The Charlie Kirk Show - The Obamagate Grand Jury Is Coming

Episode Date: August 5, 2025

Are Obamagate indictments imminent? And if so, who is getting tagged? Charlie reacts to Pam Bondi ordering a grand jury to look into the misdeeds of the Obama admin all the way back in 2016, and offers a note of caution. Then, Hillsdale Economics professor Charles Steele reacts to the Zohran Mamdani/Liz Warren summit, and the danger this duo's radical economics poses to American prosperity. Watch every episode ad-free on members.charliekirk.com!    Get new merch at charliekirkstore.com!Support the show: http://www.charliekirk.com/supportSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hey, everybody. Charlie Kirk here live from the Bitcoin.com studio. We discuss Russiagate why I don't think we should arrest Obama, even though he deserves it. Email us, as always, freedom at charliekirk.com and subscribe to our podcast. We talk mom-dani economics, and what is the greatest economic lie that college kids have coming into college? We unpack that with a professor, Dr. Steele from America's greatest college, Hillsdale College. Remember, take their free online courses at Hillsdale College. That's Charlie for Hillsdale.com. Dale.com. Buckle up, everybody. Here we go.

Charlie, what you've done is incredible here. Maybe Charlie Kirk is on the college campus. I want you to know we are lucky to have Charlie Kirk. Charlie Kirk's running the White House, folks. I want to thank Charlie. He's an incredible guy. His spirit, his love of this country. He's done an amazing job. Building one of the most powerful youth organizations ever created, Turning Point USA. We will not embrace the ideas that have destroyed countries, destroyed lives, and we are going to fight for freedom on campuses across the country. That's why we are here.

Noble Gold Investments is the official gold sponsor of the Charlie Kirk Show, a company that specializes in gold IRAs and physical delivery of precious metals. Learn how you could protect your wealth with noble gold investments at noblegoldinvestments.com. That is, noblegoldinvestments.com. It's where I buy all of my gold. Go to noblegoldinvestments.com. Breaking news, Pam Bondi has ordered a federal prosecutor, not named currently, to present evidence before a Florida grand jury to present at the case regarding Russia Gate. This is major news, everybody. Now, let's take a step back. Many people in the audience are very skeptical that we will ever see accountability.

But this is a very positive development. time and time again we've been promised accountability it goes all the way back remember bengazi we spent over a year and a half to two years on benghazi fugazi fugazi fagazi legazi reminds me of the wolf of wall street fugazi fugazi we were promised justice for that we were promised justice for the hillary clinton emails we were promised justice for the people that lied about the hunter Biden laptop. We are promised justice for the crimes that happened during COVID and the lockdowns, the vaccine mandates, and the mask mandates and the corruption of our sciences. So just color me

a little bit cautious here that I think immediately that we are going to get perp walks and indictments, but that is what we need. Fifty one intelligence officials under Joe Biden lied about the Hunter Biden laptop. Now, Pam Bodney ordering this federal prosecutor is a good step. Overall, we want to see less chatter, less memes, less talk on social media or TV. We want to see more action. If crimes did happen, investigate it, get the evidence, and be serious about it. But hopefully the Department of Justice also understands all the risks here. Prosecuting a former president of Barack Obama didn't work great for the Democrats in 24. So would prosecuting Obama be any better? He did win two elections. The Florida venue is a very

ambitious scheme. They apparently want to prosecute Brennan or Obama because the Biden Department of Justice raided Mara Lago six years ago after they left office. That could be seen as catering more to a very specific grievance of the base rather than narrowly looking at the crimes that they can prove. I would introduce some caution here about trying to indict Obama. Not, of course, I think he probably deserves it. But remember, Obama still remains very popular amongst the American people. You could potentially create a political martyr. Bren, on the other hand, however, I think indicting Brennan and Comey, who are the operators here, we want this case to be ironclad. If you indict them and this fails, it's worse than never even trying. So this needs to be a

open and shut case. No reaches, no creativity. Because, for example, if you indict Barack Obama, which I admit he probably deserves it, he'll have the most unbelievable attorneys. It will be the number one new story of the Trump government going after Obama. Remember, Obama has presidential immunity too. Now, John Brennan does not. John Brennan does not have presidential immunity. James Comey does not have presidential immunity. So if we are serious about this, and I think we need to be, this impaneling of the grand jury is major news. It's significant.

