Test Match Special - TMS meets superfan Ravi

Episode Date: July 5, 2025

Jonathan Agnew welcomes TMS superfan Ravi into the TMS commentary box. Ravi is visually impaired and plays as part of the Lord’s Taverners supers 1s competition. In two days across England’s Tests against India at Headingley and Edgbaston, Ravi meets Joe Root, Jofra Archer, Phil Tufnell and Ebony Rainford-Brent. Plus, his favourite player Yashasvi Jaiswal visits him.

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you're getting a fair exchange rate with no extra markups. Be smart. Join the 15 million customers who choose Wise. Download the Wise app today or visit Wise.com. T's and Cs apply. from BBC Radio 5 Live. Hello, I'm Jonathan Agnew. Welcome to the TMS podcast with the Test Match Special Team welcomes 12-year-old superfan Ravi. Now, Ravi's visually impaired

and plays as part of the Lord's Tavern as Super One's competition and is also involved in the ECB's My Way to Play campaign. To come, we'll hear how he was surprised at Edgebaston to meet and interview some of his heroes, but first a reminder of how he first met Ravi

at Headingley, and which member of the TMS team went to find him in the stands. Oh, yeah, Phil Tufel. Oh, no, did he? He's so annoying, isn't he? No, I like seeing him. This is a great surprise, yeah.

I'm so excited. I can see that you are. You've come, actually, you've come very carefully prepared because you're covering all bases. You've got an India hat and you've got an England shirt. So you're kind of covering, you're sort of just hedging your bets a bit, are you? Yeah, because I'm not always win, don't I? Well, I suppose you do

Unless it's a draw So look, let's explain, Ravi, what you're up to here You play disability cricket Because you can't see 12 years old And you go and play And you love cricket Which is fantastic

And I've been watching some film of you playing Can you explain Explain first of all What it was that got you Into your love of cricket Because you are like an encyclopedia I've been listening Hey Tough was he's been chatting to

Those his stuff I know. We'll get on to the Indian tactical mistakes she was telling about in a minute. Princt his father's here as well. Well, come on. What got you into cricket then, Ravre? Well, listen, like, my dad's always been interested in it, and my granddad loves it. So, obviously, it's been on the TV. So then I've found some interesting kind of listening to it.

So, yeah, that's how I've got into it. Right. And what about, you listen to the... on the radio, do you? Yeah, I listen to cricket on the radio. I love listening to cricket on Test Match Special because it describes everything where, like, Sky Sports, they don't describe every single thing that happens.

Well, you're being very diplomatic, Ravie. But I suppose, you know, if you are getting into cricket and sitting there and listening to it, any kind of cunder-up pictures in your mind, do you, about what we're talking about? Yeah, I mean, I kind of get like, yeah, feelings kind of wear what you're kind of thinking as well. And I like kind of thinking like the captain, so like, who we're going to turn to now. Oh, you like all the tactics.

Yeah. I was watching you playing because the cricket that you play, but I watch blind cricketers play, and it's astonishing. It is absolutely extraordinary. How on earth people who cannot see a ball can hit it. I mean, it's as simple as that, isn't it? Tell me, because I've seen, because you play, by the look of it, it's all kneeling down, aren't you? And you play with a bat, like a horizontal bat,

and you shall sweep the ball, don't you? Yeah, I mean, I play, like, the sweep, yeah, with the horizontal bat, and then I can play, like, the reverse sweep. Reverse sweep, can you as well? Yeah, I was pleased because I managed to a reverse sweep, Mark Wood. So that was pretty good. Yeah. Do you know, I think you might be the only batsman in the world

ever to a reverse swept Mark Wood. Was he bowling at 94 miles an hour? Yeah, I think he said that he's bowling quick. Did he? Well, he's downstairs. You better have that out with him. So how, come on, I guess it's kind of second nature to you, but explain how on earth you do hit this ball.

