The 40k Lorecast - Episode 34 - Deep dive into the Gods of Chaos pt 1 - Khorne & Tzeentch

Episode Date: May 13, 2024

On Today's episode we take our first of two deep dives into the ruinous powers. Our focus is on Khorne and Tzeentch. Who they are, what they represent, and their defining traits. From there we dive into their daemonic followers and a couple of their more famous units. Lastly we talk about how the Imperium (the inquisition primarily) feel about each god and the level of threat they pose to the Imperium itself.PatreonMerchandiseDiscord Link:Our WebsiteRetro RecallOur Sponsors:* Check out BetterHelp: https://www.betterhelp.com* Check out Pebl: https://hellopebl.com* Check out Pebl: https://hipebl.ai* Check out Shopify: https://shopify.com/loreAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Welcome to the 40K lore cast. Welcome to the 40K lore cast with me, John Barsati and Brad Chester. This guy. On today's episode, we're discussing the value of blood for the blood god and the powers of magic and deception. Yep, double episode on two of the four chaos gods. Before we begin, what? Are we going to actually promote ourselves? Yeah, please like and subscribe to the podcast. I feel like KR is here right now.

Exactly. For those of you who are, one thing, we don't mention it enough, by the way, Brad does 40K coaching for any of you who are actually looking for someone to teach them how to be better at 40K, how to play 40K, both from a beginning level, all the way up to an advanced level. To be better about the psychology and the betterment of the game also. He's actually honestly a very, very good coach, Brad, as much as I want a shit talk game at this moment in time. And I really, really want to. I have to admit, Brad's actually an exceptional player who sees the game in ways that I don't.

And it can be really eye-opening. I have I have taken, I've played a game with Brad. We've made a small list change and my list has gotten light years better. So he's available for that. But also please join our Discord. There's great conversations there about lore, books. We also, you'll see us. We're in there constantly.

It's a great place to give us feedback on episodes and request future episodes. That's actually what this one came from. We had a bunch of people who reached out to us and said, hey, you guys haven't really covered the chaos gods in depth to which I went, oops, and now we're going to. And we love feedback for, again, future episodes, but also anything that we can improve, anything that you think that you'd like to see us cover, any, all of the above. Exactly.

We're working on the audio. Yeah, we're working on everything. One of the biggest things is we've been adding channels too in the Discord. That's one of the things I'm proud about is the Discord is the Discord is grown so that we've added channels per your request. Yeah. And I'd like to see more, more just more Discord in our Discord. Good job. All right.

on that horrible, horrible. It wasn't even a pun. Topic at hand. So, as we discussed last time, there are four chaos gods. And so we're going to do two, two-part episodes. And we decided to do it in a way where we're going to have it so the gods who hate each other the least. So today we're doing corn and zinch. We're just going to do straight corn, and then we're going to jump into zinch.

So I'm not really going to bounce around a lot here. So if I'm interested in one of them, fast forward halfway through or skip the back half, one of the two. So corn is the original. he's the first chaos god who was ever who was born out of the warp i think he's the most base of the gods so he's the almost always not always but almost always the most powerful the gods in the 40k realm because in the dark his in the dark future of 40k there is only war and that's why because corn is the god of war the god of murder the god of blood the blood for the blood god and one of the biggest things about corn is he also the most base. So he came around first. So he the most base of impulse

is yeah. And an important detail here is like, you know, murder, violence. These will actually, depending on their cause may actually feed Zinich, Slanesh, and even Nergel in some cases, but not as much as corn. That's one thing to understand about the chaos gods. No action is ever fully singular. Correct. And it's benefit. But, either the motion behind it or in some cases as the cultists and whatnot, the declaration behind it will then promote it more or less within different gods. So it's just the thing when we talk about you'll say, well, yeah, like, you know, if you're a warlord and you're like conquering someone else and then burning the libraries to the ground, you know, where's Zincher, Slanesh fall into this?

It's like, yeah, they can or a warlord could conquer a village and like, you know, and just, like, you know, slaughter all the innocents. corn like the first part Sleynch like the second part. It's okay to have both. Yeah, so corn is the oldest like Brad said, he's the most base. He was the first one to come to full consciousness and the warp. It was

during the dark ages of mankind as we've covered last time. Yeah, depending on what you say on that. I think it was by a long shot that corn came online. Yeah. For, I guess, I mean, let me back that up. He's the first for humanity to come online. For

sure. Yeah, it's just the problem is it's really not clear. Like when they talk about, I know, but like, the thing is, he's just the easiest of, if you have three guys, if you have the four horsemen running, yeah,

you're right. I'm just saying, like, that's, that's, I disagree with this, this writing. I didn't,

I'm just, I'm giving you guys the facts of what was written. But the thing is, but to me, the most basic is plague and decay. Yeah.

Because it's literally how a mass extinction works. And we've had a fine. You're talking about sickness. I'm talking about getting a stick and hitting somebody. Yeah. Guess what you.

one happened first. I think the stick. No, it was very much so. The bacteria. I saw you were sick and I grabbed a stick and I hit you. Fair enough. Yeah. Bacteria predates multicellular organisms by a wee bit of time just so you know. But I digress. So corn, though, is the first one. And it is to Brad's point. The idea from the GW storyline is it's like a primitive, it's another primitive with a rock and corn is pleased. You know, the first civilization to come in to come up, not through. education or sanitation, but by just conquering their foes, corn. He loves this stuff. And the thing is, is you need for Slanesh, for Zinch.

You need civilization. You need a society. True. To further their aims, you don't need any of that for corn. That's true, because if you look at, like, you know, the way chimpanzees will go to war with each other, that's something that corn would support. This is awesome. But I'll make that chimpanzee into a rube.

You got a stick in a rock? Yeah. Corn. Exactly. So that is, in theory, would make a lot of sense, except for the fact that G.W. wrote corn coming into existence during the dark ages. So let's go into the powers of corn. So corn and actually, I think, Nergel are the simplest of the gods to please.

Mame, burn, kill. That is what, that is what corn puts. Well, we have to go to corn because corn isn't just the god of victory. Corn is the god of battle, conquest, you know, everything. Corn doesn't care if you win. Corn just wants battle for battle. Two gladiators fighting in a pit, corn loves it.

He doesn't even have a favorite. He may change sides during the fight. I like that move. This is now my champion. He actually is powering them each up. He's like he seemed a little bit more brave than you did. So now I'm, I mean, he's now my champion.

But I was your champion, not anymore. Not anymore. And so every single drop of blood that spills in, now we have to be, I want to be careful in violence feeds corn. The reason to say in violence is corn does not like needless slaughter. A war band that runs through a village of like women and children kills them all. That's Slemash.

Corn may actually, corn in theory, might actually take away. Yeah, he would punish me. He would take away your treatments. It's also sacrifices that don't have a purpose or don't have any, don't have anything bravado behind them. Yeah. There is a motion. Like blood for the blood god is not simply blood. It is, I was about to make India Head Jones and Temple of Doom reference, but I, that's just, we're going to lose everybody if we go that far back.

But Corn's whole persona is about worthy battle, worthy slaughter, worthy blood. Even if you're cutting your own head off to please corn, it is because I'm trying to raise a bloodthirster to create more war. He's not just self-mutilation for the sake of, I don't know, unfortunately. Just like of Slanesh? There you go. He goes on gath. So as a result of this, corn actually might be one of the most insidious. By accident.

Yeah. Him and Nergel. Again, I would compare them. Actually, no, no, it's corn. It's not Nergles. Nurgle, you have to reach out to Nurgle. So it is corn. He's not insidious.

Corn doesn't really require a reach out for him or you. Yeah. You just, you doing you makes corn happy. You trying to be a conquering lord. You're trying to be better at battle. You're trying to win the fight and the, arena, whatever it is. Yeah, and that's, wow, that's a great point.

Because I was thinking about that. Like, the thing about corn is, if I'm a warrior fighting, I don't even, I may not even know corn exists. Corn may not even be speaking into my ear or if he is, I don't hear it. But me doing things, corn would actually still imbue me with power. Because you just have to have the want to be better, the want to win, the want to conquer, the want to spill the most blood in this battle. Exactly.

Exactly. All of those things. That's all corn cares about. So corn is an interest in God because he's actually providing boons to people who don't want them from him or know he exists. And he does not care. He is just. And by the way, we're going to use the word he a lot. It's obviously these creatures have no gender.

