The Comedian's Comedian Podcast - Ian Smith

Episode Date: May 14, 2026

This week I’m joined by two-time Edinburgh Comedy Award nominee, Ian Smith! You may also know him best as the co-host of the Northern News podcast with Amy Gledhill, as well as appearances on Live at the Apollo, Have I Got News For You and on his own Radio 4 series, Ian Smith is Stressed!He’s now back with Ian Smith: Foot Spa Half Empty - a sharp, surreal and painfully relatable look at stress, love, and the kind of life choices that include buying a magic spell off Amazon. In this episode we discuss:the brutal on-the-job experience that actually makes a stand-upthe uncertainty of what actually leads to TV worklearning the value of other comedians as “outside eyes” on your materialwhy comedy as therapy is limited (but why it still helps anyway)the stuff that gets cut from The Northern Newsand we find out of Ian Smith is happy...Join the Insiders Club at Patreon.com/ComComPod where you can instantly WATCH the full episode and get access to 20 minutes of exclusive extras including:how writing for The News Quiz taught him to write on demandwhy previews are meant to be messyand how deadlines remove self-doubt and force clarity in creative decisions👉 Sign up to the ComComPod Mailing List and follow the show on Instagram, YouTube & TikTok.Catch Up with Ian: Foot Spa Half Empty is on its final leg of the UK tour. You can find all the dates and more at iansmithcomedian.co.uk. You can also keep-up-date with Ian on Instagram, @iansmithcomedy.Support our independently produced Podcast from only £3/month at Patreon.com/ComComPod:✅ Instant access to full video and ad-free audio episodes✅ 20 minutes of exclusive extra content with Ian✅ Early access to new episodes where possible✅ Exclusive membership offerings including weekly(ish) Stu&AsPLUS you’ll get access to the full back catalogue of extras you can find nowhere else!Everything I'm up to: Come and see me LIVE, find out all the info and more at stuartgoldsmith.com/comedy. Discover my comedy about the climate crisis, for everyone from activists to CEOs, at stuartgoldsmith.com/climate.Get in touch: If you’re listening and thinking ‘I’d love to work with ComComPod on getting something out there’ or ‘there’s someone you should absolutely have on’ - drop us an email at [e-mail]! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hello and welcome to the show. I'm Stuart Goldsmith. This is episode 510 of the Comedians, Comedian podcast. And it's the first time we've had Ian Smith, which feels remiss. He's a two-time Edinburgh Comedy Award nominee. You probably know him as the co-host of the Northern News podcast with Amy Gledhill, as well as you'll know him from his appearances. I'm live at the Apollo on Have I Got News for You and his own Radio 4 series, Ian Smith, is stressed. and I saw his show foot spa half empty and it is brilliant and you can see why he just

can you say continually after two nominations let's do it you can see why he continually gets nominated it's really sharp and it's really surreal and like sort of unassumingly surreal like not big abstract surreal but like lovely normal ideas in the mundane world that then sort of

sort of what's the word spiral off into surreal stuff and it's really relatable, he has got lots of stuff on stress and love, and according to the press release, the kind of life choices that include buying a magic spell off Amazon. Lots to enjoy there. In the first half of this episode, we're going to discuss when conversational stand-up starts to look too effortless. We'll talk about some of the brutal on-the-job experience that makes a comedian. We'll talk about Edinburgh preparation and why it's still emotionally stressful,

even eight shows in, and we'll discuss the long game of trying to earn your confidence in comedy. There's never been a better time to support the podcast, of course, so you can see the full video episode with Ian, as well as some extra content, tell you a bit more about that in the middle bit. And there's a new format, Stu-N-A every week, kind of personal little mini-videoes from me, and all of the, you know, all of the other, all of the other nebulous benefits that you get when you think to yourself, God, I've been listening to this forever, I should probably subscribe, well, you probably should. Here's Ian Smith. on tour at the moment with foot spa half empty,

which is, is this like a sort of glittering jewel in your stand-up canon this particular show? Was this the big winning show, or is it the show after the big winning show? I guess I sort of feel like maybe the last two shows have been like that in terms of the shows that have maybe just made me do a bit.

better. This is me sort of getting over my initial discomfort, sort of saying anything positive about my self. Yes, well, that's why I've opened with it because I thought we should do it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But yeah, I guess like the last two shows got nominated in Edinburgh, and I've sort of felt I think my shows always get better every year, but with those two shows in particular, it was like, oh, I think I really love what I'm doing now. And, I've sort of felt, I think And yeah, and I think this show was better than the one before. Yeah, so it's the most, like, happy I've been with a show. Great.

And it's just fun that you're saying that we're sort of without smiling. Yeah, yeah, yeah. There'll be none of that from me whenever I'm talking about myself. Is it, like, how do you feel, I'll get into detail on the show in the show's recently in a little while, but how do you feel, like, is it an element of your personality that you don't enjoy or you don't feel comfortable feeling confident. Because you know what some comedians

are like. There are people I think of them as door kickers. Some people kick down the door and go, where's my fucking TV show? And I'm not one of them and you're very much not one of them. So talk to me about how you feel your personality fits the world of comedy. Yeah. I guess

like I sort of realised I don't massively feel comfortable expressing any emotion publicly. Like, um, one thing I remember is like, um, when I passed my driving test, I had a really nice instructor and we kind of pulled the car up and he's like looking by the window and he's like trying to gauge like from a thumbs up and he like knocked on the window, thumbs up, thumbs down. And I said like thumbs up and he's like running around the car park and he's going like, Yeah. And I was just sort of like, well, I'm less happy than you about this.

But I know internally I was very happy. But I don't know. I think there's something quite vulnerable or that I find vulnerable about kind of revealing, oh, this means so much to me. And I feel really happy. It feels quite revealing. So I think maybe I'm like that across most emotions, which is a big way to say.

start. Yeah, okay. Do you have any pet theories on why that is? Yeah, I really don't know. Like, yeah, I wouldn't be able to put my finger on it. I guess I've always been quite sort of shy and, like, anxious or a bit of a, like, yeah, and maybe, so maybe it's just that, just kind of part of my personality. and I think maybe it comes of comedy,

but I think I really care about what other people think about me. So I guess, yeah, stuff like that. But no, there's not like something I could put my finger on, like, why am I so emotionally repressed? I apologize, Ian. I feel like we've really got off the break very quickly here, and I don't want to make you feel uncomfortable. I feel like I had kind of an inkling that you were coming

from quite a kind of shy place. And I probably have really got into pointing a finger in your face and going, you, why, you shy? And that's not a great, that's not a great start. No, this is what I'm, apologies. No, this is what I'm prepared for with this podcast. We've got to get to the bones of what's going on here.

Have you always been like that? Were you a shy kid? Yeah, I think so. I think I just, I think I take a while to get, comfortable and then feel quite like gregarious. So like, I guess any time I've been to school, I would maybe feel like shy when you first go to secondary school, but by the end of it, feel really confident and happy with like the group that you've found.

And then going to college would be like, oh man, this is so scary and I don't know anyone here. And then by the end of college, be really happy. And then uni starts. And like, it never really carries. that confidence carries on. I think like a new setting, you kind of go, oh man, this is completely new. So yeah, I think it's just an element of my personality that I have a slow build of confidence and then potentially get sort of irritatingly confident by the end.

Do you think you get irritatingly confident? Has anyone ever said that to you? That to me sounds like more negative self-talk like you're telling yourself off for daring to be confident. I think I just I'm trying to think of an example but I guess for me it's just interesting seeing such a mix of like when I would first start something towards towards the end of it then feeling much more comfortable but I mean I guess that's I think that's very normal to be shy and then get um

but yeah I think it's just always been my personality really to be a bit shyer Okay. And talk to me about how that impacts or has impacted your comedy. Because to a non-comedian listening to this, they might be thinking that's a really, that seems in opposition to what comedy is. Like how, you know, like particularly when you start, especially when you start. I mean, did you start when you wanted to or did you, did it take you a while to start through, you know, the fear of revealing yourself or taking a risk? Did you start as soon as you had the notion? Talk to me a bit about how. like kind of the early days through that lens. Yeah. Well, I guess like ultimately and maybe like flashing forward that I, I don't really feel that on stage.

