The Daily Stoic - BONUS | George Raveling's Greatest Lessons That Will CHANGE How You Live

Episode Date: September 4, 2025

This special tribute episode celebrates the life and wisdom of George Raveling, bringing together some of his most powerful lessons shared over the years in his conversations with Ryan on The... Daily Stoic Podcast.📕 You can grab copies of What You’re Made For by George Raveling at The Painted Porch: https://www.thepaintedporch.com/🎥 Watch George Raveling’s FULL interview on The Daily Stoic Podcast: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJ-ZQ2p0WhY📖 Preorder the final book in Ryan Holiday's The Stoic Virtues Series: "Wisdom Takes Work": https://store.dailystoic.com/pages/wisdom-takes-work🎙️ Follow The Daily Stoic Podcast on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/dailystoicpodcast🎥 Watch top moments from The Daily Stoic Podcast on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@dailystoicpodcast✉️ Want Stoic wisdom delivered to your inbox daily? Sign up for the FREE Daily Stoic email at https://dailystoic.com/dailyemail🏛 Get Stoic inspired books, medallions, and prints to remember these lessons at the Daily Stoic Store: https://store.dailystoic.com/📱 Follow us:  Instagram, Twitter, YouTube, TikTok, and FacebookSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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Starting point is 00:00:00 Welcome to the Daily Stoic Podcast, where each day we bring you a stoic-inspired meditation designed to help you find strength and insight and wisdom into everyday life. Each one of these episodes is based on the 2,000-year-old philosophy that has guided some of history's greatest men and women help you learn from them. to follow in their example, and to start your day off with a little dose of courage and discipline and justice and wisdom. For more, visitdailysteoic.com. of the Daily Stoke Podcast. It's special because it's about a special person.
Starting point is 00:01:06 It's an episode I didn't want to have to bring you because I got home two nights ago and I got a text from Mark Ravling. This is George Ravling's son. And he said, comes with extreme sadness and heartbreak that earlier this afternoon at his home in Los Angeles, our beloved George H. traveling has passed away at age 88.
Starting point is 00:01:33 He said, please know in your heart that he was resting comfortably in bed and was surrounded by immediate family at the time of his passing. Stokes talk a lot about Mementu Mori. I don't think it's a surprise when you get a text that your 88-year-old friend has passed. At the same time, George is such a force of life. He had defied so many limitations and expectations over the years. He had so much energy. And roughly a month ago, he texts me, I'm pleased to report that
Starting point is 00:02:03 my health is very stable and he was doing better. That's neither here nor there. George isn't with us anymore. And that's a very sad thing. But what remains behind George is an incredible legacy. He was one of the wisest people I've ever met, one of the most hopeful and cheerful people I've ever met one of the most inspiring people that I have ever met. I feel very lucky to have gotten 10 years with him. I met him in a UT practice in 2016. He became a dear friend, a mentor, a teacher, an example, and I was lucky to interview him several times for the Daily Stoic podcast. I was lucky enough to do this wonderful book for him called What You're Made for, which is about lessons from his life in sports and in the world.
Starting point is 00:02:54 And today I wanted to put together sort of in memoriam. Some of the best things that he taught me, some of the best clips from those episodes, I think you will want to listen to them. If you don't know who George is, you missed out. I'm sorry, but it's never too late to add a little George traveling in your life. And so let's consider this episode a celebration of a wonderful man. do read the book. I know it was something he was immensely proud of. Let me read something from it here
Starting point is 00:03:29 because it's one of my favorite parts of the book. At the end, he takes a minute to think about, to meditate on his mortality. He says, in this process of reflection, I can't help but confront my own mortality. At age 87, the same age as Jerry West, who he had recently lost, he said, I found myself acutely aware of the precious nature of time. I began to think of life as a basketball game in its final quarter with just minutes left on the clock. It said Phil Jackson has talked about how that was a lesson he learned from the great Red Holtzman of the Knicks. Phil was on the bench and Red called him over and asked him how much time was on the game clock. Phil, who had been resting or engrossed in the play didn't know. You've got to know,
Starting point is 00:04:18 Red told him. You may be going into the game, and if you don't know the time, could get us in trouble. Don't let me catch you doing that again. For me, I know what time it is, which is to say near the end, there's no way around it. In fact, as I said, at my age, I'm closer to something like double overtime or extra innings. The question then becomes how will I use this remaining time? how can I ensure that these last minutes are played with purpose and impact? Even now at age 87, I wake up every day with a sense of purpose. I'm still learning, still growing, still striving to make an impact, whether it's through my writing, my speak engagements,
Starting point is 00:04:56 or simply the conversations I have with those around me, I'm constantly looking for ways to leave a positive mark on the world, which he absolutely did. He said, as I reflect on my life, I am filled with a profound sense of gratitude and purpose. I've been blessed with a life that has exceeded my wildest expectations, a life filled with more overtime periods than I could count. Every time I thought the game was over, I was given more time on the clock. I think he absolutely did what he set out to do. He lived in an incredible life.
