Determined Society with Shawn French | Adversity & Mindset - Unlimit Your Potential

Episode Date: April 19, 2022

In this episode Shawn French chats with Seth Pepper is an instant classic. He didn't start swimming until he was 14 years old and within a manner of 4 years he was a 2X National Champion, 23X All American and he holds the record for the fastest ever split. Seth is now a mental performance coach working with the highest level athletes, CEOs, and entrepreneurs.   Listen in as Seth dives into how you can create the success you desire with your most powerful tool of all...YOUR MIND.   You can follow Seth on IG: @sethpepper   Contact Seth at: www.sethpepper.com --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/shawn-french/message Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

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And so what I was trying to do was I was trying once I knew that this was a tool, right? Then I was like, how do I leverage it? It was all leveraging, right? So it was convincing myself that I was faster than I really was. And I was like, you know, and if you really go back and you study the grades in self-help, it doesn't have to be performance oriented. They would say, if you tell a lie to yourself long enough, you'll believe it. What's up, guys? How's it going?

This is Sean French with another episode of the podcast, The Determined Society. I tell you what, we got an amazing guest here today. This gentleman has done it all. He has one hell of a resume. And more than that, he has a great mind. And I'm super excited to have him on the show. He works with high-level athletes, pro-golfers, major league baseball players, NFL players, NBA players, PGA golfers, LPGA golfers.

It really doesn't stop there, ladies and gentlemen. He works with CEOs, C-O-Os, and entrepreneurs, basically anyone that is looking to level up to an elite status. He helps them overcome obstacles to get to the next level. He's a performance coach. And this guy, let me tell you, I'm going to have to look at his accomplishments. he was the Pacific Conference athlete player of the year.

He was a two-time national champion. He was a University of Arizona athlete of the year. He's a two-time Hall of Fame inductee. He has the fastest relay split ever recorded. So to me, that right there saying something big and impressive, literally fastest relay split ever recorded. And the last one that I'm going to, I'm going to notate here. here is something that I want him to explain because I don't even know. I didn't even do it once,

but he is a 23-time All-American. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome, Seth Pepper. How you doing, buddy? Oh, it's great to be here. Thanks for having me. I've been looking forward to this conversation for a long time. Absolutely, me too, man. 23-time All-American. How does that happen? Well, I was told that anything in the top 16, right so top 16 in the nation so I was in the top 16 in the nation 23 times whether it was individually or on a relay so when I graduated I was the I'd scored more points in the entire nation in my graduating class so that was that was a big ROI return on investment you know conversation in my head absolutely no I listen I'm not hating on it I just I found it very impressive I'm like 23 times oh my goodness gracious. That is one hell of a stat. So one hell of an athlete and one hell of a professional. And, you know, you work with a lot of amazing athletes and just like I mentioned CEOs, CEOs, and entrepreneurs of the like. And what are some of the common trends you're seeing with some of those high performing people? You know, let's just jump right into it. I mean, that's a very,

you know, for me, it's a hot button, right? Because I'm on the front line of performance. And I think what I'm seeing, I would just describe it really simply that people are playing scared, you know, and it doesn't matter if it's on a field or if it's in an office, you know, or in a classroom. I'm just seeing it more and more. My personal take on it is that we have, as a culture, you know, moved more and more into a digital, you know, environment. And in that digital environment, those are great tools. awesome. We can connect with everyone on the planet, it seems like. But what tends to happen as far as from the mental perspective is that when you share something, right, you're telling your story, let's say, or you're telling your children's story. It sounds great. In essence, it is great.

But where that gets framed in our own mind or in our children's mind, that's kind of the area where I'm starting to see that it's getting, you know, to the point where, you know, let's go to the business world. When a company wants to, you know, get out there and market to the public, what do they do? They brand, right? How do they brand? They tell their story, right? So that's what I'm seeing is that we're doing this on an individual level where we're branding

and we don't even realize we're branding, right? Now, why do I say branding? I mean, to me, branding is go back to that corporate model. Branding is when you're wrapping in your results, the sale, the sell, into, you know, the story. And that just happens naturally. And that's all well and good. All of it's well and good. Again, it's the effect that it has on the individual.

And so if the child thinks, oh, well, this is great. my parents are sharing my results, that's awesome. It's all good, right? But if that child starts to go out onto the playing field and feel like they are their results and they're no longer a person, that's where it gets dangerous. And so I try to create a separation. You are a human being, not a human doing, right? The holidays have arrived at the Home Depot, and we're here to help bring the excitement

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It sounds like philosophy. I mean, to me it's very, very realistic that I want them to be able to fail. That's the space that I work in. We want to fail and want to fail often. And if they are, you know, holding back from failure, that's disastrous in the performance field. You said it right there. You know, I think a lot of times you talked about digital and then you talked about just the athlete going out there and being so result driven to a point where they're being scared to fail. I think the digital world plays into that scared to fail, right?

Because let's just talk about social media. And I've talked about this on a previous podcast. But when I was playing and when you were swimming, right, we didn't have this technology. We didn't have the ability to truly go out there and market ourselves or brand ourselves. We had that blue chip recruiter that would come and sit in our living room, offer a package, would have a folder with, you know, the plastic little sheets and everything, showing your parents like, hey, listen, I can get your son or your daughter in front of all these college recruiters. and you paid them a service, right?

That was about the extent of it. And then you had to really rely on your skills and your high school coach to promote you, right? Which I wish it were more that way now. And I'm sure we'll touch on that. But what I'm seeing now is let's say baseball player A goes on a recruiting trip to say one of the biggest schools in the SEC. Then he goes on the biggest one of the ACC

and then PAC 12 and all of a sudden they have like mock up photo shoots and they're in their football pads and their uniform their baseball uniform and it's this big old production and

it starts early. I mean there's kids you know going and doing this a freshman year in high school and they're going out there and let's say, okay, well, I've committed to University of Miami. Well, now they've told the whole world that they've committed to Miami. So for four years, you are not Sean French.

