Determined Society with Shawn French | Adversity & Mindset - How to Lead Your Family in a Broken World: Larry Hagner’s Blueprint

Episode Date: November 21, 2025

In this episode of The Determined Society, host Shawn French sits down with Larry Hagner, the founder of The Dad Edge, author, coach, and the voice behind the #1 fatherhood podcast in the world.Larry opens up about faith, marriage, parenting, and the evolution of modern masculinity. From raising teenagers in the age of social media to staying grounded as a husband, to battling imposter syndrome while writing his book, Larry shares the honest truth behind becoming a legendary father.They discuss the pressures men face today, how to build emotional safety in the home, and why prioritizing marriage is one of the greatest gifts you can give your children. Their conversation unpacks purpose, childhood wounds, connection, and the lifelong pursuit of being a present parent in a distracted world.If you're a father striving to grow, a husband looking to reconnect, or simply someone who wants to lead with more integrity and clarity, this conversation will hit home. Key Takeaways-Leading your family starts with leading yourself — in faith, discipline, and humility.-Children feel safest when they witness a strong, connected marriage.-Social media may amplify chaos, but intentional parenting neutralizes the noise.-Imposter syndrome fades when you focus on obedience, not perfection.-Presence isn’t about time quantity — it’s the quality of connection your kids feel.-Legendary fatherhood is built daily through faith, conversation, and consistent action. Connect with me :https://link.me/theshawnfrench?fbclid=PAZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAaY2s9TipS1cPaEZZ9h692pnV-rlsO-lzvK6LSFGtkKZ53WvtCAYTKY7lmQ_aem_OY08g381oa759QqTr7iPGALarry Hagnerhttps://www.instagram.com/thedadedge/ Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

As a man of faith, a husband, and a father. And in today's world, we have political opposition, we have assassinations happening on soil. How hard is it to be a present father and lead from the front in times like this? If you really look at human history and like all the things that have happened, it's been chaotic since the beginning of time. Like, this is really not new. It's new to us because we've never experienced it. When Harry Truman dropped the atomic bomb, like, you probably think the end of the world is going to come.

more like when JFK got shot. The massive difference now is it's in our face because of social media. When have you ever been able to see a live assassination? I mean, that came across our feeds, and we had no choice. Now the media is shoving it in our faces and in our kids' faces. Now, how are you helping your children navigate the world? Because social media is suffocating, dude. This is going to be an awkward conversation.

What's up, guys? We're back. And today I have Larry Hagner, founder. and host of the Dad Edge podcast, an author and a friend. This man was my first ever big guest I ever had on my show. And I think now is actually the third time you've been on. And I'm happy to bring this conversation to you guys because he's someone that believed in me early on.

And I love how great of a father he is. And I know when people are fake and when they're really living what they speak about. And I've had the opportunity to get to know Larry over the last three or four years. and everything he does from the standpoint of being a great husband and a present father really has made an impact on me. And I know it's making it with his audience and the people that he coaches and consults with. And he has the number one fatherhood podcast on the platforms. And it's just a great honor to finally meet you in person, but to have you on for the third time. Like, what's wrong with you three times? I know, right? I feel so honored. You know,

being on your show three times. It's crazy, man. And yeah, we were talking about, before we got started today, but it's just like, you know, you see people online for so long, and you're like, we've met in person, right? And then you meet them in person, you're like, oh, wait, no, we haven't. It's like, this is the first time we met in person, though we've, we've known each other for so long. It's just surreal for me because, you know, when I started, like, when I message you, that was like when I first figured out, I can upload things to Zoom or do, like, Zoom interviews and then upload them to, I think it was Anchor. Oh, my gosh. Yeah. Yeah. I'm like, wow, I could actually have people on. And, you know, I never thought

you would even respond. And then you responded while you were on the stair climber. He was out of breath, by the way, but he was preparing for a show. And it's just so cool years later to be sitting here with you and having you fly out here to see me and to have coffee before, but just get to connect in person and bring you to my audience again as a great honor, man. Well, man, I'm honored to be here. And this, I mean, I think it's amazing.

just and just some kudos to you. Like just seeing how your brand, your podcast has exploded and just like the hazing people that you've brought on the show like, you know, William H. Macy, you know, I went to high school with John O'Leary. Like, John O'Leary's the man, dude. Oh my gosh. It's crazy. And the crazy thing about it is a side note about John.

So I've known John, you know, for over 30 years because we went to high school. We were in the same class. And, you know, the guy who played John in the movie. nailed it. Like I was just like just I couldn't believe what I was watching. Oh, you're the kid? Yeah, yeah, really.

Yeah. That's wild. Yeah, had the voice, the hair, everything. It's crazy. You know what's funny? Because I remember when I was working at paychecks and you know, we were talking to Dan before,

I was looking for this purpose or this spark, right? And I was walking around the bookstore one day, just trying to find a book. And I said to myself, like, why am I even looking for a book? I'm not going to finish it because of my ADHD. And I was about to walk out and I saw this book that said, on fire. I go, I need to be on fire.

I've got a lot of stuff going on right now. I need to be able to perform. And I picked this book up because I thought it was going to be this massive motivational story. And it was, but it was completely different. And then years later, right, I have the opportunity to interview William H. Macy on his role of Jack Buck in the film that was based on John O'Leary's career. then to have John O'Leary on, and that book actually helped me through a lot of stuff. And I'm like, if this guy that pretty much was set on fire by himself, with a zero percent chance to live, like, I can surely go out and execute things in my day and felt my purpose. And then you message me and were like, dude, I went to school with John O'Leary.

I'm like, what are the odds that the book that got me started was John O'Leary, but also you had some connection with and you were my first real guest? That's wild. It's kind of like, it's the movie Crash where like everybody's living separate lives, but they're sort of connected in some way, shape, or form. It's kind of weird, but yeah. It is kind of weird, man. But, but dude, I want to, I want to reintroduce everything you do to the audience. Like, you just wrote a new book, and I do want to talk about that. But I look up to you as, as a man of faith, a husband, and a father. And in today's world, it is super noisy. We have political opposition. We have assassinations happening on

soil. How hard is it to be a present father and lead from the front in times like this? Yeah, I mean, that's a great question. Yeah, I mean, you know what's really interesting, though, is like, so I have really strong political beliefs, but I'm not public with them, and I'll tell you why. I'm not public with my political beliefs, even though they're very, very strong because I never want a man to look at the podcast and be like, oh, that's a Republican podcast. That's a conservative podcast. It's a liberal one. The one common ground that we have is we're dads, you know,

and that's always the way that I've wanted to be. But, yeah, I actually had this conversation with my 19-year-old because my 19-year-old was like, dad, he's like, I feel like the world is just, and he's got very strong political views too. He's like, I feel like the world is just so uncertain right now and it's just crazy right now. And I was like, you know what?

