The Glenn Beck Program - Best of the Program | Guest: Frank McCourt | 2/3/25

Episode Date: February 3, 2025

The clock is ticking, Glenn warns. America is living a lifestyle that it cannot afford, and the country cannot sustain itself if it continues. Glenn lays out exactly what is going wrong with America���s economy and what President Trump is doing to try to stop it, and he warns of what is coming if nothing changes. Glenn discusses the shocking news that Trump’s DOGE organization found regarding USAID. Is USAID nothing more than a covert CIA operation that funnels money endlessly? Project Liberty founder Frank McCourt joins to explain why he’s in the race to buy TikTok and why believes the platform is worth saving.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Everybody was talking about tariffs today, and that's what I really wanted to explain. I want to explain what Trump is doing with the tariffs and how the clock is ticking on what's happening in America. Also, Doge versus USAID. This one is important. It shows this government is opening the lid on the black ops. And Frank McCourt, the billionaire that wants to buy TikTok all on today's podcast. When you're trying to do something that is complicated and difficult, maybe even a little scary. It's nice to have a partner, somebody who would not only be there,

but will be there for you when you need it. That's why when it comes to trying to buy or sell a house or both, you really need the best possible real estate agent you can get. Do you know how to interview? Do you know what questions to ask to know if this person has the best plan? Over a decade ago, I formed a company called Real Estate Agents I Trust, and it exists in a way to make sure that you get the job done the first time and done right. I started by working with the 500 best real estate agents in the country, according to the Wall Street Journal, and learn their best practices and found others just like them.

Somebody who understands the crazy housing market, somebody who's a team leader, a closer, knows the difference than just putting up balloons and actually having a digital marketing system as well. If you're thinking about buying or selling a home or both, please get in touch with them. It's real estate agents.i trust.com. Real estate agents, I trust.com. You're listening to the best of the Glenback program.

All right. The clock is ticking. Of that ticking clock. And it's happening faster than people realize. There is a freight train that is barreling down the tracks and we are standing right in its path. And we're debating whether the tracks should be made of steel or recycled materials. I don't think that's what we should be talking about. The train doesn't care.

It's coming either way. You, however, because you are paying attention, you can get off the tracks and warn others as well to the game that's being played now at a global level. We have to move, but we must not blink. Let's start with tariffs here. I'm going to cover a lot of things this hour, but tariffs, they're a really big deal. But Canada, this isn't about you. It's not about Mexico. It's not about Panama.

It's about security. It's about drug runners. It's about our borders. It's about making America strong again. It's honestly about the U.S. and the end of the structure that was set up post-World War II. That's what it is. Now, the left and economic experts will now tell you, you can't do that. But that's what they've been doing.

They've been dismantling the economic structure of post-World War II, right? I mean, they say it. It can't continue like this. It's going to collapse. That's why we need a great reset. Except they want the great reset to go to a bigger global system. Donald Trump says no, it needs to be America first. Just as Canada, the EU, Mexico, and the rest should do the same for their country.

The United States, and quite honestly, the entire Western world, and I think the Eastern world as well, is at the precipice of an economic, political, and societal reckoning, unlike anything the world has faced since maybe the Great Depression. And in some ways, it's worse, because this time it's not just about economics. It's about trust. It's about trust in our institutions, trust in our leaders, and even trust in one another. And that's what makes this moment so dangerous. President Trump is walking into a storm, perhaps running head first right into it,

with a task that borders on the impossible. Think of this. He's got to be right. Not most of the time. Not right on balance. He has to be right almost every time, every policy, every decision, every negotiation. he's got to be right. It has to be in the right order, the right timing, and the right execution.

And we must not blink as he negotiates. Because here's the truth. We are out of margin for error. As pilots would say, we're out of runway. We have no more runway. It's either get this plane up or crash. Now imagine trying to diffuse a bomb with. shaky hands after somebody else set the timer and booby trapped all of the wiring.

That's exactly what we're dealing with. However, for anyone who's beginning to shrink because of the shrieks of Justin Trudeau and make you question what Trump is doing with tariffs, look who came to the negotiating table this weekend. Panama. What? I thought they were going to fight to the bitter end. No, they're returning the control of the Panama Canal to us.