You are that Miami commit. And your whole identity is tied to your performance and tied to where you're going to school. And that's just the first part of the equation. The right side of the equation is when you go there and if you fail, your whole identity is shattered. That's a problem. Yeah. Yeah. And you, what I'm, you know, working from the performance perspective because we're getting ready for battle, more or less, right?

The battlefield of the athletic world. And so everything is about results, you know, and that's the space I come. I think that's the reason why it can be so effective, just not just in athletics, but also business, you know, and also arts, is to be able to deliver consistent results. Now, when you go into the results and you start to pull apart, okay, why were we spiraling, right? That whole sort of internal dialogue, one thing goes wrong. And then it's like, oh, here we go again. And they're just off to the races in a negative direction. That's what I'm trying to unwire.

And what happened out there is that they got into full survival mode, fight, flight, freeze. So they are triggering, right? Because we're going out, we're being in a place, in a position, in an environment that's all about pressure, right? Whether it's on a field or in an office or a classroom, pressure across the board. So you feel that pressure. And then all of a sudden you feel like your life's in jeopardy if your identity is, you know, in jeopardy. And so what I'm trying to do is, you know, get them basically, you know, out of that trigger format, you know, or trick, you know, the reference, I want to, I want to

disconnect that so that they can go out there and they can fail because we're going to learn something if we fail. If we identify with the failure, though, you know, and hold on to it and take it personal, then all of a sudden that loop just keeps on going and going and it spirals out of control. So now, as you're all seeing, you know, the Olympics are one example across the board, whether it's the Summer Olympics, you know, with Simone Biles, you know, and then Chifron in the Winter Olympics, and then you're seeing it in the NBA, you know. A lot of people were concerned about Ben Simmons and playoffs. I mean, you just can basically name the sport, and there's an example at the top that's going through this, right? They're standing under the basket,

and they pass it rather than take the shot, right? That's obviously they're in some sort of, you know, survival mode where they're not processing the information in a normal way. And so if our top people are doing it, then what's happening to the whole ecosystem? And, you know, you probably, if you talk to college coaches, they'll say, you know, they're kind of dealing with the wreckage of what's happened before, you know, when they were younger.

And so if our top guys and top females are, you know, I just think they're symbols. You know, it's not just them. It's not because they have many millions of dollars. It's they represent everything that comes down below. It's like a, you know, trickle down. And so for me, I've started to look at it because I work with all different ages, right? And so I worked with a world champion eight-year-old. Yes, there is, you know.

There's a thing. That's a thing. And when they're talking to me at eight and nine and ten, and I'm, you know, I'm all about goals. I want to find out what lights of fire in them. And they say, I want to get a D1 full ride scholarship. And that to me just, you know, how do you even know, like I was a D1 full ride scholarship. And I even, you know, I was just doing it. Like I wanted a race against the fastest people in the world.

That was it. I didn't realize it was D1, right? I didn't even think of that distinction. And so at eight, people are talking about it. So we have access to the whole ecosystem. And it's just a major shift. And I don't think that, I don't know if people really are aware of the impact. To me, it's like we hit the iceberg, like in the Titanic, you know,

and all these stars that were seeing. is the tip of the, you know, the iceberg. And just like in the movie, the Titanic, the band is playing on, just saying everything's normal. Everything just keep acting normal. It's just that person over there. Now it's just the number one female in the entire world, right? Oh, it's the most clutch, you know, figure of the Olympics in the summer. Oh, it's just the same in the winter Olympics.

it's the top, you know, guy in the NBA. Like, what? Yeah. Like, these are the top people. If someone could handle the pressure, it would be these people. And so the whole ecosystem, I think, is in question. I agree with you. And it just goes back to, you know, you mentioned, you know, Simone Biles and all those

other, all those other athletes. There was major blowback there, right? At the public, judgment. And it's because, you know, they don't, people aren't seeing the human being. they're seeing a human doing like you're the best in the world how are you feeling this way like first of all that's an ignorant statement these individuals are the biggest stage in front of everybody they have a microscope on them and they are the best in the world they're going to have things go on because of the human being element and i just think it's you know it's a very telling

i love the analogy with a titanic you know because that's true like the youth sports in the high school players and all the different sports, they're just the band right now. They're playing and everything's fine. And they're going along with this whole thing. And, you know, I mentioned to you before we started recording, I spoke to a parent this morning in the gym. He's actually a neighbor of mine.

And we just got to talk and I was done with my workout. And so I was talkative. And he goes, I got to ask you a question. I feel really bad right now. I'm like, okay, what's up, man? And he goes, well, you know, his name is Sean. He goes, I started my, my son, Sean, in baseball this year. I said, cool, that's great.

How's he loving it? He goes, he loves it. I go, how old is he? He goes, he's seven. I go, perfect. He's like, well, parents on the team, because my son's not as good as a lot of the other kids. I mean, they're very advanced. They're very, very good.

And they were just kind of telling me that, you know, hey, just don't worry, be patient. He's a little behind because he started so late. It's like, wait a second. What? Late. He's seven years old. I don't think I started playing baseball until eight and I played at LSU. Like I wasn't even like really good until my sophomore year in Juko.

Like when I lost all of my baby fat and I started working out hard. Like like where did where did we go wrong, Seth? Like when did this happen? Because, you know, I saw that a big, um, organization came out with seventh grade rankings recently. Yeah, in baseball. Seventh grade rankings. What's next? Are they going to have a toddler division? Like I just don't understand what's going on. And all the while these players are being exposed, first and foremost, and I'll get to that. These parents are being bamboozled. And it's taking on a family

dynamic where all they're doing is packing the car or hopping on a plane. They're not spending any real time with each other and they're just traveling to play baseball. And that's all they're doing. And what I meant by exposed is these athletes, whether it's AAU, baseball or, you know, competitive dance or gym or whatever, if you aren't the best dancer, the best baseball player in your area, why are you flying across the country to go play? Because at that point, it's not exposure. They're getting exposed.

