The Dale Jr. Download - 410 - Sterling Marlin - "I Broke My Dad's Collarbone"

Episode Date: February 8, 2023

It’s time once again to sit down with a guest in the Bojangles Studio, and Dale Earnhardt Jr. and co-host Mike Davis have decided to kick off the year with a bang. The highly-anticipated first interview of The Dale Jr. Download’s 11th season is none other than Columbia, Tennessee’s Sterling Marlin. Marlin has been one of the most requested visitors by Download listeners, as he was a fixture in the NASCAR Cup garage for nearly four decades and a fan favorite amongst his class of competitors.Sterling truly embodies the humble farmer to stock car racing star trajectory that NASCAR was founded on. In fact, he traveled from his family’s 600-acre farm which is located about an hour southwest of Nashville. It was on that very farm that he learned the ethics of hard work from his father Clifton “Coo Coo” Marlin. Hard working principles made Coo Coo a force to be reckoned with in the NASCAR Sportsman ranks of the ‘60s and ‘70s, which carried over to him being one of the best-running independent outfits on the Cup circuit. From the age of 12, Sterling found a place on his father’s race team, eventually rising to tire changer and crew chief. His initial attempt at a cure came in the form of a ‘64 Chevelle, which he and his cousin drove from home straight to the race track; no tags, no lights, no worries. A few years later, he made a more proper entrance into the racing world, entering a NASCAR Sportsman race at the famed Nashville Fairgrounds. A couple racing weekends later, he found himself sitting in the driver’s seat of his father’s Cup ride, ready to take on the likes of Richard Petty, Cale Yarborough, and the other stars of the 1970s. And when the opportunity for a full-time Cup ride came knocking from Roger Hamby in 1983, Sterling rose to the occasion in the same fashion, finishing 19th in the point standings and winning Rookie of the Year honors. Consistency seemed to be a key to success for Sterling, as a signed contract to be chauffeur of Billy Hagan’s championship-winning number-44 Piedmont Airlines ride brought about his breakthrough season in 1988. A 10th-place points effort made other car owners in the garage take notice, and the tobacco farmer from Columbia had established himself as a more than capable wheel-turner. Sterling had stints driving for some of the most steadiest outfits in the stock car scene, including Junior Johnson, Hoss Ellington, the Stravola Brothers, and Earl Sadler, but none could help him get over the hump from solid finisher to race winner. That is, until 1994. Armed with a new ride at Morgan-McClure, in their bright-yellow Kodak number-4, Sterling set out on the season lightning quick, thanks in part to Dr. Gas’ revolutionary “x-pipe” exhaust system. The few extra horsepower was enough to edge Sterling ahead when it mattered most, making him the winner of the Daytona 500. After finishing second and coming close so many times, he was finally a race winner, in the sport’s biggest event at that. Once the glass was broken, Sterling returned the following year and repeated the feat, giving him the distinct honor of being the only driver in history to notch his first two victories in the Great American Race. He would go on to finish 3rd in the 1995 season points, certifying him as one of the top talents in the division. Sterling would go on to have continued success in NASCAR, including a near-championship run in 2002 before retiring after the ‘09 season. The discussion covers the highs and lows of his career, as well as his 2012 diagnosis of Parkinsonism and his navigation of the disorder in his day-to-day life. Tune in to gain a unique perspective on one of stock car racing’s most memorable characters on episode 410 of the Dale Jr. Download. Check out Dirty Mo Media on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@DirtyMoMedia  Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

The following is a production of Dirtymoe Media. Well, one, two, Winston Cup races, both of them 500, so I wouldn't take nothing for. Story is right here. In front. Earnhardt in second. The intimidator will have to be at his intimidating best. And the winner of 1995, Daytona 500 is again Sterling Marlin. Coming to the line, Sterly Marlin's going to win it.

He wins his first Winston Cup victory in the greatest race of the mall. Oh, it's sadden. Long has jumped out of his car. He's going around to look at the right front fender. Oh, he can't do that. You can't work on your car under the red flag. That's the NASCAR rule. Hold it off a little bit.

Jamie's done to death. We'll go down the straightaway, the hospital's hot, what I'll call it. But I was hoping he didn't come back across in front of him. Can you believe you're here? No, not really much piece for sale. I knew when I left house, we were going to win a race, and it wasn't looking to get early. But they done a heck of a job getting a car adjusted, and, man, I love them. Man, I love them.

Hey, everybody, welcome back to another episode of the Dale Jr. Download. Episode 410 on Wednesday, February 8, 2003, back at the Bojangles studio. And we got a guest coming in today on Wednesday. Sterling Marlin will be the guest for the show. I want to welcome Mike Davis. How you doing, Mike? Man, I'm pumped. I'm pumped.

Sterling Marlins here. I mean, man, this has been one that's been requested, and we've been waiting for a long time. Yeah, looking forward to getting Sterling in here, just before we do. Want to thank Lionel. I see a couple new die casts on the table. Number 17, Christopher Busher car sitting over there. Yeah. We've had diecast on this table forever, but I've seen some new modern.

That's right. Next-Gen cars here. Well, Lionel brought them. Lionel's a new partner of the Delgener down. this year. So we welcome them. Very excited that they've decided to join us. And perfect fit because, yeah, we have a lot of die cast on this table.

I want to thank Ally. They are also a great partner for the, for the Dale Jr. download, and they are actually the ones that sponsor the guest segment and bring us our, quote, allies to the table. Sterling is definitely one of our allies. And I'm known Sterling for a really long time. I've got the chance to race against him for sure. And let's just say this before we bring him in.

You know, we know that Sterling has Parkinson's disease. Hopefully everybody at home knows that too. But it may affect his speech. It may be hard to hear him at times. But that's okay. It's Sterling Marlin. We wanted him for a long time. We're glad he's here.

We're more than willing to show him grace because we know that our listeners are going to show him grace too. He's a part of a lot of different things that went on in NASCAR, but also his own career and my career. And I can't wait to get to that, but want to thank Ally for supporting us the way they do. Supporting NASCAR the way they do. You know, Allies had a lot of great announcements here lately, becoming the official sort of banking partner for NASCAR.

That's right. And so, you know, we need to celebrate and support all of these organizations that help our sport, right, achieve and grow. And Ally is certainly doing big things in this space. So thank you, Ally. and why don't we go ahead and bring Sterling in. Let's do it. Sterling Marlin on the Dale Jr. Download. He brought beer.

Of course Sterling Marlin brought beer. It's cold beer. He brought beer. Here, throw that headset on and get that mic for you. You'll be able to hear as well. What's up, pal? How you doing? He's doing good.

Yeah. So, Sterling Marlin, it's been a long time since I've seen you. It's been several years. I don't know. Last race. Homestead, I guess. How long ago was that? This is last race at Homestead.

I mean, what? Five or six years ago? Probably. Probably. Ten years ago. Yeah. Yeah. So, have you been to a cup race since you last drove?

You've been to maybe one or two, right? One or two. Yeah. What are you been doing? Farming. Farming. A bunch of cattle. You got a bunch of cattle.

Yeah, about 80. 80. So that's what's? It's always fucking, freaking broke. Something's broke about them? Yeah. Didn't you have a farming accident recently? Didn't you, like, break your foot or something?

Yeah. I mean, so you've got to be careful on these tractors, don't you? I don't want to jump off, ain't 16. Is that what happened? Did you jump off? Yeah, he jumped off, turned it. So, so let's start, let's start there. Your family owned a 600-acre farm, right?

Right. And you were born on this farm. Yeah. 18, 1879, house built. The house was built in 1879. You were living in this house, grew up in it. Yeah. Right.

And what got your dad into racing? So your dad's a driver in the Cup Series in the 70s. I remember Cuckoo and watched a ton of races of him racing. So what got him into racing? He was about 16. and had track in Holmawall, Tennessee. His brother didn't show up to race. He's going to work on his brother's car,

but brother never showed up. He said, I'll drive this thing. Okay. He went third, come back next week. His brother had a car? Yeah. So how had the family get interested in racing to begin with?

I don't know. Just him three, five brothers. There were five brothers. Yeah. Five brothers. Damn. So. You had a lot of uncles.

One of them. Yeah. So, um, your dad gave, you one acre of this farm when you turned what 12? No, I mean, I built a house on the original farm. But like back when you were a little kid, your dad gave you an acre of land to farm yourself.

Oh, yeah, you have a tobacco. Right. That's how I bought first race car. So he had 600 acres, and how much of that did he farm? Probably 400. Right, so 400, and he gives you one of those acres. Yeah, he actually gives you two acres. Oh, he did?

Tobacco. And there's more money, they have more tobacco. Really? So two acres of tobacco? And it's all your responsibility? Yeah. I mean, now it's going to get to go up and pay you not to have. Right, I got you. But this is back in the day.

Back in the day, yeah. Were you good tobacco farmer? The best for him around. The best. So you're farming yourself, using his stuff and his tractors and so forth? Yeah, his daddy passed in old five, so. So, uh, who's got all this stuff ain't here at all that stuff? Yeah.