Is it one that's got the little sort of ball? bearings in it? Is that how it works? Yeah, so the ball, like you roll the ball on the floor so I can hear it coming, I can hear it coming towards me

because it has to have a bell in because otherwise I won't know where it's going and just be guesswork. But to hear to actually be able to know where the ball is simply by the sound of a bell that's moving towards you, it's an extraordinary skill. Oh, thank you.

Well, it is, isn't it? I mean, it is pricked, come on, father, sitting alongside. This is a very cricket-obsessed young man you have here. Yeah, no, absolutely. When I first started watching it at home with him, I didn't think he was taking it in at all, and then obviously he starts saying all these stats and what's going on, and, oh, they've got two there,

oh, just the single. And I'm thinking, Ravi, how are you knowing this when you can't see anything? It's incredible. And then, from then on, he started saying that he wanted to play and I thought, oh, you know, that's unlikely. And then you start Googling things and then you think, actually, it is likely and there is things out there.

And then, you know, the Super Ones program run by Lord Taverners has just been amazing and just opened up another side of the game which I didn't think existed. And I wouldn't know it existed now until obviously we had Ravi. Yes. And are there other kids his age who, who play though or does age matter in that sort of cricket?

Yeah there are other kids there he's the youngest he's the only one with a who's severely sighting impaired the others have a range of different sort of special needs but they all just meet together and absolutely love it on a

Thursday night and then from there he's been introduced into the Durham VI team he's sort of he's had a few over us with the Durham VI team which has been lovely but you know the adults that are there just I suppose it's something that he

aspires to be playing with in the future Durham VI cricket team it must be very emotional for you to watch isn't it? Yeah absolutely yeah no it's just as a parent you want to see your kids just follow their passions and with Ravi's blindness you sort of wondered whether that was possible his sister Priya has got

sight and goes off and plays, you know, different clubs. She plays cricket as well. But for Ravi, the super ones run by the Lord Taverners is just, it's like his club. It's somewhere where he belongs. And so, that's fantastic. And obviously, me and granddad get to have a boy's weekend away occasionally. We can blame it all on Ravi.

Yeah, you're better. So, Ravi, favourite cricketer. Who is your favourite cricketer? Favorite cricketer? Well, I love Yasafi J-Swah. I mean, it used to be Raw-Hit Sharma,

but I'm not going to say Raw-Hit anymore because he's retired from T-20s and tests. Yes. So is that jazz or because the way he played Hio?

Is that what you're saying? No, not just that. It's like the way he plays and his character as well. I mean, he's had a very tough upbringing and the passion to play cricket, like how much

it just shows how much he loves it and how much he's going to sacrifice for it. He has, and he used to live in groundswins, and tents, didn't you, on the Medan in Mumbai when he was a little boy, learning the game? Is that what you're talking about? Yeah, that's what I'm talking about. Yeah, and how do you find out things like that then?

Are you just Googling and you're obsessed with stuff? You listen to podcasts and things. I listen to a lot of podcasts, but how I find these kind of stuff out is like we Google stuff yeah read articles about these players

because you don't know about the stuff outside the game you might think oh you're Sassie J's well he's a brilliant cricketer he's done so he's done so well he's so lucky but actually he's gone through

such a tough period of time yeah and it's very interesting to find out about these things isn't it yeah totally what about since you're wearing an England shirt who's your favourite England cricketer then favourite England cricketer well

Ben Stoke I love how hard he how hard he tries as well like he puts all the effort in to try and get himself back bowling brilliant batter when he gets going I mean remember that 2019 game Headingley

I love it It's the best game ever, wasn't it? Oh, no, it's like the best game ever. But you were only about seven then when that was happening. How do you remember that? Were you following it? Well, I didn't actually watch that game. I just found out how brilliant it was

through the Ben Stokes' autobiography, and obviously the Ben Stokes' autobiography. That kind of explained everything, and it's just like, wow, that's brilliant. And he also came back from that, you know, 2016 the car lost breath rate remember the name, that quote

when you got hit for sixes You're even born then, I don't see, where are you? I was free I was free in that year, yes. I was there that day I didn't think Stokes had come back from that. It was a savaging, wasn't it? I know, I mean, you got put

to the cleaners and what you thought is is art, well what you would think is art, I don't want to I don't want to come back to that kind of stuff. I mean, it's a bit like, you know, in the IPR, I mean, this is a smaller come back to than Ben Stokes. But, you know, Yash Deh Al, who got hit for 5'6s by Rinku Singh? Yes, absolutely.