So like on stage I would feel more confident than I would like anywhere else really. But I guess I started. I did some sketch shows with two of my friends in school. So like when we were like 15, 16, we put on something in our local theatre where we did and a half-hour sketch show and a half-hour play because we went to like a drama group and really we just wanted to do comedy.

And I really, I just enjoyed doing that but was aware that as we went to different unies, then we can't do this anymore. So it wasn't even like I wanted to do stand-up per se. I was just like, well, I guess I want to make people laugh and stand-up is the only like solo one of that that I can do. But yeah, I didn't necessarily feel like, I think being shy would more affect me in like, maybe in a green room or like career wise of feeling like comfortable really pushing yourself or being dominant in what you think you deserve or could do. But I think in terms of the stand-up itself, I don't think it has a negative impact.

I think you, I mean, I always. forget to do this at the top. I often forget to do this at the top of the show, which is to kind of reiterate for the listener, the people who may not be aware of your work, how funny you are. I was trying to think of the last time we gig together. And I think it was in Brighton at the comedian. Do you remember? He went to the pub afterwards. Yeah, yeah. It was really nice. It was a really nice gig. And everyone had a really good gig. And I know, I saw your PR sent me your show. I think Futspar. I actually didn't see it live, but we did a preview together. In fact, that's the most time. That's the,

most recently we saw each other, but it was a bit kind of fly by night. And I was getting ready frantically for a preview whilst half listening to you in like a downstairs under a mezzanine kind of thing. That show is just extraordinarily funny. It's so jam-packed full of gags. And what I love about you as a comic is that you've got a real comics eye for things. Do you do you mean? Like you're a real, I think of you as a real comedy writer in the sense that every punchline

has got six tags on the end. every story you've kind of you've rung out every possible you know every bit of funny from it and I'm really I'm always I'm really excited watching a comic where I when I think oh god I wish I could have got there do you know I mean like just to like think of not even the kind of the the subject matter of the stories but the fact of where you take them so with that in mind I can definitely see how confident you would feel on stage once it starts working but what were your first kind of gigging experience is like? Did it work straight away when you first did stand up on your own? Did you feel like you had funny things to say and you said them and it made it

okay? Or was there kind of any danger of retreating from it? Well, I think like the first gigs and maybe something, I still do this a little bit of like the pressure of a deadline kind of helping. But the first gig I did, I was like 17. I would do a gig and then like four months later, I'd do a gig or something. And my mum and dad drove me to the gig. It was at the upside comedy club that Dan Atkinson used to run in York. Oh yeah.

Oh, yeah, I know. And it was a proper comedy club, you know, like professional MC, opener, someone doing 10 in the middle and then a headline act. So it's really in at the deep end. But I remember, like, the car journey there sat in the back of the car thinking, like,

this is like stupid, man. Like you haven't fucking written anything. you've got like one idea. I hadn't like sat and timed it. I hadn't like looked in the mirror, pretended I had a microphone and gone through it. I just kind of had one story in mind. And yeah,

I remember being in the car just thinking like, this is really dumb that you haven't worked harder on this. But I don't know if it's a bit of a like if you have like a fear of failure so you kind of put it off a bit. But yeah, I did five minutes of a 10 minute set and it went okay

and then I remember saying I still got five minutes left what do you want to talk about and did five minutes on March of the Penguins because I think that I'd just come out and that was funnier than the five minutes I wrote and I used to feel like that a little bit that like the stuff I was preparing

wasn't good enough but because I was like 17 I don't really have like any comedic skill but I was better at kind of chatting. But that sort of happened for the first few gigs and then I think I died on my ass on the fourth gig and then really started to feel like,

oh man, this is like a lot harder than I thought it would be. That's great that you got to your fourth gig without having a horrible death. That feels like a really positive way into it, especially if the first gig you're at is like an actual comedy club with paid acts, as opposed to I imagine most people starting now are doing,

or certainly in London maybe they're starting at Open Mic Nights in front of five other comics and no real audiences or bringers or that. So that's like a really amazingly positive first experience. Yeah, I think I was lucky to be up and off when I was first doing some gigs because I think it's harder now. If all the gigs you're doing are those open mic nights, they're kind of, I don't know, I think they can create. create like a weird pattern of just non-development because you're you're playing to comedians,

you're not really playing to an audience. I think there's a culture of like how many gigs can I do a night? Like I'm doing like three different open mic gigs tonight. But I, it's like doing free pointless gigs sometimes. And I think like when I first went to uni and I was doing gigs, I mean, I was at least doing like the middle spot, a Murph control gig. and it would be only four comedians. Like I didn't do too many of those 15, 20 comedian bills.

Yeah, like it feels harder now. I think it's brutal when you're kind of having the realization, especially as like a younger kid, that you're like, oh, I'm not very good. And these people are very good. But I guess it does make you kind of go, I really need to get better. Yes.

I do wonder sometimes how I would have done if I started now. Because I remember starting 20 years ago, it felt hard. We had no idea. I mean, how long? Have you been going as similar length of time? I saw a clip of yours on YouTube from 2011. From like a Edinburgh. It was like a BBC stand-up thing.

Oh, God, yeah. Yeah, there's a bit about you having jelly on your testicles and stuff. It's like a really fun. I love watching really old stand-up clips from people I know. That's a long time. go. Yeah, and I look fucked in that video. I am, I would say that you've got a look in that video. Yeah, yeah. But no one's saying that in a positive way. I just, I think I liked growing my beard out, but I couldn't grow a full beard. So just had this weird patchy beard and quite long

hair. Yeah, I just, I looked weird. But I, yeah, I'd love to, there's a couple of clips me on YouTube that I'd love to like burn the YouTube offices to the ground to get rid of. But yeah, I mean, I basically, I was gigging regularly in uni, but maybe like one gig a month or something because I was really trying to do well on the course. What was studying? I was studying a kind of media and communications degree at Goldsmiths. But yeah, so I think I did all those new act competitions. when I think really I'd barely been a new act.

I'd done like 20 gigs and stuff. So I guess I kind of consider it from when I graduated uni as when I'd say I've been doing comedy for, but even then I think the first like five or six years of that was just like living like a student. And I didn't really have the work ethic. I was just sort of scraping by really. Talk to me a bit about work ethic

and about, like, specifically in the light of what you said about that first gig experience of going, oh, the improvised stuff is better than the prepared stuff. Because there are certainly, there are lots of ways you could employ that. Do you mean, you could imagine someone coming away from that early experience and going, I'm just going to riff it. Do you know, if like this is, that's, you know, that's how it works. And I suppose particularly in those days more than now, maybe, the idea that you could sort of wing it and have an easy life as a comic.

Like it doesn't feel like that's the case anymore. But just talk to me a little bit about the kind of the work you put into it then and what your aspirations were, what the playing field felt like. Yeah, I guess back then, I mean, I really cared about it. And I was like, I think trying, but I just would put things off maybe a bit more. I also probably didn't have a lot to talk about really. in my life, which makes it harder to write in general. I remember early on really trying to cultivate

of kind of going, I need to be better at improvising and to be quick on my feet and stuff because all the comedians I love can do stand-up but can be in the room. So I would like, I ran a gig in a kind of village near my hometown where I would emce, even though I was bad at it, just to get better. I remember specifically requesting to MC late and live when I think I maybe hadn't done a solo show or maybe it was my first solo show.

