The Charlie Kirk Show - Charlie vs. The Students on Immigration

Episode Date: April 18, 2026

In this bonus episode, Charlie debates students from many different campuses on the critical issues of immigration, border security, and what makes someone a criminal. Watch every episode ad-free on members.charliekirk.com!    Get new merch at charliekirkstore.com!Support the show: http://www.charliekirk.com/supportSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

My name is Charlie Kirk. I run the largest pro-American student organization in the country fighting for the future of our republic. My call is to fight evil and to proclaim truth. If the most important thing for you is just feeling good, you're going to end up miserable. But if the most important thing is doing good, you will end up purposeful. College is a scam, everybody. You've got to stop sending your kids to college. You should get married as young as possible and have as many kids as possible. Go start a turning point USA college chapter. Go start a turning point you would say high school chapter.

Go find out how your church can get involved. Sign up and become an activist. I gave my life to the Lord in fifth grade. Most important decision I ever made in my life and I encourage you to do the same. Here I am. Lord, use me. Buckle up, everybody. Here we go.

Noble Gold Investments is the official gold sponsor of the Charlie Kirk Show, a company that specializes in gold IRAs and physical delivery of, precious metals. Learn how you could protect your wealth with noble gold investments at nobelgoldinvestments.com. That is noble goldinvestments.com. Let's talk about the border. We have brought in 5% of the population of Haiti. I don't see the issue with that, though. Like as you don't see the issue? Allowing immigrants into our country, I mean, is that not the foundation of America? These are illegal immigrants. People seeking refuge for the best country in the world. Isn't that the whole point of your like organization?

the U.S. is the best country in the world shouldn't we be obligated to help people that are suffering? Yes, America is the best country. Therefore, citizens should come first, not foreigners. So we have an obligation to our own people. Yeah, so the pathway to citizenship should become easier. No, we should deport them all back to their homeland. We should deport them all back to their homeland. All the immigrants, okay. All the illegal foreigners, yes.

In Springfield, Ohio, in one town, English as a second language speakers in one high school went from 250 to 1,500 kids in two years. These communities are being overrun. Go down to Aurora, Colorado, right down the street here. Entire apartment complexes are now being run by Venezuelan gangs. Not to mention every day an American citizen is being killed. From Lake and Riley to Rachel Morin to 11-year-olds that are being killed in DUI accidents. We have a belief that our founding fathers had, which is if your government does not fulfill its obligation to its own people first,

its government is not legitimate. And that's what's happening right now. Our government is now providing taxpayer-funded cell phones, hotel rooms, benefit, rooms, benefits, airplane rides, cash for foreigners, but not for Americans. If you guys as an American citizen want a free cell phone, they'll laugh at you. As a foreigner from Venezuelan, you get one on the southern border. You get a flight to any city that you want. You get a luxury hotel in New York City. You get taxpayer-funded health care. That is the inversion. That is elevating somebody from a distant land over our own people. When our own kids can't afford homes, when our own people

are seeing an increase in crime homelessness, and we have over 50,000 homeless vets in this country. down to the social contract. Wait, so the government should support veterans, support citizens, and more we should do. Yeah, so, yeah, so we should spend more on our people with like better health care, better social programs. That's literally what you just said. We should spend it on veterans and not on foreigners. Sure, and American citizens with like cheaper health care. That's what you just said.

Well, hold on. Free phones, airplane rides, public transit. That sounds great for Americans. No, it sounds terrible, actually. For Americans? Yes, government should not be giving free phones to anybody, okay? You said that the citizen should come first in those programs. Yes, you know how they should come first by not having to compete against a foreigner for your job. But I don't think that's the case, though, when mostly... How about this? If your own perspective was correct, would you feel comfortable going Uber right now to Aurora, Colorado,

and going to those three apartment complexes? I mean, according to the Aurora police, I probably would. They say the apartment's complexes are not overrun. You should get in the car and go... Go talk to anybody here and go knock on the door, and they'll extort you for cash, because we're a country that is open for looting right now. For the entire world,

over 118 countries have entered the southern border. That we know of, at least 99 people on the terrorist watch list, have come across the southern border. We're talking about people from Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, from Iran, people from Pakistan, that are coming here and mean harm to the interior of the United States. not to mention we're breaking down what it means to be a citizen. A citizen should be put first above anybody else.

If a government does not do that, then a government is not fulfilling its basic obligation. And the number one obligation is to make sure that its people can have a pathway to a better life and a good life, not a variety of free stuff, but not have to compete with somebody from Brazil for a home. But not sure. The way that we're not doing that is that we're importing the third world and we're quickly becoming the third world. Why don't we use our resources to improve the third world so they're not coming here rather than just spending the same amount of money? You think we should be concerned about Central American politics. I don't care. I care about our own people.