Just to point that out. Like it's, duh. But anyway, like, duh. Like, duh. But, because, like, you'll hear, like, I, I refer to Slenash as a she a lot, but some people, but it's actually technically he, who cares. Whatever. Exactly. Who cares?

But anyway. So, I mean, you can imagine some of these scenarios where corn gets involved under high warband, you know, fighting through pit fighters who are like, you know, fighting for anti-tains to the ability or help a squad of Katachan jungle fighters. They're just, they're fighting tyrantids with chains swords. corn sees this and imbues them with more power. The Tao? No. Corn does not like ranged combat. He doesn't.

I'm just looking over the notes and I just saw all of the examples. And then of course, John went, tau, nah, screw that. Maybe the crout. He might like the crout because they at least will hit something. But corn does not like ranged combat. If you've ever played into. Any corn army, the shooting phase is really quick. Real quick. Yeah, it's like, and yeah, I'm going to charge now.

So what about the blood angels? I mean, again, corn worshippers. The fun one, one of my favorite concepts would be a gray night squad fighting Zinzer, Slanesh. I think the agents will protect you. They just might. But again, but corn wants to help them. And not because he wants to corrupt. The amount corn is corn is not.

He just wants to put down Slanesh. Yeah, he doesn't want to corrupt. A lot of the other gods. want to corrupt. Corn just wants more and more champion. This is why like corn and Nergel a lot, because their endgame is less selfish and more just,

I have a purpose in this universe, and I want more of that purpose. And the thing, they're more base and the thing. It's easy on that. They're also more true. No, the thing about corn is people make deals with corn

and that they very much so do, but a lot of corn's influence is unknown. You just feel, stronger. You feel more emboldened. And it's because you are. Yeah, you are. But you also just win more sometimes and you don't know why. You're just stronger. People think you're just

luckier. Because your blows land true more often. Your opponent's blows sometimes fall away. You know what I mean? They just slightly miss you. Remember the time that you didn't get the, you almost got a killing blow on you? Yep. And you just ducked at the last second or they hit a tree right next to your head.

One thing that we want to talk about with each chaos God is just a really quick one is numbers and colors. So Corn's number is eight. These don't matter except when you play the game. Whoa, whoa, whoa. They don't. It never comes up. Slow your role, John. Corn eight.

Nergel 7, Sunnash 6, Zinch 9. These are a real thing. Don't you sell? They have no purpose. They 100% have a purpose. Really? Who are the Eighth Legion? don't need the Eighth Legion.

It was the Knight Lords. I just know that... I just know that the number of corn is eight, and it is a sacred number. You do multiply those off of it if you want to. Okay, fine. In the Horace heresy, the Eighth Legion were the Night Lords.

The 16th Legion were the Lunables. You know, this is why you spew such heresy, John. It was... I don't understand why they do it. Is this random thing? We're like, oh, corn has a love of the number eight. Oh, so World Eaters were the Eighth Legion? No.

It doesn't matter the Legion. It matters the number of corn, my friend. Yeah. And also, why does it have to be like... Take your eight zerkers. Why do they have to be two dice? Why can't I just have it on one dice? Like, it's two.

Also throwing that one out there. All right. Colors-wise, corn has two main colors. Blood red. Brass. And brass. And the reason it's brass is for those... Brass is a very old, like,

metal from... If you know what's something like humanity, before we really worked with gold and whatnot, you saw a lot of brass. And so brass and red, first of all, they look awesome together. It's a really great color scheme.

But the brass is meant to be this almost dirty metal. It's hard. You can actually kill with it. Blood metal. Yeah, it's a blood metal. You can do a lot more with it. So that's why it's brass.

And his demons come down with it. That is their armor. Yeah. Their armor is a brass. It's brass. And you've also got like, they also see some yellows, some silvers.

If I'm, actually, I'm much more partial to Nergel and from a painting scheme, but I will say people who paint corn arm as well, who they are beautiful. They just pop. Even though like the colors look, you see for a distance, like it's just red and brass. Yeah, but it looks good. Yeah. Put some white highlights on that. It looks sweet. As we talked about in the last cast, the warp at this stage has taken form.

And so there's actually lands within the warp. corn has a region Zincheza region Slanesh and for everybody we said this last time and I want to throw this up there for everybody

that will yell at me if I don't the warp is still a twisting untamed landscape but that landscape has a four part

topography for the most part there's a map if you want to say what corn's map looks like did you see Lord of the Rings

because GW didn't even try on this one Yeah, it's Mordor. It's not even close. It's just straight up Mordor. Yeah, and when I say if he's all Lord of the Rings, I'm going to get Meter. It you read Lord of the Rings.

It's identical to Mordor. It is. No, it just is. I mean, he's affected. He also, to be fair, corn looks like Saurad. Yeah. This is a dead rip. And it's fine.

You're dead ripping the greatest sci-fi series in history. I mean, it's not even close. I mean, if you're going to, so again, if you're going to, It'd be more embarrassing they'd ripped off like Battlefield Earth. That's going to hurt my soul on that one. Oh, that movie was bad. So was he. I mean.

It's like just like the movie was bad. The human being was worse. So Corn's realm is a realm of fire and blood. So which doesn't really mean anything. It just means it's a giant wasteland that has rivers that run through it that are apparently. It's more door. Yeah. Well, it's surrounded by.

I do love it. surrounded by volcanoes that are always erupting, also has Mount Doom. And it's also got rivers of lava. Yeah, rivers of lava and rivers of blood. I refer to it as magma because I want... Liquid hot. Magma, because I wanted to put some magma in here. The volcanoes are also...

So the volcanoes rimmed the outer edge of this land. And they're not even like tapered, like the volcanoes we have in the earth. They're just pointy scrags that if you try to climb up, you'd fall down and die. But also they'd erupt on you and you die. on you and you die. Yeah, and they're also always erupting. So it's not really an overly enticing place. Also, you'll get killed if you try to end it. Well, and that's where it gets better. So corn's, again, corn is the god of battle. He's the god of conflict. So obviously, his realm is built for conflict and battle. And you know, his realm doesn't have a lot of cover. No. It's just wide open planes that are.

He doesn't have it. It's fortified. You have to make a- Well, you get to the fortuitary, but that's all that. You go from the volcanoes on the end, on the edge. If you get past the volcanoes, you've got flat planes of fire, magma, and blood with beasts of corn running all around them, fighting each other unless a common foe arrives, in which case. I think that what you meant to say was an intoxicating aura. Sure. They're just. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, good to hear, Brad.

Yeah, although I will laugh at it. at this. I did point this out from playing 40K. You know who likes wide open battlefields a lot? Well, the shooting armies. The shooting armies, not the melee armies. It's like, if your entire thing is we like doing glorious combat, you should have cover. Yeah, it's a bummer when the horrors shoot you. Yeah, it's like, it's like, a lot.

Yeah, like, I'll give Tal this piece of credit. If there's no cover, Tao are incredible. Tau will win the engagement in Cornswown. Oh, yeah, they do great. but in the center of it there's a couple little bits one is a lake of blood and fire which is just a giant lake of demons riding demon dragons yeah but it's and it's whoa whoa you're not doing this justice let's do this yeah so one it looks if someone could do a panorama of this on a displayboard it would be bonkersville everything empties into this giant lake of bubbling blood slash magma.

It looks like lava, but it's actually blood. Blood. Yes. It's like liquid blood, magma, whatever. Blood's a liquid. But it's also, yeah, well, it's a plastic. It's like liquid blood. Okay. I'm following. I'm tracking. But all I'm saying is things get reborn from here. Like you have all of these awesome creatures. All I'm saying is a bloodthirster jumping on top of a giant dragon.

coming out of a lake of magna blood leaves into something else and kills them and after they kill it the thing falls in the lake of blood is then resurrected by corn comes back out of lake of blood and it's an endless battle on top of this lake of blood of flying dragons

and bloodthirsts. This thing literally says see two in a row am I literally at least but this thing also says Valhalla suck it. This is where you this is the real deal. Have any space walls been to Corn's player. Oh, they would never come back.

Oh, he would just be like, well, so we're staying. This is so much better. We're staying, right, guys? Like, look, we have to get back to the Imperium. Prospero blows. This is amazing. Yeah, this place rocks. Yeah, this is my favorite place. This is endless epic boss combats. Yeah, so I just jumped off of a dragon to kill another dragon and then jumped to another dragon to hit, like, I literally.

You forgot. A bloodthirsty was riding the dragon. I'm never going home. Yeah. This is my, I live here. now. This place rules. Yeah. As far as for combat, Corrin's realm, pretty primo. Oh, my God. But off of this, just off the center of the lake of blood is the brass citadel, which is where corn lives.

