The 40k Lorecast - Episode 70 - Death Watch pt 1 - Who are the Death Watch and how does one become one

Episode Date: January 21, 2025

 On today’s cast we start our coverage of the Death Watch, the special forces of the Space Marines. We start with a quick overview of what the Death Watch are and then dive a bit into their two different founding stories (one was way better than the other). After that we talk about how a Space Marine joins the Death Watch, both the official and common practice as well as the Black Shield style. From there we focus a bit more on how the Death Watch function as a fighting force in the imperial forces, with their smaller and more specific goals and actions to achieve great success via tiny events.PatreonMerchandiseDiscord Link:Our WebsiteRetro RecallOur Sponsors:* Check out BetterHelp: https://www.betterhelp.com* Check out Pebl: https://hellopebl.com* Check out Pebl: https://hipebl.ai* Check out Shopify: https://shopify.com/loreAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Welcome to the 40K lore cast. Welcome to the 40K lore cast with me, John Barcotti, and Bradchester. This guy. On today's cast, we're going to deal with John building a new army. So we're talking about Death Watch because... You already built it. Not done yet. Partially done.

I mean, it's mostly done. You can always add more. It's a stupid... But that is the story of 40K. Are you done? You're never done. I've got... Well, actually, my orcs are done because I own every model.

You don't? multiples. Oh, you're right. I don't have enough. flute. You don't have enough flash cats. I already talked about that. I don't think you have enough tank bust us. Oh, no. Well, I've got the old tech. I've got guys holding rockets. I've got 20 guys holding rocket launchers. That's fine. Yeah. I like old models better anyways. All right. Before we begin, the 40K lore cast is a weekly podcast releasing every Monday evening

in the U.S. Focus on the lore of the 40K universe. So if you be so kind as to like and comment in the cast, it massively helps us out. Additionally, if you click on the show notes, you'll find a link to our website, the 40KLorecast.com, where we have our merchandise, Patreon, Discord links, even information on Brad's coaching services. We're in the merch right now. Am I not? Yep. If you could see me, you could see, oh, I just hurt myself with my own merchandise.

Yep. Brad is. I'm skilled. Yeah. Discord, though. I was like bringing it up. Discord is a completely free community that we have available for anyone looking to interact around the 40K universe.

We have channels dedicated to providing feedback. Yes. Exactly. Yes. Is that feedback? on the episodes, lore in general, literature, gameplay, memes, hobbying, online gaming, and lots more. Massive thanks to our mod community there for making it what it is at time of recording those 5,500 members in it. If you're listening to this cast in the distant future and there is no discord, it's because it got

big enough and I burned it to the ground. And the only thing between that happening- You're way ready for that, too. Yeah, the only thing between me burning this thing to the ground that existing is this group of mods. So thank you guys for doing that, because if you're serving, services weren't here, it would not exist. True story. Also on our website, we have a link and some information to Brad's coaching services, 30 years of playing the game and 10 years of coaching players. Brad has become a very good resource for everyone looking to play the game on the tabletop.

Brad has worked with players of all experience levels from brand new all the way through heavy tournament players. So if you want to know more, you can go to our website or a Discord. I'm going to do Brad a favor here. We, after maybe 69 episodes of yelling out his email address, it has become such a problem with him, the spam bots that. For everybody that has not, I have not responded to, I'm this weekend after recording this, it'll be after, who cares?

Yeah. But, I know. But for people that have not been responded to, I tried to up my spam filters and everything else. effectively what happened is I got almost no one's email. So I, you know what I still got though? I still got bots. Yeah. All the real people got stopped.

Yeah. And bots still got through. This is your fault on the website earlier. Anyway, the joke kind of is on its course. So the amount of spam hitting Brad just has actually affected his ability to do his job. So we're going to stop yelling it out. I'm not editing the prior cast. So whatever.

But anyway, if you're looking for Brad's coaching services, go to our Discord or to our website. Both links are in the show notes. I was saying, or in the Discord and people will just yell it at you. It's fine, yeah. No, it's not hidden. So what are the Death Watch? So the Death Watch, much like Custodes in the lore,

are light years better than they're on the Tabletop. They also don't... Is this the most difference between Tabletop and... Custodes. It's Custodes and Harlequins and Solitaire's. These are just plays so different from the... Because they play the most different. You're right.

Okay, I see your point. They play the most different. It's just maybe Harlequins though, actually, Harlequins are, Harlequins in the lore, and that episode's coming up, guys. They at least show up like they would, kind of. But Harlequins are in the lore are more of an NPC.

Oh, true. That's more what I'm saying. Yeah. In the other table top, like why are they? It's like playing a, if you, you unlock a boss after you beat him and then he's terrible.

That is what Harlequins are. Yeah, the Harlequin's there because there are a main role in the galley. is to guide things to happening. And just on occasion they have to end something. Yeah. They have to end something. And that's when they get real nasty. But yeah, the Death Watch to me don't make a, let's say, the Death Watch to Me on the tabletop are style-wise disappointment.

They actually play well. In the 8th edition, they played really well. They're good. The thing is they're a really good army. They're just not a lore even the way they show up. Yeah. So let's explain it. So the Death Watch, they're the.

special forces of the space marines. They're kind of part of the Inquisition of Ordo Zinos. They have a different match with them because they come from all chapters. Yeah, but we'll get into kind of where they are more. But I like to start a little bit with that just because of the fact that that's a big deal of their identity. Yes. It's all these people that are coming together. They're sending their best guys. That's why it is, they are truly the special force of the space Marines. You have to, you earn a right to be in the Death Watch. And it is, It's a serious right. Anyone who played Space Marine 2, you know what I'm talking about.

It's a massive piece. So where the Death Watch, their entire purpose in the galaxy is to deal with Xenos, whereas the Ordo Malius have the Grey Knights, the Ordo Hereticus have the sisters. Yeah, have the sisters. The Ordo Xenos have the Death Watch. And it's a big deal on this because they get very specific because they only want to fight these things. Yes, unless playing on the tabletop. Which they never fight these things.

Exactly. It's always funny when Death Watch are good. It's because they're a space Marine army is good. And then so all the Space Marine armies are good. So they just constantly play space Marines. And they have zero stories of them doing it. Yeah, but they do an eighth edition, a little bit of ninth. They did some pretty dirty things in Space Marines.

