Test Match Special - Sciver-Brunt 75 sends England into World Cup Final

Episode Date: July 3, 2026

Henry Moeran is joined by England World Cup winner Alex Hartley and South Africa broadcaster Firdose Moonda to reflect on England’s 40 run semi-final win in front of a record crowd at the Oval. We hear from player of the match and England captain Nat Sciver-Brunt plus England spinner Sophie Ecclestone and the South Africa captain Laura Wolvaardt. And we discuss how England can beat Australia on Sunday in a final you can hear on BBC Sounds from 3pm.

This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. He's widely recognised as one of the greatest footballers in history. He's won the prestigious Ballandeur Award five times. He's the all-time leading goal scorer in professional football. And according to the Bloomberg Billionaires Index, he's the first active footballer in history to achieve billionaire status. Guess who we're talking about yet? That's right. Good Bad Billionaire is exploring the life and fortune of football icon Cristiano Ronaldo.

That's good bad billionaire from the BBC World Service. Listen now, wherever you get your BBC podcasts. You're listening to the TMS podcast from BBC Radio 5 Live. So England are through to the T20 World Cup final. They've won by 40 runs here at the Oval. All smiles, jubilation for an England side that were wobbling earlier on. They lost three early wickets inside the power play to find themselves early on at 23 for 3.

They then needed something special and that special partnership came from Heather Knight, the former captain, alongside the current captain and returning from injury, Nat Siverbrunt. They put on 133 of just 90 deliveries,

England eventually scoring 169 for 5. In response, South Africa, well, there were moments early on where it looked as though Laura Wolfhardt could get going that Tasman Brits, who played nicely for a half century, could possibly do something. But no, the wickets kept on falling at crucial times. England's bowling was outstanding.

They're fielding, excellent. And they book their place in the final to face Australia at Lords on Sunday afternoon. They win by 40 runs, and it will be England, the Australia. That familiar fixture at the home of cricket to decide who will be lifting the T20 World Cup trophy. winner of the last time England won an ICC trophy, part of that squad at Lords in 2017, and on the field, taking wickets throughout that competition as well. Alex Hartley, you are part of it, you know how it feels. For those, Munda, you've been here before as a South African cricket follower.

You know what it is to see your side getting close, but not quite over the line. Let's run the rule over what we've seen. Alex, first of all, your reaction. I mean, I'm just so proud of the English. girls for getting through. I mean, so much pressure on them to get to that home World Cup final because England have never lost a home World Cup

ever. And there's been a lot of talk crowds, they've got behind the girls, how they've crumbled under pressure in the past, how they've not fielded well, how they've been under par, how they've been dominated by Australia, by South Africa. Charlotte Edwards has taken

over a year ago and she had this World Cup in her sight. She said I will be judged at this World Cup. And she absolutely, will be and she'll be judged in a proper way and the right way and whatever happens on Sunday whatever the result this team is a completely different team to what it was a year ago for this I don't think South Africa played to potential at this tournament and they certainly didn't look like a side that should be in a

World Cup final or even winning the World Cup there were far too many close matches the batting was discombobulated through a lot of the tournament and they were over aligned on two bowlers Marizan Cup and Shabna Mismail so I almost feel like from a team that reached the last three finals in Iceland events. They've gone a little bit backwards, but the bar's quite high. You're reaching finals and now you're not. There is a little bit of work to be done in terms of depth, maybe

in terms of the backroom staff, and also moving on from that golden generation. They'll be very disappointed, but I think that deep heartbreak that has accompanied some of the losses is not there this time, because they didn't deserve it. And as Alex said of England, they absolutely did. Ladies and gentlemen, the player of the match

tonight is none other than England captain Nat Siverbrund. She receives her player of the match medallion from two-time World Cup winner Isha Guha, 75 from 47, 114s and 1-6, striking at nearly 160. Firstly, welcome back. What were your feelings coming into this match, knowing what a crucial match it was to return?

