The Charlie Kirk Show - A Surprise Christmas Gift for the Economy?

Episode Date: December 24, 2025

The third quarter economic news came in better than just about anyone expected, so why is there widespread sentiment that the economy is struggling? Former Trump economist Stephen Moore explores the "vibecession" and what the real situation is for ordinary Americans. Plus, Batya Ungar-Sargon reacts to AmFest, and Andrew makes a bid to overcome her skepticism about Vice President Vance. Watch every episode ad-free on members.charliekirk.com! Get new merch at charliekirkstore.com!Support the show: http://www.charliekirk.com/supportSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

My name is Charlie Kirk. I run the largest pro-American student organization in the country fighting for the future of our republic. My call is to fight evil and to proclaim truth. If the most important thing for you is just feeling good, you're going to end up miserable. But if the most important thing is doing good, you will end up purposeful. College is a scam, everybody. You've got to stop sending your kids to college. You should get married as young as possible and have as much.

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Lord, use me. Buckle up, everybody. Here we go. The Charlie Kirk Show is proudly sponsored by Preserve Gold. Leading gold and silver experts and the only precious metals company I recommend to my family, friends, and viewers. All right, welcome back to the Charlie Kirk show. Hour 2 is underway, and President Trump got an early Christmas present with some amazing economic news that came out this morning. So here to unpack that with us is former Trump Economic Advisor, and now he's with Unleash Prosperity.

And that's, of course, Stephen Moore, a longtime guest on this show. and a good friend of Charlie's. Stephen, welcome back to the show. On a scale of 1 to 10, how good was this news that broke this morning? 4.3 growth Q3 for GDP. It's a really good number. It's a solid number.

I'd put it at 8 or a 9. Trump wants 5% growth. We're not quite there yet, although we could get there. Incidentally, once you get above 3.5% economic growth, then the economy grows faster than the debt grows. And so the burden, you know, because I know everyone listening to the show is concerned about our, you know, massive debt. And one way of lowering that debt is to grow our way out of it.

So, look, I'm super bullish on this U.S. economy. It's been a really good 2025. I don't care what the polls are showing that all of the indicators show a very strong growth year. And I think we're going to see a speed up in 2026 because a lot of people come up to me on the street and say, hey, Steve Moore, I know you help write that big beautiful bill. why are I seeing it? And I tell people, well, because it hasn't taken effect yet for tens of millions of Americans. On January 1st, when they get their first paycheck for the month of January, they're going to start to see less money with help from their paycheck, which is exactly what Americans want to see. Awesome. Okay. Well, let's play some of the reactions from the news media

here. 189. Third quarter numbers. We're looking for 3.3. Zoom, zoom, zoom. 4.3.4.3 4.3%. That is a nice jump, and I know many may question day the gathering, but on the surface, this would be the strongest quarter going back to the third quarter of 2023 when it was 4.7. This is strong. 3.5 on consumption blows away the 2.7 we're expecting. That would be the best since the last quarter of 24. On the price index, here's some not good news. 3.8% on the price index, that's much higher than 2.7 we're looking for. All right. So we hit the first part, you know, we beat the GDP forecast by over a point, potentially. But what is he talking about with this price index, Steve? Well, I'm not exactly sure, quite honestly, because we got a really

blockbuster number on inflation earlier the week, or late last week, I guess it was, where the inflation rate fell to 2.7%. And if you look at the last couple of months, inflation is headed down to 2% or less. And as you know, the Fed target rate, which is the rate we should shoot at, is about 2% inflation. So we're headed in that direction. I think the numbers just look overall really strong right now to me. I don't quite understand why, if you look at the opinion polls, about half Americans think

the economy is not doing well and even more so. And I don't get that because it is, you know, it is well. Now, a lot of people just say it's doing poorly because they hate. Trump, right? You know, you get 40% of Americans, no matter how good things are, they're going to say things are bad. But it's going to be harder and harder, in my opinion, as we move into 2026 and these good numbers continue to roll in, it's harder for the left to sustain that narrative that it's not a good economy. Yeah, I think they're calling it, the line I've seen is calling it the vibe session. It's the numbers seem good, but the sense of among a lot of people is it's bad.