So what's cool about them is that obviously the Death Watch spend their time fighting tyrannids, Eldar, Dukari, Necron, Orcs, Tao and Votan, TBD, if they're Zenos or not. But the part I find more interesting is they actually deal with their main job in the lore is the non-Codex aliens. 100%. And that's why I said they show up so much different than we're going to talk about kill teams in a minute here. But one of the things that Death Watch does in the lore is they, it's just a group, they send down effectively a platoon of Marines that are specifically kidded out for this. they don't, they usually don't send, they have sent larger forces, but for the most part. Most part they don't.

And that's because they're dealing with, and what's cool about that is that they're sending, when Brad says they don't send like an armada, they send a few dudes to deal with what is, and we'll get this more later, a small threat that could become a bigger threat. They send rangers, they send seals. This is what they do.

They're sending a small group of operators down to take care of a problem and get out. Exactly. They're not trying to take over. They're not trying to occupy. They're just trying to resolve a problem. And some of their coolest stories are these non-Codex aliens, though. Oh, yeah.

Because they have cool stories about them coming down and they take care of something. About a reason that no longer exists. Yeah, I was to say, when I say take care of it usually means kill. They're the new Dark Angels. So let's talk about the history of the Death Watch first. And they again have a really great history. So M32, the Imperium almost collapsed due to this great or Glock of the War of the Beast. The War of the Beast, I was just saying, the War of the Beast was a, but this is a big deal, though, because Xenos-wise, we've had from the horse heresy, they're aware chaos, we have to do something about that.

They're rebuilding the empire, the Imperium, the Empire, I guess it is the Empire. But in that 2000-ish-year span, it's like 1,500 before we had that, you have the Imperium kind of sitting on its laurels about Zenos. Well, and let's talk about why. It's because the Great Crusade only happened because of the fall of the Eldar. And up until basically the whole age of technology, the whole, everything up to the Great Crusade, the Eldar were in the galaxy. And the Eldar had been there for a while. They know how to handle all the Zeno.

So the Eldar were holding everything in check. Yeah, everything was in check. And what you saw, they did have the Ulinar situation during the Great Crusade, but the Ork specifically, because they were on the right side of the Galilee, I'm not changing. Eastern fringe. The galaxy would, it was hard, they had to go through what was the Eldar part of the galaxy to get to the human part of the galaxy.

So they were always telling you. Which just didn't happen. Also, remember, we talked about this in Cass previously. The Eldar didn't have to pack up and do things. The Webway meant, hey, there's a problem here. There's not a problem here. And they also could sense it. So if an orcs, if the orcs were moving anywhere, they could see them.

So even if the orcs weren't to hop on. a space Hulk and jump to us out of the galaxy, the Eldar would see it, and then to Brad's point, they'd go through a webway and just instantly in the height of the elder player at power, they just went and these were nothing to them. It took no time. There were precogs. So with the

Eldar gone, the orcs begin to kind of spread out into the galaxy. Well, they're also, they're testing it. They're like the kid testing going, hey, is Dad going to do anything about this? Nope, he didn't. Nope, he didn't. And then they keep pushing. And then this was

made a lot worse by the effects of the emperor going into the golden throne because you have the end of the horse heresy. So you've got worlds are devastated, obviously, heresy. But now the emperor is gone. Which, which means, which we have to touch on that though. Who's in charge now? Well, it's not even just who's in charge, but as much of a, I'm wearing the sweatsher, by the way, if you can go to our merchandise, the bad dad emperor sweatshirt. But as much as he, he's, He didn't tell stuff. The emperor was the best, the most powerful psychic in the galaxy. He knew what was going on most of the time.

Yeah, he could deal with it. And he sent a lot of things where he didn't tell anybody why they were going there, but he knew. But as we get into the War of the Beast, one of the challenges they have is that the Lords of Terror were fully in charge at this point. F them. And, Brad, the issue with the Lords of Terror is that the Lords of Terror were never meant to actually be in charge. They were meant to serve as figureheads.

who did the bidding of the emperor in Malcador. That's it. That's all they ever had to do. And suddenly, you know, they were in charge and they sucked at it. Because the only thing that they did, because they never had to worry before. Any poor decision by a Lord of Terror, Lord of Terra, Lord of Terra, while Malacador and the Emperor was around, was really, it was covered. Yeah.

Because the Lords of Terror were supposed to be the five, 10-year-old boys sitting around and then they did something and dad went quit it. I think of it as like their massive trust fund kids who are one day maybe they'll inherit the business. The one day they suddenly inherited the business. And unlike Tommy Boy, it wasn't funny. You just ruin the galaxy. Exactly. So what ends up happening with this is that when the first orconvasion, first parts of the orconvasion begins, almost all the lords respond with not my problem.

And the reason why is because the orc invasion was beneficial for the major. majority of the Lords of Peripers. Because they suck. Well, let's talk about why, though. Yeah, because they crushed their rivals. Exactly. And they knew it was crushing their rivals. And because they're the worst people ever, ever, ever, they just went,

they're not people. They've never existed. This is fictionally in the future. I'm still angry. God, you're mad about this. Like, you know, they suck. Fine. Anyway, the problem is that this orc invasion gets really moving.

And the Lords of Terror are not willing to put any real effort into it because they want to watch their guys fail. They actually started attacking their rivals. The rivals. They're weakened to gain less. The bigger problem, though, is the Space Marine fleets. So the Space Marine Army was cut down by like 70%. At least. Yeah, I would say at least.

At this point, in M32, everyone's gone to. Lehman and Korax are in the warp. Gilliman's already been stabbed. I think Dorn was down to just a hand, is all it's left of it. There's no, there's no prime marks in the galaxy. So this also, everything about this is building towards a huge problem. To make matters worse, because of the Lords of Terra, the Space Marines were actually a largely independent body.

And this is because the Lords of Terra were incredibly focused on improving their own standing and their own power. And all they really cared about was not crossing the Space Marines. They did a good job of this because Marines historically and somewhat to this day right now, besides people like Bobby G. Yeah. As long as you don't interrupt their flow of ammunition, food, logistics. They're good.

They just don't pay attention to what you're doing. At this stage, we're completely focused on chaos. They were all in our, again, every single Space Marine Legion has lost their prime mark because of chaos. That's the only reason that prime marks are going on. As long as you're not messing with their ability to beat the shit out of chaos, they don't care. And also, to be fair, the first one of the day, the Marines also, while geniuses, have a hard time occasionally with understanding petty men's drives and desires because why?

Because their entire doctrine of everything that they stand for, but this doesn't even make sense. Where this gets ugly is because, to exactly Brad's point, they're not suspicious of the Lords of Terra. And so what happens is the Lords of Terror kind of send all the Space Marines to the other side of the galaxy away from their spheres of influence because they don't want to heal them. Which means as this Orc invasion is progressing, the space Marines aren't even aware of it because no one's saying them. They're so far away. Yeah. Well, because no one's saying the messages.