Starting point is 00:05:32 As Seneca said, he has more than just a number to show for these 88 years. on the planet. He made an incredible difference in so many people's lives, including my own, including the game, which he loved, including in his own family, who is obviously in mourning right now. Let's just get into it. Here's some lessons and insights into George. I hope you enjoy. And maybe take this as a reminder if there's anyone that age in your life or of any age that you haven't connected with for a while. You haven't told them how they make you feel. or checked in with them, send him a note. I'm glad my last couple texts with George were good,
Starting point is 00:06:13 but you always wish for more. You always wish you'd said one more thing. So let that be the lesson, and we'll get here into George. You know, I think about it on a pretty regular basis, how glad I am that I took Shaka Smart up on his invitation to come to practice that one day. That was one of the best introductory gifts.
Starting point is 00:06:36 I tell them all the time. The greatest gift you ever gave me was an introduction of Ryan Holiday, and it was the thrill of a lifetime. I had read your books, and I remember when Shaka called me, and he said, Coach, have you ever heard of the author, Ryan Holiday? And I said, no. And he said, well, I'm reading one of his books now, and I bought an extra one for you. I think it's right down your alley. And so we met and we talked about you. And then he set up the arrangement for us.
Starting point is 00:07:10 He asked me, he said, hey, would you be interested in meeting him? Because I was coming down to do a staff retreat for him. Yeah. And he asked me, would I be interested in meeting you? I said, absolutely. And so then, of course, we set up to dinner. And little did I know that it was going to end up being one of the best things has ever happened to me in my lifetime.
Starting point is 00:07:31 I've always been a person who believed that. that you have to have mentors, and not all of your mentors have to be adults. And I also said to myself, I need to get four or five really young dudes to be my mentors. And you were one that came immediately to mine. I thought there was so much that I could learn from you. You lived a fascinating life yourself or a young man, I guess I would say, based on me being 87. But I've learned so much about writing a book, publishing a book. One of the conclusions I definitely came to, it's a lot harder to get the book published
Starting point is 00:08:12 than it is to write it. And it's been an absolute lifetime reward to have a relationship with you, to learn from you, the meetings that we have by phone and on a weekly basis when we were putting together the structure for the book, every one of those were an instrument and the best utilization of time. I told my wife, after the second time, we had those Friday morning calls. I said, one thing about Ryan, if he says in Iowa, it's going to be an hour, and we're going to impact as much as we could. And so it made me realize the value of your time and my time. Here's an opportunity to be with someone you really admire and respect, and you've got to.
Starting point is 00:08:58 their attention for one hour. That's 60 minutes and get as much out of it as we can each time. And I wrote tons of notes to help me articulate different points to you. And little did I know that we would end up doing a book together. I know. It's like you get invited to do stuff and you never know how your life is going to change from it. I thought I was just going to watch Texas do their basketball practice. And he said, there's going to be this guy there. I want you to meet. He said, he's the godfather of college basketball. That's what we call him. And I was like, okay. And I feel grateful every day that that happened because you've been such a big part of my life. You've taught me so much. And I feel like doing the book, too. Like, I was thinking throughout it, like, whether the
Starting point is 00:09:48 book happens or not, that I get an excuse to talk to George traveling for an hour or so a week, that's a win unto itself. And it was an opportunity for me to revisit my life. I had never really sat down for any meaningful amount of time and thought about the journey from being born in a segregated hospital in Washington, D.C. in 1937 to 2025. It was a long journey, and I had never really stopped to think about much of the journey along the way. I didn't appreciate a lot of it. I was always in the go-go-mood.