But understand, we have to measure twice and cut once. And from all sources and from everyone we've talked to, Brennan seems to be the chief villain of the story. And Brennan is not a sympathetic figure. You look at the eye. He's got a nasty scowl face. He's constantly lying. He was a former communist.

He's a bad person. Obama, I don't know. if we want to take the Obama bait, even though he might deserve it, even if the evidence is pretty good in Obama's direction, he is presidential immunity, you could create a massive Democrat political martyr. But I'm open to hearing both sides of the debate on this. But it seems as if Brennan is, was the hub of the conspiracy. He was the epicenter. Can we get that piece of tape guys where Brennan, Comey, and Hillary were all parroting the same lie? He was the fulcrum point. of all things, Russiagate.

Now, what exactly were the crimes that were committed? Well, we don't know the specifics, but it was likely a grand and seditious conspiracy against the American people to thwart the sovereign of an election. This is President Donald Trump. He called into squawk box on this very topic, play cut 351. The Justice Department now tapping a grand jury to look into the intelligence community's assessment of what was happening with Russia. Is that you have nothing to do with with directing the Justice Department? No, I have nothing to do. Pam is doing a great job. I have nothing to do with it.

I will tell you this. They deserve it. I was happy to hear it. I actually read it just like you did. I have nothing to do with it. But what they did in the election, what they did in even the last election, but it was too big to rigs. But what they did in the 2020 election is is grotesque. Now, mind you, even if President Trump did order his Attorney General to do this, that's perfectly constitutional. It's perfectly legal. The Attorney General acts at the behest of the President of the United States. But I understand that you want to keep some customs and something separate because you don't want to see this as a politically motivated thing. So I get that. But just so we are clear, and I get this question a lot on college campuses, oh, well, Trump orders the Attorney General. He's allowed to. The Attorney General works for the President of the United States. But from all sources, Brennan seems to be.

be the culprit. He is the center. He is the, he is the, he is the, he is the, he is the meeting point of the nervous system. He's the one where documents specifically show overriding the CIA's warnings to publish smears against President Trump. Brennan overrode all of the CIA objections, all of them, to the steel dossier being included in the new DNI assessment. John Brennan was the offensive coordinator of Russia game. He was calling the plays up from the press box. He was the one that was choreographing and orchestrating all the movements. He was the one calling pass, run, slant, out. He was in charge of all of the movements. This is a montage of James Comey, Brennan, and Hillary. We went through this tape last week. It's very important working up sequentially. But if I were to give my advice,

whatever it's worth, I would go all in on John Brennan. Unless you have Obama so stone cold dead to rights, it could potentially be a narrative distraction beyond anything that we want. My opinion, Brennan, based on everything we know publicly available, and there will be information presented to the grand jury that we do not have made available to us. But let's play cut 353. The Russians interfered in our election during 2016 cycle. It is a high confidence judgment of the entire intelligence community.

It was Russia in a very systematic way and tried to interfere in the election and to try to advance the prospects of Donald Trump being elected. Donald Trump knows that the Russians helped him win in 2016. There will always be an air of illegitimacy around the 2016 campaign. That was John Brandon saying the Russians actively helped Donald. That was a naked lie on television. Now remember, Tulsi mentioned whistleblowers coming out. I bet more whistleblowers from lower ranks will come forward.

I don't necessarily think they'll go all the way up to Obama. But first, build the case against Brennan. Build the case against John Brennan. Reliably, durably. And then we go from there. I think Brennan and Comey are the end. actual worker bees on this entire coup. I want your thoughts, freedom at charliecirk.com.