We don't own it, but they're kicking China out. That's what he wanted. So for the first time, America, you need to understand, first time since Ronald Reagan, at least, that we've had a president who knows what the truth is and knows how to get it. Justice Reagan said, that's an evil empire of communism, our number one enemy.

Trump is declaring globalism, our number one enemy, and returning jobs in manufacturing back to America. That's what's happening. That's what he's doing. You see, we have to grow our way out of this debt. It's not enough just to cut. We also have to grow. Our debt is over $34 trillion and climbing.

Our annual deficit is over $1.7 trillion. The interest on our debt alone is $1 trillion a year, just the interest. That's more than we spend on national defense. It's going to surpass what we spend on Social Security. And once that happens, the math doesn't work, and it collapses under its own weight. And that will happen because almost all of the debt accrued under Biden, were written as short-term loans. A lot of it comes back up to be re-loaned and remorgeted this next 18 months.

Now, because Biden was such a good negotiator, we're going to have to negotiate under higher interest rates. Uh-oh. this is why we don't have a choice. Just this one fact, if not dealt with, quickly, will kill us. The Federal Reserve, our so-called economic firefighter, is out of water. In fact, I think they've been an arsonist for a long time. Interest rates are already high. Inflation is sticky.

Quantitative easing the magic trick that they told us would work for over a decade is no longer even an option. the Fed printed $8 trillion in the last 15 years. And what did we get? What did we get? Did we get new companies, new manufacturing, new jobs everywhere? No, we got asset bubbles, distorted markets, and the illusion of prosperity for us as the Uber-rich and large corporations, along with the banks, just got much, much, much richer.

The illusion is finally fading. reality is setting in. There's going to be a great reset. Most likely it'll be on Wall Street. And just when we thought it couldn't get more complicated, here comes artificial intelligence and artificial super intelligence, reshaping the entire world what will feel like overnight. Millions of jobs are going to be obsolete.

Now, will there be new ones? Probably. They usually come. Are they going to come fast enough? No, there's going to be pain. We've talked about that for 15 years. See, everything that we've ever talked about that ended with somebody, usually a president, saying, and at that point, there will be no good options, we're here. That's where we are.

And the economy isn't, it's not a machine you can just reboot. It's more like an ecosystem, and we've been poisoning it now. for decades. So how do you fix this? How do you pull a nation back from the brink when it's addicted to easy money and cheap credit and government handouts? Well, you start by telling the truth. And that's what Donald Trump has been saying.

We screwed ourselves and we've been screwed by every other nation and including ourselves, mainly ourselves. Look, we're broke. Yes, if the world were a neighborhood, we'd be the one that. that had the biggest house, the nicest cars. We might even have a fleet of jets. But what the neighbors now know is that everything in our house, including our house, was purchased on loan. And our income can no longer service just the interest on the loan.

Everybody knows, it seems, except perhaps the family inside of the house with the fancy gates. That would be us. This is why the one trillion cuts, $4 billion a day that Elon Musk announced over the weekend, is a really big deal. But it cannot be the end. It has to be the beginning.

Because we can't afford to be the world's babysitter or policeman anymore. We can't keep writing blank checks to foreign countries while our own people are in real danger. It's really easy. We as a nation, as a nation, need to down. size. That's it. We need to look at our government and say it's far too big. We need cuts. And the most important thing is a new mindset. The post-World War II order is over. That system where

America props up the global economy, defends half the planet, underwrites everybody else's welfare state, it's over. It's dead. Why? Why are we still living under trade laws that were written right after World War II to help rebuild the European and German car companies. I think Mercedes is okay. I think they'll make it without us. It's been dead for years. This thing has been on life support for decades, and it's been dead for at least two decades, maybe three.

We just haven't had the funeral yet, and we need to. Countries like Panama are already beginning at the negotiating table. Why? Why? Donald Trump is playing a serious game. He is a serious negotiator. We still hold sway in that neighborhood, even though everybody knows we're broke. It's our security team that protects the entire neighborhood. If we stop, they'll need to spend money.