We have to go into the description of this, because depending on what you read, it either has an infinite sea of skulls that you can never cross, or it has panoramic view that looks cool of skulls. A lot of skulls. It's got a lot of skulls. And I view it as a very large mound of skulls.

Which then leads to the brass walls. Yep. Which are a kilometer high brass wall that stands, it sticks up out of the sea of skulls. And then what do you find inside there? More skulls. Because he corns sitting on top of them. Because corn is sitting on a throne.

Of skulls. Well, it's a throne of brass. Brass, sorry. on top of a endless pile of skulls. Blood for the blood gods are. It's, say the, come on now, say the thine. Blood for the blood god. Skull for the skull thrown.

Because what happens is as a follower of corn in the mortal realm, when I kill something, I can dedicate its death to corn. And when I do so, its skull will appear. In corn's layer. In corn's layer. Which is why it's an infinite. It's always growing. I guess it's getting taller.

I don't care how these physics work. It's not a real place. That's why the warp exists, because things can, the laws of physics do not apply to the imiterium. Thank you very much. Exactly. So in the center of all this, though, is corn. And corn is actually one of the better described gods of chaos.

Zinche, obviously, is the least. Corn's actually one of the more terrifying. Because you don't change form. That's why. You know, because also there's the threat of corn. just showing up in the material world if enough shit went down. Yeah. Like he's already has a, this is my set form.

I will, if enough things went in my way, I'll just be there. I'll just appear. And then what? Yeah, exactly. What? Feel free to bring whoever you want or whatever you want. So corn is described as this impossibly large creature with overlapping. plight mail made of brass and a face of pure rage.

Also, as a saurong. One of the bigger things about this is if you come into the presence of corn, you are immediately no matter what enveloped by his rage. So you now feel that way. Yeah, all the gods have that. All the gods, Nergo's ones a little bit fun. We'll get there next episode. But it's a little bit fun.

But all the gods, if you're in their presence, their most, you know, premier feature hits you like a, a ton of bricks. You can't resist. That's just what happens. When they're in, when, not even just the God itself,

but when the gods in his realm. Some of our listeners have been playing the game for a lot longer. You are correct. Corn used to be a beast man. That's actually in the original, he was viewed as kind of having horns and a head. If you don't know what Beast Man is, now there's age of Sigma anymore.

Too soon? Oh, that's hurtful. Too soon? That's hurtful, bro. Too soon. Wow. No, that's, that's not cool. No, it was not cool in evaluating a freaking army.

I mean, also true. That was just brutal. Old worlds. Yeah, I think you'll play old worlds, I guess. So, yeah, but he's had a few different, obviously. He's effectively the ball rock. Yeah, well, he's the ballrog. He's soron.

It moves around depending on the addition you're playing. True story. Or even the sort of games you're playing. Like, he's got different. In all of them, he's still, yeah. He's covered. He's Conan-esque. covered in something.

You know what I realized we didn't mention and we probably should? The gods of chaos overlap. Warhammer Fantasy, which is gone and now is back

and Age of Sigma. It is the same models. It is the same gods. So I just realized we never covered that in the last episode and I was like editing this in. So I'm doing it now.

There you all go. So if you play and a side note, like some of the Sigma models are way better than some of the 40K models. Some. Jesus Christ. But if you do play it, just understand that it's the exact same corn. So a lot of times if you go to buy Chaos Demon kits, you'll order them and it'll show up and

it'll say Aja Sigma on it. That's still a 40K kit because it's the same world. Or if you play an old world, the bases are different. Still a GW model, though. Yeah. But it's literally, it's the same story. It's the same God. The corn of Sigma or the corn of fantasy is the same as the corn of 40K.

which makes that timeline really, really fun. So GW did it before Marvel did, guys. True story. We'll be right back after a quick break. In my professional life, one thing I know well is how challenging, managing a global team can be. Just the act of creating one has been an extreme challenge over the years. Because one thing you learn quickly is a difficulty of hiring global talent and how unclear those costs can be. It looks simple at first, but then the fees are to start to.

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That's high p-e-b-l.a-I for a free estimate. So next to, corn does have a kind of, is a super sword, is what I would call it. It's a giant two-handed sword known as the warbringer, the wo-bringer. the end of all things. Normally I wouldn't give a crap about this, but apparently this sword is so powerful that he actually could cut a hole in the immaterial to the material in the reality.

That's my thing is this to be that he, for me, he's the most terrifying in time boss because of the fact that he already has the ability to fracture reality. Yes. And he, the question is, does he know it? That one, I don't.

Yeah, that becomes one of the questions. So followers of corn, I think we all kind of know world eaters. Some are easy, though, because of the fact that we already talked about, let's just do these in order. First off, you have trade allegiance, girl leaders, you're always going to have in a galaxy that is at war, carry the one, 100% of the time. Yeah. You're going to get followers of the guy that can make you back. better at battle when all you do is fight battles. Period.

It's pretty simple. So he's got his main retune outside of his demons are, of course, the world eaters who have given their souls over him via Angron. But he also has war bands. And war bands are a little bit different. I think it said, I want to draw this distinction early. If you've given your soul to corn and corn owns you, he imbues you with different powers. So a, my god damn, a berserker.

So berserkers are imbued with the power of corn. And the thing is, with war bands, you can have after the fracturing of the world eaters, after Karn effectively fractured the world eaters, you have zirkers and new zirkers because people do put themselves body and soul to corn and you get new berserkers. But you also get just regular chaos space marines, because this is what Aramon was in. Aramon was not with the world eaters when they found him. He was with just a war band of corn. So they were like,

they weren't imbued with corn there, but they were fans. Well, they were followers that were imbued by corn. Because again, if all you do is fight, which a lot of the time is what's going on, especially if you're a space marine on either side,

loyalist or chaos, you're looking for an advantage, especially if you're living, I don't know, in the eye of tears. slash the rift. It's not a great spot. Yeah, you might have to fisticuffs occasionally.

Every now and then, you might have to fight just throwing it out there. Yeah. So I'm probably going to look for an advantage, and that's how you get war bands of corn. And the thing is, weirdly enough, those make a lot of sense. Yeah. They actually probably make the most sense of all of them. Yeah. The people that make actually good sense again are cultists of corn.

Yeah. Most of these. I refer to them as the least. subtle of all the cultists. Like, you know when there's a corn cultists. Yeah, when you show up and you see jackals. Yeah. It's like what?

And the thing is, these are just bands of people trying to murder somebody else. And again, I'm looking for a couple PDs to make it happen. And I'll tell you what, hive cities and then feudal worlds. These guys do great there. I don't even understand how the hive cities aren't 50% corn. Yeah. In the first place. Or the undercity.

Yeah, the undercity is pure corn at this point. It's just battle. It's a royal rumble every day, all day. Yeah. And what happens as we said before, what corn loves to do is he loves a champion. So if you're in the under city of a hive and you and your three buddies go start raiding and conquering land, corn may just reach out to you. But at the same time, if you and your three buddies,

are looking to get a leg up, there also might be some weird priest around the corner who also will say, well, I can help make a deal with you, and I can help you get a hold of these and then we can grow. So cultists and corn, yeah, there's a lot of them guys. Also, corn...

Until the inquisition shows up. Yeah, also the fact that corn isn't super worried about whether or not you die in your attack. So if you go down in a glorious pile of gunshots into your face, and we're going to get to the

with Zinch, but like Zinch has a plan. He's got deception. Corn is zero plan. So if you, if the Inquisition captures devotees of corn, what are they going to tell him? That we were going to punch a guy in the head? It's blood for the blood gods,

skulls of the skulls through him. What? Well, what's the grand scheme here? We're trying to unravel this great mystery. I told you I was going to punch that guy in the head. Yeah, I have a chainsword and I was going to hit that guy of the chainsword. Right. The guy with a chainsword that I'm standing across from him,

I was going to hit him with my chains sword. Yeah, this seemed fun. Like, I don't understand what they get to where we're going at. The next one I'm going to dive and do is kind of the key demons of corn. So all the gods of chaos, corn has specific demons that he manifests. And his demons are the coolest. They do look the best. Yeah, I was thinking through.

So we'll start with the ones that you see the most, blood letters. This is the battle line version of them. This is also the most plentiful. This is what you get when you have a battle that includes, the forces of corn 100%. You're going to get bloodletters. In the 40K game today, you won't see blooders, but in the lore, you will always see fun.