Could it be specifically that the situation is very tough for young people just entering the workforce? I know the hiring for entry-level jobs this year was very rough for people just out of college. Is that diverging more than usual from the fate of other workers in the economy? Well, let me say a couple of things about that. I'm smiling when you say that because I graduated from college in late 1982, so I'm an old part. You know, I'm a baby boomer. Just to put these things in perspective, when I graduated. graduated from college, the inflation rate was not 3%. It was 9%. The unemployment rate was not 4%. It was 8%. And the mortgage rate was not 5%. It was like 14%. So for young people to say, oh, gee, this is a very good economy. They can't put this in any kind of perspective. Now, I think the one thing that where I would like to see improvement on is on the housing front because I have two sons that are

in their early 30s. And they're doing fine with their careers, but they cannot afford to buy a house. And that's a result of a lot of things we could get into it. But it is true that housing is very expensive right now. So what is driving that then, Stephen, the housing market? If you talk to J.D. Vance, if you listen to what he's saying, he's saying it's a supply and demand issue. We've just been letting in too many people, the foreign population's too high, illegals, that sort of thing is that is that really what's driving it is there other other core drivers of the housing affordability issue no i don't i don't think it's kind of scapegoating to say it's due to immigrants because actually immigrants build housing they don't just they don't just take up housing

i think the real um issue here is a couple things one is states and localities around the country have put in all sorts of restrictions on building new housing and so you know if you don't have an increase in supply then the price of something is going to go up so we've got to get rid of these restrictions in some, in fact, in many of the blue cities and suburbs, you can't build new housing, and that's a big problem. The other thing that is going on here is that people are locked into their homes. So we charge a capital gains tax if you sell your home and you make a, if you buy, sell the home for more than you bought it for. Well, that's almost all Americans, because the value of housing has been going up. And so what people do to avoid

paying that very, very significant tax is they don't sell their home. And so people are locked into their houses. So what I've proposed to Donald Trump is get rid of the capital gains tax on housing when it's sold. And if you do that, you'll have an increase in supply and prices will come down. Well, I got to take issue just a little bit. It is a supply and demand issue. And if we have more people in the country, then I get that a lot of the laborers that are building houses are immigrants, but, I mean, they are going to have to live somewhere. So there is a dynamic there that. Yeah, but we've been taking, you know, for the last 30 years, we've taken tens of millions of immigrants and housing has actually been a low cost. So there's, but look,

I take your point, you know, Biden let in, we don't know exactly how many, a lot of illegal immigrants. I'm very pro-legal immigration, but I'm very much against the illegal immigration. And so I think you have a point there. Yeah, fair enough. All right. So this is Kevin Hassett. Charlie loved Kevin Hassett because it was like this breath of fresh air and optimism when he would come on the show. Let's hear what he's having to say, 193.

President Trump's trade agenda is working. And so we got about, you know, one and a half percent of the growth on 4.3 because we reduced the trade deficit. We went back and we looked at every Bloomberg forecast for the main numbers since September and found that on average we outperformed the forecast 9. 94% of the tide. So if 94% of Wall Street economists are getting the macro trends wrong, they need to start to think about, hey, you know, maybe Trump's policies are actually way better than we thought. And maybe the fake news that says all these terrible things about Trump policies should reconsider and, you know, grab their pencil and redo their economics. So, you know, Stephen, it begs the question. I have two questions for you. Why do they get so, why are these economists getting so much wrong? Is it just TDS? And then I want to talk about tariffs. you know, because that seems to be the big hot button question. You could take it in whatever order you want, Stephen.

So, yeah, it's absolutely true that Trump Duran syndrome is a pathological disorder in this country. And it does change people's perceptions of what's happening in the economy, especially academics and professional economists who keep low-balling the numbers. And they keep getting them wrong, you know, as my friend Kevin Hassett just said, 94% of the time they're wrong. Maybe they should start thinking that their assessments and their models are completely off base. They got the inflation numbers wrong.

They got the job numbers wrong. They got the trade deficit numbers wrong. In fact, I'm writing a column on this right now as we speak about, you know, these professional economists probably should turn their PhDs back in and say, we don't know what we're talking about because they are consistently wrong. I think economists are simply struggling to catch up with a new paradigm. and they underestimate the amount of leverage America has as the market that everybody wants to, you know, play into and sell into. But, but, you know, Trump's flipping the economic models on their heads.