So then you don't care about those people that are sex trafficking children. Of course I care about it. You say you don't want to spend the money to make that change happen. Number one, we spent trillions, hundreds of billions of dollars. It doesn't do anything any good. That's not true. Number two, it is not the role of the American government to solve the problems of Panama, El Salvador, and Honduras. and our own citizens are suffering and are crying out for help.

So why has the billions of dollars spent on Central American aid over the last four years and it's been affected at slowing the rates of sex trafficking in Central America? Yeah, it hasn't slowed anything. No, it's been affected. It hasn't affected anything. What you're talking about is bribing these governments where they then go give it to cartel leaders and say, hey, this month, send 20,000 people instead of 40,000 people. That's not what that money is going towards.

It's going towards NGOs and bottom up stabilization. You think NGOs spend the money correctly? Okay, you are so naive. By the way, more people are crossed in the Darien Gap than ever before. Not to mention, they're coming across on the CBP1 app across the border into the interior of the United States in every single state. You cannot continue to have a country if you import an unfamiliar third world this quickly into America. So there should be a path to immigration?

No. No immigrants. No immigrants in the country. None. We need a total complete shutdown of immigration in this country until every single Gen Z person can afford a home and can get. their act together and be able to afford the American dream. So what's your path to Gen Z getting homes? Is it just kicking all brown people out? Not brown people. I think we should...

Immigrants, yeah, yeah, yeah. We should... Anyone that's here illegally should be deported back to their country of homeland. By the way, it's a moral position. So H-1B visas that, like, generate and stimulate the economy, kick those out? We get to know, that's interesting. H-1B. We're studying computer, anything.

Anybody, computer engineering? You guys have to compete against a foreigner for a job. That's wrong. Every... Yeah, American... Well, I actually care about the country more than the free market. So colleges should better prepare students and better utilize government resources. Well, college is a scam.

But, yes, we did that earlier. For computer science, they shouldn't go to college. Well, actually, you don't need to go to college for computer science. You don't need to go to college for computer science? No, you could do a coding class in a couple months and get a job. Yes. Alphabet is hiring right now? You could get a job at Alphabet, Google, taking a C++ class.

Correct. Yes. They're hiring coders after a 60-day coding class. To answer your question, A country that ceases to secure its own sovereignty and does not think I care more about my own people than the foreigners ceases to be a country. You're a colony and you're something else. And we are seeing our generosity be taken advantage of. I am all for American charities going down to Panama and helping out.

I'm all for people giving the charity. So we should reallocate U.S. spending towards things that are actually effective for people in and outside of our borders. So then we don't have people coming into our borders and then we can help our people. Well, no, the way, again, if they come to the border and the border is closed and you say, Astala vista, go back to Nicaragua. Or we spend in Central America, they don't have to come to the U.S., and then we have a better U.S. The same amount of spending. No, no, first of all, to solve the problems of the third world would cost trillions of dollars,

and that would all be laundered and not even work. And again, it's not the position of the American government to go throw money around in the Southern Triangle. Instead, it's, our country's closed. We're not open for looting anymore. go make Nicarago great again or go do what El Salvador is done. El Salvador is now a safe and stable country and they're seeing their GDP go up

and it's not because of us. Yeah, it is. We put $4 billion into South Central America. Hold on. And, you know, Buckele barely took the money. You know why it's safe? Buckele has turned El Salvador's safe because he locked up all the criminals. He locked up 40,000 criminals and put them in prisons and El Salvador

is now safer than America. El Salvador is the murder capital of the world and now El Salvador is much safer than America. I think it's wrong if you guys are afraid to walk the streets of Denver at night. I wouldn't walk the streets of Denver at night. Would you guys? No.

That's a breakdown of the fundamental role of government. Would you guys walk the streets of L.A. at night? No. The streets of San Francisco? No. We can't walk our own greatest cities at night, and we want to bring in more people from the Third World? Hell no.

In the case of immigration, if you hard restrict it and make it harder to get in, the only people who are going to make the attempts to get in or generally going to make the attempts to get in are more likely to commit crimes. Well, that's just not. There's no data or evidence to suggest that at all. When we've had the strictest immigration policies, crime was at its lowest in this country.

Well, that's correlation. Well, no, it's actually direct causation. Right now we have wide open borders, correct? DNA background testing from over 120 different countries. Sure, but I don't think that has to do with the process of getting into the country. Well, it has to do with the process of getting in the country because if it's extremely difficult to get in through legally, people are going to resort to coming through illegally. Is that not true?

