? Yes, it will do. Unless you or India lose a shock game, obviously.

Yeah, yeah, of course. So we've got a little day off tomorrow We're going on safari Which will be very nice And we're on the beach at the minute Which is beautiful I can see the ocean from my room The ocean

The ocean Well very jealous I'm still in Cape Town I'm here until Saturday morning Because I'm doing every game Every ball of every game Live with BBC So I fly to you Saturday morning

So I'll be there Just to me Yeah just to you I really enjoy the fact we're allowed back on the pitch and I can come and say hi before a game now. Yeah, I need to speak about another rick. I know you said that the X have run their course, but I've got an ick with you.

Your bib, you need a smaller bib. Right, they don't, you know, I like oversized clothes. But the bib that I wear, so when you go out to the middle and you're not on camera or you're not a player, you have to wear a coloured bib which represents who you work for. So I have a broadcasting holders bib or something like that, and it's bright green, and it's just the size that we got given. That's all. Well, it drowns you. You need a big one. They're a smaller one. You don't need a big one.

Well, if I get a bigger one, I could put nothing underneath it, grassy. Oh, yeah. Oh, you like? Happy Valentine's Day. Shall we go upstairs on that note? Yeah, and there is only one umpire we have to go upstairs with. Superlover, superlover, superlover, superlover. How was it living next to Mr Palmer's house? I mean, we had a bomb go off in their garage, which was quite frightening. I'm Livy Haydock, and this is gangster, the explosive story of John Goldfinger Palmer.

He built an empire in the sun, scamming tens of thousands of innocent people. I said, who are you? And he went, I'm John Palmer. So I've said, you're the con man who's taken all my mummy then, are you? A scam that ultimately turned bloody. When people started to complain, Palmer sent in violent men. This is gangster, the story of John Palmer. Listen now on BBC Sounds. Hi both.

off the back of a very exciting day for cricket and the WPL auction, do you think the money involved in the WPL will create a bigger gap between the big three international teams, India, Australia and England and the rest of the world? Thanks very much, Gareth. Good question. Potentially, yeah.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, it could. Because England, India and Australia, the only three countries, well, Pakistan are having a PSL that have got a franchise competition. and I think they... Caribbean League. Oh yeah.

Oh, maybe not then. I think this is my opinion on it and it has been before I knew what the money was yesterday that the franchise tournaments are great but you still have to support them with the domestic structure underneath and you can't just drop people into these tournaments who like let's say Grace Scriven's for example you can't just pay her 12 grand to play in the 100

and then that's it for her competitive cricket for the rest of the year. So you need to support that tournament with the structures underneath it. And actually I saw Sophie Devine in a press conference yesterday say how she actually thinks that the Super Smash in New Zealand now and the domestic structure clearly isn't preparing them for international cricket. Well, obviously not. It's embarrassing. Well, that's what she says. But bar the West Indies.

Well, in fact, them and the West Indies are the only team that have got worse in the last four years. so that's what you can't just have like a one-off tournament for three four weeks of the year and then that's it like you have to support these players properly with the right money with the right structures facilities etc etc i think we bang on about this all the time on the pod yeah but it works though p s my ick is those socks and shoes that have toes i would have to immediately end the relationship if my partner turned up in them correct correct answer is just correct They are disgusting. Hello ladies. Why are Australia so good? Not a nice question for English people to answer, but why? They're playing the same sport as every other country in the same conditions,

but why are they just so good? They can't have bowlers that are faster than the rest of the world by that bigger margin. Their spinners can't spin the ball drastically more than other countries, so why are they better? Is it purely down to their domestic structure or what? Love the pod, anonymous. Oh, why are you? You Anonymous.

I do think, again, domestic structure is a part of it. They turn their girls professional four years before us. Yeah. Four or five years maybe. So that would have been around 2010. I think, again, we've said this on the pod, but I think the way that their states work, it's easy to have those domestic structures

because there was six states, basically, that could contract their players but I honestly think a lot of it and a lot of sport and a lot of sport it just comes down to belief and they believe they are the best team in the world. I have something to counteract this. I genuinely believe our spinners are better than theirs and our bowling attack is better than theirs. They have all rounders so they literally bat right down to number 11 even Darcy Brown and number 11 she can come in and she can hit the ball, they have got this breed of all rounders. Yeah, I would agree with that, yeah.

But I think with the way that we are batting at the moment, and I'm no, no doubt that our bowling will improve as the tournament goes on, because that's, what's that saying? Baters win your games, bowlers win your trophies. Something like that. I'm pretty sure we'll sort our stuff out soon. but yeah I do think with the way that we're batting if we can do that against an Australian team

because no one really does it against them no and I genuinely I think if someone can put them under pressure we saw it in the ashes last year we bowled them out for 180 we just couldn't chase it we had them 200 and something for seven in the next game like 210 for seven like they are

vulnerable yeah yeah they are hi Kate and Alex long time listener first time email it is a long one else so hold on to your nappy i've just listened to the episode discussing the under 19 world cup final and needed to message you after hearing about alex's bad day i wanted to say how refreshing it is to hear people talk about difficulties that are so relatable to me and i'm sure many others without feeling like i'm being diagnosed with a problem

while i'm sure it's true that playing and commentating on cricket would be a dream job for many myself included that doesn't mean that it doesn't come with its own struggles and downsides and I think being able to recognise that, let alone share it, is pretty great. I work from home nearly every day in a bog standard office job, just about managing to get myself out the house to play football on the weekend and often feel like life is just happening to me rather than actually living it. I'm sure there are many cliches applicable here about living life to the fullest, but the truth is that when you're stuck in a routine, you barely have to think about it.

