The Glenn Beck Program - Ep 26 | Brad Meltzer | The Glenn Beck Podcast

Episode Date: March 2, 2019

Glenn is joined by noted author and friend of the program, Brad Meltzer who discusses his new book, "The First Conspiracy" which highlights an aspect of George Washington's story that you probably haven't heard before. It is through this discussion that you'll see a completely different side to the Father of our Nation.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

You are, I think, one of the best storytellers alive today. You humble me with that. You know, what I love when we do this is you and I, we have a history, right? We have this amazing history and it's this mutual love of history. And I love that we've had all these conversations over the years that have gone on privately, depending on who's empowered, depending on what's changed, depending on where the culture is. And this is oddly, I think the first time we've ever sat down, for the in-depth conversation.

Which I love. I'm just, I can't wait because I'm like, you know, usually it's like, whatever, I do my thing. And I'm like, they're going to ask me these five questions, and I'm going to answer these five questions. And I feel like I'm like, I'm giddy right now. I'm just like, look, this is going to be a good one. And you brought a toy.

I did. I should have brought something from my collection. But you brought something pretty amazing. And it kind of goes with the book. Yeah. So your new book is the first conspiracy, the secret plot to kill George Washington. I know just. a little bit of it. I just know the, I just know the execution part. But I don't know anything

else. And you know me. I love this stuff and you know this stuff. I love George Washington. And I, I even have from 1911, I think, New York did the complete bound conspiracy papers. They bound all the conspiracy theories. So I have that. I still don't know this. And I didn't know this either. This story I found, and you know, only the nerds read the footnotes, and that means you and I. Yeah. Right. And I found this nearly a decade ago in the footnotes. And I remember thinking, a secret plot to kill George Washington?

Is this real? Is it fake? Is it internet nonsense? What is it? And it's true. In 1776, there was a secret plot to kill Washington. When George Washington finds out about it, he gathers up those responsible, builds a gallows. Let's not start at the end.

Yeah, let's not start at the end. And let's just say it's foiled. It's foiled. And George Washington, spoiler alert, lives. All right. So let's start. Let's go back with George Washington. Because when you look at history, a lot of people were made into heroes that shouldn't have been made into heroes.

A lot of the stuff that we read about is either bogus or just so one-sided. One of the guys I started doing research on Edison and Tesla, I thought. I thought I knew the story. No, it's an incredible story. Edison's a monster. Yeah, I won't do Edison in the I Am books. Oh my gosh, he's a monster. Yeah.

And you never know that. And so there are some things to where you look at, and we've made the problem of, we made it worse by making giant statues of people. Yeah. And that's what we do. We do that. But we've always done that with our heroes. We dip them in granite.

We make these statues. We worship at them. and we do a great disservice because then they're not people anymore. But this guy, George Washington, is the only one that I could find that isn't Winston Churchill. That if you talk to one set of people, like a different answer. You get a different answer. And he was both. Yep.

This guy, I can't find the flaw in him. Yeah. And I totally agree. And we've talked about this offline as well. but the thing about George Washington is he's not like John Adams, he's not like Thomas Jefferson, who are writing all their feelings to their loved ones and telling you every emotion they have.

George Washington spends everything for him is close to the vest. Martha Washington obviously gets rid of all the papers, so we lose lots of correspondence. But even on some of the biggest days of his life, they barely merit a warrant in his diary, on some of the biggest moments where he's scared. The day he was there when they signed the Constitution, the day they signed the Constitution, you know what's in his diary? No.

I went to pick up my copy of Don Quixote. Right, right, which was his favorite book. Right. You're like, what is this? What are you doing? You just signed the concept, right? I mean, that's a thing is even, in fact, in this one, there's this day where he, you know, someone dies in front of 20,000 people. You know, if you murder someone in front of 20,000 movies, say, Dear Diary, had a bad day.

And his is just like, nothing, barely a mention. And it's not, it's not because. he was, correct me if I'm wrong. It's not because he was secretive. He was just very private and didn't, there's this great letter. The archives has one half. They're trying to get the other half

from a friend of mine. Okay. And they have the letter written to George Washington right after the revolution. It says, George, they're going to praise your name up and down.

They're going to name cities after you. They're going to build monuments. He's horrified by it. My friend has the response. And the response is, dear Lord, I hope not. Yeah, of course. I should never praise me. It was the God Almighty that did it and we all witnessed it.

So he's not trying to hide things or play it close to the vest except in war. No, and I don't mean it right. It's just not his way. Yeah, he just doesn't boast. And I think it comes back. I mean, I always believe, and I don't want to get all frayed in on it, but I do believe it. You know, so much of who we are comes from our childhood. You tell me your childhood and I'll show you who you are.

And Washington, as a kid, you know, one of the things he does, I mean, he loses everything, right? He loses his brothers. He loses his father. Loses everything. But even as a kid, he's writing down these 110 rules of civility to live by. Who did that come from? Right? Well, historians debate whether he did it because he needed to or whether it was a class exercise.

Either way, it's a spectacular thing that he apparently does. does over and over 110 rules of civility that exist back then. And they're spectacular. They're actually read them because I was like, I want to read something that I know George Washington read at the most impressionable moment of his life when he's young. When it's all just starting, you're just that kind of tabula rasa. There you are.

And they're spectacular because one of them is, you know, don't pick your teeth at the table. Don't spit on people when you talk to them. All good advice we could use right now. Don't spit in the fire is kind of gone away to the side. But it's also, you know, about humility and modesty and there are ways to be, you know, when you say a proper Virginian gentleman, we assume it means someone with great manners. But I think for him it actually meant to be a great man. And I think that those, that's what I mean when I say close to the vest.

It's not about being secretive. It's not about I don't want anyone to know. I feel like he, when it comes to his own emotions, he's like, what I think doesn't matter, there are bigger things to worry about. And I feel like it's just, it all comes from this point of a level of humility that I've never seen on anyone in history. And I always say, I don't think George Washington's greatest victory or most important thing that he's ever done is winning the war. I don't think it's being president. I don't think it's any of that. I think the greatest thing he's ever done is that moment after the war where he can be king.