But we should just prevent both. That's the point. You should prevent people getting in in any way? Yeah, well, we should have a total immigration moratorium in this country completely. We have, like, the lowest unemployment we've had in a long time. Wouldn't we want more workers? No, we want wages to go up for American workers. Yeah.

It's the opposite. So you want to restrict the labor pool so that you guys get the jobs first, not some competitor from Korea or Japan that comes in and steals your tech job. shouldn't we invest in American workers first before foreigners? We should. We should. But why do you think wages are not keeping up with inflation? Because we're bringing in millions of people into this country every single year that you guys have to compete against, and they don't have student loan debt.

So they're able to undercut wages every single year. Yeah, continue. If we're bringing in so many people, I don't think we would have as low unemployment as we would right now. Would we? There's two types of unemployment. There's structural unemployment, and then there's specialized unemployment. Specialized unemployment is very, very high, which is about eight to nine. 9%, which is more computer science, data engineering.

But we have millions of people that have entered the disabled roles, too. But to your point, we do have millions of people coming into the... I mean, it's not even a question. But how many of those people you think that are coming in or would comb in if we made it faster and more easy are going to be taking these high specialized tech jobs? Well, very few, but the point is that they undercut the muscular class, which is the very people that pay the biggest burden for all these policies. that the high unemployment is in specialized, not in general unemployment.

Correct. If general unemployment is so low, then why is it, like, why are we worried about people coming and taking the jobs of, like, the labor? Well, that's not the only reason why we're worried. We're worried because many of them are coming in illegally, and it's their criminals, every single one of them, so they break our laws. I think you're proving my point here, though. But no, you're just making one sliver of economics, though.

Numbers aside, how many of you guys have seen things get so expensive in the last year and a half? Okay, so that's just... I agree, but I think we have different reasons, because I see that, that major companies. Why are prices going up? I see major companies are owning different things like cereal brands. There's like two companies that own all cereal brands. And when they can increase the prices continually and say, hey, look, guys, it's inflation. When they're making record profits that they've never made before. Yeah, if that's the case, then why are small businesses

raising their prices? Small businesses are raising their prices because the products that they're getting in from these major two, three companies are getting pushed up. Okay, so how does inflation work? Inflation works by having more money in the system. And generally, because of that, your dollar is worth less, and then your wages don't really increase. And because your wages don't increase, everything's costing more to you. So true or false, we have injected around $10 trillion of new money in the last three years? Absolutely. Okay, so, yeah, that is the number one reason why we're seeing prices increase.

Absolutely. But I think the inflation itself has slowed down a lot, and the prices themselves. It depends on what good or service you're talking about. I agree. And I think the reason it's what good or service is because the goods are services that are in control of borderline monopolies are able to raise their prices more and more. That's why when you go to the grocery store, the big issue is a bunch of things are going up that are controlled by major companies that are supplying all these grocery stores, right? Yeah, but a lot of them have competitors. And so,

I mean, I can list five or six examples where there's robust competition and prices are still going up. But we have too many dollars chasing too many, too few goods and services. That's the big problem. Our worker base isn't really churning as it should, because we have such low unemployment, which is why I'm saying immigration should be easier to come in, because when your workers aren't moving through positions and stuff, wages aren't going to increase that often because you're more likely get a wage increase by switching to another job that pays you more. Yeah. So wouldn't it make, if you want to get wages up, shouldn't you want to restrict the amount of workers in the workforce?

I mean, it's pretty, so if you have 200 people you could hire to fix a window or 30 people to hire to fix a window, which pool is going to have the higher average? average wage. I think the smaller pool would. Okay, we agree. The issue is a lot of people right now aren't wanting to go switch to other jobs all the time. And when you get more people and more jobs, you're likely to have more churn through there. Okay, yeah, I don't think we disagree on that. Okay, cool. So that's why I'm saying like... You don't have me convinced on the immigration issue, though. Okay. Because if you restrict immigration across the board, then you have a, you've a prioritization and a lesser pool of competition for foreign-born American law.

labor. Sure, but I think, am I wrong in saying your issue is that you have issues with specialized labor coming in and taking the positions of higher, paying more specialized? Yeah, I mean, to be fair, it's specialized muscular class labor, which is conflated. So there's advanced manufacturing, too, which does not require a college degree, but can take six to nine months of apprenticeship. Or, for example, being an auto mechanic, that's not exactly being a coder, but that's tough work, right? Or, you know, even more simply... I just don't think that that's the majority of labor that is going to come in if we allow more people through.