Money they don't have, or at least haven't been willing to spend. So, yeah, you like our jets, you like our protection, you like the world order, yeah, you're going to have to pay for some of it because we're done. And the world is feeling the shift. And the ones who are really against it were the ones that were designing a new global community, not a local community. The tariffs, the economic pressure, it's not just about money. It's about leverage. For the first time in generations, we're forcing other nations to stand on their own two feet. We're telling them, look, we have standards.

We have a border and you cannot allow China to come in, make all that fentanyl right under your nose and then ship it across our border with drug cartels. And if you can't control them, we're going to push you first, 25% tariff. And if you can't control them, then we're going to take care of those drug cartels. cartels ourselves because they're killing people here in America. And Canada, I'm sorry, it's not about you. We're good friends. We are. But you have problems as well. You need to look at Canada first. We've all built our economies on the illusion that we could have it all without paying the price. Bricks is building an alternative to the U.S. dollar as a global reserve currency, which is not a

conspiracy theory. It's happening. China, Russia, India, Brazil, South Africa, they're betting against us and Canada is beginning to say they'll join Panama and others to stand against us too. Fine. Bet on America's best days are behind us. But no, they're not. They're hedging their future against the collapse of the dollar. That's fine. If they're right, if the dollar loses its status as the World Reserve currency, then our standard of living will collapse almost overnight. but it's going to anyway if we don't act boldly now. Here's the thing. It's not just about economics. It's also about character.

We've been living in a fantasy too long, believing economic magic tricks can print wealth out of thin air, or we could borrow it forever without any consequence. That's not how reality works. Reality has rules. And if you break them, you pay the price. And we're not the only ones that broke all those rules. schools. Every country in the West did. We're just the first now under Donald Trump to say, okay, we're out of that game. Cuts are coming. Deep cuts. Cuts that will make people scream.

Cuts to programs that you think are sacred. Cuts to programs that I think are sacred. Because if everything is sacred, then nothing is sacred. We've treated government spending like an all you can eat buffet, but the bill is now doing, guess what? There's no such thing as a free lunch. And in fact, every item we ate had a very high price. It's easy to say cut the waste. But the truth is, the waste isn't enough. Even if you eliminated every dollar of fraud, waste, and abuse, it wouldn't fix the problem. Because the problem is us.

It's our expectations. Our unwillingness to make sacrifices. Our unwillingness to do it ourselves and force others to do it themselves. Every generation before us has faced hard times, wars, depression, pandemics. They rose to the occasion. The history books are just wondering which direction am I going to write this in. Will we stand up? Because a lot of tough things are coming.

A lot of tough things. But here's the hope. We still choose how this story ends. We face the truth now while we still have some options. We can tighten our belts, make the cuts, rebuild our economy on solid ground. It's going to be painful, painful here, and painful for other countries. But pain's not the enemy.

Complacency is. You know, I worry about these tariffs as well, but Donald Trump is not a lawyer. I mean, all of our presidents usually come from law. He's not a lawyer. He's not a politician. He's a businessman, so he knows how the economy works. He's the best negotiator I've ever seen. And over the last eight years, he has earned at least my trust and respect.

I don't follow him blindly, nor should you. I worry about the effects of tariffs, but I think I see what he's doing and why he's doing it, and it may be the last chance we have if we do not let others see us blink. This isn't about politics. This is about survival. The world has we known it since World War II is over, and that's not a bad thing. It's an opportunity. It's an opportunity to rebuild something better, stronger, something real.

The question is, are we brave enough to face it? Or will we believe the truth when we hear it? Are you living with pain? If so, how bad is it? How frequent is it? It is a sort of thing that just only annoys you, or does it interfere with the way you live your life? You have to make decisions based on whether or not it's going to flare up. Here are a few follow-up questions.

How long are you going to put up with it? What have you tried to get rid of it? Have you tried everything? Because that's what I thought. I tried everything. My wife said, no, yeah, I mean, I've tried this. It's not going to work. It's a daily supplement.

Helps your body fight inflammation. I know that trick. That doesn't work. I've been taking ibuprofen my old life. It doesn't work. This does, strangely. I don't know why. I think it's because of the ingredients.