But just because I'd heard that, like, Kitson had done that and Johnny Vegas, who I loved when I was starting out. So I remember, like, pushing myself into situations, at least, to try and get better. but that was more a confidence thing rather than a like craft or writing thing, which I think came like later on. But yeah, I would at least sort of force myself to do stuff that I wasn't good at. I think that's an under-discussed quality. I think I've definitely done that. I remember hearing Eddie Izard say years ago, like before I started comedy years and years ago,

it was an interview and Eddie said I've always tried to go towards things that scare me I mean not jumping off a cliff onto a spike like that's just a little bit I remember for an interview

for you yeah yeah and I think I kind of employed that and went right go towards things that scare you like those two qualities of like dogged persistence just keep turning up and if you get offered

something frightening say yes so that's quite a big tell me just briefly about that late and live experience because even the mention of late and live

even though I feel very confident and happy in my these days. The last time I thought about that gig or the last time I did it was years ago and it still has that, like the bear cat. You know the bear cat in Twickenham? I remember when I started two different comics, I heard about two different comics who were open mics who'd given up after they died at the bear cat. And you just, like, even though I've had beautiful gigs there since, it's not frightening at all. I mean, I'm sure it was tougher back then, but it wasn't that bad. But like,

you always get like a sort of an ancestral comedy memory. So tell me about throwing yourself into into emceeing late in live? Did you have success or did you have terrible failures? Or how was it? I guess a bit of a mixed bag. So I think I used to have that like with say when you mentioned the Bearcat. I remember when I started I would have a bit of a thing that if a gig was tough or if I was like watching a gig and three people had gone on and died, I would feel weirdly quite excited

to be like, this is a, I'd love to see if I can do well. Okay. But like, with late and live, I remember like, the first 20 minutes,

when you're comparing, or the 15 you do at the top is like, oh, this is pretty good. And like, there's a few heckles and stuff, but people are listening. But what I realized very quickly is like,

after the first act had been on, and everyone just gets up to go and get a drink, it was just impossible. Um, and just like a nightmare. So like, the 10 minutes. minutes I would do in between every act was just pointless.

Like there's no need for me to be there. No one was really listening. And then all the confidence you built up in the first section had gone because, and I'd find that frustrating because I'd think, you liked me in the first bit. So why wouldn't you, like, listen to me now? So then I started doing stuff that, and now I think I'm a good enough comic to hopefully change that situation with the stuff I'm saying. but I went through a phase at Late and Live

where I just bought watermelons and I would bring them on in between the acts and I got the crowd to chant fuck up the watermelons and then I would like punch through like four watermelons and I mean people didn't leave it really got people's attention but I remember at one point

bringing Sean Moche on stage and I think people were still sweeping up watermelons and I could tell he wasn't delighted with that happening and it's stank of watermelons they really smell um so i was doing stuff like that and i think feeling a bit johnny vagusy um yeah i got two people up on stage and i'd buy a pint for whoever could eat the most of a lemon in a minute so people would like gnaw into the skin um and there's like tears and like lemon juice everywhere um i didn't felt fun but i guess looking back i don't feel like proud of that.

Yeah. I always know, I mean, years ago when I was doing lots of warm-up, like sitcom warm-up, have you ever done that where you're like you're on and off and on-off? It's the most thankless, hard job in the world. Yeah. But I remember saying to someone, oh, if you see me offer to juggle any three objects from the audience, that's when you'll know that I've got nothing left in a tank. Yeah, yeah.

For me, it was some big box of sweets and like throwing them out to the crowd. I only, I did quite a bit of warm up and sort of stopped doing it eventually because I would have real like 50-50 success rate with it but I did one sitcom warm-up and it was a mad sitcom. And apparently I wasn't allowed to do it again because I think I introduced one of the actresses with the wrong name and apparently throughout, basically throughout the recording, all she was thinking about is as soon as this recording is done,

I'm going to the producers and saying you never book that guy again. But I definitely, I was throwing sweets out during that. Yeah, sitcom warm up is awful. So many takes. And then they tell you to go on in between the takes. And I would have to go, hey, guys, let's hear it for that. For take two, everyone. Whoa!

Didn't quite work. We're going to go for take three. And I just thought, fuck me. I can't do this. Yeah. I feel quite nostalgic talking about it because I've got, I still do the Graham Norton warm up,

but that's like the sweetest. There's one of those like, that's a prize for having gone through the trenches for years. That goes, lovely. But I don't do any others. I did loads of sitcom. And that thing, like you say, of like they've done a take,

so everyone's seen all of the jokes. And now they're going to do the take again. And every so often, you know, the sketch involves someone getting covered in water. And you're like, oh, well, they're going to need to dry them and put them in a dry costume. So that's 10 to 15 minutes before we see the same jokes all over again.

It's quite nice to look back on it now, not doing it anymore. I almost see Covent Garden in the same way. Like, I'm really proud of having done that. But I'm really glad I no longer need to do that. It's like a real baptism of fire. Yeah, I think it's a good thing. Like, I mean, I think it's good to do. I guess what I've learned is that when your agent tells you,

it's good to do warm up because you'll get seen by the producers. But that's bullshit. I remember like really smashing a sort of warm up. And it's the first time I felt like I'd done like really well. And I thought, I'll stick around in the green room and I guess do a bit of schmoozing. And the producer, like, I said a lot to them and they just clearly didn't remember who I was. And I was like, I've just been doing a really good job for like two hours. So I just think it doesn't

It's good to do Like money and all that kind of stuff And experience But it I think it very rarely leads to any of the things That sometimes your agents Will tell you It can

The heartbreaking moment When you find out that they don't listen to you In the director's government Like they just literally don't They don't have the sound switched on Because you're a member of the sound department You're nothing to do with them Yeah

Yeah I remember The last warm up I did I can't remember what show it was, but it was like an entertainment one, so I was like on and off. And I was starting to feel a little bit like, come on, man, I can't be coming on this much. This is crazy.

People were getting up and going to the toilet. There's no one there. And so the last like half an hour, there'd be a little change in the recording. And I'd see the floor manager like look towards me and I would just look away as if I was like looking at something else. Because I knew, like, I'm not doing it again. I was basically quitting my job.

And I was just like, I'm not even going to look you in the fucking eye. You're going to have to walk over to me and tell me to come on because this is horrible. So, yeah, I really did a hard quit on warm up. That can be useful as well. You know, it helps you work out what you want and what you don't want to do. Did you learn anything from it or from those kind of like, you know, the slightly more kind of buttlindsay crowdwork, the watermelon stuff? Did it was it like, is it like kind of a fun war story or did you learn anything?

Is it, does it, does it, do those experiences form any kind of worthwhile part of your toolkit? Yeah, I don't know. Like, I mean, I guess it does mean that every now and then, like, no matter how like established you could get, I imagine, you'll just have a gig where it isn't great or like a corporate gig that, um, You know, you maybe don't really want to do, but like the money is good enough that you're like, well, I have to do this. So I guess the corporate element is like, because those are really like beneficial to your life to try and pick up something like that. And I think they can be basically like doing warm up where you're trying to get the attention of people who don't really want to listen to you. So I think having a few tools in your pocket then of like, what can I? I do to get these people's attention that I know that no other comedian has to see me doing.

It's not like I'm at the stand and I've got a box of celebrations and I'm going, Who I'm so sweet? Whoa! And then you'd be humiliated. But if it's the mortgage broker of the year awards and no one else is going to know about it, then you could do stuff like that. And then one of them comes up to ours and says, oh, that was good. Yeah, my brother's a comedian.

Do you know this guy? Yeah, yeah. you die. Yeah. So let's talk about the kind of the more artistic pursuits then. So how many shows have you done? How many Edinburgh shows have you done? I am eight.

Eight, okay. And do you feel a progression over those eight, not just of quality? One would assume, like you said before, you know, they're getting better and better. But is your approach different? If you think back to how you put show number one together or how you put show number four together and what you were aiming for and whether or not you achieved it. Like what's the kind of the change across the scope of all of those eight hours? Yeah.