Well, you did until 10th edition. They just made them pointless. But bipedal creature, all red, big teeth, giant brass horns, carrying a makeshift sword. Swords and or an axe. They used to have both. Yeah, now it's all just a pointy thing. And the thing is that this is the soldier.

This is the footline soldier. and they haven't literally. There we go. Infinite amount. And I'm using it correctly on this one. Yeah. There's a nonstop amount of energy that corn can pull from

to make more and more blood letters. But there is a level up from a blood letter and that's called a blood crusher. These are my favorites. Yeah. Okay. So you know what? I didn't talk about juggernauts.

Let's just do juggernauts real quick. So a juggernaut is a demon bull. That has flames coming from its nostrils. It is so cool. It's also made of metal. Yeah, for some reason. It's made of brass. Yeah, it's a demon engine.

And a blood letter will ride it. And that's called a blood crush. Yeah. And that's why it's freaking awesome. They're so cool. Aesthetically amazing. It looks awesome. Rules.

Rules have been okay for a long time. Yeah. They've always been okay. I also own the metal ones, which if I got mad at my opponent, I get thrown at them, I'm not pretty sure. It would leave a bruise. It would be, it would be a crime. Those are heavy.

Yeah, it would definitely. leave a bruise. From there, we're moving to the greater demons, and there's really just one, because everyone just has one greater demon. It's a bloodthirster. I mean, there's some serious mojo with that, because we've had some great, great named bloodthusters. We have. Big Kay that fought sanguineous multiple times, but you've had some great stories because the bloodthusters are rage incarnate. They are the direct will of corn. These, are rage in his layer made manifest. It's a

giant demon with wings that carries a whip and an axe or a sword. Depends. The thing is, is that... I would model it. Never gun. Yeah. These are... Exactly. And the thing is, is that these are just... They can make the entire battle

different for both sides. We'll talk about Scarbrand. Scarbrand's aura is so big that he used to affect everyone on the table. So, he's amazing. Come on that. Yeah. So the purpose of a greater demon

is to lead the forces for corn in the materium. Because as Brad said, corn in theory could make it into the materium, but he'd have to manifest himself with all of his power. So instead of doing that, what the gods of chaos do is they manifest their greater demons into there. And when you manifest

a bloodthirster, it is not a great day for a lot of people. No. Because this is, it is not only rage incarnate, It is battle incarnate. They are incredible in their strength, their speed, their everything. They can slay entire legions if they need to. And we'll even talk about one now.

So a good example is Cabanda. So for those who were there for a horse heresy, Cabanda or Bandha, one of them, was the demon who exposed the blood, the bloodthirst and the blood angels and almost killed Sanguineas. He did do the look at Elvis before he did it. Yeah, he did. I mean, later, the second meeting didn't go great for Cabanda. Didn't go.

Yeah. Didn't go well. I mean, sometimes you break your back, sometimes you know. Yeah, Sanguania definitely took out round two. But Cabanda, it's a good story to tie of talk about how powerful Calbanda is because he took out almost the entire Blood Angel Legion and their prime work single-handedly. Sorry, Blood Angels, but he also. single-handedly turn the tide

and the devastation of ball. Yeah, it's actually one of my favorite stories about him is, and we haven't covered this yet, but when the tyrantids come into the galaxy, they hit ball, which is the home planet for the blood angels. And the tyranids are not having a tough battle here from being perfectly honest. They're getting Rickroll.

Yeah, the tyrant's just running through the blood angels. Cabanda sees this, and he had claimed that he would be the one to end the blood angels. It's such a crazy story. He shows up to start killing Ternads because he said no one gets to kill blood angels, but me. But me. So he and a few million blood letters fight off the Tiranid invasion.

Which is, this is another thing that we have to talk about. He destroyed Hydefeet Levi. This is the big thing. By himself. This is the big deal of corn, though, because this is a battle that wasn't dedicated to corn either way. Nope. But battle was happening. How much battle?

enough battle that it made a demonic incursion possible because of all the fighting, all the bloodlet, all the, you know, the war that was going on. And then that demonic incursion created so much more bloodlet that it actually fed itself. I mean, this was, we haven't touched on them yet. I understand. But those who know dearinets, this was high feet, high fleet Leviathan. Which was the high feet. Which is the biggest high fleet got just wreck rolled. by cabanda and a bunch of bloodletters

saving the blood angels so that you could go kill them later. To get the overbine credit, whoopsie, I did not see a million demons. This was not planned. Another one that actually, I would say, if I'm looking at, if I ranked all the corn demons and my favorites, Scarbrand's my favorite.

And I just love the story of Scarbrams. We're talking about origins of Scarbram. Yeah. Zinch whispered. into the ear of Scarbran that Scarbran was powerful enough to take on corn. So Scarbran, who was a bloodthirster,

winged bloodthirster, as they all are, except for him now, came up and swung his mighty axe and hit corn in the foot and left a tiny mark. And corn was not, ain't trying to hear that sea. Yeah.

And picked Scarbran up and threw him for eight. Eight days. Eight days through the Imitarium. Which ripped off his wigs because he was mock nine through the warp. And then Scar Brad was unbelievably pissed that this happened and has been trying to show everybody how awesome he is ever since. Not even the showing people is awesome. He's just been so angry about it.

He's just angry and shows up. And he's just, he's effectively rampaging across the galaxy. He's a maniac. Looney Tunes Tasmanian Devil style. He just shows up places. I know what Scarbrand's rules are now, but Scarbrand's rules... Oh, they're terrible now. Yes, but Scarbrand Jews used to be he gave extra attacks to both...

Anybody in his presence. In his presence, didn't matter. Friends, foes. He also would attack friends. Yes. Anybody that was around him got caught up in his rage, which is awesome of a story. Oh, it was incredible. Because Scarbrand is effectively mentally broken.

And he's just, he's just, but being in his presence created rage in your inside of you. You could not stop it. It was just, you got caught up

in the whirlwind of his range. It was crazy. Yeah, Scarburn's awesome. Models really good, too. And it always has,

man. Corns got good models. Corn has really, really good models. I think of the demons. You can do amazing things with keepers and with,

what's a two-headed bird? Lord of change. Lord of change. They, well painted, those are incredible. but the line, those lines in general, I'm like, me, the corn line is perfect all the way through. It's 100%.

So good. Let's talk about corn and the Imperium because at its core, that's kind of what matters right now to us from a lore. The thing is, is that sorry Imperium lovers, the Imperium is keeping corn going. Yeah. War is the business and business is good. Well, in this, we talked about this before on the last cast a little bit. One of the things about corn is, if you're the Imperium and we'll do the Ragdan invasion, right? We're taking those before Horacee.

It's a good example. You've got this massive war or actually, hell, the Leviathan coming in. Anywhere, not town. God damn. Anywhere that the Imperium is fighting, corn is going to see it. And you're right. Maybe he's not able to infuse gray knights with his power. but he's a Katachan jungle fighter

I mean anyone knows the Katachans are even if they don't need even if they don't know it unless you're actually trained to fight against warp influence you will not even know that you're getting a boost to your power and I'm sorry if I'm a Katachin jungle fighter and I'm fighting off whatever

yeah a tyranted warrior who's twice my size and has twice the arms and I get a little lucky I seem to be a little faster. I seem to dodge just a little bit better. I'm not worrying about where the hell that came from. And Corne's not reaching out to him saying, hey, I took care of you. No.

I need to cut a toe off for me. Like, no one's just like, cool. Can you go do that again? Thanks for fighting. Thanks for fighting. There's more tyrannids over there. What do you say? Yeah.

The thing is, again, you don't have to go out and say, I worship corn. You just have to fight. Yeah. And so this creates kind of a challenge, obviously, for the Imperium and the Inquisition. Because the Inquisition obviously needs to stamp out all influence of chaos. That's impossible, though. So what do you do? Can't.

Well, it's more funny. What do you do when you have a frontline force that's winning? And it's like, well, do we want to go, we'll pretend it's guardsmen, not space marines, because they're the more expendable. But if we've got a front line of guardsman who's just really wrecking shop on some necrons, Do we nuke them? Yeah, do we nuke them because we realize that corn is favoring them? They're not worshipping corn, but he's favoring them.

This is, so this is why corn in some ways is the most insidious part of the Imperium's challenges. Because you can't do, because they're forever, the Imperium is forever at battle from legitimately everywhere. Yeah. All corn is against. So corn is effectively being fed from everywhere. And it's really hard. I mean, Sisters of battle.