And it's not like a blanket, oh, we're letting everybody through. But right now I see my biggest issue with the right is that, like, why are we restricting more immigration other than, like, illegal immigration? But why are we not proposing ways to loosen immigration to fix the jobs that aren't like that? Because there's, like, most jobs aren't generally in those classes. You're coming after this in good faith.

My response would be, we need a national job. training program to get Americans properly trained before we try to import foreign labor to fill those positions. And that goes back to my college as a scam type postulization. So we have oversupplied the credentialing, which is for your college degree, and we've undersupplied the six to nine month specialization vector. And because that, we have massive job openings. I want to get to the next question. Thank you. Appreciate it. Charlie had an absolutely relentless passion for learning. I saw it up close and personal, and every waking moment, every spare moment that he could. He had a book open. He had a podcast open. He had a Hillsdale online course open.

He was always diving into new ideas, absorbing information, studying up and sharpening his skills. That's why I love Dr. Arne at Hillsdale College. They shared a deep understanding that learning is the key to shaping your character, creating courage and changing lives. Charlie never stopped learning and neither should you. Through Hillsdale's online courses, he spent time studying the classics, the American founding, and the enduring truths of the Bible. Now it is your turn. With Hillsdale's free online courses, you can follow in his footsteps, learning from real professors

and challenging yourself with rigorous coursework that's free and accessible to anybody who's willing to learn. A great place to start is their brand new course on logic and rhetoric. Learn from Hillsdale professors how to speak math. masterfully, make a powerful point, and see how clear thinking leads to better decision-making and more effective speech. Don't wait. Go to Charlie forhillsdale.com to enroll today. It's completely free. This is a real good one, by the way, logic and rhetoric. Pick up the mic, carry it forward, learn like Charlie. Start right now at Charlie forhillsdale.com. So I just had a question, because you talk a lot about protecting and securing our southern borders.

but as the granddaughter of immigrants, I think that we get into a lot of complicated disputes with the idea that immigrants are criminals, are drug dealers, and things like that. So I just want to hear what your opinion is on those expectations or those, what do you call it, those stereotypes that are put on Hispanic communities, Latino communities, and how they change the way people perceive immigration. Sure. So thank you for the question. question. So you said you're the first generation

student or first generation American? I'm a first generation student. Cool, great. Second generation American. Did I hear that right? Third generation American on my mom's side. Great. Second on my dad's. When your grandparents then, is that right? Came to this country? Did they do so through the legal process that was

in front of him? So my father got married to my mother. So he's a legal resident of the United States. She's been here her entire life. But did she enter legal? My great, she did. She's born. Here, yeah. Got it.

My grandpa on my dad's side entered in illegally. Okay. So I'm not here to, like, insult your grandpa, right? But we must be very clear that the type of immigration that we support is when you follow our rules and you come on our terms. And that you do not break into a country uninvited and you try to cut me. Can I add something to that? The reason why he left and a lot of people in Mexico do is because of the political state, especially in the 70s, and 80s when they decided to move.

They have a government that isn't supportive of their constituents and because of drug problems their only choice was to move. I totally sympathize. That's not true. It's never the only choice to commit a crime and we should not put up with it. And so it is an insult

to other immigrants from Vietnam and Laos and Pakistan that have to wait decades in line to morally equivalent people that come in and just break in, oh, I have an unstable country. Like half of the world's countries are unstable. So, look, we just have to be very clear with this, is that if you come into the country uninvited, you have committed a crime and you are a criminal. And we could decide that we're not going to enforce our laws, or we can say that when you are a criminal, you should then be punished for that crime, aka sent back to your country of origin, because you were not invited.

And it is an insult, again, to the polls and to the Czechoslovakians and from the Senegalese and people all across the world that don't have the proximity of luxury just to waltz into America. You call it a luxury to leave a country that has political tyranny and come into a country with opportunity? Yes, to live in Mexico to be able to go 100 miles north and break into America. Do you know how many people in Pakistan would kill to be on that border? That's why we bring them in. Well, we shouldn't, right? That's the point. And secondly, do you think that you have a right to immigrate to America?

I think that I didn't have a choice. My grandparents made that decision for me. I'm not trying to attack your grandparents, but no one has a right to go to anybody else's country. You are invited. It is a privilege, not a right to come into America. So it's a privilege to live a life that requires you to have clean water, clean food, clean air.

And you have to fight for that? Yes, it is not. But we didn't? Hold on a second. Born here, we didn't fight for that? Well, my ancestors did fight for that, actually. And I'm a very thankful recipient. of many generations of Americans that fought for the greatest nation ever to exist.