He's came back quite, has came back brilliantly because I think some people, I think, like, he kind of, he kind of kept on having a go. Like some players would just say I'm not going through this heartbreak anymore And give up Yeah But these are other But these are other players Are like

Actually I want to carry on And that shows their passion for the game Because these players go through So many highs and so many lows Like for example The Carlos Braffert Remember the name for Ben Stokes

And then winning the World Cup With England In 2019 And then doing that Things in Headingley Yep It is extraordinary Isn't it?

Tough as What is? I think he's got his job I think What are you doing for 20 minutes After tea I'm on the edge of my seat I mean it's just

Incredible isn't it I mean amazing Everyone loves cricket Don't you know They're all here today And I was down there There's a real buzz about it You know India here

Amazing What's it like big in the Test Match Special box in Ravik, because you're hearing the voices in your ears now that you've been listening to on the radio for some time, haven't you? You've met Isha as well?

Oh, I can't tell you how good that is. I mean, meeting all these players, like, for example, who have been brilliant for England for such a long time. Like, Alistair Cook. You met Alistair Cook as well? In his era,

obviously you, Phil Tuff. Ishigua, yeah, so it's just being brilliant and also Andy Zaltman because I'm a big fan of Andy Zaltman. Oh, where is? He's punching the air behind. I'm sitting with all his, he's got all these bits of paper here, Ravi, and screens and computerised stuff. So do you, yes, I think you probably do quite like the stats, don't you?

I think I've got an idea how your mind works with cricket. Yeah, I really like the stats because obviously, the stats are very important because, for example, if you don't know the stats, then you might think Shawa Bashir is an opening batter. Like, you know what I mean? Yes, no, it's very important to know

to know the facts of it all. India went a bit wrong this morning, didn't they? Yes. Well, what do you think? I think it was a very disappointing morning. I mean, it started off brilliantly with that Gill and Pant partnership carrying on, Pant getting up to her century.

And then a collapse started happening. And you just thought, well, I was thinking, oh, we can get up to 600, and that's going to put England under serious pressure. Maybe we can get the follow on. Where now, England, bowling India out quickly this morning, and then getting batting, like, they've started, I mean, they lost in early wicket,

but, I mean, they haven't necessarily gone hell for leather, but they've, like, kind of, they've defended, they've tucked the singles on offer. Seen bummer off? Yeah, they've seen bummer off. Yeah, gosh. So, does he sit there with the radio on? He's got sort of headphones in,

so he's listening to the commentary and just taking all that in, isn't it? Yeah, that's it. No, he's taking it all in, and he picks up so much from it, Beyond cricket as well. Where are you going to go with your cricket then, Ravi? Because, I mean, there's an England blind team for a start, isn't there? Is that what you sort of aspire to doing? Or are you going to try and get involved in cricket in other ways?

Yeah, I mean, I'm definitely going to try and get into, I want to get, like, international cricket playing that. And I'm so pleased that there is an England blind team because it would be so unfair if there was. because then it's not fair on any blind people because they should be allowed to do exactly what other people can do it's just in a slightly different way

it doesn't stop you from doing anything no that's an absolutely correct attitude to have avocuses and it is pretty I don't know if you know about Virginia pair cricket I mean is it the same sort of thing that he's playing in the super ones I mean is there a progression from that onto the organised blind cricket Yes, yeah, I think so, because as I said, from Super Ones, he's then got involved in the county scene, as I say, he's not there yet, but he's mixing in the right circles and then from there, who knows, but yeah, Ravi's, he's very, he's very passionate about making sure that he's going to aim for the top, aren't you, Ravi?