But back when you get this couple of acres and you're a little boy, right, or you're young, young? How's young, I was 18, 19? 18 or 19. And you do your own farming with this two acres and raise enough money to buy a race car? Yeah, that was, I mean, a race car then would cost you. I bought the first race car for $66. And it paid $4,000 for it. That's a lot.

Yeah. Yeah. And what year, I mean, how? It was $76. 76. And so where did you get the car from? Buddy Star.

Who? Buddy Star, the guy in Alabama. He's got your dad's car when he flipped the line. He's behind the shop. He was about 10 years ago. Damn, really? You know, when it was, he broke a roll bar

into. Had nitrous oxide. Yeah. Had nitrous oxide in it. Yeah. So they... Get some nitrous oxide story's there now. So, um,

Where is it at? I need to go see you're still there. So Johnny Starr lives in Alabama. Buddy, Buddy Starr. He passed last year. Oh, he did? I'm going to drive right to where it's at. Yeah, if it's there, I'd like to have it.

He'll run down service station, I was in a ways to get a clip, put on my car. And I was wanting through the Weasler here. And I'm saying, no shit. No shit. Dang. It's all the hell to flip it, but he used to be a Dygard car. Yeah. John really bought it from Dagar.

He did. Wow, I never heard that story. That car just sitting there. Sitting there. Damn. And the dude died last year? Did you say it? Yeah, yeah, last year.

So who owns it now? I don't know. Go get it. Sterling. This is what we got you here. This is what? You're going to go get that car. So your dad, when did he start racing in the Cup series?

He's bought race about 67. And who named your dad, Kuku? He did. He did. He can talk about it, like me. I like me. He can't say it like Cuckoo when he, he's like, let's call me Cuckoo. What's his name?

What's his full name? Clifton B. What? Clifton B. Clifton B. And so he just started going by Cuckoo. Yeah. And, because I mean, you know, that's pretty unique name.

Ain't many people got. Yeah, he didn't, any many people got. I don't know anybody else. And so when did he start raising the cup? A little time? Started about 19. He bought a junior's car. The one gloss back selling pole with a shark.

Oh, yeah, yeah, the white three. White three. Charlie wrecked out of that thing in that race. Yeah, he'd head on the streetway. Yeah. He's fast, but he raced. He was fast and crashed at all. He was a dart without feathers.

Yeah. In that race, at least. I hate to go off with Daddy. Daddy got hurt in Talladeo and broke his shoulder. Yep. And we had to go to Charlotte. run a 40600 and Humphie made a deal with daddy, paying up by the three car.

But he got in that car. Then he'll warm it up. He'll come by, wide open, Charlie Glossback. And Charlie drove it, broke a motor and race. We had prototype motors back then. So your dad bought the car, the white three car that Junior Johnson owned at Charlie wrecked. Yeah. That was your dad's...

He won't bristol with it. That was your dad's first. car? No, he had a 69th Shepil. That was your first cup car.

Cup car. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. He had stopped. He had to run windows, doors with the windows in them and

roll a window up or down or short track doors and both had two doors you both down and used to be lighter. Yeah. But badgers in the right front

had a big four, 27 minute and hooked up cowling ducts. Pretty neat. Yeah. And so your dad starts cup racing

with that car? Yeah, started that. Did he drive it? Yeah, he drove it to, we ran in Daytona. Right car, 10 years didn't put a clip on it nowhere. You ran it 10 years. 10 years, never put a clip on it.

Good heavens. Put it real clip on it one time for much. And it just got re-skinned. Body-wise over the years. Right. Damn. How do you do that? Well, I mean, that's pretty cool.

I love that history. We cut the body off, just me and my buddies. Yeah. Shoot the body off, put the body on. So your dad was, you know, back, so in the, when I watched race, in the 70s I watch a bunch of them and there were you know there's David Pearson Richard Petty Kell Yarborough yeah there was there was like five or six guys yeah and then your dad and your dad was like right on their ass every once while you'd run with them but out of you know

y'all are an independent in yeah in most people's eyes what what you call an independent they don't really exist anymore these days but y'all were you all exceed you know you know they y'all were always like the best independent yeah um and i'm kind of curious how y'all made power how y'all made speed you know you'd outrun all the other independents you'd outrun james hilton and all those other guys that were doing the same same stuff with the same stuff as y'all and y'all and y'all run right on the heels of junior johnston and richard and those guys and how did you how did you do it a lot of work yeah that's a good driver yeah but more of you ride they'd drive his car He said, like, I was a farm.

He turned him down, but he worked his ass off. Yeah. And so a lot of hard work and ingenuity and creativity, and you guys were able to go to the racetrack. I mean, you'd show up, one year he showed up Daytona and run second. Yeah. In the 125, the fourth in the race or something like that. Yeah.

Should have won't. Yeah. Like, literally. We pitied. There was about 34. I think was leading. And that's what I said, you have to come back in. I said, come back in for what?

I was changing the right front tire. He said, you got to, you left the lugs off. I said, I don't leave no damn lugs off. And sure enough, he had to come in the pit road. Fish walked into the Lundits and go ahead. They were on there? Yeah, it was on there. There was nothing off.

Well, y'all got screwed. The tire guy in the tower up there, sent a little down on period. You tell me he can sit down a little of that off. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Why would they do that? They wanted to pay to win.

Oh. You think? I imagine. I love the rich rich a little bit of it. That's the way it was back in. Yeah. Man, that's crazy. So, yeah, that was, there was a Daytona 500, I think it's 76 or 7 or something like that, where Kuku was leading.

And that was the year. He was leading one time, Benin won the race. Yeah. Was there other weeks where y'all were, you know, as competitive at other racetracks? I mean, I know when you go to, like, you know, Michigan, or Charlotte or somewhere like that it was you know it was rare where

y'all to have you know top two top three finishes but outside of Daytona what other racetracks did y'all look forward to going to? I never were yeah in town but that did it took a lot pride in the speedway stuff yeah cut here

cheese here move this move back he put that much he took a lug and wailed on the roof it's on the car raised up his high and got to be able to look Like a camel. Roofs. Built up in the center to get by the templates.

How would you get by the templates with the lug net on the roof? His bond over then, it made roof us weighed 500 pounds. Just to get the arrow with the spolid or stuff like that? He's pretty sharp on arrows.

So he, he, he made one of the stuff. He built that. He's pretty innovative. Yeah. But he had one deal there. He took a radio,

radio. And you're a time. We didn't let you block cars off. So, you go away 20 tires, qualified in top five. And he got a radiator out of a junkyard, and the trope took a core out of it. And the officials, when you went through the inspection, they'd take a hose pipe and squirt through the radiator

to see if it was blocked off anywhere. Well, he had a few holes in it where water had run out. And every time we pick up a second, qualifying line, I'm going to figure out what the hell you're all doing. and had it block a block car off on solid if he wanted to. Yeah, that's pretty cool. Cuckoo Marlin Innovation Stories. I bet we could just do a whole series on that, right?

I have a shop, Dano too. What's that? I was shot down oh, is that right? Gino and Munroes? One here and on here. The work with his arm, that's good, put that in a good pile, a bag pile. I got you. Oh, Monroe, old Moves used to have it, oh, have all Monroe shops in back with his trunk.

Yeah. Here come a god, you're going to go. I need a shot. So I got, you know, watching all these old races from the 70s, there's this blonde-headed skinny kid running around this race car, changing tires. And that was you. That's me. So what was, you know, I, when I look at the videos, I can't imagine what it must have been like to be.

be running around in the garage back then in the 70s. You talk about the Laguna, Dodge Chargers, these beautiful, beautiful late 70s, mid-70s, muscle cars, Detroit Iron, all the creativity and innovation, so much, so many, so much ability for you guys to kind of work and to massage and create whatever you want with these cars. living the dream. You probably didn't know you were living the dream back then. You were probably having a blast, but you're working your butt off probably doing it.

But, man, I know that you go on to have this great driving career, but as a kid running around helping your dad, going to the racetrack every single weekend, how much fun was that? It was ball. We had a ball. Yeah. About the first time I changed tires. I was in Darling.

and you used to have to take, like, Walter's pit crew, our pit crew, we had three or four guys. And if that is in front of everybody, he had to pick first, and then Walter Battle of come in and pick. Walter Ballard. We'd give out.

We'd change the tires on everybody's car, you know. Yeah. Was there a time where you changed, you know, you were the pit crew for more than two cars? No, we're all. But y'all would share, you would share with another team. Yeah, Richard Childers, I was we shared with him too.

Richard Childers? Yeah. Yeah, so like, whoever would. was leading or whoever was the best running car at a time would be the car that come first. Yeah, yeah. And the guy that was struggling, he'd come on down the next time by it. Again, his tires changed. How about that?

Could you imagine doing that today? Well, actually, that happened at Talladega, my first year in the sport. James Finch was crazy enough to try that because he didn't want to pay for a second pit crew, which would make complete sense, so James Finch didn't care. But, like, in that, he put Joe Rutman in, he got the backup car. Jimmy Spencer's in that number one yellow car. Remember that? Yeah.

