The Blindboy Podcast - Jim Sheridan

Episode Date: September 1, 2021

A Chat with Jim Sheridan, a multi Oscar nominated director and screenwriter from Dublin. We talk about the process of film making and when he took 50 Cent for pints in Sherrif Street Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome to the Blind Boy Podcast, you jaundiced anyas. If you're a brand new listener, I suggest listening to some previous episodes. If you're a regular listener, you know the crack. It's September 1st. It's September 1st. The reliable misery of winter awaits. And I'm feeling alright about it, because I don't think we're going to see another lockdown this winter.

So... So what? Fuck it. Bit of cold weather. I can go to the gym and I can get a pint if I want. This week I have a smashing interview for you with the director and screenwriter Jim Sheridan. And we had tremendous crack. I'm going to play that for you in a while. Before I do that, I, So there's this short story. It's the shortest short story ever written. And it's attributed to Ernest Hemingway.

But people don't know if it's definitely Ernest Hemingway or not. But it's the shortest short story ever written. And this is it. For sale. Baby shoes. Never worn. And that's magnificent it's fantastic because it's only six words but it's a short story because the story didn't happen in those words that you read it happened in in the possibilities of your own mind for sale baby, baby shoes, never worn. I'm not going to get into the many possible

reasons why a pair of baby shoes that were never worn are for sale, but the multitude of different directions that you can take that in, that's the beauty of that short story it's it's written by the person reading it you know such a small amount of information can tell so much about the story about the setting about the characters it can tell so much and that little short story sometimes so sometimes algorithmic adverts remind me a bit of that short story now what I mean by Algorithmic Adverts is do you know when you're reading a website usually a news website

Sky News is particularly bad for it RTE News can be bad for it so let's just say you you read a news article on Sky News and then you've finished reading the article and you go to the very bottom of the page and there's a bunch of things that look like news articles but they're not news articles they're actually very weird adverts and those adverts that are at the bottom of a legitimate

news page those fake news articles they are customized for you. They're algorithmically generated depending on what you search for or what your age is or what your gender is. Basically, the data that your internet browser or your phone gets from you using it, your phone gets from you using it, it feeds this to these algorithmically generated adverts and then a little profile of you is generated by algorithmic ads. And sometimes it can actually paint a very unflattering picture of you. Like for instance, as soon as I turned 30, there was like fake news articles at the bottom of Sky News

saying men in Limerick are trying this solution for their impotency and then I'm like what the fuck who says I'm fucking impotent who says I can't get erections and I'm now getting angry with a fake fucking algorithmically generated

article at the bottom of Sky News for making the assumption that I can no longer get erections. Because when I was like 29, the adverts were for like fast fashion or for protein powder. And now all of a sudden it's talking to me about floppy mickeys.

And if impotency, if you live with impotency, no shame. Isn't it great that we live in an era where there are pills that fix it and it's not fucking 1980s with the cock ring it's just I'm a human being

if my computer thinks I've got impotency I'm gonna go what's that about why do you think that should I be worried about impotency what do you know that I don't know because you're the computer and the reason it's so insulting is like

I wasn't googling I don't know? Because you're the computer. And the reason it's so insulting is like, I wasn't Googling. I wasn't typing into the internet. I'm impotent. I wasn't looking for Viagra or Cialis or whatever you're selling me. I wasn't looking for them. Why are you making this assumption about me? And usually what it is,

is it's just your age, your gender and what other people with similar interests that are your age and your gender and in your location are looking for, and you get lumped in with that. But every so often, I'd be scrolling at the bottom of Sky News or RTE, and there's a collection of adverts together. And they work like that Ernest Hemingway short story, in that they visually describe a character. And more often than not,

I don't like the character that it's describing. And what's even worse is it's supposed to be describing me because it's algorithmically generated to target me. And this week in particular, I had a very upsetting collection of fucking algorithmically generated ads so I clicked some article on Sky News this week

probably something that was breaking news finished reading it went to the bottom of the page and there were six separate adverts disguised as news articles that are algorithmically generated to target me so the first one

doctor reveals natural remedy for painful joints. Okay, that's accurate. That's accurate. I've got sore knees from running and I do search on Google quite a lot for solutions to my sore knees and exercises. Okay, you got me. I'm still not clicking on it

because I know it's a fucking bullshit link. But you got me there. Then the second one turkey's hair transplants might be the solution to your hair loss now nothing against anyone

who's experiencing baldness but I'm not going bald I'm not going to go bald no one in my family is bald I don't think about baldness I don't google baldness

the fuck why does my algorithm think I'm bald, then doctors are baffled, this is what detoxification through the feet looks like, okay why the fuck does my algorithm think I need a detox, and I clicked on that one and that was all about liver and alcohol and I'm like, I haven't drank in ages. I don't Google that much about drinking. I'm certainly not worried about drinking so much that it affects my liver. Why does the algorithm think I have a drink problem? Then it's like the other ad, UK doctor.

It's like it vacuums out your digestive problems. So that advert thinks I have an ulcer. Then there's another advert. Top solicitors in Ireland 2021. See the list. Now my algorithm thinks I have legal problems. And then the final one. Is Minecraft educational for kids?

And I thought that was the odd one out. I thought that was the odd one out. But then it started to paint a much darker picture this character that my algorithm thinks that I am my algorithm thinks that I have children who I don't parent and they're just on Minecraft

playing Minecraft all day and I don't communicate with them I don't attend to their needs I just leave them on Minecraft and the algorithm thinks I need an article that tells me it's okay because who needs an article that says is Minecraft educational for kids?

A parent who's worried about how much Minecraft their kids are using but doesn't want to take any responsibility for it. So like that Hemingway short story uses six words to describe this entire life, this, a person

or a scenario. My algorithmically generated ads at the bottom of my Sky News article were now painting a picture but it was, it was quite insulting because I'm like,

why the fuck does my algorithm think this of me? So my algorithm this week thinks that I'm like why the fuck does my algorithm think this of me? So my algorithm this week thinks that I'm a balding, unattentive parent with stomach ulcers, a drink problem, sore knees and legal problems. Now my heart goes out to you

if that's what you're dealing with but it's not an accurate portrayal of my life. So I started to get worried because I'm like what the fuck is up with my algorithm I haven't googled any of this shit I haven't been looking for solicitors I haven't been typing baldness I haven't been talking about it Minecraft what the fuck what's going on with my algorithm and I started to get a little bit paranoid thinking what if someone else is using my IP address on my computer or what if I'm getting hacked and some other person is googling things on my behalf and this is influencing my algorithm and I couldn't figure it out and then I realized I bought a barbecue online a week ago and it arrived damaged

and then I asked them to replace the damaged part and the replacement arrived damaged so then I've been having these heated arguments via email with an online barbecue company to the point that I'm threatening them with legal action so the algorithm has been privy to the data of these emails because I'm typing them in using Google Chrome and the algorithm just

made these wild assumptions about who I am the algorithm just said this prick's pissed off all week about a fucking barbecue and he's threatening legal action what a wanker because the algorithm knows my age and my gender so it's just basically going okay What a wanker. Because the algorithm knows my age and my gender.