President Trump walked into a catch-22 when taking office. Do nothing in America would be staring at a ticking debt bomb, the kind of crisis that could cripple our future. Instead, he's taken action with strong policies to slow the train and buy some time. But the effects of past administration's spending are still working. working through the system and experts predict dramatic price increases and market uncertainty. Trump is doing all he can, but no matter who's in office, protecting your retirement savings is ultimately up to you. And that's why many Americans are turning to real assets like gold and silver. Preserve gold is our go-to choice here at the Charlie Kirk Show. We use them because

they make it easy to own physical gold and silver, even inside your retirement accounts like an IRA or 401K. Now, hear from Charlie in his own words. Preserve gold is my go-to choice for all my precious metal needs. They are the real deal. And I recommend them to my friends, family, and viewers. Get their free wealth protection guide now by texting Charlie to 50505. President Trump is fighting for America's future. Now it's your term to help protect yours. All right, Stephen Moore, I got to ask you a softball question. Well, it's not soft. It's a really hard question, actually. What is your favorite Christmas movie and why? Love Actually is one of my favorite modern ones. And then I'd have to go with Miracle on 34

Street. Oh, wow. We just got an email endorsing that one. You guys are so young, you probably never even seen it. I know, they had the remake of it. I saw the remake. They did a 90s remake. No, you got to go out. You got to look at the old one. No, I've seen it. I've seen it. See, I grew up in a house that was full of like John Wayne movies and World War II movies and the black and white stuff. We got one. We got a, Caleb said their favorite was Muppets Christmas Carol. I need to see that one. I don't think I ever have. See, I like the old school, like the English, like the more English and like, you know, gloomy the better. So, you know,

let's let's deal with this tariff question one last time here. Or Blake, you've got a email, right? Yeah, yeah. We've got, we got an email from someone. I think on the vibe session topic, why are people downbeat? And he says, it's food, Stephen, go to the grocery store and tell me the economy is great. Okay, Biden. Oh, get in the, getting, uh, what's your response to that? Yeah. Yeah, no, look, I get that all the time. Even from my wife. wife. She goes to the grocery store. She comes back really angry about, you know, the price of steak used to cost, you know, $12 and now it's $20, $25. So I get it. I feel your pain, folks. But if you look overall at the economy, by the way, bee prices are way up.

Guess what? Pork chops are way down in price. There's a lot of things. Cell phones are down in price. Airlines are down in price. Motels and hotels are down in price. Television's down in price. So overall, the inflation rate is headed in the right direction, but I understand people are angry when they come back from the grocery store. And I can tell you this, though, that we're going to start to see declining grocery prices, not declining prices, but this is the other thing. Trump keeps saying I'm going to bring prices down. What he meant to say is I'm going to bring the rate of inflation down. We don't want to see deflation. That's even worse for the economy than inflation. We want to stabilize the prices, as my friend Steve Forbes would say,

and create a sound stable dollar, and that's exactly what Trump is doing. Well, we are seeing energy prices drop. Oh, yeah, gasoline. Amazing. I mean, gas is under $3 a gallon. Yeah, yeah. There's, I think in Cincinnati, it's at like $2.50 a gallon. It might be one of the lower parts of the country.

Kentucky. By the way, you know what state has the highest gas price? California. Yeah, like five bucks a gallon there. Well, yeah, it's a little lower than that. but, you know, like, it's very structural. California has, you basically can only refine the fuel for cars over here, and they won't build new refineries.

And so, you know, it's a whole issue. But there's a serious point, but there's a serious point here. If you look at the 10 states that have the highest cost of living, nine of them are blue states because liberal Democrats cause shortages of everything because of their stupid policies, high taxes, high regulations, and therefore the price rises. So if you want lower prices, folks, move to a red state like Florida, like Texas, like Alabama, like Utah. That's where prices are low. Yeah. Well, I mean, listen, I'm sympathetic to people that want to stay in their home in the blue states, right? We don't have people having to leave the locust that keep infiltrating. Blake,

you had one more question on that? Or did I misunderstand? Oh, no, no, no. It was just that one there. Oh, I guess we could ask him what he thinks of the, on housing, what he thinks of like 50-year mortgage topics or whatever. There's various things like that come up. I'm not a big fan of that. I think, you know, stretching out the mortgage is a dumb thing to do. Look, I know Trump's hardest in the right place on that. But the best way to bring the price of housing down is to bring the mortgage rate down.