It is. You know, so it's like validating that for them. I'm like, yeah, it is. You know, it's like, I'm trying to hide that. But at the same time, like, conversation I had with them. I was like, you know, though, Ethan, I was like, if you really look at human history and, like, all the things that have happened, like, it's been chaotic since the beginning of time. Like, this is really not new. It's new to us because we've

never experienced it. But I was like, when Harry Truman dropped the bomb, like the atomic bomb, like, can you imagine waking up the next morning knowing that the president of United States just dropped a bomb on an enemy? Like, you probably think the end of the world is going to come. Or like when JFK got shot or like things like that. that, I was like, really bad things have happened over the years. And I was like, and it's just so happens that we're experiencing the chaos right now that quite frankly in the past have. But I think it's really just, I don't want to say normalizing it because, but at the same time, validating that like, you know, yeah, it is chaotic. But at the same time, it's, it's really always been

that way. It's interesting. We share the whole political thing. Like I don't bring it to my platform because I want to be for everybody. I'm truly a uniform. right? I don't want anybody to look at me or look at my show and be like, that's not for me. I can't listen, nor can I be on it. So I commend you for that. Because in today's landscape, everybody's wanting somebody to choose a side. Yeah. And we've dug our heels and like, I'm not doing that. I'm going to be me. But going back to that conversation you have with Ethan, you know, the massive difference now is it's in our face because of social media. And that to me, I think, is the big common denominator. Like, when have you ever been able to say?

see a live assassination. I mean, that came across our feeds, and we had no choice. You used to have to be able to play. Now the media is shoving it in our faces and in our kids' faces. Now, my kids don't have phone yet. They don't have social media. But how are you helping your children navigate the world? Because social media is suffocating, dude.

It can be. So, you know, with my older kids, like, I mean, so obviously I have an adult son and I have almost another adult son. So my 17-year-old will be 18 here in just a month. And, you know, so for them, like, they're on social media. They see things. The fascinating thing that I see, like, we have a lot of conversations around what we see, what's happening, and that kind of thing. You know, but it's almost like this generation is almost so used to it.

They don't know any other way. And I think this sounds really odd to say, but I think for us, it's more uncomfortable because we didn't grow up with that. Like we didn't grow up with this at all. Like in fact, like this is so new to us. And we think like, well, this must be so new to them. But if you really think about it, they don't know life any other way. Like they really, really don't. Like so seeing all this stuff to them is super common.

But it still requires, I think, a conversation. Yeah. Right. And for us, like, you know, no matter what political side or the things that are going on in the world, like with my family, the thing that we always, our foundation is faith. So like if it's if it's not biblical, then it's not truth, period. Like, and that's the filter that we run things through. And I think, you know, I'm in a Bible study every single day with my oldest son.

So we read a chapter of the Bible day and we reflect on it. And we look and we don't miss a day. And we look at those verses and we always compare it to like what's happening in the world. And it's like, and the similarities of things that even happened, you know, when Jesus was here, they're still here. And it's fascinating because anything biblical and faith-based will always point you back, I think, to the truth. And like when you're seeing everything on social media, it's a lot of noise. And you don't know how to filter through it. But we always use our faith and the Bible is like this, you know, you might see this, but you filter it through this.

And then that's where the truth comes out. That story right there, I picked up on something that I already knew about you, but I want to address this for the audience's sake. You're not just a dad. You're an active parent. you're an active father. Those times that you're spending with Ethan and going through the Bible every day, that's building relationship. That is building understanding.

That is helping him through the world. Did you, I mean, I don't know much about your childhood, but did you have that growing up? Not at all. I mean, I grew up Catholic, so it was like, who's kind of like the guilt and the buttons were used a lot. Like, I remember, like, if I missed church on Sunday, my grandmother, like, literally told me I was going to hell. Like, I mean, that's how she was.

That's how she was raised. She's like, that's a mortal sin. You're going to go to hell unless you go to confession. I'm like, well, it's severe. But, you know, so like there was a lot of levers pulled that was like more guilt versus like, you know, an invite to a conversation, if you know what I mean? So, no, I didn't grow up with that. And the funny thing was is my faith journey didn't even really start until 2019,

which was really, really fascinating. So you'll appreciate this because it kind of... It was like two years before I met you. Yeah, yeah, it was. So like I had... So, like, I was, I think it was like right around. 2018, like Dad Edge was was really starting to blow up. Like that was the year that we really, you know, got big. And I remember like, I remember, and I remember getting a bit of an ego

about it. Like, oh, like, look, this is awesome. Right. And it's like, and I remember like posting things online that were more like just absolutely in your face. Like, and I would use language and stuff like that. Like I kind of like had this like persona like Andy Fricela. Dude, I fell into that, dude. I was the same way. Yeah, absolutely. It's like, I, I can get more people's attention if I yell, scream and say, you know, say curse words. And I'll never forget, I had this, this friend of mine who's 10 years ahead of me in life. And I've always looked at him as like just a mentor. And he messages me one day and he's like, hey, you got time for coffee?

And I'm like, sure. And so I met him. And as soon as I walked into the coffee shop, I was like, this is going to be an awkward conversation. He just knew what you felt. I felt it. I felt like something does. The energy. Yeah, it felt like I could tell, like right when I saw him, I was like, he's going to

talk to me about something serious. And I got the feeling like I was in trouble. So we're talking for like 45 minutes, just small talk. And I finally look at him. I was like, all right, Brian, why'd you ask me to coffee? I feel like you want to talk to me about something. And he's like, he's like, he's like, Larry, he goes, I've been watching you online. I'm obviously a huge fan of your show. He goes, I've noticed that there's been a turn and how you're talking and the things you're posting. He's like, you know, let me just ask you. He's like, do you believe in using that kind of language, you know, when you're talking about like your topics? And I'm like, well, you got to get people's attention sometimes. I was just very kind of egotistical about it. And he's just like,