It's difficult to break that cycle. Anyway, I hope you both know how amazing it is to hear successful people dealing with similar feelings while still showing up every day. and producing great work like the podcast. The cricket's not bad either. It really is a great listen, and I'm always buzzing when a new episode comes out. I think you're both hilarious,

and listening always makes me think of the kind of conversations I have with my teammates and friends playing football. I don't think it's a relationship that you can really replicate anywhere else. I realize that I've rambled on a little bit here, but I do actually have a question. I've just seen the headshots for the T20 World Cup on Instagram,

and needed to know that given that Kate was exposed as being really happy when her tongs out, does she feel under pressure to do it in photos so people think she's genuinely buzzing rather than faking it. All the best and good luck for the woke up, Lucy. Well, thank you Lucy. And that's why we do this podcast

to be relatable, to show with normal people. Crossie, did you fake Tong out? I can't. I can't do it. So I do think headshots probably expose me a little bit because it is a genuine smile but it's also not a genuine smile because someone says, smile.

And you got three, two, one. Yeah, but maybe it's just become a habit now But my teeth have changed I've got less of a gap now So they can't see the tongue as much They look good Thanks Hi guys

Hope you're enjoying South Africa And finding ways to keep cool The ice creams must be a medical must Oh my God, I've got a story about the ice cream So Georgia always went to buy us an ice cream The other day Or did buy us an ice cream And she opened hers, took a bite into

it and it's delicious, got some, you know, the ones with chocolate on the outside and ice cream in the middle, like almond flavour. So hers was lovely, lovely, lovely. I opened mine, took a bite into it, and I had a hollow chocolate bar with a stick in it because all the, all the ice cream had melted out the packet. Oh, no, that's such a sad occasion. I know, I was gutted. I was just like, do you want to go get another one?

I was like, no, it's fine. It's the world telling me something. Oh, I'm sorry, oh. Yeah. I'm sorry, oh. Are you okay? No, I'm really poorly, and I've got a cold. Sorry, that was gross.

I thought Al's alternative phrase have took the words out of my head on commentary with Henry was very great. You'd probably enjoy that one. I thought it could be a good texting. What are listeners' alternative phrases? So basically, Dan just wants to tell us his alternative phrase. Mine is from my youngest daughter Hattie

who calls littering glittering. It must be confusing for anyone that overhears her saying how naughty people are for glittering. You say Skellington, don't you? Yes, I do say Skellington. And I try and say skeleton. Skeleton, is that the right one? Skeleton. Yeah, but I've said Skellington for so long.

It's just stick with it. Do you know what one of my favourite phrases that's not a real phrase is that Siri has created, really? Ducking Hell. Yes. What the duck? Yes. I love it. Every day.

Ducksake. I love saying duck's sake. I actually say it now, but people don't know if... I don't say it in real life. That's actually the first time I've ever said it out loud. I know. That's an ink if you say it in real life. No, I wouldn't.

But I do think it on text, and I will say, if it keeps it, I don't change it. Yeah, I don't change it. I don't think what's the point? Should we do one more quick one? Because my battery is going to run out on my phone. Yes. Okay, this is titled My Thing. definitely was a nick honest. I was gutted to be filed under never happened in last week's

pod with my icky finger. Here's a couple of the obligatory social media photos of the finger crock in all its beige glory. Seeing it again, I can really understand why it's a nick. Go well, Matthew, and he has sent some photos of his finger in a crock. Well, all right, sorry Matthew. I apologise because it was me that said file that under it didn't happen. It did happen. I can see it with my own two eyes right now. Please, please stop sending those pictures of your fingers. Yeah, that's not great. Chris wants us to get an Irish player on the pod.

I've got big plans for this podcast, Crossy, and before you back to your runs out, I'll tell you it afterwards, but let's keep the listeners guessing. It's a secret anonymous. Keep it anonymous. Anonymous, that's from anonymous. If you want to email us, you can on...

Noballspodcast at BBC.com.com.com.com. It's so good. They've said it twice. They've said it twice. Okay, I hope you feel better. Best of look with the next 24 hours, because it's probably going to be worst. Thank you.

Thank you. Bye, everyone. Thank you. Bye. And cross strikes in the first over. It's what England we're looking for. Heartley balls. Down the track comes scoring.

This time, she connects. It's either six or out. It's six. I just didn't want to let my family down So that's why I sort of like push myself every single day Jermaine DeFoe outside the box From BBC Radio 5 Live Join me for my brand new

Flying the World podcast In my quest to become a football manager Just being able to look yourself in the mirror every day And just be like, you know what? I did everything right, I didn't cut any corners From my roots in East London to 57 England caps Winning the Scottish Premier League and everything in between

The gift and the talent, that takes care of itself. But the hard work and the sort of application, this needs to be day in and day out. Jermaine DeFoe, outside the box. Listen on BBC Sounds. You've got great eyelashes and great teeth. Like, it's really annoying. Thanks, Al. Thank you.

Paying a lot of money for these teeth.