The Dale Jr. Download - NASCAR’s Independent Teams: Surviving The ‘Unchartered’ Wilderness

Episode Date: April 11, 2024

When talking about the big business of Cup charters this week on the Download, Dale Jr. said something that struck us. He wondered how realistic it is in today’s NASCAR to be an open, unchartered team and financially be able to break even. Today on Reloaded we will ask the question - how do independent, non-chartered Cup teams make it (both financially and competitively) in today’s NASCAR?Host Carla Gebhart is joined by Jordan Bianchi from Dirty Mo Media’s The Teardown podcast to ask that very question to MBM Motorsports owner Carl Long and Cup Series owner/driver BJ McLeod, who now races as an open team after selling his charter. Plus, we listen to your short track concerns and your solutions for saving our beloved short tracks.  Check out Dirty Mo Media on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@DirtyMoMedia  Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

NFL teams have franchises and NASCAR has charters. And just like you, DJD Reloaded wants to know a little bit more about the charter system. But we don't want to know about the teams that already have charters. We want to know about the independent teams, the uncharted teams. And the reason that we're asking this question today is because Dell Jr. is actually the one that posed the question earlier this week on the Dell Jr. download. He kind of asked, what is the realistic expectation for these teams when they show up at the track? Can they be competitive and can they break even on the weekend after they get there?

And he kind of used the example of NBM motorsports owner Carl Long on his show. So how about we have Carl Long on our show? He's going to call in a little bit later. Plus, BJ McLeod had a charter, sold a charter, and is now a driver and owner for an open team in the series. He's going to join us too. And if you listen to the tear down on dirty mode, then you're already familiar with Jordan Bianchi's voice. he's going to weigh in here in studio with me. Plus we've got Dale calls.

We've got social media reaction because I think we can all agree. It was a wild weekend in NASCAR. The following is a production of Dirtymoe Media. Welcome into another episode of DJD, Reloaded. Imagine your dream was to be involved in racing your entire life. I grew up in a NASCAR if you wanted to build a race car to a cup race in your race to now be an owner in the car.

to now be an owner in the Cup series feels like it's only for a certain club. I'm not in that club. Welcome inside to the Bojangles studio for another episode of DJD Reloaded. I'm Carla Gebhardt and I am joined by the athletics and the teardown of Dirty Moe. Jordan, nice to have you.

Pleasure. This is a much more fancier studio than I'm used to. Usually I'm sitting in a closet somewhere. And you're in jeans too. For people that can't see this right now. So that's a novelty in and of itself. jeans and the sports go. The typical look for me at the racetrack.

That's right. Jordan, how many people do you think thought we were going to use this platform today to talk about short track racing and all the problems that we saw at Martinsville? Well, that seems to be the topic du jour. But it was interesting as we kind of brainstorm this, and then Dale brought up something else on his show this week about charters. And it's not, as you said, it's not about who owns the charters. It's about who doesn't own the charters and the system itself.

And instead of just kind of rehashing a lot of the short track stuff, which feels like we've done ad nauseum. This is a very unique and interesting look at a topic that we probably don't delve into enough. Yeah, all of Dirty Moe podcast out there really kind of covered the short tracks extensively. The only thing that they didn't really do is maybe get an extensive look at what fans had to say.

So we're going to have some fun at the end of this show and listen to what fans had to say about short track. But you mentioned Dale Jr.'s comments earlier this week, and so let's go ahead and take a listen to what he had to say. I don't care about being financially successful in NASCAR. I just want to race. I just want to be in it. I just love it. It's what I do. To now be an owner in the Cup Series feels like it's only for a certain club, right? I'm not in that club. Imagine that your, you know, your dream was to be involved in racing your entire life in some way, right?