he goes, well, would you want your son to talk like that? And would you want your son to talk like that to my daughter if he was dating my daughter? And I was like, I don't know what it was about that. But it kind of like, pissed me off to be honest. Yeah, of course he did. And I was like, I was like, no, I wouldn't want that. I was like, but, you know, sometimes you need to say things to get people's attention because it's really noisy out there. He's like, yeah, but there's a way to go about it. He's like, what's your relationship with Jesus Christ and I looked at him and I was like here we go right I was like I was like I was like I I was like I go to church I was like I pray I was like he's like yeah but do you have a relationship with him and I was like he's like do you ever read your Bible and I'm like and I was just getting irritated at that

point and I was like I don't know I was like I and I kept saying things like I'm a good person like I'm a good person I try to do the right thing he's just like that's not you know basically he's like, that's not enough. So I got on my car and I just remember being so pissed off. And I was pissed because he was right. Yeah, man. He was dead on. Yeah, dead on. And that's what made me angry. And I think two days passed, I remember sending him an audio, thanking him for having the courage to sit me down and challenge. You know, and I was just like, you know, here's the deal, man. I don't have a good relationship with Christ. I don't know much about the Bible. I'm totally overwhelmed by it. Like, I checked the box. I like literally, I just totally told them everything.

And then I got this invite from him and the invite said Operation Timothy. And I was like, what is this? So Operation Timothy is a is an online Bible study where a mentor, Paul, takes a Timothy, me through a two year mentorship of a Bible study where we get together. We got together every other Wednesday for 90 minutes. I had homework every single time and I had to basically get into my Bible and answer these questions online that just helped me reflect. And I'll tell you, man, that two years totally changed my life because I was like, I had someone who was guiding me and helping me understand the word so it didn't feel so overwhelming. And I just fully gave myself to it and haven't stopped since. And it's just been awesome. That's amazing because

something I struggle with, I mean, to be fully transparent, I'm also a believer. But I don't spend enough time in the word, right? I know that Christ is my savior. I fully am aware of that, but I don't spend enough time with him. And my buddy, Matthew Haddon, he said to me one day, are you spending as much time with Christ as you are building your platform? And I was so mad. And I held it in. I'm like, no, no, I'm not. But dude, like, this is how I feed my family. That ego kicks in, right? And you're like, bro, I'm trying to survive here. This is a hard world to live in. And I'm not talking about the world. I'm talking about this world. This show, this industry is a very difficult one because you're always, it's always moving.

And so I have a hard enough time slowing down, making that time. I'll do it for two days. And then it'll slip. So if you were talking to me, which you are, and then to the audience who is also having this little bit of an issue, how do you slow it down? How do you break it down into chunks to where you can dive in and make it digestible and then grow from that point. I honestly, the biggest game changer for me is doing it with my kid. So like, you know, accountability is key. You know, and left to my own vices, I probably wouldn't read the Bible every day. I probably wouldn't.

Kind of like you, I'd get busy or I'd get distracted. I'd do something else. But knowing that I have to sit down on my son every single day and we read the chapter and we discuss it and we unpack it, that accountability is key. So like, for me, it's like, it's absolute accountability. So like, I never want to look my son in the eye and be like, I got really busy today. You know, I mean, there are times we crack open that Bible at like 1130 at night,

you know, like right before bed because we're smoked, we're tired, you know, and it's just like, we didn't do it yet today. So let's just go ahead and do it. And let's take at least 10 minutes, you know, something like that. But accountability for sure. Yeah, that's good. I've been thinking about doing it with my wife. Yeah.

You know, because I think that, you know, in a cornerstone of a marriage, I think it's super important because we share that faith. And a lot of times, you know, once it gets to be the kids get down, you know, the game. You've got four energetic boys. I've got a boy and two girls. By the time we get them down, everybody's down by 830, I need to disconnect. Like, I'm like, I'm TV. Like, I need silence.

I just need to consume because I'm so overwhelmed through the day. and I just feel like those moments are moments that are being missed where I can get closer to my wife and Christ. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's a, you know, it's one of those things where believe it or not, I feel you on that one because like I too, like when when all the kids are in bed, like I have never, my kids

joking me all the time. They're like, at 9 o'clock, like what happens to you? And I'm like, I'm dead. Yeah. Like I'm dead tired. Like I, sometimes I get like, no kidding around. This happened three nights ago. We were sitting there as a family watching a movie and it was like 8.45 at night.

I was sitting on the floor with my back up against the couch. And my wife was like kind of like just scratching the back of my neck. And I literally just, I literally fell asleep like this. Like just with my head like to the side. So but I will say this. The cool thing about like we always look at something like that is like I have to go do something again. Like, you know, but if you and it takes effort and it kind of feels heavy when I'd rather just, you know, you know, chill out and do it. But when you really think about it, when you're reading the Bible,

especially like with your wife, it's like we're still consuming. Yeah. You know, but you're just consuming something very different. And then the cool thing about that is usually it's like a really fruitful conversation and connection that comes out of it too. That's really cool, man. That's really cool. Like I always love conversations with you, dude. I feel like we should just do a show together. Just like freaking do it constantly, man, because there's always so much value. I mean, And I always go back to this. You know, we'll get to your book in a second, but I always get back to being a father in this time.

It's just so, it's so hard. One of the things that I struggle with, like I remember having this conversation this morning with my wife, hey, you know, Bobby's game got canceled. So I'm going to keep everybody at school. They're going to do their homework. Then I'm going to come home. And then I'm going to take a lean to the gymnastics.

So you're going to study with Bobby on science to make sure he has his elements a periodic table of whatever it is right can you do that i'm like yeah i could do it i go but then what about dinner i got to make dinner and she was well you we got to figure it out it's so hard because it's like when you're doing your daily work and then that's not your real job right like when when the kids get in the audience i'm getting somewhere with this it's really hard because at that time by the time they come through the door i'm like i'm freaking exhausted. Yeah. And then the next three, four hours are even more intense because those are my kids, you know? And so for fathers and mothers out there that are struggling with this XYZ after

school, like how do you get through that stay present? Because to me, that's still a challenge. I think it's always going to be a challenge. I mean, it's definitely a challenge for me. I've talked about this on my own podcast, but like I think this might surprise people. But I have a a very hard time playing with my kids. Dude. Yeah. Oh, okay. Touch on this, please.

Because I feel so guilty. My kids come home that my kids are in prep school. So it's not just like public school where they come home. Homework takes 25 minutes and we can go throw a ball. I never get to spend time throwing a ball with my son. I feel like I'm failing him. Yeah. Yeah.