I mean, I would argue some of the saints. They're juiced up on. Yeah, it was, I mean, you tell me, we'll do this on those guys.

Acts of faith, you know. Yeah, I'm not going to throw St. Celestine under the, under the bridge here. Who's powering those? You know what I mean?

Everybody was going to yell, it's the emperor, but also all that power's coming from the war. It just is. Is it the emperor, though? I mean, it's,

because again, he's not talking. It's all I'm saying. he's not out there saying yeah that was me guys he's not a real socialite yeah exactly the difference between the emperor powering up a saint of the the sororitus and corn doing it's going to look really similar yep and the thing is is that corns which is why he keeps usually waxing not a lot of waning yep because the galaxy is at war when you're the god of war and the galaxy is at war and the galaxies at war, then business is good.

It's a good gig. I hope that's enough coverage for corn for all of you guys. And that gives you a good grasp of where corn is. We'll now move on to the next part of this, which is in some ways the opposite. But there's actually a lot of similarities here. I think there's a lot of synergy that goes on with ancient corn. So this is one of the reasons why the brothers, they are, which they are, is ancient corn go together so much while all the ruinous powers are always fighting.

Zinche guides people into battle. Yeah. Which always fuels corn. So while there, none of the gods are going kumbaya and skipping through the forest together, corn and Zinch get along as much as powers. As much as they could. That's the best way to explain. I think, yeah, exactly.

Because Zinch creates scenarios for corn to benefit. He literally creates discord. He creates the seeds of conflict are put into play by Zinch in most of the places fighting's going on. He, Zinch is, Zinch is crazy insidious. Zinch is consistently making people fight. Zinch makes his own people fight quite a bit. Well, so the thing about Zinch, one of the things I was reading about it, which I like the way they broke it down, work. Zinche is engaging in plots that last millennia, but not just a single plot. He's also engaging

in millions of plots that all last millennia upon layer upon layer. To the point where it's actually impossible to tell not just what Zich's final goal is, but if Zich even has a final goal. And he's such a trickster about things because he's into deceiving misinformation, giving, making you find stuff, but also he doesn't do his own followers. where he has them on a series of quests just to screw with them. Yeah. And then just think why that guy could have been your greatest champion. You're like, yeah, it was kind of funny.

It's kind of funny. Let's see what happens. I just screwed him over at the end. So why not? I mean, Zinch, it's interesting. The differences between Zinch and the laughing and Segarak are not massive. Not massive. Yeah.

It's really is the elder gods. The laughing god, I'm sorry, elder guys, but the laughing god and Zinch are pretty close. Yeah. They're but they would be, I wouldn't be surprised if it's a, like, I wouldn't be surprised if they have a shared origin. Because as Zinch is supposed to be a very serious God of knowledge, deception, forbid knowledge. He sends people on clown quests a lot.

Yeah, I mean, and that's, it depends on what you're reading with that, because you're right, there was a period of time where I think Zinch was pretty heavily in that, oh, like, it's all forbidden knowledge, the dark arts, that's what Zinch was. And then over time, it's been this, like, almost trick. of like, yeah. Yeah, he just, he constantly sends you on nonsense, Phil. Because he tests, you, test, you, test you. And the worst part about it is, as many, as much of the time as he gives boons,

sometimes he gives you nothing. Yeah. You, I achieved 22 quests in a row. What was my final reward? This is an empty box. Deuce is. Also, there's a 400 space Marines outside that are going to kill you now. You're like, but I did everything you asked.

Yeah, I know. You shouldn't have done that. Yeah, it was stupid. I was dumb. I'm the god of deception. Why he makes him feel with me. You should have been smarter about that. See you later.

What makes Zinch really tricky, though, is Zinch is the only one who can actually both affect space and time. So sometimes he'll have a plot that will actually conclude before it began. Also the fact that Zinche sees forward and backward in time, but he also changes it when he looks at it. We also talk about every time you look at the future, you change the future, which is what Zinj is constantly doing. So he has 500,000 plots to achieve the same goal, possibly.

And that's the whole thing about Zich. No one can figure out what Zincch is going to do. Yeah, it's just sometimes it just looks like deception for the sake of deception. So let's dive into kind of the birth of Zich. We don't know that the only God whose birth is recorded is Slanesh, obviously. But GW has told us Zincch was the same. second to come into being, which I still think it should have been Nurgle, but whatever. But the big thing is, is we know how.

Once civilization came into being, we can not say that this was already Eldar, but whatever. When human civilization came into B, that's when you got people thirsting for knowledge, thirsting for power that came through knowledge, scheming. It feels like, like plague would have happened first, but whatever. But anyway, Zine, is actually in the early stages the most powerful of the chaos gods because zich is warp energy well he was at the beginning he was the flashiest yeah well he actually was he was the most powerful he was he was the first one because he's the god of knowledge who the all mean all these gods are awakening in

the warp zich was the first one to figure out how to use the warp so he actually was this massively powerful god it's also nice when your followers can again and throw lightning bolts out of their butt. You're going to get a lot of followers when you say, the corn guy goes, I'm a powerful warrior. I can show this to you. And the Zeech follower goes, I will just shoot lightning bolts out of you.

I'll just make you disintegrate. Yeah, it's pretty easy for me to show you the power of my God. I play a lot of D&D. It's a beholder. Like, I look, disintegration right. And you're done. They failed that test. Your character doesn't exist anymore.

She'd have better sense. Yeah. What's funny about this story, and I'm foreshadings I'm going to cover later. is the other gods, at this point, believe it was just Nergel and corn, had enough of Zinch and then actually came together to kill him. And they threw, they took Zinch and they threw him against a mountain and he just shattered into billions, millions of shards all around the galaxy.

But did he want to be shattered? Of course he did. Because he kind of came back more powerful. Yeah. And don't worry. Like, that story sounds like, hey, is there more to that story? Yeah, I'll get there in like 15 minutes. Just trust me, but I just want to get that.

So as it currently stands, though, Zinch is actually the fourth most most prevalent chaos god. And he might be one of the least powerful. However, despite him being the least prevalent in the 40K universe, he is by according to the Inquisition, the most feared. Oh, 100%. And we'll get to there in a minute too. But like Zimsh's powers are horrifying.

Luckily, no one really can use them. So let's go into what those powers are. He's the god of forbidden knowledge, deception, and magic. I don't know, which is I just think a trope. But anyway, he's really just the god of all knowledge. And he has endless knowledge. And my opinion, I think he just gets bored sometimes. Well, he's playing games in the games.

Yeah, he just like to see, like we'll use the rubric of Aramon. Oh, yeah. Yeah, true. So Aramon is trying to cast a spell. to release all of his brothers from... Rubric and Aramon, it's also the rubric again. Rubric of damnation. Yes, true.

Yeah, those are the same thing. Oopsies. What does Zinch do? He allows him to proceed. He actually helps him be successful when he's testing. This test is working great. No problem. Go ahead and cast your spell, Armand, what's going to happen?

Oh, that's what's going to happen. You're like, those were your guys. Yeah, I know. Yeah. You damned all of them to damnation. Why? Eh, it was. hilarious when he thought everything was working out.

Did you see Aramon's face? He basically is punked. Yeah. And he does that a lot. There isn't, there, there are arguments that actually the ability to use war powers may be a Zich thing. It may be that everything in the galaxy that can use the warp is a gift from Zich. That was, uh, that's a fan, that's fan fiction. That's a fan thing. But I like it. I like the idea that Zinch is so old.

It's also so ancient. They said that that's one of the reasons that the old ones could only do certain things because they didn't want. They knew that all of the ruinous powers could be what they are. And they were trying to not let that happen. Eldor did not. No, Eldar did not listen. As a result, though, every single spell that's cast in the entire galaxy, Zinch is aware of. Every time someone reaches into the warp and does something.

It's not even that he's aware of. knows the spell. Yeah. Well, but one thing is he feels it. So any psych or anywhere in the galaxy doing anything psychic, Zinche is instantly aware of it. It's not even just, it is important

to dispensual. In fact, he's aware of it before it happens. Yeah, he knows the spell, though. That's a big thing. Yeah, that's true. Because he knows every spell. Not every spell. Well, we're getting there. Because I really do love those two little fuckers. I thought that word.

So Zinche's knowledge, though, just to kind of put on a scale, the black library that the Eldar have held. It's the repository of all the most knowledge in the galaxy. That is effectively a child's bookshelf compared to what Zinich knows. He is, there is anything and everything that has ever happened or potentially will happen. Zinich is aware of. Or has a hand. Yeah. Colors and numbers.