Yeah. And he just decided to put Joe Ruttman in the backup car at Talladega. And they were like, hey, Finch, who's going to pit Ruttmans? He's the same crew I got from Spencer. But then they just wrecked out so early that it didn't even become a thing. But I never, that was so far. I couldn't believe he was even bossy enough to try that. Yeah, sounds like a good idea.

Well, it definitely is more affordable, I guess. I guess. How did you end up driving a race car for yourself? I bought a 64th ofville, and at the time Nashville had street races. After everything got over, you used to kill your street car from stands and driving a race out there. So I bought a 64th of Vail for 100 bucks and run it twice, made 100 bucks, and sold back the guy for 150. Yeah, that's a good deal. We drove it from Columbia to Nashville.

No tags, no lights, no nothing up in the state, me and my cousin. Outlaw. Come on back. Go back. And then not a few hell that's knocked out. Oh. On the cord, my, anyway, that's my first car.

And I bought that 6-6-7-7. And just qualified six, I think, first race, May the other year, and finished 6th, and it's a national championship race. He used to have a national championship races. And so how did you end up driving your dad's car in a cup race? Back then, you used to track up on wins.

just Thursday Friday, had all kinds of time. He gets the car qualified, and he's just getting a car and run for you that something. I drive 10 or 15 lamps. Just get the seat time, you know. Right. So, for example, when they would go to any racetrack on the schedule, the track is open on Wednesday. 9 o'clock in the morning, track's open until 5. You can go out there run.

All day, the track's open. Am I right? You got it. And so, you know, you might sit in the garage, work on your shit for a couple hours. The guy next to you is out on the racetrack running. Then he comes in, you know, puts his shit on stands for a few hours. And then you go, you know, and the next guy's out. I mean, you just run whenever the hell you won't.

And it wasn't, you know, it wasn't like everybody's lined up at the gate when the practice started. It was just very casual. You know, Sterling could climb in the car and go run five laps if he wanted to. It's a little seat time. Yeah. And so you's out there messing around. driving the car in practice. How often did you do that?

All I wanted to. Every week. I went faster than Daddy and Dorothy. The first time I didn't. Really? Pished him off. Well, he was mad. You know we would have been mad.

I love Darleton. And you... We'd pit at Dorothy. We'd be down there and turn four. Yeah. He's had it on him over. Yeah. And you're getting shade right now.

I love to watch the corner four, piercing him. Cale. Hit that flat up off two over. They're bouncing. That's right. So your dad was mad. What happens when Cuckoo Marlin gets mad at you? Like, is it words?

Well, I told you he'd be kicking me an ass with cowboy boots. And I'll be going around a circle. I broke his collarbone twice. What's his collarbone? Yeah. You broke your dad's collarbone. I remember when he go car. Oh, okay.

He got him jumping out at me. I dodged. I said, I ain't dodging this time I come by. You ran over him? Yeah. You ran over your dad? I thought he was going to jump out of the way and he didn't. that's that's some that's some that's some spencer level right there sterling that's that's that's that's that's crazy

he didn't do it again though didn't so you you you made your sportsman debut in 1976 at nashville you've predominantly raced at the fairgrounds for a long time yeah that was your track how far do you live from the racetrack go for a minute and so um That first race, when you ran that streetstock, you drove your car home with no tail lights. Yeah. I guess they got knocked out in the race. Oh, yeah. Yeah.

So we got to send him to the vehicle on stands. Everybody took him and he had a nice car. Because he had a nice car. He's a nice car. Yeah. They whipped his car's ass. Yeah. It shouldn't bring you nice stuff out there.

Your dad broke his shoulder at Talladega. And you ended up. driving in your first cup race. Yeah. So what year was that? 76. So you ain't raced but a couple races. You only run...

Third race I've run a cup race. Third race you ran. So this is what's weird to me. Kyle has the same situation. So, you know, Richard Petty, when we talk to Kyle, you know, Kyle goes and runs an arka race at Daytona.

It's like the first race he ever ran in his life. And he wins it. And his dad's like, you ain't going to mess around with sportsmen or any of that mess. You're going right to cup. And he goes right into a cup in 79. He took that Dodge Miranda or whatever and Magnum or whatever

and tried his ass off to try to make a few races. He's out there running cup races with, he don't have no other experience. But his dad thought, that was what he needed to do. He's like, why? You ain't wasting your time of that other shit. If you want to go run a cup, come learn to run cup. So even, I mean, this is almost no different

for you. I know you ended up getting a lot of short track and sportsman racing in your in your in your in your in your background but i mean there you are third race of your life running in the cup race and it's not a big deal it was not i mean i know there was some drivers that might have been concerned about your inexperienced but it happened and you did you know you fell out with an issue but just explained to me back then in the 70s how you Kyle, I mean, anybody could just show up and jump in a car and there you go. Off you went.

They took, I think I took my car. I went in Talladega. And the dad had an old beat of a car. I went to shit, really. I was running Talladega with it. And your dad had a backup car. And you were going to run. Flat nose tovail.

You were going to run Talladega. So we can't hit it from Mama because of a bit. You know what we got to Talladega. And I was by myself, a two box in the wagon, he got in and decided to work on the car. The Archerfish would come by. He said, this car got good brakes?

I said, yes. He said, how about the stands? It's pretty good. He got a stung on stand on. Here's your seat. Wow. That's all it took? All it took.

Boy, they were lax. Yeah. Back then. And so you ran an Archer race at Talladega? Yeah. What year was that? Sevent. Yeah.

So this is, yeah. And how did you do? I was only fourth and some come apart. Damn. So how did your first cup race go? Where was that that you filled in for your dad? Nashville? Nashville.

That's the program. Cunningham Kelly sponsored the car and he was right in Nashville. Who great guy? Who was he? H.B. Cunningham. What was his business? Chevrolet dealership. He had a Chevrolet dealership.

That was the sponsor on the side of your dad's car all through the 70s. So we had to get the car ready for tight up first. Daytona? I was like, shit. Nashville. He was going to qualify at Saturday. Your dad?

For the office race, yeah. The next week. And he's a run to 200. He'll run it to... He got him clocked back straight. He'd run 200. Both spin them. Hit the wall.

Hit the wall. He'd hurt him. And he's laid over on the right side of the car. Wait, what? He's laid over the right side of the car. That's spiral a seat in the car. He's cost the $50.

And it broke. It broke. Damn. he's lucky you didn't get. killed. I don't kill him. How long was he out? About a month.

Goodness. Yeah. Well, then they needed a driver, and that was you. Well, it was one with me. We had to work an ass off. We got ready and both tributtal in the race. Is that right? The car, old frame was all twisted up, bent.

It wasn't most good. Oh, the car that you drove for your dad at Nashville is all bent? Yeah. Yeah, just an old car? That's an old car. Since it was you, you got the old junk car out of the backyard. Yeah. You didn't get the nice car.

No. So you run that race and that's it. Your dad gets well, comes back, or what did you do after that? After Nashville. Whenever we didn't run CUP, I'd run Nashville. I'd run full time in Nashville until 1980. You didn't run, you're talking sportsmen, like late model stock or late model car. You went to Nashville and ran any time the CUP cars didn't race.

So you were with your dad on pit road, helping your dad in the garage and all that on a cup weekend. but when that wasn't going on, you took your little sportsman car and raced on Nashville playground. And then in 1980, you went and ran full-time at Nashville. Yeah. And what was your dad doing?

He retired. He retired. So why did your dad retire? It's right of money. What year was this? 7-9 or 80. So why did, was it the transition to the smaller cars? Yeah, he said downside's cars.

Downsized cars. He couldn't have money. He came down to pit road. And went sure. caved in. And the hands cut all the hell, bleeding like hell. He's hell on top. He's running.

It's all yours. Really? Just like that. How old was he in 1980? He was born in 32. So he's about 50? 50. 48.

So your dad, just like that, decided he was going to retire. Was it really that easy of a decision? I don't think. He decided broke. I got a money to get out. He'd follow us. We made my cousin, David, drive a truck. trailer to the race of Charlotte, Michigan, wherever.

And him, Mama, father, I said to car, come home. He'd run with the truck, the trailer. He got about 100 miles from home. He was home sleeping about an hour. He's pretty tough old guy. Yeah. He looked tough. Yeah.

So he retires. What happens to all the cars and shit? He gives me. He had two cars. So he had two cars and gave him to you. Yeah. What'd you do with them? I took him around.

I went to a car, had a car downsized. We could rip, R-Sar-Sheard-chilers. They put a clip on it for me. and run Charlotte one time I run out of money too I had the coolest response it wouldn't give a $4,000 but I'd run out of money

I'd run out of money and but did run like 1778 they had a thank Charlotte it's called the Underdog Award and I run eighth

in the world 600 1978 yeah driving your dad's car yeah and drunk good. And, uh, when it, when it,

paid $5,000 to win that deal. Anyway, he, he's a pretty bad drink. Your dad? Yeah. So he, he always wanted to rough you up a little bit when he was drinking.