Mm-hmm. And it's happening everywhere. I agree. I agree. When did this happen? Like, it just happened. It seems like it happens.

It's kind of like that overnight success everybody talks about that took 10 years to happen. But, you know, what was the, because I, I remember I coached travel ball. I'm not against travel ball. I think it's great, you know,

for the right players. You know, but the way that youth sports is going right now. It's driving hard on being a human doing, result driven. And again, and I tell this people all the time, I am result driven. I love results. I'm an athlete. I'm an entrepreneur. I want results, but I also don't tie it to who the hell I am. I'm a human being. I'm a husband. I have three children, right? These kids are being taught at such an early age that they are how they swing the bat or kick the soccer ball.

So sorry, I went on a little bit of a rant there. Didn't let you talk. No, no. You're just speaking what's on my mind, you know. That's good because you have a beautiful mind. So I'm glad I'm going to. Appreciate it. Appreciate it.

Well, maybe if I went back and told a little bit of my history, then I could frame up a little bit on what you're talking about with the age. Is that all right? if I share a little. I would love that. I would love that athletic sign. Okay. Because I work in a space where it's subtle, right?

When you start talking about the mind, it's like it's easy for people to kind of go, oh, yeah, yeah, I know that's important. Goals are important. Maybe a little bit of visualization. Oh, I get that kind of stuff. But I can actually stare someone in the eye and say, look, I got the story. This is real stuff. This is going to be the most powerful thing you've ever done, right?

You know, my story. I started at the age of 14, right? Twice the age of what you just mentioned, right? I started out of my own reasons. Curiosity. I fell in love with the Olympics when I was little, and my parents were not, you know, my dad built classical guitars.

My mom was an English teacher, so we were more like an art family. And so what was athletics? It was a hobby. It was nothing they could relate to. Right. Which is perfect for me, because my internal wiring was just, I'm going to go explore and put this together myself

and own it. And so when I started, it was watching the Olympics and it was determining which sport I could actually get access to. And I'm from a small town. So it had to be something that was pretty popular. Narrowed it down. It's going to be the summer Olympics, narrowed it down, I chose swimming. When I started focusing on swimming, it's this whole process of curiosity. That's why I referenced a lot with Kobe Bryant because even though we know the end result, if you really study what he did, it was self-made, right? And he's all about trying to understand, can I get there? And he talks about that story the same way, you know, for me at the beginning was they're on the TV, you know, and they're in the Olympics.

Can I go do that? So it was a curiosity. It was not like dominance. You see the end result on ESPN. It is not that. It is this process of constantly, you know, and one of my favorite quotes from Kobe is failure is an illusion. Now, the only reason he can say that failure is an illusion is because his total focus was

on the process, was on the process of getting better. It was never about the result. it's not that he didn't enjoy, you know, the good things that came along. But right after he would win the World Championship, he'd say, you know, find me at the gym. 4 a.m. tomorrow, I'll be there. Because the process is what fed him. The process is what made him happy, you know. And I've gotten the chance to meet with the Yankees, meet with, you know, you name the organization.

I've gotten a good, you know, glimpse into the, you know, behind the scenes. What's interesting is when you talk to. to a world champion, right? And you ask them, what's the experience like? A lot of it will be is the process, like what I learned about myself. And then they'll say, you know, the shocking part of it is that as soon as I won the championship is as soon as I wanted to get busy earning the next one, right? So it's not even about the trophy in the end. If you're going to make it to the top, you've got to be a student. And so for me, I was starting as a student, 14 years old. You know, watching the Olympics, girl wins the gold medal.

Nounser asked the question that's in my head, which is the next step of the process, the journey. What's next? He said, you know, I asked her, where did you go? What did you do? If there's someone out there that wants to do what you just did, I said, whatever she says, that's it. that's what I'm going to do. I'm all about timing and just making a clear choice. And thankfully, she said, I went through YMCA, so youth program, and there was one in my small town, went down there, walked up to the head coach, and I said, I want to go to the Olympics.

Can you help me? Right? So it's clear of mind, right? It wasn't cocky arrogant. I didn't say I was going to the Olympics. I said, I want to. He asked me if I knew how to swim. I said, no.

No. So he started laughing. But he said, okay, that's fine. So he sent me over to go, you know, learn how to swim and train with the eight-year-olds, right? Little kids, seven, eight-year-olds. And they were about half my height. And they were kicking my butt every day. Now, I look at that journey and I go, that is a bizarre thing to even think of, you know, that's even possible.

Go do it, put yourself through it, especially as a teenager, you know. but what was the gift that keeps on giving with where I'm at now and our conversation that we're talking about is I started in a state of failure. I didn't see it as failure, you know, but I work with some of these top people in the world and the nation. First thing I got to go through is you got to get that girl off your back. I'll be like, what do you mean? So no, I can see it. I can see it in your eyes. I can see it in just the way that you're carrying yourself.

the gorilla is your identity right you've been carrying around that trophy room you know around your chest you know from youth sports and right now man you're in a d1 program you're the number one recruit in the nation we've got to hit the reset button none of that stuff matters you start over now you know and you got to get rid of you got to put that gorilla down because it's a lot of weight right on your back on your shoulders and i i don't think you can move as quickly, you know, with something like that on your shoulders. And then also your sports become your job. You're not even having fun doing this thing that you started out, you know, just wanting to hit a ball or swim to the other end and race everyone or whatever it is. And so for me, you know, I'm in this kind of

interesting juxtaposition of having my own story be that, okay, I started late, super late, learning how to swim at the age of 14, failing all the time, just curious about the process. Parents, dad didn't pay for my sport, right? He said, it's a hobby. Remember, he's a loving person, but he's also helping me with life lessons. So I was old enough to go find a way. So I worked at the horse barns, right, in the summers to be able to pave my dues. Right.

So I do that. And then also he said, you've got to get yourself to your practices and your meats, right? So my parents never went to it sounds probably someone might go well are they even supportive. Yes, they're supportive of where it matters. Right. And personally, I didn't want them there. That was too much pressure even if they asked me what the results were. I was like, you know, ease up, you know, back off.