So I guess like a few things. I guess if there was like split into like three sort of stages of it, that the first shows would maybe be, I guess like still trying to find my voice and like working hard and putting a lot of like stress and effort into it and finding this kind of like the July kind of period to be the most productive period as the like deadline gets closer but maybe not having a real technique like um yeah like I felt like I had a good instinct for like callbacks and stuff like that like, I mean, I guess the first thing that someone said to me, I don't think he'd even

remember this, but it was Phil Gilbert, who's a producer at Fudge Park, and we'd worked together on a sitcom like ages ago. And he saw my first sure, and he said, he's very positive, but he said, your stylist are conversational, that I think it was only towards the end, I guess, with some callbacks and stuff that maybe an audience would realize that you've put effort into this. And I think he was saying, I think it's really important for you to have like structural stuff and tricks and callbacks to kind of prove that because you're on stage. But Sona is quite chatty and like, like I really like seeming like I'm coming up with it on the spot.

Okay. But yeah, I think him saying that to me, I thought it was really good advice that, like, I need to show people that I'm being smart with this and I know what I'm doing and I've got some structure. And then I think the second show I did, I think I had like the best callback I've ever done in terms of like the response. And slightly inspired by like big set pieces or like someone like Tim Kee and Aercaster doing bigger set piece callbacks. but basically I had some material about actors getting recast in serps and how as a kid I'd find that really weird to be like that's not your wife why and no one everyone's in on this and no one

so we'd have a routine about that and we'd talk about like basically saying if if someone else just come out and did my show for a while like you wouldn't just accept that you'd be like the fuck it's going on but I seeded that a bit more subtly but then I guess like 20 minutes later I would nip back to behind the curtain to get a prop and someone wearing the exact same outfit would come out and just do the next two minutes of the show

Angus Dunnaker and sometimes that laugh would last like a minute of like them coming out and then I started doing quite a lot of things like that of like theatrical set pieces and stuff So I had like a story about someone who would put a mannequin in their front window to deter burglars and how someone could just replace themselves of a mannequin in other situations if they don't want to do their work and stuff. And then had a bit where the slides weren't changing in my slideshow and I would get angry at my tech. And when everyone looks around, my tech is just like a mannequin now and he would switch himself out.

So I was big into doing stuff like that So I think that was like the first like revelation for me of like Oh man these callbacks like elevate the show Yeah completely if I can do big stuff like that And they also they kind of approach that issue that Phil Gilbert mentioned you were saying About like letting them know that actually you have thought about this Because your manner is so conversational I think that's a really interesting bit of feedback and a really good good thing to spot.

It's like part of the trick of stand-up is making it seem like you're just coming up with it. But if you make it seem too much like you're just coming up with it, then when he sort of suggested that you need to do that, what did you understand that mean in terms of, understand that to mean in terms of why you needed to do that? Was that like for the benefit of reviewers or for the benefit of the general public or the benefit of the industry? To whom are you signaling that actually you know what you're doing? I guess I don't know what his intention was. I guess he's an audience member who's part of the industry. But I guess I was very concerned about wanting to be like critically acclaimed

over like sort of just getting laughs. Like I think it mattered to me a lot about reviews and stuff. So I think like, maybe in the wrong way, I probably did see it a bit like that of like, um, that's how you would get a better critical response. Um, but also I guess that's what I liked. I always liked Edinburgh shows that had a bit of a, like, story or a theme to them. Um, but yeah, I think back then I probably was driven by the idea of thinking,

or that would get like a claim if I do something quite small. art with it. Yeah, it's tricky. And you said just then, like, probably in the wrong way, you thought that. Does it feel in retrospect? I mean, they're both, the jokes that you, you know, both those physical gays you've described. I absolutely love those. I love a physical joke.

I love an end buried in the beginning kind of a joke. Yeah, yeah. For me, the, you know, the textbook definition is the Joel Domit confetti canon one. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Where they just laugh for so long. Yeah. But at the same time, I'm like, yeah, okay, where does that? Not that one specifically, but maybe these ones we're talking about.

Like, if you talk to me a little bit about looking back on that and thinking, was that the right thing to be kind of, I think of it as like chasing the fifth star. I think sometimes you see people get the fifth star in their review because they have, you know, because they are living the show somehow. And sometimes you see people, sometimes I think we've both seen shows where we've gone, oh, this performer has put that bit in in order to be worth the fifth star? Yeah, yeah.

Yeah, I think like, yeah, I guess it's more like the emotional reaction, I think, from me. Because I do think, I think it's good to aim to have, like, structural audacity, and it's good to have those call back this day. Sorry, I'm just going to enjoy. Just going to roll that around my mouth. Structural audacity. Great.

Sorry, I think I was sort of motivated in the wrong way of like sort of maybe frustration or wanting people to go like Ian's good and to get opportunities and stuff. Whereas now I guess feel a bit more comfortable in myself or my ability that I guess I'm thinking because I want this show to be really good. than thinking because I want a reviewer to think it's good. I guess it's like they're the same thing, but kind of going, I should make this show so that reviewers think it's good. And then I'll be happy as more switched to, I'll be happy if I love my show because it's good. And then reviews will be better because I think I've just slightly switched

the onus of like what's important. Yes. That's really interesting. I think that's really interesting. Obviously, that's moved in the right direction. Do you think that you were particularly, do you feel that you struggled to stand out as a standout? Yeah. Yeah, I think like, I mean, I had like a lot of frustration, I guess maybe my first two shows, I think were good. But I guess my third to my, Sixth shows were all like pretty well reviewed. And I guess for the, for those three in the middle, I didn't have an agent. And I like wanted an agent and was getting good reviews and had done some acting work like and would get sort of turned down by everyone in a way that like really upset me and really sort of confuse me as well because I think I'm sort of

hard on myself enough to have at the time looked and gone, oh, on paper, I think I'm doing like well. But so I think, yeah, had a long time when I was kind of, I guess beating myself up a bit of going, what is it, there must be something about me that's not quite interesting enough

or not quite good enough. And I need to find that. So it meant that Edinburgh become, and still is, but become very stressful so like May to July because I'm just sort of like going the show has to be better

it's got to be better it's got to be better and just sort of go crazy on it until the fringe starts and I still do that now but I think I'm doing that because it just means Edinburgh means a lot to me whereas back then I think I was doing it

because I was like, I've got to try and get more in my career. I've got to try and get noticed and I've got to try and progress in a way that I don't feel like I can at the minute without an agent. So, yeah, I did feel like it took a while to start getting stuff that maybe I felt like I was ready to get. It is some, I think that's like a perennial issue for comics, isn't it? is that when the progression that you're on on the circuit seems to then stop with the circuit.

And you see people all around you going, oh, oh, they've taken off, they've escaped, they're out. Or not that they've escaped, but necessarily, but they're on to, their progression has continued. And one might feel like, oh, mine hasn't to the extent that I feel I deserve. Is that, like, what kind of things were driving you in that? Like, what sort of emotions were driving you? Is it a sense of frustration because you, I think a lot, for a lot of people, it's driven by frustration because you can, you smash a gig and you just walk away going, I unquestionably smash that gig. Yeah, yeah. So what happens now, please?