And we're doing that as Xfinity owners because we can. If it was a $10 million charter buy to get into the Xfinity series, I wouldn't be in it. The 66 car, they, you know, car along and those guys, they came and showed up and race this weekend, but is that realistic to be an open team and come compete and financially be able to at least break even? I grew up in a NASCAR where if you wanted to build a race car, go cup racing, you built one and you raced. All right. So Dale mentioned Carl Long. So let's go ahead and bring Carl Long, who is ironically joining us from his hauler. He is in the process of driving this thing down to Texas right now. So Carl, first of all, thanks for joining us. and to kind of go off Dale's point at the top of this,

how realistic is it for you to break even on a weekend when you show up at the racetrack? Well, that's our goal is to at least break even. And we just don't have a ton of overhead like the bigger teams do so we can offer a product for a lot less money. When you look at your schedule and kind of lay it out on the Cup Series side, how do you decide which races to go to? I look at you being at Martinsville last week, and I guess it makes sense. Logistically, you're close to home.

I would imagine your travel costs are pretty minimal. Is that a big factor when you lay out your schedule? It is. You know, the first thing we do is we look at the payout, see which race is pay the most, and then you look at how many car count you think is going to come, and if you could possibly go home because they were too many of them. And, of course, Martinsville, there was no hotel rooms for us. We just, and the way the schedule is laid out, just drive up there and drive back.

back. So that is a big factor. And then the other factor is which people you have that will sponsor a race in a certain event. You know, Texas, we have money or Martin's or wherever you can put it together at. Carl, you mentioned the sponsorship there. How are you kind of selling this two sponsors out there? Because I assume that you probably have a different way of doing that than some of the other chartered teams, the Big Cup series teams? I do. And it's, you know, to run in Cup, you've already had to be established driver. And most of them are still actively competing in another series.

And $50,000, $60,000 a race is kind of the low end of where people try to run at in Exfinity. And I can offer the same thing in Cup and give guys a chance to run Cup and give me a chance to learn more about the cars to, be a little more competitive as we get more experience. You talk to team owners on the Cup Series, and they will tell you the charter system is working largely for them. They are in favor of the system. It gives them insurances and protections should they choose to get out. But from an independent perspective,

as someone who doesn't own a charter, and it probably feels maybe squeezed out of the game a little bit, do you think the charter system is good for NASCAR in the Cup Series in its future? I guess it's opinions both ways. It's not as good for me because it's only the four spots. I guess a whole program racing all year. It's great to know that you're locked in every week when you go to the track. So I see a lot of benefits by that and being a charter,

but it does kind of keep it closed for an independent to come along. Is that a good thing, though, that NASCAR is losing independence in the Cup series? Because that is, if you look at the history of NASCAR, independence have always had a place. They have, but right now, if I didn't have some help from some of the people that I've raced with in the past, it would be very difficult to show up. But it's so much involved with this cup car that's all the engineers. used to be a bunch of mechanics. We'd work on the cars and we'd do stuff. Now I think you've got about three or four engineers to one mechanic,

three of them telling him what to do and what the computer came up with. But I'm not a computer guy, so we're just kind of learning. I still use a laser and a string trying to set the toe in on the cars and figure out how to get them things squared up. You're old school, man. Yeah. Carl, you mentioned the help that you've kind of received to be able to do this. For people listening or maybe a team out there that might think about this, is it realistic for them to think that they can make a living doing this?

If you have an established race team and people with experience, sure, anybody can do it. And that's what happens to where I'm at. I get guys from college and NTI students and people. from all forms of life that this is their first starting racing. And as we go through their mistakes and it bites us in the team here and there, once we finally get them pretty decent and you're parked beside somebody at the racetrack that realizes you've got a decent guy there, next thing you know, they're on the flight instead of driving to the racetrack with somebody else.

And, you know, I just always wanted to try to get enough money to elevate my team up enough where I didn't lose all my employees that we would bring. along, you know, and you get a good crew chief that doesn't have a job, and you put him to work. He leaves and gets another job six months later, and he takes you two or three good people you had with you. So I just like to have enough security. I didn't lose them all. And right now I went from two years ago.

We had over 30 employees, and now I have six. I'm the crew chief. I'm the truck driver, and I don't think I'm going to leave and take my crew somewhere else. So just trying to make it less stressful. When you look at the charter system, is there a pathway for a car long to realistically buy a charter? We had an opportunity back when VJ was able to purchase the one from Archie St. Hilaire. I went in at that point and basically my partner said, just give him a check and tell Archie what numbers that he want us to fill in. and we'll do it.