Yeah, I guess obviously nervous. Probably the occasion gets quite big as well. So that increased the nerves as well, and I missed a few games as well. So yeah, I guess there was a lot of emotion pre-game but yeah I suppose as soon as the warm-up started I managed to switch back on to game time and yeah just just enjoyed myself out there and the way you managed to switch back on 23 for three you got together with Heather Knight you neither just one partnership you got that but how did

you go about rebuilding that in England innings yeah I guess Shabnam and Marizana obviously world-class opening ballers that we knew could do the damage so I suppose and I wanted to nullify the threat and make sure that we were then in and able to capitalize on the other bowlers. And yeah, I suppose with our experience we put our heads together and yeah, got the job done. It's usually a good surface here, but it was the third game played on this weekend. How did you find the conditions and how did you manage your game out there? Yeah, a little bit of variable bounce. So I guess we had to be really strong on the

stamps and I guess be very clear on where you wanted to score. And yeah, I suppose when you're in for a period of time, it does get a little bit easier. And yeah, I guess it was difficult for new batters coming in. So, yeah, the partnership was obviously crucial. Well, congratulations tonight. Our play of the match, Nat Siverbrunt. The England captain, Nat Siverbrun, speaking down there on the boundary edge. And reaction immediately that we will bring more of as we get it,

as we look back on England qualifying for the final of the tournament that is going to roll around quickly, Alex. Sunday, not long to wait, but lying in wait, Australia. I mean, it's a huge fixture. It's what the tournaments deserved, actually, I think. Yeah, absolutely. The two best teams, are they? Have been the two best teams, Australia, best team in the world,

England shown their dominance throughout this tournament. So, yeah, it definitely deserves an England-Australia final. Yeah, we'll get on to maybe how that game will go shortly, But just if we do examine the England performance for those, you mention the fact that you feel maybe South Africa have gone backwards. I'm not sure from the position England we're in at 23 for 3. A year ago, even, they go on to post a total like the 169 for 5 because I think that they were a more brittle side then.

I think they're tougher. Yeah, definitely. You know, Henry, we know that teams 73% or 77% of the time when you lose three wickets in the power play, you go on to lose the game. And just to see their two experienced players, Nat Zverbrant and Heather Knight, playing as well as they did,

that was an incredible partnership. The pacing of the innings was good. Nat's of Abund looked incredible. She was in total control, and I love what she said there about how she just switched on when the warm-ups came, and she knew that she had to lead this team there.

So I think England are a lot stronger. I was really interested to see what Charlotte Edwards would do with this side and turn them around the way that she has. You know, it hasn't been that long that she's been in charge, and she's already made such a big difference. They really look like a strong side.

I think the final's going to be so interesting. I think you're right, yeah. 2010, you have to go back. Seven additions for the last time aside, lost three wickets in the power play and came back to win it. I mean, that says quite a lot. Yeah, it does. And the funny thing is, like a year ago,

England losing three in the power play, you'd go, what's game off, isn't it? They're going to crumble under the pressure. We were saying it on air, really. I had no doubt that there would be a partnership between Nat Siverbrun and Heather Knight. These are two players that have played in the team, in the past, where I have gone, oh, they're going to crumble under pressure

and they're going to get knocked out of the tournament. So whatever is going on in that dressing room, to give them confidence and to give everybody else. What is going on? How does that happen? I think the way they are playing cricket and the way they are winning games of cricket gives you confidence, the way they're fielding, the way they're stopping the ball on the boundary,

the catches they're taking, the opportunities they're creating in the field, the way that Freya Kemp and Danny Gibson have come into this side and both on separate occasions taking the game away from a team knowing that if Heather Knight and Natseverbrun just have a six or seven over partnership you have that firepower at the back it just it's just such a well-balanced side now yeah and that feels like there is real confidence that if one person doesn't perform or two or three people don't perform there is the resilience they're not going to be quite as fickle as a slide. It feels like Charlie Dean coming in at eight in this team is so different to Charlie Dean coming in at eight last year.

