The Dale Jr. Download - Why Jimmie Johnson Bet on Josh Berry

Episode Date: September 9, 2026

The day the Wood Brothers let Josh Berry go, two people texted him. One was Joey Logano. The other was Riley Herbst, who had gotten “the worst call in all of motorsports” himself just two months earlier. Riley just wanted Josh to know that it gets better. And it did.Josh went on the best stretch the Wood Brothers had seen since 1976, only to have his future questioned as soon as the results started to slip. Then, despite all of that, he ended up getting a call from Jimmie Johnson and a spot at Legacy Motor Club.On this episode of the Dale Jr. Download, Jimmie Johnson joins Dale to talk about his two newest drivers, Riley Herbst and Josh Berry, and how Legacy’s 2027 lineup came together.Jimmie explains why Josh’s hot streak wasn’t what made the decision for him, and why three years of data ultimately made the case. Riley talks about the long history between the Herbst family and Legacy’s ownership group, going back to off-road and stadium truck racing, and reveals the surprisingly random story behind his No. 84. Jimmie also gets into what it took for Legacy to build its own aero tools from scratch after moving away from its Joe Gibbs Racing alliance.If you follow NASCAR, Legacy Motor Club, Jimmie Johnson as a team owner, or the 2027 silly season, this episode gives you the story behind the moves, not just the version that made the press release. Check out Dirty Mo Media on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@DirtyMoMedia Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

The following is a production of Dirtymo Media. You're Dale Jr. Should I say it? It's Dale Jr. podcast, I've got to say it. Hey, everybody. It's Dale Jr. back again for another episode of the Dale Jr. Download, and we've got a great show for you today. We've got three guests coming in here.

We've had a lot of shows this year where we've had multiple people in the room, and we've got another one. A seven-time champion and owner at Legacy Motor Club, Jimmy Johnson, is bringing in a couple of special guests. First off, we're going to have Riley Herps coming to the room. They're announcing just recently that Riley is going to be driving the third car for Legacy next year. They're scaling up into a three-car team. And later in the show, there's another big announcement and another guest that will be joining us.

And it is Josh Barry. As they announced yesterday, Josh Barry is the drive. driver who will be replacing John Hunter Nimichick at Legacy Motor Club. Next year, Josh has been on a tear over the last couple of months with some great results while driving for the Wood Brothers. And, you know, Josh had a lot of success last year in the 21 car as well and has done enough to catch the attention of Jimmy Johnson and Legacy to bring him on board. and I think it's a great opportunity for Josh.

Not only does he get to keep racing in the Cup Series because I personally believe he belongs there, and I think he's proved that out over the last couple of months, at least, if not before that. But this will be a new opportunity, you know. He's going to change manufacturers. He's raced for this team before, but he's going to go racing for Toyota next year.

And, you know, it's a growing, company with a growing race team and Josh can bring a lot of information and knowledge that he's gained over the last couple of years working closely with Penske and so forth. Riley's going to be bringing a lot of knowledge as well from 2311 Toyota Joe Gibbs Racing. Just a great opportunity for legacy, I think, to bring these two guys on board and it should elevate the entire company. So they're going to come in here and tell us all about it. Let's get started and bring Jimmy and Riley into the room.

And don't forget this episode is presented by Arby's and Arby's new meat in three box. You get more meal for your money at Arby's. We have the meats. It's time for the Dale Jr. Download. All right, everybody, here we are with Jimmy Johnson and Riley Hurst in the Dale Junior Download Studio. Awesome to have both y'all here.

Thanks, buddy. Thank you. Thank you. Yeah. I don't even where to start, man. This is exciting. Riley, we finally kind of get to understand your path forward with the announcement that you're going to go drive for Legacy.

And I think it was probably one of the worst kept secrets. The silly season is kind of always that way. It's hard to keep these things under wraps. But you've got to be excited to finally be able to go out there and tell people what's going on. Yeah, absolutely. I feel like my whole career has kind of been the worst kept secret in auto sports from Joe Gibbs Racing to Stuart Haas to 2311 and now finally the Legacy with Jimmy Johnson and everything. But yeah, it's amazing to be with Jimmy and everybody at Legacy and Toyota.

and Monster for a multiple year deal. So it kind of gives me some groundwork to stand on and just go out there and enjoy what I love to do. And that's driving circles and go have a really good time in a cup car. Jamie. I was going to say it's wild how the business of our sport and how much time it takes to get things in order. We've known, and that's why it's the worst kept secret, where he is going to go. but the other pieces of the puzzle to put in place just take time. What are those pieces?

From partnership to contracts, you know, there's just a lot of little layers. And then fortunately with the- Adding another team. Add in another team. There's so many business pieces that need to fall in place. We knew he was coming. We knew who was going in to the third car over it at 2311. So it was very easy for the world to figure out what was going on.

It's just tough to keep a secret to sport. I heard something that you mentioned over the past couple of days about the family connection and relationships you've had with his family. Talk about that because I think that that was something that not a lot of people know about. Yeah, not only myself, but Cal Wells are CEO. I think Cal actually knew Riley's grandfather really well. And then in the premier division of desert truck racing and actually even the stadium racing, Riley's father and his two uncles were competitors as well.

So we've known each other for a long time and have always looked out for each other. His father, Troy, has been a great friend. I think Cal and your father have spent time as Riley was coming up through the ranks, kind of guiding him and just being another voice to sound things against. And then, you know, now this opportunity has come together. I've also had a chance to go racing off-road truck with his father, which was in place before any of this really happened. And then when the opportunity came together,

knowing the Hurps family, getting to O'Reilly and understanding his focus and dedication on fulfilling his childhood dream and being back here racing, all the pieces really started to fall in place. Was that the Mickey Thompson Stadium? Yeah, the Mickey Thompson Stadium and then the Score Desert Series. The stadium stuff, I used to watch that all the time.

It was so awesome. Oh, yeah, because it was full contact. Yeah. And there were parts and pieces falling off and trucks rolling over and going again, and I watched your family race and didn't even realize. Didn't even know it. I was doing that. It was cool stuff.