No, I hear you, man. And, you know, when it comes to like, you know, balancing like this, like, so your kids are in prep school. So I'm sure the workload is huge. It's ridiculous. And, you know, school can be a huge workload. It's no different than like our workload. And one of the reasons, and you might be the exact same is like, it's not that I don't want to play with my kids.

It's that I feel this inner battle. Like I'm just like, well, I could go play catch with you or, but maybe I should not be doing this other thing over here. Like shouldn't I be helping with dinner or do the dishes or maybe shouldn't I do something with work or like just to provide, do something else to move the needle somewhere else? and it's not that I don't want to play with them. It's like I always feel like I should be doing something that is going to move the needle somewhere else. And what I don't, what I always have to remind myself is playing with my kids

is a massive needle mover, right, for them. And the funny thing is, I know myself well enough that, you know, when my kids are like, hey, can we go outside? That first part of me is like, we can, but I was just getting ready to do this thing over here, right? but the cool thing about saying yes to when your kids want to play whether you want to or not or whether you feel like you have the bandwidth or not or the time is that your kids will

always remember that dad most of the time said yes they will always remember also if dad always said no that I interviewed this guy rock Thomas I don't know if you've if you've never interviewed rock I will connect you to rock I'm one of the most craziest stories I've ever heard in my life but basically um this guy he had zero relationship with his dad growing up. Like his dad only worked and he was an only child and all he wanted to do is play ball with his dad. And he just, his dad would always blow up at him and be like, I don't have time for ball.

Do you know how much it, how much work it takes to put food on the table in this house? You'll know one of these days. And he's like one time when I was 11 and same age as, you know, as Bobby and Lawson. He's like, when I was 11, I asked my dad on like a Tuesday or Wednesday, like can we, can we play this Saturday. Can we play? Can we play catch? And my dad said, yes. And he was like for days, I was so excited. And I went into my dad's office with my glove. And I was like, and he, even the way he asks, it's like, dude, it's like you almost get emotionally. He's like, hey, hey, dad, because he was kind of nervous. Like dad was going to say no. He's like, hey, dad, he's like, so, you know, today's Saturday,

can we go out and throw the ball today? And he was like just real giddy and his dad stood up. And he's So like, I don't have time for that today. Do you know how much I have to work? And just went on and on and on. He's like, get outside and you play by yourself. And he said that was, he's 60 years old now. He said that was the last time I ever asked my dad to play. And that guy's 60 years old.

So like, whenever like, so Colton right now, he's my nine year old, he always wants to play catch. And when he comes up to me and he's like, hey, can we go out and play catch? And there's that part of me, it's like, maybe I should do something like more important or like maybe help out mom or help this kid with homework or do work over here, I think about that experience that Rock had. So even every part of me, it's like, I've got other priorities. I just look at them and I say, yes. And here's the cool thing. I think a lot of us think like, well, if I'm going to go out and play catch, it's got to be for like two hours.

Like after like 20 minutes, he's ready to move on to something else. So like sometimes like playing catch, it's like literally, it's like a, it's like this tiny moment in time. But it's always special. And the last thing I'll say about that is I've never once regretted saying yes when I want to potentially say no. It's an interesting topic and I'm glad you said that. And that's why I want to stick on it because I don't view you as having that hard time with playing with your kids. I see you as always playing with your kids and in accepting that.

And for a long time, I would look at you and be like, why am I not like this? why am I not like Larry in this? Because, you know, there are times where, and again, like there's external environments too. Like there's some times where, you know, my wife will say, well, we got to do X, Y, and Z. I'm like, okay, well, can we just, can we just be? Can, you know, in it, and then I go, you know, I need to take Bobby the cages. I need to do this with him. I need to do that with him.

Well, yes, well, maybe on this day you can. I'm like, well, that's not enough. That's just one day a week. It's got to be multiple days a week because if he wants to be good at something, then we have to show him the way. And it just gets very convoluted. I'm not putting this on my wife. I'm not saying that.

But there's stuff that needs to be ran in the household. And I think there's a lot of noise when it comes to kids going to a prep school and the demands that are placed on them. But I just thank you for sharing that, man. I mean, that, dude, that, I mean, that right there, that monologue, I think really probably helped a lot of fathers, even mothers that are listening to this, you know? Because for me, it's hard. Like my daughter's, hey, can we?

you go play Barbies. I'm like, uh, what the like, like, really? Like, you know, sometimes I'll do it, but like I don't feel I play enough with my kids and it's something that I beat myself up over a lot. And, you know, I don't say my kids don't ask me anymore because it's, it's not there. They're just so dang busy with everything they have going on. It just doesn't come up. But, um, dude, let's talk about your book, man. Yeah. Yeah. Let's talk about the book. Yeah. So, funny thing about this book is it's actually, I think kind of fascinating how the book came about because it actually, the pursuit of legendary

fatherhood actually turned into another book. So truth be told, I wrote pursuit of legendary fatherhood. It just came out September 16th. But I wrote it back in 2023. So, which was kind of funny. But I've added to it before we, before I launched it. But I originally wrote Pursuit of Legendary Fatherhood and I was going to go through a, I was going through a publisher, I had a contract and everything. And then six weeks before my launch, and back in 2023, I got an email that the publishing company was going bankrupt.

And I'm like, so I reach out to the CEO, and I'm like, hey, I was like, we're supposed to launch this book in six weeks. I just got this email. He's like, yeah, yeah, the company's going under. And I'm like, okay, I was like, well, what happens to my book? He's like, well, I can either help yourself publish or I can just write, just sign the rights back over to you.

I was like, I'll just take the rights. Yeah. So I hired a literary agent, and she's been in the game for like 40 years. And I was connected to her through a friend, and she's like, if you got a good book, I'll know it. I've been in this game for a long time. So I sent her the book. She's like, I love this book. She's like, I'd love to rep it.

And like, so she went and shopped it. We got a few meetings with publishers, and then Morehouse publishing contacted us. And they're like, hey, we like the book. We want a meeting. So this is, this is in August of 2003. and I'm sitting here thinking like, oh, we're going to, we're going to sign a contract to publish this book. I'm sitting here thinking like, this is the easy button.

