The Dale Jr. Download - Bonus: Next Level w/ Ken Squier - Chapter 7: Legacy

Episode Date: January 27, 2023

At the heart of every legendary broadcasting voice lies one indescribable characteristic that sets them apart from others. It’s a quality that can’t be faked or fabricated in any way and lives deep in their own soul.It’s passion.For decades, Ken Squier did what he loved, no question about it. In the final installment of our Next Level conversation with Ken Squier, host Andrew Kurland and Squier discuss the legacy he has left behind on the sport. Squier shares what it means to be in the NASCAR Hall of Fame, gives his thoughts on NASCAR today and reveals which popular 1970s movie he thought was a terrible idea. Squier closes the interview by providing Kurland with advice on how to pursue a career in motorsports broadcasting and shares what the state of Vermont means to him. Squier told the stories of heroes that were daring enough to jump in a race car and battle it out at high speeds. However, a story is only as good as the storyteller, and we were lucky to hear a few from one of the best. Check out Dirty Mo Media on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@DirtyMoMedia  Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

What's going on, Download fans? This is Alex Timms. We are extremely excited for 2020. We have a lot of great guests lined up for this year, some new segment ideas, and a lot of other cool things I think you guys are going to really enjoy. And speaking of new things, a brand new episode of Next Level with Andrew Curland is out now. Make sure you go over to the Next Level podcast and hit subscribe so you never miss another episode. But now, without further ado, here's the brand new episode of Andrew Curland. Erland's next level conversation with Ken Squire. This is a production of Dirtymo Media. And now to the man who brought CBS Sports on the air with the first live flag-to-flag coverage of NASCAR racing back in 1979.

Ken Squire. And so we finished the first race to the new millennium. The biggest question throughout speed weeks to me has not been who was going to win this race or what car was going to end up in victory lane. but did you ever think this race would be this big? And my answer is, of course it would. In 1965, when this snowbird first flew south to Daytona, Bill France Senior, organizer of NASCAR, the builder of this beautiful racing facility told us, told me, come the year 2000, this sport will be major league right up there with baseball and football.

France Sr. sure hit it right on the nose. a bead on the checkered flag as he storms out of turn number four and over 190 miles per hour. For everyone here at CBS, who for 22 years have brought you this American racing classic, brought it into your homes with a sense of dignity and dedication, love and respect, thank you for being part of it. After all, it is the great American race. I have this wallop-a-loosia of the finish, right? And then the principles in the story come back on stage

for one more round and every one of them had a champion and the film they were there they were theirs they knew what they had to get done and if they didn't win to hell with it

and he presented them so that people that didn't give a fig about them would go to the race and think they saw something's And they did. Never got much publicity. We're talking about like an actual bear, right? Beer, a real beer.

Where'd he get it? Who'd you get to see you the bear from? Bees a bad of me. Common man doing uncommon deeds. They wouldn't be denied. At the heart of every legendary broadcasting voice lies one indescribable characteristic that sets them apart from others.

It's a quality that can be faked or fabricated in any way and lives deep in their own soul. Passion. For decades, Ken Squire did what he loved. No question about it. Not even Ken Squire knows what his legacy is, but today we'll attempt to narrow it down. Hell everybody, Andrew Curland here with the final installment of our next level conversation with Ken Squire.

being able to listen back to all of these episodes again. I was able to relive this conversation. I truly, I think I'm starting to understand how special it was to get this much time with Ken Squire to get to pick his brain, to get to hear some of the stories we got to hear, and we're not done yet. We've got one more episode left that you are about to hear. and we will be talking Ken's legacy. I ask him, what do you think your legacy is? And I'll give my thoughts on that.

Afterwards, I want you to hear the answer. Hear great stories from Dave Moody, David Hobbs. David Hobbs, who in particular, there's a story, and he's told it before in the download, but he tells it again. He kind of throws Ken under the bus a little bit, but, you know, in a fun way, obviously. We'll get his thoughts on NASCAR today. Does he still watch? What does he think of these young, new drivers making names for themselves?