It was. I don't know why it went away because it was so entertaining. It had a moment. Honestly, what really heard it more than anything was the Craftsman Truck Series being started. It did. Because those trucks are so expensive. And you have desert and stadium. And the budget to run like a full effort for Chevrolet, Toyota, whatever it might be,

they'd take one desert program or one, one, one, kind of team program in dirt, and it was the entire budget for truck racing in NASCAR. So you raced for Legacy a few times over the last couple of years using the number 84. Yeah. Yeah, Rick wouldn't give up the 48 until 27 Daytona 500. Right. And so the, was there, you know, was there conversation around any different numbers?

Was the number 84? Was that the number from the get-go? I don't know. I, uh, it's kind of a hot take by me, but I'm, I'm, I'm not a huge number guy. I, uh, yeah, 35, 98, 18, 84. I kind of, I don't know. I just like driving race cars. So Jimmy was like, what do you think about 84? And I was like, sounds good to me, boss, whatever, whatever number do you want to slap on the side of the thing. But I like the connection, um, with Jimmy. It's, I kind of like Jimmy's version of the 48. It's just kind of backwards and, um, it's unique. So, uh, yeah, I mean, really, I don't really know if we had many conversations.

about it. No, not so much. And I end up being a big numbers guy. And the number four and eight in my dirt and off-road racing, even ASA, those numbers were always a part of my journey. And when I came to Hendrick, they showed me a list of numbers that were available that I picked the 48. And just, you know, stick with it. I wanted the 44, but it's occupied. I think it'd be great to have those three petty numbers in a row. But 84 is where we are. How important, Raleigh, is it that you get to continue the relationship with Toyota. You've been with them since 2016 or so. But, you know, it took a brief break. Like I said, I went to college with Stewart House racing, but I'm back in Toyota. And it was huge. That was a huge stepping stone of where

I wanted to land. I think Toyota, what they invest into the top level of motor sport, or I should say all three levels of this sport is insane. And I think Jimmy's really, really aligned with Legacy and Toyota. And I did. don't want to start over again. The manufacturer switch is really huge in the top series of NASCAR. And I felt like Toyota's situated for the best path forward right now. And that was a huge component for sure. How about the star-studded lineup that Jimmy has put together in terms of the ownership group? That's not something unfamiliar at all for you having worked with Michael at 2311. But the opportunity, I guess, to

to be a part of something that that's going to draw a lot of attention and there's a lot of excitement around it. There's also some pressure with that as well. You've got a lot of owners to make happy. None more important than Jimmy here, but talk about, I guess, the excitement around the program itself is you're watching this come together. You're literally, you know, this program and this race team is growing by leaps and bounds over the last 12 months, as you've known you're kind of shifting into that gear. Yeah, it's huge.

I think the speed on the racetrack is the first thing that's relevant. And you can see the 42 and the 43 car. Some weeks have a shot to go win the race. And so that's awesome to see. It excites me to see. But when it comes to all the ownership group and the pressure, I've been kind of thrown in the pressure cooker, as you've kind of experienced my whole career in this side of the country in NASCAR.

So that's not very new to me. I'm excited for the opportunity to hopefully perform at a high level for Jimmy. and all the great owners at Legacy Motor Club. But on the flip side, I'm excited to meet all of them. They sound like super cool guys, and one of them is from Las Vegas as well. So I'm excited about that, Darius, Guy Fieri, super cool guys. And hopefully, I mean, it doesn't really mean anything.

If we can't perform on the racetrack, but that's our goal. I think Riley is still, forgive me, you're sitting right here. Yeah, he's still a prospect, if you will. You're still, he's still in a phase of his career relatively in the Cup series where he's growing, he's improving, he's got a ceiling that you want to continue to tap and extract speed out of. What are some of the things that you, Jimmy, can do to make him a better race car driver? What are some of the things that you're excited about when you finally get him in the building to sort of say, hey, all right, you've got all these tools, these things you've gathered from your experiences with other race teams and going through the Raleigh series. here's some other things that we can help give you attached to you to make you a better race car driver and go faster. Yeah, there's a lot there to dig in on.

And I'm excited to, I've already started blowing him up this weekend as he was heading to Darlington. But, you know, a couple aspects to it. One, the third car in where Riley's coming in for us is within the company, we want a development car. You know, a young talented driver that's coming along. We want two-season veterans. You know, that's really the plan that we have in place and Riley fits that role. We're obviously a growing company. So how we support him and as we evolve as a company is really important.

I feel like we have more of a responsibility to make sure he has the experience around him to help while our cars are on this journey. It's one thing if you're at JGR and you have this deep history and playbook to work off of, but we have to be realistic about our journey and where we are. And within that, I find that the advantage, or what I stumbled into as a competitor in the success that I had, I had the mental game much more under control than I realized, or at least relative to the competitors I was racing against. And, you know, Gordon did such a nice job of bringing me in

and helping me realize that it's not just the job behind the wheel. You know, there are the other aspects of the job. And then you have a responsibility to really take care of yourself so that when you show up at work, you're fully full, focused and dedicated to it. So there's a lot in that. I think the mental game, keeping the big picture in mind, setting achievable objectives and goals each week, each quarter, each year, you know, when you can plot that stuff out, it really helps you, in my opinion, make better decisions in the car. The, from an outsider looking in, the growth of the race team is really

ambitious. Just yesterday I was driving home from South Carolina and rolled up beside one of your hospitality trailers going down the road. And I pulled into, I believe it was Kansas this year, and just right outside the tunnels, this gigantic, you know, fully built out hospitality looking over the third and fourth turn of the racetrack. And I liken it to what you see, a Red Bull or somebody else may be doing at some of the F1 events. It's really robust. I feel like that's got your fingerprints on it. I feel like that this, you know, there's just been a rebrand of the team itself

that's happened over the last several years that you've been a big part of. But the identity that you're trying to create with this team, talk about that a little bit. So that's something I'm super curious about because I didn't know what kind of owner you were going to be. I don't think anybody knew. And you're all over the place physically. You're everywhere. Yep.