The book's already done. It's already edited. It's already designed. All they have to is publish it. And they go, we like your book, but we actually want you to write another one. And I'm like, what? I was like, what do you mean when we write another one? And they're like, well, we want to hold off on this one because we just had a woman write a book

called The Beauty of Motherhood that's a faith-based approach to motherhood. and it's going, it's going gangbusters. So we want you to write a book called Spirit of Fatherhood, a Christian-based approach to fatherhood. And even though we just had this conversation about faith, right, I was just like, I looked at these three people who I was on the Zoom call with and I'm like, are you serious?

I was like, I seriously think you guys have the wrong guy for this one. I was like, I'm so new to my faith. I've just learned it. You know, like I am not qualified to even write a chapter of this book. and they kind of smile and they're like, we know, we've been watching you and we've been listening to your podcast, we know you're new to your faith,

which is the exact reason why we want you to write it because we think that you can write this book from a perspective of being shoulder to shoulder with a man instead of preaching from a pulpit. And I was like, I was like, I can do that. I was like, because if you want me to write the book as like we're all kind of learning this together, I can do that.

And I got in front of my screen and I had this blank screen up and I exited out of, of that and I emailed my agent and I was like I'm not writing this book I went out of this contract I'm not gonna do it wow and she she's like 65 she called me she's like she's like a mom she's like sweetheart what's going on and I was like I'm not qualified to write this book she goes yes you are you need to write this book and I was like I I have the worst writer's block ever I'm staying I'm sitting here at the blank screen so um I ended up writing the book and I and they they needed it in 11 weeks and I wrote it in So it came out the following year, and then I had a contract that I couldn't launch Pursuit

of Legendary Fatherhood for one year after that. So that's why I'm doing it. But the funny thing was is Pursuit of Legendary Fatherhood was supposed to be out a couple years ago. And it just launched now, but it led to another book. That's pretty cool, man. I mean, we all, so those are the times of struggle, right, and where you don't feel you're worth something.

And having people in your corner to tap back into you and say, hey, dude, you are qualified. you are the man to write this. And then from that point on is just falling to your disciplines and your systems. And, you know, this shows that determined society is being determined to write this and just get something out there. And the one thing that I find most people struggle with, including myself, is looking at top of the mountain. And that's what you were doing at that moment. You're looking at this top of the mountain. I have to write this.

This is not the way I scripted it. My book's already done. Now I've got to write this. I'm not qualified. But just writing a little bit. And what people need to understand is we don't have to have it all figured out at that moment. You don't even have to know how. You just need to move, right?

And do little by little. So true. And that's what I did, man. And even like the crazy timeline that they gave me, they were like, you know, we need you to write this in 12 weeks. And I'm like, you guys are crazy. There's no way. I was like, it took me a year to write my other book. But like I ended up injuring my knee really bad at that point in time.

and I think that that was like divine intervention because I had no choice but to go through rehab and sit on my rear end and write this book. And there were times, man, I was at Starbucks for like nine straight hours. And the baristas would be like, are you going to stay the night here? I'm like, I'm just going.

But once you're in that flow state, you're right. It's like once you take action, it's like, you know, then that momentum usually follows. It's hard because, you know, we go into adversity all the time on the show. And, you know, for you who is so active, You work out, you've done shows, you know, you take care of your temple.

And then you get hit with this adversity. And most people look at that. I'm like, what now? Right? But you looked at it as an opportunity. I get to write this book now because there's no other option. I can't move my body. So how did that help you through your, because I would have to imagine it helped you

through your injury in that, in that rehabilitation. It did. It was quite a journey because like, you know, like, yeah, you know, fitness is a huge outlet for me. So it's like when you can't do that, you usually need another outlet. And sometimes like, I mean, let's just be really honest. Usually when guys need an outlet and they don't have the outlet they're used to. If it's a healthy one, they'll go to an unhealthy one.

Yeah, absolutely. But no, like that book was a lifesaver because it gave me a battle. It gave me an adventure. You know, and that's really what I needed. And, you know, just something to focus on. And it was definitely key. Was any part of the ego kicking when you said, I'm not going to write this book? Like I'm, I've already written my book.

I'm out. No, it was actually the opposite for this book. So like there was, it was more like, I'm going to screw this up. I'm going to write this book and it's going to be so disastrous. Like people are going to pick it apart, say that it's wrong and all this stuff. And none of that happened. But no, it was the actual complete and total opposite. It was the most imposter syndrome I think I've ever felt my life.

Man, I mean, that's a real thing too. It's like, you know, imposter syndrome is kind of like the thing that, you know, for the audience, that happens when you don't think you're qualified and your step. into a new space. You're like, who the hell am I to even be talking about this? And I remember when I started my show, like, it was a lot of that. And that's why I leaned on, and you alluded to it earlier, I leaned on to the big voices like Andy Vicella because I listened to the MF CEO project religiously. Yeah, yeah.

And I just thought that I had to be him in order to, you know, be listened to. And so my shows early on were full of language. my shows early on were full of, you know, or look at me, like, you know, insult somebody on the video to get their attention. And again, Matthew Haddon, my friend, who's always put me in my place, said, I had someone say to me that they can't even show your show

to their kid. I'm like, well, that's cool because my show's not for their kid. And then I thought about it for two days. I'm like, shouldn't I be for everybody? Like shouldn't, shouldn't this be a platform that's wholesome? Shouldn't it be a platform that gives information?

Shouldn't it be a bright light in this dark world to where even kids could come and listen? If there's a cursor that slips out here and there, cool, but it was like every other word. Yeah, yeah. And so I think, you know, imposter syndrome,

it's like when you latch on to somebody else's persona and think it's going to work for you, it often doesn't. Quite honestly, I probably was looked at like a joke. That's so true. Oh, man.

That is so true. Or, like, I'll give you a piece of podcasting advice if you want to. Yeah, of course. Your kids are little. My kids are older, so they now listen to my show. And I've done 1,400 episodes in my, my oldest son. He at the time was working as a mechanic, so he had like nine straight hours of listen time.

And, dude, I'll never forget this because I talked about it on the podcast, but like, you know, I was talking about the importance of date nights and chemistry and creating intimacy and connection with your wife and that kind of thing. And I gave this example of, like, how me and Jessica, there's a little. a few years ago. We were out on a date. All this great chemistry was happening. And we let this restaurant went in the parking lot and just totally got it on. And I talked about it. I kept it PG. But like, my son comes home. He's like, dad, you did what's my mom? He's like, did you mess around with mom in the parking lot of BCs? And I'm like, yes, I did. I was like, I'm not hiding this.