We wrap the interview up by him giving me advice on how to pursue a career in NASCAR broadcast. I mean, obviously, I'm still getting started myself. I've barely scratched the surface of what it's like to make it in the industry. And it kind of ties Ken's personality together. and it's a great answer that honestly every time I hear it fires me up. And then, of course, his closing remarks that give me chills every time I hear it. This is what I've been waiting to share and waiting for everyone to be able to hear is Ken's closing remarks, how we end the entire conversation.

I can't wait for everyone to hear it. This is the finale of our conversation with Ken Squire. And enough of me talking about it. Let's hear it. When people say the name Ken Squire today, what do you hope that they think of and what do you think your legacy on the sport is? Oh, I never thought about that very much. I thought I was doing what I loved and what I knew something about. And there's a lot of things I didn't know very much about.

One was baseball. But this was a sport that represented so much of the United States. and then those cars, big, bulky, difficult to handle cars, speeding it. The speed of sounds, you know, all that kind of thing. Hey. And it made a lot of noise. And when those kids came back from World War II, there was a whole new influx of those people. And they were good people.

And they turned the tide. in favor of it. And it took a long time for the major markets to understand that because those were television markets like CBS, like NBC, like ABC, I mean, guys running around in circles

making a lot of noise. What the hell did that mean? Well, it meant that someone was sitting in that car that cared enough about it that he was going to run it until the wheels came off or he won. No if stands or Butts, that was the part of it, the motor car, and we could make something of it.

And Bill France did that. He understood completely why the new car. And when that came into play in NASCAR, the new cars, that's when NASCAR just elevated itself to a new delivery, to the point where they were talking to, they were talking to Detroit, and Detroit was listening, and they learned some things. that were manufactured, produced, thought out in Spartanburg and all throughout the South. I want to jump in real quick on our conversation with Ken Squire to tee up a story from Dave Moody. Dave Moody grew up learning under the wing of Ken Squire, and this is a crazy good lesson from the master himself.

Take a listen. every Friday I would be in his office and we'd go through all of the things that I did wrong and the one or two things that I almost did right because, you know, Ken's no gladhander. He's going to give you the brutal truth whether you're ready for it or not. And so when we were done at the end of our sessions, he would say, okay, go home and Thursday night come back to the track with a list of 20 ways to say side by side. And so I'd go home and I, you know, door to door, bumper to bumper, wheel to wheel, nose to whatever. And I'd come back with my list and he'd say, and he'd look at it and say, yep, okay, now use

all of those tonight. Don't say the same thing, the same way, because people don't want to hear that. That was his number one phrase. People don't want to hear that. Do it the right way. People don't want to hear that. And then the next week it would be 20 ways to say nose to tail, 20 ways to say on the outside, 20 ways to say on the inside. And after a while, that just starts ingreening itself in your brain and you start kind of self-monitoring yourself as you're on the microphone and you say, all right, I said it that way twice. Now it's time to say it a different way. And that never happens without camp. Or you don't say anything. Yeah. A lot of times that speaks for itself, the action. And that they're running that close to. And that they're running that

close together, you can just say that's what's going on. And it was true. When these big moments happen on the track, you said you could just say nothing, let it speak for itself, or sometimes words are the way to go. Where did you come up with your extensive vocabulary? I lied a lot. No, that's not true. I tried to tell the story as best I could. But here was something in front of you that was being lived at this very fast pace, which in the case of NASCAR and they got under the bigger tracks, was so serious. And when something bad happened, it was bad, period, end of the statement. And to represent as much as you could that without making it death dodgers,

was important because that's what they were and still are today. I have a clip from David Hobbs, your broadcast partner of many years, and you guys are in the booth at Talladega one year and he's told this story a few times. I'll let him tell it and you can tell me what you think.

Camera standing up right up against the wall because we can't go back far enough And of course, the lights all wrong because the floodlights are on us and they're bouncing back from the windows of the booth. And we're standing there. Ken used to look at the lights and blink, I go out.