It actually works with. your body to help fight inflammation, which is the cause of most of our disease and most of our pain. Make 2025 the year of feeling good and living great. Try the relief factor three-week quick start right now for 1995. That's less than a dollar a day. 800, 4 relief, 800, the number 4 relief. Or visit relieffactor.com. Now back to the podcast. This is the best of the Glenn Beck program. Let me tell you about what happened this weekend with doge. This is something was tucked, tucked beneath the

political squabbles and the Grammy night celebrity nonsense. It is a story far more important than any of our daily distractions and it makes me oh so very happy and you'll understand why in a minute. This story pulls

the curtain back on who really holds the reins of power in our country. I want to connect a few dots with you here in the next 40 minutes or so. We're going to talk about USAID. We're going to talk about Elon Musk, Donald Trump, and Doge, the Department of Government Efficiency. Doge and the Trump team are battling it out with USAID. We cannot let Elon Musk see our books. We are not giving him. Really? You run an aid program.

what's so top secret that you can't let him see it? This is about control. Control over the flow of information, over government secrecy, and yes, control over your tax dollars. So here's the story in a nutshell. In case you didn't know, USAID, the U.S. Agency for the International Development,

had its director of security, Jonathan Vorhees and his deputy, Brian McGill, placed on administrative leave. Why? Because they refused to grant access to security systems and systems containing sensitive personnel files, security clearance information, even classified materials to employees of Doge. When Vorhees and McGill said, no, you're not allowed to see any of this. That's when the Doge team threatened to call in the U.S. Marshals. The U.S. marshals over a bureaucratic disagreement. No.

Remember this is about something much, much bigger. It's about who controls the machinery of the government when it comes to foreign influence, covert operations, and the shadow games our government is playing overseas. So let's start with USAID. On paper, it sounds great, right? The U.S. Agency for International Development. They're the folks who help develop countries, build schools and fight diseases and support democracy.

First of all, I don't want to be in that business as a government. But if you've been paying attention, history will tell you something else. It's well known that USAID has been much more than an aid operation since its inception in 1961. By the way, can you tell me anything that happened, you know, with the government and overseas things that was good that happened in the 50s and 60s? Maybe the Peace Corps, maybe the Peace Corps, but I doubt it. USAID is a covert CIA operation. They do covert black ops all around the world. And their money just comes in and it just, oh, it's no, this is aid.

black hole. Now this is not a conspiracy theory. This is historic fact. In the Cold War, USAID funded cultural organizations and student groups and agricultural projects. They were covers for intelligence gathering. And they have been accused of everything from influencing elections in foreign countries to helping overthrow governments that didn't align with our interests. Do you want any country doing that? No, we have a big problem with other countries influencing our elections? How dare they? Uh-huh.

Black Ops. Do you remember the color revolutions in Europe? Yeah. Yeah. Now, don't get me wrong. I'm not saying that every employee at USAID is a covert operative. Most, I'm sure, are good, decent people trying to do their jobs. But the agency has always had a,

dual identity, part humanitarian, part shadowy extension of U.S. foreign policy through the CIA. And that's really the part that I think is interesting here. Because every nation knows that this is a CIA front, except the American people. We don't. We don't know that apparently. We doesn't. No, no, we're good. You know, it has billions of dollars in black covert money flowing through it. We just don't know it because those with oversight can't see the records. President team has just been denied access. Wait a minute. Who works for who?

This is an aid thing. What do you have that is so very top secret? So here comes Doge. The Department of Government Efficiency. Sounds pretty harmless. Yeah. Like a bunch of accountants trying to balance the budget. That's all we're trying to do.

But those who are running black ops know that Doge has two agendas, and the president has made it very clear. Yes, cut the waste, downsize the government. But it also has another very specific mission, except this isn't a black op. Again, this mission is right out in the open where all missions should be. their mission is not only to cut the budget, but to break up the entrenched bureaucracies that have been running Washington like their own personal fiefdoms. Trump's goal was to drain the swamp,

and Doge is supposed to be one of the tools that is headed by Elon Musk to drain that swamp. Now, I personally like it for a couple of reasons. Elon Musk is one of the world's greatest minds. I mean, when he goes into his own companies, he sits with every employee for about five minutes and just says, what are you working on this week? And if they don't have something that, you know, he feels is like really moving the company forward, you're not necessary. You're fired. He has a knack for cutting waste and making companies more efficient and also coming up with some really good products.