And when we win the Revolutionary War, he can easily be the King of America. They were so popular I would have made him the King of America. as you said in the letter, they're going to praise you forever. And, you know, the famous story we've talked about this one, I remember, is King George. King George is talking to painter Benjamin West and says, what's George Washington doing after the war? Benjamin West says he's going home. And King George says, if he does that, he'll be the greatest man to ever live. Greatest man who ever lived, right?

And that's what he does. And then he does it again after his second term. He could have had a third term or a fourth term. But that's what he continues to do is he has faith in. us as a culture, faith in us as a country, faith in us as a people, that we'll be in charge of our own destiny. We don't need him on there. And I feel like when I think about that, you know, a plot to kill George Washington, I just think, my God, would anyone else have had the character, the depth of character to walk away from that opportunity of power? And that's, I don't know anyone

else in history like that. Not even today. I know. Nothing. I mean, there's nothing like them. So where did that come from? Because his mother, and his mother eventually kind of turned on him. Yeah. He said he was running for a president the second time. And she said, oh, he's, you wouldn't believe how much he spends on ice cream. That was the big scandal with George Washington. And his mother actually kind of made him give up a dream.

He wanted to go and join, thank God he didn't, the British Navy. Yeah. And he's young and he gets on to the ship. and his mom is making a scene she goes, finds out that he's joined the Navy and, you know, oh, George, you cannot leave me. And he comes back down on the gangplank with his stuff. And he says,

Mother, if this is where you need me to be, I will remain at your side. And his whole life is about sacrifice. But you know what I love about George Washington's life is every sacrifice he makes for someone else always pays him back later. in this odd, only God couldn't pull it off way. There's a moment in the book.

It just defies logic. I don't know if you know this story, but I didn't know it, and it blew my mind. During the Revolution of War, smallpox is just raging through our troops. And they're trying to figure out should they have quarantines. They can't cure it. They don't know what to do. And if, God forbid, George Washington gets smallpox.

In the middle of all this, we're dead. And they know we're dead. He's not going to. And so, just to tell this. the story for those who don't know. You know, and the British are putting smallpox on blankets because they're like the first. No, no, no, that was us with the name of Americans. Right, right, right.

I mean, the first levels of biological warfare. And they figure out that when George Washington is a kid, he goes with his brother who gets a disease and they send them back then. The cure was go to the Caribbean and you'll be cured by the sunlight and the nice water. But while George Washington, as a kid, is there making the sacrifice to go with his brother, winds up. being immune to smallpox. And the reason he never gets smallpox in the war is because of his dead brother, who oddly is almost protecting him from beyond the grave.

You can't write, I mean, I write thrillers for a living. If I ever put that scene in a book, my editor would say, you're insane. You can't keep the, say that the president of the United States when he's a kid gets immunized for no reason by helping his brother in the Caribbean and then comes and it saves his life during the Revolutionary War? So he is a guy who wants to be a farmer.

That's what he talks about all the time. I just want to go back to farm. Go back my farm. I just want to do my farm thing. And yet he had this drive to get into the military. This is what I wanted to ask you about. Let's talk about this. Yeah, I mean, so he goes right, the second kind of Congress happens, and they're picking

who's going to run the military. And the only guy, everyone's wearing their usual outfits, the only guy who shows up in a military uniform, The only one, which is still shocking to me, is George Washington. And I know he's always humble, but that's a conscious effort. That's one of those moments where I actually wanted to hear. I wanted to talk to you about this because there's, you know, some people when you read about that, they say, oh, he was peacocking, which I actually don't believe. But I do think, right, that wasn't that guy.

But he is, he's clearly going for a job. You know, you don't, I had a guy in college, a buddy of mine. He used to take every, all of his suits, I mean, all of his tests in his. suit. And we'd of course make fun of him and be like, are you insane? You're an 18-year-old kid while you wearing a suit to take a test. But he was clearly trying to say, this is what I do, I'm a more serious sort. If you're the only guy of all those founders who were there at that moment, and you're the only guy who shows in a military uniform, you're, you are making a statement. And it's, it's genius advertising. That's who he was. Well, he's a soldier, right? Yeah, he was a soldier.

So he's showing up, you've got your thing, I have my thing. I don't think he wants to, Let me ask you this question and kind of response to that. You know who Peter Lilback is? No. Okay, Peter Lilback from the Providence Project up in Philadelphia. One of leading scholars on George Washington. He wrote Sacred Fire. I don't know if you've ever read.

Yeah, you sent me a copy. Of course, I read it, of course. I read it for this. Yeah. Did you really? I did. Well, I read a years ago. You sent me a copy years ago.

So Peter and I were talking. I said, Peter, I've been reading a lot of George Washington. I've been reading a lot of his letters and a lot of stuff that nobody ever reads. And I said, I think you could make the case that George and our founders knew that the United States would play some role in the reestablishment of Israel. And they were so religious that that meant something to them. They weren't, I shouldn't say that. they were very acquiescent to the Almighty. I was going to say they were not religious.

They were greater power, of course. But they were Christian, but they weren't like. Right, right, right. It's Providence. It's not God. It's the right. Correct. And he said, you're crazy. He did a year of research, unbeknownst to me.

He comes back to me a year later, and he has written a book about it. Right. And he said, I think you're right. So I wonder if Washington had a sense of some sort of providence of destiny that he knew this is the skill I have. I'm supposed to be here. I'll show up so they know my skill and everybody is aware of my skill. And they choose me, so be it. If they don't, so be it.

Because remember, they choose him and he says. And then he leaves, right? He runs out of the room. Right. No, no, no, you can't talk about all the bad things about me with me in the room. Please. Right. And then when they go to tell him, they look around, he's gone.

He's gone. And the first thing he says when they find them, I think it's to Adams. He says, you know, I don't know if I'm up to this task. Right. And I don't think he was. First of all, he 100% wasn't the first thing that George, one of the first things, I should say that he does, is he immediately goes to a book story. He orders books on how to be a better general. He did three things, right?