And often the answer is, well, nothing. You just have to go and do it again. And no one seems to care outside the room, which is why a lot of us end up very needy or are already very needy. But were there other kind of, you know, do you have any other kind of drives that we haven't covered? so far about like, you know, wanting to please your parents or competition with a sibling or, do you mean? Is there, is there like, um, like what, what are your drives do you think within comedy that, that you wanted to prove yourself? Yeah, I mean, I really, I don't think anything outside of that, you know, like family wise, like, you know, never feel any pressure my parents

always like, really supportive, like, um, yeah, I think just I, I really love comedy, and it's all I've really wanted to do since I was, like, quite a young teenager. So I guess, like, just not wanting to do the work and then for it not to happen. Like, I think I would have been really scared about the idea of doing comedy for 10 years and then going, oh, man, this isn't going anywhere, so I've got to just get a normal job. But, yeah, so I really feel. think it was just sort of having that the dual thing that probably so many comedians have of having a lot of self-doubt, but also having done it enough to be able to go like, oh, I know I'm good

at this and I sort of believe in myself. But I guess you, with any creative thing, you need like, free other people in a position of influence to also believe in you. Otherwise, like, it doesn't really matter. Or it didn't then, like, I guess we've online stuff now, you can put out your stuff and find your audience. But I think pre-pandemic, it was very much like, you can't go up for an acting casting if you don't have an agent. You can't get put up for like a TV thing just by like, I don't know, like looking online and going, oh, mock the week might be booking at the minute and trying to find an email address. So, Yeah, I think it's just that feeling of like watching life unfold and you're a bit of a spectator on it.

You just want to have like access, even if that doesn't mean anything happens. I think if you don't have an agent, you can feel like, I can't even get rejected for some of this stuff. So this is Ian. Foot spa half empty is on the final leg of the tour. You can find all the dates and more at Ian Smithcomedian.comedian. co. UK, which suggests that someone else has got Ian Smithcommedian.com. I'm sure they haven't, but what a lovely... Oh God, I hope they haven't actually. God, I just did an Alan Partridge. I hope that horse isn't dead moment. And nonetheless, let's press on as if that is the only

Ian Smith in comedy, because there are... He's got some very funny material about there being other Ian Smith. My voice went a bit weird there, and let's assume it's not with horror at some accidental partridge. It could be. You can keep up to date with Ian on Instagram at Ian Smith comedy, and you can come and see me live in Radstock, Monmouth, Margin, London, Exeter, Northampton, Swindon, London again, Guildford, Shrewsbury and Edinburgh at the Edinburgh Festival. All of those dates are available at Stuart Goldsmith.com slash comedy. And at the bottom of that page, you can sign up to the Comcom pod mailing list and my own Cleverclog's climate mailing list, if that is within the sphere of your interest. Margum. Margan? Margan. Margam. Radstock, Monmouth and Margam. It sounds like a place, doesn't it? It's almost certainly a place.

Don't miss, if you're in the South West, don't miss the Exeter Comedy Festival. Last year I had to withdraw from the Exeter Comedy Festival for reasons, not reasons beyond my control, but I did have to make a very difficult decision. And so I'm really hoping, with many apologies to people who bought tickets and then were disappointed or possibly elated by seeing someone else instead. I hope that Exeter has forgiven me and I am back in, I was going to say in anger, but that's not the right phrase. with Vim, with Vim and Vigour. I think there's a few tickets still available.

So for all your information on that, go to Exetercomedyfestival.com and it would be wonderful to see you at that preview. Coming up in the second half, we are going to discuss the uncertainty of ever knowing what actually leads to the TV stuff. We'll talk about the strange psychology of regional comedy success, and we will also,

we talk a bit about how podcast spontaneity can quietly cannibalize yourself. set. Fascinating stuff. Let's get back to Ian Smith. I want to learn a bit more about these, like this technical approach of yours. So are there things that you don't do? If you're like, okay, this is the system, these are the things, this is the way I'll break down, take a subject, idiom experience, and then the other two, something and prop, idiom experience. What was it? Observation and prop. Great. Love it. Love a system. there equivalent rules for you as things in terms of things that you don't do? Or the other

the question is like, do you spot, I'll come to that in a minute. Are there any, are there any don'ts? Are there any like things that you, or that you see other people do that you think, I just don't like it when, you know, when comics do that. Things to a word. Yeah. I guess so like, slag some people off, Ian. That's not what I mean. Here we fucking go. So I guess, yeah, well, one, that kind of like idiom and experience thing, I think, has gone away a bit for me now and is kind of replaced with like just a brainstorm and then maybe instinctively where I go. And I think my last two shows have been more personal. So I think that's a bit of a thing for me now of like being aware of like feeling more comfortable talking about my personal life. and not just wanting to write a show about kind of anything.

I guess the one thing that I felt that I would try not to do is maybe a typical, but I'm thinking about this at the minute. But the typical kind of the 40 minute mark bit in a show, I guess, again, because maybe I care about like, what comedians would think of my show and I think anything that feels like I guess when we see a show now and at the 40 minute mark

if the lights change and some music came up you'd be like oh fucking hell and I guess I want to avoid moments like that I think I always want to try and make it funny but yeah I really don't know if I would approach it by going, I must avoid doing this. I think I would just try and gather everything I've got first

and then just try and find like this structure for it. Yeah, I don't know if there's anything I avoid. I think I just, some of that stuff's become more instinct. and I guess I'm also more a bit more open to like like I try and get advice from other people a bit like I have sessions with other comics on the show like yeah I don't think there's anything I consciously avoid

what kind of what kind of sessions with what kind of other comics what things what things do you look for to other comics to help you with Well, I guess like the Stuart Laws directed like a lot of my shows and worked on like the last one as well. He's so busy now that it's maybe a bit harder for us to have like a ton of sessions together. But I think I've found that what I find really helpful is someone listening to my show and then us having a chat about it or someone who I really. like love or work with well in the early stages being able to go I think this is what I want to talk about and I'm not quite sure the best way to do it. Like I with my last show I had a couple

of chats with John Kearns and he said some stuff that I think was really useful like structurally that I would maybe notice that he does. I had a chat with Jordan Brooks and I had like chats with Stuart. But I think some one thing I find like most valuable about them is like you're you're just bouncing an idea off like if you're if you're writing a script and you have a writing partner imagine the script will be a little bit funnier or just be developed a little bit quicker because you can say something see that someone is laughing at that and you're like oh okay, this is the funny thing.

And they're always going to say like something that you wouldn't have considered that then leads you to like another two jokes. It's just so exponential. And also I think when you're talking about something more personal, I think other people have a perspective that isn't marred by the experience where they can kind of go,

I think you should do this. And it doesn't matter to them as much personally that they're not, yeah, not doing something for like the wrong reason or because that personally doesn't feel right to you. Yeah. Yeah. It's nuts that. The sense of like when someone points something out that in retrospect is incredibly obvious. Like, why don't you talk about that bit? Or you know, what does that mean? And you go, oh, it just means this. And they're like, well, say that then. Like, that's a really, I think that's a really. positive part of it. Do you write mostly, and again, if you could answer this, if you could have apply this to the whole of the Urvra, the whole of those eight shows, do you write mostly in order to make people laugh

or in order to express yourself? Like what's the primary drive out of those two? Maybe, I would say to make people laugh. And then, but in the last two shows that made. maybe that's more equally weighted. Like, I think all I wanted in the first shows was to do, like, a fun, silly show with good structure. Like, I would probably, like, write that at the top of, like,

a page on a writing pad when I was, like, ever sort of worrying about the show or kind of doubting myself a bit of just as a reminder to be like, that's a minimum of what you want to do, a show that's really funny and it's silly but it's got good structure that's all you're aiming for whereas I think now

I want it to be really funny but I also want it to be like cathartic and about something that means something to me as well cathartic for you or for them I guess probably more for me um like I guess it's a

like release of tension or pressure and being able to kind of shout about stuff in a funny way. So yeah, I think when I'm thinking about a new show now, like the starting points are maybe a bit more sort of not serious. I think a lot of comedians do this one. If you were asked like in January, what's your show going to be about? You'd have this big grand like, oh, it's going to be about. this or the nature of how we do this and this.

And often by the time it gets to August, that's like an element of that, but it's really just like the funniest stuff that's happened to you in your year. But yeah, I think my motivation is a bit more sort of personal than it used to be. Yeah. Yeah.

And like you were saying before about having real things in your life that are difficult that you want to complain about or that you want to talk about. Does it end up having, does that catharsis for you? end up having a therapeutic value. Like, does it work? Are you broadly happier in your life because you're able to...