He's a disruptor. He doesn't do things like everybody else. He doesn't think like everybody else. That's his strength. He disrupts industries. He challenges the norms. And he's been on a very public mission to expose and challenge what he sees his government overreach, whether it's with Twitter or X or even the critiques of regulatory agencies.

Now, he can come in and he can look at these things and go, wait a minute, this doesn't seem to be exactly, you know, what you're supposed to be doing. This is different. This isn't about posting memes and calling out the woke mind virus. This is about accessing the very heart of the government's covert machinery. That's what's happening with USAID because it's not about aid programs. It's all about data. It's all about networks. It's all about the hidden influence that the U.S. experts flex all around the world.

world, including perhaps inside the United States against her own people, but we don't know. And now for the first time in decades, somebody from the outside of traditional power structures are saying, huh, what is it you guys do here? And guess what? The machine doesn't like it. The people who have been running that machine also don't like it. I want you to remember who was in charge of USAID. Does anybody remember? Anybody? Bueller? Anybody? Samantha Power. Now, Samantha Power, she's the wife of the Harvard professor, Obama advisor, and author of the really super important book called Nudge. How to get people to do what you want them to do without them knowing. Nudge. So,

the wife of that guy, who I'm sure has nothing to do with nudging or doing anything like that, even though she was with the Biden or the Obama administration forever, she doesn't know anything about that. This is why John Voorhees and Brian McGill push back. That's why they're risking their careers to say, no, you can't come in here. Because they weren't just protecting the files. they were protecting the status quo. They're protecting a system that is operated in the shadows for decades

with little to no accountability to the American people. And here's where it gets even more fascinating. The employees at USAID and across the federal bureaucracy aren't just fighting to protect sensitive information. They are fighting to protect their power. He's getting into the roots now. He's opening up to it. You know how Donald's.

Trump is kind of like a human hand grenade. I've said this to his face. You know, I think you're kind of like a human hand grenade. What do you mean? Well, I mean, you're the greatest human hand grenade I've ever seen. Don't get me wrong. You just kind of throw yourself into things and then a wall comes down. And as the dust is settling, everybody goes, wait a minute, what's on the other side of that wall?

That's what's happening. Except this time, they're not just lobbing grenades in. They know where it is. Over the years, we've created this massive administrative state, which is a fourth branch of government that nobody votes for. Wholly unconstitutional. No one really controls it. You notice that the people on Capitol Hill,

they're afraid of the intelligence agencies. So who's really boss then? They operate with a level of secrecy that would make our founding fathers roll in their graves. This administrative state has been the gatekeeper of information, deciding who gets to know what, both here, at home, and abroad. Does the president even know? So when Trump and Musk come knocking, knocking, knocking at the door,

trying to peek behind the curtain, the reaction is swift and fierce. Because if they succeed, they'll manage to pull USAIDs up. and put it right under direct control of the State Department, or even worse in the public eye, they'll be held accountable for things. We can't have that. It will expose decades of covert actions, questionable alliances, the dark side of U.S. foreign policy that has been hidden under the guise of aid. It's why the rest of the world hates us. Think about some of the crazy. things we've done in the name of foreign aid. We've funneled money to warlords

in Afghanistan. We gave money to the Taliban, money to Gaza to prop up Hamas. We've run guns to the Syrian group ISIS, propped up dictators in Latin America, even funded opposition groups in countries where we wanted regime change all under the

banner of freedom and democracy. Again, this is why everybody hates the American government. Her people see our influence as good and benevolent. And sometimes, I think we are. Other times, America is anything but. So in exchange for our tax dollars, we've asked countries to change their laws, to accept abortion in places where the people are morally outraged. We promote transgenderism

in their schools. We tell them that this is the enlightened way to go, otherwise they lose their raid. We force them to open their markets to multinational corporations that sometimes don't have their best interest at heart. And we conduct military operations on their soil. You will do it our way. And yet you don't know anything about it. Most Americans have no idea because it's all wrapped up in the nice shiny package of humanitarian assistance. So here's what happens if Doge succeeds. What happens if Musk and Trump managed to pry open the lid to this operation? Well, for once, the bureaucrats lose control of one of their many hiding places. The intelligence community loses one of its more useful tools.