Like, oh, hey, by the way, this is happening. They don't know. So moving forward, the war, the beast's war, the beast's war, finally gets to a point where it's so massive that it can no longer be ignored. And it gets close enough to Terra, that basically right up to the segmentum solar, that now you have to do something about it. And two things happen. First, as we covered before, the head of the assassins, so you can listen to our

assassins cast, gets involved and gets all the Lords of Terror to fall in line by, I think, killing one of them and then threatening a bunch of the others with his assassins. He showed up to a meeting. Exactly. That's a real thing. Actually, it's pretty funny. So it's a good cast. Listen to our cast on the assassins would talk about this.

This gets the commitment of the Imperial Navy and the Militarum. It also there then gets the notice of the Space Marine chapters, primarily the imperial fists, but they weren't the only ones. Space wolves were there, Black Templar, Ultramarines, Blood Angels. everyone joins the cult. Well, it becomes an everybody. And it again... Oh, you're right. Yes, sisters of silence.

Yeah, it becomes all hands on deck because it becomes so serious. Yeah. Because the orcs aren't just winning. They're smashing. Yeah. And they're also ruining logistics. Yeah. And so what's during this War of the Beast, there is an imperial fist who is the current chapter

master Corland. Corland was the Lord Commander of all imperial forces. So that's why he went there first. And he's also the head of the imperial fists. So he and the fists take the brunt of the beast. He's supposed to be a brilliant strategist, but this initial move is terrible, by the way. What, I'm just get between Orquah?

He had no other play. He starts to come up with some plans, but his original plan was just let him, he'll get, use the Rocky, he'll get tired of punching me in the face because they get wrecked. They get absolutely wrecked. I mean, to the point where the Legion is potentially going to fall, like that level of wrecked.

Corland at this point becomes a better strategist and realizes that they cannot defeat the war, the beast waugh head on. And I will defend him this one. This is the first time they've seen anything like this. When they fought the orcs on Ulanor, it was a very powerful, it wasn't even a war boss on Ulanor. But the beast is a whole different volume. The Beaks is the largest wall up until the second time that gas shows up. I mean, we've never, and so they've never seen like this. Duct taped head to that gas?

Yeah, well, that's a third time. That's true. The third time is the head is the head duct taped on. On to multiple bodies. So what Corland realizes is that they need to win, they need to win small skirmishes all over the place to lead into a greater. Let's say that. Why? Because the bigger the battle, the more orcs are drawn, the bigger the wall gets.

but if you fight small skirmishes, it actually not only kills some of the orcs, but it degreases the log because it deflates them, because they've lost and it wasn't a big battle and nothing happens. And he focuses on these, like these tiny little asset wins that maybe divert the orc hoard in certain directions or impede some movements. The problem he has, though, is that there's no force within the Imperium that works with this. the Imperial Warr machine has always been dominance.

It has been thrown giant numbers, giant arms, and just wrecked. Exactly. I would say, we've never done that because our MO is, you have bodies, so do we. We have more bodies. They're better armored. They're better equipped all this stuff. And the problem with the orcs. I've read the Imperial Primer. I know they're better armed.

Exactly. Well, they know how to recite their proper litany. The issue, though, is that where this becomes a problem is the orcs outnumber them here. 20 to 1, 30 to 1, 50 to 1, to 1, I mean, it is out of control. There's so many. And I'm saying, they're outnumbering the guardsmen. It is not a good, this, you can't win the war this way.

So he has to figure out something else. What he comes up with ends up becoming the Death Watch, where he realizes that he needs that make a new fighting force of small space marine groups who can go and win tiny battles. With specific weaponry, though, that's the biggest thing. They're not only going to be different tactics, but they're going to be equipped to only specifically do these things. Now, one thing, we're going to tell you two stories here back to back on the founding of the Death Watch. They're both in codexes and they're, but not in the same codex.

So this does get a little bit loopy. So I'll tell you a story I like more and then the other one. Well, I want to tell the one thing before we continue to. This is a big deal because codex compliance is a big deal. space marines fight a certain way and then adapt from here. This is them saying, we're scrapping that. We're going to make you unbelievably focused to only deal with this. Yeah.

So this story becomes interesting. The only way for Corland to make a new space marine chapter effectively is with the blessing of the Lords of Terra, who do not want to do this. And the reason they don't want to do it is because space marines were already operating independently of them. And this would technically increase the size of a military force that they have no control over. These people care about nothing but control. Personal power.

Yeah. Luckily, the War of the Beast is kind of an imminent concern. And I'm pretty sure the head of the assassins got involved here. So they approve it. And the first kill teams are. They had to approve it because they screwed around so long that the war was outside the door. see the, but I also firmly believe the head of the assassins was also saying, hey, sign this because I got someone behind you who's going to have an issue if you don't sign it.

The next guy up will sign it. Also, he'll be wearing your skin. What's great is, so this gets approved, and I love the original found. You've got this situation where all these space marine chapters have been fighting against the beast, and they've lost 75 plus percent of their soldiers. They are not battlefield-ready because they operate these big groups. But these like 20 to 25 percent who are alive want nothing more than to get vengeance for their fallen brothers. So Corlin just floats this idea of, hey, would anyone be willing to join a hodgepodge group of Marines to go fight the Zenos?

And yeah, quite a few volunteers show up. There's some grim anger coming out of here. But don't forget, these are also the people who survive. survived the fight against the orcs. So they have into, and as Braddon and I've discussed before, space marines are light years intelligence. So every battle of space marine fights is knowledge they never forget. So what ends up happening is a cool side effect is these are some of the best

orc fighters in the galaxy form small groups to go fight orcs. Because now they figured out what works, what doesn't work, and they've got it burned into their brains because that's how they roll. After the War of the Beast, this then becomes, not canonized, whatever it is, they become an official force, but this force ends up being moved under the Inquisition

due to some protests from the Lords of Terra. But that's, that's, that's, so they end up becoming, but it actually just makes sense. You put them under, under the Ordo Zenos, because their goal was to fight Zenos. It just was a weird little thing. The funny thing about this to me, though, is that that's one of the two stories.

The other one, so it, In 2010, we've got the first Death Watch Codex. In 2015, you get Black Library novels that tell the story we just covered with Coralino. So now I'm going to tell you the 2010 version of it. Which is labor. Which is labor. And it's... Yeah, because they act like they just showed up almost.