But I guess Joe Falk brother teamed up with BJ and they had a lot nicer building a lot nicer stuff. So it was just better for him to do that. But we tried and we tried when BK. Racing went out to get the charter. But we gave out of money before we could get it. Do you think that opportunity will be there again for you to possibly buy a charter? Nope. Not at $40 million.

I'm just lucky to get one million. Must less 40. Carl, you mentioned the six employees. You're driving the hauler to Texas right now. So what keeps you going? What keeps you wanting to do this in the sport? Well, the job at Walmart has agreed or doesn't pay as good. So this is about the only thing that I've learned to do.

I've been racing since 83. And it fairs a way. I actually enjoy. more being hands-on back with it and going to the racetrack and doing better than people expect me to do. You know, we made a, I made a mistake at Martinsville with David Starr on the setup. I tried to fix a problem that didn't have one. I should make something little better. I outsmarted myself.

So when I go back to Wilkesboro with Timmy Hill in the same car, I think Timmy will be a lot more competitive. But I don't have the simulation. I don't have all of the stuff that they run. So as we called it, the assometer that we used to use and fixing the car, I don't get to use that as much anymore. I got to get a race in to figure out what it is afterwards. Assometer? Yeah.

All right. Learn something new today. Yeah. You can ask Jr. You know, you put the ass in the seat. It'll come back and tell you what needs to be changed. But if you don't get practice and things to do that, kind of makes it difficult to read that meter. That's awesome. I don't think we can really top that. Carl, thanks so much for joining us. Safe travels the rest of the way.

All right. Thank you. Thanks, Carl. Wow. That's one for the dictionary right there. Yeah, I'm going to play. Use that next time I play Scrabble. I'm going to use that. Outside of that, what would you take away from what Carl said? It's tough to be an independent. It's never been an easy road to being independent in NASCAR and now with the charter system. And I think it is a good system. I just want to say that. It is hard. It is. is the pathway to make money and to make a living on the Cup series is not really there. I mean, if you want to be an independent owner, you almost are pushed to either the extended to your truck series because doing it in the Cup series is just not realistic. But, I mean, I know that sounds like maybe a negative thing, right, for the independent owners, but the charters are doing what they're supposed to do, right?

Guaranteed revenue, a guaranteed spot in the sport. And that's exactly what the NBA, NFL, other teams out there do. Absolutely. And Carl said there's good. this is a good system for the guys who have the charters. And for a long time, the owners, and you could be a big owner, you could be a small owner, did not have financial security. And when it was time for them to get out, whether it was a Robert Yates or even a Barney Visser,

they were sometimes getting pennies on the dollar. And at least at Barney's case, he was able to turn around and sell his charter for a little bit of money, not nearly what the charters are worth now, but at least it was more than he would have gotten otherwise in the previous charter system. Dale's kind of mentioned that he likes the underdog in the sport, right? And I know a lot of other fans feel that way as well. Do you like seeing these uncharted teams? I mean, listen, they're the fabric of NASCAR.

And part of NASCAR is you put a guy in the garage and you build a race car and you bring it to the racetrack and you could go compete. And if you had the dream and you had the initiative and all of that, you can maybe turn that dream into a goal of winning a race someday. Is that there anymore? No. But that's big league sports in general. I mean, there was a time when across the board you had little teams in sports who could compete with the New York Yankees or, you know, these other giants.

And that's just not the way it is anymore. I mean, in a lot of ways, it kind of reminds me of English soccer where you've had a consolidation where you've had these big teams just kind of close ranks a little bit. Is that a good thing or bad thing? I don't know. But the end of the day, I don't look at this as sports. I look at this as a business. And on the business side, this is a good thing. Yeah, you always want to see the value increase for your sport.

certainly the case for NASCAR. Of course, we've listened to one uncharted team. So now we've got one more to go. But the difference for BJ McLeod is that he did on a charter. So we're going to talk with him coming up next on DJD Reloaded. Well, race fans are already familiar with our next guest. Let's go ahead and welcome BJ McLeod. And of course, driving in the NASCAR Cup series for many years on the charter team, sold his charter team. But now still is an owner and a driver for an open team in the sports. So let's bring BJ in. And BJ, I know you've answered this question quite a bit since doing so. But just to go ahead and start us off, why did you end up selling the charter in the first place?