And the American people might finally get to see just how much of their hard-earned money has been used not to build schools or feed the hungry, but to manipulate foreign governments and maintain our empire of influence. And here's the kicker. This isn't about just the past. It is about the future. Because if Musk and Trump can break through this wall, it sets a precedent. It says no part of the government is beyond scrutiny of our elected officials. And that terrifies people who have been running the show.

So what do we take away? One, pay attention. Stories like these are not. bureaucratic squabbles. This is the battle front. This is the battle line right there that will decide who actually runs the country. We're going to see more on this and the intelligence agencies are not going to like it. So one thing I would take away from this is don't take any news story at face value for a while. There are many hiding places and those who receive and use dark money for black ops are going to fight back. Second, ask questions. Continue to ask questions. Why does

USAID have classified systems that other government officials can't access? Why is there so much resistance in an aid organization to transparency? And third, remember the people that are screaming the loudest about protecting democracy are often the ones most afraid of the people actually seeing how the sausage gets made. So this isn't about. USAID, Doge, or even Trump and Musk. It's about whether you have the right to know what our government is doing with your money. Stay curious, America. We will get to the bottom of this, but we have to be willing to go through the tough times, remain determined and vigilant. You're streaming the best of the Glenn Beck program, and you can find full episodes

wherever you download podcasts. So Frank McCourt, best known as the former owner of the Los Angeles Dodgers, has placed a bit in to buy TikTok through a group that he started called Project Liberty. Project Liberty is, I think, a really good mission. They are trying to make sure that the data that everybody collects on us is owned by each of us, rather than by the tech giants. And he wants to start this with TikTok. Welcome to the program.

How are you, Frank? I'm well, Glenn. How are you doing today? I'm good. I'm good. So tell me first. I guess we start with Project Liberty. Explain what you're trying to do with that.

Yeah. So we have this awesome internet technology, which we all are dependent on now. It's no longer a nice to have, right? it's a must have. And it's evolved into a place that I believe, and those of us involved in Project Liberty believe, is very bad for American citizens and for America at large. And the reason I say that is that everything about us now is captured and, you know, scraped from a, you know, and aggregated in, you know, centralized places and, uh, including China in one instance.

And all of this information about us essentially creates a virtual version of us that it should be owned by each of us, right? Because when you, when you have all of this information and all this knowledge extracted and, and single centralized points knowing about us and can manipulate us and so on and so. But that's that's antithetical to democratic principles, right, where individuals have agency and own and control themselves. So we started this project five years ago, December of 19, to build an alternative tech stack, which would allow individuals to own themselves, to own their personhood in the digital age,

to own their data and to permission its use and to get value for it, quite frankly, because it turns out it's extremely valuable. So that's what Project Liberty is about. The TikTok bid is intended to really accelerate the effort. We've built the tech stack. It's up and operating. There's a couple million people using it now, but a couple million people is not an alternative internet.

We need a couple hundred million people. So I tell you, I have been concerned about this. And really, especially when you look at the power that is being consolidated with just a few individuals and a few companies, the only thing that we have is our own information. That's where our power and money comes from is from our information. And they've just taken it all from. We've given it to them. But it is absolutely time. We take it back.

Is that even possible, Frank, to do that? Yeah. Yeah, absolutely possible. And that's why I committed a half a billion dollars to this project to actually build the technology to prove that it's possible. And that's up and running. As I said, we have a couple million people using it now and several apps built on it. But we need much more than that. You know, Glenn, you hit the nail on the head.

I mean, look, if I was the postmaster general and I said to you and your listeners, I have an idea. I have a deal for everyone. You can send your mail from now on for free. No stamps. You know, send it for free. you might say, well, okay, what's the deal? All right. Well, in exchange, I'm going to put a camera and listening device in every room of your house, in your car, in your workplace, and I'm going to surveil you 24 hours a day.