And the way you bring the mortgage rate down is bringing the inflation rate down, which Trump is doing. Mortgage rates will continue to fall as prices stabilize. Yeah. Hey, real quick, we have two minutes left here, Stephen. You were, you knew Charlie for a long time. When did you first meet Charlie Kirk? So, I mean, I was thinking about that the other day. And, you know, he, I met him when he was way before you guys did.

I think he was 18 or 19 years old, really just getting started. And my friend Gary Rabine, who was very close to Charlie, he had a event with Charlie. And I think he was just starting. I think, as I said, just, you know, about 18 or 19 years old. And I remember this, who is this notty-nose kid? You know, he was very ambitious, and I don't say that in a negative way, in a positive way. He knew he what he wanted to do.

He knew he wanted to be a leader. And when he started doing it's like reading Outlaw, reading Larry Kudlow, reading Steve Moore, and educating himself. And by the way, you can educate yourself way more by reading the stuff that we write than the crap that they teach in college on economics, because most of it is wrong. That's the reason 94% of the professional economists got it wrong. but he you know i just saw his evolution over the next 12 11 or 12 years and every time i saw him he just got better and better and better and boy i mean it's just such a sad thing because i really believe charlie kirk was on path to someday be president of the united states i really believe that yeah and you guys i i'll never one of my kind of lasting memories of this show with charlie at the

helm was uh every time you'd come on steven we'd have this this whole topic prepped and it would be, you know, Charlie, we're going to talk about this and this economic new number came in and what Trump's going to do or whatever. And then you guys would just like talk about Chicago the whole time. But he and I both love the Chicago. By the way, how about those bears? They pulled off a miracle in the Soldier's Field on this weekend. So we're proud of it. Oh, I know. The same night, Stephen, it was the bears won in that overtime game against the Packers and the Ducks demolished. Don't remind me. Well, you know what, that really was a miracle.

The odds of the Bears winning that game with two minutes left was one in 200. One and 200. Miracles really can't happen. It's a Christmas miracle. Stephen Moore, thank you from Unleashed Prosperity. Thank you, my friend, Merry Christmas, everyone. This is Lane Schoenberger, Chief Investment Officer and founding partner of Y Reefi. It has been an honor and a privilege to partner with Turning Point and for Charlie

to endorse us. His endorsement means the world to us, and we look forward to continuing our partnership with Turning Point for years to come. Now, hear Charlie, in his own words, tell you about why refi. I'm going to tell you guys about yrefi.com. That is yR-R-E-F-Y.com. Why refi is private student loan debt in America total is about $300 billion. Why refi is refinancing distress or defaulted private student loans. You can finally take control of your student loan situation with a plan that works for your monthly budget. Go to whyrefi.com. That is Refi.com. Do you have a co-barrower? Why refi can get them released from the loan. You're going to skip a payment up to 12 times without penalty. It may not be available in all 50 states. Go to Y-Refi.com. That is Y-R-E-F-Y-F-Y.com. Let's face it, if you have distress or default to student loans, it can be overwhelming. Because of private-sident loan debt, so many people feel stuck, go to Y-ReFi.com. That is Y-R-E-F-Y-F-F-Y-Fy.com. All right. Next up here is Batya Ungar Sargon. She is the host of Batya with an exclamation mark on News Nation.

Batty, you have, we were talking on the phone. You've been watching everything that happened at Amfest from afar. And you, you know, you were so complimentary to me and to turning point about the event because I think maybe you were surprised by it a little bit. You were a little nervous, a little trepidation going in when you saw the speaker list. And then tell us what your 30,000 foot view, what was the vibe for you watching from afar? First of all, thank you so much for having me, Andrew. I have to say I'm like unexpectedly getting a little bit emotional because it's my first time on since Charlie was taken.

He meant so much to me. Actually, there's a woman on my street whose car has, we live in Brooklyn, South Brooklyn. It's, you know, not, you know, hipster Brooklyn, but her car is just festooned with stickers about Charlie and I was literally staking out the car because I didn't know who's it belonged to and I just wanted to thank her

and the first time I saw her getting out of the car I just ran over to her and we just had the most amazing conversation about what he meant to this country and so thank you so much for having me and think about him every single day. I thought that the America Fest you put on was incredible, incredible.