Yeah. Well, yeah, a bunch of... The idea is this one is a bunch of Inquisitor Lords got together to petition the space marine chapters to give them a fighting force to stand against a Zeno threat. And under this one, all of the heads of the Ordo Zinos went to all of the heads of the space marines and told them that they needed, basically, they said, give us your best space marines so we can go fight with your best space marines. And the chapter messers agreed, this is.

It's not as cool as multiple chapters wanting vengeance for their fallen brothers and come together with the best of the best of the veterans. Exactly. So I'm just going to skip over the rest of it because I really don't. I don't like that story. You're fine. And it's the older story. Effectively, the only thing that really comes out of these two stories I do think is important

is I am still unclear as to the relationship with between Ordo Xenos and the Inquisition. I'm still unclear between the relationship between Death Watch and the Ordo Zenos. And I say that because in the codexes and in the books, they work together. But it's very evident that the Inquisition cannot tell. the death watch want to do. They can. They just don't. Maybe that's it.

Okay, because I'm not going through an eyes of horn. I'm going through even codecs. On paper, they do have the ability. They just, the death watch just will ignore them. Yeah, saying to a

nine foot man holding a fragon wearing power armor, go do what I told you to do. I want you to tell the same thing would happen to you that happened to the biker in secret level. He will put his shoulder down and you will explode.

Yeah. Fair enough. So let's go that and into kind of, now that we've covered the Death Watch origin, let's talk about the structure of them. Because I really, I love the Death Watch. I'm sorry, I really do. The way they make new people or get new people is so different. This is, they're unique. So a key piece here. Every space marine chapter holds its roots in its gene seat. As we discussed before, it's a stupid waste of a program because you could easily just implant them with the Emperor's Gene Seed. but we'll skip that. Or you could have always been

Primaris. Yeah. Well, the Primaris has extra things, but anyway, the point being is that each Legion... Still get poisoned.

There's no limit to poisoning, Brett. Apparently now. There's no limit to poisoning. It's just, it just happens. They need gas masks. Anyway,

the, so the gene seed determines your chapter. Whatever chapter you're from, they put a gene seed in, and you've got a natural attachment to your prime. The Death Watch

don't have. have a prime mark, so they have no gene seed. So as a result, the Death Watch become an amalgamation of chapters, which I love them so much. Not only did you pronounce that right, but you also spelled it right in our notes, and I don't understand how that happened. I have spell check. You think it's spell amalgamation on one shot? The amount of times you put the wildest stuff up here?

Yeah. I also work in dental, so amalgams make a spell instantly. It's like, it's like, I can just, Malcolm, all right, like a malcolm and then Mation. All right, so the couple of things on the death watch. Joining the death watch is not a permanent assignment. I mean, it is that you die, but if you don't die, you will eventually leave the death watch and return back. Again, Space Marine 2.

So once you've, this is a huge thing of people who return. Going to the death watch is an amazing honor. We'll get to that in a second. So when you come back from the death watch, Watch, let's just say you weren't stationed on like, you know, a super happy, you weren't guarding Hawaii, you know? If you come back from Death Watch, you've killed more Zinos than most of your chapter brothers will ever even see.

You also get sent to some serious hot zones. You can fight. They don't call for the Death Watch to clean up. Yeah, it's not like, hey, can you guys help us out over here a little bit? It's like, hey, go. We're going to drop you into the middle of a Necron tomb. some of the way they actually did to fight your raid at the center of it, which they did,

to then kill, you know. It's, they get some whack assignments. Their stories are awesome. Also, they send them into, we don't know what this alien race does, kill them. Yeah. You're like, so absolutely no intel?

Nah. You'll figure it out. You're good. You kill Zinos. Second Eisenhower novel or third Eisenhower novel is the one where they do that. It's the second of the third where, yeah, they're fighting an alien race

that no one has ever seen. before in the Death Watch, they're going, right. There's a Yolo a man. Yeah, whatever. Next problem. So another key part of the Death Watch, though, is that they are not centralized. So it's, this is a huge deal. This is so cool.

This is actually one of the coolest things to me about them. The galaxy's massive. And like we said, they're not just fighting the codexed, you know, aliens. But also, there's aliens everywhere. It goes to the size of that, though. They never tell you exactly how big the Death Watch is. but you start to figure out, wait a minute, they're doing things. Galaxy, yes.

GW.M.F. There technically should be more Death Watch than there are Space Marines. Yeah, because they are everywhere. They get drawn from all the chapters. And they also operate independent of the Codex Astardis so they can have whatever the hell they want. But the way the Death Watch is set up is they're on these watch fortresses, which will cover more in the next cast, and actually watch, another term for them too,

watch stations all around the galaxy. This is done because they have to be able to deploy real fast. They have a centralized base, but overall, these small spots all around the galaxy are so that if a Xeno's threat is detected, they can be there basically in an instant. This is very different than we talked about the last cast with the Space Wolves.

They have just the base on Fenris. I think fists, a couple of them might have more than one base. obviously the Ultraman's have the entire... I think you're meant to say the Fang. The Fang, fine. But the Ultramarines have an entire system, but still it's one system. If something's going on the other side of the galaxy,

they have to warp travel the whole way there. The Death Watch have someone local. They've got... Almost every. There's so many Death Watch. There should be. They're everywhere. So in each of these local areas have a watch commander.

And I like the Watch Commander because he fits like a strange role within the Death Watch. I love these guys, though, because they have good rules in the game. The watchmasters are great. Yeah, but they, I love the fact of what they are, though,

because they're the guy that has to get everybody going now all the time. And it is, who, let's just say, talk about tabletop rules. Yeah, the rules suck compared to what they should be. Oh,

this is the, to become a watchmaster means that you've been in the death watch for decades. Decades upon decades. Also, no one has any idea how you're still alive. Yeah. You basically should be a watchmaster against a custode in combat. The custode still wins, but he has to sweat a little bit, whereas a custod versus

Space Marine is a, oh, yeah, that guy was there. Past tense. Past tense. Unless on the tabletop said opponent is holding a las rifle. He read the litany. Can't be stopped. Yeah, can't be stopped. or your vehicles blow up.