You're busy dude. But you also seem to have enough bandwidth to do this properly and do it correctly. So talk about the identity that you want Legacy to have. Talk about when we go to the racetrack and we see Legacy Motor Club, hospitality, and all those things. A lot of teams moved away from some of those things. activating its track and so forth. Yeah, I think we're at an interesting point in time where NASCAR is going to be that next sport to really explode. You know, we're seeing it as charter values were increasing. And when that happens,

you have, you know, various, very serious investors coming in, including private equity. We were fortunate enough to bring in Knighthead Capital and their belief in sports and entertainment. For a long time, they've been separate. And around the globe, they're becoming one. And within that, there's a ton of opportunity. And with their support and then also the strategics that have come in, that's a big part of our plan and building the brand and trying to figure out how to monetize through those moments. All of that is only to service core product. So it may look a little spread out, it may look like a lot, and it is a lot. But we are staffing up accordingly and have made these decisions collectively to feed core product.

Because at the end of the day, I can't go write a check like Mr. Hendrick can to work in a certain area to buy a new tool or whatever it might be. And so sponsorship retention, sponsorship recruitment, building the brand, you know, the other ways that we can help monetize and bring value are going to help us in the short term. But now as the sport has turned to proper franchises, post-settlement, and the evaluation of the race teams continue to go up, there are more interested parties trying to invest. And I think our sport is really kind of at the doorstep of a huge growth cycle that's going to happen. And we're just trying to be positioned to take advantage of that opportunity. And, you know, fans and also CEOs

want hospitality and experiential. And that's why they're traveling all around the world, going to all these different events, not even being at the event. I've been to some different sporting events where parties in events are taking place 10 miles away, but everybody's in the area and they want access and entertainment. And so there's a thread for us to pull on there, but in a smart fashion and doing it the right way. And, you know, we're in our second year of really bringing it to life. Yeah, I went to the F1 race in Miami and I was, I experienced what you're talking about when I was at a casino. And there were hospitality. events happening miles away from the racetrack.

And the entire, probably, I think, you know, 30 square miles of the racetrack was literally the footprint of the event. Yeah. Whereas, you know, with NASCAR races, it's its own property or, you know. Yeah. And so. And I think where that is is a long way away from where we sit now. Yeah.

And, you know, there are some markets where we could be on that higher end. But there's no reason in Martin's. there can't be an awesome tailgate or, you know, some other event that's happening in the bars and local restaurants there in the area. So I really think that our team owners, sponsors, partners, NASCAR themselves, there's a movement here thinking how do we scale and head in that direction and I'm happy to be a driving force behind that. When you just would describe legacy for me then, what is your race team? What is what is the what is the personality of your race team? We are deep in building our culture.

Really, it's been a year in seven or eight months since I've had control of the team. And, you know, I really feel like doing things the right way, building for sustainability, core product first, which is racing. You know, that's our north starts all about performance. We don't make a decision unless it ties back into making cars go faster. might be a decision that serves us in a couple of weeks or it's going to be something that serves us in a couple of years. But we're building something for the long haul, not to just be a flash in the pan and gone. Explains why we've been on this long road to independence and didn't have the alliance with Joe Gibbs racing. So there's a lot of investment for the future.

And we're getting our feet under us now and really getting things rolling. So you just mentioned the lack of the alliance. It was as far as I understood it, there was an opportunity for any team that goes to any manufacturer to sort of adhere to the teacher's favorite student in the class, right? So in this case, it would have been Joe Gibbs Racing. And you can kind of cheat off their paper a little bit, you know, use their tools, use their SIM, use all these different programs and pathways to. to success, for the most part, you guys decided to build from the ground up from scratch a lot of your own tools. Is that correct? That is correct, yeah. And so how long is that process? How, when, and I know you'll probably tell me you're already seeing it, but like, when do

you think you're complete? When do you think you've, like, gotten, gotten that process finished? We're seeing some better results as you're starting to get some traction with some of your tools, but, you know, when do you feel like you've got comparable tools? Yeah. If you think about when NASCAR said, okay, OEs, we want you more involved and you're going to control all the data collection and distribution of data. Not one of them was really prepared and ready to manage that in the body of work that's behind it. So Toyota goes to JGR, Chevy, I think was Hendrick Trackhouse and Childress at once.

and then Ford has Penske. From there, when you're an alliance team paying a substantial fee to have access, each one of those ecosystems have a different way that it's managed and regulated. Through Toyota and JGR, big check, you get full transparency. Amazing. We want to go down our own road and build our own software tool chain and all the things to go with it. Unfortunately, when the data comes off, all these tools and toys that collect data and they go to JGR,

that data goes through a variety of different processes, all driven by the setup of the race car. It would be unfair for us, and we haven't paid anything. So why should we have that direct line of sight? So we've been getting data and raw data, but if you don't have the setup, tire pressures, the bill, all those things that put it under, it's not going to do any good. So on this journey, we have hired up and built a robust Arrow staff that now has earned a right to sit at the table with the Arrow Group.

Our next step, the wheel force transducer side, then drive lines. So we are proving within our Toyota ecosystem that, hey, we're staffing up and we're not going to be standing here looking for handouts. We want to sit at the table and be a part of the process. So we're doing that now. Unfortunately, to start the 26th season, we reverse engineering. into our arrow tools, and then in 26, we had to start all over again. The way they measure their arrow markers and where they put, all that was different. So it's been a lot of stopping and starting, which is tough for the outsiders to see.

But internally, we know what we're fighting for, and again, we're building for the long run. Yeah, that's pretty interesting. It's a lot of it's a way over my head, but I'll walk through the garage and talk to some of the guys that are in the Toyota in the Toyota family, not necessarily direct link to specific race teams, but they'll tell me about some of the gains that you guys are making on bodies and different things, and you'll start to see the results immediately on the racetrack.

And that must be exciting for you, because the way this car is put together, once you sort of understand one component of it, it's like a good chunk of gained speed on the race track. You're only as good as your data because we have so little track time and the track time we have,

we don't have instruments on the cars. So the correlation loop is based on the driver's feel. And so we have our drivers sitting in the simulator and does that feel like the tire? Does the track feel bumpy enough? But over there in the world of JGR,

they have all that data and the setup that goes off of it. So the validity that they have for their tools is it as such a higher rate. Ours is still pretty, pretty coarse right now, and we're trying to dial that in. Riley, you'll be able to come over from having all of that experience, right, racing, kind of getting to peek under the hood a little bit at JGR and obviously all the information that you're able to gain working at 2311.