You've been toying between England V-I team or India V-I team. It's almost like he's got a choice of which one he plays for in the end. Well, I've been trying to work out, if you had to put everything on the line here, Robbie, I'm just trying to work out which team are the two out there playing. You are actually most committed to, because you sounded a bit disappointed that India didn't get the 600 there. So are you barricing really for India or England? Come on, be honest.

Well, I want India to win, but when I'm older, I'm thinking about wanting to play for England because it's going to be easier for me, so I think I might decide to play for England. The TMS podcast from BBC Radio 5 Live. The Dakar Rally is the ultimate off-road challenge, perfect for the ultimate defender, The High Performance Defender Octa, 626 horsepower twin turbo V8 engine and intelligent 6D dynamics air suspension. Learn more at Landrover.ca. The following advertisement feature is presented by GoTurkia. Most travellers only scratch the surface of Turkey.

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One clip reached well over a million views on the BBC cricket Instagram account. And even his favourite player, Yoshazvi Jaiswell, shared an Instagram story for Ravi. So this week at Edgemaster, we sent Ebony Rainford Brent to go out and find him again.

Hello, guys. Hi, Ravi. I'm Ebony. Ebony Rain for Brent from Test Mackey. special. I heard you had a surprise last week from Phil Tufnell. How was it? Oh yeah. It was great. Great to meet you. Have you had any reaction from all your friends and family?

Yes, lots of people have been saying how it was great and all that kind of stuff. So that was great. Well, are you here to watch the cricket today? What's the plan? Well, yeah, I'm going to watch the cricket today. India are in the driver's seat at the minute. 64 for 1 lead lead 2-4-4 so I'm going to need to get wet-out. Amazing. Well, do you fancy another surprise? Oh, yes, please.

Do you? Okay. Oh, yes, please. All right. How about you come and join me, all three of you, Dad and Granddad, do you fancy coming? What's the best thing? Do you want to hold your hand? Right, which hand's better for you? I don't really want to. All, let's go this way with your right hand. Okay, come around. Guess what? First of all, we're going to go down here. We're going to go first thing onto the pitch, all right?

Have you been on the international cricket pitch before? Well, yeah, I've been to Edgebast It always been onto the pitch Which it was great, yeah What did you think of it when you went last time? Oh, it's great, brilliant Sounds like you've been listening to the match What do you think so far?

Well, India in the driver's seat Like I said, it's six lead to 344 I mean England need to take wickets So one thing that I will say about England though Is they can chase big scores They can, I mean we've seen them do it before Well, a couple of questions. I know that Jarswal is one of your favourite cricketers.

He got a few runs in the first innings, but also did you see Shubman Gill? Big, big score. 266. Did you hear about that? Oh, yeah. He was brilliant that innings. I mean, he played beautifully.

He batted with the lower order as well, like with Washington Sundar, who I think he played a crucial role like Jadaja as well. I think India has corrected the mistake from the first test. And did you listen to it? Were you listening or do you come here as well? Well, I've just been listening like from home on the radio. I was watching it on the radio yesterday because we're travelling down.

I like this little step here. We're going to come down. Right. First of all, stop here. You feel that? That is the pitch. So we are now about to walk on. Right, let's go.

Let's see what we find. This is great. This is so cool. And so I also saw that you play as well, right? Yeah, I love cricket, play, watch. I saw it because I've played a bit and you've got the ball with the ball balls in, and do you like to bat or bowl more? Batting, definitely.

Definitely, right? Yeah, definitely batten. Which batter would you want to be in the England side? Who would I like to be? Well, I mean, I would say like be but obviously be a bit more

aggressive as well, so like kind of a bit like a bend ducket, kind of. What number do you want to play as well? Would you want to open or middle order a little bit later? I'd love to open. Oh, yeah. So I used to open as well.