Yeah. God, I'm so mad about that still. Yeah, all right, so I'm like I tell the story about playing some again. What? Are you blowing up my stuff? By me blowing up your stuff? Yeah, Brad and I played this weekend,

and I took him, I took out a chunk of his army with an exploding Rogel Dorn. Yeah, but you kept blowing up. Yeah. You act like one thing blew up. Man, the appearance doesn't build stuff. I didn't realize that all of your reactors

were set to explode. I blew up two Lehman, what, one Lehman, Russ, one Rogel, Dorn. one sentinel one basilis that's all it's not much like I probably did about 70 mortal wounds to you on explosions you're upset about this I don't think you should have planned better uh-huh I should have punched you with just the right amount of force be careful also watch out for overwatch it can it can sting yeah especially with melters anyway we'll be right back after a quick break in my professional life one thing I know well

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That's high, P-E-B-L-A-I for a free estimate. So the next, the greatest thing about the watchmaster is, because he falls into all the pieces of Death Watch. When you join the Death Watch, you reset your rank. You could be a captain and join the Death Watch. Doesn't matter you're joining a Kilding. And you have to re-fight your way all the way up. And this is done not because of some weird, like,

You're new here, so you have to start from the bottom. It really is a, look, we fight differently than you fought before. You're going to learn your way up. Well, so it's not just ranking back up. It's they want to find what you're specifically good at. What are you the absolute best at? Because we're going to specialize right down to the back. You're already sending the best of the best here.

We want to know if we take the best of the best and we figure out their specialty, that's where we're putting them in. and they have kill teams. Yeah, the kill teams admit. But the idea is that every member of the death watch is as you move further and further up, you have your death, you have your kill teams, you have your veterans, you have your watchmaster. Each level up, they get astronomically better. And they have to be because of what we just were discussing earlier.

These guys operate independently. They move very quickly. When it's go time, they are absolute go time. They don't have a bunch of support behind them. The way it's going to work is the local inquisition is basically scouring the galaxy for problems. They're going to find a problem. They're going to decide quickly what needs to be done. Is this a local planetary defense force situation, maybe a little bit of guardsman,

or am I really up, you know, a river without a paddle, in which case we're calling in the death watch? And if you wanted to, I just better read these, I believe it's the second Eisenhorn, novel when he's dealing with, forget an alien race there? It might be the first one, actually. I think about it. They touch it. It's both.

Yeah, but anyway, but the Death Watcher present there. But also, people ask us for recommendations. They've been asking a lot in Discord lately. You're never going to go wrong with the Eisenhower novels. They're good.

Yes, I think it's the best one. I like Gons a lot, but I think Eisenhower's the best. I just, I've listened to, on audiobook-wise, I've listened to Eisenhorn a bunch. The only downside to the Eisenhorn audiobook.

Is it, you listen to them? What's the writer's name? Abbot uses the same guy for all of his audiobooks. So, so you can't, the next one in, you're like, oh, but that was Eisenhorn's voice. Anyway, let's now talk about joining the Death Watch, because again, cool as shit. So we'll start with a Codex way you join, and then we'll get into the Space Marine to way that you join. They don't really cover this as much in the codexes, but they've kind of added it later. So we'll start with the original, which is the Death Watch are not a secret

organization, whereas like the Grey Knights, only certain members are aware of them. No. Everybody knows about the Death Watch. Every Space Marine, even members of the Imperium, the Death Watch are well known, which makes sense because the Zenos aren't really a secret. Ordomalius is holding a secret. Ordo Zenos is like, I do have to assume that there's like, some sort of like Stallone and Arnold movies that are Death Watch movies. Oh, yeah. 100%. Because they're everywhere.

Yeah. Within the Space Marines, as we were discussing, the Death Watch are viewed as the elite. They are a special force. So everyone kind of wants to be in the Death Watch, joining the Death, so effectively, every single Space Marine, whether they say it or haven't said it, are volunteering to being part of the Death Watch. It's a huge honor. However, you can't volunteer for. the death watch. You have to be volunteered

into it. And this is because space marines by nature are stoic. You know, space walls, we give them a bit of a grief about glory in action, but it's still done with class. No space marine would ever demand I want to be in the death watch.

Lucius. But Lucius would. Lucius would. But aside from Lucius, he did fall to chaos. That's fair. still likes killing Zinos. He was such a douche. Because I do want to talk about this a little bit in the sense of like this whole idea of honor and stoicism.

Because space wolves, we did kind of make them out to be a little bit like kind of borderline chaosy with some of them. They're awesome. Just accept it to move on. But they, it's, I want to clarify, they, they're not, the space wolves are not so prideful that they would, that they would kind of be part of emperor's children. The space wolves take pride. in the honorable way that they do things.

A space wolf, you know, does he want the final kill and the biggest boss? Oh, yeah. Yes. But would he do anything nefarious to get it? Absolutely not. He would also not try to ruin the victory, period. And so what happens is with the Death Watch is everyone wants to be in the Death Watch, but they don't really, but they're not going to overly ever demand to be in it.

So the question is, how do you get someone into the Death Watch? you join the Death Watch by being recommended to it. But it's a process. It's a really cool process of recommendation. It starts with either your lieutenant or your captain, seeing a Marine who just excels in combat against Zenos. So fighting Zenos is step one. They then take that recommendation,

and they actually go to the chapter master and say, I believe Space Marine Ted, I wish they'd name him that, that it's something weird. It's weird Latin. It's funny because Ted then has to go through a physical. Yeah. You're like, hey, man, I'm already a Marine.

You're like, yeah, but. But, and the physical's done by the apothecary. And it's actually kind of cool because I didn't realize this until you're reading about Death Watch. You do get variances in physical ability within space marines. They are, some are bigger, some are stronger, some are faster. So in order. And one of the biggest things is they, They want the guys that heal the fastest.

That is one of the biggest things. They basically do an NFL combine, sorry for those of you who are in the U.S., for these guys to figure out, all right, yes, you're going to killing Zenos, but are you also the peak of physicality? But that's not the cool one. The cool one to me is once your captain lieutenant has signed off and the apothecary has signed off, the next one they send you to is your chaplain. and the chaplain's doing a few really important things. First off, weighing the strength of your character and your soul,

because you're going to be faced with overwhelming odds constantly against genuine horrors of the galaxy. You will fight enslave. It's decently possible you will fight enslave. And the thing is, you also fight against something that maybe no one has ever seen. So it's not even like you can fall back on your teachings, which is a big thing because a lot of these horrors are just, yes, is it something unbelievable, my mind is going to melt,

but you've been taught about it. Being a death watch, yes, you have to be really good at following orders, but you can't be on automaton. You have to be able to say, all right, we're dropping you off in point A, bare grills style. We're dropping you off at point A, you have to get to point B. Well, what's between those two? Not good things.

Stop. Yeah, a lot of horror. How do I get there? Just get there. Yeah. Also, figure out how to take care of the thing that's stopping you. Yeah. The other one, though, which is why I really like that the chaplain has to be there, is the chaplain's also testing the metal of your ability to keep a secret. Which is so crazy because every Space Marine chapter has stuff they don't want.