Right. Right. Right. It was, I know the books. What were the, I got the sash. He wanted the uniform. What were the other ones? I mean, there are plenty that he does, but you have three in mine that you know?

No, no, no. Oh, no. Oh, I was going to say, oh, yeah, yeah, I said, right, he gets the sash. So let's start over. He goes and gets books because he's like, you know, and it's like the idiot's guide for 1776, right? I got to be a general, and this is military strategy. There's no time to get a uniform, but he wants to let people know he's in charge. So he orders a blue sash that you'll see in the pictures from then.

And I just love that he's like, he's just the basic things, right? And that book thing is not a sign of weakness. It's the ultimate sign of strength. I believe Lincoln does the same thing as he immediately goes and says, I'm not up to this task. How do I get better immediately? My God. We need leaders, right?

Yeah, we have a letter from Lincoln in about 56, where somebody's saying, you have to run. And he said, I don't think I'd be up to the. task, but I will tell you, if I do ever become a position of leadership in Washington, there will be no one that will work harder to be able to do that. Yeah. You know, they are preparing themselves. Right.

But back to what you said, I do think that Washington, I just believe that, and especially then, I mean, again, it's not a science-driven time, right? It's a faith-driven time back then. I do believe that that sense of destiny is something that plays. And I know, you know, people love to tell that story in the French and Indian War where he shot at and he has the bullet holes in his outfit and, you know, and the Indian lore that someone said he was the chosen one to be the leader. That's the lore. You have any evidence? Right.

No, no, no, no. It's I'm saying. But the point of it is when stories like that persist, that lore is it shows you the belief system at the time, right? Like if other people are saying you're the chosen one. So if he's, if you, for instance, in, I think it was in Trenton, he was also shot at. He had several horses shot out from underneath him. Yeah. And he gets the biggest white stallions and rides up.

Right, right. Goes right in the front of everything. And that's not, I mean, that's not lore. Yeah. That's true. That's true. And whether he knew it at the time, he was creating this legend of you can't kill this guy. Right. Well, and listen, even when he was failing, I mean, and this is, I can't get into and can't

get my head around or even pretend to say that we understand what he thought. You know, the thing that frustrates me about many Washington books is they'll tell you, and then Washington thought this. And we don't know. We can't know. We can have a theory. You can have a theory. I can have a theory. But no one will ever know why he did it. What we do with our heroes in this moment is, again, we always do our heroes are mirrors. They're always mirrors. And we see him. and then what we want to see and what we need. That's what being a hero is, is they give you something back in that way. But even when you go to the concrete things that happen, Washington still measures up.

Even in the failures that in the Battle of Brooklyn, one of the scenes I love in the book, is the Battle of Brooklyn, the first battles of the war here in New York. And, you know, we tell the story. Washington is the greatest general who ever lived. He's got everything. He gets out general. He's horrible. He gets out flanked by the British.

He doesn't have the experience of the world. the British have. He basically gets pinned down. He has the British in front of him. He's got the East River behind him. And this is the end. He should die in this moment. If he's a lesser man, he basically should say, you know what? We're pinned down. We're going to take out as many of them as we can. We'll show him whose boss will go out in a blaze of glory. He'll beat his chest and show what a macho guy he is. But there's nothing genius about being a macho moron. There's nothing manly about that. Instead, he does the best thing he always does. He adapts to the situation. He improvises in that moment, and he plans a daring escape in the middle of the night. They commandeer

every boat along the East River. They say, give me every boat you can find. And in the middle of the night, when no one thinks they're going to go. Provinential fog, if I'm not mistaken. Yeah, it always happens like that, right? You feel like there's something like Spielberg's directing the moment. You wouldn't believe it if you saw it in a movie, but they all right about it. And basically, this fog comes in. In the middle of the night, he puts slowly one by one, all of his men get on the boat, and he makes sure they're safe. But here's the key moment, Glenn, right? Is that George Washington won't get on the boat until he makes sure that even his lowest men are on their first and safely away.

And they see him in that moment risking his life for them. And there are plenty of moments that come before and plenty of moments that come after. But to me, that's one of those moments where I think today we've forgotten the word united in United States. And that's one of those moments where we truly come together with a leader. that leads us that way. So let me flip this around. I think one of the low points in Washington is when he's standing, I think, in New Jersey, and he's lost New York.

He's lost everything. And now they're headed south again. Right. They've just lot. And retreat and retreat and retreat. And we should say this for anyone listening. Every battle is we fight and we retreat a little. We fight and we retreat a little.

We go to Long Island. We retreat. They just keep leaving. From Boston, almost to Philadelphia. 100%. And it's months of just retreat. And so we have no chance. And he's standing and he's looking across the water at now New England with New York, all gone.

Yep. Lost it all. And one of his men see him weep. And it's the only time. I know the other time. I know the second time they see him weep. I don't know the second one. I don't know the second one.

Wow. We are like one brain. If you put us together, we actually may know a lot of stuff, but we only know half. Right. So he was standing on the. standing on the bank and he's looking at New York and the losses that they have done. And in a moment of weakness, he weeps. And it's at that point, the guy who sees him is like, we are in trouble.

Right. If he's upset, right. This guy, no, this guy is weak. This and it really starts to churn. It starts to churn. The troops are starting to say. Yeah, they threw out the war. Yeah, they start turning on them, of course.

By the time he gets to the Delaware, he's done. Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, no. I mean, and the thing that's amazing. Wait, wait, what's the second time? Let's do the second time. So the second time is Benedict Arnold. Is basically when he finds out, when Benedict Arnold betrays him, a letter is delivered from Benedict Arnold.

Alexander Hamilton delivers this letter to George Washington, as Benedict Donald writes. He doesn't deliver it in song or in rap. He just hands it over. But the letter says three things. It says, don't kill my wife, Benedict Donald writes, because she didn't know what I was doing. Don't kill my men because they didn't know what I was doing. And he actually also says, in the craziest moment of letter writing history, he says, basically, I want my stuff back. Can you bring me my belongings?