It was so important because you allowed the debate to be aired. And I think we get really attached to our positions in this country. And then we get really attached to the idea that, you know, we have to convince people that we're right and we forget that the most important thing is, I think, what Charlie really stood for, which was the view that more unites us than divides us as Americans, and that you have to have the conversation. You have to trust your fellow Americans, and you have to bring that love that he had, even to people that don't agree with you. I think, like, that is the thing that we really lost was that spectacle of him going to those college campuses and talking to people whose views, I know he thought were bad and wrong and dangerous, but you could still see the love that he brought to them. And that's my New Year's resolution is to be more like that, even especially when I'm talking about the things that matter to me the most. And I just felt that you really, you and Erica made that happen. You aired the debate and everybody could see it for themselves. And because this is

the greatest country on earth and the American people are the most incredible people on planet earth it reminded me to just trust that process of seeing the debate and hearing the debate and listening to both sides so i just i watched every minute of it i was glued to it and i'm so proud of you and just again like to see charlie's legacy being carried on in such a fulsome way was really moving to me and really powerful wow well thank you thank you for saying that botta it means a lot And I know Blake, Blake's in studio there in Phoenix, and, you know, we both sort of watched everything play out. We saw the online chatter. And, you know, the elephant in the room is sort of this foreign policy debate, the Israel debate.

But also this debate, Ben kind of kicked things off on night one, calling out some of the people that he had grievances with. And then they ended up taking the stage later, some of them at least, and kind of throwing it back. So it, like you said, it was this debate, this airing of the family businesses, Erica called it. And but then we led up to, Blake, feel free if you want to chime in on that, on that point before I move on. Because I do have a question for Bataia. No, no. Let's get into it. Let's get into it. All right. So you on your show had some words for, I mean, directed at J.D. Vance. And I want to give you a chance to kind of talk about that. Let's go ahead and play 209.

was already anointing the vice president as the GOP nominee for 2028, you might want to slow your role. Leadership is about having principles and standing up for them, no matter the blowback, not being afraid of offending actual Nazis. All right. So that seems to be the cliff. I see you smiling there. So I am obviously Team Jady. I think he's an amazing leader. I thought his speech at Amfest was morally clear. He condemned anti-Semitism. He condemned uh racism a di anti white racism anti-asian racism and it felt like to me being there it was kind of like dad's in the room settle down kids here's the north star here's where we're going you you we're we certainly are not trying to anoint jd vance anything it was sort of this if you're in turning

point circles charlie was talking about that we had jd's back a thousand percent and he hopes he runs and if he runs we've got his back you know so it was kind of this thing that's been said out loud 48 times. I think Erica was just kind of like, let's just say it out loud, you know, let's just do it here. But from your perspective, why did you say what you said and, you know, what is it going to take to kind of get you to come around on the J.D. J.D. Vance conversation. I want to believe. I'm so honored to be able to have this conversation with you. Like, you have no idea what it means to me to be here with you in the room. On so many issues, I think J.D. is spot on, you know, my top issues, I would say, is I think what President Trump represented,

which was, you know, being pro worker, pro labor. The dignity of working class Americans is like my number one issue, which entails, you know, getting to immigration zero right away for as long as it takes, you know, in order to make sure that Americans have access to the American dream before we start giving it to everybody else on foreign policy. I'm aware that, I guess, the 50% of the turning point straw poll was. Like, I see Israel as a great ally among great allies. Our interests are frequently aligned, but not always. Sometimes the Israelis, I think, overstep. And I've been, you know, glad to see President Trump have a really strong idea of when our interests are aligned and when they diverge and choosing American interests when he needs to.

You know, so on all of that stuff, I feel like, you know, very much on the same page, certainly don't want to go back to the like rhino pre-Trump version of the gop i think that would be a huge mistake and a huge betrayal of the american working class which is like where my allegiances lie as a jewish american um but i will say that i think there have been podcasters out there who have been saying things that make me as an american and as a jew feel like i'm questioning whether this movement wants me um for example platforming people who think that Hitler was not the villain of World War II. That's just going to make every Jewish person, like somebody, a podcaster agreeing with that point of view,

the way that Tucker Carlson seemed to is going to make every Jewish person feel like, wait a minute, is that actually a question? And so when JD says, well, I'm, you know, close to Tucker Carlson, I disagree with him about a lot of things, but I'm not going to be clear about what those things are, that leaves people. people thinking, well, you know, is that one of the things or not? Yeah. And Blake, I want to get you in on this conversation because you obviously have a really long conversation, uh, relationship with, with Tucker.