Yeah. It's funny how perspectives change, isn't it? How much credit do you put at the door of Charlotte Edwards for the turnaround? I think a lot of it because she has brought in that all-rounder aspect and she, you know, she said that I want Frey Kemp and I want Danny Gibson from the outset. And, you know, from the off, she's been really, really keen to develop everybody as all-rounders. And you can't just be an opening back. You've got to be a jet in the field. You know, they had to get fit. they had to start fielding better. They have done that. They absolutely have done that. The way that everybody's developed their game.

You know, Danny Wyatt Hodge being able to play 360. Nat Siverrunt obviously doing that as well. Heather Knight being confident enough to play a reverse sweeps. I just think everybody has adapted their game for the better. Yeah. It feels that way, isn't it? It feels as though they've grown in confidence and strength and resilience and all of those sort of key elements that no matter how many hours of drills you do in the net,

never going to necessarily get. A word on England's bowling for those, first of all. There'll be some brilliant figures in there. And bearing of mind that the required rate at the start of the South African run chase was in excess of eight and over. The fact that nobody's economy was over that figure is such a credit to England. And you have to say that particularly Sophie Eckle Stern and particularly Freer Kemp and also I think you could probably chuck in Charlie Dean,

though she did go for a few runs at the back end of her, of her, spell but it just was such a strong all-round unit. It was. I think England also do a really nice thing where they start with Lindsay Smith and she tends to get rid of an over or two really cheaply up front. So already you're under pressure. You start needing eight runs and over. By the fourth over you need nine or ten runs and over. Then you've got Lauren Bell coming. You know the ball's going to be swinging. Then you've got Sophie Eccleston who comes on after the power play and she was impossible to get away. It was a really impressive performance from her. You know, she's also been under pressure. I think as a unit, They just came together in a way that I haven't seen another team do at this tournament.

Australia maybe, but to me, and I've watched all the matches in this tournament, I think England looked almost just that little bit stronger at the moment. Sophie Eccleston, Alex now has 334 wickets across international formats. We'll hear more from you in a moment, but here is Laura Walfard. I know it's pretty raw at the moment, but just talk us through the emotions. Yeah, very disappointed, but just not meant to be for us today. I think we're outplayed today by a really good England side and yeah, I think they played really well. You've been in situations like this before and you've been able to get over the line.

So what was different this evening? Not too sure. I think the main difference between our innings and theirs is just they had so many more partnerships. Obviously we started really well with the ball and then they had that really big partnership. And I think we just didn't have any partnerships to sort of speak of and didn't really have any badders that really got going. So frustrating to lose this way on a big stage. But yeah, we'll go back to the drawing board. Do the pitch play as you expected to in that second innings?

And what did you feel was traceable at the halfway stage? Yeah, I thought it was a pretty decent pitch coming on quite nicely. Thought 170 was about par. Pretty happy with that. Yeah, I thought, especially with the outfit as well, it's lightning. I thought it was going to be tough to defend. But yeah, I think they built pretty well. Clearly had different plans for us.

And yeah, we weren't able to step up. How difficult is it to play against the team that have so much home support as well at a ground like this? Yeah, I think it does play a role, but it was so cool to see so many fans here tonight. I think you just add sort of to the vibe and the energy. A couple of South Africans as well that I saw. So yeah, that was nice. And just lastly, just on South Africa, on the whole, through this tournament, you know, a lot of positives, obviously, for you to get to this point. How will you reflect on, you know, what you put and what you brought to the table?

Yeah, a decent campaign for us. I think happy to have made it out of this group stages. I think upon reflection, our batting never really fired throughout the competition. We had some glimpses here or there, some special innings throughout the tournament. But I think as a whole, we just weren't quite clicking. So, yeah, and I think that showed again a bit today. But, yeah, I think our bowling and our fielding was pretty good throughout. So, yeah, I think we'll have a look at what we've done wrong and hopefully be better next time. A lot of experienced players within that squad, but a lot of young players coming through.