Yeah. But it worked for me. So I used to ride my bike 10 miles a day to go to workout. Now you ride your bike for 10 miles just to get to the workout. You're going to make the most of that workout. Right. And then if you fast forward eventually in swimming, we have kicking sets, so where you just use your legs. When I get to the D1 level, you know, the top level, top team, one of the top teams,

no one can kick faster than me or longer than me. And I know that that's a direct result for what happened at the beginning, which was the resistance, the obstacle is your way, right? The stoicism of it, you know? keep going, keep grinding. And then the other thing was my parents didn't go to my meets, and I was totally fine with that. I mean, like I said, it allowed it to be my experience, my experiment. So when I started, my dad, you know, lovingly, he's always given me books.

He's into self-help. So he had this book on memory. And he said, there's a, you know, a few pages in here on this study that's happened in East Germany. And in that study, they were shooting basketball. you know, free throws. They had one group that was physical only, another group that was mental and physical. And I had no idea what mental training was.

I don't even know that you could do that, like that you could train your mind. And then the other group, they didn't even touch a basketball, right? All they did was mental training. Results come back. The group that was the lowest by far was physical only. The group that was the highest was the mix.

Then this group that didn't even touch a basketball was only a little bit below the top group. And I was like, what the heck are they doing? That's what took me down the rabbit hole. That's where I was like, oh, I can train my mind. And that's what started the whole process. And within four years, well, the first thing I did was I cut out, you know, Sports Illustrated that had like a, you know, an Olympic issue.

And so I went and I got an idol, right? Pablo Morales, he was in there, cut out the picture, put it on the wall, took my picture and put it on the wall so that I could see that every day, you know, connecting the dots in my mind, in my subconscious mind. I was all into this sort of understanding of how powerful the mind is. And so then you fast forward four years later, state champion. That's pretty good. And then the next thing that I did, and I always tell these parts because, you know, we have an audience. that's probably going to be about youth sports going into college, speaking it into existence, your thoughts, become your words, becoming your actions. So when I get clear up here, I can walk up to a head coach with no experience and say, I want to go do that, the ultimate, can you help me? And if you said, no, I'd go find another one because I'm clear up here. So I went to, you know, I went again, starting the next phase, I went and I found the top 20 schools, D1 schools and contacted them all with a mission statement.

I said, this is who I am. This is what makes me unique. I see that you want to go do this. I think I could be an important ingredient in that. And I coach people from that perspective. I help athletes because I say if they have to come discover you, someone's getting a paycheck to have to do the legwork to find you. Now, I know that makes you feel good because you've been discovered.

But is that your first choice? Have you ever thought about going and actually contacting the place you want to go? And it's been, I've had result after result of people going and just doing that, whether it's in, and again, you can do that in business too. And so eventually I went to the university, University of Arizona, like you mentioned, sophomore year. I'm going against the Olympic gold medalist. And I'm beating him the entire race until the final. stroke. So within six years, training with tiny little kids, learning how to swim, using my mind equally as my body, I became one of the best. And then by the time I was a senior, I was a two-time national champion, like you had mentioned. And then again, you know, to go counter to what people's expectations are. Because if you look at that, no one ever spotted me. No one ever

saw me throw a ball or do something and go, hey, you know what, you should keep doing that. It started with me. It started up here. And then when my brother, I have a brother is two and a half years younger, he's the opposite personality type. He's not going to be the student necessarily the way I was about the sport, but he liked the social environment, being a part of a team. And so he started swimming when he is 17, okay? True story, all this, 14 and 17. These are like ancient age. This is like a joke. And so he went, he started swimming. He learned out to swim, all that. Had to go to junior, junior college for a year to kind of show that he was going to on the same trajectory. Because the college coaches, my college coaches were watching him and saying,

well, maybe the apple fall, doesn't fall too far from the tree. We'll keep an eye on him. He proved himself enough. He came to the University of Arizona also. And senior year, he gets up on blocks and, you know, kept it really simple with him. Your brother did it. You can do it. And all the younger brother wants to do is beat their, their older brother. Of course, yeah. He dove in and he took the race from start to finish. And we became the first brothers in the same event to win the same national title in the history of swimming, right? And we started at 14 and 17, right? And we had to get our butts to our own workouts, you know, I mean, it goes counter. And I don't want to say that people should change because I like the support. And I think it works well. But for us, you know, I think it was, you know,

evident that you can do it without, right? And that you have to kind of, on some level, the kid has to be bought in. Like it has to be their journey. So we were able to do this. And like I said, our personality is a completely opposite. So the only thing that we really share in common is that we know the power of the mind actually works, right? So if you go back to the youth, I mean, that goes counter to all that youth culture that we were talking about. That's exactly. Dude, this whole time, I'm getting bullet point after bullet point in my mind. There's so many things, three things here that I want to touch on. First of all, it's an amazing story. It says a lot about who you were as an athlete, who you are as a person, who you are now as also a professional.

I'd like to think, too, that has spilled over into your marriage and you being a father and just who you are and how you make people feel. A couple things. And I want my listeners to really, really dial in on. Not afraid of failure. Not afraid of starting. Not afraid of doing it on his own or finding a way. And, you know, you mentioned your parents, you know, people would say, well, they didn't really support, but they did, you know, in some very, you know, the most important ways.

Your parents did something for you that I know it's not going on in many households today. That was their support. They looked at you. You were 14 years old. And like, this kid wants to swim all of a sudden. He wants to go to the Olympics. Okay, show me. Show me what you're about.