But I want to show that you mentioned the straw poll. Go ahead and throw a 178 up on the screen. It shows 53.4% consider Israel an ally. 33.3% are top ally. Only 13.3% say that Israel is not an ally of the United States. So despite all of, you know, you know, the hand-wringing, all the loud voices online, we still are at, you know, 87% of Amfest attendees consider, you know, Israel either our top ally or, or an ally.

And, you know, maybe what you're seeing in the shift in the dialogue is more to, you know, one ally of many as opposed to our top ally. Maybe that's the shift you've seen in the Trump era. Blake, I want to give you a chance to respond just because of your relationship with Turner. Yeah, so a few things. I totally understand where you're coming. through it specifically on some of that. Yeah, the Hitler stuff, that's popped up more. I will say, I've been hearing stuff like that. Honestly, my entire adult life, it bubbles up. I think there is

an element where some people find it interesting in a transgressive sense or something. And I'd want to say, I hope it has no modern political manifestations, but it does, it does pop up with a degree that if I were a Jewish American, I think I would find it disturbing as, more disturbing as you do. I don't get why some people think in this particular political moment, re-litigating an 80-year-old war's morality is of great importance. But some people like that, I'm, I will say, I'm sympathetic to the position. Can I just jump in for a second? Sure, sure, sure. Like, when you, first of all, I think it's not just Jewish Americans.

I think every American should feel worried about this question of whether Hiller was truly the. Yeah. But, but I mean, beyond that, when you say you're like, I don't know why. somebody would bring that up but you know like that I know why they would bring it up because they they you know what I'm saying like that's fair that's fair there's there's there is it's unfortunate I do think that pattern is real for it certainly at least some of the people doing it big picture I recognize vice president Vance and everyone in this coalition we have a tough challenge we asked we were doing one of our exclusives interviews I think it was when we had

Megan, I think it was actually when we had Michael Nulls on and we just asked the crowd, raise your hands, do you agree more with Ben Shapiro or more with Tucker? And it was about 50-50. Ultimately, what we've been saying is we have to be able to build a coalition that is Ford. And what I liked with Vice President Vance was he's saying, we are going to define this movement by positive things, by positive affirmations. And those are going to be good affirmations that make us a superior. are alternative to the left. And I think if Vice President Vance is setting a positive example and if he's taking on a leadership role that shows that positive example, he can shape the movement in a good direction that is good on policy, good on unifying rhetoric. And instead of having to go around playing place and disavowing people, what you are is what you are avowing is going to make people into something better. And I think that's an example Charlie himself tried to set while he was with us? I was truly humbled by how right Andrew and Charlie and you, Blake, were about how you set

up the whole America Fest. I just came away feeling like it could not have gone better. And that was because of the disparity between me and the views that I heard there. Hey, everybody. This is Andrew Colvette, executive producer of the Charlie Kirk Show. Berna is proud to continue supporting Charlie Kirk's mission and the important work. of Turning Point USA because empowering Americans to defend their freedoms begins with protecting themselves, their families, and their communities. The Burna, less lethal launcher looks like a firearm,

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and see why tens of thousands of Americans are choosing Burna for peace of mind. I have to ask, I think this is going to be the hardest question that Batya has to navigate. As a Jewish woman, what is your favorite Christmas movie? Or is there like a Hanukkah movie? I don't even know. Okay. I just every year I watch all of the Christmas rom-coms.

And the thing about them is, is that they're all exactly the same. And they're all equally delightful and delicious. So I couldn't even tell you which is the best one, because I can just watch all of them again and again. Is it like, is it, where's, uh, are there? Are there traditions, I know, I know Jewish Americans often eat Chinese on Christmas. Are there traditional movies they watch that are like emphatically not Christmas movies or something? Well, the Big Lebowski is often on the list for sure. The dude abides.