So, once the racetrack next morning, one morning, where he did it. Uh, he'd be a later. He came in, had a hat on sunglasses, and he popped up mouth off, some golden glove boxer, some bar.

He wanted to head up. I had to drive the car. Your dad ran his mouth some fellow at the bar at the night before. The golden glove boxer. He didn't over the golden a little boxer. The guy led him up? He'd let him up. Goodness.

And so he couldn't drive it? He couldn't drive. Couldn't see. Damn. So you had to drive the car in the race? He had to drive the car in the race? He had finished eight, World 600. Damn.

I wonder what he said. I don't know. About somebody's mama. My gosh. Did your dad run his mouth to, like, any of the drivers he raised against? Do you ever have any kind of? No, he had no conflict with the drivers. Just got it.

What we're done with, this is funny sale here. In Tadalega. Him and Hoss. Elington. Haleington. Hades. Yeah. Hals El Mow Lingly.

Yeah. Elmo Lingly. So they get, to go, Mom's driving out. To go out of a horse at the bottle of Rangue. Thank you. No. So, Mama and Daddy. And Hawson was some old Jeep joint.

Well, Mom didn't drink. So they got ready to go. Mom, he, Haas made Mama drives. She's trying to get the car started. When she's going to see her how the power button was on everything. Well, the cops center. They come over in, Haas and Dad sent in the back seat.

And they kind of roughed up getting snatched out of the car. But Daddy bail out of them with her ass. What? Yeah, four-file cops here, right. That can't end well. So they got to put me in jail, Haas and Daddy in jail. Haas.

He said, sir, you're going to have to step out at car, and he said, you're going to jail? He said, that's a boss brand. You're like Connell. I'm going to drive it home. He said, no, he ain't put a horse in jail, too. So, damn. So he said, a horse who woke up in sleeping there in jail cell.

Hoss heard something beating. She looked over in dead head, a shoe beating on a Cokeola can. So if only horse will make a key, you going to get out of here. He said, I ain't, you saw them dogs that they ain't going out of here. He's trying to break out? Yeah. Yeah. He's trying to break out.

That's funny. Golly. Wild times. Man, they ran hard back then, Dale. Tell you what, that's a different breed right there. Yeah. Oh, horse, I loved him. They drove one.

They'll form ten races. You did. And the bull's eye. Boards out of money. Barbecue number one. So you ran out of money to run a Cup series. You have your dad's cars. You're downsized one for a 1981 season.

you end up going back to Nashville, right? Right. And committed yourself to racing at home. Yeah, I won a championship. You won the championship. Three years in a row, yeah. At fairground. Who were you racing against?

Buddy Brown, Bush. Yeah. So did, that was right, I guess dad was kind of moving out of the, dad used to go to the fairgrounds every once in a while back in the 70s. 76 77. Darrell tells the story about dad going there with Darrell's car. Daryl couldn't go and run. And so Daryl sent dad to run the fairgrounds in the sports and race

with Daryl's orange and white 17. Yeah. And daddy run over everybody and they called Daryl and told Daryl never to let dad take his car down to fair round. Yeah. You got ran over two? Yeah. I guess dad was pretty wild.

He's hungry. Hungry. Is that right? Yeah. everybody was hungry back in. That's right. You got to want to do it. Yeah.

So, you win the track championship three years in a row. And how do you get yourself back into the cup series? Earl Sadler. Who? Earl Sadler. Yeah.

He's had a car number 95 around forever. Everybody drove for him. Davy, all kinds of people. Jim Mayfield. Yep. Much of them. See, he bought two cars. And he is, is he from around Nashville?

Yeah, he's from Nashville. He's from Nashville. I want to be a trucking company. Okay. And so he wants to help you out. Yeah. About 10 races with him. Yeah.

I'm spots to, but didn't have any money. He had to run, 84, had the, Roger Hamby let me drive his car, about three or four races. Roger Hamby had that 17 car. A lot of different guys would end up driving his car, Phil Parsons. You know, he was, he was a guy that was, his car was dependable. would it run it run all right? Yeah. He said, he called me, said, look, I want you driving a car next year.

I said, I'd be glad to get off his farm. Yeah. It's killing me. So, I pay 20% of winnings. That's pretty good. I got into the year ago, I think I had $4,7,000. Man, I love this shit. Yeah.

And we're at the backer, no more. Yeah. Yeah. And then Hawks called in 80, 85. I went to Daytona. It ain't mean I, but run, running, it was good. But the pole was 40, I think outside pole was a 44-02, I run a 4403.

Yeah. And I lost outside pole. But that's when we went to the Utah, went down there again, and went to the ice house, got the dry ice. And it called you. What were you doing with the dry ice? putting on the intake or something? Yeah, on the fuel line.

Putting it on the fuel line. Yeah. Just funny old fish will pop that little devout, the door you look in there. He looks in there and you see him going. He touched it down on dry ice. I bet. So why would you want to put dry ice on the fuel line for people listening?

I said about 20, right. It said about 20 horsepower. Damn. That's a lot. Having that fuel, that cold. Yeah. It's cold. Damn, that's nice.

So what happens when they catch you with dry? Like the Make it qualified the next day They made you qualify The next day Yeah just re-qualified I remember back in the day

Them buying bags of ice And dumping it all over the intake and stuff Right Yeah it would be a bunch of ice Yeah Before we had ice You know machines that were like cooling down The water tent mic

Yeah They would have you know You wanted to get that air And that fuel And that mixture Going through the intake As cold as possible So you wanted the intake

To be as cold as you could get it Right So they were dumping You know the garage with people just dumping ice all over. On top of the motor, it was a crazy thing to think about now, but back then it seemed so normal.

You're getting back in the cup garage running a couple races for this guy, a couple races for that guy. What was the first full-time ride? You're running part-time with Bailey and Hoss Ellington and I think the 44 team? 4-14. Yeah.

So when you got the ride with the 44th, that was in 1987. You know, in 1984, you're driving for Hamby and the deal fell apart. You finished the year with the Sadler Brothers. You ran for Jimmy Means and Bihari Racing. You were kind of bouncing around in 85 and 86. Helen Ray drove for her a couple races. I called her.

She had a little car. Good car. I called. I said, Ms. Ray, can I drive your cars for you in Charlotte? She said, honey, I got about to work on you. If you work on, put a motor in you, you can have it. Yeah. Everybody qualified to seven, eight.

So Helen Ray, Dave Marcus ran for her for a year or two, that orange and white car. I think Ray Everingham has one of those cars over at his shop, restored. In 87, Billy Hagan calls you. This is the team that won a championship in 1984 that you're getting a call from. Yeah. You've been working, bouncing around, grinding, trying to put deals together, and now you're getting a call from a team like that. They were kind of, you know, in a transition.

Terry's leaving, going to drive for, I think, at that point. He had already, yeah, he'd going to drive for junior. Yeah. And you are going to jump in this 44. It's a great race car. Yeah. So you're far removed from the farm. You're not at the farm anymore.

You're kind of making money and making a living. But now you've got a full-time ride. Which all is going. Yeah. You had a great top five finish at Charlotte in the fall. 11th and points. Yeah. We got Jake Hilda, about Southern Fire and Hunter.

Jake Heldon worked for everybody. I love him, I love him Jake. But he didn't stick around. They called him a suitcase, Jake. Did he leave you two? He had a business card, yeah. Yeah, on his business card? He took pride in the fact that he was going to leave you about halfway through the year.

He had that on, he'd have it on his business card. Like, hey, man, here, I'm going to come work, but don't expect me to stick around. Don't buy a uniform for me. Yeah, don't buy a uniform. That's what he'd say. I would think it'd make him hard to hire, but he must have been that good. He was that good. He made you fast.

We're not four with first race out with it. Yeah. What would he do to a car that you think? He knew how to set up the front hand and all that such. He gets me a car. I made a little change in the same. It's going to be race morning. He said, I made a change in a little car.

It's going to be good. It'll be good. He'd hold you by a car on you. Race in the form. And might take it easy at first lap, then I think it'd be okay. But what was he changing? Spring, shops, way more. Yeah.

He was just good. Yeah. So I want to, I want you to talk about being able to, you know, find the security of a full-time ride. You've, like, you've been trying your whole life to get this opportunity and now you're, you know, you got to deal with Hagan and you're on your way. You ain't got to worry about, you maybe you deal, maybe you do got to worry about it. But, I mean, it seems like that you'd have some security and comfort knowing that you got a good, nice deal here. three years of contract, you know. Yeah. Did you feel good about it?

Yeah, good. I think he paid me. A hundred thousand dollars, a hundred twenty thousand dollars a salary. Yeah? Man, look there. One hundred twenty. That's better than the tobacco farm. Oh, yeah.