You're going to, I'm going to make it so tough on you because in three and a half years, whether you're, an athlete or not, you're going to be in college and you're going to have to figure out on your own because you're not going to be under this roof. So at that point, your parents are like, okay, well, it's 10 miles to the swimming pool. Go ahead. So you went 10 miles there, trained 10 miles back, that's 20 miles of bike riding just to get to practice. So it allowed you or trained you to not only be physically fit, but also mentally fit. And that's the most important thing of what you do and what I do, is that mental fitness is the most important link in the chain. You can be as physically strong as you want,

but if that mental chain breaks, the whole chain is going to shatter. And what the other thing was is the process. You know, I hear this all too often, and sometimes it still plays in my mind, and I have to go to my coach that coaches me. I'm like, dude, I'm thinking about this. He's like, Sean, you're focusing on the results right now.

Like, dude, get out of there. Like, you know how to do this, but get out of there and focus on the process, right? You know, marry the process and divorce the result. And, you know, it's crazy because if you look back at one of the most successful coaches ever, it was John Wooden. Modern day, Nick Saban. Some people like to think that Nick Saban so focused on results, but that dude is focused on the most minute process. And so was John Wooden. It was every single day put in the work.

Don't look at that scoreboard. At the end of the game, at the end of four quarters or two halves or whatever it is in a basketball, college basketball, that we're going to win if we handle our business. And that's what you learned at such an early age. And, you know, that's important for entrepreneurs as well. You know, someone like me building out my business and going through the early growing pains. And, you know, I'd like to imagine, you know, if you rewind when you start, you. started. Maybe there were some moments where you got stuck looking at a result. And you had to remove yourself.

You had to remove yourself. You know how this works. Focus on the process. And that's what I think these kids nowadays need to look at. But more importantly, I think they're so impressionable. And they're seeing, you know, this digital age of technology. They're seeing all their friends fly to wherever and play whatever in whatever tournament. And their parents are, you know, getting hopped up and excited about this and spending thousands of thousands of dollars to go get them exposure.

And I just don't think it's advantageous for every single player. I mean, you're seeing eight U baseball teams now, Seth. Eight. My son's eight. I can't imagine. I mean, listen, literally, right? Yeah. We play Wednesday.

We play Saturday and then we practice Sunday. My daughters have dance. You know, my wife has yoga. Bobby likes to go play, do tennis lessons because we're trying to, you know, make them, you know, well-rounded, right? And then we have our business, my workouts, like, how could I even, I can't imagine traveling, you know, four days a week for baseball right now and my kids eight. It just, to me, it just, it, it drives me crazy.

And it's almost to a point where I think it's, I think it's self-serving for some of the organizations and the adults that are in charge of those organizations. And they see this like, well, hey, we've got three teams. Let's do an eight you team. That's like another 16 grand. It's, it's getting, it's getting, it's getting bad, you know, and people are starting to really get upset about it. What do you, what does your take on all that? Yeah, I think that, you know, again, we're seeing the signs from the top down. And I think that it's, I'm working with people that, you know, I'm trying to steer, you know, out of the wreckage, so to speak.

Because part of my story I haven't shared yet is that I didn't make the Olympic team, right? Pablo came off my wall and into my life. He was the one that there was a good thing. There was a good thing. Right. Right. One good thing was he handed me the national trophy when I won. So that was super cool to have that whole full circle.

But he also got back in the pool and he did what's never been done before or since. In one season, he made the Olympic team and he took the spot that I would have taken on the Olympic team. right so as the runner up so you know be specific when you really put it out there that your heroes have to stay retired um and then yeah go ahead no i think that's amazing i just be specific when you put it out there because you know you need them to be retired and stay retired i i just think it's super special because um you you're touching on a lot of visualization a lot of law of attraction stuff and I do want to get there because I fully believe in it. And I believe whatever we set in our mind has a clear and it can see.

I call it on the movie screen of our mind, you know, we can see it. Then we can actually truly go out there and do it. But I interrupt a thought. I apologize. No, no. I jump in any time. So, yeah, I missed the Olympic team that time by two tenths of a second, right? So you can, you know, that's maybe an inch, I think.

Yeah. And then the next time, you know, four years later, I go back in a different event. And I'm, I finish fourth. I'm the fourth fastest American and I'm fourth in the world and I missed it by four one hundredths of a second. So, you know, you can't even see that with a naked eye. So someone else for the rest of their life gets to call themselves an Olympian. And I don't.

I won everything else. You know, I went to the world championships, won medals. I won the World University Games, gold medal, Pan Pacific Games, gold medal. I want everything except for even, you know, I just didn't get to go to the Olympics. But that, to me, is my, you know, my lesson in what's really important about the process. And so I can speak from personal experience and be able to say,

you know, look, you know, we're not going to get caught up in those results. because if you get that identity, because what I struggled with when I was done with swimming, I had such a strong identity that when, you know, people in my circle would introduce me, they'd say, here's Seth the swimmer. You know, it kind of rolls off the time. You know, Seth the swimmers in the room, you know,

hey, if you met Seth the swimmer. And there was a certain point where I was like, you know, this is really cool. I really wanted to prove that I could go out and do this and I did it, right? But after a while, you're kind of like, the identity kind of gets a little bit like flat, you know, two-dimensional, you know. I just want to be set. And I'd say, just introduce me to Seth. And they, they wouldn't.

They were just proud and they enjoyed the moment. Well, I had panic attacks after my career, completely debilitating panic attacks, where I could, I was living in Los Angeles at the time. I couldn't get in the car and drive without having to pull over and having to walk around the block for about three hours just to bring my nervous system down, right? Wow. So it was full fight, flight, freeze. And then I went through a program at UCLA on repeat exposure so that again, I just felt like everything in my life, a weakness could turn into a strength. So through my training, you know, internally, my mental health situation, I was able to train myself back to a strength.

So the fear is not gone. I just manage it now, right? I manage it. manage it better. I detect it earlier. And so I'm able to speak from both sides of, you know, performance and health of the mind and be able to say, if you don't figure this out now, you will have to figure it out someday or you're going to have to medicate the hell out of it, right? And that's a slippery slope. You know, I understand that there is, you know, some good reason to do that. But not everyone. You know, And for me, I'm very thankful that I pushed through the weakness and made it into a strength so that I know that I can handle it. And I'm not dependent on anything or anyone.