Yeah, but there's levels to know. Let's say, there's levels to that. There's the Dark Angels, Blood Angels, and even the Spacewell secret is not as bad as those two secret. you know, keep a secret. And then there's the Imperial Fist keep a secret, which is what? Like, sometimes we eat second breakfast. Exactly. Like, it's really not that big of a deal. But they all have to be able to keep absolute secrets.

The irony, and we'll cover this later, is that the death watch is the same thing to them when they leave. So that's an important beast. You have to go into the Death Watch with a ton of secrets. And then you come out of the Death Watch. Because you would tell them there's a real chance of the Dark Angels would show up. Oh, the Dark Angels would absolutely want to go to war with the Death Watch. If they were like, you're doing what?

So much, heresy. What weapons are you using? It's not important. I'm sorry. They work so well. They're incredible. So that being said, though, if the chaplain does give the final check mark, then the Chapter Master makes the final determination.

And, you know, they usually do, obviously. What I like is that the Chapter Master makes a determination. The Marine may not know that there were the Death Watch. for like a year because they have to go find them, pull them off assignment, and then send them over. That, though, is half of the story. Actually, probably, that's why I would say for the army I'm building, that's about two-thirds of the story. The remaining third are the Black Shields, who I like so much more than the regular ones. I, for whatever reason, I just decided to forget those guys existed for a minute.

And they are cool as shit. The Black Shields are even more badass to me. So the Black Shields, and again, Space Marine II covers us pretty well, are people who join the Death Watch not out of honor or pride, but out of redemption. So these are people who, for whatever reason, have gained the eye of suspicion of the Imperium. And unlike penitent engines or other such options, these people are able to then, they're allowed to join a, the Death Watch. The most common scenario of this actually are successor chapters that still fall to chaos. It happens to a common story. And when that happens, not all of them fall.

You'll have a small handful who will stand out. But if your chapter falls, it doesn't matter. You are still tainted. You're tainted. So these are the most common ones to join because these are space marines who oftentimes killed their chapter brought. others because they'd fall into chaos. They're standing and everything about them says this is a loyal servant of the emperor, but what are we going to do about it? So what they do is they join as black shields. And this, by the way, for those of those of you who played Space Marine 2, this is the

backstory for Titus. He fought against chaos, was deemed to have too much contact with the warp in that fight, and no one trusts him. So he joined, he became a black shield. Which also was so trash for Titus because that dude has had no. nothing go right for him ever and he's always been fighting against it and they were like yeah we don't trust you fight against it a little bit too much you're like i've had nothing but shit happened to me and i've been wrecking it from day one so these ones are called black shields and the way you can tell

if someone has painted their army is you'll have on the one shoulder you'll have the the death watch kind of silver on the other shoulder they'll have their normal chapter color if there's no chapter color on another one. They either are painting quickly and didn't want to deal with it, or it's a black shield. It's either way. Which also 75% of Death Watch armies are only Black Shields, apparently. I know. It's something where I'm just, I'm building everywhere from scratch, and I have a lower podcast,

so I'm much more handcuffed. We will definitely give you some shit. Yeah, I'm much more handcuffed on the ability for me to build armies, just being honest. So once you join the Death Watch, what happens? As we said before, you lose all rank or title because you're not organized by that. You, you know, you may have been a space wolf. You may have been an ultramarine. It doesn't matter.

You are now. Well, it's also important because they don't have companies. The Death Watch is not organized into companies. So it's not like Scout Company, First Companies, Terminators, you know, so and so forth. Death Watch has no. So, yeah, you're more often than not, you're going to be sent to your random, fortress somewhere in the galaxy. Some guys go to the main headquarters, but still,

random fortress in the galaxy, and then you just get going. So upon arriving at the base, the Marine embarks on what is basically neophyte training all over again, because they are a new recruit. Yes, they know how to fight, but they know how to fight Xenos as well. So they first, and they are just, I mean, they go on a horrifying course of Xenot technology, and not the Imperial Primer one,

where all the Zenos are weak and pathetic, but like the real one about this is how you can do, here's all the time. They also have some of those weapons there. It does help. It does help. They show you what they're going to be, what they look like,

how they function. Well, they've got some of the Zenos there. They're dead. I mean, I'm assuming there's a very fun taxidermist who works somewhere within the death watch. It's just like,

just stuffing a necrime. It's a big deal, though, because you know exactly what that weapon does. Because that is a marine problem because of heresy, you know, you can't have them. These guys have the weapon there so you can go, this is how

you get around this, this will do this as opposed to going, oh, Timmy just got hit in the face by a web spinner. We should probably know what that does before I get hit in the face. And that's why I love about this. By the time they are coming out of their training, they can identify a Zenos in an instant,

not just by the Zenos, but even the weapon that the Zenos is using. And because, again, these are space means. They're incredible super soldiers. they can also fully recall all the tricks and tactics that work against them. Like, you know, hitting a towel with a blunt object. That'll work. It's all you really need.

So I will say, quick call out to 8th edition, because maybe the best version of Death Watch that ever existed sucked as a Zeno player. And I say that as someone who played Zenos and did not play Death Watch in 8th edition. And even, I'll admit, look, this. sucked, but it was cool as hell. Turning off your abilities, wounding rerolable two. Yeah, so the Death Watch

had abilities in 8th edition to make it so that the necrons couldn't reanimate. Green Tide wouldn't work. The Orcs would just flee, basically, in front of them. Yeah, Tiredons would just kill hive tyrants. Yeah, because you're monstrous. These things that would normally get wounded on the game on a D6

on a 6, got wounded on a 2. Yeah, with high damage. Yes. It was awesome. They would turn up. They also, how did they jacked up, I think how they jacked up Eldar. It was saying they had these goofy ways they could just shut everything down. They could blow up psychers. That's right. Yeah, they could auto kill psychers effectively.

Yeah, it was really cool. Eighth edition really mastered what the Death Watch were. And then people really complained. Like, there were some tournaments that it was basically, just to be honest, how bad these rules were. If you played, and I remember playing Tyrid at this point, if I was a Tyrannid player, and I pulled a Death Watch match, unless my opponent was the dumbest, worst player who's ever existed,

I basically auto lost the game. The problem was, and I think this is not the problem, you know, I'm going to give my quick two cents on this. I love that shit, though. It's awesome. Because they also had zero abilities

that worked against not Xenus. Oh, yeah, they fought a chaos army, and this is when chaos was bad. Chaos would just go, oh, so you just can't do anything. to me? Like none of your weapons work against me. Yeah. No, not really.