I mean, yeah, definitely when we had our first child, the ability to go on stage and complain about my situation as a new dad, night after night, was enormously therapeutic, and I wish I could gift that experience to my wife. You know, that's... Like, it definitely did me good. I don't think it did anything negative.

You know what I mean? I think it made people laugh as well. So that felt like I'd earned it. But do you feel any of your cathartic shows or material have improved your general happiness? I don't know. It's hard to say and not wanting to go into too much detail and stuff. But like I guess doing a show about like fertility struggles, I think there's definitely something cathartic about rather than just worrying about it, being able to go on stage and go like, this is fucking mad and this this thing was mad about it and this is funny um and it's

i think a good and bad coping mechanism because rather than dwelling on it you get to perform it and take ownership of it and make people laugh but it also does mean don't really process what's going on fully because like part of you is also going let's try and keep this light or make it entertaining to an audience So I think it can be helpful in the moment, but it doesn't solve your problem. I think I guess if your problem is something that you're looking at in hindsight, then it probably is easy to go. Like, that was very cathartic.

So, but at the minute I was like performing comedy while going through like that stuff in a way that I would say was like very immediate. and that I don't think people would recommend. But it was definitely, I think, helpful at the time to do that. Yeah. And do you, just going back to the writing, do you have any, I meant to ask you this before, do you have any habits? Do you have any things that you spot yourself doing and go,

oh, I always do this? I've done that shape of a joke again. Maybe, I think like other comedians would say that, Like I remember a few times when someone would say, like, oh, that's like a very you way of doing that. Or that's like a very Ian Smith kind of angle to take. But it's harder to like grasp that yourself. Which kind of bits? Do you remember any of like what those particular things were? I guess maybe.

I feel I should have asked that of every question of the last, every guest of the last 500. What is it that people put it to you and say, this is a very you thing. Yeah, yeah. What's your perception of other people's perception of what's particularly you? I guess it would be stuff where I like take on someone's kind of reaction to something. Like I like to kind of characterize someone reacting to a situation of like what the fuck is going on here and seeing their thought process. Yeah.

I had to think of an example in like the last sure. I'm trying to sort of like reel through my set list. Well, I was just thinking of the Seagull story. It's like, you know, you're really populating that with loads of characters, all of whom are losing their minds in different ways. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I think that's a good example of like, rather than like describing what's going on, I like to go and people were running around like and then how.

have me going, fucking hell, ah! Yeah, I think rather than say everyone was screaming, that I'm going to just start screaming like I'm the person going through. Maybe that's the catharsis

for someone who's quite sort of private and shy to go, oh, I've created some circumstances here within which I can run around shouting and screaming and swearing. Yeah, yeah. Sort of feel like, hey, this is good. Yeah, I mean, I definitely,

I guess if I'm having a point when I'm kind of doubting myself writing a show, I would probably say to myself, oh, it's just a lot of shouting, isn't it? But I sort of know that's not the case, but I know that my instinct is probably to be like, it'd be good to have someone shouting about this. Yeah, what of mine, I think, is,

or something that I try, I sort of actively encourage, is people pointing out where I could be doing an act out, because I find act out such a fun, such a kind of a freeing thing. I think the bit of my brain that's trying to be clever sort of switches off when I do an act out. So for anyone just to sit and watch my stuff and go,

I can probably do that now, I might make a note to do that with my current show. Just make a list of all the nouns in the show and think, can I be bread? How does the bread feel? How does the bread behave? Yeah, yeah. Like that.

It's quite a good creative trick. Yeah, I do, I remember sort of consciously thinking that I had some bits where I was just stood up not really doing much for too long. And do you have to consciously go, like, yeah, even in that Seagull routine, I talk about the Seagull doing like a really low figure of A around this beer garden. And then sort of started doing like the figure of A with my hand because I just felt like was being a bit too static.

I'm not like massively physical. But kind of noticed how much that helped. Even like doing, well, I mean, we don't. Apollo, like not on the same day, but on the same series. Oh, the same series, yeah, right. Doing, I did a routine in that show, and there was a really big laugh from something that was more physical than I would usually do it.

And I remember, like, on stage at that gig, thinking, yeah, I've got to fucking do that all the time. I've only just started doing it now because I thought, this room is massive, so I guess I've got a show really, literally what's going on, and just thought, yeah, I had a realization mid-gig of like, yeah, it's funny when you do stuff and you don't just stand there. Yeah, so I guess that's something I will try and do a bit more as well. And what do you think are your weaknesses as a comic?

What are the things that you see other people doing and think, oh, really, I wish I could add that to my repertoire? Hmm. I guess like on stage, I mean, characterisation. I'm not like someone who could and it's maybe not totally my vibe but I couldn't do like, I guess like Larry Dean is like a great example of like Larry can do like any accent and really physicalize someone

but I think if I was to talk about like oh some like hard cockney bloke come up to me I wouldn't really be able to kind of physicalize that and make that like a fun character on stage. Yeah, I think I yeah, that and like physical stuff I don't do as much. But they're the main things that stand out to me.

I guess that stuff that I would say is naturally outside of my comfort zone of being really big and showy and doing voice work and stuff like that. So yeah, I guess on stage that's the things I'd maybe want to do bit more. And what's, what's, as we wrap up, what is the plan going forward?

We haven't talked about Northern News, I'm afraid. I've missed, missed the opportunity to talk about Northern News, which I enjoy. My wife's a big listener. I hear it occasionally. Oh, yeah. Is that a good, just tell me a little bit about that. What's the most surprising thing about how you write and make Northern News that you think would surprise people?

Well, I guess we really don't read the, articles before we put them on the podcast. So we'll just look at a headline and go, well, that's clearly funny. And it's fun for us to, I think we really want to talk about them in the room and for it all to be natural like improv. But I guess that just means there's been about like 10 things that get cut from the episode halfway through talking about them because the headline is really funny. And then you're like, oh, this sounds mad. And then you're like, oh, this guy. it's like, yeah, mentally this guy's not well. And it was say something like, he had previously killed another,

and you're like, oh, right, okay. So, yeah. This is why people read the whole of the article, right? Yeah, yeah. There was one when I had to stop halfway through from a ghoul story, because I was like, yeah, well, I just went to school with that kid. So I'm not going to take the piss out of his prison sentence for quite a funny crime. So I think that's the main obstacle that comes up doing that.

And what's the plan? What's the kind of dream scenario for the rest of your career in comedy? Do you have like a pinnacle gig or a pinnacle kind of thing that you want to achieve? I guess like, I guess at the minute I'm at a position where like I'm starting to do like TV bits and really want that. to become something that I do more regularly, rather than it feeling like, I guess it feels like a huge deal at the minute to get those first, to get on the show.

But yeah, ultimately, I guess wanting to write a show, maybe more spaced out, like to kind of do a show every two or three years, really tour it. But I was like script-wise, like, again, I sort of don't know how much, you know, like allowed to say and stuff. But I have a script in development with a channel and we filmed a taster for it.

And that's kind of moving forwards, but in a way where, you know, nothing's confirmed, but it can write more, see what they think. And that would be with, like, me in a kind of lead role. And that was always the dream when I started to kind of write and star in a sitcom. So I really love, like, the scripted side of stuff.

And it's something I'm trying to, it's like a benefit I think of, like I would never do Edinburgh in consecutive years anymore because I want to work on other stuff and I want to tour the show and not like try and rush a show and stuff. So like I think the dream for me would be at the minute to write a show every three years knowing that in those like years in between I can have a script that I'm developing or be busier with like TV stuff. so that I don't need to. Like, I love writing shows, but I'm also, I just love to have a life where I'm not churning them out a bit through necessity, like to just do it whenever I feel like I have a show that I'm happy with.