Do you think we should focus on Obama, Brennan, or Comey? We're getting lots of different. And I'm saying Obama likely deserves it, but you got to really have had the stone cold case dead to rights. And if you don't, it could be worse than not even trying. It could derail a lot of the projects we have. Again, I don't know all the evidence, but I see definitely Brennan as the architect, the designer, the coordinator of this malevolent effort.

to undermine the U.S. Constitution, popular sovereignty, and President Donald Trump. Charlie Kirk here, we know that rates are still high and that they can make refinancing or purchasing feel out of reach. But markets can shift fast. And when they do, I want you to be in the strike zone. So what is the strike zone? That's a sweet spot when rates dip just enough to meet your target goal. But it doesn't last long. Make sure you're ready to strike first and save big. At Sierra Pacific Mortgage, Andrew and Todd and their team will get you set up and keep you in informed so you can strike at the right time. These are the guys I trust. With 40 years of experience, they are really the experts.

And they make it easy because they keep everything in house. Get prequalified today. Visit Andrew and Todd.com. Do it now to get a priority spot at the front of the line before the rest of the herd jumps in. And when the market enters the strike zone, you'll strike first and save big. Call AAA, AAA, 1172. That's AAA, 1172, or online at Andrew and Todd.com. That is Andrew and Todd.com. They help me, and they'll help you, Andrew and Todd.com. All right, let's play a piece of tape here. Let's go to Obamagate here.

This is Stephen Miller, 247. If we have a country where we can continue to have FBI careerists and CIA careers, deep staters, who will fabricate and doctor evidence, who will create and produce fake material fabricate and material phony information to try to go after their political enemies up to and including the president, If we continue to create the impression and the reality that there is not a criminal, a severe criminal penalty for such conduct, it will never stop. It will never desist. It will keep on going forever. And we will continue to have a country that is sabotaged endlessly by the production of fake documents, fake material, fake plots against democratically elected officials. We can't have that.

There must be consequences. I think Obama is the head of the snake, but I think we have to be prudent about this. Number one, we were very critical when we said former presidents had never been touched by the system of justice, and he definitely deserves it, definitely. Obama had done sneaky stuff his entire career. You can't trust that guy. Everyone in the audience agrees. But let's get Brennan first. Let's get the Brennan Clapper Comey triad at it going first. Right here, email says, Charlie, I think you're right about charging Obama with the items. He needs to be indicted for sure. There's nothing that prevents him from being an unindicted co-conspirate. I just think we have to be very cautious on the Obama thing. He's already a super celebrity. Let's start on the bottom up, guys. Let's start on the bottom up and build that grand conspiracy.

And then if we have it, then we got Obama and we can indict him and put him in prison. Breaking news. FBI director Cash Patel has asked to help Texas authorities track down and arrest the Democrat lawmakers who fled the state to block a vote on redistricting. Very important piece of information there. Okay, let's put this up here from Alabama. I love this. This shows how people's information habits are amongst an Alabama gubernator. primary. This is a poll done by Signal. So this shows how are potential gubernatorial voters getting their information on the conservative side? Well, number one, no surprise is Fox News. Fifty-nine percent get their news from Fox News. We love Fox. It was able to host Fox and Friends weekend. Tons of friends there. They've been phenomenal. But number two is this program, the Charlie Kirk Show.

This is real empirical data done by Signal Research, C-Y-G-N-A-L. This is Charlie Kirk Show or Turning Point USA is the second largest news source for, I think, all voters in Alabama. And Blake has analyzed this. Really good demographics across the board. We have tons of women, both old and young. And right there, Tucker Carlson is basically within the average of us. So it's like Charlie Kirk, Tucker Carlson, right there. And then it's Newsmax DailyWy.

The Blaze, Megan Kelly, Candace Owens, all great friends of mine. Just goes to show the power of alternative media, and it shows that what we have been able to create on this program is a viral mover of where people look at for primary information. So someone sent that to me earlier. I said, Andrew, we've got to show this on screen. And the, right now, we're a little less popular with Catholics. It's not a huge surprise, though it's probably a small sample size in Alabama.

I love Catholics. We have fun debates. I definitely love Catholics and I love Catholicism. But it goes to show what we do on this program is different. It is unique and it is working. So it is the second largest, and it is the largest non, our program is the largest non-corporate media source or non-cable driven media source. We call balls and strikes, as you know, and you guys keep on tuning in our podcast keeps doing well because we call it as it is here on the program and we are truth seekers. It is the largest independent media source amongst Alabama voters.