You're excited to kind of get with some of the newer tools and get with this new organization, this organization that's sort of growing, and you're, you've got to feel as though that gives you some value. You're an asset. You have information and knowledge that they're going to benefit from, that you're going to bring to the table. That's got to be a great feeling for you. Yeah, for sure.

I'm excited to get over there. I'm excited to continue racing. Like I tell Jimmy all the time, this is kind of a far-fetched stream from a kid from Las Vegas, Nevada, to move out to the south and race on asphalt. So I'm just excited to continue to do this. But like you said,

Coming up from the O'Reilly series, you think you know what it takes to work hard to win some races. And then you get paired up with Bubba Wallace and Tyler Redick and Denny Hamlin. And you're like, oh, I don't know what working hard is. And Tyler Redick lives in that sim. He can't watch enough film. And you have Denny Hamlin probably the greatest in our sport right now, feeling what you're feeling. So if you're like, hey, I don't understand what's going on with my steering wheel or my front tires, my front axle, he's going to be like, oh, that's normal, that's not normal.

So all that stuff I learned over the last year and a half, two years is invaluable. And hopefully I can take it and put it to good use with Jimmy and my two teammates next year. You had a really, really difficult season a year ago. This year, things started clicking. You know, you had some really, really strong runs and were able to go out there and go, all right, man, I belong here. How did that make you feel personally? because I think we're

you know listen we're all we all race car drivers have massive egos we're very confident you got to go to the racetrack believe in you're the best one out there and all of those things but privately you know struggling can be very very difficult and what was that like to

finally go to the racetrack and go there it is you know there's that's what I've been looking for or I didn't even know the next gen car could do what this car is doing we kind of heard the same thing I guess I would liken it to Brisco when he left Hoss and went to Gibbs. He's like, well, I didn't know I could ask the car to do this because I didn't know the car was capable of doing this.

You've had these kind of moments this year where we've been able to see just what you're capable of doing. Yeah, I think we've had some good flashes in the pan of speed late spring, early summer, and obviously out last week and a rough weekend at Darlington. But I still don't think I'm to the full potential of the next-gen car. still a little bit right behind where I wanted to be. But I think, honestly, it just boils down to hard work. It boils down to have really good people around you. And I don't take this slightly, but the people at 2311 have treated me tremendously

and really helped me through the awful season last year and surrounding me with even more and better people this year. And I feel like the pace has increased and having good teammates in Bubba and Tyler and having people to lean on when times get rough really, helps. If I, you know, if I were to ask you about what's challenging, what's difficult in the next gen car, what would you, how would you describe it to me as a driver? If I'm going to go out there and drive this car and you're going to go, I'm going to go, man, that's what you're going to have trouble with. Wow. So much. I was just in the bus Saturday, yeah, Saturday night watching

the O'Reilly race at Darlington. And I just remember from two years ago when you get a little loose, you can just countersteered and throttle it out off the turn two. And if you, you can do that in the next-gen car, but if you over slip it by an inch, it's tank swapping head on into the fence. So the margin for air is just so small. There's no yaw, there's no yaw angle at all, which is really difficult for somebody, a young driver. I think a lot of them, my buddies kind of right now in the Cup Series are struggling all of it too, first time, rookie year. And you just drive these stock cars your whole life since you're eight, nine years old. and then you get in this thing, and it's completely opposite of what you've learned your whole life.

So it's a difficult step for sure. I got one for you. How many times have you tested a next-gen car? Never. My first time... Can you imagine that? Never tested a car. You can't test?

Like, our time's coming up. You tested like crazy. Crazy. Yeah. Yeah, I find I was just thinking about that. Like next year, there's going to be a little additional practice. Right. You've got to be pretty.

See, I'm not happy. You're not happy? No, because I wanted. practice last year when I was a rookie and I got 15 minutes warm up to get the engine primed. And now when I'm kind of starting to figure out the feel of my front axle, they're like, okay, the whole field gets an hour practice. And I'm like, no, I wanted that last year, not now. Well, I think that still, you know, with a new team, new, yeah. So who's the team that Jimmy's going to build around you? I don't know yet. We are still assembling the team without a doubt.

Do you have an idea who you want to put in charge? Yeah, we have some options right now. We just want to make sure that the fit is right. And one thing that did hurt us in taking so long to announce was being able to publicly go out and shop, you know, him as the driver of that car. So we're a little behind schedule there, but getting closer. Yeah.

That's exciting to kind of build that team around him. How do you, you know, how do you kind of get the most out of the remaining? racing this year. You know, I mean, you're still learning. You're still seeing opportunity every time you go to the racetracks a chance to get better and learn more. Yeah. I know, I would expect that 2311, Denny and all those guys are going to give you the best

opportunity every single week. Without a doubt. They are first class. And they have been so, so supportive of you to this point. 100%. So how do you, you know, take advantage of the remainder of the season to put yourself in a good spot for the off season? Yeah, just continue to work hard.

There's nine to go, and I look at nine opportunities to get back to where I want to be, and that's to be back in the top 10, getting stage points. I think the month of May and June, our stage points were at a career high, and we had quite a bit. So there's no reason why we can't get back there. And, yeah, I mean, I have nine more opportunities in the 35 with a lot of good friends that I have, and a lot of good teammates and just continue to work hard and build my notebook for next year.

Have you had a chance to talk to, I'm sure you have, but have you had a chance to talk to your future teammates? Eric? Yeah. Yeah, Eric came by the announcement last Thursday, which was pretty awesome, and he's a good dude.

I was kind of one step behind him. I got into Gibbs right as he was kind of walking out of Gibbs. But yeah, I think we're going to try to get some lunch in the next week or two, and build that relationship. Have you and him had a pretty solid relationship on the racetrack up to this point? Yeah, for sure.