So it's just basically going, okay, cunty here is so angry about a barbecue that he's threatening legal action. So, how much is the barbecue? Says the algorithm, 250 quid. Fuck off, you sad cunt. He doesn't have a solicitor. And what is a Kamado barbecue for 250 quid? Sure, they're a thousand euros minimum. And this fella thinks. And what is a Kamado barbecue for 250 quid? Sure, they're a thousand euros minimum.

And this fella thinks that he can get a Kamado barbecue for 250 quid and not get ripped off? Fucking idiot. He doesn't have a solicitor. Anyone who threatens legal action over 250 euro barbecue does not have a solicitor. He's talking out of his arse. So he's going to need a list. A fake list of Ireland's best solicitors because he won't know the difference anyway he's talking out of his hole

also I assume that he's also bald so he's also bald or going bald and that's why he's so angry then the anger is leading him to have drink problems that's why he's so angry. Then the anger is leading him to have drink problems, that's why he needs a detox. Then the stress of the drinking too much alcohol and being bald is

causing him to have stomach ulcers. And then the most crushing assumption about me of all, any man who's dealing with all this must also be a bad parent. This man has 10-year-old children and he's so angry and drunk that they just play Minecraft all day long and he doesn't communicate with them. And this man needs an article to tell him that Minecraft is actually educational and it's okay.

And, like, is the algorithm being creative here? Is the algorithm intelligent? Is it guessing? No. How it works is it collates data. So all the other men my age who are using the internet and giving their data to the internet. To feed these advertising algorithms. So all these other men are doing this too. And the algorithm has basically. Found out that.

Men who. Threaten legal action. Over broken barbecues. Tend to also have these qualities. And now I've been lumped in as this one persona this one persona and you know what it made me want to do? it made me want to back off

and let those rats those barbecue rats get away with selling me faulty goods because the algorithm had shamed me the algorithm had shamed me. The algorithm had shamed me and painted a portrait of me

that I wasn't happy with. I didn't like seeing that. Like a shit version of the picture of Dorian Gray. So that's been my week. An incredibly pathetic week but I just want a fucking refund I want a refund on principle it's not right

it's not right to fucking buy a barbecue to have it sent broken and then for the replacement to be broken because they can't package it properly I just want a refund

and they're making that whole process really difficult for me they're making it incredibly difficult the replacement to be broken because they can't package it properly i just want a refund and they're making that whole process really difficult for me they're making it incredibly difficult i have to send a barbecue to amsterdam i bought it in an irish website at dot ie and i have to send it back to amsterdam to get my 250 quid back and i know that they've done this because they go he's not going to go through with this and we're just going to keep his 250 quid and and I know that they've done this because they go he's not going to go through with this and we're just going to keep his 250 quid and he's going to be stuck with a shit Kamado BBQ

and no way I'm just going to have to be a difficult angry da about it and make them facilitate the return of the BBQ and give me my money back and it is entirely my own fault I wanted a Kamado BBQ they're fantastic

they're like outdoor ovens but they're very expensive they're minimum a thousand euro and I'm not spending a thousand euro on a fucking BBQ so Big Egypt clicks on the oh 250 quid wow look at me

gaming the system clever boy but you know what on the oh 250 quid wow look at me gaming the system clever buy but you know what play stupid games and you win stupid prizes and I won a bent Dutch barbecue so this week's podcast

isn't about faulty barbecues I interviewed the filmmaker and director Jim Sheridan who is an absolute legend and has made some incredible films

I urge you to check out what would be the two best Jim Sheridan films to check out In the Name of the Father with Daniel Day-Lewis and Pete Postlethwaite

incredible film and also The Field with Richard Harris and John Hurt with Daniel Day-Lewis and Pete Postlethwaite. Incredible film. And also The Field with Richard Harris and John Hart. Me and Jim had this conversation at a live socially distanced podcast that I did a couple of weeks ago. It was my first live gig in nearly two years where it's weird when you listen to it

you can't hear the audience, because it was a socially distanced audience, so they were in this huge field, 400 people, all spaced out on tables, but it was a really enjoyable day, and an enjoyable interview, and we speak about a bunch of shit,

like, Jim also directed the, biopic, of the rapper 50 Cent's life, so I have some great chats with Jim about him bringing 50 Cent for pints in Dublin. Jim also recently made a documentary that a lot of people spoke about a true crime documentary for Sky about the horrific murder of Sophie Toscane du Plantier in West Cork and Jim's documentary is called Murder at the Cottage.

And it was released simultaneously to another documentary about the same situation that Netflix released. So we speak a bit about that as well. But before I get into that interview, I'd like to do the Ocarina pause because I don't want to interrupt the interview. I want to leave the interview play completely because we had a really good chat we spoke about the process of filmmaking as well it's good crack, very enjoyable and Jim was

lovely, so here's the ocarina pause where you're going to hear an algorithmically generated advert depending upon things you google search for and hopefully it won't insult you. Will you rise with the sun to help change mental health care forever?

Join the Sunrise Challenge to raise funds for CAMH, the Centre for Addiction and Mental Health to support life-saving progress in mental health care. From May 27th to 31st, people across Canada will rise together and show those living with mental illness and addiction that they're not alone.

Help CAMH build a future where no one is left behind. So, who will you rise for? Register today at sunrisechallenge.ca That's sunrisechallenge.ca On April 5th, you must be very careful, Margaret. That's sunrise mark of the devil. Hey! Movie of the year.

It's not real. It's not real. What's not real? Who said that? The First Omen. Only in theaters April 5th. That was the Ocarina Pause. You would have heard an advert.

I don't know what for because it depends on what you search for. All right? Support for this podcast comes from you, the listener, via the Patreon page. advert I don't know what for because it depends on what you search for all right um support for this podcast comes from you the listener via the patreon page patreon.com forward slash the blind by podcast this podcast is my full-time job this podcast is how I earn a living um I've got significant legal fees over a dispute about a barbecue I don't I'm not fucking suing anyone over a barbecue but if you consume this podcast frequently

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that have massive financial backing follow me on Instagram, Blind By Boat Club catch me on Twitch once a week, twitch.tv forward slash the blind by podcast Thursday nights at half eight so without further ado here is the chat that I had

with the wonderful film maker and screenwriter Jim Sheridan do you want a mic stand Jim are you happy to hold the mic up which do you prefer well I don't have control of your arms so which would make you more comfortable, Jim? Yeah, I think I'm okay with holding it.