Yeah. Did you feel secure? Did you feel secure for the first time or have you ever felt? Do you, do you drivers, I wonder even when you get your big, you know, your multi-year deals, do you ever feel like you're stable or does it all still feel cut throat? Probably a little cutthroat, but. You just have to. know who you're dealing with

what was hagan like he was he was going through divorce at the time and he wasn't around much oh and he's really hurt for money so you drove for you drove for them in 87 88 and

89 they changed the number to 94 and sonoga comes on board in 1989 but let's talk about getting wrecked at bristol by daddy leading the race dad I'll be the first to admit

dad would run flat run over people and uh you know sometimes he would beat and bang and get annoyed sometimes i thought the guy deserved it but sometimes he'd just drive straight through you and and there was like you know you couldn't argue you couldn't argue some of the things that happened he gets underneath you and y'all are going around a lap car i think it was buddy errington somebody and uh and he didn't back out so you're going down in the corner and he's got his nose in there in the middle between you in that lap car and clipped you in the left rear takes the front off your car going by you're leading the race yeah you know having a great run and uh how does that how does that go you know

you got to be pretty damn pissed off right teams pissed off yeah he's pissed off running running good a bit of 15th right you're leading the race so do you have a conversation or does dad i can't remember you can't remember y'all never uh never talked about it No. Yeah. What car in a year was this? This was probably either 86 or 87. Okay.

So with the 80s, I'm sorry, 87 or 88. Yeah. He's driving that, it was the Piedmont car steel. It wasn't Snoko yet. Okay. I just was always curious about that because, you know, typically, Dad would see you the next week and put his arm around and go, hey, he didn't mean to do that. It's like, how do you let this guy, you know, he had this way about him where you, you, you were like, all right.

I mean, I'm still pissed off, but, you know. He was 10 years old than me. He was 10. I mean, I learned him, but he could, I learned him. He said an old seat. Yeah. Made all that's where he made my Camaro. It's the top of your head.

Yeah. And I thought it was a little cold. I sit real low in the car. Yeah. And I fixed my, I fixed my car like it down low. Yeah. So the age difference, you, him being 10 years older, you kind of. I met him when I was farm

looked at hands and chickens Dad's farm Yeah Deer and everything else Known a man can Yeah he'd take you around He'd take you around He'd all take it

Yeah the only time we'd come in from Nashville We'd race in Nashville And I flew back with him I forgot my ride I was, got to make the other airport Hey let's take it Van home with you I said you sure

Yeah Hell just keep it long as you want I don't need it Talked the world of Yeah Were y'all that tight back in the 80s though I think he's I don't know

Yeah I mean because I guess you all were You said you all were racing each other At Nashville back in the 70s I guess I just was assuming That y'all weren't really developing a relationship Or a friendship or anything But maybe I'm wrong

Did you guys start becoming friends that early? I've been friends with them all the time really Wow Yeah okay Okay But he wrecks you That's got a test of friendship Sterling

It's got to right I mean, you're leading the race at Bristol. It's got to test a little bit. You get to temper up a little bit. Yeah. I mean, you say things. You didn't want to go cuckoo on him? Yeah, it was.

It worked itself out. It works itself out. So speaking to that, so, like, who, and who are the drivers that were friends of yours? Like, when you talk, when, like, I would say, like, you know, Martin Trix Jr. Elliott Sadler, I had buddies, you know, McMurray. Who were your buddies? Shrader, Michael. Yeah.

That was a hell of a crowd That's a crew I can't imagine y'all three together causing any problems No, no, no, talk What happens to the Hagan deal? You get the Sonoco sponsorship, change the number to 94,

the team gets sold to some guy A king comes and buys a team Then what happens? Junior Johnson's going to hire you for the second car Yes, I'm at Microsoft's car Number 22 Yeah, at this point of you like,

Hell yeah, Junior Johnson One of the best damn deals around What I thought. Yeah. And so the one thing I remember about Junior Johnson and you driving that 22 is the fireball at Bristol. Oh, yeah. So they're racing at Bristol. It's a damn badass race.

Now, maybe not for him and all the guys on the racetrack. This was when it was asphalt. Every damn body's getting her shit tore up, left and right. Every damn calling the tracks. But that is stupid. Huh? Pit road thing, remember? That pit road thing, you used to odd even.

Yeah. You work like hell fifty last. past body to get back in front of it. Oh yeah, just on pit road. It was a damn wild-ass race. I remember sitting on top of a comfort coach van in the corner watching you. And you backed it in the wall. Yeah.

They come down on pit road and they need to get in the back of the car is mashed down to the ground. They need to get the damn spoiler back up at a reasonable height so he goes out there and drives it. He's like, I can't drive some with a spoiler on the ground. So they put jack stands on top of the fuel cell rack. and the jackstands hold the deckle-lad. So he goes back on the track, and he's making laps. Run third, you're back to third.

Did you? With the damn jackstands riding in the back. Yeah. Got turned around or what happened? How did you get spun out? I don't go back some hell off, saw smoke off, cut it up here a tire down. So you backed it into the wall again. Those jackstands go through the fuel cell, Mike.

Yeah. As it would when it's sitting on top of the fuel. In the pictures of this crash, you can see one of the fuel cell or one of the jack stands bouncing down the racetrack in the ball of fire. I mean, this thing was a ball of fire. Oh, yeah. It was hot. Back then, you had fuel cells back then.

That's a fuel cell, but you had oil. Oil, too. Oil tank. And that ruptured as well? It rushed out. The oil got the gas, got the oil fire started. Damn. Boy, that's combustible.

Yeah, you had a lot going on. Chocolate Myers runs over there, helps you get out. Pull the glove of us, meat come off of the... What? Meat. Really? You got burnt up pretty bad. Pretty good.

Yeah. Just your hand or... Legs? Damn. Because the car backs into the wall, then comes down to track backwards. So the fire's... He's backing into the fire. Back one in the damn, crust panels.

Wow. Fun of the fire on me. burns a damn bad. It was hot. So I've been inside a car that's been on fire, and I can't express to people how fucking hot fire is. It is like a million bees stinging you all at once. It's a snowmunk.

Yeah. It is a worst experience. And those burns take forever, forever to heal. I was sitting in the car at Bristol. The weekend that we swept Bristol. I remember. I was thinking about this as you were talking. So I had a big old scab on top of my thigh, and it was a big sore,

but it had grown almost shut, right? It healed itself almost shut, but it was still about, I don't know, four by four big scab on top of my thigh. And I'm in the car practicing, and one of my crew guys comes over to help me tighten my seatbelt, and his hand slipped, and he punched me in the thigh right there, and it busted that, like, it just busted. it and it's just like you've got to start all over that whole scab I has to regrow right and those things will take forever to heal so I can't imagine what you dealt with so you

burnt a lot of your a lot of skin on your hand how did you race just just want to race yeah you just I'm running next week and you wrapped it up Wiltsboro wrap it up and go and I just run one lap just keep points oh I got you and then come back from Martinville next week I'm good and then Well, Tyler Lankan run fourth. Yeah. So driving for junior, what was that like? What was Junior Johnson like?

Well, he's going to a divorce same time. Damn. Heavy Flossy were splitting up. Yeah. And it's kind of disappointed. I mean, Beaver's hands kind of tired on a lot of things. She was, yeah, she was pretty woven into his racing organization, right? Yeah.

Like, she had more control than I think you'd imagine when it came down. to it. She wasn't going to turn around and just walk away. And so, yeah, she made things a little challenging. Yeah. Yeah. And then 92, 92 went to Daytona, Tone, Tull in P. Yeah. And had to be a wreck on back straight away. I was in it. Is that 1992 in the Maxwell House?

Yeah, is that the car that, so Brad Means, told me Brad is Jimmy's son that after qualifying so who sat on the pole with you? Your teammate and both of those cars went in the hauler and they closed the doors and changed the damn

trailing arms. In the cars in the hauler, it's like impossible tight as hell but you had to because what they had was illegal when it's signals business coming. Yeah knocking on the toes clanging shit. Yeah oh my gosh. So y'all

I was standing watch. Yeah. Yeah. You take off to qualify? I had a valve turn right here. Oh. Yeah, it's sit down. Sit down.

Junior was not scared to break a rule. And Darrell talks about, you know, the lead shot and the frame rail, pulling out all over the racetrack and all that driving his cars back in the day. after driving for junior you wanted to leave or did you all just kind of

that deal just kind of split you end up going to drive eight car for Stavola brothers yeah she won about four five races of junior right finished 19 times yeah

and so 19 times my gosh and so what are you thinking about this eight car for Stavola brothers right they're all that ass they were they should have won about two races she was one polka she'll want New Hampshire Wilkesburg and they're home to beat yeah she got four she had this july four he's holding it down thing wide up so you ran there for one year with de Vola yeah um they that team was like the you know bobby and bobby

Hill and Bobby Allison drove for them back in the 80s with the Miller car. But at this point, the 22 is gone, and it's just the eight that Bobby Hillen had originally drove, and Jeff Burton would drive for them. That's right. Ray Bessis and all that. You end up getting hired by Morgan McClure in 1994. I mean, this is pretty much, I think what a lot of people would remember about your career is driving that car to two Daytona 500 wins.