Eric's a really respectful driver and haven't really had any run-ins with him, which is a good thing, obviously, as you go to a new team, and he's your teammate. What do you think, you mentioned having, Jimmy, you mentioned having a couple of veterans

and then, you know, your kind of rookie hot shoe. Talk about the veteran that Eric is and what he brings at a table. Yeah, he brings so much. His form of leadership is maybe a little quieter, and it's hard at times maybe to see from the outside. But to see our competition group hanging on every word

that he describes the way he engages with engineering, the mechanical side, his efforts he's put into getting better at Sim just because it's a necessary evil in his honesty around the queuing and in the areas that he feels confident and saying, yeah, that that did help the car. He's been an incredible leader. He's been incredible loyal to, to legacy in a sense. When you think about him being at GMS, first petty, then petty GMS and now with us,

he's been through a lot and he's seen a lot and a lot of different groups of leadership. And through all of that, you know, the way he's carried himself and what he's, he does on race days and getting points and finding where that limit is and rarely stepping over and making a mistake. And we just need to give him better cars. You know, every time we've given him a great car, he has almost won a couple this year for us and really excited for next year and how we know we can take a step up in performance. You mentioned the petty name. We still see Richard integrated into the program. What's it like being able to stand next to him when you're out there promoting and doing your thing.

I think that, you know, Richard, he's pretty amazing dude. Amazing. That he's still in such great shape and still a part of everything, wanting to be a part of everything, wanting to be going to the racetrack and doing everything he's doing. How awesome is it to have him kind of part of the operation? It's incredible. And he's always thinking.

You'll love this. To start the year, he's saying, I need 10 minutes with you. All right, cool. So we sit in the bus, I said, I don't know what this is, but evidently there's all these young people where they cut the cord to watch racing. Whatever that is, let me know how I can help. And those cord cutters, I want to be a part of that. I'm like, okay, so you're talking about digital. I don't know what it is, but I want to do more.

So at his age, coming to the track, always thinking about how we can be better, he's incredible. The first question or two from him never changes, though. And it's why were we slow? How are we going to get faster? And so that racer is really in there still today. I know it. I've been around him a little bit over the last couple of years, and it's so funny because he is matter of fact.

He's like, no, we're not doing that. It has given shit meters broke. He's going to say what he wants to. Yeah, for sure. All right, NASCAR fans, listen up. Xfinity is waving the red flag on internet price hikes, and they're raising the green flag for savings. Now you get to speed and reliable,

Wi-Fi that you need locked in at one price for five years, no surprises, no late yellows, just a straight shot to Victory Lane. And just like that, folks, we've got a winner. I've been using Xfinity Internet for years, and it gives me the speed and reliability that I need for anything we've got going on at the house. Xfinity, imagine that. Let's bring him in the room and get started. There he is. Hey, nice shirt, dear. Back at the table in the studio, we got another guest that showed up. Josh Berry is now in the RB studio here with us. And I guess we're a day after a big announcement for Legacy Motor Club filling out their

roster of three cars next year with the addition of Josh. You know, it's been, it's been an interesting, I would say. say a couple of months for you, Josh, to understand that, you know, number one, you're, you're not going to be back with the Wood Brothers, where are you going to go, where are you going to be? None of us knew. I don't think anybody in the industry was aware of what might be available. And in the last seven weeks, you went on this really impressive run of top 10 finishes that

the Wood Brothers hadn't seen since 1976. And so a lot of people are wondering how that happened, right? I think most people in the industry understand how it happened. But, you know, coincidentally, all the Penske cars started running better as well. But how, you know, just describe this. I mean, this is pretty unprecedented. I don't think that we've really ever seen anything like this where a guy was kind of maybe on the line wondering what the next opportunity might be to being presented something as incredible as this from

Legacy and Jimmy. Yeah, I mean, it's been a whirlwind the last couple months without a doubt. Yeah, obviously, first and foremost, just really thankful for our performance over the last two months, really. I mean, that's what, I mean, truthfully, what saved me, kept me, kept me relevant, gave me, you know, got a lot of our, got a lot of our confidence back and kind of got our group going well. And, yeah, the cars have been really good. And, I mean, that's been a, It's been a big step in the process. But just, yeah, I mean, the emotions of it all, man, it's been a lot to take in. You know, it's funny.

I want to tell the story. So the day that I found out, actually, two people text me. He was one of them, which is funny now. Well, I, sorry, Josh, but I had the same call probably two months earlier than Josh. So it's probably the worst call in all of motorsports. And so I just wanted to reach out and let them know that it'd get better. Yeah. Yeah.

And the second one was Joey. And Joey sent me this big, long text. And he's like, man, I'm summarizing that now. But he's like, man, you know, I know how tough a day this is. But he's like, you know, I believe in who you are. And he's like, I believe, you know, this thing will turn around. And there's going to be something out there that's going to be a great fit for you and better. And let's just say over the last two months, I questioned Joey's text a lot.

It seemed like everything that we were trying to work on would, you know, just never come together. didn't, you know, just didn't line up, didn't work out. And, you know, it took all those things not working out for this to come together, right? And it's just amazing how it's all worked out. And then thankfully that time, you know, we went on this run of, you know, running so well the last two months. And, yeah, it's just been a lot of fun, really. And just, you know, obviously thankful to be with Legacy Motor Club and Jimmy, really excited to work with Riley and Eric and that whole group. And, yeah, I mean, it's going to be a, it's going to be a challenge.

We're going to have to get to work and, you know, keep building this program. But they're definitely on a positive upswing and, you know, hopefully I can add to it. Riley spoke a little bit about this and continue if you can, Riley. But for both of y'all, you know, I'm a huge fan of yours, Josh. So when you go out there and you're, I know you need to get the results, right? And I'm sitting there watching, I know what you're capable of, right? and I'm watching these races, and I'm thinking, damn, he's got a chance at a top five here. Let's, you know, hope it, you know, and you're doing that inside the car.

You're like, I've got to get this result. I've got, I know what car I've got today. I've got to get this finish next week. Same thing. Next week, same thing. You know, you're just kind of piling this up, trying to, you know, wave this flag of, hey, y'all, over here, look at me, what I'm doing. you're you're doing the same thing after last year coming into this year you know you'll have you'll have that flash where it's like all right there it is this is what I can do given the car

this is what I'm capable of did anyone notice you know who saw that um you know talk about that stress that's insanely difficult uh I think that people don't you know we fans myself the industry we watch these races we're entertained where we're either We're either excited about the result or disappointed that it didn't go the way we wanted it to for our driver. But we don't necessarily take a moment to really live how difficult it can be at times emotionally. You're racing, both of you, I think you're racing to prove this out, right, to have this career, right? To earn this opportunity to be here until you decide that it's over. and both of you really literally have been doing that over the last several months.