Yeah, I mean, it basically come down to, you know, we had goals when we started and honestly planned on owning our charter for a couple of decades. It just, the longer we went, we build up some sponsorship. We're making progress with that. we were able to spend more money and have better vehicles. And ultimately, the last year we ran, which was last year, it just, we spent a lot of money on our side to improve. And our finishing position didn't improve one spot. Our Delta improved quite a bit. We went from being three or four laps down at most of downforce tracks to, you know, sometimes we finish on a lead lap.

And then, you know, a lot of times we finished one lap down. So, you know, we saw improvement in it, but it just, it become to be a realization that we weren't going to be able to grow as fast as the sport had grown. And I, you know, I've watched this sport since I was, I think my first race I watched, I was three and a half years old. Obviously, wasn't planning on an owner and a business then, but I have dreamed and worked towards being an owner and a driver in the Cup series for over three decades. And, you know, the sport watching it as I was growing up, I could have gotten in at a younger time if things had worked out. And, you know, let's say pre-2005, and I completely believe that we could have built our team into a winning cup team. The way the popularity has grown around the ownership side of the sport in the last three to four years, you know, wrapped around mainly next gen. and it just grew faster than we could grow.

And at the same time with the charters and the values, the way they build up, it just was a bad business decision to keep going. And I'm not about that. Like I've always been, you know, good at whatever small business I was a part of or, you know, obviously the racing business. I know when to set the racer aside and, you know, make sure that we take care of the business.

And the opportunity was there for us to, you know, sell and move on. and honestly, the quickest route, you know, I'm 40 years old now. So the quickest route for me to be able to drive a competitive car in the Cups series was to sell and have more capital and just run less races. Because ultimately, I've never, I've probably got an average finish of 28th to 30th in the Cups series. And that's not something I'm proud of, right? Like, it's not, I'm thankful to have gotten there. I'm proud of the journey that we took to get there.

It's a very awesome journey. You know, there's a lot of wins, truth. to get to that point, but the driver in me just honestly couldn't do it anymore. And I want to, I want to try to compete and be on the lead lap. You know, any cup race I show up and, and selling ultimately was the quickest way to do that. And it was the smartest business decision at the same time. So, you know, that's what led to it, just the growth of the sport. And I want to be clear that I'm happy about that. Like, it did push me out in a way, but I love the sport and I love seeing the popularity that it has right now,

especially on the ownership side. And, you know, it's a good thing all the way around. So I'm just looking forward to, you know, the shift that we made, which is what you have to do when you're in business. And I'm looking forward to trying to prove that we can run a little bit better now. And I think we obviously did that at Daytona. So, you know, we missed the race, but we had an awesome duel. And it come down to the last, you know, three or four car lengths on the front stretch.

And I just got beat. So, you know, I think we're looking forward to Talladega and races to come to prove that we can run a little bit better than we've been running. BJ, you have a unique story in that you started as an open team. You bought a charter. Then you sold that charter and now you're back being an open team again. Going through this, do you feel, one, the charter system is working as intended. And two, is it good for NASCAR to have this system in place as is?

Yeah, there's no doubt that the charter system's working. I've got proof on both sides. I started as an open team because I wanted to make sure that my shop, because I have a small shop. My shop's 15,000 square feet. I'm pretty sure the top, you know, the big, the big four, big five, whatever you want to say, it, uh, I'd say that that shops probably their front office or their four year, right? So I wanted to make sure that my shop, my infrastructure, could handle a cup team back in 2020. And that's why we ran some open races as a cup team. And we ran, we ran a lot of the hard ones. We ran them when they were running on, you know, I think they're

running two or three a week. I mean, at one point, I remember racing on a Sunday, a Wednesday, and a Saturday, I believe. So we did that to see if we could handle it and make sure that we could perform it and make sure we were there on time for tech and everything was organized because, yes, we've had a small team this whole time. We've been underfunded. But if you walk down pit road at a cup race in the last three years and looked at my pit stall with my garage box or my pit box, you can't tell the difference between it and a top 10 team.