And they were a, they were a relatively new team still at the time. They'd been around with Rick Wilson for a while. Phil Parsons drove the car a couple races. But I think when you, you know, and I think people when Rick Wilson was driving the car, people could see how fast that car could be. There was a lot of times when Rick had some great opportunities to win races, especially at Daytona and so forth. You get in the car in 94.

and right away, I mean, they're another innovative team. They had the ex-pipes, what, the Dr. Gas, which had a different sound than anybody else, and created some additional power and so forth. At least people assume that that sound and that ex-pipe and that exhaust would give you some more speed. You go out there and you went a couple Daytona 500s with that car. Your first race, like you say, you've run second so many times. You came so close. And now you're, you know, you're with a team.

They seem to be a great fit for you. It was. Tony Glover. He'd been pretty long time. Yeah. Larry's great. All the brothers on the phone, on the car. Yep.

Had a good time with it. They seem like they had the same sort of approach mentality, attitude, personality that you have. Yeah. And that y'all worked really well together. Yeah. When you go to Daytona and you drive that car in practice I mean I know you've been to Daytona

You've had fast cars before but what's fit What about this car is different? 94 the cars are aluminum Yep And it's a pretty quick car This year to come out there's a lot of money car Yep And that thing would fly

So when you Talk about the XPites You know is that a big deal as people make it today? about two horse power. Just two horse power. Yeah, two horse power. But, you know, and it's, was it cool? I mean, was it fun to, fun to mess with people because people would hear it and go,

wow, they're making, and that, you know, is it another deal where it's a bit of a distraction from other things y'all can do? Because, like, I always felt like if I'm going to try to pull some shit off, I'm going to make something super obvious that I don't mind them catching. Because the guy that, you know, the tech guy going through. tech and he goes, oh, dude, I see this. Take, you got to fix this

right here. You got it, man, no problem. We're going to fix that. Sorry, we're trying to get, you know, trying to look, trying to be fast, but they ain't looking at the other shit that you really want, that you want to keep. You know, is that kind of what the sound and all, you know, even though those pipes were making just a couple horsepower, the distraction that it made

through the garage of everybody going, oh, what the hell they got in there. They got to see, we got to see what those pipes look like. Oh, man, everybody's talking about that they're not talking about anything else Steve Chris said Steve, Steve, Chris. He started to hang up and everybody started saying up and everybody's what the hell is that? Yeah.

So what was the other stuff then? What other tricks did that car have? I didn't push nothing. Flipped nothing. He didn't have no valves to push and buttons the push. He just threw it wrong. Yeah. So I mean, let's talk about winning your first race.

You actually won back-to-back Daytona-Farhundreds, 90. 95. Yeah, 94-95. What was it like to finally win? I mean, you win your first race, and it's the biggest race of the year. You know, what was this feeling like? Yeah. I mean, you're in your 30s at this point.

You're doing this a long time. Long time. Run second a lot. You finally get to stand there in Victor Lane, the biggest day of this, you know, biggest race of the year. What was that feeling like? Great. Yeah. I mean, just finally going to turn forward.

It was close on gas. Yeah. Or he was behind me. I said, please don't ride the gas. Flat tire or something, you know, just thought. Fandicoe sent a check a flag. It's all, man. Yeah, we got it.

Yeah. And so you go back in 95 to win it again. I mean, you had a great year in 94. some good runs and all, but you go to 95 and get two Daytona 500s back to back. Now you're not, you know, because like anyone else, you know, you win one, that's, you know, it's Daytona, the draft, you know, the car, this and that another, but now you got two, you know, now you, now you've, you kind of really made a claim that it's, uh, that it legitimizes the first one, if you will.

Yeah. What kind of pay date did it have? 356,000. Remembers that? Both. I mean, like to the dime. I mean, The first one, or together?

The mine, that's the first win. $356,000? What about the second one? You know, it's about $4.20,000. $420,000? $2,000. Oh, I got you. 20,000 winners first.

That's a life changer right there. Yeah. I mean, this has to be the first, I mean, this is your first win. So this, what does this do to you financially? What's the first thing you go by? Tractor, house? I built house You built the house?

Where'd you build it? Did you always stay in Nashville? You always did it? Yeah. Same farm. Same farm. You still on that same piece of property? Yeah.

All 600 acres? Yeah. Really? Damn. Still there. Yeah. You'd think it'd be parted out a little bit. There's an upgrade on the farm somewhere when you win a Daytona 500 dollar.

Then you're damn sure going to upgrade somewhere when you went to. Bulldozer. There we go. That's what we're looking for. Your house got that bulldozer. You went and bought a little bit of it. You haven't bought a toy is what you did. You won two more races than 95.

You won another race at Talladega, but Darlington. I mean, Darlington is the hardest race track on the circuit. That is a, it's all driver. You know, if there is a track where driver matters more than car, Darlington will be on that list, maybe at the top of that list. I'd never won at Darlington. Never won an Exfinity Race or a Cup race there. It came close.

but when you're trying to prove everybody in that industry and yourself that you've got what it takes. Yeah, to win somewhere else. And you win there. You've done it. What was that like? It's neat. I said, I always love darn.

Yeah. And the driver's track. And they paid it. It just paid the track. You're 95 when I won't. It paid the track. Make it mess it up or make it better? More grip.

More grip. Hold ass. Everybody hates Darlington. You're the only one I know that love Darlington. I mean, everybody loves Darlington from a historical standpoint, but I didn't know many drivers that love it this much. You finished third in points that year. Damn, that's pretty close.

Yeah. In 96, 97, you won Talladega in 96. You won the Firecracker at Daytona. And then you left the team after 1997. You go to Sabco to drive for them. I mean, they're starting up getting the Sabco thing look pretty and shiny. you're like lured over to this neat thing. Why did you leave this four car that seemed to be such a great fit and go to Sabco?

Felix had a lot of money. Felix had a lot of money. So you got a good paycheck. Couldn't a little one over there. You took Glover with you. Yeah. Yep. Oh, that's right.

So you basically felt like you were moving, not only you, but you were moving performance and everything that was working at the floor. You were coming over, you were taking all this with you. And so that gave you the confidence to make that change. Yeah. When did you break your neck? What year was that? 2002.

Oh, two. So in 2002, you are leading the points. Mm-hmm. It's about, I don't know, 10 races left in the season? It ain't long. I've been fascinated by this year where you break your neck. You're leading the points. You're in this perfect position to win the championship.

ship and you had to stop. How bad was your, how bad, I mean, how bad was the break? What was the doctor's telling you? You've got a broke third vertebrae. And if you race and crash, you're going to have. Be paranoid. Yeah, that's why they made you get. Yeah.

They told you if you got, you had a chance, if you got hurt, you got another wreck, you were going to have some serious problems. I don't remember how you injured it. How did you break your neck? Was it a wreck? Yeah. Richmond. I think really, right there, somebody clipped me on the start race. She was across three or four, me hit the wall head on.

It made it hurt. That it did. So, Congress about threw it, spoiled. And if I burnt, it hooked me to left for you, turn my head on again. Yeah. You took two big hits right there. Everybody thought that the Kansas hit was the one where the injury happened, but you think it might have started from Richmond. I mean, I hit risk.

I hit risk. He just head on. And so you go. and so basically you had to vacate your title run. You would have definitely been in the mix if not winning the championship. What it did do was, you know, jumpstart to career of Jamie McMurray, who feels in for you and in his second attempt at Charlotte in his second race, I guess he wins the race.

Which I would assume was hard. I know how you guys, you guys don't like other people. driving your race car, do you? They made you calling in Victory Lane. Do I remember this race? Yeah. Come a car in one race, but... Listen, if you said that you had a problem with that,

nobody would think any lesser of you. I mean, like, but who asked you to do that? Chip? Chip. He didn't ask me, told me. Chip told you. To call him? To call Jamie McMurray in Victory Lane.

Did he tell you, God, it had to been spur of the moment. there's no way anybody thought Jamie McMurray was going to win that race. Where were you at home in Nashville? Did you watch the race? Yeah. You get the phone call? Yeah. And did you want to do that?

Or were you really cool with that? You didn't care. Yeah. I don't think it was that big of it. I don't see that as a big deal. I mean, the car was so damn good. I don't think anybody's shocked that it wins. I think no driver wants to see somebody getting their car and run good.

I think we all want them to run a little slower. Same car run. You won a race here before. Okay, so maybe they knew it was a rocket ship. Nobody really knew that McMurray could go out and win that race. I mean, he's leading the championship with the whole deal. Yeah, I remember 2002. You won a ton of races that year.

You won Darlington that spring. I remember that. That was the first year of the chip Felix partnership, wasn't it? Oh, I think. I mean, I know he was driving for Felix, but I'm saying is that, Or maybe it was it. I remember that was... O-1 is when Chip comes on board.

I got it. Okay. So, but that, yeah, the O-2 is when you were driving the silver bullet, and then Jimmy was the first year in that Target 41 car. Y'all are teammates in O2 short-lived, but that was that year. Yeah, you were on a rail. You should have won that championship. I'm going to take a break.