You know, you finally did it enough to get somebody to notice and somebody to take a chance and put something together around you. Talk about how difficult that is. Yeah, it's extremely difficult, at least for me. Like when you do have a good car, obviously, as you both, all three know, you kind of understand. it in the first five laps of practice. You just get that feel in your ass and your hands, you're kind of doing everything that it wants it to do. And then when the laps are winding down, and you do have an opportunity for a top 10 and top five, and you run so well all day,

and then you come to pit road, and you knock your nose off and a stack up like I did at Richmond, or you have a speeding penalty, and you finish 26. And it's like, wow, I just worked three out three and a half hours for six points. That was kind of brutal. So yeah, the pressure does mount. I feel like at least for me as the race winds down. And that's just when you have to kind of take a step back and understand how you were running and just try to make the most out of the day. Yeah, I mean, for me, for me, I feel like you always have some, there's always pressure in the sport, right, to perform. And even like, or even just the last six weeks, obviously, like I went from, you know, having, you know, we had such a run.

of terrible results that it's completely changed the perception of who I am as a race car driver, right? Like it completely went from, you know, this guy that's, you know, been, you know, that come from the short track ranks, built up through the ranks, had success, won races, and now basically I'm getting treated like I'm a bum, right? Like, just like that, it's just changed, right? And so there was the, so that was the biggest frustration, I think, for me is I'm just like, I don't, like, I felt the pressure of obviously wanting to find an opportunity and wanting to keep racing and I want to do that but I wanted to I just what I wanted more than anything was not to be thought of like that you know however it ends up it ends up but I wanted I felt like that we had

the potential to turn things around and we just needed to I mean we just needed to have have some things go our way we had to be obviously we had to be faster which is the biggest thing right like when you get you take that next step and you're running in the top 10 you're racing with a totally different group right like and that and that helps you stay out of trouble and helps things go easier you know you get better pit stalls and better pit stops and all those things. But I mean, even as I went through, it's like once we had a couple good results, then everybody's like, yeah, well,

that's just because it's a short track. He can't, he only runs good at a short track or whatever. And then, you know, we go to, which most, you know, we started at Indy and then we went, you know, through a couple short tracks. And then you're carrying the pressure of just trying to keep it going. And then there's the whole top 10 streak

that like keeps getting blown way out of proportion, right? It is not blown out of proportion. Well, we're going back to the 60s. And there's all this, We got all this debate about who was driving the car and how consecutive were. And then you're like trying to keep that up. And then even like I told my wife before this weekend, I was like, man, this is the most nervous I've been for a race in a while. Yeah.

And she's like, why? And I'm like, well, now you got the pressure of, you know, well, first we didn't practice or anything. So you're like got the little bit of the uneasiness. How's the car going to feel? How's it going to drive? When you start this race, you have what happened to me last year in that race, which was when we missed the heights to start the race. And I wrecked in the first corner and still never lived that one. down even though it bottomed out all the way through the corner, right? But so you had that. And then plus,

yeah, like this deal coming together at Jimmy. I'm like, man, this is, you know, everybody's kind of knows what's happening now. Like, I don't want to go out here and, you know, I want to make a good impression because now you know that, you know, everybody that that's at Lexi Motor Club is watching my performance and how I do and how I handle it. Now, okay, now he's going to be in that car. Like, how is he going to do now that he knows that. So, I mean, there's, it's always, there's always pressure in this sport. And it's just how managing it, you know, that is the most important, no matter what, you're not going to get away from it, whether you're winning every week or you're trying to prove yourself,

there's always the pressure of trying to handle that and just, so I feel like that that's something for me that I'm used to, because we've just always had it. It's always felt like I've had to race for my job and race for my career, and I think just learning to navigate through that helps you when, you know, times are really, that you're tough like this season are that you're not, I'm not changing anything, right? I'm confident enough of myself that I haven't changed

anything about my approach or what I'm doing and not overthinking it, just trying to stick it out and just turn things around is what we're trying to do. So wearing my team owner hat for a minute. This is something I haven't shared with them. I was in their shoes trying to make it to cup and, yes, ended up in the perfect storm. But we were great friends back then. And you know all the struggles that I was dealing with and trying to keep a job and trying to find that opportunity to go to go cup racing. And so where I feel I can help them is I've been there. In addition, the team is in a

very similar space as well. And so people that are fighting for their job, always under pressure, and also starting with a new company and having that opportunity to build a team, that was something that was so special and I think such a big part of the 48th success, we were all putting our fingerprints on that car number. And yes, there was an established system. But, But within legacy and what we're trying to build, everybody's there together. And, you know, Eric, a veteran and a builder, another builder, the young guy to bring along. So the pieces of the puzzle are there and we're also aligned. You know, from a team owner's standpoint, I feel like I have the same pressure they do trying to perform and be out there.

They certainly feel that inside the car. And, you know, through the end of this year and into next year and as we go racing, that's an area where we're all going to bond and be aligned. and make sure that we meet our objectives and go out on the track and drive, you know, with the right objectives in play and not looking for the walk off home runs. I mean, if we get lucky and really connect with one, we got it, cool. But that's not our objective. We're building and we're going to build together. What was the reaction within the organization to the idea of bringing Josh in? Very, very strong reaction.

The way we operate and how close we all are as a team, you know, not an easy decision with John Hunter. but we are where we are now and where Josh can bring in a lot of experience in building maturity, know how these things that a 35-year-old can bring, it's just different. And having two veterans in a sense. And then Riley is the younger development driver coming along is the environment we wanted to create. Josh, what do you think your biggest gain is in the, you know, in just a little short time you've had racing in the Cup series? Where do you feel like you've made the most improvement? I think just understanding how to manage the races.

I think that's something that takes a while to develop and just understanding how to race when you have a 20th place car versus how to race when you have a top 10 car, top five car. I think just learning to manage all that is something that takes a while to develop and just the race craft. And you just kind of got to earn the respect of the guys around you and just race with them and kind of build off that. And because to me, that's such a key part of it. It's just, you know, on the bad day, you know, it's easy to lose a lot of those guys respect on the bad days when you're struggling. And then I feel like if you do a good job of managing those days, then when you have the nights like we had Sunday where we're really fast, like that's when you get the break. and stuff here or there, right from the guys that you've shown respect for. So just managing all that.