Starting point is 00:10:28 And once I had an opportunity to share my journey with you, things took on a more valuable positioning in my life. I learned to look at some of the things that I took for granted and realize how lucky I was to survive some of these situations along the way. Yeah, I can't imagine when you were born you could have even conceived of the year 2025 existing, let alone that you would be around. Like, that would have been so incomprehensibly far in the distance. Yeah. What's interesting is that in 1937, I was born at Garfield Hospital, which is a segregated hospital. The whites had the top four floors above the ground, and you had to
Starting point is 00:11:15 go around to the basement if you were black to get treatment. And at that time, the life expectancy of a black male in the United States was 44 years. And now if you go and you look at the life expectancy of an 87-year-old black man, it's 77 percent. So I beat the, I beat the odds on both of them. Yeah. Does it sometimes sting a little, though? I think, I think people, people go, yeah, I want to have an impact. I want to help others. But if I'm not like sort of actively fighting for myself, if I'm not making it all about me i'll get pushed aside like i mean you've done all this stuff you've had this enormous impact of the game i will say there was something for me watching that movie
Starting point is 00:12:01 about jordan going to uh to nike which which she insisted on you being in i think that's incredible but even there like that movie they made it about they made it about some other dude even though like essentially underplaying your role in that story, is there something about, like if you're preparing someone for the trajectory we're talking about, do they have to cultivate a kind of a sense of self-worth as opposed to getting your worth from your achievements or your recognition? Because it's not always going to be there. You're not always going to get the credit you deserve. Well, to me, I really never, I never was in it for the I was in it to try to be a positive difference maker in as many lives as I possibly could.
Starting point is 00:12:55 And in some situations, I had better impact and others I had less impact. But I always try to say, what is it that I have that I can use to help this person become a better human being? The more I gave, the easier it was to get and to try to be a positive difference maker and as many lives as possible. There's probably 50 players that I've coached between Washington State, Iowa, and USC to this day, that we still text each other, we still talk to each other, we still share information together. And to me, I felt coaching is a great responsibility because here's a parent that takes their most prized possession and they put them in your hands.
Starting point is 00:14:01 Yeah. And so my responsibility is that at the end of the day, the mother is saying, I sent you my most valuable possession. And at the end of the day, you want to be able to, the reward that trust that she had, she had in you. Give them back better than you found him. Yes, yes. And some of the things we've neglected or not been taking care of are coming back into view. If you want to get ahead of cold and flu season, make sure you're doing what you can,
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Starting point is 00:15:53 your health. We've been hiring for some positions at Daily Stoic lately. And when you have roles you're trying to fill, it can be difficult, right? You want to fill the roles quickly, but you also want to find the right people. So that's really a question. How do you find amazing candidates fast? Well, the answer is just use indeed. When it comes to hiring, Indeed is all you need. Stop struggling to get your job posts seen on other job sites. With Indeed's sponsored jobs, you stand out and hire fast. And with sponsored jobs, your jobs jump to the top of the page to help you find relevant candidates quickly. How fast is Indeed? In the minute we've been talking here, 23 hires were made on Indeed, according to Indeed data worldwide. There's no need to
Starting point is 00:16:36 wait any longer. Speed up your hiring right now with Indeed. And listeners will get a $75 sponsored job credit to get your job more visibility at indeed.com slash daily stoic just go to indeed.com slash daily stoic right now to support the show and say you heard about indeed on this podcast dd.com slash daily stoic terms and conditions apply hiring deed is all you need so one of my favorite things about our relationship is what actually just happened a few seconds ago which is something popped into your mind that you'd forgotten about because I feel like when I ask you, I'll go, I'll think of someone or I'll think of some event. And I go, oh, did you ever meet this person?
Starting point is 00:17:20 Does this ever happen? And you always have, you know, a crazy story. Like when Jimmy Carter died, I texted you and I said, hey, did you ever meet Jimmy Carter? And he said, oh, he sure did. We were in China together. Yeah. So your life's absurd. That was in 1979.