And in that moment, you know, he's just been betrayed by someone who was obviously one of his dearest, nearest and dearest, and they say that's one of the only times they've ever seen George Washington weep is in that moment. And the greater part, the PS to that story is George Washington, actually delivers his belongings. I mean, if you did that to me, and you said, I don't give my stuff, I'd light it on fire. I'd light your stuff on fire, and you betrayed me, and we're done. It's not Washington.

And it's not Washington. He actually does the gentlemanly thing and says, here you go, here's your belongings. Oh, which actually, if you want to do this, it works perfectly. Right. As a sake, there was a problem that people don't understand here. And you mentioned it on unity a minute ago. Let's talk about that, yeah. and loyalty, there's a couple things going on.

Most people don't know. It's between 20 and 30 percent are actually behind this revolution. About 30 percent are dead set against it. And the rest of the nation is like, whatever, I don't want to get involved. That's right. Which is no different than where we are today, right? It's the same exact thing. You have a liberal side, you have a conservative side, you have a middle side that's apathetic.

And God, you think in all these years we learn, but we're the same humans. So the middle of the country, if you will, the middle section that's like, I don't care. They'll play it either way just to stay. If the British are in town, hey, I'm with you guys. The Americans are in town. I'm with you guys. Far as they're not, they just want to live their life and be left. Yeah.

Oh, and I was actually struck when I was researching the book because I didn't know any of this. We always, again, we tell this the story we give our kids today. And let's be honest, I want to say those kids today get off my lawn. I mean, the way I learned it is, you know, there's a shot hurt around the world, then there's a fight, there's a Declaration for Independence, George Washington comes in, we win, they signed the Constitution, he's the president, we live happily ever after. And it seems like a line that is just beautiful and straight and easy, and it's a giant mess. You know, like... I asked my kids the other day, how many presidents did we have before George Washington? And they just looked up as to what?

I said, seven. Seven. We had seven. Now, they were presidents of the Congress. Oh, okay, yeah. But most people, you don't even think that there's a time. You skip those seven years. It's like, what?

We won the war. We're the United States. No, we were something entirely different. And what struck me is how divided we were as a culture back then. What struck me was, because again, we think that dream is we believe in democracy. We hold hands. We come together. And democracy was a wonderful idea.

But most, you know, as you said, a third of the people were just, They saw what was happening with the king as just basically a trade deal that they needed better terms on. It was a financial solution. There was no great idea. They just tax us less. Give us a better deal. Let's negotiate a little. And we'll be fine under your rule.

And that's why one reason why I don't like Hamilton. Yeah. Because as soon as the war is over, he's like, you know, let's just have a king. Just make the money, right, right. Let's just have a king. But to me, but I'm struck by that idea. And I love, and certainly we definitely do get to that. point where democracy catches fire. The good idea does catch on. I don't want to deflate the whole

thing. But what strikes me, and again, in a plot to kill Washington, you have to find people willing to do it. And what struck me is how divided our own military, our own people were. And we're always going to be like that. We did a look at, we were like, what's the culture look like in 1776? 10,000 men come to New York City, trying to do what 10,000 men always do when they're left alone with the women around, right? Like they're gambling, they're drinking, they want to go see prostitutes, that's what they want to do. George Washington is a proper virginian gentleman is horrified by this. He has general orders is what they're called. And his general orders are the rules that are coming down on almost daily basis because there's no rules to the army. He's got to build it. He has to make it.

He's trying to figure out. And so one of the rules is, you know, no gambling. He hated gambling. Everyone's playing cards back then. I didn't even like that. You know, it doesn't want them drinking, doesn't want them going to prostitutes. Like, again, all good rules, like almost as if he's a young boy again. But also because he knows it's insane to take on the English. You're talking about the greatest fighting force ever assembled ever. It's like the people in Toledo going, hey, let's go get the Navy SEALs. It doesn't work.

It doesn't work. So he knows it's insane. And so he's playing into divine providence. Look, we have to be on God's side. We have to be people of merit. And the thing that is amazing is, and the best part of it, he's right. He's absolutely right. I mean, there's this moment where you see him in Harvard Square, and he's got, you know, the regiment from Massachusetts, is there with Connecticut, is there with Virginia, and just like any guys who get together, the Virginians wear something frilly on their uniforms. So the Massachusetts guy's mouthed off as Massachusetts guys will forever mouth off. Fight breaks out and Washington rides in, and the story goes, you know, the first-tenths were. the count that we found in the letter is he grabs two of these guys and is shaking him and

basically saying, stop fighting with each other. We're on the same team. And there was no United States back then. We rally around the, you know, right now, again, whatever your politics are, we have leaders who draped themselves on the flag and will happily tell you how patriotic they are. There was no flag to rally yourself around. I mean, obviously the early parts of it, but it was George Washington insisting that we be united, pulling us together, and, and, and And to me, our leaders that will, that are the best are the ones who can bring us together, not those who pull us apart. And I think it's amazing to me that if he doesn't do that, we don't get where we want to go. He's absolutely right that you have to, you know, bring order to this chaos because we have no chance against this military otherwise.

So one of the things he does is he says you have to have a loyalty oath. Yes, let's talk about it. So there is a, they called it the oath of allegiance. and I'm going to read I think so I'll tell you this let me back up because for anyone who's listening because you and I talked about this. So when I go, I was supposed to do an event for this book at the National Archives. And I love, I got to take you to the National Archives. We have to make that happen. So every time I go, the archivist of the United States is become a dear friend, an amazing guy.

And David Ferrio will always pull out something. When you go visit, he's really. good at finding that secret thing you love. For you and I, it's going to, like, the toy store. And he always finds something that's just amazing. So when we, because of the shutdown in the government, we had to, we couldn't do the event. So he said, well, let's meet for lunch. So three days ago, we meet in Washington, D.C. for lunch during the book tour.