Right. So that's what I try and coach is that, you know, people need to be able to be beyond the doing, right? And be a human being. And I try to get that in an early age so that they see the separation that you're going out to play this sport. And this sport is a choice. it is not, you know, it's not who you are. Those results are not you. You're actually going and choosing to go out there on that field and play it. That's a choice. You're not, you know, it's not interwoven with, with who you are. And little kids, you know, they just don't, you know, it's not there to be

able to make it that clear. They can get so wrapped up in it. And then if you get into specialization, that's that's really really tricky space because what if that sport you know i mean there's just so many great examples you know Patrick mahomes you know and when he won with kansas city you know the previous year they'd say it's because he scrambles and he does things from all the other sports that he played it wasn't even like they weren't saying it because he was the greatest football player of all time they were saying he does things because he gets really creative out there because he's used to scrambling because he played all those other sports right and So there's just that, you know, I just think that we need a lot more balance in the world,

whether it's mental or it's physical. I think it's an important subject that we all need to kind of start to, you know, because what I'm seeing in my coaching, it just happened yesterday. I mean, it happens every day where you start with someone and they're in a youth league, about 16 years old, right? And they go into the draft. there's a draft for some of these youth leagues, right? Selection process.

But it's mock, you know, it's like a mock-up of the actual draft, right? There's a whole thing to it, right? That's intense. We're falling in line with what's going to happen in the pros, right, if we get there, big if. So what happens is the coach, if that coach is not the greatest coach, starts coaching as if that is a salary played kid or a player, right? So now it's shifted from a team environment to a business model, and you don't even see it coming.

And all of a sudden you're going, you know, the parents are going, this doesn't really feel right, but I don't know how to speak up because he's the coach and systems in place and everyone else is, you know, falling in line. I don't want to, you know, spoil this thing. And I'm not sure, but I don't feel good about it. you know, the individual does not feel good about this. You know, they heard the conversation of the coach

and what the coach said to the player actually heard that. As a parent, there's going to be a defense mechanism inside of you going, is that right? You know, can he really talk that way? It's not only my kid, but is he talking to the whole team like that? But what he's talking is he's talking business model. he's made the child a commodity it's a product now it's just it's not a person anymore and the parents don't see it they can just feel it so i don't want to blame the parents in this whole thing i don't blame the parents

because they're loving they're trying to provide they're trying to give you know access i mean there are plenty of examples maybe they're living vicariously maybe they're not maybe they're just inexperienced in that in that sport You know, my daughter, she's, she's 10 years old. She loves gymnastics, right? When she was five, they, they were like, oh, you know what? She's really talented. She's really picking this up fast. And I'm detecting a business model. Right. Yeah, of course you are. Yeah. You want her more, you want her here more often because you're going to charge me two or three times the amount. And then what? You want my five-year-olds to go and compete every weekend in a different city? you know, and they kept pushing.

And then they started talking amongst themselves. And my daughter would come home crying saying, yeah, the coaches are talking about me as if there's something wrong with me, Dad. I went in front of the owner and I said, I was one of the best in the world at what I did. I started when I was 14. My brother was one of the best in the world at what he did. He started when he was 17, right?

Don't start selling your model to my five-year-old and then have all the people that are on your salary trying to bully her into doing what you want to do. And still to this day, she's in classes that she wants to do that have nothing to do with competition. They have everything to do about just self-expression and just enjoying gymnastics. Like, whatever happened to that, just enjoy the darn sports. You know, I think those are some really good points there. And, you know, I want to go back to it.

And I want to thank you for introducing a new perspective to me. not that I blamed the parents or thought that every parent had a living vicariously through their child complex. But like, I just want to thank you because you said, you know, you don't blame the parents. And really what's going on is these parents are doing the best that they can with what they have. They love their daughter. They love their son. And they see how much they want to be that professional baseball player, that professional volleyball player, whatever it is, swimmer, Olympian, and they want to give everything they can, even if it's their last red

sense to actualize that dream with their kid. And I see this as something that these organizations, these businesses, like you said, are imposing that business model on that five-year-old, on that eight-year-old, or whatever the age is, to a point where they're driving that sense of urgency. These kids are going home. This is what it takes. This is what it takes. If I don't do this. I'm not going to make it. And like, what that does, it, it gets into their mind at such an early age. And when they go and they are in college and they are technically a commodity at that point, right? I mean, let's just be honest, right? If, if you don't get it done, Seth, there's like 10 Seth Pepper's waiting to jump off the block. I mean, that's just the way it is.

And so for me, going back to that a little bit about me, that's how I was in college. It was a complete shock to me, right? Because I went to LSU and I was like, oh, my God, I'm going to LSU. This is like the pinnacle. This is what I've always wanted. And so I kind of already took myself out of the game because I was no longer that dude walking around. I was like, oh my God, I'm at Disneyland. Like, look at this, right?

And I wasn't prepared. And I broke mentally because I had all these expectations. you know, whether it was from my father or, you know, just fear too. I was letting fear really drive me because I was always told if you don't make it in the major leagues, then you're going to be in trouble. Like, you don't have any other skills. Like who you are as a baby. That is your identity.

That's who you are. And so for me, I didn't really understand how to navigate through that in college. When I got to, you know, the SEC, you know, there was an, you know, an injury, right? There was a surgery. Then it was like a two-year rehab. And then I finally got back on the field, went from six-string to second string. My senior year got some playing time, but it still wasn't good enough, right?

And it didn't get any better, right? Because, again, that's my identity. And it starts from an early age, just like you said, five years old, whatever age that is. I did start a little bit later, seven, eight years old. But like from that point on, I was, for, I, I was French the catcher. I was Sean the baseball player. And so when it was over for me in 2003, boy, did I just implode.