Again, I wonder how applicable that is to other states, but you guys tune in for a reason, and it means a lot, and I want to thank you in the audience. And we listen to you. Literally, I'm reading these emails right now, Obama, Brennan, all that. I always have my laptop up for this reason, because you guys can reach me immediately. And people say, Charlie, what's your secret sauce? I'll say, look, I learned one thing from Rush Limbaugh, the great Rush Limbaugh, always had his laptop up. Now, it was a Mac desktop, and he was reading emails in the breaks. I do that every break. What is the audience feeling? What are you guys saying? And it's not, I mean, sometimes I think you guys send me stuff where you might be incorrect. But I want to know the vibe. I want to know the aura. I want to know the direction. And I definitely want to know your feedback on the top issues. It means a lot. So thank you guys. It's a phenomenal piece of data that is real empirical data that shows the success, that shows the velocity, that shows the increase of what we are able to be able to get done here on this program and at Turning Point USA. You have a lot of choices for cell phone service, with new ones popping up all the time, but here's the truth. There's only one that boldly stands in the gap for every American that believes that freedom is worth fighting for, and that is Patriot Mobile. The good news that you can switch to Patriot Mobile today without sacrificing quality or service. Are you worried about coverage? Well, don't be because Patriot Mobile uses all three major U.S. networks. If you have service in America today, you'll have as good or better coverage

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Use promo code Charlie and get a free month of service. Switch today. That's patriotmobile.com slash Charlie. Joining us now is Dr. Charles Steele, director of the Hutchinson Center for Commerce and Freedom and the Associate Professor of Economics and America's Greatest College, Hillsdale College. Dr. Steele, great to see you. Thank you so much for taking the time. Dr. Steele, you are also the one that did the understanding capitalism course, which is wonderful that people should check out at Charlie for Hillsdale.com. Dr. Steele, I want to talk to you about Mom Donnie. Let's just address one of his ideas. Why would freezing the rent and having government run, grocery stores in New York City be a bad economic idea. Dr. Steele. Well, thank you very much for the kind words about Hillsdale. We're striving to be the best college in the world, and we're going to do that. We may be there now. So this is an excellent question. I think people really need to understand what socialism is and how it works, really it doesn't work, and understand the importance of capitalism

and the free enterprise system. So you're asking about rent control. Rent control prevents owners of properties from being able to maintain them. It limits the amount of property that will be made available. It stops building and it creates shortages. That's also true of any kind of price controls that hold prices down, attempt to hold prices down. They don't actually do that.

They simply create shortages. And then the property will be allocated in some other way. Grocery stores, government grocery stores, I lived in the former Soviet Union. I also lived in communist China for a short time. And I've been in other places where they have government controls on these sorts of things. And if you like, shortages and standing in lines and not enough to eat, then government grocery stores are the way to go. That's the quick answer. So, Dr. Steele, let's zero in on the rent control.

It's actually, so there are tens of thousands of vacant apartments in New York City right now where he is running and they do not get improved upon and they do not have significant upgrades because of rent control. The cities with the most rent control in the United States, without exception, have the highest average housing prices, New York City, San Francisco, D.C., and they've had the controls for a long period of time. and so speak more about this, the direct connection between rent controls and freezing the rent and housing prices increasing. It actually hurts the very problem that they are seeking to solve. Sure. Why would anyone want to invest money? Why would you want to build apartments if you're not going to be able to charge an amount that allows you to recover your costs? And so there's the first problem. There's no point in investing in something where there's no possible return on it. And I mean, it's going to be important that we that we talk a little bit about capitalism and about profit and why that's important, why that's a valuable thing.

But just as a just as a starting point, if you can't recover your cost, you're not going to invest something. People will not invest in building new housing if there's if they're simply going to take a loss on it. And that's what the rent controls do. It's interesting that after the Vietnam War, after the United States, had left Vietnam and North Vietnam conquered South Vietnam. One of the Vietnamese, North Vietnamese finance ministers said, we managed to do to housing in Hanoi what the Americans could not do by bombing. We destroyed it and we destroyed it with rent controls. That's what rent controls do. And so I know that you're a professor of economics, but it's an irresistible call, the tempest,