You brought your own Bluetooth speaker. I did. What's that for? That's for playing you a clip if you want to hear it. Okay, yeah. Okay. Yeah. Very fucking well prepared.

So, Jim Sheridan, I didn't get to introduce you properly, Jim. You're a director and a screenwriter. You've made such classics as The Field, The Boxer, In the Name of the Father, My Left Foot. And so an absolute legend,

an absolute legend. I'm going to take off my hat, Jim, because it's out of respect and also because it's incredibly hot under the sun. It is, yeah. I wasn't expecting this heat. It's better than rain, though, isn't it? Yeah! So, Jim, I want to chat to you about what's your process

of beginning when you're screenwriting something or directing what's your process, what makes you want to start a story It's hard, you know you never know entirely

what makes you want to do it, you know, and sometimes, like, I'd start with this story that I hated lawyers and solicitors and barristers, and so I found one guy who was a solicitor, and I liked him, and he had an idea for a script. So I said, yeah, well, I'll try to get to like one solicitor. So what's it about? And he said, it's about Standing Bear the Indian. And that started out just like as a courtroom drama

to understand the first civil rights case in America certainly involving Native Americans but probably the first ever and Judge Dundee was asked whether the Indian could be admitted to court under habeas corpus

and the prosecution said, no, he couldn't because he was a savage and not human. And he wanted to bury his son back in the... What year was this, Jim, when they were saying that? 1868. And he wanted to bury his son.

So it started out as a small story, and then as I started to write it, it kind of has legs, if you know what what I mean and you start getting interested in it and I wouldn't really consider myself like a writer in the normal sense you know I'm much more like a storyteller yeah and so I have to find a story and every time start, I end up back with the same story. And this is just a new version of it. What's the essence of a good story for you, Jim? What are you looking for a good story?

I'm looking for something that kind of hurts me a bit. That, you know, what I mean is that I could get exposed by making it and I then know that, yeah, this has potential damage and I better get it right. Do you mean damage as in what it could do to the outside or internally, your own emotions? Probably I mean initially outside. Okay. I'm not that... Yet my own emotions I don't know. I think like I'm now older, but I do think I still have a great degree of rage, you know what I mean?

And I only notice this when you press one of five or six buttons, you know? And then I'll just fucking go off. So rage is a motivating factor for you, something that would anger you? Yeah. Let's take, for instance, an incredible film in the name of the father.

Yeah. And you made that, was that about 92, 93? Yeah. Like, what was it like? That must have stirred a lot of shit, because that was at a time where politically, if you did anything

that looked sympathetic towards Ireland, you would have been savaged to bits. What was that like, the process of making that film? And why did you want to make it? What was it about the story of the Guildford Four that you said, I need to make this a fucking huge film? You why did you want to make it? What was it about the story of the Guilford Four that you said, I need to make this a fucking huge film?

You know, it's kind of... It's weird in that I didn't want to make the Guilford Four or the Birmingham Six as a movie because I thought the names themselves were dehumanizing, turning people into numbers. And I was never that interested in that type of story.

So when Terry George said it to me, I was like, oh, I don't know. Four characters, we have to follow the whole four of them. It's too complicated. And then he said, well, Jerry Conlon's father was put in the prison. I was like, bang, the light went off. Because father-son story really appealed to me. jerry conlon's father was put in the prison i was like bang the light went off because i father son story really appealed to me and so i start following that and just focusing it down to a father son story you know and making it was fairly easy until we went to England, and there it was difficult, especially

when we were doing the explosion. And everybody was so fucking nervous that, you know, the scene... Because you essentially have a load of Irish people in London saying, we want to make a bomb today, but it's one of the good ones. Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's, it's, it's, it's only a make-believe bomb, but it could kill you. Yeah, and there might be a real one around the corner later on, but it wasn't us.

Yeah, and so, you know, what happened was the policeman, the head of the police, started giving me, you know, like, you have to be finished by 11 or there's a night shoot and I was like well that's going to be hard well you have I repeat you know you have to be finished so everybody got nervous they set the bomb and then they forgot oh for fuck's sake they forgot that we hadn't done the shot where the people entered the pub. So I knew we're going to blow the fucking set up and we haven't done the one shot we need. So the cop was like, no, well, you can't do that. So I just said, well, here's the situation.

That bomb is now set and I would advise everybody to stand back a mile so you became in that moment the IRA you're phoning in the warning except you're doing it as you to the head of the police I am, I'm doing it right to them saying unless you stand back

somebody could get injured and while they were standing back I sent in a fella to defuse it. And then I did the shot and then we blew the place up. Fucking hell! And

are you glad that you, because I was looking at The Irishman by Martin Scorsese recently, and they'd used, in my opinion, just far too much Because I was looking at The Irishman by Martin Scorsese recently. And they'd used, in my opinion, just far too much digital stuff. Like there's a scene where they broke a window. And they fucking did it digitally. It's like, come on, it's a Netflix project.

You can break a fucking window. Are you glad that you got to do the spectacle of pyrotechnics and actually blowing something up rather than digital. How do you feel about that? That's a very interesting question. It goes to the heart of... This might take me a minute or two to explain. Do you mind that? It's a live podcast.

We're here to chat and these people are here chilling out. I'm sure it'll be grand. So do you remember 24 frames a second? Yeah. Well that was Trompe l'oeil, yeah? It was basically the ability to fool you that what you were watching was

reality. But between each frame, there was a small, like the top of this bottle was a small piece of film that was blank. So when you watched a movie back in the old 24 frames the second day, you were watching approximately 10 to 15 minutes of black, of trance. And it was very relaxing if you're old enough to remember film.

And if you put an ad in that little part there saying buy popcorn or diet coke, the place was packed out by... It was long enough that you could do subliminal advertising? You could do subliminal advertising and so subliminally you were seeing the darkness, seeing the trance, seeing the... And it's relaxing on the eye.

Now, when they got rid of that, just before I come to that, film is essentially a spiritual engagement which nobody ever talks about, but I come back on that. But when you replaced the 24 frames with pixels, it's much easier to change the surface. So now you can have fellas flying over the stage and doing all sorts of cartoonish stuff.