Like I literally was the worst person. I lost friendships. I wasn't a good person. And it was because I was so hurt and completely distraught because I didn't even know who the hell I was. And I think that, you know, that was my. you know, my, a little bit of my story. And that's what, you know, propelled me to doing what I'm doing now, you know, striving to be a performance coach like yourself, like Ben Newman, like all these, like all these dudes that are having such an amazing impact on athletes and, and CEOs, because

you guys understand the mental aspect of everything. And I always say, like, I just want to help people because I'm working with high school athletes right now. You know, in some Division I, college baseball players and Division II college baseball players. And it's just the stories are so similar. And I feel it. Like I have a reaction to it. You know, like in my heart,

I'm just like, oh, man, dude, I feel you, bro. Like I know exactly what's going on. You know, it's almost like these coaches, you know, sometimes, you know, I'll probably get some blowback for this. but sometimes I feel like they don't know how to communicate with young adults. Yeah, I think that they're, just because your coach doesn't mean that you're, you know, good at even your job, let alone, you know, communicating. So, right.

I mean, I've been through, I went through some coaches early on and, you know, challenging because I wasn't their model. I wasn't the kid that had been in the program for a long time. it was this sort of freak thing that came along and I did an event that they weren't really familiar with, you know? You were that alien. You didn't even know how to swim when you're 14 and all of a sudden you're banging down the door to the Olympics.

Like, this kid's an alien. What's he talking about going to the Olympics? What's wrong with him? Yeah. Oh my gosh. You know, he qualified for districts. Oh, my gosh. He's going to state.

Oh, my God. He won the state. And then I'm gone. I'm out of town, right? I show up. and I'm gone, I didn't need to be the favorite. I was never the favorite. Everyone should know that.

I was never the darling kid, because there's always a darling kid that's the teacher, you know, the coach's pet. I was not that at all. I was breaking all the rules. And I knew that I was breaking all the rules up here first, you know, so, you know, I'd have people that would say, you know, you can't keep doing that, you know, and what they're saying is you can't keep improving that quickly. You know, it's interesting.

You keep pointing to this, and we've talked about and touched on it, this is what we do, right? So when was it for you that you truly understood, you know, I'm guessing you're going to go back to that moment, right? But there was probably a lot of times throughout your young adulthood where it just became solidified. Like my most powerful tool is between my ears. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I didn't have any other things because I was all in, right? I felt like I was Indiana Jones.

My whole career was, you know, it was pressure sensitive, time sensitive. And so, you know, like there's the old, you know, Indiana Jones Temple of Zoom, there's this big boulder rolling down and he's barely getting out. That was my whole career was I got this short period of time. I got four years. I didn't come from a family that could really afford, you know, going through. to college. So I knew that my dream was dead if I didn't get to a point where I could, you know, market myself to colleges, right? And so I didn't have the time to sit around and go, does this work or doesn't it work? It made sense to me. Some part of me, I mean,

like the saying that I have behind me, you know, Unlimit Your Potential. That popped into my head when I was like six years old. So I've been wired to do this. I'm wired to look at things. things really super simple, as you can kind of tell the way I communicate is really like, I'm giving people like something quick that they can remember and take it out under a pressure situation out into the battlefield. I'm wired that way. That's my way my mind works. And so I'm looking for patterns, you know, a pattern of expansion, a pattern of contraction, blockages. That's kind of my whole world. And so what I was trying to do was I was trying, once I knew that this. was a tool, right? Then I was like, how do I leverage it? It was all leveraging, right? So it was

convincing myself that I was faster than I really was. And I was like, you know, and if you really go back and you study the grades and self-help, it doesn't have to be performance oriented. They would say, if you tell a lie to yourself long enough, you'll believe it, right? So that's, to me, was my mental, you know, training was, I'm going to lie to myself and negative. You're right. all the time yeah or like you know and i i like to i love to study the grates so it's an ongoing process um i feel like i'm evolving um with the people that i work with at the same time um like you know one of one of the phrases that i like is as tyson how he says it's all delusion and you know until you make it right when you make it then everyone you know goes oh wait you just did that

you're world champion now. They don't realize that your entire career up to that point. People were laughing at you making fun of you. You know, like I got to a certain point, and I'd be at school and I'd be at lunch. And someone would go, hey, I saw the headline that you did well in districts. Are you going to go to the Olympics? You know, they start teasing you. Kids tease you because they're threatened.

And so I coached people through this. If someone is threatened by you because you're stepping. into your greatness. They're just projecting. It has nothing to do with you. And if you think of how many people took things personal, and that became the end of their journey or that became the fork in the road where they headed off and, you know, went away because so-and-so said that I, you know, I was a dreamer. You know, imagine how many killed dreams. Yeah. And I coached people through that because I, there's one story of helping a guy on Monday. He contacted me. I had no idea who he was, didn't even know the sport that he was in. And we started talking. We had a 45 minute

conversation. And he said, I got this practice on Thursday. I really care about. Okay. And so I could tell that he had, I'm looking for patterns. He had this pattern of self-sabotage, right? He definitely had the ability. But every time he went to anything that could be a performance, a competition, some weird thing would happen. Like, even like mind-body connection of like, he'd get a rash. Oh, wow. Stuff like that. Yeah. Just different weird things like, yeah.

And so I was like, okay, I'm going to try and steer him around any sort of these sort of self-inflicted, you know, barriers. And so I gave him a tool just to, you know, kind of trick it and go around it. And, you know, it was this identity sort of, you know, it was a temporary sort of, you know, allow him space to just be delusional for that Thursday practice. So he goes to Thursday practice, and he calls me all excited afterwards, and he says, I made it. I said, you made it. I thought it was just a practice. He said, no, it was a tryout for the NBA. I'm now in the NBA.

So he had been in the G-League, finally the Gator-Rid game on Monday, and then the top team, the world championship team selected him in this tryout. And the only difference between those four days was up here. It's amazing. So I experienced it. My brother experienced it. And now this complete stranger in a 45-minute conversation just basically unlock what's going on up here temporarily.

And then he goes to the top. So, I mean, that to me is like, that's massive. And if you take something like that and you apply it, you know, I've been able to help sales executives and the fastest growing tech company in the world that contact me and say, hey, would you train me like an athlete? yeah, let's do it.