By doing what? Coming here? Illegally? What, wait, what did my ancestors do? They came over here in 1620, fought in the Revolutionary War, fought in the Civil War, fought in World War I, fought in World War II. So because my grandpa didn't come here in 1620, it gives him no right to have a good life? No, he can fill out paperwork and wait in line, like the rest of the world. And then we can see whether or not it's in our best interest to allow him to come in. And so we have to weigh costs and benefits. Do you think that the American government should first have a obligation to citizens before foreigners?

Okay. I think we have an obligation. Here's the thing. Yeah, we're obligated because we're citizens to have the rights that we have. But that doesn't mean we can't open up our borders and we have the process to do so. You being a younger American and everyone in the audience is the first generation in American history to have it be worse off than your parents. So the social, and you agree with that, social contract. more expensive. So wouldn't it be rational for the American government to say we're going to prioritize younger

generation Americans that are American passport holders and citizens before those in another nation? I don't think, I don't want to say anything that offends people. But you know, go ahead. I've already said it, right? I've already said it. Whatever. I think that the

way we're going about it is wrong. And that if we don't have a clear path to citizenship, we won't open up those opportunities for people to come and seek a good life. But I also think that yeah, we are required to have those rights ourselves as American citizens. Seeking a good life is fine. It's a nice added benefit. Our government does not exist to improve

the life of foreign citizens. But we should be open to the idea of accepting that. Of course we are, if we have our own house in order. We are in chaos right now. We have the most depressed, suicidal, anxious generation history. Our birth rate is collapsing. Kids can't afford homes. You guys are drowning in debt.

You have to compete for jobs against foreigners. Our country is a mess right now. And so when your country's a mess and your home is in disarray and bedlam, your own government should say, time out. I have a heart for the people of Haiti. I have a heart for the people of every country. But you're not coming here until this generation at least has it as good as their parents. And that is a very simple moral statement. If when you bring people in, they make the life worse for the people that were already here.

Should we stop letting those people in? Do they, though? Yes, they do. Illegals every day are doing DUIs and kids are dying across the country. But if Americans are doing this, it's fine? Well, it's not fine. They should go to jail. But this is the red herring.

Is that Americans are invited guests. Foreigners are people that broke into the country that shouldn't be here. And none of those crimes should be happening at all. One of them is a crime of choice. The other is just a crime because that's part of what happens when you have a society. So when you have Americans that are murdered by illegals, that is because we have decided and chosen, we're okay with them being here. And if they kill our people, no big deal.

That's, I'm just trying to... I know we're not going to agree on it. That's why I came up here in the first place. Are you okay with deporting every illegal person that's here? No. Why? Because there's some people here that are not represented well by the media. There's a lot of illegal immigrants here that are working their butts off for the life that they are.

I don't care if they're working hard. But the point is, what should the punishment be for breaking into a country? Depends on the crime you commit after you break into it. Okay. That's it. I'm talking about just the crime is breaking in. What should the punishment be? I break into somebody's home.

What should their punishment be? Can you repeat that? Oh, so if you behave after you get here, that's fine. So to play that out, if someone comes into your dorm room uninvited, and they do the dishes and laundry, they can stay? If I'm not going to do my own dishes, heck yeah. They're doing my dishes for me? Cool.

If they don't kill me, I'm not dead. It is what it is, man. Well, they are killing a lot of Americans, but... You say they. Like, they are? Like, all illegal immigrants kill people? That's crazy. Many illegals do, actually. No, but it's just interesting. The punishment for the crime of breaking into a nation should be what it is in Switzerland and Israel and Hungary. Every person who breaks into a nation uninvited goes back to their country of origin, period. So why is there an emphasis on the southern border? Because most people come illegally through the southern border. The point I'm trying to make is that we categorize all illegal immigrants under the same thing.

Sex traffickers, drug dealers. Am I doing that? No, no. You're implying that all of them are doing these terrible things and not a small percentage of them. If you come into a country uninvited, definitionally you are a criminal. We're just not going to agree. It's fine. Then final question.

What is a criminal? What is a criminal? No, no, what is it? Would you agree with the definition? that a criminal is someone who breaks the law. Here's where I'm thinking. Here's the thing. I don't...

I know how he's going to turn it, and I don't fully... It's not a matter of turning it. It's a very ABC sequence. If they're not criminals, then tell me what a criminal is. And a criminal is obviously someone who breaks the law. Someone who comes across the southern border broke federal law. Therefore, they are a criminal. Okay, then we can just disagree.

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