So he didn't squint when he's looking at the camera. He'd go out. And anyway, we got about less than a minute to go. And Ken sneezed. Snop all around. down his tie and diane patterson it was a she said you and she she grabbed she found some tissue from somewhere and she just wiping down his tire you know with me while it's like 25 you know

50 it's clean straight his tie because we went on because all this was live we never did any all those recording days had gone everything everything was live from that on but yeah about 45 I was saying, he's a guy, all that's shit, tired. That was a fun. That was a good memory. Do you remember that? It was an allergy. It was.

It certainly was. And as you hear today, I still have it. One of those things that comes along and you have to deal with it as it is. Sometimes it comes to the precarious police, like a start of a race. Yeah. Bad. But did anyone know? Nobody knew.

No, nobody knew. know. Well, it was because of Diane Keough Patterson. And she looked after us in the booth. Takes a lot of people to put on a race. Yeah. Yeah. What was your broadcast crew like? Well, they changed a lot. The first one was Marvin Panch. The first race as we did, I did, with an expert was Marvin Pange. who to this day I think so much of and what he meant. This was a guy out of California, and he definitely was a racer. No question about it.

Damn near killed himself. And when he got so badly hurt, he went to the Woodrowders because he was scheduled to run in the Daytona 500 and said, I want that guy that got that car off of me. And there was a bird cage down at Maserati and he'd got it upside down practicing at Daytona. And he was going to make it.

But it was 50-50. And he was back in just as interesting and as interested in racing as before that incident and he was able to confide to people what it was that he did in a manner that they appreciated. Guys like that, you just can't, Ned Jarrett is certainly one of those. He was better school than many, but he took that schooling to school, and he used everything he could find to explain, to communicate with people what it was

that the sport was. And it made a big difference to have those people at that time because they spoke from experience and tough experience as to what racing was. And it made such a difference. You mentioned Ned Jarrett.

He worked in the booth with you for a number of years. You actually let him take the call to call Dale Jarrett home to the Daytona 500. What was it like taking the back seat on that one? Well, it was necessary. That was his kid. Yeah.

And his kid who drove a hell of a race. And it was right for him to bring his son home. He did a good job. Is there a particular race? And I know I'm putting you on the spot over all the years that stands out as being one that was unbelievable to watch in person? Most of them. because you had it in front of you and what were you going to do? And there were some hellish scenes and some miracle scenes and some sad scenes.

And you couldn't hide it. There it was. On fire and smoke. That's hard to define and hard to put into place in the midst of a sporting event. But that's what that was. And time after time, we get into those situations. and Ned Jarrett was just wonderful. He saw it and his interpretation from one who darn near was killed. He didn't have to say it, but in his explanation of what he was looking at, it all came across and people understood this is more than throwing a ball and catching it. We talk about daredevils and people willing to put their

to put their lives on the line to achieve something that not many people have done before. I know you're at Edwards Air Force Base in 1979, and I'll pull up a clip for you of the Land Speed record. I'll let you watch this, and you can tell me what you think. All night, the crews have been organizing to put this car through the sound barrier, better than 740 miles per hour at the one place where they are most use to ultimate speed we have been to tonapaw Nevada we've been to bonneville Utah but now we are here on the rogers dry lake looking for mock one on land procedure away on a run that took him to 714 miles per hour that's amazing 714 miles an hour for stan barrett do you remember Seeing that speed in person?

Sure do. What was that like? That was a Natham production. That car, the Budweiser rocket car. And it was incredible to be there at Edwards Air Force Base and being allowed to have a privateer out there trying to do this. that run was something

Hal Needham made up he was an interesting character and smart he had all kinds of great ideas Needham who made all those movies that were kind of fun but this was serious stuff

that he wanted to get a car over the record for land speed and we had tried so hard originally up on the dry lake in Utah, and there was a problem. They had pulled so much salt off the salt flat, and it wouldn't, the wheels would not catch. It went through and into the dirt, and it would throw that tripod well in front, the two behind them, up in the air at 700 miles an hour, and you were floating down through

and it settled back down. And that was Stan Barrett. And he came out of a family that had a lot to do with skiing out west. He wasn't a big skier, but he understood something about risk. And it was there that Hal Needham came up with some other ideas, and we listened and said, you can't do that. And he became a good friend. He had learned all that he did, and he was a top stuntman for many, many years.