You'd say, wait a second, that's super creepy. And I say, well, but it's for free, no more stamps. Oh, one other thing I have to tell you, I'm going to open your mail, I'm going to read it, and everything I learn, you know, not just where you shop or what food you like to eat or this or that, but your, you're, your, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're. thoughts, including your most intimate ones, your feelings, including your most intimate ones, they're now mine, okay? So you would say, wait a second, this is creepy and very unfair. Oh, one other thing, I'm going to read your 14-year-old daughter's diary when I learn she's concerned about her weight. I'm going to push stuff towards her to make her feel worse. Then I'm going to push stuff towards her, have her buy things because I've made her feel worse.

I'm going to profit from that. Oh, and while I'm at it, I'm going to teach her, show her how to cut herself, hurt herself, harm herself, because I've made her feel so bad about herself. So now you'd say, wait a second, creepy, unfair, and downright harmful. And that's the internet we have. It's time to take back ownership of ourselves in the digital age. We've given up our citizenship. We've given up our agency. And it's just, let's fix it.

This is just technology, and we can fix it from the ground up. And that's what Project Liberty is all about. Go ahead. I have to tell you, Frank, that I don't know why we don't care more about this. I guess people just don't see the problem. And as I see it, it is truly the loss of the most important thing, and that is free will. We're to a point to where it knows us better than we know ourselves, and we can so easily be manipulated because it knows us better than we know ourselves.

and we're entering a time where we won't know if we voted for somebody because we actually felt that way or that was planted in us or we bought this product because we were steered that direction. I mean, it is truly the loss of free will. Again, nail being hit in the head. We talk far, far too much about the loss of free speech and far too little about the loss of free will. This is highly manipulative technology. The TikTok issue has brought this to the four. It's grave concerns about having the information on 170 million Americans in the hands of the Chinese Communist Party and even graver concerns that the Chinese Communist Party would have the ability now to

manipulate 170 million Americans. And you're a little crazy though, Mark, of Frank. that we are sitting here, we're only concerned because it's the Chinese. We think if anybody else is doing it, I guess it's fine. If Apple's doing it, if Google's doing it, it's okay. This is exactly right. This is why this TikTok legislation, I think, is kind of, it's the so-called tip of the iceberg. It brings the whole, the whole architecture, the whole architecture of how the Internet works to the four people like yourself and thank you for doing it,

are bringing these issues forward so people understand. And believe me, I appreciate the difference of our information going to Beijing versus going to Silicon Valley. But quite frankly, I don't want my information in either place. I want to own my information. I want a permission it's use. And I want to benefit from it if it's going to make, make, you know, create a lot of, a lot of economic activity.

Exactly right. So, Frank, so tell me about the bid that you put it. You've already placed a bid on. TikTok, right? Yes. And how is this being received? How does this, I mean, I haven't, I haven't tried to buy TikTok, so I don't have any idea how that even works. You know, how is it going, I guess? Do you know if you're in the running? Yeah, well, definitely in the running. We don't know if, well, let's take a step backward. What's going on here, right? So back in the spring of last year, legislation was passed, a great piece of legislation passed by a strong bipartisan majority in Congress to force bite dance, the parent company of U.S. TikTok, to either shut it down in the U.S.

or sell the U.S. assets, the U.S. platform. And so that was legislation that had a – gave bite-tube. against 270 days to sort that out with the one 90-day extension available to them. So we put in our bid within that 270 days, and I think we're the only ones to put in a a certifiable bid, a bid where we as a buyer can move forward and not only have the finances in place, but meet most importantly the national security criteria, which was, a disentanglement of the Chinese technology from the U.S. assets being sold. Because you already have built the platform.

That's exactly right. And had we not been building this platform, we would not be a bidder because we just coincidentally can solve for this set of national security issues. And so we saw TikTok as a wonderful opportunity that fell in our hands, fell in our laps, to say, wait a second. We'll buy TikTok, solve the national security issues, move the user base and the data over to this clean made-in-America stack, give people ownership and control of their data. And we've solved a bunch of issues because we've also spun up an alternative to the current internet so people would have a choice. You and I would have a choice.