And he hands me this, this envelope in front of me from the archives. And basically what happens is, is in, and I want to make sure I get the date right, it's 1778. That's what I thought. there's an oath of allegiance that George Washington asks everyone to sign. And what the oath basically is is we want you to swear, you solemnly swear that you're going to make sure you don't betray this, you know, this military that we're in.

And we do that same oath today. We have our men and women in the military. When they enter, they raise their right hand. They say, I solemnly swear, state your name, that you're going to be loyal. But what they did back then is they used to number the oaths because it was the first one. And so they numbered a one, two, three, four, five, and you stood in line, and you dipped your pen in, and you signed this oath. And what he brought to me, what I have, and is this, this is number one. And you'll see right at the center.

And it's the oath that is signed number one by George Washington. And the nice part of the story is, and this is the great irony of it, of course, is that when George Washington signs that he's number one, and then there's number two, three, four, and then there's number two, three, four, and then there's number. number five, which the National Archives also has number five. And the oath is Benedict Arnold. The oath from Benedict Arnold is, and there in that moment is when Benedict Arnold actually became a human being to me. I grew up, you know, like you were, Benedict Arnold was a kind of curse word you told something. But in that moment, Benedict Arnold, on that day, in 1778, put his pen in the ink, and stood there and signed and said, I solemnly swear I'll forever be on your side. You can read it there.

This is what he says. I, written in his handwriting, I, George Washington, commander in chief of the armies of the United States of America, then it's printed, do acknowledge the United States of America to be free, independent, and sovereign states, and declare that the people thereof owe no allegiance or obedience to George the third king of Great Britain. and I renounce, refuse, is it, kind of look at, it's refute, maybe, and abjure any alliance or obedience to him. And I do, he wrote something here, or I do swear, that I will, to the utmost of my power, support, maintain and defend the said United States against said King George III, his heirs, his officers, or his successors and to their abettors. And I will serve the United States in the office of commander-in-chief, which I now hold with fidelity, according to the best of my skill and understanding. And that's the first time.

I mean, that's it, right? I get emotional every time I see it. There's George Washington swearing that he will forever be loyal to these United States. And it's not just something you talk about, but they took the time, wrote it up, made them, numbered them, and said, everybody, get in line. Wow. Get in line. And the Archivist United States was kind enough to bring me this one.

He'd shown me, I'd never seen this one. He'd shown me Benedict Arnold's before. But I didn't even know they had George Washington's. They have in the archives, they have these treasure vaults. And their rooms, I would say, some of them are, you know, maybe 20 by 20. And they're dumpy. You know, you think they look like Goldfinger, you know, or something that they're not. They're dumpy, they're hard, but the air is pure.

It's all modified. It's all fireproof. It's walls that can prevent Nicholas Cage from coming in the middle of the night and stealing the treasure map. And they have the best stuff. They have the most amazing things. So I walk in and the head of the Smithsonian meets me. I go to the Smithsonian. He said, come on in it.

So it's one of those rooms, the little thin drawers and stuff. And he said, And oh, you'll like this. And he pulls out a drawer and it's George Washington's christening dress. Oh, my gosh. Wow. Oh, my gosh. So much good stuff.

Yeah, I know. The flag that was used against Thomas Jefferson by Adams in another drawer, they start going through these drawers. And none of this stuff is seen anymore. Right, right, right. He gets to the very end. We go around this corner and he's like, He'll like this drawer. He pulls it out.

And it's all stuff from my event in Washington, D.C. In a drawer. Of course it is. They have it, of course. And I said, shut up. Right. And he said, it may never be seen. He said, in a hundred years, we may throw it away.

He said, but we found it's much better to collect it as it's happening. Wow. Then go back and try to get it. Well, the thing that's amazing about the archives to me when you go there is you think, oh, you know, put in the word Abraham Lincoln or George Washington, everything will come up. And the Washington stuff, I should say,

they tend to know what they have. But as it goes forward, there's so much work product that they're still finding new things even in their own documents. So you'll see every like five years will be a story that breaks on a new Lincoln letter that they've never seen before

because there's so much paper. And in fact, right now what's happening is you're seeing, thank God for the Mormons out there who are helping people, to digitize so we can search it because otherwise we can we don't have the the government doesn't have the money to digitize all these all this work product and in fact one of the places where some of it goes is the national archives has caves hidden across the country literally underground caves because it's cheaper for air conditioning and for the to preserve the document so I was like

I got to go if you have a bad cave I got to go right like I got to make my way there so I went out to St. Louis I went to these places and what they have I mean you know the They have, you know, Jackie Kennedy's pink dress from the day JFK's shot. It's not just paperwork, right? It sees amazing things. And obviously the letters that Nixon writes if the astronauts don't make it back, you know, if they die up on the moon. You have the greatest job in the world. Trust me, I feel, when I go there, I mooch off their greatest job in the world.

I feel like that. They have the greatest job. What I get to do is I get to go in and look at it. Yeah, I guess. And every time I go, they have something that I go, how did you not show me this last time? Because this is the greatest thing ever. Every time it's the greatest thing ever. And you realize that's us, right?

It's the perfect metaphor for us as people. We are all, you know, these amazing things and these horrible things, these unspeakable. You know, we are all of us brave and terrified. We're all of us bold and scared. We're all of us amazing and cowards. And we're all of us, you know, spectacular, sometimes in the same hour, sometimes in the same, you know, minutes. And that's what history always is, right?

It's not that straight line we were talking about from, you know, the start of the war to George Washington become president. It's like mercury. It flows every which way. It moves all over. It's contradictory. And that's not the bad part of history. That's the best part of it, is that it is exactly us.

And that's what the government always will be is it's us. We always want to say, the government did this, the government did that. The government's always the people. That's what it is. It's just us. And it's as messy and good as bad. It's a reflection of what we'll tolerate. And our best and our worst sides, depending on who's in power and who has it.