I was like, so like, you know, it's funny. Like when your kids go back and like listen to your podcast, you're like, oh, like I said that. And they're like, they're going to know about that that's funny i mean there were times with me and jacky got it on rest stops like after a concert we did we did yes yes absolutely i'm just thinking a dumb and dumber right now find a happy place but i mean you know it's but it's also really cool for the kids to go back to listen to it and just know that their parents love each other right exactly but i could imagine you know he's working on you know working on an engine he's like wait wait what what did you do to my mom what like what the hell but no man i think

I think it's, you know, it's really cool. You know, your kid listened to the show. I walked in, I think it was probably about a year ago. And this is what hit me. I walked in about a year ago. My son had this little iPod. He was listening to my show. And I was mortified.

Hey, bro, you can't listen to my show. Why? So because there's language in that you can't listen to. And I went into my wife and I said, hey, I think people are right. She was, what do you mean? I'm like, Bobby was listening to my show. She was, no. And I'm like, well, that's the problem.

And it's a change. Yeah. Because I want my children to be able to, you know, turn on the TV. And of course, you know, because I subscribe to my YouTube, it comes up. But look, there's daddy. And I think it's cool. And I'm like, dude, it's just because I subscribe to myself. That's all it is.

Yeah, yeah. I'm not really on TV. But I want them to feel comfortable and hit and play. Yeah. Because I want them to see what's possible. I want them to see the conversations like this. And I just think it's so important, man. But that's a funny story, dude.

Oh, yeah, man. That's a funny story. Yeah, a little podcast last. I'm like, I never really thought my kids would listen to this, but they do. Yeah, I mean, they, because they're proud of you, right? They want to listen. Like, what does dad actually do? Yeah.

Right? It's so funny because my youngest, she'll go to school and she'll talk about dad. And she'll go up to her teachers. Do you listen to the determined society? Like, no, what's that? She goes, you don't know? It's like my dad. He's like famous.

You need to. And then I'll go there and then the teacher will say something or, you know, And they're like, yeah, she's like, I'm not famous, but like, did you listen? They're like, yeah, we really like it. I was like, well, cool. She's like my biggest marketing assistant. She goes to school, talks about the determined society. That's awesome, man.

In fact, one time, last year, there was an entrepreneur project, and she's in kindergarten. She goes, Dad, I want to do this with you. That's awesome. I'm like, okay, what do you want to do? She goes, Panda Paws podcast, Dad. I'm like, what? She goes, I love pandas. and they have cute pause and you have a podcast.

Can we do this together? So we did it. You know, we created revenue streams. We did the post-up. No way. We did. Oh my gosh.

I had pictures of her like, you know, sitting in front of the microphone in the home office, just like acting like she was ripping one off. And she got third place. It was really cool. It was a really cool moment. Oh my gosh.

That's awesome. You know, what we have to understand too is like when we're doing things like this, where we're just doing what we feel we're led to do, it is translated to the, younger generation that is seeing it. And I always make a joke. People ask me like, when you're done, who's taken over?

I'm like, oh, that's easily Mia. Like, that's easily Mia. Then my other kids are like, what, not me? I'm like, she's, she's already, she's acting like, she'll be in a mirror. Hi, welcome to my YouTube channel. And she doesn't even watch YouTube, right? Well, she, I don't know, she sneaks it. But, um, but those kind of moments are really cool as a father because you see your,

your children stretching themselves. and understanding that there's other ways to do something. Yeah, for sure. I love that. So you're going to rebrand in like 20 years, call it the Determined Panda Podcast or something? I don't know, man. 20 years, hopefully I'm done, man.

They can do whatever they want with it. But, no, it's just a pretty cool moment, man. Yeah, that cracked me up about, was it Ethan that was listening? Yeah. Oh, man. The one who's going to be scarred for life. Yeah, I know.

I can't look at you and your wife the same anymore. It's like, yeah, I can't unsee this. Right. But no, there's a lot of funny moments like that in parents. parenting, right? Oh my gosh, yeah. My six-year-old, like, Daddy Kissed Mama. And then, you know, well, and then the other kids, my older kids are like, oh, I want to see that. And I was like, dude, I love, I love my wife, you know, as much as we get on each other's nerves, and she's, she's my rock, you know, I mean, and, in her well-being and, and everything like that is super important to me. But, you know,

that's the other thing that you do so well is those date nights, you know, we, we fall into this problem where we don't trust many people with our kids. And I think there's a lot of parents listening right now that want that one-on-one time with their spouse, but they're afraid to just let anybody into the house to watch your kids. How would you walk them through something like that, how to prioritize it, maybe to find somebody? Because that's something you do very well, dude. Well, thank you. I appreciate that.

I mean, so I've already talked about, like, how one of the negative things about me is that I just have a hard time plan my kids just because like, you know, not because I don't want to spend time with them, but it's because I'm always like, well, shouldn't I go do something that more important type of thing? Marriage, though. And this was not always so. Like I was, I was not a good husband in the beginning. I had a lot to learn. Same do. But, but one thing that I can hang my hat on is like, I've become like just this student over the past eight years of marriage. All the skills that are associated with it, connection, intimacy, attraction, all of these, you know, aligning parenting roles, all those things. Like, I love that topic. And I love being a student of it. And this might

trigger people, but I believe it to be true. And that is you're married first and you're a parent second. So, and that wasn't always the case with me and Jess. And I see a lot of other couples get in trouble with that. So like when the kids come along, what they'll do is they'll take like those frying pans that are on the stove, right? And they'll take the marriage frying pans and they'll put them on the back burner and those kids are like on the front burner. Now, I'm not saying the kids are not a priority. They're absolutely a priority. But what people I think miss sometimes is that it's like in those early years when like, you know, you come home with your first kid and their babies and like, they're so dependent on you. And like that's the entire world right there. But I, I get the sense a lot

of people don't ever exit that. You know, they stay in that. I'm still in that with the parenting thing. still we're still in that. Yeah. And I'm resonating with this because, you know, my wife is so entrenched in the school and everything that they're doing. You know, I'm entrenched with the kids. And we are putting the kids first. Right.

And so this is a real issue, right? Not in, when you think of issues to have, it's a pretty decent one to how, okay, you love your kids so much, you're putting them first. But at the same time, if you're growing apart as a couple, right. I'm not saying me and Jackie are, but we could be closer. Yeah. I'm not, hey, like, that's not a nice. Like, that's not a knock on my wife.