Do you see that they've learned enough lessons here to be able to take forwards? I hope so. Yeah, I think that's a we have got an exciting mix at the moment. We've got some some really senior players who have played a lot of games with a lot of experience, but some exciting youngsters coming through as well. Hopefully we learned from this. I think the likes of Daxson was pretty good with the bat throughout. So yeah, hopefully players like that can be even better in the next edition.

I'd like once again, Laura, and all the best in your matches coming up. Thanks. 17 years since England last one, a T20 World Cup semi-final here. There's something about the Oval and playing here as an England team. Yeah, what a special place to play cricket. We've really loved playing here over the years, obviously 17 years ago as well, but yeah,

what a great ground to, I suppose, show the crowd how much we enjoy playing for England. and yeah, trying to inspire as many people as we can. At 23 for 3, you've already explained how you and Heather Knight went about your business and the partnership that you put together. A lot of experience there, but how much belief can you tell us that you have as a unit at the moment that you can bounce back from difficult situations? Yeah, I guess we've got full confidence in our batting lineup from top to bottom.

So I suppose from that point of view, there was never any worry about, know other people coming in, but Heather and I knew that we had a really important job to do to get our team back on track. And yeah, I suppose the composure that we showed was really important. You know, we could have tried to go harder earlier and, you know, maybe it didn't work out the way it did. So, yeah, I think we were really smart and, yeah, took the game on it in a slightly different way to, I suppose, a typical T20 innings. Did you feel short at the halfway stage? No, I think we had a good score.

We could tell that there was some variable bounce and keeping the sums in play was going to be so important, maybe using some cutters and cross seamers as a seam bowling group. And yeah, I thought that Freya Kemp especially did so well with her off-paced deliveries and mixing it up just made it so difficult for the batters. When it came to that second thing, as we know how much depth South Africa have with the bat. It felt like a bit of a gamble that six over in the power play with Lindsay Smith coming back on. You got the wicket of the captain. Charlotte Edwards ran onto the field. Was there a plan behind that? Yeah.

To get three overs from the same baller was pretty tough in T20. Lindsay's done a brilliant job for us in the power play. But I suppose tactically for us to be able to have four oars of Sophie in the middle, that has been a huge benefit for our team. but obviously Lindsay's taking that wicket of warfare in the power play was so key we had the plan set out right and yeah we stuck to our guns really

when she'd hit one over the top the delivery before Lindsay and I looked at it looked at each other and thought let's go again yeah the crowd just incredible did you have a chance to kind of take it all in we heard them banging out Adela at one point yeah

yeah very tuneful Yeah, no, the crowd has been so good throughout this tournament. I managed to take it in a little bit, walking out to bat and walking off and a few of the wickets as well. Yeah, it's just infectious playing with this team and in front of the home crowd has been so special. So, yeah, I cannot wait to do it again at Lords. How's the calf? Calf's good. The old enemy at Lords.

How big of an occasion is that going to be? massive. Yeah, what an occasion it'll be. I guess, you know, finding out there's a Home World Cup who is doomed to be in that final and what an opposition to be facing. Yeah, so obviously a really, really talented side that have had a huge success. But yeah, we'll see what happens down at odds. Is it coming home? hopefully okay we'll leave it at that well done this evening

now congratulations on your own performance to Heather as well and for the overall team performance all the best on Sunday you're listening to the TMS podcast from BBC Radio 5 live thoughts there of the two captains

that was Natseverbrunt Jash Duiji Gouha and mentioning Australia and their record in finals against England well, I might as well bring you the stat. They've played six of them, and Australia have won six of them,

going right back from 1982, 88, 2012, 2014, 2018 and 2018 and 2022. But records are there to be broken, Alex Hartley. They are indeed, and that record has to be broken at some stage, isn't it? So England will be hoping and praying that it is this time round, this time on Sunday. England will lifted the trophy, hopefully, and they'll be sat on the outfield having a drink. Yeah, but Australia have been dominant against England in World Cup finals.