But the point is it moves and it changes. You know the line that has stuck out to me in the Declaration of Independence lately is, and I'm going to butcher it. But it's the line where it says and history will show that man will put up with a lot, you know, until it just gets so painful. That's it. And I think that's, that's, you know, we say, oh, the government is doing all these horrible things. Well, somebody was around in the people, and they kind of knew it or had an opportunity to know it. They just didn't want to know. Right.

There's a lot of stuff now. We just don't want to know that we're tolerating. That's right. And listen, we, I always say the government is not, you know, evilly stroking their cat and sitting on their throne. The government is, you know, the government doesn't lie. People lie, and they lie for very human reasons, right? Because whether it's shame or whether it's not strong enough or whether it's greed or whether it's sex or whether it's, you know, those are the basic, it's very human things. But I think it's just, I can't let that go because it's so beautiful.

The founders are so genius when you look at what they constructed. And there's this, and I'll butcher it too, but right outside, I forget if it's the senator of the House or somewhere in between in the U.S. Capitol, there's one of the, there's the line that basically says, you know, and it shows the whole government is designed to fail. It is designed to be really hard to make change in the government. It is the founding fathers wanted one thing and they said, if it's easy, then people will just come through and plow their way through, demand all their demands, and we'll have a king again. But if we make it really hard, we make two houses that have to fight each other. And then, even if it gets past there, and it's still bad, we have a Supreme Court to look over. We have a president.

who can be to it. We're designed to fight, designed to fail, so no one can do it. And it's genius in the way it's constructed. But it takes us, because we don't know our own, our civil responsibility, our civil rules and, um, and responsibilities, we, we, it takes us a while. Like, right now, you're starting to see in America people going, you know what, I don't really care what happens in Washington. They can't get a damn thing done. I agree. Yes. Yes. Yes. That's the system working at its best. There are people on both sides that want to take it crazy places. And you can't get anywhere in Washington.

And so people on both sides want to take shortcuts. No, stick to the Constitution because eventually the American people will go, you know what, you guys are a bunch of clowns. We'll just do it. Right. Oh, if history proves one thing, it's that there are great moments where we don't care until we do. and then when we do care, look out, because it's all going to change. And I, you know, it's funny, I've been on book tour this week, and I went, I started on CBS.

I went to my friends of Fox News. I went to friends at CNN. I went to the local NPR affiliate. And despite what we all think, there are things we all agree on. America, whatever side you're on is tired of the way we're talking to each other. They're tired, we're tired of the way we've been playing this wonderful game of us first them. Whatever side you're on, those people did this. You know, if you're a Democrat, you hate the Republicans, you're Republican, you hate the Democrats.

We hate each other. And the way what we do right now, we find an opinion that's opposite our own, we unfriend, we unfollow, and then we surrounded, and you're surrounded by people who only agree with you. And nothing good will ever come of that. And it's amazing to me as I go, as I've been across the country this week, watching, again, if you watch Fox News or you watch MSNBC, you have two polar views of how the world work. You literally have different pieces of information that is coming into your brain. And someone said to me in one of those places, we don't do news. We do opinions. Because if we just showed the news, no one would watch.

But if we show opinions, then people will really watch us. And people watch and don't realize they're watching opinions. So we have in our phones the library of Alexandria at our fingertips at all times, as much information as we want. But the hardest thing to find today is the truth. Right. That's what you've always been. And that's your, the bread and butter, right, is the place where you can come and say, here's the truth.

And we've lost sight of it. And we've lost sight of talking to each other. We've just, we've entered this hard part. And I think you're right. We're basically saying right now, you know what? I don't like what's happening in D.C. I'm going to ignore it. And then we'll get mad.

And then once again, we'll ask for that change. It's a time of a lack of courage. Yeah. I think it's courage. You know, when I was doing, I think I've mentioned to you. I've very good friends with President George H.W. Bush and Barbara Bush. And years ago, they wrote me a fan letter.

They're like one of my thrillers. And I met them and spent a lot of time. They invited me to Houston for a week to go see what it was like to be a former president. We became dear friends. And I love Barbara Bush because she reminded me of my mother in the sense that she didn't care if you were the king of England or you were the guy who was sweeping the floors. Do you have something interesting to say? Are you funny?

Do you have something that's insightful? If not, then get out of my face. She's not impressed with anybody. And we would sit and laugh and have fun together. I spent many events doing work for literacy with her. She just believed in the value of literacy that that unlocked the American dream is helping people read and I totally agree.

And so we were honoring Mrs. Bush on her passing a couple months ago. We did an event in Kennebunkport, Maine. And I get to Kennebunkport with my wife. And I know at this point, we all know what's going to happen the President Bush. We know he's sick. We know the end's coming. And I found out that they were bringing in some of his favorite authors to read to him.

And they said to me, you know, would you like, we'd like you to read the President Bush. Would you know, your book would you like to read to him? So I say, of course, I'd be honored. And I get in there and it's myself, it's my wife, it's President Bush, and it's a service dog solilo. The Secret Service leave, where alone in Kennebunk poured in his private. office and this is the end. This is the end. We know what's coming. And they warned me. They said, we just want you know, you're only going to read for 10 minutes because he falls asleep. And my wife said, Brad's used to putting people asleep with his books. Don't worry. They'll be fine.

And we go in there and we pretend that everything's normal. Like this is just my average day and my average life. And it's the end, right? He's got the rocking chair with the presidential seal on it. Got a little view of the ocean, but I know what's coming. And I see on his desk, he's got about five books stacked up, and one of them is the first conspiracy, and it's dog-eared. It's like it's been read, I mean, I can't do how many times, post-it notes in it, the whole thing, because I had sent it to him a year ago. That's how he blurbed the book for us. And I say to him, sir, you want to read this?

And at this point, he's really only nodding in a couple of celebrities and said, mm-hmm. And so I read my favorite part of the book, the part that makes me tear up every time I get to it when I was proofing it. I'm going to read it to you, yeah. And it's this moment. It's the moment where George Washington presents to the troops for the very first time, has it read to them the Declaration of Independence. I don't even need the book.