Starting point is 00:17:39 Nike gave myself Bill Furter. Foster, who was the coaching at Clemson at that time, and Eddie Sutton, Nike sent us to China to do basketball clinics. And at that time, China was a communist country. Beijing didn't exist. It was Peking. And so we started out the clinics in Shanghai. It was a little bit challenging because you couldn't get a really good rhythm going into teaching because you'd have to stop for the person to translate the information. But they put us up at a place in Shanghai called a Jingjing Hotel, which is still there now. Carter and Nixon both had meetings with the Chinese government at that hotel.
Starting point is 00:18:25 And so one day we come back from doing a clinic. And when we walk into the lobby, three gentlemen approach us, shirt and tie and so forth. And the one guy shows this badge. He's from the Secret Service. and he said that, hey, we're going to have to move you guys off that floor to another place in the hotel. We asked him, why did we have to move? And he said, well, President Carter's coming tomorrow, and he's going to be on the floor above that, and we can't have anybody on the floor right directly under him and so forth.
Starting point is 00:19:01 And so they moved us, and Jimmy Carter came to town, and the Secret Service guys introduced us, to him. You couldn't meet a nicer person than him or his wife. And he thanked us for, you know, switching the floors and so forth. He was having a luncheon at the U.S. Embassy, and he invited us to the luncheon, and we showed up. And the first thing that amazed me was he remembered each one of our names and addressed us by our name and that and so forth. I have a picture at home of him standing next to his wife eating a piece of cake at that same luncheon. and then that. Little did I know that many years later, I would look back and realize I played an interesting piece of history. Interesting thing of history. Why? Well, because first of all,
Starting point is 00:19:53 we get to Peking, doing the clinics, and our interpreter took us down to Tianan Square. And we go down the Tenement Square and we're taking pictures and so forth. And the crowd starts to gather around there's people just staring at us and so forth. And an elderly gentleman steps out of the crowd and he picks up my hand and he goes like that. And I remember Bill Foss's wife, she was highly insulted. And I said, no, no, I get it. He's never seen a black person before in his life. And he thinks that this is paint. I'm never. forget that and my life. He just, he just stepped out of the crowd, picked up my hand, and then I realized the next few weeks when I would think about it, I said, God, I never thought
Starting point is 00:20:45 about the fact that there's a lot of people who have never seen a black person in their life. And that was also a big, that was part of the early days of Nike and the NBA really pushing the game of basketball internationally, which would, I mean, you later, you would become the director of international basketball at Nike, but that when people see the NBA as a global game today, it's probably one of the more next to soccer, the most global game. Yes. That was because of trips like that. Greatness is complex.
Starting point is 00:21:20 It's uncommon. You know, one thing you'll hear about most uncommon people is they'll say, oh, they have such a big ego. But to me, I think that's a prerequisite of greatness, it is an ego to see things that other people don't see, to do things that other people don't do, to say things that other people don't do, to go down the roads that nobody else travels, to me, inherent in all of greatness is the uncommonness of it all. Sure. But don't you, but I don't know, I was just struck by the way that Krauss sort of continually sought out conflict and sought to make it about him and thought like, you know, even just, you know, driving Phil Jackson out, you know, not treating scabby pippen well. You know, it struck me that, you know, that was really a factor that cost, you know, the bull is probably a maybe a few more, if not several more chance. championships for really no upsides. It may be a perspective that we could examine, Ryan, is for some people, for them to reach your outer limits, they need conflict to drive them. And peace, they're not as good at doing, when peace and tranquility is the environment. But when there's all this conflict and disunity, it drives, it's the fuel that runs the vehicle.