Yeah, they have. They've been so strong. So a little word on Sophie Eccleston, 334 international wickets across formats. Hypercourse, thank you for that stat and for pointing out that it is now only one behind England's leading wicket-taker, Catherine Siverbrand. I mean, that's just ridiculous, isn't it? She's an unbelievable cricketer. You know, there's absolutely no doubt about that. I said, you know, she's, what is she now, 26? She's got another 10 years.

She could take a thousand wickets, like genuinely, you know, she's such a good player. Yeah, I mean, there's no words to sum her up as a player. One wicket behind Catherine Siverbrun. She's like the greatest England I've ever had, a fast bowler. Sophie Eccleston is, you know, the best bowler, I think, that cricket has produced ever. Women. She's not quite Rashid Kahn. But she's the women's version of.

Yeah, well, that's pretty high praise, Alex, I have to say. She took one for 21 from her four overs this evening and she's been speaking to Alison Mitchell. Sophie, your into World Cup final at home. What's tonight meant to you all? I can't even point in words how much I'm absolutely buzzing. Home World Cup final. How much, like the keyhole was unbelievable tonight

so I can't wait for Sunday. How about Nat's Sibre Brent your captain strolling in? Calf, what calf? Yeah, I can't believe how good she was. I've got no words for her. She's just unbelievable and one in a generation. Cricketer. Take me into the dugout though when it was 23 for three what were you all feeling then and how did then things unfold when that as that partnership develop between that suburb Bruns and

Heather night. Yeah I was going to be quiet but watch Heather walk out to join that. I feel like the sort of calmest duo you've got in cricket and we're very lucky to have them so to watch them go out and do their thing I think as one world-class to watch them do that and the catch you took a couple of catches tonight talk us through those yeah I feel like I was following me a little bit but I feel like yeah I'm big game player like the football's following me then I'll love it so So I was buzzing save a few catches. You're into the World Cup final. In 2017, when England won the World Cup, you had already made your debut for England,

but you couldn't be in contention for the World Cup, could you back then? Tell us about that story. Yeah, obviously I was in school, so I got told my exams over cricket, so to be in a home walk-up final now, however many years on, I'm absolutely buzzing. I can't wait.

What do you remember of that final? Did you watch it? Yeah, I was in the stands watching, so I got a picture with Danny White Hodd with a trophy. So hopefully we can reincarnate that on Sunday. How important do you think it will be to have some of those in the side still that played in that final to bring their experience to what's going to be such a big occasion? Yeah, to have some experienced players there like Heather and now. I mean, it's unbelievable to have them in the team anyway, but they've got World Cup experience on home soil.

So, yeah, we'll definitely be tapping into them too ahead of Sunday. Australia's just been such a thorn in England side for so long. Is there any sense of fear factor about this current Australian side? T-20 cricket, anything that can happen. They're a great team, but we're also a great team. I feel like we've proved how good we are over the last few weeks and a few months. so hopefully you can give them a good game and yeah come out on top you're unbeaten what sense of momentum does that give you going into a final yeah unbelievable to be unbeaten going into a world cup finally can't ask for much more so you're really excited for that well done incredible achievement see you on sunday thank you sophie echleston who took from her four overs won for 21 as england won by 40 runs to ensure their place in sunday's t20 world cup final come then alex how do they beat australia

your nerve. Hold your nerve. When Australia are going hard at you, don't crumble under that pressure. They are human. They are not robots. They will also be feeling that pressure. I think they're allowed to have good spells in the game, but England hold their nerve.