Because, I mean, really from the start, I felt fairly comfortable in the next-gen car. So I don't know that, you know, fundamentally, like, learning how to drive the car, I haven't really felt that, like, I've had to make the shift of how I approach racing. I think it's just learning how to manage the races and just learning how to manage your weeks and try to, you know, you have to walk the fine line of trying to lead your team, but at the same time trust the people that you got working for it for you and let them do their jobs. But you also have you're also the, you know, you're the quarterback, right? I mean, you've got to lead them.

And just still learning how to do that effectively is, you know, a big part of it. What about finishing this year on a strong note, you know, how important was that to you? Because I know that you built relationships with these guys you're racing with on a 21 car. I know you've kind of checked the box of, hey, man, we've proven that we can do this with the last several weeks. But how important is it to continue and end on a good term? Yeah, no, I mean, it goes back to what I was talking about earlier with the pressure. I mean, obviously, now that we've done it and we've been on the success run, I mean, now you hold the pressure of trying to keep that up and keep finishing the year strong.

And obviously, there's still a lot to race for. I mean, obviously, there's a lot of financial implications and more we can move the car up in points, and we've gained a ton of ground in a short period of time. So just continuing to work on that and just see how far we can get. I mean, I think, I mean, remember a couple weeks ago, we kind of said, hey, you know, we need to try to get to 25th and points. And we got to 25th point Sunday. So now we're like, well, I guess we've got to move the goalpost again, right?

So just trying to finish it out. And like I said, I am very appreciative of those guys because, I mean, they, you know, the biggest thing that I wanted out of this too for myself was that I didn't want this situation and how it ended. I didn't want those around me to think less. of me after we got done. Right. Now, regardless of what the results were, I wanted them to think more of me, how I handled it, how I was the person to work with, how we race.

And the last thing I wanted was it to go just off the rails to the point where they're like, man, I'm so glad to get rid of that guy. You know what I mean? And I feel like, you know, I feel like I've done a good job managing that. And I wanted it to, you know, I wanted to end in a way that everyone around me thought, man he regardless of that situation he handled that well and in you know we stayed we you know we've stayed together as a group and believe in each other and just have just been consistent and just putting into work and trying to get better and I felt like finally we're seeing the results of that

and now we got you know nine more races to keep it up. Riley's had a lot of time to you know kind of get to know the future workplace this has been just this deal for you come together. in just a couple of weeks, I would assume. So, you know, what's your, what are you excited about, aside from just driving fast race cars? What's exciting about this opportunity? Well, I think, first off, it seems like, you know, there's a lot of great people there, which is a huge part of what, you know, the sport takes to be successful is just the people side of it.

And it seems like there's everyone I've met so far has been really good to me. And obviously, I think, can bring a lot to the table. So just getting to know those people and kind of work. through what we need to do to get me comfortable as soon as from the start try to get all that aligned where we can hit the ground running is kind of what we're looking at but i mean i think the biggest thing is just the you know obviously with jimmy's leadership and just the trajectory they're on of improving it seems like they got a lot of great people in place and i think that they're willing to rely on me in some areas to try to bring some of the knowledge that i've had over the last

couple of years to hopefully you know keep pushing that forward and i'm excited about that that. I think, you know, I had, you know, I had lunch with Eric last week and we had, I thought that went really well. And it just seems like that me and him are going to get, be a really good fit together about, you know, of just trying to, it's like I said, it's so much about we're the quarterbacks in this deal, right? Like, we got to make the, we got to help push the, push the football down the field, right? We got to help these teams and you got to, you know, try to help them get better. And, and, and, um, so yeah, I'm excited, excited for that part of it. And, you know, ready, ready to get going.

I was going to say one thing that got us really excited about both these guys. With analytics, there's so much that you can dig in on. And there's a lot of areas that we look, but two areas we spend a lot of time is performance and a lot of layers that go with it and then execution. Both of them, year over year, from a performance standpoint, where they qualify versus spots gained, all the matrix to go with that, both have done an exceptional job. The execution side has been more of the problem. One thing we've done a really good job with is executing at Legacy.

That's pit stops or strategy, you know, a variety of different things play into that. So for them both, you know, performance, you know, that's a harder one to fix, but the execution side we feel really, really good about. And so I know that people think maybe Legacy chose to move in a direction with Josh because of what's happened here in the last five or six weeks. It's really the data and the body of work over the last three years as we dive in and really look at that. that figure out how it fits into our program. Both of these guys are a perfect fit for us. Yeah, I felt like that this decision with Josh wasn't on a whim of like, man, we're going to make change, what do we do? Who do we grab? Right. Talk about diving into that. I mean, you know, how, how wide of a net did you cast? What did you, what did you see that made you drill down

to Josh? We're always looking and trying to understand where, driver contracts, you know, laps. And then you also have a manufacturer contract. So there's, there's two that you got to play with there. And it's way different from when we were driving. You really need to grow your own talent now. And, you know, that's a big part of where we see things going forward in the future for us. Yes, we had an auto renewal, John Hunter, and that happened, I guess, in the summer. But through the, you know, that moment to when we finally made the decision, you know, a lot of internal pressure, a lot of pressure in general to potentially make a change. And through all the work that we've done with analytics, his numbers, Josh's

numbers stand out in so many categories. In the top three and many, top five in most, all performance driven, the execution side, you know, has been that weaker spot and kind of explains what's happened during the uh during that stretch you know the summer for uh as an example um and again we feel like that's an area when we put ourselves on the same grading our execution is higher than our performance we still have work to do there but with great collaboration amongst the drivers eric and josh although they haven't spent a lot of time together those that know both very well are like these two dudes are going to be so good together and pushing each other um so holistically it just, it needed to happen as uncomfortable as it is. And of course, we're going to treat

John Hunter as we should going into next year and handle our contractual duties to them, but, you know, made that decision and made the change. When do you feel like that you guys can finally start to get to work? I think now, honestly. I mean, there are some layers with his Ford relationship that will prevent that with Riley. We're open and can go. It's just really not messing up you know, the years that they need to finish up and the work they need to do with their two companies. But I know Josh has already talked about the day after Homestead being in the legacy office working already. So guys ready to go. How are you going to build the team around Josh?