I can do it by heart because it's the line you know and I know. And I get to that line. I'm sitting there, President Bush, any sleeping at this point. It's 10 minutes any sleeping. Get to the line. We hold these truths to be self-evident that all men are created equal. And in that moment, President Bush's eyes, boom, right open. wide awake. And you know, if you've ever been at the hospital room of someone who's dying and

they have that moment of clarity, where you just know they're back, boom, my mom died, boom, she came back. My dad died, boom, they came back. And he's back again. It's like the Declaration of Independence is his lifeblood, like it's the ultimate IV. And we get to the end of the chapter. And I said, sir, do you want to do another chapter? Mm-hmm. We do another chapter. Mm-hmm. And another. Mm-hmm. And for a full hour, I'm sitting there. And at the end of the hour, of course, I say goodbye, thank him for everything. I know it's goodbye forever.

I know what's happening. And when he died, I went to the funeral in Houston. And when he died, the one thing I was clear on is one word was mentioned over and over in all the tributes to him. And it was this word, decency, decency. And yes, it was because it was a decent man. but I think it was also because as a country, we're starving for decency again. We've lost sight of the word united in these United States. We don't talk to each other.

We yell at each other. We talk about each other. We scream at each other. And to me, I feel like we, when I look back, and I always look at the zeitgeist for kind of where we are, I don't think it's a coincidence that the big biographies this past year were Neil Armstrong and were Mr. Rogers, that George Bush's death, that, you know, was such a big deal. I feel like we celebrated for a while those who are the best.

And what we do right now in our culture is we celebrate those who are good at getting attention call to themselves. We celebrate the loud ones. We celebrate those who on social media, whether it's, you know, Facebook or Instagram or Twitter or anywhere else are, you know, write with multiple exclamation points and tell us how great they are and can get the most attention. That's what we celebrate. That's what we like.

That's what we pay attention to. But we're starving for that generation that taught us humility. and decency. And I don't think it's a coincidence that Mr. Rogers was such a huge movie this year, or even that the movie,

whether it was good or bad or otherwise, but about Neil Armstrong came out. Neil Armstrong never used the word I, use the word we. We did this. We accomplished it.

And he wasn't just talking about the astronauts. He was talking about the scientists, the mathematicians, the people who sewed his space suit together. This was our accomplishment.

And, you know, I know Hollywood can mess up or do a good movie, but the fact that they even made it in the same, time is, and it's not that it's an answer, but it's, it's showing the desire and the population for that humility and that, that, that decency that I feel like we've lost track of. A modern day example of that.

Yeah, I constantly, you know, my belief about heroes is that heroes come when we need the most. You never get the hero you want, that you always get the heroes you need. And I think, and this is, I admit, and I wish I could say that I'm so optimistic and I always know, you can find me on a certain day and I say that person's coming, we haven't met them yet. I don't know who it is, but they're coming.

And we're going to need them because we need them right now, the same way as you need Superman or anyone else. And then there are days I wake up and say, you know, in fact, they asked me to do an event. I did an event with President Bush for W with 43, and with President Clinton. They did an event together that I went to. And I asked them both.

I said, how do we come together if we're not even agreeing on the basic facts? If we're watching our own television networks, our own Twitter feeds, I said, how do we do that? And neither of them really had an answer. And so some days I have the dark side of me says, I don't know how we get out of it. And some days I go, that person's coming. And when the need comes and the need arises, we will find them. and it just as anything else it just depends what day you catch me have you ever read any tim ballard no nonfiction yeah i'm gonna i'm gonna send

some stuff to you um he wrote something called the american covenant and uh it's about george washington making that four hour uh prayer after the inauguration and the the covenant that he made with God and that his theory is we have violated that and until we turn back and go, way, we will be your people and you will be our God that we'll just continue to go off the tracks. But it's that George Washington covenant that has played divine providence with this nation really from the beginning, and I think still is. I mean, we've had extraordinary protection on this nation.

Yeah, no, I mean, listen, so many of the things we, I mean, I feel like, and again, you can call it Providence, you can call it God, you can call it whatever you want, but so much, especially when you study this era, is unexplainable by anything else. You know, you look at it and you go, how to this happen? You have somebody like Franklin say, how dare you? Right, right. How can you deny that? You stood there and watched it.

Right. Man of science. Right. When you have the man of science, when you went over the man of science. And it's an interesting idea. I'm curious, you've got to send it to me so I can read it. It's a, I don't know the answer. I wish I knew the answer.

I'm searching for the answer. I think, I personally think, and I don't know, I'd be curious your answer too, that my obsession with history doesn't come from some old quest. It comes from a new one of an answer that I'm looking. for today. I'm just not finding it today, so I search for somewhere else to try and find the answer that will make today better. I don't consciously do that. I don't, you know, I wish I was so, I'm so amazing and I'm going to find the answer to, you know, all of our problems. I don't do that. I go and look what's interesting to me, but I really do believe, you know, when I grew up,

my life was by no means, you know, easy. My dad lost his job. And it wasn't one of those moments where, okay, you got to find a new job. We were worried about not money, but we were worried about safety. I was the first of my family to go to a four-year college. My dad and mom moved us down from where I grew up in New York down to Florida, started over from scratch at 39 years old. And my father never really had the answers. He just couldn't find. He just had a temper.

And his dad was a military guy who in World War II was a boxer and was struck by lightning, and that's how he got his discharge. And then my father, when he was a kid at camp, got struck by lightning. Two men, two generations, both struck by lightning.