I love you. I'm not saying that. But what I'm saying is, like, these are things that parents struggle with, man. They do. And I think a lot of parents, like, I don't know about your situation, but what I've seen with with the guys that I work with is that there's a guilt factor. Like, it's almost like, well, shouldn't we? Shouldn't the kids come first?

Not really. I mean, and I say that. And there's reasoning behind that. If you're married first and a parent second, there are tremendous benefits. go with that. And let me, let me explain. And by the way, when I say we're married first and parents second, I'm not saying like, oh, I know you just broke your leg, but me and mom have a day night, right? It's one A1B, man. It's not saying that at all, but we prioritize the heck out of each other. So, like, every Friday. And this is where, like, I think, like, work life integration and

making decisions, I take off every Friday at 10.30 in the morning. And I spend my, my Friday with my wife. So we have a date day. So, like, you know, we'll either be working out. We'll we'll go for a hike, we'll walk the dog, we'll go for lunch, we'll mess around. Yeah, go to BC. Yeah, we'll go to the parking lot, whatever. We're really public place people now. We'll check out the rest areas. But no, but like, only after a concert. It's got to be dark.

But like, you know, every Friday, like that gives us something to look forward to. Like, even when I wake up on Monday morning, I'm like, oh, man, Friday, right? But like, the battle of that is like, well, shouldn't I be working? Like, I'm an entrepreneur. or like if I'm not working, I'm not providing. But I have to make that decision of like, but this is insanely important. And when I say we're married first, parents second,

like what my wife and I want to do is, if you really think about it, one of the best gifts, one of the best things we can do is parents. Like one of the best lessons that we can teach as parents is to teach kids how to have a functional relationship with your significant other. And kids don't, like if you really look at the statistics,

kids don't see that. Yeah. They see the opposite of that. So it's like, no wonder, like, they go to have their own adult relationships and they're like, I don't know about communication. I don't know about attraction. I don't know about conflict resolution. So, like, Jessica and I, you know, our big thing is I feel this responsibility of like,

I have four boys. So I need to model and exemplify what it means to love a woman well, right? To make her feel seen, to make her feel heard, to make her feel safe. Like, these kids are watching every move that we make. she feels this tremendous responsibility, even probably more so than I do, she's like, oh, no, no, no, I set the standard. How I treat you is how they're going to tolerate being treated by other girls. So if I'm not treating you well, they're going to tolerate less. So like, and I'll tell you, man, like now that my older sons are dating and my one son, his 17-year-old has been with his girlfriend for four years, they have a very insanely mature relationship. I'm floored by it. Like they have great balance. They have great communication. They spend time with family.

and friends and with each other and separate and everything. And, but my wife is like, I need to treat you well because I don't want these teenage girls treating my sons terribly and them tolerating it. So, and the final thing I'll say is this, even the little guys, like, we just had this conversation with them probably like a month ago. We set them down and we're very affectionate with each other. We're very, like, we publicly tell each other compliments and how much we love each other in front of the kids.

And I asked my little guys, I was like, what is, what do you feel? when you see me and mom, like, love each other well. And, of course, my 11-year-old was, like, gross. And I was like, no, seriously, man. And then he really thought about it. And so did my 9-year-old. But my 11-year-old goes, it feels warm. It feels cozy.

It feels comfortable. It feels like I want to be here. And I was like, and I looked at Colton. I was like, what about you? He goes, same. But, you know, it's like, it's those adjectives to me, what that says is when I see mom and dad love each other, it makes me want to be here and I feel safe.

So the whole time you're talking, I'm like, safe, safe, safe, safe. They need to feel safe. Yep. Right? And then that's something that you and Jess are providing. And like that's the only word I could think of. Yeah. Kids need to feel safe.

They do. And then the cool, like I didn't grow up with that from a dad perspective. I didn't grow up with that at all. Yeah. But I did with a with a grandfather. So my grandfather and my grandmother only lived a mile from us and I spent a ton of time over there. And my grandfather, even at like 73. years old would every day all the time all the time would just they'd be sitting at the table he'd just

grab her by the hand and be like you're so beautiful I just love you so much and like she'd walk by he would slap her on the butt and pull her on his lap and like joke with her. That's something good to see from a 73 year old man I know I'm like I remember being like I was like nine years old and I remember like watching this and I remember the feeling that I had I was like I don't feel this way at home like I don't feel this way at my own house and the and the cool thing that the feeling that I felt was like joy and like just being able to relax and decompress and not knowing that there was going to be like a huge fight or a battle like watching them. And I know this sounds like weird to say and I've said this on another podcast.

It made me proud of them. They like made me proud to be, want to be around them. So I was like, man, these people like love each other so much. Like this is so cool to see. But in nine years old, you don't really realize that until you look back. There's two places where I felt super safe in my life. One was my grandma's house. My grandma Dixie, she died in 1997 for pancreatic cancer.

She was my everything. She's my best friend. I remember being so excited when I could just go there and spend the night. Like my mama go and, you know, I don't know, you know, go out with her friends or whatever. But even if she wasn't, like I was just wanted to spend time with my grandma. We would watch Hobo's Christmas on VHS and then sidekicks with Ernie. We make little popcorn balls and she'd, you know, take that, that height of bed, you know, in the living room and take it out

and that's where I would sleep and we just had this amazing connection. She was my everything. I still remember the last baseball game she ever saw me. You know, my senior year, it was against Campo Lindo.

And her last I bat she ever saw for me was an 02 count basis load and I took an O2 pitch. I was looking away to react it in from a left and I hit a grand slam. Are you serious? It's the last, yeah.

That's awesome. Yeah, yeah. And then she died the summer going into my freshman year in college. And I remember, you know, she was on hospice, and she was just literally dying in front of us. And I remember going to a baseball game and, you know, summer ball, I go, Grandma hit you a home run today. She goes, you don't have to promise that. Brought her back a home run ball.

That's awesome. The very next game, I said, hey, grandma, here's another one coming. She goes, honey. Same. And those two baseballs are buried with her. Are they really? They are. Yeah.

Oh, my gosh. Yeah. The second place ever felt really, really safe was every year, right around. Labor Day. We would go up to Clear Lake California, and my grandparents, you know, had this, you know, mobile home. It was a double-wide, right on a creek,

and then my great-a-and-uncle had one right next door, and we'd have this massive family reunion. And I just remember those moments of going up there, stopping at the natural spring waterfall to get the waters on the way back, and then pulling up and then walking to the front porch and all the Rice Krispy treats and all of everything,

was just laid out there. And the whole family was together listening to Randy Travis on the gray boom box, right? Because that was the vibe. Yeah, yeah. And we play croquet. We play badminton.