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breaking your neck. And I mean, honestly, I know that that probably, I don't know how much that bothers you today, but I think you made the right decision. I mean, if you, you know, if you don't, you know, if you get out there and you get in another crash, who knows what would have happened to you. But, you know, Felix, Felix call me. and he said, Sturdy, what are you doing right now?

It's a bush hog and finish. Get off and tracts immediately. He has a broken neck. So with a broken neck, you can't race the car, but you're dang sure you're going to bush hog. Yeah. You were working the farm. I didn't know how to have a broken neck.

Yeah. And he'd hurt. You didn't know, you just knew it hurt. Hurt, yeah. I got you. You went on to to race with MB2 Motorsports. You drove that number 14.

car, um, end up making a couple starts, uh, in 2008. How do you decide, I think,

you know, that it's time for you to stop racing in the Cups series? Like, what's, what's that process like for a driver? I was a little sort part for James. Yep. He's kind of embarrassing.

James Fentz? Yeah. But his cars weren't terrible. No, it wouldn't matter. It was real quick margin. But I just, I just,

sent admission one time, toward the interview career and it's the race started five or something five six o'clock I went ahead of my doing here no just pull out and this man he could go to race I won't raise at 12 o'clock one o'clock yeah you don't like to start time as late either I mean either um I come home you know bulldooms when they started 12 o'clock be home three or four yeah that was nice when they'd start to raise it at noon one o'clock you'd be home they'd like you'd get home from the racing, day damp, it's still daylight outside.

Oh, yeah. So you just kind of, it just ran its course. It wasn't a hard thing for you when you walked away. Yeah. And you end up going and running, you know, late models over at the fairgrounds. Yeah.

Still piddling and racing over the last decade and a half, two decades. Yeah. You know, how much, why did you want to go run a old short track car at the fairgrounds? You didn't have any pressure, you know, Just for fun.

All the most used to do for fun. Like when you started. So, like, I go back and run the late model car for the same reason. There ain't no pressure, no expectation. I miss it. When I tried to do it, when I was doing it back in the 90s when I was getting my start for you back in the 70s, I didn't enjoy it as much as I should have because I had too much pressure. I was trying my ass off to make it.

And then when I got there, I thought, damn, I wish I would have enjoyed that late model racing more. And so now I go back to do it because I can do it without pressure. Yeah. You had success. You won races. I mean, as recently as the last couple years ago, you won a race over there. One last, one last race ever run. Did you?

When? I think August 80, I mean, 2008, 2008, something like that. All right. I mean, there's some YouTube videos of in-car camera. Are you out there riding around running that little pro-late model? Where did you run your late model out of? Your old farm. Farm.

Farm shop? Is Stadman your son messing with any of that? What was his driving career all about? Sure. Yeah. But he tried to make it. He didn't try. Yeah.

I think I wish he now it would have. But he just put a hundred percent effort at it. Where is he now? He's working on the farm. Oh, he is? What's his deal? He's married now, got a family. A couple of kids.

Yep. I hadn't heard from him in a while. I used to see him there once in a while. Huh? He was old for you all in Vegas somewhere. Yeah, we ran hard a couple times, Daytona, here and there. He was fun. He's just, I mean, the apple doesn't far too far from the trees.

Pretty much like a smaller version of Sterling. Yeah, Sterling, different version of Sterling. But let's talk about Parkinson's. When did you recognize that you might have something going on? I got to bed in the mornings, and I tripped, trip in the house. And I said, what did I wrong, man? I couldn't hook my seatbelt on my helmet. What year?

That was like 2012, I think. Okay. And it's weird, you know, just, you know, just, you can't really talk right at times. Yeah. But at least six, still six feet above. Yeah. But all this came on, like, very subtle. Yeah.

And did you go to the doctor right away? Yeah, probably. Probably what you know with me. Yeah. But yeah. And then they know exactly what was wrong? Yeah, pretty much. And so I've kind of tried to, I've tried to kind of keep tabs on what's going on with you.

And you've had various, you've had some, it's, I'm assuming this. I don't know for sure, so I'm asking. But you've had, you've had some. things that have helped you. Like they've been able to do things that have sort of made this a better shot somewhat, yeah, somewhat tolerable, I guess.

I know at times you've really struggled with it, but there's been, you know, you've, you've been pretty aggressive in treatment in trying to find different things that might, you know, give you some control. Is that true? True. Yeah.

And so what are, What are some of the things that are helping you now? Several different pills you can take. Yeah. And so you kind of went through the gamut. They all help. They all do. Most of them.

Yeah. A couple of you keep messing with. So make a shake some more. Yeah. I can pour you. Yeah. Pour you drink. Yeah.

You can pour a drink anytime you want to. Yeah. Yeah. But you work hard at it. Yeah. Yep. And you've made a, you know, you know, I guess, I don't know what, I don't know exactly what I'm trying to get at,

but I think I want to, I want to acknowledge what effort you've put in to try to, to live with this, right? I want, because I think you've worked really hard to, to try to, you know, try to have some control over this and try to be able to live a reason,

you know, be able to do whatever it is you want to do. Like you continue to race your pro late model and you've worked hard to be able to do that. You still work on your farm and have, you know, things that you still want to achieve so you've worked hard to try to you know manage this best you can yeah is it yeah how does that work i mean everybody would want to know i mean when you're you're battling parkinson's which is no small fight and then racing a car what are you

having to do to me able to manage both of those at the same time well i had the surgery what kind of surgery at dbs the dv yes right which is that like a brainstem Yeah. And, uh, race, not two months later. You race two months after the surgery? Surgery.

So the brain stem really does wonders then. Is it, I mean, would you, that's a fair assessment? I'd get it done again. If I had to do it. You would do it again? Yeah.

So I told you, uh, when we were not taping that my dad has Parkinson's. Yeah. And this is a real, it's is our new real reality, right? And, um, I do know that,

of all the, I guess of all the different things that he's battling, one of the things is just emotional, like, depression because he just can't do things like he used to, right? And it drives him crazy. It really makes him depressed. Did you deal with that? Yeah. I mean, you get halfway through something.

All of a sudden you start tingling. Yeah. And you just got to quit from, I. Yeah. You come back, keep working. I would say, though, At the same time, you are, I don't even know if you realize this, but you know, you also give a lot of people hope.

My dad doesn't live far from where you guys are. And we see you out there racing and getting it done. And you're still working on the farm and breaking your ankle off the tractor and doing stuff. And it's like, I got to be honest with you. It's pretty uplifting. I don't know if it's uplifting for you. And I don't even know if it's uplifting to hear it.

But it's uplifting for people that are battling Parkinson's. And I don't know if you know that, but I want you to know that. because that's, I mean, you give a lot of reason for people to keep up the fight. And it is a fight. It's a fight every day. Every day. Yeah. Yeah.

You once said, I believe, that when you would get in your pro late model and race was a time, one time when you would feel regular, normal. Yeah. Behind the wheel driving. Because it seemed like, you know, I guess that was the most in control of any moment you would ever be. Yeah. and so how often do you see specialist today? About six months? Every six months you go see somebody.

What is the typical, you know, what are they telling you about your, you know, your condition today? What are they telling you about what to expect moving forward? Well, see, parks won't key. The medicine. The medicine. You're too much medicine. and you know what's that but it's like going town so I drive the town I ain't no sure to get back

yeah yeah get one of them bits you know yeah had some side row that happened to my dad he would get lost is that right is that what you're saying no no I couldn't oh so that it wasn't that you just just physically couldn't drive it I got you my dad had gone through some stuff with the he just he his His brain was just playing tricks on him. And those were early symptoms, early symptoms,

where he's like, God, where am I? Well, you know, where am I going? You know, and then he would get it back. But you're saying just physically it was hard. So physically it's hard to drive to town. How do you drive the race car? It's like your race car is married. Just makes sense?

It makes sense. It makes sense. Just, I drive the car. I think something in your system gets, adrenaline? Yep Got to want to do it Gotta want to do it

I gotcha Boy, one might say that race car is the best medicine you got About it Yeah So you're managing this You know You feel like you've got all the information

You need and you've got good knowledge About everything You know That you can do to To live your day and live your life people need to, you know, are we to have confidence that you, you know, we're going to see you around for a long time

and you got this under control. That's it. Yeah. And Sterling's just out there doing Sterling. That's pretty much it. That's it. I'm pretty sure when Sterling leaves this earth, it's going to be with the bulldozer.

It ain't going to be a race car. It'll be with the bulldozer and something, you know. And that's the way we all should want to go, by the way. I know. Big Tim had three bulldozers. One nut truck You got all these toys? Yeah

When do we get invited out to the farm? I want to ride bulldozer dump trucks These are what Daytona 500's bought Right here This is what these are I think

You know a lot of people Would want us to touch on the 2001 Daytona 500 You know You're You Obviously me and the Earnhardt family Shrader.

There's all kinds of people that are part of that story willingly or not, right? And I wanted to just share a quick story about that. We, I think, went to Rockingham the next weekend. I get...