temptation of rent control? Why is it though we're not able to shut ourselves of the political attraction to the allure of rent control despite its tragic and catastrophic failure? So Mr. Mandami just recently met with Elizabeth Warren and Warren has endorsed him, Senator Warren, and she put it this way. She said that we need affordability. And what's attractive is they say, we'll hold prices down. If we hold prices down, it's more affordable, right? Well, actually not so. What you actually do is constrained supply with less supply. It's less available. Whatever is whatever we're good commodity we're talking about, in this case, housing will be in less supply and therefore be allocated to a number of

across people, across the people attempting to get it via some other method, whether it is is waiting in line, bribery, special favors, something like this, but there will also be shortages inevitably with a system like that. It's attractive because we say, because the politician will say, we're going to give you something for free. We're going to do something that's cheap. It'll be, you know, we're affordable. It won't be available, but boy, the price will be low. And that's, that low price is what, no one will have it, but it will be a very low prize. Yeah. There'll be no abundance, but it won't cost very much. And so the political realities, it's so hard and frustrating because our job as conservatives or free market people, we have to

defend a system that it's not about free stuff. It's about earned success. It's about meritocratic ascension. It is about investment. It is about delayed gratification. But the truth is that people's frustrations are real. And so, Dr. Steele, there are real economic problems in New York. There are real economic problems in Boston. What would a free market capitalist, market-based solution look like? Not the Mamdadi garbage. What would you say are two or three things that these cities can do to fix housing, cost of living, transportation? Our population is getting crushed by the affordability crisis. Dr. Steele, what would be one or two proven free market ways that we can address? these problems. In particular, for housing, we have various kinds of controls that zoning laws and

things like this that actually people from building. All sorts of restricting building codes, permitting processes, and things like this. In California, for example, it is nearly impossible to build any kind of reasonable housing because of the regulatory systems. New York City. New York City, of course, is a bit of a different situation because New York is a constrained area. If you think about Manhattan, it is largely built up. But it is very difficult to upgrade, to build anything new, and to develop, to further develop property that one owns. This is why you have parts of New York City, which are basically just slums and have been left abandoned because it won't have, nobody can afford to put anything into.

them to build them. So one of the first things I would do is get rid of the housing regulations and the building regulations and the various kinds of environmental rules also which don't actually help the environment but do block any kind of development. That would be the first thing you could do and it would make a great deal of difference. Another thing would be to just decontrol prices. That's a big deal and certainly in New York City we have rent, They have rent controls. It's interesting. A nice example of this.

I did my Ph.D. at New York University, so I lived in New York City for four years. And some of my friends who went on, finished their doctoral degrees and went on to the World Bank and the IMF, they had rent-controlled apartments. I believe they still have them. Once you have a rent-controlled apartment, it is... Yep. It's a, it's a, it's a, it's a plum thing to have. And so these are wealthy people. That's right. Friends of mine, nice people. But boy, you don't want to get rid of your, you don't want to get rid of those things. No, in L.A. In L.A., in L.A., that's exactly

right. That's right. Once you have them, it's a luxury item that you do not want to get rid of. And in L.A., you get a rent control apartment. Some of these people are making two, three, four, five hundred thousand dollars a year in a rent control apartment. And, They just, you know, they say, oh, you know, we're not giving that up. Let's play a piece of tape here. Let's go. I want you to respond to the democratic message of government-run grocery stores. 319.

When someone stands up and says, I will lead this city by making it more affordable. And here are my plans, real plans, plans to deliver on child care, plans to deliver on housing, plans to deliver. We're going to experiment. We're going to try things on groceries. that is the democratic message. That is the democratic message. And this sounds like Marxist ideology. And the grocery store thing, so let's say that there are city-run groceries.

What would the result of that be? I know you touched on it earlier, but let's go deeper. Well, it's interesting that Elizabeth Warren says they want to run experiments. These experiments have been run in the Soviet Union and other communist countries. and they're not going to get a different result here when they try this. What are the results of a government-run grocery store, first of all, low-quality, poor service, and shortages. And you get that because, first of all, and this is a really important point. Under capitalism, it's important to make a profit.

That's what keeps you in business. If you don't make a profit, then you're taking losses and your operations are shut down. But what's a profit? What does that mean? What it means is you're taking resources, inputs, and you're creating something that was more valuable to consumers than you started with. And the difference is profit. And that's a good thing. That's a sign that you have created value. Yes.