And we'd catch minnows in the creek, me and my cousins. And we would sleep on the porch. We could hear the creek the whole time. And we could hear the crickets constantly. But those are the two areas. I'm not saying I never felt safer on my parents. I'm not saying that. But my parents did.

They resolved their conflict by a lot of yelling, a lot of storming out. And so my limbic system, my nervous system was wired to when I have conflict, I need to yell. So I've had to really work through that. And at times still I struggle with it, right? But those are the two. We were talking about safety. Like my grandma and my great-grandparents, like they, to me, like made me feel safe all the time, 100% of the time. That's one of the best gifts I think you can give, you know, your kids is that, I mean, that's part of their three needs, you know, to feel seen, heard and safe. And it's actually the same needs your wife, too, is to feel seen heard and safe. But yeah, that's a killer story, man. That's awesome. I remember one time. I've never told these stories here. This is so cool, man. You always bring the best out of me, man. It's, uh, my grandparents also had a cabin in Truckee, California. That's about three and a half hours from my hometown. And we'd always go up there. And I don't remember what time of year it was. But me, my grandma,

were walking along and there was this flower and I'm like this is a random flower this is what I remember the conversation it was just this pink flower she was make a wish

anything you want and it'll come true I'm like grandma just do it I wish it would snow the next morning my grandma woke me up

she was honey look outside get out of here snowing and we took a picture by that flower and that picture to this day is still cut out in my wallet. No way.

That is wild, man. So when I lose my wallet at times, I freak out and why it's like, we can get the cars. I'm like, no, no, no, you don't understand. The only picture I have of me and my grandma is in that wallet. Yeah. After the show, you got to show me that. I will.

Take you out to my truck. It's out back. That would be awesome. I would love to see that. That's crazy, man. Well, do, thank you so much, man. This has been the fact that you flew from Missouri to come see me, and I'm going to have to fly up to you.

Yeah, you will. You have to come in the day. I would love to come back, come to the Dad Edge Studio. It's so funny having you on three different times, the conversations have just amplified to be so much better. And it's because I understand what I'm doing more now, but I also understand you a great deal more. And I'm just so happy to share your story, your book, and who you are with my audience once again. I would say it's probably going to be the last time, but probably not. Probably not.

You're probably in two years. You'll be back on anyway. But I can't think of anybody else I'd rather have on multiple times. Thank you. This is a real honor, man. I appreciate you having me on to talk about the book and obviously the conversation. But yeah, just so the audience knows, like, how the book is just sort of divided up. It's, so it's called Pursuit of Legendary Fatherhood is divided up in four parts. The first part is called The Drift, which a lot of a lot of us slip into that. Then there's husband, father, and leader. So basically everything that we've learned,

in the Dad Edge ecosystem for the past 10 years, I pretty much put it into that book. And if your audience wants a signed copy of it, I did this campaign right before it was about six weeks before the book launched. And it was, you know, we built a landing page, you know, $28 so you can buy a copy of the book. And then I was given, I decided to give away two of my most popular courses. One is called Creating More Patients. It's for help guys with patients. and then creating extraordinary marriage where you learn 11 skills on how to connect with your wife, build intimacy and attraction. And I was like, I'll just put this page together.

And, you know, and my assistant was like, how many books you think will sell? I was like, I don't know, 20. We sold a ton of books. In six weeks, I think there were, we sold over $11,000 in books. It was nuts. I've never seen anything like it. So what I decided to do was, is if you, if your audience goes, the dad edge.com for slash legendary book,

I actually decided to leave that landing page up for the rest of the year. Because obviously, I think people really want the courses, like, because, you know, I figure if someone really wants the book, then they can dive right into the courses. But I decided to leave that promotion up for the rest of the year. So if anybody wants those courses, they can. What is the website again? Thedadedge.com forward slash legendary book, all one word.

Okay. I'm going to need that link, too. Danny, we'll put that in the show notes, help push that out. I'm going to do that because I want to learn more from you. And of course, I want to read the book because, you know, it's good material, right? So where else can they find and interact with you? You got a lot going on. You have marriage coaching, right?

You have Dad Edge community. And, dude, like, let's not sleep on the actual show here. I appreciate that, man. Yeah, so the podcast, I always joke if you've never listened to the Dad Edge podcast, I have enough content, probably keep you busy for 10 years because it's 10 years of content in 1,400 episodes. I literally just recorded my 1400 episode with my nine-year-old. I was like 234 and I thought it was a lot.

Yeah, 1400. 1400. We've been talking a lot. But you can always find me on Instagram. Everything is at the dad edge, Instagram and Facebook and everything else. You know, for anybody out there that, you know, if you're, you know, the podcast is great, you know, it's a great resource. But if you want more and you want more interaction, we have three different programs. So I have what's called the Dad Edge Alliance.

That's for men who have careers. It doesn't matter if it's a white collar, blue collar. but that's our basic program. We have several guys in that program. We also created a program called the Dad Edge Business Boardroom, and that's for business owners. So that's where we just cater to the needs of a business owner, because quite frankly, we're wired quite a bit different,

and we're usually super high drivers, and we drive really, really far in our businesses, and we tend to neglect things at home. So we built that program. Then I do one-on-one marriage coaching as well. That's so awesome, dude. But yeah, if anybody ever needs anything or, you know, then go to the Dad-Eedge.

dot com for slash mastermind for those programs and if they want one-on-one coaching they can just email info at the dad edge.com beautiful man thank you so much dude and for the audience go check him out seriously let's see what he's all about listen to his show dive into his content and if there's anything that resonated with you fully endorse working with larry here and uh thank you learning from him and learning how to be a better spouse better father and a better human i appreciate that i need I need to be a better shopper of shoes depending on what I see there. These are so clean.

These are, these are cold, bro. Like I got these. Remember, I got these at the Miramar outlets here, like three years ago. Yeah.

And I'm like, those are really cool, but I'll probably never wear them. And then, you know, I started wearing them out. I've wearing them a lot. And I get,

like, I get a lot of compliments. I bet you do. Yeah, these ones are cool. I need more of them, though. I need more.

But, uh, do you thanks again, thank you. Thank you. Share the show with somebody you know, love and trust. time, stay determined.