But the consequence is that the audience know it's not real and they know they don't have to believe it so their belief system gets crashed and they move into an area of not believing any fucking thing they see and that's a tragedy and it's not talked about. And so that then extends further into the internet and fake news and lack of trust. But spiritually, when a movie starts, you're watching it as if it contradicts your beliefs, you'll reject it. So nobody in England is going to go and see In the Name of the Father. And nobody in America is going to see a Scorsese movie or a black movie in the red states. And that's been true for 100 years.

So those European movies I made never got seen in the flyover states because their belief system rejected European movies and rejected Scorsese, any Italian, any Catholic priest. They were make my day, you know. They're in Clint Eastwood, revenge, make my day. Yeah. So I said to the studios one day, why don't you send me to one of these places? They go, we never go, right? Now, I then did a bit of research and the man who was the most,

the biggest cinema distributor, filmmaker in the early 30s was an Irish man called Joe Kennedy. And he understood from the ledger, because he was obsessed with figures, that the English movies and the French movies, comedies were dead. They didn't travel.

And comedy never travels, which is the problem. And he then had a system, he understood that the only English movies that really performed were Merchant Ivory type, you know? Royal Family, Poshfrocks, Big Houses.

And so when he was stopped being president by Roosevelt, he asked for the job in the court of St. James. Was he related to President Kennedy? His father. Wow! Yeah.

And when he got to the court of St. James, they said, well, the system is you walk in. Sorry, the king comes in. He's there. You walk into the church you come forward and he engages you with the sword has been the ambassador and joe kennedy said i have a slight problem with that and and the guy said what's that he said i i can't take my hat off to another man. I only take my hat off in church. And the English were crazy. They hated him. And what he was doing was figuring out how the whole thing worked. So he was obsessed with the way that the royalty and they established this. Americans in the

red states and in every state are upward mobile. They're not democratic at heart. None of us are. We all love Princess Di and the wedding and the whole thing. So he understood to get past the Catholicism that he had to make Camelot for the president. So he ran the presidency as a...

He ran the attempt to be president for JFK as a movie with a princess and a prince. Wow. And the whole thing bypassed Catholicism. He would never have got elected without it. So you're saying that Kennedy took the narrative that suits these red states

fed that narrative and then all of a sudden they're no longer looking at an Irish Catholic who they'd never vote for he took it from royalty he took it from the movies wow and it's still true to this day, you know.

But that thing you were saying earlier, you were saying that films have lost their spectacle. We don't believe in the spectacle anymore. You mentioned there the Trump de Lille. How do you pronounce it? I think it's Trompe l'oeil. Who speaks French?

Trompe l'oeil. Trompe l'oeil. The earliest films that people went I think it's Tramp Lai. Is that how you... Who speaks French? Fool the eye, yeah. Fool the eye. Tramp Lai. The earliest films that people went to see in the cinema were like one of the first ones. A train was coming towards the camera and people literally left the cinema. They couldn't believe it. They thought they were going to get crushed by a train.

Are you saying that cinema has lost that capacity and because of this, storytelling is more difficult? I think that it's a belief system. So, when you're doing a fiction, the belief bar is here.

And when you're doing a documentary, the belief bar is here. Yeah. Which is why they put people in documentaries out of focus and all. Mm-hmm. So they're saying it is him

but it's not him. Mm-hmm. And that's fucking ancient. Stupid. So I was doing this documentary recently and what I wanted to do which I couldn't do

because of COVID I wanted the actors to be the investigators of the murder. Is this the murder at the cottage documentary you made for Sky? Yeah. Yeah. And so I had somebody playing like Ian Bailey in Jewels.

And it's amazing that I did one, the only scenes I got to do were two or three, but I did the scene where Ian Bailey was arrested and he comes in in handcuffs into his partner's house. He lived in a separate studio and he shows the handcuffs like a victim and I'm like, oh, Ian, because he's there. I said, why is the other police car there because I just staged it as it happened and he was kind of like

I don't know and so I go to Jules and I say Jules, why is the other police car there and she says because they're arresting me and I go to Ian and I say Ian did you you've told me this five times and you never said they were arresting Jules at the same time.

And he goes, oh, were they arresting you? And she goes, yeah. And he was so in his world that he didn't notice that his partner was being arrested. So then I said, okay, okay. And then I said, and Jules, remember, you went and took the photographs which disappeared. The first piece of evidence that disappeared was the first photograph taken of the scene. So she took a photograph and I said, so we got a camera. It's from the 90s.

So is that your camera? Was it like that? She goes, no. I turned to the production designer, who's a brilliant designer, Derek, and I go, Derek, I asked you to get the fucking camera. He goes, I did, I asked such and such. We went to the person who asked, who had asked Ian Bailey, what was the camera, did they have the camera? He said, no.

Jules says, I do have it. So she ran up and got it and she had a lens that lent. So everybody had portrayed her as an amateur camera person who didn't take the right shot. But it's only when you get into

the remake and you're walking like you're literally in the boots of the accused or the killer or whoever that you begin to understand on a level that you can't understand by the brain you know you have to engage your whole body in a search for the truth which is what actors do so actors tell lies to find the truth legal people tell the truth to hide lies yeah and so the the case of this murder case is a case where hundreds of legal documents and statements are all in effect hiding lies and i just thought that I could find some road to the truth

by crossing, blurring the line between fiction and documentary. And I'm going to go back and make another version which will be that, which I hope ends up... Yeah, why are you making a second one? A lot of people were asking me that on the internet. Why are you making a second documentary about that murder of people were asking me that on the internet. Why are you making a second documentary

about that murder down in West Cork? Well, you know, it might be that I'm not able to actually make it because I have to go on and do something else, but I will have people filming stuff and it's mostly made in the edit. So the reason I'm doing that is the case is still open.

It's still an ongoing murder investigation. Yeah. And seeing that the Irish police can't ask any questions in France, I will. And seeing that... Okay. And seeing that the French have decided that it's over, they're not going to ask questions.

Yeah. So in effect, it's become a situation where it's convenient to have this eccentric guy as the named killer, you know? Mm-hmm. I just want to take it back to your earliest career, Jim. guy as the named killer, you know? I just want to take it back to your earliest career, Jim. You're from Sheriff Street, you are? I am, yeah. What was it like?