Starting point is 00:23:04 That human vehicle is fueled by that. The peace and tranquility gets them nervous and they feel inadequate. And they feel adequate when there's a lot of excitement, drama going on, disunity. because then they kind of, in a way, feel like, okay, now I get on the white horse and I'll calm the warders. No, I think that's a profound observation, and I've met a number of those people in life. And I think in a weird way, that's an attitude that can often make someone extraordinarily successful. I just found in my study of history, that tends also to be an attitude that leads to very, you know, cataclysmic fall. because eventually the person tangles with the wrong enemy or, you know,
Starting point is 00:23:55 blows up something that they work very hard to build. I don't know about you, but I tend to have a lot of sympathy and pity for that person, even if they're really difficult to be around, even if they make my life miserable, ultimately I feel sadness for them because I know that the person who bears the true brunt of what that must be like is themselves. Yeah, Ryan, one of the one of the first. of the things that that I think about people who are extraordinary or uncommon, they have acquired the ability to stand in their own truth. And for most people, they can't stand in their
Starting point is 00:24:39 own truth. I think this is what standing in their own truth is applicable to Phil Jackson to Michael, the Krauss. God knows the guy who, who most people didn't even even really know that he coached Jordan, Doug Collins. I mean, there's so many examples so far of people who have the courage to stand in their own truth. I think it's something that goes under discussion in our society today is this whole idea about having the courage to stand in your own truth. No, that's beautiful. That's beautiful. And the self-respect to do that. Talk to me about your journaling habit, because one of the texts that you sent me that affected me very deeply, you just sent me this sort of page in your journal where you'd ask this question. You said, what am I made for? And then you'd put down these bullets sort of ruminating on that most essential of question. which is like, why are we here? What is the meaning of life? What are we supposed to make of this
Starting point is 00:25:52 gift that we've been given? And that's what ultimately became the book. But that came out of your journaling. Yeah, I started journaling in 1972 when I was at Washington State. I would underline things in books or write notes to myself. And then once a week, I'd give them to my secretary and I'd ask her to type these out. And then I put them in plastic sheet. So I have every journal I kept from 1972 to this day now, I have all those journals year by year. And the last, I'd say, eight or nine years, I've done most of the transcribing myself. I take two or three hours on a Sunday and I sit down and I write my notes out in my journal from things that I've learned or read it in books. and so...
Starting point is 00:26:45 And you collect this into like a single... Yeah, and then I collect that into a single journey for the year. I actually have one of them here, if you want to... It's a tan book with the notes in it. Yeah, they call that a commonplace book, like a collection of thoughts and ideas and inspirations. That's what you're keeping? Yeah.
Starting point is 00:27:03 As you can see, it says on their 2020, but this is one of the books that this is when I stopped doing the type in and started to collect information. and kept my notes. So I have one of these for every year. But here I kind of took my own way of keeping notes in that. And so, like I said, I have every year since 1972, I have these journals.
Starting point is 00:27:29 And they're a great reference for me when I'm speaking or writing an article or something like that. But this is the earlier ones in the 70s were three ring binders in that. there's a line in Jewish culture. They say, we keep the Sabbath, but mostly the Sabbath keeps us. And I think there's something about keeping a journal where, yeah, you are keeping the journal, but the journal is helping you keep it together.
Starting point is 00:27:55 Yes. Keeps your thoughts organized. It calms you down. It gives you perspective. It gives you a little space. Even if you never go back through it ever again, it was the act of doing it that gives you most of the value. Yeah. It's so true because I actually.
Starting point is 00:28:11 actually look forward to it. I would come across bits of information and I thought were really relevant and I'd write down notes to myself. And then once a week, I would go back to my journal and I'd make the entries in there. And so it became a great source of learning for me because I could go back and refer to things. And if I were going to do a talk on the relevance of truth. Over the years, I probably have a hundred page notes just on truth, where I wrote them into the journal and so forth. It struck me as interesting that even in your 80s, you're still, you were still thinking about like why you're here. What is the purpose of this? It strikes me that that realization you had
Starting point is 00:29:04 that you basically doubled the life expectancy that was predicted for you at your birth, that you're sort of like, well, I got two lives. How am I going to spend it? What am I going to have to show for this? Like, Seneca has this line about how a lot of old people have nothing to show for their age, but a high number of years. And it seems like you're really fascinated and feel compelled to have answers to those kinds of questions about what you used it for? I really, when I asked myself, who am I? I think I'm one of God's disciples. And I felt that the reason I'm on earth is to serve the needs of others to help people live a better life. I've always believed if you help enough people get what they want, you'll always get what
Starting point is 00:29:57 you want. Yeah. And so over the years, I've always tried to find ways to serve. the needs of others. And as a result, it came back to pay me or later in life or reward me later. As someone who's now in your 80s, who's been around before, who's been through some bad times in America and experience some of the hope and redemption that America brings, how are you feeling about the state of things right now, and I'm just wondering if you have any wisdom for it? I'm going to give you my grandma's wisdom. She used to say, it's always darkest before the sun shines. And that's where I think we'll come out on the other side of this, and we'll all
Starting point is 00:30:54 be better for it. And, and, you know, one great lesson that we're going to, we're going to learn from this is that the American people are resilient. They're, they're loving, forgiving, caring people. I mean, we're, we're being deluge with random acts of kindness. Not every day, every second, somewhere in the globe, someone is exercising a random act of kindness. And so, So there's a hell of a lot that we're being challenged with, but there's a hell of a lot of love and kindness in our people. And not just American people. It's really showed us, I'll go back to what I said before. In a very simple way, there's a hell of a lot of people who are standing in their truth.