You have an incentive to hold cost down and to provide quality. Now, under a socialist system or a government system, there's no incentive to control costs. And in a government supermarket, government grocery store, no incentive, no price signal that's going to, you don't have a profit and loss signal. So no incentive to keep cost down. But at the same time, quality doesn't matter

because it's a government store. They don't need to earn a profit. So they just do whatever is convenient for the people working there, managing. Thus, you get under a socialist system, poor quality, and shortages. And that's what a government grocery store system would give you. Private student loan debt in America totals about $300 billion. Why Refi refinances private student loan debt and they do not care what your credit score is.

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Y-ReFi.com. That is Y-R-E-F-Y.F-Y.com. Dr. Steele continues with us from America's greatest college, the greatest college in the world, Hillsdale College. Dr. Steele, I cut you off. Please continue on government-run grocery stores. You were mentioning Venezuela, sir. Dr. Steele from Hillsdale College. Yes, Venezuela. Hugo Chavez, the communist who became dictator of Venezuela, imposed price controls on groceries and everything in supermarkets. shortages necessarily developed then because if you can't cover the cost of the goods, they're not going to be on the shelves.

He then used that when the shortages emerged as an excuse to nationalize the grocery stores, take them over. And it was really a plan that he had just simply to nationalize things simply by saying with the supermarkets, the grocery stores were not doing their, we're not doing their job. So he created the shortages. And he confiscated the property, became, as some might say, appropriating the means of production, which is something of course that Zohan Mamdani is called for. And then you have a socialist system and you have chronic shortages.

The consequences for Venezuela were stunted growth, malnutrition, and children that cannot be corrected. Permanent damage to children from starvation and from famine. that's what socialism does, and that's the result that you get in any time you use that kind of a system. Hopefully it wouldn't be so bad if they pulled something like this in New York City, because we still have a free enterprise system elsewhere. But it's a dangerous thing. People need to understand how destructive socialism is, and it really is destructive. So, Professor, you are a phenomenal teacher. Dr. Arne has entrusted you with a course Hillsdale

College. Two minutes remaining, what would you say is the greatest economic myth or stumbling block that you have to deprogram or confront of students that you come at Hillsdale College, something that they believe that is not true that you have to correct early on? Dr. Steele. I will tell you, yes, two things. Number one, people have a tendency to think in terms of class warfare. Even conservatives and Christians will sometimes think this, that necessarily there's conflict between capital and labor. Capital and labor are actually inputs, and workers and people who employ them actually are engaged in mutually beneficial exchange. And getting the idea of class conflict out of people's heads can be very difficult. Maybe even a bigger point,

although with Hillsdale students, they catch on quickly. Profit. Profit is a great thing. Profit is an incentive to serve your fellow man, provide goods and services that people want, need and willing to pay for and to do it at a cost that cost effectively. So you avoid waste. A system like the Soviet system is incredibly wasteful and generated goods and services that people didn't want. If you want to have a society that is productive, if people are going to have productive and rewarding lives and flourish, if we want to protect the environment, if we want a free and peaceful society, we need capitalism. socialism promises those things that it actually brings authoritarianism tyranny it divides people into the leaders and the serfs who must follow and it's a destruction tyranny and poverty

result so people need to understand the importance of capitalism and why it works dr steel you're welcome back anytime we need to talk more about capitalism we need to talk more about markets we need to talk more about what makes a what makes the economy tick and it's private property. It is profits. It is production. Dr. Steele from the greatest college in the world, Hillsdale College. Thank you so much. Thank you so much. I appreciate it. Terrific conversation. We've got to have him back on. So important. We can't lose sight of that. Email us, as always, Freedom at Charlie Kirk.com. Very interesting new Gallup poll shows Bobby Kennedy is the administration's most popular administration figure. We've been saying that on this program. We said that

RFK and the Maha movement is the most coherent movement that has sustained throughout MAGA. Very interesting. I just saw that on CNN. Thanks so much for listening. Everybody. Email us, as always, freedom at charliekirk.com. Thanks so much for listening, and God bless. For more on many of these stories and news you can trust, go to charliekirk.com.