So we wanted to make sure that the infrastructure was there to be able to compete at the cup level. not to do with speed, but just simply getting there and performing and being on time and, you know, being, being professional that we wanted to be. So we proved all that with the open car. And I believed that in the future of the charter system at that time, Matt believed in it. Joe, obviously, was already a part of it. Jessica believed in it. So it was, you know, it was risky what we did. We definitely, you know, spent a lot of money to buy into the charter system and get going and, you know, try to build a cup team.

you know, it was all of us believed in it business-wise also. So that's part of, you know, what you have to see. So we bought in at the right time and seeing everything happening around it. Absolutely, you know, enjoyed trying to make that happen. And then, like I said, when things shifted, I'm thankful that there's four spots for open cars at the races. Even though I went home in Daytona, it still gave me a shot to go down there and try to get in for the Daytona 500 as an independent team. So I think NASCAR has done a great job of having a charter system that you must have to be able to get their correct sponsorship to be able to win races or even compete in 25th or 30th position, honestly. It's that tough now.

So I think they've done a great job with that. And then I also believe that they've done a great job of saying, hey, you know what? If the 91 wants to show up at Chicago with SVG and it went a race, they got an opportunity because if there was no open spots, that win never gets given the trackhouse, right? So I just, I think that it's a good balance. And I believe that they've got, they've got a good system going the way it is. And I can speak firsthand to the sponsorship side of it. When you have a charter, you can sell sponsorship. When you're open, it's twice to three times as difficult to sell sponsorship.

So that is the part that makes the charter so valuable. I can't imagine, like my sponsorship's probably a third to a fourth of what a top 10 team asks for. and I have a hard time getting it. I can't imagine, you know, before the charter system, how difficult it was once the sport had gone down a little bit in popularity. You mentioned sponsorship. You mentioned Daytona, your next one in Talladega. I'm sure this has comes into play when you're deciding which tracks to visit next. But how do you determine your schedule now as an open team?

You know, I took that from personal experience. I've been here a long time. I don't have the finishes that I wish I have. I, Demma, had the success on track that I want. That's what we're still fighting for. But I have, you know, got a ton of experience. And I think I'm the most experienced, non-full-time next-gen driver right now. So I believe that I just went off what I know that I can at least stay on the lead lap with if things go right.

And Greenflike stops don't get messed up, which we know are difficult. And that's easy to speedways, right? Like Daytona, Talladega. And now Atlanta, you know, it's not a full-blown speed. speedway, but it races a lot like it. So, you know, we, we, we, we like Atlanta's because we know we can, we can stay with the group. And that, that gives us something to build off of. There's a couple of tracks last year. We ran really good at Texas. I think we finished 22nd or something like that. And, um, Charlotte, we were actually running good in the 600. We were running like 30 at 29,

somewhere in that area. And I spun out, um, just, uh, made a mistake. And, uh, it cost us a decent finish. But regardless, you know, I'm just going off a personal experience. of what I choose to be able to try to run and perform. And even, you know, when we go to a speedway, I'm honestly, I'm shooting for top 10 or nothing. Like I really, and we all know that there's a lot of attrition there. And I want to be, you know, I want to have a car that's fast enough to draft inside the top 10 all day versus the top tens that I have,

which honestly, I'm thankful to have them, but they don't mean very much because they were all attrition top tens. I didn't, I did do my job. I did stay out of the wrecks. I did what I could, but the racer in me says I didn't do much to earn them. So, you know, I want to switch that. And I think I proved that in the duel. Like they dropped the grain and it took me, I think about 15 laps that I was in the top.