A lot of the questions that I got asked on the internet when I said I was going to have you on is people talking about nowadays how difficult it would be to get into cinema if you don't come from a background of huge into cinema if you don't come from a background of huge wealth or if you don't have relatives who are already in in the industry what was it like for you coming coming out of sheriff's streets and like becoming a director

what was your your initial processes well that's a very interesting question and i would agree with that in many ways, you know. That it's, in England, Ireland's bad enough. In England, if you don't go to Oxford or Cambridge, you have no chance. Oh, yeah, yeah. So the whole system is over there, is run by that kind of club. And, you know know essentially American cinema is a lot of rich people because really people who are ambitious wouldn't be going into film to make money. Joe Kennedy left

it he said there was no money in cinema so he started the mercantile bank which is bigger than this park in Chicago. And, you know, I was from, so Sheriff Street and Seville Place meet at the church, which is there. It's like a triangle. And I was in Seville Place, and my parents had a lodging house. And so, like, I met everybody before I was 14.

Like, every lunatic from every culture, every, you know, everybody from the north of Ireland. The whole lot stayed in their house. Yeah. everybody from the north of Ireland the whole lot stayed in their house and that was very interesting to me on a just understanding people level Sheriff Street

was kind of like a place where you know you'd have a kid I remember on Monday you got brawn or something and on Friday you got brawn or something, and on Friday you got jam,

and on Wednesday you got a currant bun and a little bottle of milk, and I hated the milk. But I loved the currant bun on the Wednesday, and it was the only thing I ate. Yeah. So sometimes you wouldn't get the currant bun because there might be 42 and there's 48 in the class.

And one day, I was coming home and I can't remember why I said to the kid, I hate those curtain buns. And I used to put the Sambos in my bag. Yeah. And this kid said, have you got... I said, yeah, I have the jam. That was from Friday.

And he said, oh, give me the jam. And I gave it to him. He ate two weeks of sandwiches. And they were like cardboard, the last two he was eating. And I realized how fucking hungry he was. You know what I mean? Okay, yeah. And so that were the, but in our house,

so long as you could get your hand on the plate before the lodgers, you were well fed. So we were kind of the well-off people from Sheriff Street. But I had to, like, fight Jojo Martin and people like that. And you had to learn how to defend yourself in a way, you know? But at what point did you say to yourself, I wouldn't mind making films? I was about 16 or 17. Rewind that question a little bit.

The first film I saw that I had control over was Shane. Because in the place I lived until I was 10, Abercorn Road, there was a Protestant church. And the roof, there were holes in the roof and there were pigeons in the church. Yeah. And I remember going in and seeing these pigeons all over the prod church and they were pooing everywhere.

And I was like, the prods definitely are the devil you know like you just thought this is what happens in all protestant churches they close the doors well they've got a fucking eagle on the altar so you would assume they'd then let all the pigeons in and they shit everywhere and then maybe the eagle comes to life and kills them or something

if you don't know what a protestant church is and and so they were having a benefit to repair the roof. And I was not going to that because I knew I couldn't contribute to the devil. But my friend Anto said, But Cheryl, it's only sixpence in and it's tenpence into the fucking strand. And our monetary decision overcame our morals. And we went down and paid sixpence in. And me and Antho sat watching Shane.

And what was Shane? Was that it? That wasn't Clint Eastwood, was it? No, it was a cowboy movie. Oh, yeah, yeah. But the projector was in the aisle. And the projector kept breaking. And the film fell on the floor.

And they kept repairing it. Then they got fed up. And they couldn't repair it. And they decided they were going to do a little show. So they all put on blackface and they were all like this and then they all turned around with the blackface and i was like i'm in hell and they had an operation on a man on a table and they just make up a show yeah they made up a show so you went to a protestant church that had a broken roof with pigeons inside in it.

Then they decide, we're going to show Shane so that we can pay for it. Shane doesn't work because the projector's broken. And then they go, fuck, we better put on a show. Yeah. And it's a black and white minstrel show where someone's receiving an operation. Yeah.

Go on. And they pulled this guy's heart out. even an operation. Yeah. Go on. And they pulled this guy's heart out. And his heart was an alarm clock that went off. And they he jumped up off the table and they chased him around the table

like in a Bruegel painting. Yeah. But they could never catch him and I fainted and I was carried out and I knew the power of theater then fuck Wow and I knew too that film was fake yeah you know because I could see the projector and everything, and the magic was gone. Why did you go into, like, film and not theatre? No, I first went into theatre. And did you ever head down to, like, the Abbey when you were a young fella?

Yeah. Because that's not too far from Sheriff Street. Did you ever, like, decide to go down there and see what was on? I went to the Abbey school when i was 18 of acting okay and we had a teacher there who was a complete genius and he was from chicago and he was a filmmaker in france and he gave up film to come and teach in the Abbey. And his name was Frank Dermody. And his first lesson to us was he had an upright piano. And he got up on the piano and he lay on it.

And he said, you see, I am totally relaxed. Every bone in my body. Wait. And for 48 minutes, he'd tip, tip, tip, tip, tip, until he fell off the piano. And he stood up and he said, you see, I didn't hurt myself. I was totally relaxed.

Go home. What was he trying to show you? Deep relaxation and not giving a fuck when you're on stage. When did that make becoming a filmmaker then seem something... What was the moment for you where you were like, I can fucking try this. This thing I want, I reckon I can try that. Well, you know, I always wanted to make the films,

but in the theatre, I would do shows that were very filmic and I got trapped in doing that you know um like from I was 19 until you know for 20 years I was doing theater and theatre and I had like people like Neil Jordan and Vinnie McGee and it was only in 81, I mean I was 31 I went to do a film course because I was, I wanted to

move into movies but I didn't know if I was any good at it, you know, yeah Is it true that you took the rapper 50 Cent for pints in Dublin? Yeah. Yeah. What? So you directed the biopic 50 Cent Get Rich or Die Trying?

Yeah. You went on the lash with 50 Cent in Dublin? I did, you know. Can we hear about that, man? Yeah. 50 was a great laugh. But I tell you, the most... Some of the...

So I suddenly found myself, like, telling Dr. Dre what to do. So I'm, Dre, could you do that again? What drew you towards that project? Because I think the maddest thing about that film when we heard about it was like, what, Jim Sheridan's directing The 50 Cent by Opik?

Yeah. What? How the fuck did that happen? I always loved rap. And, yeah. I remember this kid from America in Trinity. And he used to do this rap song. And I wasn't that good.

I had a band, but I couldn't really sing. Yeah. But I could kind of talk, you know? Yeah. So this was my favorite song because I could say it, you know? Yeah. So this was my favorite song because I could say it, you know? Yeah. And it was Oscar Brown Jr.

Did you ever hear to him? No. I could do the first verse, yeah? Go on. It's a hard one to do now because you really can get embarrassed. Give me a clap there. It's a hard one to do now because you really can get embarrassed.