They were very, very capable of coming back. I think they have to use the strength of their bowling attack to their advantage. I think England have been very adaptable in the way that they've gone about things. Sophie Eccleston, if she needs to ball in the power player, has to ball in the power play. Lindsay Smith doesn't necessarily have to ball at the death. They've obviously got Kemp and Gibson, Gibson with the back of the hand, slower balls, Lauren Bell.

Up top, I think, yeah, just hold your nerve against a very, very strong Australian side and absorb the pressure. And if they're on top, so be it. You know that, you know, somebody like Phoebe Litchfield, for example, when she's in and she's striking the ball, she's playing a sweeps, a reverse sweeps, she's also going to create opportunities with those. So you think they can do it? Absolutely.

The way I've seen this England side play, the way they've cruised through this group stage, the confidence they'll take, like I've said before, the way they're fielding, the way they're taking their catches, the ground fielding, Danny Gibson has set the standard. She's been unbelievable in the field, and it's just given them all confidence. So, yes, I do believe they can win.

It's just not going to be easy. talk us through that feeling just finally of being part of an England squad as you were in 2017 that knows the pressure to get to the final is a big pressure because of the fact it's a home World Cup I mean how relieved do you feel at this point that you've done that as a side yeah so relieved you've almost the game has changed in the nine years since we did it back in 2017 it was almost like a okay we've got to the World Cup finance almost a job done and that's The talk to me was that job done whatever happens happens. And obviously amongst the senior players,

it would have been we've got to win this game of cricket to see what had to change in the cricket in the future. In a weird way, there is more pressure on this side because having won in 17 means we've never lost the home World Cup final. The roses, the lionesses, they've added a little bit of pressure as well. But then you're playing against the world's best side who are very adaptable, who have all bases covered, that clinical, they know how to win,

but they haven't been winning either. You know, they've not made World Cup finals recently. Their recent record is not what it was. Exactly. So you've got one team with a point to prove to themselves, being Australia. I don't think they've got a point to prove to the rest of the world.

And you've got England that go in as underdogs at home with the backing of the crowd, hopefully are sold out lords. And I guess that confidence of knowing, how they've played throughout this tournament. We shall see, Alex Hartley. Thank you very much indeed for your thoughts and company this evening. And that is just about where we will leave things here from the Oval,

where we've seen England getting over the line quite comfortably in the end to beat South Africa by 40 runs and book their place in the final of the T20 World Cup against Australia on Sunday. So much to look forward to ahead of that game as well. don't forget on BBC Sounds. The Test Match Special podcast has an addition looking back at that 2017 success from those inside the camp. And I highly recommend that. So do look out for that.

Just search Test Match Special on BBC Sounds. On Sunday, we will be live on air 3 o'clock ahead of a 3.30 start from Lords, the Homer cricket. Before that, the second T20 England's men against India from 215 on Saturday from Old Traff. So much to look forward to, so much to enjoy. England through to the World Cup final against Australia. We'll be there on Sunday. Make sure you're with us.

The TMS podcast from BBC Radio 5 Live. Five Lights 4th. My favourite World Cup moment? It's the first World Cup I properly remember watching. Argentina 78. The ticker tape, Mario Kempes, Ari Hahn's scoring goals from miles out. And always one of my favorite World Cup moments.

Archie Gemles, great goal for Scotland against the Dutch. What makes the World Cup such a special tournament is the atmosphere, the colour, it is a meeting of the nations and of people who love football. The People World Cup 2026. Listen on BBC Sounds. He's widely recognised as one of the greatest footballers in history.

He's won the prestigious Ballandeur Award five times. He's the all-time leading goal scorer in professional football. And according to the Bloomberg Billionaires Index, he's the first active footballer in history to achieve billionaire status. Guess who we're talking about yet? That's right. Good Bad Billionaire is exploring the life and fortune of football icon Cristiano Ronaldo. That's Good Bad Billionaire from the BBC World Service.

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