So, you know, stuntmen and racing don't naturally fit together. But he understood what it was to hang it all on yourself at high speed. So I prayed very careful attention to what he told me. And it developed into that story about the rocket car. And they had taken it up to 700 miles an hour. Interesting people. And people that really care about racing. and are willing to put all that you think about

is important in life off to the side and just go do it. He was a big listen. And he did that and he became famous in Hollywood for the stunts that he would attempt that nobody would even consider trying to do. Interesting. And that character was represented by Bert

in those movies that they made together. It was beyond people's imagination. And he played on that and made movies about it. Quite a guy. Is it true that you told Hal Needham when he was thinking of making Smoking the Bandit that it wasn't a good idea? Oh, awful.

We go out there to the salt flats and he always had another chapter to add to this, what he thought would make the great movie. And finally, over a few toddies, he told me how this was going to work. And I said, Hal, this is the dumbest thing you've ever thought of. Why do you want to do that? He says, well, I know I can do it. They came right out there and did it, made every effort.

Yeah. And that was so much of the character that was represented in his buddy, Bert. Yeah, those were great days. And it was another experiment in breaking the bearers, breaking the lawn, and doing it above and the beyond where it'd ever been before. So there are good people to learn from. And he was a good, what they would call a B director in motion pictures out universal. And he could have been a minister as much as anything. He was a true believer.

And I find more and more of that feeling in the guys that were the stock car drivers where they would go beyond where everybody had been and take the chances. Some of them were successful and some of them not so successful. Wow. We sure had fun. What shocked me about the interview you had with Stan Barrett is he went 714. miles an hour. Yeah. But all he could think about was how he could go faster. Yeah. And he was a stuntman trained by Hal. You know, he understood about that stuff. Yeah. Exaggeration. Well, it was up there where they

could measure with the equipment how fast the thing was going. So they were really hung out on that. And I think we made three different efforts out there. And they got over 700 miles. 714 and the record was higher than that and they believed they didn't but I'll tell you by the time they get to the end of that one you thought you were at the end of everything I hear you still watch watch most every race today not most some some I would try to watch all the cup races and I always like the coming upers the Saturday show because you see some guys in there and you know they're scared to death and they still get it together and perform on a level that is like the high wire act in the circus.

And that's part of it. That's part of racing. And it's part of what makes it special. No question that today they have so much more education, so much more knowledge, so much more to work with. And now they've got big money that are backing them. But it always comes down to the guy that puts his seat in the car and goes fast. You can't fight with that. That's the reality of what they do.

Because we get caught up in a lot of sports where you hit the ball and hit it back. I want to find the guys that are willing to hit the ball right out of the park. Do you still see those guys in the drivers today? Those daredevils? I don't know that I see as much. And probably that's a good thing.

Yeah. That's that. But when you get to that top line, the fastest and the best, which was what NASCAR, and Indianapolis, I don't want to discredit that. Those guys are amazing. I like how you use the word high wire act. I feel like that's a great way to describe racing. Well, it was always, you know, the guy that jumped off and hoped he hit the mat. Special characters.

and meaningful. When you say character, you always think of boys, guys, and so forth. But the characters in racing represented so much more. And when you take them out and you sit them down and you interview them, you can find that. And that's what I think America is always looking for, escaping to find out of our day-to-day existence.