You know, I'm an Orthodox Jew. So the traditions of like secular liberal Jews, I'm not as familiar with them. You know, to us, Christmas is, it's funny because one of the things is, you know, like there's certain texts that you're supposed to. study and that you're not supposed to study on Christmas due to like so you know there's that conversation as well but I'm not this is way more complicated than I realized this was a hard question the J.D. Vance question's easy. All right. I accidentally opened up a whole can of worms asking a Jewish woman what her favorite Christmas movie. It's not a fair question. It's not a fair question. I apologize. Bati did wonderful with it though. Christmas rom-coms. What are those even?

is it's like love actually is one love actually love actually hold on what's the one with um what's the one what's the one with john kusack and the british gal where they they they they meet and then they try and find each other again uh i'm forgetting that's that's another christmas movie kind of it's a really good movie called the family stone um see you and i have wildly different movie taste botcha this is this is this is spinning out of control we need to bring it back rain it back in all right so my here's my pointed question for actually why you gave. So you've got guys like Steve Bannon. He calls himself a Zionist. You've got Matt Gates, who just did the interview with Tucker Carlson. He calls himself pro-Israel. You've got a lot. Megan Kelly has been traditionally extremely

pro-Israel. Their biggest beef is that they feel, and by the way, Charlie had this conversation with Megan, you know, just before he was assassinated, actually, was just this feeling from like, the Gentile friends of the Jewish people in Israel, that there is a moral blackmail campaign where the pressure just feels like, you know, if you're only with us 80% of the way, we're not going to be happy and we're going to call you names. I do find it counterproductive. I'm not saying everybody's guilty of it. I'm literally about to send a video to Dennis Prager wishing him a Merry Christmas because he loves Christmas. You know I love you completely, even when I disagree with you, but that's, so what is that dynamic and what do you do about that? Do you feel like the response

after October 7th is driving away Friends of Israel? I'm going to give an analogy, okay? I am a person who feels that we should not be funding the Ukraine war, okay? I've thought that from the beginning. Two weeks in, Putin was like, if you all just recognize the status quo and ratify it, that Crimea belongs to Russia, which he had already taken eight years earlier, you know, that the Dunbass is independent, which there was a civil war there, and that Ukraine is not part of NATO, I'll withdraw immediately. I thought we should have pushed for that. You know, we had gas prices were insane at the time. I just didn't understand why, you know, a few hundred kilometers in Eastern Europe was the responsibility of the American working class to bear. Now, if you hold that view, which I do,

you will get letters snail mail delivered to your home with death threats from people who are pro-Ukraine. The entire Ukraine lobby will come after you. They will impugn your character. They will call you a Putin puppet. Doesn't matter how many times you say Putin is a thug and a murderer, which is what I believe. The people who feel very strongly about this issue will do everything they can to get you to shut up. And you know what, Andrew, that is their job. I don't hold that against them.

And the idea that that would make me embrace Russia as the good guys because the Ukrainians are behaving insane at the extremes, that's insane because I don't answer to the inverse of what the most extreme people in a lobby are doing. I answer to my God. I have to face myself in the mirror. So, you know, and the fact that there are these loons at the extreme of the Ukraine lobby, that doesn't even influence how I think about Zelensky or the Ukrainian people or the vast majority of the people who think we should be funding the war in Ukraine. I have a policy difference

that makes me very unpopular with a very big group of people and the extremes of them are extreme in their opposition to me and think I should be dead for having my view. The idea that I would allow that to influence my view would make me an unsurious person. So do I think there are people in the Israel lobby who embarrass me because they are extreme? Sure. Do I think Israel itself has in some ways behaved badly, especially vis-à-vis our president, the greatest friend the Jewish people have ever had? Yes. Does that, if somebody allows that to determine whether they interview Holocaust survivors, if anybody telling you that that is an excuse to become anti-Semitic, I think is not a morally serious person. That is a person who is not answering.

to their god that is a person who is answering to the inverse of the algorithm and i look down on that yeah yeah and i know that you think some of the reaction has been counterproductive so i just wanted to give you an opportunity to to say that and listen i am going to convince you on jd vance it's just going to happen i know i'm going to take a bow and the internet's going to know because jd van's a good man and i know you're you're waiting you're waiting for you're waiting for the the signal to proceed. We're going to get you there, Bata. Thank you for joining on this 23rd of December, two days before our Christian Christmas. For more on many of these stories and news you can trust, go to charliekirk.com.