But yeah, I think that's it. It's just, like, I feel like I'm in a good moment of my career and trying to make sure that I enjoy it while also not wanting to, like, lose the ambition of wanting to do more. But yeah, I guess the dream would be get a script made and have stand-up and script-writing

as two sort of equally weighted things in my career. Yeah, that weighting's interesting, isn't it? Because do you find yourself thinking, oh, if I had a sitcom and I was the lead in my sitcom, then more people had come to my stand-up shows. I could do bigger stand-up shows. Or are you thinking, if I do some really big stand-up shows, I'll get more noticed and there's more likelihood of the sitcom happen.

Like, are they completely equally weighted? Yeah, it's hard to say because I guess like, it's really difficult to know what producers and channels want in terms of like, if you become big enough, will that make your sitcom get made? Because there's like, there's far bigger people than me who have talked about having scripts that haven't got made where you kind of read those articles and think, yeah, well, why don't they have a sitcom? So, like, yeah, I think I would have felt like that of, like, the two things are kind of equal. But, yeah, I think I'd maybe learn a bit that the script thing doesn't quite coincide with

the stand-up in the way that I thought it would. Like, I think I maybe wouldn't have had script meetings of my last two shows, didn't go well. but I think as long as you're in those meetings it really just depends on if the script is good enough but yeah I mean I can't imagine writing a script and if it got made not thinking oh this is great because it means

I can do a bigger tour I don't know if one would ever eclipse the other and just go oh just do this now but I mean having said that maybe it would because it would be easier so yeah I mean that's not to break a habit of the pod for me and to give you quite a long answer with no clear definitive thoughts you're on tour at the moment and you're going to be returning to Gould

I see on your list of where your tour is yeah yeah not many people do GOOle on their tours. No, right. Who else tours Gould? Where are you playing? You're playing the Gould Arts Centre, I see. Yeah, yeah, Gull Junction. Gould Junction. It's very nice. But, yeah, I've done a lot of weird

Goul, Selby, Baton-Humber Hull are all within like what looks like about 30 miles of each other. But that's the region I'm big in. I'm big in East Yorkshire. Are you Gould's most famous son?

I don't know. I think there was a writer from Goal, but I'm on the notable people on Wikipedia, so I'm sort of getting there. And one of them was in the same year as me in school, Nikki Feverson, who was like a football player. But he'll have to retire from football soon. Ah, yeah, right.

Whereas I can keep doing stand-up. So maybe in like 10 years. years, but who knows? I mean, he might do something else after then. But imagine if he had a sitcom. Oh, knife in your heart. Yeah, I do. I mean, I wish him no ill will, but if he develops a sitcom, I'll be absolutely furious.

Finally, Ian Smith, are you happy? Yes, I think there's lots of things that I'm happy about, but I guess they, There's lots of things that I'm a bit stressed about at the minute that I'm trying to solve. So, but fundamentally, I'm happy. But there's stuff that it would be nice to get as well. It's my honest answer. So that was Ian. Thanks to him for coming on the show. Foot spa half empty is on the final leg of the tour.

Find all of the dates at Ian Smithcomedian.comedion. UK and keep up to date with him on Instagram at Ian Smith comedy. If you enjoyed this episode, of course, you can get the extras, all the Insiders Club stuff on Patreon, at patreon.com.com slash comcom pod, including Ian on how writing for the news quiz taught him to write on demand, why previews are meant to be messy, and how deadlines can remove self-doubt. And we also talk a little bit about learning to build stand up through a kind of modular approach. Fascinating stuff. All of that at patreon.com slash comcom pod as well as,

literally hundreds of hours of extras. And what you may have noticed, if you're eagle-eared, you, that doesn't make sense, what you may have noticed is that I tend to leave the more kind of in the weeds technique, technical stuff, stuff about success on socials and how to rig the world in order to go viral and how to do kind of the minutiae of the writing stuff. All of that stuff tends to, I kind of dribble out a little bit on the main show

and then save the bulk of that for the extras. So if you are someone who is a, a kind of a creative comedy person or a technique person, or if you would like to go the extra few miles in finding out some of the gritty. I'd nearly said grotty, but no, gritty, the gritty business of how people approach their comedy careers and the marketing thereof in private, amongst many other things. And then that will thrill you. Patreon.com slash comcom pod for all of that.

That was a more of a general announcement. I'm not suggesting there's anything gritty nor grotty about lovely Ian Smith. You can find out how to see me live at Stuartgoldsmith.com slash comedy. You can join the podcast mailing list there as well. And thank you to everyone. Thanks to Susie. Our award nominated, I'm going to assume she didn't win because I have not heard anything. But such is the nature of awards.

I think as podcast helpers, assistants, loggers, as people like that, as roles like that go, being an award nominated one is pretty sweet. So thank you very much to Susie Lewis. Thanks to evil producer Callum. Thank you to Ian for coming on the show. And also, of course, our insider producers, Richard Booth, Luke Hacker, Roger Spiller, I Cave Dave, Daniel Powell, Keith Simmons, Sam Allen, J. Lucas,

Gary McClellan, Chris Swarbrick, Dave McHawdell, Paul Swaddle, Alex Wormell and James Burry. And a big thank you as well to our two special insider executive producers, Neil Los Peters and Andrew Angelese Dennant and to the super secret one as well. I'm going to post amblaught you briefly about Netflix as a joke, but other than that, I will speak to you next week with another wonderful episode that I think.

think we'll stay with you for many months to come. Speak you soon. So I'm back. I'm back in the studio. I've just realised my name is the first three letters of studio. I'm glad I've never made anything of that. That would seem trite. But nonetheless, I mean, the other reason is it isn't a studio. It's a seller and I've had part of it tanked. But as anyone will tell you, having part of something tanked is pointless. I am now back and I've had an incredibly full-on slam back into reality. I went, as you may be aware, from the wonderful Mahancliffe Comedy Festival to the differently wonderful Netflix is a Joker comedy festival in Los Angeles. And I did it over the course of a weekend. It took longer than 24 hours of real

time to travel between the two, partly because I had a stay over in the Novatel in Birmingham Airport, which what it lacks in luxury it makes up for in being a literal one-minute walk from the from the departures. I, yeah, so it was, it was longer than 24 hours in the end. But let's call it 24 hours because I managed to get my photo taken

with the big McCuncliffe Hollywood-style letters and then the actual Hollywood, the actual Hollywood-style letters within the space of less than a weekend. So that was very exciting. I got there, did the show. Well, I had a bit of a wobble when I got there. I think I told the patrons,

I did little stew and A. I had a bit of a wobble. and I tell you the reason for the wobble was that often, like it's been a while since I've been somewhere, this is going to sound so pathetic. No, will it? Who cares? It's been, I'm channeling John Robbins here,

I don't have to pretend anything. I had a bit of a wobble because I felt suddenly very far from home. I'd gone from, do you know, what's the analogy about the, it sort of represents life? It's a bird flying through the endless darkness and suddenly it flies in through the window

of a banqueting hall and everything is light and colour and chaos, then it flies out the window at the other end and it's gone forever. And it's some sort of metaphor about life. Well, I had some sort of version of that with being at the McCunkunkirk-uncleth Comedy Festival staying just outside town in a huge house

as we have done for like 10 years now. So a huge house full of family and friends and, you know, having a wonderful time that you sort of look forward to this special thing. Once a year. And then suddenly was sort of very alone traveling and then staying in a hotel on my own, which had, I'm going to say comfortably,

worst hotel breakfast I've ever had in my life. This is a first world problem I know, but, oh my God, it had a porridge machine which literally kind of shat water and dry oats into a cup. And it had, it was just, everything was very kind of, you know the way American stuff is sometimes pumpful of sugar and shiny and bright and doesn't taste like the thing. It was like that writ large. Oh my Christ. And then it's very lynchian. In one corner of the room, there was a huge TV screen, which had been detuned and was only a cage. occasionally playing some morning update news type thing. And the whole week I was there, no one turned it off.