And we've got some kids. coming along now. And there's more because now they've put the race car into a form of training where you can go that fast without going that fast. But there comes a time and you have to give all that up and go out there and show the show. I've always looked up to you as someone that I've tried to shape myself as an up-and-comer in the racing industry, what advice would you have for me and what challenges might I face as I progress in my career? Well, first of all, you need to move to Vermont. Step one.

Yeah, that's step one. But to be true to yourself and what you believe in, mumps people are playing the game. created by television, broadcasting, media. But the real people are the ones that we focus on and have to because they go out and do it. How many races a year? That's pretty special.

And that special gets lost in all of the advertising and all the promotion. But somewhere in a kid that really believes in this game and I have to believe awfully hard because they pay some big dues. That makes them special. Yeah. For years, racing's been full of heroes

and I think everyone would define you as a hero of racing and so much of what we see now is you help pave the way for that. And so I appreciate you letting us into your home, Ken, and being able to chat with you, these couple days and to see this place that you've grown up around and that you've put so much of your time and effort in and it's been really cool for me so I appreciate you taking the time to do this Vermont's a good place to be from it's not a rich state as far as pecuniary means but as far as a place that early has some feeling to it and people that are real you can't

can't beat Vermont. I love it and I love the people. I guess everybody feels that way about where they're from, but I really feel it here. It means so much. And all I am is a talker, which lets me know what I really am. Now, I was awful glad to talk to you. Gives me chills every time I hear that. What a crazy good closing remark from Ken Squire. And it was just so cool. to hear him say that. He has such deep-rooted passion for where he is from. He wears Vermont on his sleeve, and that is, I mean, he's lived there all his life. That is something that is so cool to me.

He's had such a connection to the place he grew up in. He's never strayed far away from it, and Vermont is home for Ken Squire. But I hope you guys have enjoyed. this conversation, all the conversations that we've had over the last couple of months with Ken Squire, it has been so great to let each individual segment of our talk, breathe and have its own time. That's been something that's, I've really enjoyed doing, and hopefully you guys have enjoyed the episodical approach to our interview with Ken Squire. But I want to jump back to the very beginning of this installment of our conversation because I open it up and ask him,

hey, what do you think your legacy is? And I think in the most Ken Squire way, he starts talking about other people. And he doesn't necessarily put it on himself. He had a sport that he loved so much. And it goes back to the intro, the passion behind it. And, that is, in my opinion, Ken Squire's legacy. And I don't want to necessarily answer for him, but at least when I think of Ken Squire, I see somebody that truly loved what he did, believed in something so much that he never gave up on it,

and he still loves to talk about it today. That is the heart of Ken Squire, at least from what I have gotten out of talking to him and hearing what he had to say. And I think that that should go into what everybody does. And hopefully you can learn a little bit from how Ken Squire chased his career. And at least for me, apply it to myself. Chase passion, chase what you want to do, just like what Ken Squire did.

And maybe we can all learn a little bit about ourselves from him. And I think that's the perfect way to close it out. But we're not necessarily done with the, the Ken Squire content. We are starting to release video series, a video series on YouTube where you can relive these stories and see his facial reaction and get to go inside the home of Ken Squire. So that is coming soon. And then also next level will be continuing for 2023.

You might have heard it on Dirty Mo Live, but we're planning on doing about five, six, seven different individual in-depth interviews this year with some names that I have on a list that would be very, very exciting to get. So stay tuned for that. But I appreciate everyone listening to this entire episodical series of Next Level with Ken Squire. And who knows, maybe we'll be back with some more bonus episodes featuring Dave Moody and David Hobbs. So stay tuned for that. But Thank you so much for listening. I've been Andrew Curland, and we'll see you later. Next Level is a production of Dirty Mo Media,

hosted by myself, Andrew Curlin, executive producers, Mike Davis, and Tiffany Powers. Artwork is by Sean Sen. Special thanks to Alex Tims, Jason Schultz, Micah Codwell, and James Brosan. Broadcast audio is credited to CBS, MRN, and TNT. Check out Dirty Mo Media on YouTube, Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram. Dirty Mo! You're gonna do it.

You're gonna win it.