I think it's the best place because you can then just go out. If the ball's new, it comes off the bat more, you can smash it. Would you want to play some aggressive shots as well? Yeah, I mean, I like playing aggressive shots. I mean, I think kind of, even when the bowlers are bowling well, I think attacking is your best shot to play because sometimes, not all the time, but sometimes because it changes the ballers line. Right, just to let you know what's around us at the moment,

And you know, Dinesh Kartik, an Indian player. He's right to near us. He's on the Sky TV at the moment. So he's to your right. We've got some crowd coming in as well. So a few people are just starting to come in, but it's still early. And then I'm going to bring you around. So we're kind of, we're at the media, underneath the media center.

I know you went in you last week, didn't you? Who did you speak to? Jonathan Agnew, Phil Tufnell. And then I met Alistair Cook, Stephen Finn. Oh, wow. You met so many players. Who was your favorite? And don't tell them I asked you that.

I feel tough now. Okay, we said we had a surprise for you. Okay. Guess what? What? You're about to meet an England player. Say hello. Hello.

Hi. Ravi, how are you? Good, nice. What's your name? I'm Joe. Oh, hello. Let me, uh, let you speak to him. It's so great to meet you as well.

Come here, Ravi, lovely to meet you. Lovely to meet you. I've got a few little treats for you, actually. We've got your signed... Sorry, I've got a signed shirt for you first. all, which says to Ravi, keep enjoying the sport, and thank you for all your support, best wishes from me. Thank you.

I've also got a pair of my gloves, which I've put a little sign on as well for you. Oh, thanks. These are for you, I'll put this just over your shoulder like that, and then you'll have to wear these when you play your next match, okay? Thank you. Oh, yes, definitely. I don't probably wish you me good luck because you're so good, so it'll wish me good luck. Well, I've seen you play, actually, with Mark Wood, and he's told me all about you.

and I actually really enjoyed watching your play it's incredible what you do so keep doing it keep enjoying it keep inspiring so many other people in the sport and I can't wait to watch your play again thanks so what's your plan for today in England well take 10 wickets for no runs

and then knock them off that's our plan for today you think you're going to get the ball today I'm not sure I'm going to if I do I'll try my best have you got any tips for me well obviously just just ball to obviously what the The pitch, if the pitch is turning, then obviously try and get it to turn, if it's not, then obviously trying to get a to skid, obviously.

Oh, that's some good advice, actually. Hopefully that works out nicely for me if I get the ball. So do you think there's a possibility of that? Or do you think Bashir will just bowl will spin today? There is a small possibility. I'll have to try and sweet talk Ben into giving me a bowl, but we'll see. I'll definitely try my best, and I'll take that advice on board if I do get the chance to bowl. so watch that would be good

you're a great battle as well thank you well hopefully I get another bat today and try and score some runs for you okay thanks yeah so you so in the first innings you play nicely for that 22 as well

oh that's very kind thank you I was a bit unlucky wasn't I yeah a bit unlucky to get out yeah and then so what do you feel comfortable with chasing then 400 or what do you feel comfortable anything

anything. I think this team, one thing that we we're not, I don't say I think we're arrogant, we are very confident, but I think we can chase anything. We'll certainly be giving it a good go. We've got a number of players that are very talented, that are in great form, we've got a lot of confidence, so we'll take whatever it is on.

Would you ever try and draw the game if you'll? That's not in our nature, I don't think, but we'll just play it as we see it. Long way to go yet, so hard hard work this morning first. Even if you chasing 600 on the final day, you'll have a go. That's only just overseas.

and over so we can give it a good game yeah definitely so and then you've got obviously the seymers wokes cast tongue uh will strokes ball today do you think i hope so i mean you're you should be working for the BBC full time this is you've got ebony out of a job here asking all the tough questions um yeah like you say we've got all all those very talented skillful bowlers so hopefully they can exploit what there is in the wicket and we can take some early ones this morning. Yeah, I mean, you score very quickly, so you don't have to worry about that, to be honest. I mean, if you bat for the whole test, well, you bat all day tomorrow and a session today,

then you should wait, to be honest. Thank you, mate. Well, we need to get you in the dressing room and tell all the lads that you're very inspiring and you speak some very good, honest stuff. So thanks for your time this morning. I'm going to have to go and hit some balls now and get ready for my day, but I hope you have a wonderful day again and enjoy the rest of the test match. Lovely to me.