I didn't want to go. Yeah, I didn't either. I didn't want to... It's funny, I didn't want to go to Rockingham, but I knew I damn sure didn't want to be anywhere else. That was like the one place... It was the place I, only place I really could go. But I didn't know, didn't want to be anywhere.

I don't remember if it was a, I don't think it was a phone call. I think me and you saw each other in person. Might have been as soon as we got to the track on Thursday. We had a press conference. And we were going to speak. And Sterling came up to me and said, hey, could you do me a favor? He's like, I'm getting literal death threats about this, about, you know, people thinking I had something to do with this.

And I was like, no, shit. And he's like, yeah, and it's bothering me. And I think you're the only one that could fix it. Remember that conversation? Sure do. And so I go on to the press conference and I said, you know, I said, I don't, you know, I couldn't believe I needed to, I had to say this at that moment. But I was like, you know, whoever got a problem with Sterling or think Sterling has

some role in this needs to get rid of that notion altogether. I was, you know, I have sort of felt, you know, some sympathy or something about that for you. You know, everybody that ever drove a race car, especially all the guys that were on the racetrack in that moment, know that we were all out there racing our ass off. It's the last lap of the race. We're all hauling ass and trying to get to where we're going, right? And that was a race, and that was a racing crash, and those happen every race. You know, and I know that maybe the majority of common sense folks out there watching it knew that that was a typical race and accident.

I don't know how much that bothered you that people would have any problem with, what went on right there I just hope that you've had I hope that you've carried no problems or or carried no no sliver of guilt or any kind of

any kind of thing going forward with that because I haven't I've always thought the world of you and felt we were all very unfortunate you know to in that moment various degrees of of unfortunate but

I told you trader I was like man I know you didn't want to be in that crash I know you didn't want to be the one to walk up to that car but I'm glad you were you know and and I was more than happy to assist you on that day in that press conference to quell any kind of I can't right there people it stopped like that good well I'm glad it made a difference I never did find out whether I was wondering did it help you're saying it helped yeah sure it yeah well I You know, I felt so unfortunate because none of us, none of us wanted to be a part of that, you know, that whole experience.

That was a horrible thing. But, and the whole sport had to go through it, you know. But I know people would want us to touch on that during this conversation today. You know, you, but I will say, man, I mean, after that and moving forward, knowing you and getting to know you and the person you are and the way you look at racing, I've really enjoyed it. I really have. I don't think I knew you too well before I started racing in the Cup Series.

But from 2000, when I started, all the way through pretty much when you retired, and the last time we saw each other, you were always. easy to talk to. I'd see you, if I saw you and we were within five or ten foot each other in the garage, we always said, hey, you would always go, what are you doing? What's you doing? What's you got to go on? You were friendly.

You were a guy that I think a lot of people in the garage called a friend. You were a guy that I think a lot of people enjoyed talking to. You're always funny. had always a joke to tell or a funny story to share or something that had happened that weekend. You were in the middle of something all the time. Oh, I too.

Yeah, you were kind of the class clown, if you will, in the garage. You know, the guy always in the middle of something. Everybody knew there was going to be a story with Sterling. Of course, it was dynamite. I was just sitting here thinking about Talladega, you put dynamite under somebody's van. You sit a bunch of people to therapy that day. So let's let's talk about that.

this might be a good way to to wrap up the conversation. When you were driving for again, or at some point near the back end of your career, T.J. Majors is your spotter. My buddy T.J. He would become my spotter. T.J. and me were always doing some dumb bha. And he comes home one day with some dynamite. And he's like, I got dynamite in my hand. Let's blow some shit up. and I was like, well, where do you get dynamite from?

He's like, Sterling gave me this. I'm like, Sterling's just giving dynamite away. I remember. I got some time. Five, six inch stick. Yeah, yeah. I brought one home. My wife still brings that up.

The middle of time you brought dynamite home. Yes, Sterling. Sterling did it. Yeah, me and TJ put, there was this old wooden outhouse on the property, and me and TJ put that damn dynamite in there and blew that damn outhouse, all the pieces. But you, what was the story about you, you stuck it under a, rental car or somebody was uh in kentucky yeah it was tested and I'd blowed up to two to I shot them off twice that day it's all the all crewboys kind of new yeah you done

you done blew you done blew up two pieces two sticks out there in the yard and the boys was all shook up so uh they got 12 passenger van 12 passenger van that's right stick cut out got the power out of it put the end back in it so uh I said y'all hold on I got to take a leak out here. Got to take a leak. I told them all get the van. I thought that something went in there. They'd like killed his son to get.

They went out and hit on transmission. I killed him, skinned his hands all up. But it wasn't going to blow up because you put it to town. You took it apart out. Yeah. Who would think? No. I mean, that's quite genius.

He saved their lives, actually. Who would think that, you know what? I'm going to put that prank. I'm going to take this dynamite apart. I'm going to pour the damn powder out of it. put it back together, hopefully it's not going to... No, powder. Hopefully none of the, you know, I don't know.

I mean, a little bit of powder. How much powder is too much? I don't know. Like a thimble of powder still in there might make some sort of explosion. You're crazy, man. Yeah, that's what we're trying to say. You always messing with people. You had, you were pulling pranks and shit like that.

What was the, the, the, the, the, freaking gasman or Henry Benfield. Oh, Henry Benfield versus Sterling Martin would be like the celebrity death match right there. So you, so you were kind of like Henry. Remember when Henry put the X-lax in the donuts or something? Yeah. For the, no, no, I know exactly what you're talking about. At Phoenix, he put him, put the donuts.

The gateworker. Some gateworker pissed him off. Well, because remember they used to cross over on the backstretch and then he would gone out and then they wouldn't let him until practice because practice was going to start soon. They wouldn't let him across so he went back, got the donuts. He just set him down. He just set him down. He didn't say here some donuts have a donut. He just set them down and those guys were like, hmm. That day he was so pissed off. He passed them things out with a smile.

Yeah. And it was, and none of them showed up the next day. He sent a whole wave of workers. He wanted them. Yeah. Yeah. Did you ever prank him? Nobody mess with Henry I don't know if anybody would do it He wanted to get pranked back He comes down to beach Ross Beach

And I didn't do it But so I put a fish in on his intake A truck They put what on his intake A dead fish And it cooked it Of course It's a lot of shit in it

Oh it's terrible Yeah My buddy then was Football players So he didn't get the wrong truck I had another truck He called He said he'd turn that damn

been a fellow kid. Yeah. My daughter was throwing up over two miles. Threw up. I know that dad got, dad or rusty, one of them put sardines under the damn seat and when a race car somewhere practicing

and they cooked them sardines under there. Henry actually, he about ended up marriage because he put women's panties into, you remember Shorty or Phil? Yeah, you remember Shorty? He put it in their suitcase and made him go home with it.

The wife found the panties in the suitcase. Man. That was planted by Henry Benfield. And he didn't feel bad about it. That reminds me, you had Underreuse as a sponsor on that 44 car. What was that like? Because I thought that was pretty difficult. Yeah.

Yeah. For a macho, masculine. What are those productions like? Cup driver with a ladies garment sponsor on the side of his car. It was. Yeah. I mean, you know. Martin comes along and has Viagra, so he kind of trumped you on that one.

I don't know. I think Viagra must be better. I think I had to choose between the two. I think I could make, I mean, if anybody can make Underruz fun, it would be Sterling. Sterling could do it? Yeah. Well, man, Sterling, it's been a lot of fun. I'm glad you came all this way to see us.

Good night to hear me. Yep. A lot of people are going to be glad. You've been highly requested to come on the show. See, yeah. And it's great to see you. Appreciate you bringing all you folks to join us today and sit in on the conversation. You had a, you had a really, 65 years old.

65 years old. You had a really, really interesting life. I'm going to write a book? Yeah, you should. You need to write that book. Yeah. You need to write it. I certainly read it.

How you became, you know, how you come off the farm with your dad, went to the racetrack as a mechanic and a tire changer, made your way into the seat of the car, how you worked multiple years to put together something that would get you into a cup car full-time. I mean, the effort and the determination, I would say. A lot of people might have turned and gave up after a while, but you made it work,

and then you spent years before you finally saw the success that you dreamed about your whole life and got to go to Victor Lane winning races. the biggest races in our sport. And then, you know, you retired, went back, race short tracks, and now you're here with us today. So thank you so much. We appreciate you.

We got an ally here in Sterling Marlin. That'll do it, Sterling Marlin on the Dale Jr. Download. Man, I'm really excited to have Ally help us bring the guest segment every week. It's one of my favorite parts of the download. We get to talk to so many different people in racing, outside of racing. but everybody that comes in here, I want them to have had a good time. I want them to want them to want to come back. I want them to feel like an ally to Dirty Mo Media.

Thank you, Ally, for your continued support of the download and the entire Dirty Mo Media team. There is a new episode of Actions Detrimental with Denny Hamlin available now. Go to your favorite podcast platform to check it out. And while you're there, don't forget, follow and subscribe, so you never miss an episode. Check out Dirtymoe Media. Twitter, Facebook, TikTok, and Instagram.