Zich is nine. As we said on corn, these don't matter. They totally matter. They're useless. It never comes up. It only comes up because everything on the cast a spell and nine's a pain in the ass to roll and two dice, so it's not even a good one. Zich is the models.

I'm going to throw this out there. Cool models. Don't get me wrong at all. But just like we said last episode when we were talking about Terminator Armor versus what was in reality. Yeah. One of the biggest things is Zinche's minions change form. They don't respect reality of laws of physics.

Looking at horrors makes regular men lose their sanity. Yep. It is so hard to put that on the table. How do I model something? Yeah, that's true. I think with the exception of the Lord of Changes, Zinche's models... It's just hard because they're supposed to be changing and not It's the same thing when you're talking about Cthulu.

Like, they don't respect the laws of physics. Yeah, that's a good point. They are, they're shifting in and out of, because we'll get the Zinich and a second does the same way. Like, you're right. The tabletop doesn't do the lower credit. But how? You know, because you couldn't.

You're like, sorry, but we had to make three things in three dimensions. Yeah. I didn't have five or six other dimensions to model this in. So my bad. So it's good. Yeah, we're going to do it in the one you can all, and but you's only visible light. But it is the thing of that because that is one of my favorite things about Zich. And Zich's demons is they win fights a lot of times, not because they're the most powerful.

Zinch physically demons are a lot of times very weak comparatively. But when you break the minds of everyone you fight against before any shots are fired or any swords or swung, well, I'm probably going to win that one because the guy's in the corner shitting his pants. because he can't figure out why reality doesn't work. I'm probably going to win that fight. It's fair. We'll be right back after a quick break. One cool thing about Zinj is where, like, corn has this great land, which it's structured.

We have volcanoes. We've got rivers of blood. We've got all this stuff, a skull throne. Zinche's land is just confusing. That's the way they describe it. Well, it's ever changing. It's ever changing. There are the people who've been.

there describe it as everything has no edges. It's all like it's a dream. Trying to move through it, you know, one step could feel like impossible because somehow you forgot how to walk. That's his entire realm. Distances don't exist. His entire realm, most people who visit it, you know, they come back and they're just crazy and they all end up committing suicide or the inclusion helps them with that process. Yeah. Inquisition's like, oh, we'll just help you along. Yeah, because mostly because the one challenge is if you've been to Zinche's realm and come back to the materium, you probably know some stuff. The Inquisition doesn't want you to know. One of the big things is, Zinche is often truthful on the fact of, I will let you know the thing that you want to

know. However, your mortal brain can't comprehend the actual thing you want to know. So he goes, no problem. I'll show you it. And then you go, oh, my brain broke. Sorry. I'm now completely crazy. And that happens so much in the stories. Yeah. Zinch breaks the minds of more people than he ever kills. Well, because he's giving so much.

What he does is just dumps so much information and so much so you just can't comprehend it all. And so you're just driven mad. Yeah. I mean, it's so he, most of the stories of Zinch, people that are trying to either defeat Zinch. following Zinch his greatest champions

a lot of times he never smites them kills them defeats them he lets them have what they want and that thing that they want is often the thing that breaks their mind yeah that's tons of the stories

you're right it's kind of cool because the next bit I was going to here is the center of Zinj's realm is his great labyrinth because Zinch has no defenders If you were to walk into the realm of Zinch, you could walk all over the labyrinth. I mean, you might not.

You'll probably go crazy in the process, but it's designed to just be this, look, if you want to get here, you can try. Also, tons of people that have went through the labyrinth again, win in huge air quotes. No one's ever gotten through the labyrinth. That's the whole thing. It's plenty of people have thought. Yep, there we go. They've gotten through the labyrinth. Is this impossible?

And we say labyrinth. when we talk about lore in general, I'm talking like mythology, all those things, labyrinth is always used as this like trope of, it's an impossible maze. No one can ever get through, except for one hero who pulls it off. Not in this case.

No one gets through. And also Zich's Labyrinth isn't just the Minotaur walking through a walled things. Zinch will put you through everything. He'll make you replay every shitty event in your life and drive you mad. And the labyrinth also is moving. It's adjusting any success you have within Zinz's labyrinth is because Zinch wanted you to do it.

He's just waiting for the time that giving you failure is going to be the most painful. And that's when he's going to do it. True story. Zich is kind of a dick. Yeah, I was saying Zinc is terrible. Yeah. So followers of Zinch, equally important, they're kind of complicated because they're the most, they're the fewest, and they're also the most powerful.

But they're also the most at the same time. And what I'm going to say is, Zinj Kaiser-Sose's more people because a ton of people think they're doing stuff for somebody else, including the Imperium and or one of the other ruinous powers. But they're not. They're doing something. They're doing something because Zinch whispered into the ear and that person whispered into the year and this person whispered into the air and some,

followers of Slanesh are doing the thing that Slanesh told us to do and you're like, I mean, are you? Yeah. But that's how Zinich works, though. This is why the other gods hate Zich. Because it's often. He makes their followers do his bidding. Yep.

A lot also. Yeah. One area that makes Zinc really dangerous, though, is psychers. The thing about being a psycher, and we don't really talk about this enough and we probably should do some casts on it is the act of using. using your psychic powers is training, it's experience. You have to learn, you have to learn to do all these things. And we're talking, we talk about Eldar, right?

Eldar were at their core, at their core, at their prime. We're able to just use psychic powers to create anything from anywhere. But they always could. It's 60 million years of that. It's also part of their DNA. But mankind is not. is new to this. Also, using psychic powers, especially for humans as a whole, takes a tremendous, even done right,

taxes you, takes a tremendous, because you're like, hey, what's tired? My soul. How do you rest the soul up? I don't really know how to stretch out before I, I didn't want to pull a hammy on my soul. It's really hard to figure that out, especially if you don't have training. which a lot of Zinch cultists do not have anything. Zincha says, you've got powers. You should do stuff.

And he's like, what can I do? Anything you want. And then if you don't pause and go, is that going to have an adverse effect on me? You're like, oh, yeah, you're going to die for sure. But what makes Zinich so nasty is that Zich can go to a cyger and say to them, hey, you made a lightning bolt or you manifested some food or whatever it is. what if I show you how to really do it. So now we're talking,

and we're going to cover this in the future cast, an unregulated psycher. So dangerous. Now has, it's not because a psycher, it's a weird way to look at it. I look at it this way. Cycars aren't more or less powerful than other psychers.

It's their ability to pull power from the warp and use it. So that's what, which to me is a knowledge thing. So I think it would become. Well, one of the biggest things, though, John is, for me is you can have these untrained psychers do things that other psychers can't do because of the fact that they don't know any better in the fact that they're going to die after casting that spell.

So you get people throwing down these just gigantic lightning storm, store, whatever it is. But the person gets snuffed out after that because they get killed by, channeling that much and they get immediately murdered and Zinj doesn't care. I wanted you to cast that lightning storm that you just cast. You mean nothing to me. But what this creates is incredibly powerful psychers. Because it's just more my theory on this. It's like you look at some of the best psychers are the ones who can pull massive amounts

of energy but can kind of calm themselves as they use it. Why can't I think of the ultramarine psycher? Taguars. Tigris. Great example. Tiggy. Tiggie's just a man. But he was born just knowing how to do it.

Exactly. Immediately. And what Tiggie does is just like any other. Is he a father of Zich? Maybe he doesn't know it. There we go. But what Tiggi does is when he casts, he can cast incredible powers,

he's able to keep himself calm and his soul calm. So that he can do it. That is something that Zinch can give you. But he also did that immediately. Yeah, he's a Zingh demon. Yeah. I'm just saying he did it without training. Yep.

So you can imagine how enticing giving your soul or making a deal with Zinches. And Zinch loves himself a deal. But it's also, it's so easy for Zinch on this because his gifts are so, obviously, forbidden knowledge, and he leads those people on, but we're talking about the psychers part of it. Yeah. When you're a psycher, it is so easy for Zincch to take a hold of you because his powers are so obviously you couldn't destroy things with lightning bolts from your fingertips and now you can

that seems good i'm going to keep worshiping this guy yeah i want to kind of let's hang out with this guy he seems to be good for me yeah he's i was a lot less cool before the lightning bolts out of the fingers yeah the other thing that makes seems dangerous though is he also has knowledge and when we use a term forbidden knowledge you can take a different ways i don't take it as like like, ooh, the dark arts. I mean it as secrets. Oh, he knows everyone's secrets. Again, politicians.