Cheers, Joe. That's real pleasure. Thank you very much. England's got a very fast bowler called Joffra Archer. You've heard of him, right? Yes. Guess what? He's right next to you.

Okay, let me hold this for you. And Joff, I'm going to give you the mic. Say hello to Ravi. Hello, Ravi. I was told to come over and say hello to you. How are you? Good, man. It's brilliant to meet you.

Nice. I heard you at Headingley as well. Did you enjoy that one? Oh, yeah. That was a great one. You think you're going to get in the table? I'll come talk to you when the camera's gone. All right, I'm going to go warm up and they'll catch back up with you in about 10, 15 minutes.

I'll see you in 10, 15 minutes. Nice to see you, Joe. See you soon. All right. Oh my gosh, you're getting to meet all the England heroes. Give me your hand. All right. Yeah, so how was that?

So what do you think? Do you want to see him playing in Lorsu? 100%. Is he one of your favourite bowlers? Yeah, I'm my favourite. Although, I think the biggest series is he asked, so you need to be careful. Okay, so we've got to look after him. We've had two surprises already, but remind me who your favourite player was.

My favourite player is your Savoy, Jasewell. It is. Okay, well, guess what? We have an exciting opportunity for you. Come this way, and I'll give you the microphone. All right, take a stop here, and here's your mic. Ooh. Hello.

Hello, Ravi. How are you? I'm great, face. I'm Yeshashvi. Nice to meet you. Lovely to meet you too. Well done on your 87 in the first inning. And I thought you played nicely for that 28 in the second.

Thank you very much. That's very kind. Thank you so much. And I was really excited to meet you since I know that you have been a big fan of cricket. And actually, I don't know why I'm nervous to meet you. I'm so excited to meet you as well. What do you plan for today with runs? How many do you think you need?

We need a lot of runs, of course. We will just, we will try our best, I feel. And there is, I have a gift for you, my bat. I would like you to keep it and just have as my memory. And it's amazing to see you and meet you. It's very lovely, like, to be here with you. Thanks so much. Yeah, I can't wait to have your bat because you're brilliant.

cricketer, yeah, yeah, do you know when you're going to declare about tea or do you not get involved in these kind of things? No, no, no, I don't know about that. I wish I could know, but yeah, I don't know, sorry. You just concentrate on your batting basically and fielding. Yeah, I think more often, yeah. You're looking forward to it? Do you think it's going to be good conditions to bat today or? I think it's pretty good condition to bat, of course, there's a lot of run in the wicket. Ben, did you know? It might on the last day, I feel.

Yeah, I mean, that would be good because you have got two spinners in Jadaja and obviously and obviously Washington two brilliant spinners. Oh my God, you have so many information, huh?

You're really into cricket. Yeah, I love cricket, I watch as much as I can. I love watching you, but... Lovely. Yeah, I loved you double centuries that you've got. Thank you so much Thank you so much

They were brilliant You can On your day You can score big Tons and double centuries Oh my God Thank you I always try

I always try my best I think you're the future of Indian cricket Thank you very much Thank you Nice to meet you Nice to meet you This is for you

Oh thank you All right This pat is amazing right On it it says Believe Become So that's amazing, isn't it? Clearly you have to believe as a sportsperson

and he's also put at the back Best Wishes to Ravi with love and then he's signed it for you. So how amazing is that? I know that's amazing. I'm going to use that back loads because if you're superstitious and you could say

it's got good luck of with Jay-Swell. You've got to hold it because it's actually quite heavy to have a feel because you might have to grow into it. You feel it? So how old are you 12 now? I'll hold your stick for something. There you go. So what do you think?