All right. So I'm just now you go, I guess I'll move up the board and win. Yeah. You're like, if you were, you sure you don't want to be Zenos? Yeah. Can you change? You sure you got a Zenos. Anyway. So the other part, though, that's actually probably more interesting from a lore standpoint is the way they wage war is totally different. As I said before, the space marines specialize in large scale combat. Layering all offenses to destroy their opponents. So, like, when we got doctrines for space marines, you start your devastating doctrine. So you pound the enemy from a distance.

Then you move into your tactical doctrine where you're using more small arms to fight them and get closer. And then you finally finish them off with your assault doctrine. And you move this way. The Death Watch don't fight like that. They use kill teams. Yeah. And these little kill teams engage all over the place. And the difference is each kill team is a hodgepodge of all of those pieces.

Heavy weapons, combat, small arms. but the kill teams themselves are very specialized for what they're trying to do. Yes, I know, but I'll know what the weaponry they carry. Is that the kill team itself is designed to be, I can drop this kill team somewhere. And whatever's between it and where it has to be, it has at least one to two dudes who can handle that thing. Sure, but they usually, they're in that thing, though, they're still, what are we going to face here? Yeah, it's strategic. Yeah.

It's not a complete hodgepots. It's going to be impossible. Because there's going to be a big difference between an indometer team and a Fordist team where they're going. Yeah, but it's like the current version you can play them. And thanks to the index it's been out for like a month, I can have MELTA and aggressors and heavy intercessors. So it's like, yeah, I'm handling big stuff, but it's that piece of. And we're jumping. We're not giving enough to say what we're saying is you can put together guys that have anti-tank weapons.

Yeah. With guys that have anti-armetry. Yeah. armor and tie, but nothing, but you wouldn't, you're right. You're not putting together a melee guy and a last cannon. Right. Right. So, actually, it's great.

Let's talk about kill teams. Because actually, this is where we're going to. So as it said, from the War of the Beast, the Kill Teams, it was where they, sorry, as we said before, the War of the Beast was the origin of the kill teams. And it was quintessential to how they, they were going to fight their battles. And these original groups, where this came from was actually an accident. when Corland was first forming the first kill teams, as we said, these were made of groups who just been decimated.

So it was three guys left, one guy left of a squad, right? And I'm shoving him with this other squad over there. And you're just trying to put together the most effective of what's left. And then you started coming up with the basis for kill teams. So it was a necessity of what do we have? What goes together out of what is actually? What I love about this is it was done. Again, obviously, I'm as we found out in the Taocast, I'm a massive fan of XCOM, but it's also, D&D is the same thing.

I love parties. Like, I love the old TSR, TSSR, the old Gold Box D&D games. Cold box games are awesome. They were the best. If you guys don't know what I'm talking about, Google it. And if you're under the age of 20, you're going to hate it. I was just about to say it's 35 years ago. Yeah, 35 years ago, it was written for, I mean, these were floppy disk games.

I'll admit the graphics aren't the best. There's not graphics. It's a 2D graphic. But they loved it because you would build a party. And the idea is that anyone who plays a lot, you get your magic user, you get your cleric, you get your warrior, maybe you get an archer, maybe do another war, however it's set up.

That's what these kill teams originally were. You've got a guy who's got more of a heavy weapon, then you've got a guy who's got maybe a lighter weapon, someone who's stealthy, et cetera. or it's a ghost actually fall in this category too. It's why those books are good. And the idea here is that the kill teams

were able with this to be very effective in saying the small areas where they wouldn't draw a lot of attention, but they would achieve a lot of stuff. I love kill teams. You know what? I'm going to let John go off

and a little bit on the kill teams here, but I love the idea of kill teams, these specialized teams. Okay, I'll let John go, as soon as I never stopped talking. I love the idea of these kill teams being specific focused roles that came from just the necessity of what's left and what we can do with them. And this is where I fanbollah on this so hard,

because these space brains function in squads. But usually the space marine squads, they're all kind of the same. Every squad is, okay, these are hell blasters. Everyone, everyone's holding a plasma gun. No, Death Watch went, no, we don't. don't need 10 plasma guns. They want to play the game, you end up over killing with it. More often than that, you actually have too many of one gun than you actually need.

With Death Watch, they went, no, this is how many we're going to need. And also, we're all the best of the best. So we know the guy holding the plasma gun is the best plasma gun guy. We have. And it will not blow up in his face, in theory. In theory. Let's talk about one of my favorite things about this, which is they're the only Imperium period in the game, units that combine armor types.

Yeah. And that's well, all right. I mean, that's a big thing, though. Let's talk about us to a point. Yes. So the cool thing about them is it does make sense. You will actually have Gravis armor, which is Primaris Terminator armor, with standard primaris armor, with some other armors.

Now, we should call out that the laws of physics got a little bit messed up at one point, because I could have a squad that had a biker in it. That drove through a wall. It drove through a wall and was able to move at twice the speed of everyone else and the thing, but everyone just ran faster because he was there. As long as they were close enough to him. Yeah. There was a,

they've had some interesting rules or like, hey, this squad can suddenly drop out of the sky because there's one dude with a jump pack in it. And everybody else doesn't. They're like, no one else has a jump pack. I guess they were holding on. Yeah.

Everybody's holding his feet. Yeah, exactly. As he flies around. I hope that's a good jump pack, man. Exactly. Because we are being, we are being dropped from low orbits. You're playing out of low orbit and one of the five of us has a jet pack. And I'm an aggressor.

I'm like, I'm falling quite quickly. I weigh more than the guy with the jetpack. So some of these things, mistakes were made. Mistakes were made. This has been cleaned up in more than modern era by just the, not a lot of feeling like to have bikes. But these guys are cool. think about it though

you know whether you like it or not outside of the that bit it was a really cool idea they're like the expendables man but that's what I'm saying that's what makes them so cool to me on the tabletop because it's at peace why do I have an aggressor with double with double flame gauntlets sitting here out me out well because I need the meat guy to go through the wall

and burn all the all the jeans that are cults because I'm also with three other guys that have anti-tank weapons that blow up the thing then the guys with the flamers Burned up. Because that's, that's, which is a great example of how they work in the lore. You're right. The guys with the melta guns will open, will then blow open the piece of armor, whatever it is, the falcon.

And then as the fire dragons start pouring out of it, the aggressors are right there to flame it to death. And this is all done within one squad. Obviously, you can't do it. That's not the sequence of operation on the tabletop, but that's not important. I'm going lore. So in the lore, they're freaking awesome. And the stories they have of some of these kill teams in action are, it's everything I've ever wanted to do in D&D campaigns.