Give me a clap there. I've always lived by this golden rule. Whatever happens, don't blow your cool. You got to have nerves of steel. And never show folk how you honestly feel. I lived my whole life this way. For example, take yesterday. I breezed home happy bringing her my pay.

Her note read, so long, Sappy, I've run away. I true myself down across our empty bed. And this is what I said. Thank you. Oh, fucking fantastic, Jim. That was fantastic. And what... Tell us about 50 Cent in Dublin, please. Well, you know, he was on in the pint and he was staying in some hotel

and I brought him down Sherrifer you know and you know Sherrifer was exact same as where he's from in Queens and he totally got it you know we really got on like he used to tell me I was his da you know

and that came about because of an event. Not that much happened in Shedderford, you know, other than we had a few gargles and all the kids. And Gemma Dunleavy's sister was there. Oh, yeah, Gemma, yeah. Getting her... Yeah, she's great, isn't she?

Fantastic. Yeah, she's great, isn't she? Fantastic. And so we were shooting in Toronto, and like 50 wasn't that well known in Toronto. He was the biggest star in America. He'd just done In the Club. Find me in the club, bottle full of booze. And he, when he would get back to

New York, he would get $800 in singles, $100 in tens and a $100 bill. And he put the $100 in tens and a $100 bill and he put the $100 bill in the middle and he'd go out in the Bronx and he'd throw the money up in the air and all the kids would scramble for it like crazy and I was like wow 50 that's mad and like so I said yep that's good

that's good for walking around you know money and we came to shoe and he had the money in the shoe. Yeah. So he threw the fucking money in the air, and we'd about 2,000 watching the shoe, and then we'd about 10,000 getting the money and all. And I was like, 50, if this was Ireland,

if this was Sheriff or Liverpool even worse, some mother would have already thrown her kid out the fucking window and broken his legs and got 10 million off you. You know? And I said, you should be careful. Don't do it again. And he goes, I won't do it again.

So you've got to understand how quickly you can get out of control on a movie. And they had this guy who I knew up for cutting the head off an actor. Remember with the helicopter? Yeah. And the studio heads all dumped it on the director. I'll open that for you, Jim. They all dumped it on, thank you, dumped it on the director.

So I rang the studio head and I said, listen, 50's throwing money around and I didn't like the studio head around the set and I'm wondering what I should do. And he's like, why are you ringing me? I said, because you have to tell me to keep going. I'll get back to you. So then I went to the to the policeman Ray

I said Ray if 50 throws the money again arrest him and Ray's looking at me and I went to 50's manager and said if 50 fucking throws that money again there's going to be a row

so and he promised he wouldn't do it and he's a sweetheart and then he got up the hill he gets carried away all the kids are shouting he throws the money it's a scramble from hell and then all his security act like the rock star and they bustle him into a fucking van start reversing kids are nearly hurt get out of the way they drive fast through the kids and I'm like fucking had it you know so I lost my temper and I and the main the stage guy came to me and he's like he was great this

guy and he said do you want me to talk to 50 and I'm like if you talk to 50 I lose my authority I said no so I said I'll have to talk him. I didn't know what I was going to say. So I went into the big trailer, you know, and I stood beside the guy who I knew had the knife because I'd seen him on CCTV footage stabbing fellas at a fight backstage. And I got really friendly with him. Right? fight backstage and I got really friendly with him right it's called Sheriff Street knowledge and I just went in the trailer and I held him by the arm and I said and I had no idea was gonna say and I start off and I was like 50 I

told you not to throw the fucking money and he's like yeah and they're all looking at me I said are you a fucking gangster for real and he was like I said are you a fucking gangster or what I said get a fucking gun out

but don't be fucking throwing money for kids to get hurt yeah so he came out with a trailer and he said to me Jim you know I thought about it and that was a fucking maddie to do that but I agree with you and I'm apologizing and I took it out of my pocket the name of the studio head, the policeman, his manager, the first AD. I said, you have to apologize to every one of them. And he went around apologizing to them all.

And then he came to me and he said, nobody tells me the truth. He said, you're the first person that's told me the truth in about five fucking years. Okay. So you're me dad. the first person that's told me the truth in about five fucking years. Okay. So you're me dad. Because

yeah, I've read interviews with 50 Cent and he mentions a lot about you roaring and screaming at him and he really respects you for it. He's really fond of you for shouting at him. Yeah, I did love him. He knew I loved him so it's not a fucking

problem. But one of the interesting things was poor Ray, who was the head policeman. So I went to Ray and I said, Ray, and he had all his cops around him. I said, why did you not arrest 50 when I told you? And he's like, Jimmy, are you serious?

And I go, what's up, Ray? Because he was very nervous and he said, well, Jim, you know, I was in 9-11, I was in the towers. And I'm like, okay. And so what? So he lost his nerve. I said, oh, okay.

So let me get this straight. So the people at the top of the cup said, what are we going to do with Ray? Because he can't really work in the real world so let's put him in the movies okay that's what people think of the movies they think it's somehow

not the real world and he was one of the I stayed friendly with Ray but it's that kind of you get in that world and you can become abusive you can become a Harvey you can be I've seen it all against it, you know? You directed The Field.

One question about that. What was the decision... The Field is absolutely fucking incredible. One of my favorite films. What was the decision to make... Because in the play, in the John B. Keane play, it's a British man who comes to buy the field. Why did you change it to an American? What was the thinking?

Crass. You know, have an American in the movie. Ah, fuck. Is that all? No. But put that aside. It's just that America was the returned Irish fella, you know? Yeah. And I didn't really want to focus it onto the English.

I just wanted it to be about land hunger, you know? And I think the Englishman would have made it too family, too... That's the thing. So I obviously have huge respect for the original play, but by making it an American, it made it more potent. It made it more... For me, it made it about losing our values to capitalism. Yeah.

And a subtle critique as well on Irish America. You know, and it's... Yeah. That struck me harder than the English person, which you kind of just under... A bit clichéd. Yeah. Well, you know, the American...

England's no longer the empire. America's the empire. Yeah. So that's what I was kind of trying to hint at. What was Richard Harris like, working with Richard Harris? Oh. That was... Let's say it presented

different difficulties than working with Daniel Day-Lewis. That's what I'm wondering. Did Richard Harris become the bull? Did he become that character and was he difficult to deal with as a result? Because there's no reasoning

with the bull. No, he did become the character, but it was a kind of... You know, I found out... Richard loved Peter O'Toole. Yeah. And I knew O'Toole well, you know? And there was probably no greater performer

in film than O'Toole, you know and there was probably no greater performer in film than O'Toole you know he's like so amazing but he said to Richard don't act in the wide shots forced them to come in on you yeah so they were dealing with the Hollywood system where the close-ups meant everything. So they wouldn't act that well in the wide shot, so they had to come in on them. What? Yeah. And that's basically forcing your hand as a director to include a lot of close-ups.