I think I got to the top five for a little bit. So, you know, it's, I want to prove that my car can race inside the top 10 at these speedways. And, you know, and granted, qualifying wise, we're still going to be in the back. We still, we still have a lot to work on for single car stuff. We were half a second off from making it on time at Daytona. We have a lot to work on there. but all we can do is keep going and trying and getting smarter. So, you know, I think knowing that I'll be in a, you know,

a bad starting position that you speedways, it'll take a while. Maybe I get wrecked before I ever get up there, but I'm at least going to try to get up to the front, you know, every one of these races I go to. I'm not riding around on the back anymore. So I'm looking forward to that, looking forward to having fun. And then, you know, I think we're probably going to go to Indy. And that's simply because I love the brickyard.

I love the history of the track. And we're going back to the Oval, which is the way it should be. So I want to show up and support that race and see if we can at least finish sleep lap. BJ, we know what the charter market is in terms of what it costs to buy a charter. And that cost is probably going to go up.

Looking at this, could you see yourself ever realistically buying a charter again? You know, the real shot that I have at that would be, I would like to be a successful cup owner at the full-time level, you know, again. And I'm still, on that, side of things I'm very young right so I think that one reason I'm doing the open team is to prove that we have the infrastructure to compete with very

little resource right and it takes a lot of years to build a network in the sport that can handle operating a cup team and fortunately I have done that I've been here since 06 and I have a large network inside the sport of a lot of good people a lot of successful people and I've had the support of a lot of great people to even be in the spot that I'm in. And I feel like that is worth a lot of money, right? So if I can prove that my open team can run good three times a year, five times a year, six times a year, with the popularity around the sport, you never know when somebody outside the

sport might want to come in on a charter, but they don't have the groundwork laid to be able to run a team or be in a position to make it successful. And I want to prove that that's us. And maybe one day that'll happen. If not, then we'll be an open team for five to ten races a year for however long I decide to do it. So it's something that's on the side that I want people to know I'd be willing to do. But it, you know, it's a long shot, but it definitely is possible. And that's what we're here to prove.

BJ, we appreciate you joining us so much and giving us that perspective. Of course, we look forward to seeing you back out on the track in Talladega as well. Thanks. Yeah, thank you guys for having me. I appreciate it. Thanks, BJ. So that was kind of interesting, just knowing that there might be some interest for him. was not the case for Carl Long, but that's not the case for BJ McLeod.

No, I mean, BJ has been through this before. His unique experience, as we talked about, you know, he was an open team, and then he bought a charter, and now he's sold, and he's still trying to race and be competitive. And, you know, as he said, the pathway to getting back as a charter owner is difficult. He's not closing the door, but it's still there for him. And BJ, people don't realize that's about BJ. One, he's one of the more popular figures in the garage. Like, he has widespread respect among drivers and competitors.

They understand what he does and how he does it. He races everybody really clean. There's a lot of guys who get very angry when they come up on back markers and traffic and they just have no patience at all for them. BJ, though, they have very much respect for. Because BJ races them very clean, raises them hard, but respectfully. Yeah, I think fans can kind of see that too. I talked to him before the Daytona 500, and it was just very interesting to see him

compared to seasons before, right? I felt like he was maybe more lighthearted, less stress. but having more fun. Well, when you got that money in your bank account after selling a charter, I would hope so. That's a good point. That is a good point. But also the fact that he can, you know, pick his races and race competitively, that's the part that means the most to him. Yeah, and he now has, and he didn't say in this interview, but the conversation I've had with him, he now has the opportunity to maybe go with a bigger team and say, hey, I want to go with you for a race or two, an opportunity where I feel like as a driver I can make a difference and showcase my ability, which is not something he's really ever been able to do with his. team. It's just the way that this game is. And so now the opportunity is there, maybe to do that down the road with, you know, pick a team in the Xfinity series that you want to go and race for

wins because that is not something he's never had the chance to do. Yeah, and you can finally see that talent like you said. All right, Jordan, I know you've got places to be. You're a big talent in the Charlotte area. So we'll let you go in a minute. But before we do, I have to let you weigh in on this really important topic that Dirty Moe has been talking a lot about this week. So let's for all that clip. I never heard of Jay Cole before. Doesn't like Jay Cole like make shoes? Have you looked up Jay Cole?