The people in control are zinich. This is why Zinich doesn't need the most followers. You're like, hey, you've got all these random, the unwashed matches. You're like, masses, who are your followers? Oh, the president? And this dictator over here and this guy over here and the entire parliament is mine. You're like, oh, how? Because I let them have all.

of the knowledge of their competitors, all of the knowledge of the other powers, the other nations that were trying to compete against me. Oh, here's, here's everything that they know. Now you know it. Yep. And it's so powerful. It's incredibly powerful. And so what you get is politicians rise up from nowhere because they know, you know, so and so is skimming from the Imperium. So now he can report it. And then, yeah, so-and-so's extremely dead now. And you report it. So now you move up a tier. It's all these little things, these little changes. And this also will even infest the military because you want to be a greater general. Zich can help you know your opponent's movements so that you become a more successful warrior.

This is what Zich does. And is... You can tell you of impending engagements too. So you can stop those before they even happen. And it's all yours. That being said, corn is happy to just give his. boons to anyone who wants the boom. Well, that's the biggest thing.

Zinch. Corne gives no shits about who the victor is. Zinch does. Yeah, Zinch, if he's going to give you something, there is a return. I mean, the flesh curse. Yeah, Zich doesn't, Zinch wants his pound to flash after he's done. They aren't great return. You can worship corn accidentally and not really get a whole lot of terrible things that

happened to you. If you worship Zinch, he, He's getting something. You cannot worship Zinch without giving something. You should read the fine prints a pretty big deal. Yeah. Yeah. It's also written.

You should definitely get Daniel Webster to look over your stuff. Also, if you don't know what that is, read the, read it down. You're old. I know, but it's good. That's still good. So we should also, just like with Korn and what spends on time on some of the demons of Zich. So starting off, obviously, with the lesser demons, which he actually has three. they're all horrors.

And I get a kick out of horrors because... Because it's cool. From the gameplay standpoint, the first one is a pink horror. Pink horrors are just about a space marine size. They have three arms, which is random. It's because... Well, they don't. They model that three.

They're ever-changing and they look crazy. Yeah. And they run at you. If you kill a pink horror, though, it explodes into two blues. Blue horrors, which are smaller versions of the... which then keep running at you and trying to hit you. Then if you kill the blues, you get my favorites. Brimstones.

Which are brimstones, which are little. So the way to look at it from, if I can you guys have visual here? A pink horror is a large bipedal thing with, you know, in the models, they have three arms. Yeah. They actually can cast psychic powers, but they're about that. Blues are about half the size of a pink. But they kind of look similar to a pink. They're just blue.

And brims are just cute little. marshmallow guys. There's little marshmallows of fire. And what they do is they're made of fire. What they love to do is light their opponents on fire with warp fire. Then they join hands around the opponent

and sing while the opponent burns to death. This is something brimstones just do. Yeah, they're cute and they're lovable. Yeah, they're adorable. And yeah, they just want to burn their enemies to the ground. I don't know.

Harold's. Well, heralds can be several different things. They have the most common is the herald that leads other horrors. It's basically a juiced up people. Yeah, it's a big, it's a big horror. But then you've also got, Zinch has probably the most herald, I guess, ask models. Because there's a lot of named demons that have done a lot of different knowledge for Zinch. So they can appear as riding things.

They can appear as where anyone, They're walking horrors. There's just, as the Lord of Change, they can appear as a lot of wildly different horde or largely different forms. Yeah, heralds are kind of the, on the battlefield, the heralds are actually much more the leaders. So we're going to get to Lords of Change in a second, but Lords of Change aren't really meant for combat.

How do you mean the Lord of Change the Demon? Just the Zinch as the Lord, the Prince. I'm thinking the Greater Demons, whereas like, when you look at the other greater demons, so bloodthusters, keepers, and great and clean ones, they are there to lead the armies. Whereas in Zinch, and we're going to get there, I'm jumping ahead, but we'll come back to it, they're not, they're there to actually do the workings of Zich. The heralds of Zich are the ones who are actually leading the armies. Yeah.

Because the Lords of Change are actually fighting and actually changing things with powerful sites. Exactly. One other group that I didn't, I'm going to wedge him in here, because I'm not really sure. we've never talked about Zangor's before. It's the planets of Zinch, though. That's what happens when you take our entire planet. Because Zangor's aren't technically demons, though.

No, they're Zinch infused whatever's. Yeah, beast men is what is what I described that. But so anyone who plays the game, you've seen Zangor's actually might not because it rules of in garbage, but anyone who owns Thousand Sons, owns them. They're pretty good.

Yeah, but anyone who owns them, just like, owns them begrudgingly. So there's no will, origin on a Zangor. So Zangor is, they're basically a beast man, but they have a bird face and horns. That's the best way I explain. But otherwise they're just... And they have a bunch of different.

They have the actual psychers and casters. They have several versions of them. They are planets devoted to Zing. Yeah, there'll be entire planets of Zangor's. And they live there, but they're actually created because the original thought was that they came from the planet of

sorcerers, which doesn't make sense because... They were there before the planet of the sorcerers. Well, there was no planet of sorcerers before there was plan of sorcerers. That's the thing. So it's like they predate. They're supposed to be on the planet of sorcerers, which is what all of the thousand sons appeared on.

There was more of them before. I don't, they goof themselves up on that. If Zich before is the problem. So effectively, we don't know where they come from, but we do know that they will randomly appear. So, uh, only a ship that gets lost in the warp, the crew will get converted into Zangor's. So we know Zeech makes them.

Are they demons? No, because they move in the material with comfort. They don't need to be summoned into the materials. That's why they're not demons. But they have, they have casters. They have psychic affinity. They do. But what I'm saying is like they fall in a weird category because like, they're demon prince-esque.

Yeah, you know, that's a good point. Demon prince-esque. How about their warp touched is what I would say. So, but from there we move into the greater deed, which is the Lord of Change. So the Lord of Change is really cool because, as we said, Zich, he also doesn't. Has no phone. I know, but the greater demons on the board function very well to the lore. Obviously, the bloodthirster doesn't just kill everyone.

Yeah. But he is a devastating force. The Great and Clean one. Just. The Lord of Change, floor versus tabletop is difficult because, yes, he's powerfully. pretty decent in combat has some pretty great psychic abilities but man in the lore

of these guys are just bending reality to their will changing things the problem is that in the lore they're not meant for combat Lords of change exist in the lore to influence

and corrupt that's what they do they are they are the ones who are interacting with you know mortals yeah with mortals that's what they do When you're making a deal with Zinch, you're making a deal with a Lord of Change. They're legitimately the devils, and they psychically project themselves a lot. They don't always even show up.

Yeah. So them being on the tabletop doesn't really make a ton of sense because, as we said before, the fight happening makes a lot of sense because they probably caused it. Yeah, they probably caused it. But they're not, it's not their world. They would actually more likely leave and let the followers of Zingch fight. Because they're frail is what they are for greater. They're a greater demon.

Oh, they're by far the weakest in combat. Yeah. In psychic, ooh, boys. They'll melt your face. It's just, it's insane. It's hard to give them, you know, Lord, all of them are going to be. We've already said that. Lord to Tabletop is always going to be tough.

One thing I like is, and there's a few different stories of Inquisitors who are driven mad because it turns out what they're, the person that they're hunting down is a Lord of Change. Oh, they didn't know the whole time. And they finally get to the Lord of Change, Lord of Change, just basically. melts their brain with information. A lot of times they again give them what they want. Yeah.

Which is too much for their mind to handle all the time. They show you all the corruption. Hey. And this is lovecraftian stuff all over. They do it all the time. Yeah, like you shouldn't have made that deal with Cthulhu. Yeah. But that being said, if a Lord of Change fought a bloodthirster, the bloodthirster is probably just.

Oh, it would stuff him into a kid. Yeah. And just like, all right, now I'm going to go to soda, I guess. I thought, who's the guy I'm supposed to fight? Yeah, this thing? Can I fight three? Like, I just, I'm not really that interested. So, as we talked before, when you go into the stories of any of the demons, you get a lot of named characters.