Starting point is 00:31:45 No, that's beautiful. And I think that's a great sort of stoic lesson, which is like you decide what lens to look at this. Do you look at all the awful things that are happening in the institutions that have failed and the leaders that have dropped the ball? Or do you look at the leaders who have stepped up or the institutions that have endured the pressure? Do you think, you know, obviously, for me, at being in my 30s, you know, I'm not that worried about a virus. Like, you know, I know the odds are in my favor, right? It must be a different experience to be 80 and to have had some health problems. How are you managing what I must suspect might be some anxiety or worry or even fear?
Starting point is 00:32:30 How do you managing? I just go to bed every night and I think to myself and pray for a better tomorrow. And just keep it simple. Just we'll wake up in the morning and it'll be a better tomorrow than it was. And for me personally, hell, I've already hit the lottery, man. And I've had the blessing to be on this earth for 82 years. There's a large segment of American population. I'll never make it to 40.
Starting point is 00:33:00 I've been on the planet for 82 years. I've already hit the lottery. Anything I get from here on out is a bonus. You know, Seneca actually said the exact same thing. He said, the man who tells himself at the end of the day, I've lived my life, I'm done. every morning you awake is a bonus. And so I just love that intuitively, that's how you live. And honestly, I feel better just hearing those words out of your mouth.
Starting point is 00:33:31 And I always feel better talking to you, Coach. Well, thank you. I want to say this to you publicly. You've really been a positive difference maker in my life. And you were a good example of elders need young mentors. And you've been a great young mentor for me. And I want to thank you for that. I would say my favorite part of the calls that we got to do was at the end, you always close with I love you.
Starting point is 00:34:08 Yes. And I always say that back. And there's not a lot of people that I say that to on the phone these days. I know that's kind of part of your philosophy when you love somebody, you tell them. Yes, I really, that's one of the most important things to me in my life is to express appreciation. But also, when you tell someone you love them, then it's got to be a reality. What do you mean? I mean, it's like you're dating this girl and you say, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you.
Starting point is 00:34:47 That's how many throw around. Yeah, and at some points, she says, well, Georgia, if you love me, show me that you love me. Yeah. And so there comes a time when you have to, the words I love you have to take the next step. And the next step is an over expression of love. Yeah, someone once told me love is spelled, T-I-M-E. So, Coach, Seneca's line, this is a opens part one of your book. Often a very old man has no other proof of his long life than his age.
Starting point is 00:35:28 What's that mean to you? What it means to me is what did I achieve during my lifetime that has unique value, not just for me, but for others. At the end of the day, I think if I have to go up and, and meet St. Peter at the gate, I think he'll say you did a good job of serving the needs of others, and we have taken particular notice of that, and you're welcome to come and be amongst the heavenly angels. And that, to me, would be the ultimate reward of my life, is to look back and to realize that I live the reason I was put on earth.
Starting point is 00:36:19 And that's, I believe the reason I was put on earth is to serve the needs of others. And so I would like to be able to meet St. Peter at the gate. And he looks at my achievements and he says, well done. Welcome. Hey, it's Ryan. Thank you for listening to the Daily Stoog podcast. I just wanted to say we so appreciate it.
Starting point is 00:36:46 We love serving you. It's amazing to us that over 30 million people have downloaded these episodes in the couple of years we've been doing it. It's an honor. Please spread the word, tell people about it, and this isn't to sell anything. I just wanted to say, thank you. Look, ads are annoying. They are to be avoided. if at all possible.
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