I think by the time you're like 16, That'll be good for you, but you're going to obviously be using it before then. Now, we have one final surprise. So I'm going to give the bat to Dad. Okay, give me your hand. Let's go this way. Right, follow me. Now, final surprise.

You've been so good at asking questions. We want to see if you can do it for us. So we're going to get you to interview a player. Do you want to know what player it is? Yes, please. So you're going to get a chance to interview Jamie Smith. the England batter, okay? So he's going to finish up with the BBC

and then you're going to take over and do what we do. So when we're broadcasting, we do like an introduction sometimes. So you can say, hello, I'm Ravi. Today I'm going to be interviewing you and then give him a nice sort of intro and go straight into it. So I think you've got this. Hello, my name is Ravi. And today I'm going to interview Jamie Smith.

First of all, Jamie, thanks so much for your time. How were the conditions yesterday? I think they're, you know, easygoing. I'd say that when you've scored some runs. It's always nice to say the wicket, you know, did quite a lot, but it wasn't quite the case. I think we've seen with two new balls that's been the hardest it's been, and once the sort of ball gets a bit softer, it becomes easier.

Yeah, 100%. How is it batting with Harry Brooke? Yeah, it's great. Obviously, I've spent a bit of time with him now over the past year. I think we feed off each other quite nicely in our style of play. We're both quite positive players. we don't speak too much in the middle. I think that helps. We sort of both get in our own little bubble and we can just go and play aggressively. How does it feel shepherding the tail? Is it a hard

thing to do or do you find it naturally? I think naturally is sort of way I play my game quite aggressively. It suits my game quite nicely. Obviously on this occasion it didn't quite work out too well. We had a few ducks at the end of the innings that sort of stemmed that flow and a little bit of momentum I guess but it doesn't always work out that way but it was nice to get a few away. What do you feel like you can chase? I think we're going to have to try and chase anything. I think that's the key to this side. I think we back ourselves to, you know, chase things. We've seen it's quite a nice wicket if we can sort of stem that flow of the new ball and get through that sort of period and the ball gets a bit softer, gets easier. So I think the main

thing for us this morning is to put them under a bit of pressure, take a few wickets and not wait for a declaration, sort of try and enforce a way that we can chase less. Is there ever a problem, point where you have to think, right, we realistically can't win now. We have to start trying to draw the game. I don't think that conversation will be had just yet. Certainly in the dressing we're in now, it's all quite positive of how we can go and win the game. That's the sort of team we are always looking to be positive. And I think that's the same in this situation. We can't sort of just wait for a declaration from them. They'll put on a big score. So we've got to go out and try and take wickets with this slightly newer ball that we have the opportunity now. Some cloud cover

hopefully that stays in and we can get some wickets early. So how is like the dressing room, how good is it being in the dressing room? Because like being with someone like Ben Stokes who understands if you have like a couple of off days, like the shots that you've been playing. So kind of does it release all the pressure kind of? Yeah, absolutely. As you said, we've got two fantastic leaders in Brendan and Stokesy. take that little bit of added pressure off.

I think everyone knows that when you're playing international cricket, there's always that level of expectation, but pressure that comes with it. So to have a backing of a dressing room, to go out and play the way you want to play, you know, irrespective results. I think we know that batting can be quite tough at times. You only get one opportunity sometimes. So to go out and play the brand that you want to play

and knowing that you can go out and not have them muddled thoughts that you've maybe had in the past about previous dismissals, knowing that if it doesn't come off, you're not going to get a slap on the wrist and you can come again the next day and try and be positive again. Thanks so much for coming, Jamie, and good luck today. Thank you, mate.

What done, Ravi. Thanks. I think Ravi will soon be coming for our jobs in the TMS commentary box. What a pleasure it was to host him and get him to ask the tough questions to some of cricket's biggest names. Well, that's it for this episode of the TMS podcast. Make sure you're subscribed so you never miss an episode.

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