Have you Googled Jay Cole yet? No, don't care. And Jeff's been texting me all week about Jay Cole, sending the information about this. He has a new album out, right? Apparently, and he's like the number 15th greatest rapper of all time

according to Billboard or Rolling Stones. Whatever. Don't care. I'd never heard of them before. Not my thing. Cool. Congratulations and no idea. And you're not going to listen to him.

I probably not. But you do know who Kenneth Cole is and Cole Han, the designers. Yeah, You want to talk shoes? I can talk shoe game with you all day. I have no idea who Jay Cole is, though. But he makes a loafer, I'm in. A loafer?

All right. Jay Cole, your audience right here is Jordan Bianchi if you decide to go into the loafer game. Thank you. All right, Jordan. Thanks so much. It's hard to beat that conversation, but we are certainly going to try.

Andrew Curling going to join me here in the Bojangles studio. We're talking short track eulogies, and we're also going to get your opinions on how to fix short track racing. That's next. All right, Andrew Curlin now joining me and your number's been called. You're in the game. The coach has put you in the game right now.

I got the call. Yeah, excited to have you back right now. And we are now going to be discussing the short track racing that we saw at Martinsville because every other podcast that Dirty Mo put out this week was pretty intense about this topic. And fans online were pretty intense as well. I think we struck a nerve on that conversation. Absolutely. And by the way, I have to mention I'm not, you know, I feel like I'm underdressed here.

You are. You are. You are. You set the bar really high for this seat. I'll have to come in next week with like, you know, a suit and tie, sport coat. Yeah, something nice. Yeah, okay, good. Well, I've got the jeans.

That's what's important. No, but the short track racing, it was obviously big topic. Dale was frustrated about it on the show this week. And fans, as you mentioned, shared his frustration. I think that's because we set such a high bar for ourselves because we know the potential that Martinsville and these other types of racetracks have. and it seemed to have fallen short these past couple of short track races and, you know, kind of in this next-gen era, it seems like.

Yeah, you could hear the frustration from fans online. You could hear the big sigh that Dell gave on the Dell Jr. download a lot to unpack there. But let's go ahead and take a listen to the Dell calls this week and what you had to say about short tracks. This car, road courses, street courses, super speedways. It's got places it can shine. but on the short track, we're going to need something different. We may have to go back to the day when we built track cars just four short tracks. That was kind of brought up on some other podcasts earlier this week.

The fact that maybe there just needs to be a completely different vehicle. Yeah, no, I mean, like we were talking, you know, is horsepower the answer? Dale says, oh, you can add 80 horsepower, no problem. But is that going to really make a difference? So it's like what is the one thing that's causing us to race this way? Is it the car? Is it the tires? Is it a mix of both?

I still don't fully have that answer. Yeah, Elton Sawyer, though, of NASCAR did come out and say that they're going to try to find the solution to all of this. So maybe don't hit the panic button just yet. But let's get to caller number two. Not too pleased. Went to Martin Zille this past weekend. And I hate to see something like that happened to North Wilkesboro. And now that we've got the All-Star Race and not able hopefully to get a regular cup date.

And it doesn't look good for the future of North Wilkesboro. I really wish NASCAR get this fixed so that my daughter can enjoy what I grew up until I was about 12 years old. So I'm hoping we can get this fig so we can enjoy North Wilkesboro for a long time. I was going to say, are we already saying about in North Wilkesboro? It just came back. I know. It's interesting for these types of tracks that are almost getting their tryout, you know, necessarily. And are they getting a fair chance here to really show us what they're capable of?

I loved that North Wilkesboro had so much tire fall off. Now we've paved that track. It's going to be interesting to see how that changes things this year. But I don't know. Yeah, can you really evaluate just the track being the one thing that decides a racing product? I think one thing you're hearing in these calls are the wheel spinning for fans are going, this was Martinsville, next is North Wilkesboro, next is the next short track. And you can kind of see that if they don't fix it, it's going to continue to be a bigger issue.

I don't force. I don't see. And again, this is our overreaction here, right? I don't see Martinsville going away. You know, Richmond, there's been talk of it losing a date, but I still think short track racing has a very prominent role in NASCAR. And so, you know, as it should, we're saying, oh, Martinsville, you know, it's going to lose a date.