Yeah. Wow. And so Richard had done Camelot forever, seven years. Like Richard knew the name of the guy selling the raffle tickets in Camelot. And he sacked them after six weeks. And I said, why do you do that, Richard? He says, after six weeks, they all start robbing. That's such a limerick thing to say.

He was very much a limerick guy. And he was brilliant. You had to see him on stage. He said to me, I've got five auras on stage, but I've only four in film. And on stage stage he had this complete unpredictability that was scary

you never knew what he was going to do including looking at the other actors and making faces and telling people in the audience stop eating their fucking stupid biscuits and and you never knew what he was going to do and so when we were on the movie,

we were doing the very first big scene, which I really didn't want to do. And what was the first big scene you shot? Where he talks to the priest and he says, you know, my mother was in one corner of the field and I was in the other. And I saw her fall down you know keel over

and I went to her and my father came over and my father felt whatever you know knew she was dead she was dying and he said to me fetch a priest and I said let's bring the hay in first

yeah let's bring the hay in first yeah let's bring the hay in first and when Richard did that scene he was very over the top right? very theatrical and I was like

initially I thought he's been too long on stage then I thought he's overdoing it deliberately to see if I notice. Yeah. And then I thought this is fucked. And he got to the end of the scene and I involuntarily went cut, put my head down. And when my head was just about there,

I heard the first AD clapping then the cameraman then the entire crew giving Richard a standing ovation and I knew he was looking at me and I was down like this trying to figure what will I say when I look at him

and I knew if I said something in between I'd lose power or, you know. Yeah. So I just said, that's the most over-the-top fucking act that I ever saw. And he was shocked.

And did you feel he did a piece for stage there rather than doing something for film? Yeah. And this impressed everybody who was physically present. Yeah. And I knew it wouldn't be easy after that. So we did about seven takes,

and on the seventh take he shouted at me, I'm not even acting. And I said, good. And the effect of that was to... The effect was that... I knew it was going to be a war, but the effect was he acted in every scene. And so you're dead right.

We got to this scene where, you know, where he has to go out and say, he has to say something like, why did you torture the widow? Yeah. And so we're doing the scene and he says to Sean Bean why did you torture the mother

I go Richard it's the widow mother it's the widow Richard and John Hort got the script and quietly when I wasn't there went up to Richard and said you know Richard I looked at the first two drafts and the present draft, and it is The

Widow. Fuck off. So I'm like, oh, okay. So for... How does he get to make that type of decision about the script? Like, did he have a reason behind it or was he just being stubborn? It was... He was so odd that he told me

in the middle of all this, you know, he had a thing with his mother and father, I think, but he kept saying mother until it became murder. Okay.

Murder. And I kept saying widow. And for six hours, we sat there saying one word to each other. Like a Samuel Beckett play. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. And then I said, look, Richard, the light's gone,

so I'm going to put the camera up. But if you say fucking mother, that's the end of it. And he didn't. He went out and he said widow. But he said it with such demented remember he's on the back of the car. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And he was like fucking mad half the movie.

But it was a different type of and he's amazing in it, you know. And he's an amazing character. You mentioned twice there you said you're conscious about not giving away power when you're a director.

What do you mean by that? You've got 400 people behind you all saying, next shot, next shot, next shot, next shot. And you've got 10 people in front of you saying, will we do it again? It's very easy to move on to the next shot and not get it right do you know what I mean and to me it's it's a thing about I don't we none of us get to tell the truth really in social environments or at home or so you got this special spiritual world where you have a chance of telling the truth so i don't want to be there there's no point in me being there if i'm gonna

lie you know there's just no point so i'm like fuck them all it's good i don't care what happens you know um you've worked with danielLewis loads. What is it about Daniel Day-Lewis that has you with a continued relationship? Just the fact that I can get him. He's so good. He's like

one of a kind, special performer that he just can do anything, you know? And my favorite bits ever making movies were just doing the acting bits. If the actor wasn't there and I was doing it with him, because it was so easy because he's so real. It's like I'm talking to you. It's that relationship. There's nothing beyond

you know. This business when you read about that he goes completely into character for the entirety. Is that exaggerated or is that legit? I mean if he's fully in the character can you have a

conversation with the man if you need to have it? Like, what are the boundaries there? Well, you could, but like, see, I'm 5'5", and on good days

when I was younger, I was 5'6". Right? And to get into the Royal Air Force you had to be 5'6", and I was rejected. Because they said I wasn't exactly 5'6". So I was always the small guy in sheriff for having to be careful and look out for myself. So when I got onto that set of, you know, My Left Foot,

and Daniel was in character, he intimidated all the other actors. And he was the centre of attention. And I was like, that's perfect. Nobody's going to pay any attention to me and not notice I know nothing. And I can make the movie away over here so for me it was a big liberation you know to have somebody

so committed and so believing in this world that you know he transferred into you know so you did you find yourself getting self confidence from the way that Daniel was acting

yeah I would never self-confidence from the way that Daniel was acting? Yeah. I would never, I knew I would never have to have a row with him other than saying that I don't think it's art. I think it's communication. And I just want them to communicate with me and I don't give a fuck how good he is with the art. My job is to just see

if it's true, you know? And I think my thing as a director is very performance-oriented and actor-oriented and that stands me in good stead when I'm interviewing people because I have a very good x-ray interior for when people are not telling the truth you know and

and that's kind of it's all about the truth you know it's all about trying to get to that you mentioned the painter peter breugel earlier and are are there any painters that are influence you as a director well you know the one that influences me is probably the one that started out most like an irish painter and that's Van Gogh. Yeah. And he started out

with dark bog-like colours. Yeah. And he looks like the most depressed guy in the world. Mm-hmm.

And in The Potato Eaters, for instance, Yes. his mother is looking past him to his dead brother. Yeah. And I knew that from my own parents

and from people who've lost a child, that they become obsessed with the dead. And Van Gogh has this thing that's like... He has a thing in his paintings which is... He's getting the muse. He's getting the muse he's getting inspiration he's getting attention from let's say the mother figure or the muse and at the same time he's kind of suicidal so it's so when he's doing for instance a portrait of Gaucher or any of them, I think that you can always feel

that they're doing him a big favor and they don't really want to be there. From the people that are sitting in his paintings? Yeah. Fucking lovely, yeah. And he knows that. Yeah. And he's like,

I'll fucking paint you here. Wow. I'll make you a present. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So he's not, he's like, I'll fucking paint you here. Wow. I'll make you present. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So he's not, he's getting the interior. It's the emotion that he's getting. So when you're making a movie, you're dealing with emotions. Yeah.