Took him from the bottom of sales all the way of the top, doubled second place in a matter of two and a half months. And all I did was have him focus on the metric of the rep. You know, you know that in sports. It's all about the rep. I kept saying, is it really that simple? Yes, it is that simple.

And I calm them down. I bring him back to what's the metric, what's your commitment? What's the little tiny thing you're going to do today? You do this to this. got straight to the top. Now he's the manager of all the sales executives. He's got the dream job.

And he's really young too. And I said, now you've become the coach. Now you've got to find out how to motivate everyone on your team, you know, in your office. And so now the real work comes because now you've got to figure out all those different personalities and what makes them too. Yeah. Yeah, that's the frontline management is always the most difficult, right? Not because you're always needed, but then you have to find out what works for everybody. because it's not a one-size-fits-all.

You have to lead in a differentiated manner. You know, it's funny, though, because you give that example. And I think, you know, kind of, and I'm glad you went down that road to kind of land the plane here a little bit. Whatever performance industry you're in, whether it's business or sports, it's all tied to that one thing. That is your process.

What are your non-negotiables? What are part of your actionable items that you need to do every single day, right? Is it for business? Is it 20 reachouts? Well, don't do 19, do 20. That's kind of what you're talking about. Sticking to the plan that you created or co-authored with your coach in order to create that success and that momentum. And then when you gain that momentum, whether it's on the playing field in the pool, on the court, or in the board room, you continue to execute those items.

Yeah. That's all it is. Yeah. And now as a coach, as the manager of his team, he's like, wow, it really is that simple. But it's, it's really, it takes a lot of work to convince people that it's that simple. And he's like, it'll take him six months just to realize it is that simple. Yeah. Yeah.

I mean, you know, follow the recipe, right? You look at a recipe for the best chocolate cake in the world. You're going to look at it. You're like, really? Like, that's what I got to do. And then you're going to be doing. And then you're questioning it the whole time. Right.

Like, did it say like a quarter cup or whatever? Like, be sure that's enough? Like, all right, whatever, I'll do it. But whatever. It ain't going to work. And then you, you bake that cake and it comes out amazing. You're like, oh, okay, trust the process. Let me do that again tomorrow.

Man, I tell you what, man, the only bad thing is we don't have like three hours to talk because I'm learning so much from you. And I've truly appreciated, you know, our conversation. And I'm looking forward to continued conversations offline, hopefully, in building a relationship with you. And, man, I got to tell you, it's just, it was an absolute honor of mind to have you on the show today.

And man, how can my audience best support you? Well, you know, if they want to go to the website, you know, I'm always here. I try to put all the interviews that I've done, you know, be a resource. I've always been an open book. So, you know, if they want to go, it's just my full name, Sethpiper.com.

and again, I just feel like my story personally and then the work that we do is really important in the world right now. I think that it's in big demands. And, you know, just to know that first of all, this is that powerful. And then also to be able to manage it so that you're, you know, kind of working with both performance and health simultaneously. And, you know, trying to shed some light. in the ecosystem right now because there's a you know really there's a huge demand to try and figure this thing out absolutely i try to be supportive whatever way i can absolutely and i think your your instagram handle too i know you're not big in social media but you're are you just it's

at set pepper right yeah i try to do set pepper across the board so same thing on lincoln and yeah yeah so cool so yeah awesome it was i guess the biggest question of the day is like how How can I best support you? Is there anything that I can do to help spread your message, whatever you need, man? I'd like to know. I just have enjoyed the podcast. I hope that it reaches, you know, out there. It's like a little child, right?

Yeah. Yeah. And see who it, you know, who it touches. And so just keep doing what you're doing. I think you ask great questions. I would just say, you know, we are the audience, right? So I know that I've said things to you that I haven't said to others. and I'm speaking really clearly, so you must be really clear.

I like to say to other people, you know, the people that I work with, I'm like, you have to see greatness in yourself before you can see it in others, you know, because I can spot it. I swear you, I could spot greatness and it is the tangible thing. So it must be something I can see in myself. So I can see that at you. So, you know, the conversation has been really, you know, not only a lot of fun, but I think that there was a lot of clarity and, you know, we went through a good journey together.

I think it was great. I think there was, I think it was clear. I think it was fun. I think it was informative. And you stretched me and I appreciate that. You know, I was hoping that you would, you know, because, you know, you and I have never had the opportunity to speak or connect prior to us hopping on this. And so you never know what you're going to get on the other side of the Zoom lens, right? So I, that's the fun of it. And, you know, I feel like, you know, the fun part about the episode was giving all the information, but then also, too, like, really just learning each other. And I think that, you know, there's a big mission out there to improve the mental aspect in youth sports and even professional sports, collegiate level,

Olympic level, and just bringing awareness with high-level individuals like yourself. I think for me it's more than a dream, so I appreciate it. Oh, thank you. And it's 100% mutual and let's go out there and, you know, help some people. Let's do this. Well, I'm going to conclude the episode here. Hang out when we're done recording. I want to talk to you really quick. But you're here to hear, guys, the mind is the most powerful thing that you have and anything you want in this life. If you are clear on it and you speak it to existence and you visualize it every single day with clarity, it can come to pass. So, you know, you heard it here first on how to unlimited your potential with Seth Pepper. Share the show, guys.

If you're listening to this, please share it out. Share it with your friends, your family, an athlete you may know, a coach, whomever. But that's how we're going to grow. And that's how this message is going to get out there. The message dies with us unless you guys share it. So I appreciate you all. Until the next time, y'all be good. Rinse takes your laundry and hand delivers it to your door.

expertly cleaned and folded. So you could take the time once spent folding and sorting and waiting to finally pursue a whole new version of you. Like tea time you. Or this tea time you. Or even this tea time you. Said you hear about Dave? Or even tea time, tea time, tea time you.

So update on Dave. It's up to you. We'll take the laundry. Rinse, it's time to be great.