You've been tight-lipped on the, on Rally's deal. Yeah, I mean, Eric's team, you know, largely, if not, completely intact with the 42 and 84, now that we've announced both drivers, we want to make sure that the alignment of people are right. There could be some shifting and moving around, but getting both in the building, getting time with our people, finding out where those relationships matter,

is at the end of the day, the thicker the rulebook gets and the closer the cars are on performance, the difference maker are people. And, you know, I found myself in a situation with canals. We had a deep friendship, and his level of accountability on me, was something I didn't really like, but then I realized I was getting the performance out of it.

So it's not always like, yeah, me and this individual get along so great. We need to get to know each other all better and figure out how we can get the most out of one another and how those teams really get assembled and put together. Yeah. Do you think you let Josh have some influence? Without a doubt. Yeah. Absolutely.

The other example I always use is you in LaTart. Oh, yeah. I mean, he was the perfect fit for you. Yeah. And then layered up with the engineering behind Steve in different areas. And so there are many ways to get the job done. And I just want to be intentional about how we do that with both of them. Awesome.

Man, I'm excited about this. I, you know, we've known that Riley was probably going over there for a long time. And, you know, you're a great friend, Jimmy. And it's been fun watching you, you know, become the owner you're becoming. I don't think any, like I said earlier, I don't think any of us really knew. exactly what to expect. Or myself. Yeah.

I found my lane here, but it's been a journey and respect to you for what you've built through your Riley team, I should say now. I have a much better understanding of all the work and effort. And thank you for friendship through all this. Well, it's been cool, man. And I'm hoping that this is, you know, a great new chapter for your team. I'm excited for Riley, excited for Josh. These guys are in great hands.

and that team is going to continue to just continue to gain traction as those tools get better and all the right people were put in all the right places. You guys have made a ton of new hires over the last 12 months to scale up. Yeah, we're on a way to 200 people. Yeah, that's wild. We need a new building. We've outgrown the one we're in. You guys are going to get in the new building.

We are, yeah. When is that happening? We'll move in winter of next season. We don't want to displace or disrupt. what we have going on and then Windows construction ever end on time. But we'll have a good. Do you know where it is? Yes, in the Mooresville Business Park East. So not far from here actually. Right. In the Morseville area, incredible building. We're starting the build out phase. Now we've laid out the floor plan and then have the room to expand if needed. But a lot of great things that we can bring in house, control our own

destiny, continue to get stronger, continue to grow. Awesome. Thank you all for being here, man. Appreciate it. Thank you. It's going to be awesome. I know we wish the season could start tomorrow, but we got a good chunk of racing left for the end of the year comes, and good luck to y'all,

and I'll hopefully see you back on the show maybe before the end of the season. Thanks, Paul. Appreciate it. All right, guys. Hey, this is Dellenhart Jr. And for all the latest Dale Jr. download gear, including the I'm old drink some beer T-shirt that we've been talking about here around the office, head over to shop.

Dirtymomedia.com for all. all the latest merch. All right, everybody. So that was pretty awesome to have Jimmy Johnson in the studio, seven-time champion. We'd love to get him back

so we can dive a little bit more into just his life and his growth as an owner and some of the things he's got going on. But with respect to, you know,

wanted to respect Riley and obviously Josh as well at the table. And stick to business, but pretty, impressive pretty impressive what legacy is turning into and what they continue to do and I don't think that they're even close to where they want to be and where they want to go

and the growth that they want to have as Jimmy and as we talked about they scaled up hiring multiple individuals for different positions they're tooling up their physical programs and race teams at a pretty rapid rate. So, and the speed is there at times where they really see what they're capable of and see them improving in little chunks. And I know that they want to try to get to where they can start to have those results every single week on the series.

But I like the driver lineup a lot. I think that Josh Barry and Eric Jones are quite similar, very blue collar, hardworking, know their race cars, can fix and work on their race cars, understand when they look at the car what they're looking at, what the part is, how it works. And so I think it's extremely helpful as a team owner, crew chief engineer to have a driver with some sense of what's going on under the hood. And they both, you know, they both have a great bit of history and have been with different teams to where they can, you know, bring a lot to the table. Riley has a, you know, a lot more to extract, a lot more growth to obtain.

So there's a lot of potential there with him. And he's shown this year what he's capable of doing when given a really good race car. So he's got, confidence rolling into this deal. The team's got confidence that they can put things around him to where they can find that speed and pace that he's wanting to have every single week. So it's going to be really, really interesting watching how they perform next year.

I would expect that, you know, you're going to see those high moments. You're going to see those bright spots. But that team is still, you know, in a phase of putting it together and get. getting all the cylinders where they're firing at the right time. So, yeah, I think it's great. I'm happy for Josh just as his friend to see him get an opportunity like this. You know, I think that I would liken it to when I was at HMS and I got the opportunity to move into the shop with Jimmy.

it wasn't enough to be on the same piece of property as the 48 team. Man, if you got an opportunity to get in the building beside them, to have your car set up exactly right beside Jimmy's car, to be able to look at the interior, the suspension, anything you wanted to, and compare and contrast and, try to make things similar if you needed to or wanted to. It was just really, really nice. And so, you know, Rowley and Josh both kind of get to, you know,

get up close with Jimmy and pick his brain and take the advice that he's going to be giving and direction that he's going to be giving and setting expectations. Jimmy's, I wouldn't say Jimmy's conservative or aggressive. He's a realist and he understands, you know, what he, what he thinks his team's capable of, what it should go out and try to achieve on a weekly basis, and he'll be clear in the directive and what he expects those guys to do. So that would be a lot of fun, I think, as a driver to be able to be led by a guy with that much success. Jimmy is super motivated to, he said it.

He feels kind of the same pressure of the drivers feel. He feels that pressure as an owner to go out there and prove that he can do this well. So I'm excited about it. I'm looking forward to all that next year. But we got a lot of racing left before this season's over with. And it's interesting to see how it turns out for both Josh and Riley and how they might be able to end the season on a high note. Don't forget about Arby's new meat and three bucks right here in the Arby's studio.

We've got one ourselves. You get more meal for your money at Arby's. We have the meats. We've had a great show today. Thanks for tuning in and checking us out. And we'll see you tomorrow. Check out Dirtymo Media on Instagram, Facebook, X, and TikTok.