And emotions are invisible. Yeah. Therefore, you're dealing with the invisible. Yeah. And anything that you do visibly only fucks up the invisible so if you make marks on the ground for actors to hit or whatever yeah our lights you can do one type of film that way which is a hitchcock type kubrick type movie and i wouldn't be able to do that I'm more in performance

and allowing the actors to be free and trying to catch something that's gone with the wind you know yeah yeah just could be gone maybe not wouldn't work you know it's kind of a high wire act you know what do you think of the approach of the likes of Ken Loach where where they offer a huge amount of freedom? Is that something that would... How would you feel about that method? I would say Ken... is contradictory

in that he is the most controlling person who offers loads of freedom. Yeah. In other words, he doesn't give the actors any script. So I've been trying to do movies with people who worked with Ken, and they go, Jim, you need to rewrite the script. I'm going, when you're doing it with Ken, you don't fucking have a script, so why are you worried about the script?

Do you know what I mean? So people latch on to... Once the rules are established that it doesn't matter, it's what you say, that's very good. It has its limits, but Ken is a supreme artist, and movies come out of

strong individuals, and he's a very strong individual. And he's kind of making more or less the same movie, but it's a great movie you know I'm going to take one more question we have one here

the Netflix documentary that came out at the same time as your Sky one had quite a different perspective could you give us your thoughts on the Netflix documentary fake news I mean they purport to show in a documentary Ian Bailey's coat in a bucket that it wouldn't fit in, that he bleached it,

that it was in a shower. And here's the problem with that. Jules Thomas doesn't have a shower. And here's the second problem. The woman who said that in the program, the Italian girl, made a sworn statement to the police saying she couldn't identify the clothes in the bath. And there was no shower. Now, it sounds very unkind and ungenerous of me complaining about another director's work, even if it is lazy and shoddy.

But that's not the issue. The issue is this is an ongoing murder investigation. So get off the fucking stage. Which are recreations that aren't true. That's what I said about believability. The audience are believing. So when they show that picture, everybody in the world, in the 160 countries that Netflix say they're in, believe that this is what Ian Bailey did. So I'll tell you what happened to the coat. He went up the hill and he got a breeze block and he murdered a woman and he got blood all over the coat. And he came down, he invited three students into his house.

He let them go into the bathroom where he was seemingly bleaching the coat on Christmas Eve. He wore the coat on Christmas Day to the Christmas swim. The girl who made that statement was with him on Christmas Day when he wore the coat. He burned it on Stephen's Day in a fire. The police picked it up on the 10th of February, detailed it in their report and sworn statements, and then it disappeared. That's the magic

code. Some things are too serious to let people away with them. Does that make sense? There's a thing in screenwriting called Chekhov's gun where at the very start of a film an object is introduced

and then you don't reference it until the very end. I'm going to do that now with your Bluetooth speaker that you brought out at the start. What the fuck is that about? You need the mic money this is the second Jim bitch moment

so the bitch now is about a fella who wrote a book called murder at rolling water and he basically like worked for me. And in the book he says that Bailey said, I did it.

I killed her, but it was a crime of passion. Now, I want you all, close your eyes and take your hand and write those words. I did it. I killed her. It was a crime of passion. Now, after writing that he said, unfortunately, when he told this to the cameraman, the camera wasn't running. Well, unfortunately for him, it was. And this is what Ian Bailey said. How long has it been a crime to be eccentric? How long has it been a crime to, I want to go on stage and be,

you know, isn't that part of the, I mean, it's really weird that the fucking French who seem to be, I thought was sort of, well, we know that they you know extramarital affairs and this that and the other I'm surprised they didn't charge me with a crime passion now I mean you know if that's what you're saying

why don't you go out with a whole hog and fucking charge me with a crime passion now it's the thing in French law where you can get off because you were in a height of passion when you killed your lover. Whoa. Jesus. That's nuts. Check it out.

That exists in love? It existed for men who killed their wives for being, getting it from another, uh, part. Yeah. Serious? Yeah, serious. I don't know if it still exists, but you check it out. You don't think I make these things up, do you?

Fuck! What was that? Ah. Fuck sake! What was that? You okay? No. Uh, get me some water, please.

A cup of water. Something just flew into me eye, and it's still in there. A wasp! Can you break down that clip, Jim? What was that? What was that about? What does that tell us? Hold on, we need the mic. Ian is always, you know, he just muses on everything. But the important thing is it's the opposite of a confession. I think Ian is always, you know, he just muses on everything.

But the important thing is it's the opposite of a confession. He's wondering why the French don't charge him with a crime of passion if he knew Sophie, like they're saying. But you can't say that he said, I did it, I killed her, it was a crime of passion. You can't just fucking report that if he didn't say it and you weren't there. He's implicating me and the cameraman and everybody

in holding back a secret but I was the only one went in France to the prosecutor and I didn't think it was of any consequence because I knew I had heard this, but I did say to the French prosecutor

when she came out after the trial, Bailey was wondering why you didn't try him with a crime of passion, and she went crazy, went off on me, you know, which I understand. But it's very important when you're dealing with facts and people's lives and the poor French family who, you know, believe

Bailey did it. It's very important that the facts are adhered to. You know what I mean? And that the believability of both... It's hard enough for... I see the policemen

outside Tesco and they're trying to stop some fella battering up a homeless guy and they have a fucking terrible job, you know? And they're unarmed. So I have nothing but respect for the ordinary cop going around doing his job. So it's very important that we maintain that trust

and it's very important that we're allowed to question them and raise questions when it's possible they got something wrong that's just it thank you so much Jim for that chat it was absolutely fantastic thank you to all of you for coming out

thank you very much ladies and gentlemen for listening to that that interview with Jim Sheridan it was a fantastic chat, it was a lovely lovely to be chatting to someone in front of an audience for the first time in a long time

I'll be back next week and probably have a hot take or something like that mind yourselves enjoy the start of September rub a dog and don't be too hard on yourself Yart Bar none. Tickets are on sale now for Fan Appreciation Night on Saturday, April 13th when the Toronto Rock hosts the Rochester Nighthawks at First Ontario Centre in Hamilton at 7.30pm. You can also lock in your playoff pack right now to guarantee the same seats for every postseason game

and you'll only pay as we play. Come along for the ride and punch your ticket to Rock City at torontorock.com.