That's why I get, this is why I love them so much. That being said with all, with all the pieces, we've talked a lot about the Warriors. There are other people who join the Death Watch. You do have Armors, Apothecaries, chaplains. I have no idea what a, how you come in Death Watch chaplain, by the way. That one's, just given how you become a death watch. Watch, it's like, okay, the Space Marine makes sense.

The apothecary, probably really good at healing Zeno weapons. Got it. The armorer. We know that that's just the best armor because you're going to go work with a fun toys. The chaplain? We also have talked about one of the Death Watch Armors in previous games. They're extremely good. They might be, and I'm not going to, there's a couple chapters that have some pretty damn good artificers.

They do. But Death Watch, well, they're definitely the best at working with shit that you're not supposed to work with. Because they're the only people working with it. But these guys have incorporated Zeno's technology into Imperium weapons that only the Death Watch uses. I wanted to point that out because I do think we'll cover that more than that. Yeah. I'm just saying each team's showing up with stuff that other people don't have access to. So as we discussed before, as we were discussing, the space that you join the.

death watch, you join this kill team, and you're in this massive kind of education program. The thing I love with the Death Watch is that you do it as part of your kill team. So you arrive, you get sent to your barracks, you go to your bunk, and everyone else in that room, that's your kill team. And these guys work together the entire time of their training. This goes back to the story we were just telling. They not only are they masters of whatever weapon they have, they also master what everyone else in the squad does.

They know everyone's speed, everyone's movement, everyone's everything. Where you're going to be. I love that. I love in the lore, Death Watch is pretty cool on the board. But in the lore, I love the fact that they're definitely synergizing. They're way war. The pure movie style combat where one guy, you know, the guy's shooting at his buddy comes in front of him. He stops shooting for that little second that picks up soon as his buddy clears.

So they, they're almost impossible to fight against because it's the idea of, 10 men feel like 100 style. Well, it's a big deal, too. Also, a lot of, and this is why they're so good versus tear nets, for instance, because the hive mine learns how Marines fight, and the Death Watch shows up and completely flips that. It's got to make no sense to the hive tire, by the way. Yeah, the high time is just like, well, the high time is used to, okay, there's Marines

here. We let's let them be there because when the full force arrives, we'll fight them. And now the full force is those eat dudes. Yeah. Yeah. He's lost. Yeah. And also, well, it's obviously, if they've got heavy weapons, then we'll just attack them.

Yeah. If they've got hand-to-hand weapons, they don't have anything to deal with this armor, and they have everything to do with everything. And this is actually a key part of the Death Watch. I mean, candidly, I'm building a Death Watch army. I won't play them very much, the Tabletop. Because on Tabletop, they don't play anywhere as near as gold-go-go-de-law. I wish they could shoot.

I wish Death Watch had a... You can fire half, then fire half again. Yeah, that's why the death watch, because this is the biggest thing about Death Watch. The Death Watch should be, they come in, the Kill Team goes, they actually make more sense in the game Kill Team than they do. Oh, 100%. Well, Ket Team has individual activations for each and every guy.

And that's where they excel in that. Yeah. Kill Team Death Watch is on. They're amazing. But also in the lore, they've got way more skills. So we're talking about a tabletop game. Okay, this guy's got a plasmine on this guy. It's a bolter. this guy. It's a heavy bolter this guy. In the lore, this guy is a master of stealth. This guy can

hack. This guy has language decryption. This guy is an explosives expert. And they come through, and this is how in the lore, they just fight through almost anything. Because again, it's more story. They really do nail some of these stories. And as you guys can hear me fanboying a lot. It's because in my mind, in the lore, I think they're the best example of what I believe a space brain should be. I find a lot of the space marine lore to be, you know, just large scale combat, everyone's shooting everybody. Which guard does better. Yeah. The Death Watchers are better. The Death Watch stories are like, no, these super soldiers get to be super soldiers. They get to be super soldiers. And they also get to use all of their, I do like a lot of the Death Watch stories

because you get them being super smart also. Yeah, that's exactly. They are, it's a, I keep using this phrase over in point A, point B. The Death Watch are, given a you have to be it's actually or video game ask you have to go achieve this objective it is over there we're going to put you right here how do i get there figure it out we've never been there before there's you know it's it's i mean in video gaming it's having to go from one point of the map to the point of that but you don't have a map well to find your way to death watch make way more sense than anybody else in the games to be honest oh yeah so they are to be fair that's they are absolutely kick ass and i love it.

them and actually know this is actually a good spot to break because of where we're going to go in the i like i like that i really i'm thinking about that death watch play better in video games than they do on the tabletop yeah not even close also that that's where they belong they belong in a video game setting they belong in a d and d setting yeah it's because 100% because they do have to hack they have me the death watch for example would be sent in to go and disable like they're who you would send a enemy in placement. I mean, that's one of the best stories. They got, they, they did Independence Day to Necrons on in the

That story. We're going to do that story next time. That is one of my favorite stories that they did. They went in and they ruined the place and took off. But it is a piece of like if you're sitting there, you got an invasion and for whatever, you know, whatever reason you've got orbital guns that are shooting up at you, the death watch are the ones you'd send down there to disable the orbital guns and not because the truth is we could, I can try to blow it up from space, but I can't.

So the Death Watch ones will have to infiltrate, you know, the facility, fight their way to it and blow the gun up from the inside a la Star Wars. At a name your cool movie, it's the Death Watch you would do that. Everyone else is saving Private Ryan. I mean, they're totally the expendables. Yeah, but I just hate that movie. I know, but that is 100% what they are. That's why everything made the reference.

I've just given you silence as a result of it because it's a terrible. You know it's so apt, though. Yeah, I just don't want it to be. I mean, sure, but it's totally accurate. It's predator. Because it's way better, minus the losing to the predator thing. Yeah, I was just about to say. The one predator, two of them out pretty bad.

Think about it, you've got Jesse the body Ventura with his mini gun for no reason. You know what you're going to do? Whatever the dude was with a knife who was kind of native. You know what you're going to be with it? It's no racist. You're going to be, you're going to be, he's a crazy person by the way. in real life. Instead of predator, you should go with Oceans 11 then.

No combat in Oceans 11. They punched like one guy. I guess that. Or maybe they got punched either way. But that's, this again is why I fanboy so hard on Death Watch because Tabletop, they've had some fun rules and we'll cover some more of them in the next episode about good God, some of those armored. Oh, I'm going to shoot you with Hellfire rounds. I'll just pick my models up.

So anyway, we hope today was informative and fun and that you'll join us next week for more on The Death Watch. Until then, this has been John Barcati and Bradchester. This guy. See you then.