I don't foresee that necessarily being the case. It's too iconic of a racetrack. I agree with that. All right. We're saving the best call for last weekend, so let's get to that. We were singing bye, bye, short track racing has died. Martinsville, Richmond, Bristol, Goodyear needs a new tire. This horse power sucks, and I've got a tear in my eye,

because Iowa will be the day short tracks die. That was beautiful. So that song's going to be played at the funeral for the short track? I think that was an original. It was an original. I appreciate the vocal talent there. can't do that. I'm not even going to try. I mean, now that was a eulogy right there. That's what we were looking for. Brilliantly delivered. Yeah, it was. All right, so now let's transition to Twitter and X to hashtag,

don't hold me to it. We've talked about the reaction, maybe the overreaction from fans for short tracks, but let's now talk about how we solve it and we asked the fans out there, what would you do to fix short track racing? So let's go ahead and pull up what fans had to say. And a lot of people, pretty vocal about this. Yeah, absolutely. Between two bushes, raise minimum height. Let's go to groove tires, increase horsepower. Matt, our friend, O, uh, says groove tires. So, so that seems to be the thing, the groove tires. Um, Compton says, you know, widen the width of the tires, increase the purse at short track, shorten the length of the race that can create more incentive for aggressive driving.

Uh, I think that's interesting. I don't know, especially on Copton's point, they wanted to race. Martinsville. I think there came a point where they just couldn't. I mean, Denny was even saying he was trying to get around someone. He was trying to be aggressive and still couldn't do it. I'm always for added aggression. But, you know, I think there's definitely something to that. You know, the suggestions, especially with the tires, I think are something we really have to look into. Dale talked about how eye-opening Bristol was. And it opened my eyes too that tires play a huge role in the product of the racing. Yeah. Happy. accident at Bristol, but Goodyear could be the hero in all of this. They could save short track

racing. And I think that would be the easiest fix because there's also fans out there. I was reading through replies last night. And, you know, they want a completely different model. Another next gen model car. Yeah. I mean, I've been seeing a lot of responses about tires being the answer. And, you know, it's almost like we've got to be nice to Good Year because they're trying to portray themselves as the reliable tire company and here we are asking them, we want your tires to be less reliable. We want them to wear really fast. It's almost like as a collective, you know, race fans, we got to understand. Yes. We'll start a campaign for them. Yeah. Do the groundwork for that. I agree. Just like Good Year, we know you're trying to help us, right? We will understand that these tires don't match the

road tires. You know, like something like if they can save our short track racing, I think fans are going to love Good Year even more. Well, we hope you enjoyed this episode of DeVos. DJD reloaded. Of course, we've got a lot of content out there on dirty mode this week. We got the tear down. You can listen to Jordan Bianchi and Jeff Gluck. Again, Jordan Bianchi was on the show earlier today. DBC. Those guys were heated on the short track discussion as well. The Dell Jr. download. You got to talk with Dell earlier this week. Y'all talked about short tracks. She also had Richard and Compettian. Such a good episode. What a great episode. Wow. I mean, the stories that came from that were fantastic. There was one in particular. It was basically a 193-mile joyride in the passenger seat.

Just make sure you go and listen to that. That was a cool story. But yeah, it was awesome to have those two in there. Absolutely. Actions detrimental with Denny Hamlin. We got Speed Street and Dirty Mode Doe. That's on Friday this week. So a little schedule change at least for this week.

And that's going to be important. Betting on the Masters, watching the Masters. Yeah. Perfect time to take part in that podcast. Absolutely. Tampa Tims. He gave us a little tease as to who he's got his eyes on, at least for the Masters, and if it ends up hitting,

it's going to be a good payday. And Tampa Tim and Steve and Russ and everyone on there, they've been on it this year. Yeah, I'll have to take a listen. I hear Scotty Sheffler, though, is the heavy favorite as the number one. Okay, Tampa Timbs, he might disagree with you. All right. You have to tune in.

I'll have to do that. All right, that's going to do it for us on DJD Reloaded. We'll see you next Thursday. Check out Dirtymo Media on Twitter, Facebook, TikTok, and Instagram.