Do we go on the internet where we're surveilled 24-7 and we give up everything about us for free? or do we go on a different internet and we permission the use of our data and we're in charge of ourselves. We own ourselves and we get value. To me, I believe, you know, people will flock to this new internet because they'll have all the benefits

that you currently have, ease of use and be able to order things and have them delivered to your house and be entertained and communicate with people, but you'll be doing it from a position of power and where the power will be in the individual's hands, not in a centralized platform's hands. This is, by the way, when I wrote the book Our Biggest Fight, I used the American Project as my framing device because it's so ironic that 250 years ago, we were doing the same thing, which was taking rights

from a single centralized power, a monarch, and saying, no, no, no, we're citizens born with these rights, right, but became inalienable rights, and we want to be citizens, not subjects. Why in the world would we become, allow ourselves to lose our citizenship in the digital age just to, you know, get free apps? It's nuts. Well, yeah, I mean, every word you say, it gets me excited because I've been waiting for somebody to do this. But for some reason, I think, yeah, but what's the other shoe that's going to fall? Why? I mean, what are you facing?

What are the giants that maybe you're facing that would stand in the way of this? Well, I think the incumbents are, you know, the ones who are benefiting from our data and have, you know, built this, you know, soul-sucking, data-sucking machinery are the ones that are going to resist the change because they're profiting my belief. And look, I'm a capitalist. My family's been building infrastructure for 131 years. I'm all for people making money. And, you know, I love.

I love the America that my family helped build, literally build. But I don't like seeing money be made at the expense of American citizens. Right. As you say, we're losing our free will and we're in our ability to get along with each other. I mean, we don't even have an information ecosystem right now or we can tell fact from fiction, right? We're, we just are in this Never Neverland where if you destroy trust and faith in your fellow, you know, American, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, you're, your, the ability of human beings being in a better position than centralized, you know, government, some

monarchy or some centralized government to make decisions for us, right? That's why we started self-governance, right? Because it's the power of the individual. That's where the agency should be. And for it to matter, we have to respect it in other people. That's the so-called social contract. And then give people power, and we can govern ourselves. And we're rapidly losing that ability to self-govern and to have agency because of how this technology works in a highly centralized way. I would have to believe that Elon Musk would understand this and be a supporter. And I would imagine Donald Trump would be a supporter. Do you have the connections?

Are you working with the administration on this? Yeah, we have Kevin O'Leary called me. He's the Shark Tank guy. And he said, look, I talked to all the potential bidders. You're the only one that really has a solution to the technology. And I want to join your bid. And I said, come on in. This is, this is the people's bid for TikTok.

This is, this is bigger than TikTok, right? It's changing how the internet works. And Kevin, Kevin has a great relationship with, with millions and millions of small businesses in America because he's been doing Shark Tank now for 17 years. And I said, come on in. We want small businesses. We want everybody involved in this. And I, I mentioned Kevin because he's, you know, he's been kind of hanging out at Mar-a-Lago and making

sure the president knows exactly what we're doing. And I've talked to a number of people in his administration about what we're doing. There's no secrets here, Glenn. We want to be totally transparent where we believe this is, I called the book our biggest fight for a reason, right? We believe this is the issue of our day to reclaim what's ours, to reclaim our data. It is our personhood. When you're listening to hear the word data, it's kind of like, eh, who cares about data, right? It just is one of those terms that, what does it mean? Think of every time you hear the word data, I want you and your listeners to think of personhood, your person, your virtual you. It is you. Why would in the world, would we let anyone else own us? It just, I can't

emphasize this enough. Let's reclaim what's ours. And then restore trust and integrity in the internet and then let's go build a more powerful version which entered the AI but i'm very concerned about taking a broken internet that exploits people and making it more powerful until we fix the core infrastructure once we fix the core infrastructure so the individuals benefit then let's make it more powerful and better for people and let people benefit from the financially as well i think we could have a beautiful future without so much concern and anxiety and skepticism about the technology if we fix the core infrastructure. So, Frank, is there anything the average person can do to help this along?

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think we all need to get engaged in this because, you know, look, I'll be what I can, but no single person can win this fight. This is going to take an army of people insisting on a better internet. And I would say, I would start by asking people to go to projectliberty.io or to thepeopelsbid.com and learn about what we're doing. And there's plenty of ways there to be easy to engage. And people will be happy to respond to questions and engage you in the project in ways that you think you can be. Your listeners think they can be helpful.

We need you. Frank, thank you so much. I appreciate it. We're going to be looking into it, project liberty. dot i.o or the people's bid.com