And so I just picked the two that I enjoy the most. And I mean, let's go with the changeling. Because the changeling, he's also got great rules. So, yeah. So the changeling is, it's just to have. Harold of Zich. And we talked about this in the last episode. This is a lesser demon that has, that might be the most, one of the most powerful demons in the galaxy. You're about to get your brake line cut in the second. Yeah. This guy is nutty though. He's so cool. He has manipulated

wars he has made big dog characters do some. Oh yeah. We're going to talk about a couple of them in a second. So the change ring has no form. He just can appear as anything. So, you know, I would actually argue is Segarath a changeling? I mean, that's kind of weird, actually, but possibly. Just saying, like, Segarath has no form. Cigarath likes to manipulate. But anyway, so one of my favorites is on Fenris, the changeling, so when the Thousandons, as we talked about,

on the Iron One, were attacking Fenris. A changeling appeared first the scout Marine and then took his form of Samayel, to convince Azrael to attack Fenris. That was a changeling doing that. He also took the form of Lord Solar at one point and convinced half of Lord Solar's own army to retreat. And when you said half of the army,

it wasn't like half of the platoon. No, the army. Yeah. He appeared, Lord Solar appeared and told them, oh, we're good, go home. And they all went, well, it's Lord Solar. I guess I'll just go home now. Yep.

My favorite one is no idea why. he appeared as a Gretchen to a big mech and said he just tuned up as a gun which made the gun explode when he went to use it just looking for nowhere he just went to screw you and just took off yeah this is these are just some of the weird stories he also this one is actually fantastic created a nergling whoopee cushion I'm so surprised he didn't get killed for this one so the changeling snuck into the the skull throne with a bunch of nerglings, tied them together, and made it so when corn sat down,

the nerglings exploded, making a horrible sound and even worse smell. Why did he make the skull thrown stinky? No idea, but he did it. Indeed. And this is why my question was, is Cigarath actually a changeling? Because this is just what he does over and over and over again.

The changeling does not exist for a specific purpose, other than for chaos. Yeah. But they don't have, well, they have a model. It's hard to find. They do have a model. Are the Blue scribes. Blue scribes rock, too.

These things are just cool as hell. So. They're like the two guards. Yeah. But we talked earlier where Zinche was thrown against a mountain and broke up into a million shards. Each shard of Zinch is actually a spell. of Zinch and they're spread throughout the galaxy.

These are shards of a god. So Zinch would like his shards back. Well, Zinch also already got, he is more than the sum of his parts. But he still wants all his shards back. True story. The problem is that who do you send to collect a shard? Because once I get a couple of them, they're some of the most powerful beings in the galaxy. So he grabs two blue horrors.

and sends them out to go collect them all. By the way. The document them all, actually. Well, yeah, we'll collect them and document them. Aramon, this is one of those things where if someone like Aramon knew these shards existed. Oh, he'd be scooping that stuff on. He could care less of the webway. Like, I'm going here now.

So he's got two blue horrors named Paterics and Zirxaptip. I cannot. That's all I'm doing, guys. it's the same name spelled backwards. P-T-A-R-I-X and then the other way around. So that's what it is. Tatarix, whoof, can transcribe any spell that he sees, but he doesn't transcribe it into a language he can read or comprehend.

Then Ziktarup can cast and read anything that Ptarex writes down, but also can't comprehend them. So these two little blue horrors are running around grabbing shards, writing them down, no idea what they're writing down, but they can read them if they're in trouble. But they don't know what they're casting. They have no idea what they're casting.

It just might be anything. These stories are hilarious. It could be a comet. It could be, I created pancakes. Yeah, that's, yeah, that's a great. And there are some very comical stories about these two when they get corners. They always run away, obviously.

They've got, they have a disc of Zimsh that they ride. They can actually jump in it out of the material. They can get anywhere. But if cornered, Zixariped, whatever, Zixarup will then immediately just start reading spells.

Not randomly. He'll just start randomly reading spells to see what happens. And yeah, it might be you've got them cornered and as Brad said, a comet hits you and blows you up or French toast. Yep.

French toast is now there and it just looks at it and just keeps casting until it works. They're awesome. They have a cool model. They're useless on the tabletop. But, I mean, I mean, the other.

Yeah, and also, by the way, they also hate each other, which is what's really funny. They're always caught arguing with each other. And they're with each other 100% of the time. Yeah. They are the bane of existence for the Imperium. They have split a planet in half before with one of these spells, just because they were cornered and didn't know what to do.

Nothing wrong with that. Yeah, these things happen. Last little bit we'll cover, though, is going to be Zinch and the Imperium and discuss kind of what the Imperium's viewpoint on Zinches. And simply put, as far as, as the Inquisition is concerned, Zinche is the greatest threat to the Imperium. So Zinche and the Imperium, the challenge for the Imperium is Zinch, though, as we said before,

doesn't represent a lot of cults. Zinich is the most dangerous to the Imperium because of who he corrupts. The leadership. Yeah. Every noble throughout the Imperium may be working for Zinch. And as we said before, unlike corn, where you could work for corn and not know it, if you work for Zinch, you have made a deal with. Zinich, which means Zinj is getting something.

Which also you have made a shitty deal. Zero people have made a great deal with Zing. No one ever walks away going, I really pulled the wool over Zinche's eyes. I came away with that with the best deal ever. Yeah. I mean, he, Zinch, the problem is you never know what these deal, what Zinch's goal is. Zich may make a deal with someone to give them knowledge and ask them to do something that looks benign.

But that benign act changes two different systems. Exactly. It's a nothing thing. It is he, Zinj is so corrupt. And so the, the Inquisition is most obsessed with tracking down Zinj corruption because it can affect the Imperium. Like, to be fair, if a corn gets a hold of a system, it's just going to burn. You send in some soldiers, you kill the corruption. Yeah, but it's Zinch gets a hold of the system.

All of a sudden, his plan is that. He wants to stop the shipment of corn, 43 systems over, because he wants to have a battle go his way in 100 years. You have no idea he's there, but he's, and every day he's getting his fingers deeper and deeper into it. It is terrifying for the Imperium because once it, the only thing too, Zeech is so crafty. Once his plans have begun, you're not going to stop them. The other one, though, that's actually a lot scarier, are psychers. And we're going to do an episode pretty soon, everybody, on psychers and black fleets and what have you. But regulated psychers are scary to the Imperium.

Unregulated psychers that are worshippers or Zinch. Again, Zinch gives, hold on, carry the one, zero shits whether you live or die. So he is willing to give you powers that will for sure kill you. So what? But kill you, you might explode like an atom bomb in the middle of a Hyde City. In the middle of a high city, you might wreck Imperium shit, which is what he wanted you for in the first place. He doesn't, he gives no craps that you made a deal with him to become the most powerful psycher to take over the world. And then, no, that was never going to happen.

And actually, let's dive into this just briefly here. If you're an unregulated psycher in the Imperium, you are living a life of fear. You know you're not supposed to have these powers. And everyone in the Imperium's aware of the Black Ships. So you know that if people find out you have these powers, they will take you somewhere and you don't know where. So the only way to stay alive is like, the only way to stay alive is to fight.

And you need power to fight. Zinesh will give you that power. And what ends up happening is, psychers and spoiler alert guys, psychers in the Imperium are not rare. There won't be one psycher in a hive city. There could be thousands. Oh, there won't be, you mean,

Possibly there is. There are thousands. And Zich may connect all of them together. So now you don't have... It could be a cabal. Yeah, you have a cabal of psychers. You don't have one or two psychers. You've got thousands of them.

And also psychers are powerful by themselves. Cabals of psychers can do world-altering magic. And so this is why Zinch is such a threat to the imperial. you. But from there, I think we'll just conclude. Next week, we're going into Slanesh and Nergel. That's going to be difficult. We're going to do the six rooms. There's no chance for doing that.

We're not doing anything close to that. I do not need this. This getting canceled, we're doing really well right now. We're going to talk about all of the great baking championships that Slenish has going on. So many baking championships. Just incredible. Baking championships, it really is like basically the entire Bravo network. It's like, you know, top runway, you know, America's next top model, project runway.

Like, I don't watch these things, but they all exist. That's Slemesh. Making so many faces right now. All right. With that, though, and again, sorry for my voice, everybody. I realize it just gave out part with this cast. This is what happens we try to do multiple in the day. But with that, like and subscribe to our cast, join our Discord.

It really is going very well. We're coming up. It's a good time to join the Discord, by the way, because we're coming up on the end of some of our new written content. So if you have some ideas, really good time to let us know. Also, I keep forgetting we have a Patreon. Jesus Christ, we're like 11 episodes in, haven't said it one time. We should probably mention that. She mentions the Patreon. My bad. But with that, this is John Barassani and Bradchester. See you all next week.