I would have. I'm the sort of person who would do that. But I sort of began to quite enjoy how lynchy it was, this sort of flickering garbage coming out of the thing. I had a bit of a wobble. I felt a long way from home. It felt like it had been a long time since the banqueting hall. And I just, I think what happened ultimately is that I got,

I'm not, I'm pretty, absolutely not excluded, but I get to choose now at the ripe old age of 20 in comedy. I largely get to choose how much of the bollocks of the comedy industry I interact with, and I largely choose not to. By the bollocks, I mean, you know, the kind of, you know, reviews and awards and numbers and metrics and all those sorts of things, because of the way that I've kind of specialised and because of the way. that I like doing shows and the gigs I go to and all the rest of it. Just general because of gestures at everything. I don't really, not have to, no one has to. I don't often fall into the trap of indulging all of the things that come up on this show. You know, I mean, the big gestures

at everything is, I've done 14 years of this show and so I'm pretty adept now at keeping my own mental health together whilst people become, you know, envious or, you know, there's the traps of seeing someone with, you know, more of a profile or more followers or someone, someone who's crap but enormously successful or someone who's brilliant and unnoticed, or all of these things that you can get sort of sucked into the undertow of feeling like, oh, God, poor me, I haven't felt that for so long. And I move, and like, for example, the McUncliffe Comedy Festival is the opposite of those things, right? Because it's all about, look, you're here because you're trying and you love it and we all love it and this is the thing. So it was, I described it, I think,

on Instagram as an emotional base job. It was like, let's, it was like when I did, I, do you remember years ago I did, I opened for Jack Whitehall at Wembley and then I got the bus home because I wanted to do a sort of, I wanted to enjoy a sort of unbearable Muppetness of being type schism between this and that. And it felt like I was, I was, I was, Not that Los Angeles is fake, but I felt like I was, I'd moved from a festival where it's not about image and metrics and gloss, to a festival where it's all about image and metrics and gloss. Now, the reality is, like any comedy festival, what it's about is the individual comics having their individual authentic relationships with the audience. So I don't mean to condemn the Netflix festival at all. it's just that it was very seductive.

No, not it. The existence of it pressed certain buttons of mine triggers that I was like, oh God, I'm letting myself be seduced into all of the, you know, who's got the biggest venue and who's got the huge, you know, just so much of it is like, it's, you know, it's literally in Hollywood. It's like the movies of, it's like the, I'm not calling it the Oscars of Comedy, but it has a lot of the trappings of the Oscars of Comedy, right? So I had, that was the last thing I actually.

I had no idea that I would be vulnerable to that. I had no idea that I would have, I didn't even know at the time that it was happening. I was like, I'm having a wobble. I feel a bit wobbly. And it's only looking back on it a few days later could I go, oh no, clearly what was happening was, I was having all of those same feelings that I probably had on year one of doing Edinburgh as a stand-up. You know, you're like, this and that and them and why them and why not me? And all, you know, it's bananas. I thought I was way past all of that stuff. But there's something about the small apple, as they call Los Angeles. This nonsense. What do they call it? It's La La Land or the City of Dreams, City of Angels. I feel like there's another one. There's another big apple one. The weed gummy. I don't know what it is. There's something about, I mean, it's nuts. Have you been? It's nuts. The city is bananas. It's got a beach, technically. It's four miles away, but it's still in the city because the city's so vast. And it really feels full of hope and possibility, and like you really can do anything.

And also, you know, there's a, fuck, there's a lot of sort of visible homelessness and there's a lot of sort of, look, I think it is beyond the remit of this podcast for me to attempt to sum up Los Angeles in a sentence or two. But I think ultimately it just served as a reminder. That part of the experience, the wobble, this before I'd get,

The wobbles served as a reminder that like, oh, you can still be vulnerable to this. It was like, I tell you what it was like. It was like you can cut everything else before this. Don't do that. But you could mentally. If you could reward yourself, real ones, maybe I'll just tweet the time code of this bit. And then anyone that bothers following me will know, skip to this bit. What it's like is it's like I'm 30 odd years into Edinburgh and I'm fine with it.

It was like going to alternate universe Edinburgh. But more so with the contrast turned up. So it was a bit wobbly. And then I did the gig, and the gig was super fun. And it was really interesting. I've got a couple of metrics now because of the climate stuff that I do. The Adam McKay Emergency Board Meeting Slumber Party, which is a sort of a climate gig by any other name.

Adam McKay, of course, the director of writer of Anchorman. I don't think I knew that until I got there. The director of Don't Look Up and The Big Short. The Big Short is, well, I mean, Don't Look Up is fantastic. The Big Short is one of the movies I've seen most often. Huge fan. Such a pleasure to meet him. and because of the climate-ness of the gig,

I have two metrics now for gigs. How much of a comedian was I? How good was I as a comedian? And how good was I communicating about the climate? And I think there were moments when each one was to the four, I'll say. But I get very in my head about stuff like this, because it's such a tight-rope act. Trying to make people laugh about something frightening and complex

and apparently a long way away, is, and deeply implicating, is a constant tightrope walk. And I suppose what I was very inspired, Jesus, Robbie Hoffman is unreal. She's so good. Jean-Marco Serrazi was absolutely fantastic. Beth Stelling, I was very proud. Like as if I have any right, having once podcasted these people some years ago, to be proud of them. But I was like, these are my guys.

Esteban Gaster's fantastic as well. There were loads of really, really great comics. Cat Cohen as well. Jesus, Cat Cohen was an unbelievable six-minute injection of energy and fresh air into quite a long night. So many great comics. And I suppose I was inspired by them. It's so nice to see people who are totally unfamiliar with who are killing.

Some of them totally unfamiliar, you know. And very, very inspiring. And also, I suppose I came away from it. I tell you what it is, is you feel like there are so many more possibilities. When you see all, and I experienced this before in Australia, in New Zealand, you sort of get used to your idea of what comedy is and what its parameters are. And then you go somewhere new where people are operating under a, it's a different operating system. It's like Mac and Windows.

You go, they both do the job to a wildly different degree and with different specialities. It's a different universe. It's like going from the Star Trek universe to the Star Wars universe. That's the worst possible analysis. I tell you what it's better. It's like going from adventure time to Fiona and cake. It's the same thing. So different.

Anyway, I really had a great time. And I saw the Sclar brothers do their tagging its show with Jenna Friedman and Alex Aidman just killing. And I saw the Stamptown guys and I meant to text them good luck before they take their special. They take the special three times over the week. I spent a lot of time with them,

well, a bit of time with them at the beginning of the week. and I absolutely vowed a solemn blood oath to make sure I got in touch of them in time and say, hey, good luck with the taping, because it's such a huge deal. I'm so proud of them. And then I didn't do that because I was on a plane. But I cannot wait. The only good thing about missing by about 12 hours seeing some wonderful creative friends of yours record their Netflix special is that it got recorded. So at least I can see the Netflix special. So listen, it was wonderful.

And then I've come back from it. My wife then immediately, like she dropped the kids off and went on a five-day walking holiday, and then I didn't see her and then pick the kids up. So I've been slammed straight back into parenting, which has been joyous, started playing Dead of Winter with the boy. He's 10 now, and I think that's old enough to get stuck in a dead of winter. We're hooked on that. Board game, zombies. If you've got young children, zombie kids is absolutely brilliant.

If they're slightly older, zombie teams is brilliant. And if you're an adult, or you've got a precocious 10-year-old, and, crucially, you already know how to play it, dead of winter is effectively zombie adults. It's just brilliant. So I've been doing that and I had, he went to asleep. You don't need to know all the details. I just wanted to kind of also big up the girl because I had a great time with her as well

when he bugged off to his leaveover. So I've gone from mega hectic comedy gloss to deep parenting. And I've got a few days left before my lovely wife returns in which, so today I went straight into admin. six back-to-back Zoom meetings. So I tell you what, I'm never bored. Speak to you soon.