It defies, as we were just talking about, everything, which also means, don't walk with me in a rain store. I know, right? But I grew up, right? But I grew up, never known if that story was true

or just like George Washington's, coat with the bullet holes in it, right? Like, is it the lure or is it the truth? And when my dad died, and I should also say my grandfather used to put his hands on my father, and he was a boxer in the military. It was bad. And my father should have repeated history. He should have absolutely beat the crap out of me, because that's what he learned, and that's all he learned. And my father's whole reason for living was to be different, that the lightning won't strike twice. right that it won't hit again and my father died oh you get me emotional now my father died when he was dying i whispered two things in his ear and one of them was you were a good father

because i was but he didn't know how to be he just tried to feed all the good parts of my father no one gave them to him he had to find them and when my dad dies at his eulogy i wrote this story of these two lightning bolts one after the other that should have followed one right after the other. The history should have repeated every single time. And when I was growing up, my dad never, he'd lose his temper all the time. He would always punch a hole in the wall when he was angry. So all the walls and all the doors in our house, bathroom doors, his door had a giant hole and a giant dent that was in the door whenever he'd get mad. But the only door he never, ever touched was my door. My sister and I shared a room. It was the two-bedroom

apartment for the four of us, never touched our door. The lightning never repeated. And when my dad died and I told that story in his eulogy, I even acknowledged and said, I just don't know if it's a good story if it really happened because my dad's gone now. And I never knew if he was telling the truth about being struck by lightning or if that was just what he thought happened on a day

when he got knocked out at camp. And I told the story and I put it on our Facebook page or Twitter page, whatever was on. And a week later, it just people started reading it and responding to it. And a week later, a guy emails me and says, Hey, Brad, I read that story about your father, and I got to tell you something about your dead dad. He was struck by lightning because I was there that day

when he was struck by lightning when we were kids, and I'm going to tell you the story now. And this total stranger out there does the greatest thing that's ever happened to me when you lose a parent is they tell you a new story about your parent. And in that moment, my father's alive again. I get a new story. And he told me exactly second by second what happened.

And he said, I know what happened because I was struck by lightning on that day too. And he tells me the story how my father had grabbed the doorknob, a metal doorknob at camp, and the lightning had hit my father, wearing through him, and he said, my hand was on your father's shoulder. We were both knocked out, both unconscious. They were treated. They put white sheets over your father. They thought he was dead. He took the worst of it.

And verified the story. And I tell you all that to simply say, I still. I still feel like my love of history is trying to explain what I can't find explanations for today. I don't know what they are. I know I say my prayers every night. I know what I believe, like, you know, is that thing in the universe, but God, I can't find that answer. I think I know why you and I connect so much now. Dad thing.

My father was beaten by his dad. And my dad, and I didn't understand this, my dad was... gentle as a lamb in the house. And I didn't, he didn't tell anybody until, and I'm the only one he told. Yeah, I didn't know until I grew up. 35. Same thing.

Same thing. Yeah. And I think what it is we are looking for, I think we're looking for the, we're looking for the key that turns that on. but both of our fathers didn't want to repeat history. Yeah. They didn't want to be that.

They didn't know how. They don't know what to do. My father, same way, did not know how to be a dad. It was pretty lousy dad for a while. I've been a pretty great dad for a while and pretty lousy dad at the end. But he was up until the end, he tried. He was lousy at the beginning because I didn't know what. what was wrong with him.

Right. You know, he was trying not to be his father. Those words are literally in my father's eulogy, that all he was trying to do is not be his father. Yeah. That was the only, that was his true north.

Just do the opposite of that, and you've got to be on the right path. He didn't realize that that's not enough. Yeah. You have to, and he said it to me, but I don't think he understood it. he also kind of like a Willie Loman in a way.

You have no, my father was a salesman. When I go see Death of a Salesman, I'm in tear because I'm like, there's my father. He's Willie Loman. He is him. I mean,

it is literally the play that undoes me. Part of me went to Michigan because Arthur Miller went to Michigan. Like, I mean, that play, I look at it, I'm like,

there's my dad. My dad, I mean, he would come home, I feel like new level now, but he would come home from sales and I knew he got paid, because only on the days he got paid could he bring home the dry cleaning.

And if the dry cleaning came home, I knew he would have, he would have take out food and he'd have the over his shoulder the dry clean because those were the only days he could afford to come home. But the one thing my father knew, the only thing he knew is how to love me like a crazy person. Like a crazy person. I mean, he would, and he would, you know, he would, you know, he was insane. Like he would go into the bookstore and say, this is the best story for my father. My father, when he was 18 years old, had knee surgery, and he died on the table. He flatlined, and they brought him back to life.

And when he was in, I think, his 60s, he was going in for hip replacement surgery. And he's worried that I don't have the body of an 18-year-old anymore. I'm in my 60s. And if I flatline, I'm dead. I'm not going to come back. So he thinks these are his last moments on the planet. And I fly home to see him. and he's so worried that these are his last moments on the planet

that they have to fill him full of tranquilizers just to calm his blood pressure before they can give him the anesthetic. The doctor's like, he's crazy, he's like an animal on there. We have to literally trank him to give him the anesthetic. So they give him the tranquilizers, then they give him the anesthetic, they take them upstairs,

an hour goes to an hour and a half, hour and a half goes to two hours, please let him be okay. And after two hours, a doctor comes down, and he says, you want to see your father? I do. And I go into the room. He's full of tranquilizers. He's full of anesthetic. He's flying high as a guy who doesn't know where he is. And he opens his eyes and he says, I love you. And then he says to me, I sold a dozen books up there. And I said, that's what you're thinking of when you're this close

to death? I said, that's what you're thinking of. And I said, did you tell him about the paperbacks? But this was the guy always selling, right? He's on his deathbed. And he's still selling for his boy. like he'd go into every Barnes & Noble and say, I'm here for Brad Meltzer's new book. He's my favorite author. They're like, Mr. Meltzer. We know he's your son. We know he's your son.

And to the day he died, he was that guy, Willie Lohman, forever out doing the sale, but never had the tools to figure out his own life, but just knew how to connect and how to close. That was what he did. Five people, Brad, that you think are essential to know about. That's a good one.

It may be completely either on the edges of history that people would have to go find or or maybe misunderstood. Yeah, I'll take, I want to give you a thoughtful answer, not a quick answer. I mean, I know I do feel George Washington, Abraham, Lincoln, or two. And I'm going to take away religious because I feel like that just creates a whole different thing. So let's just do historical. Those are always the top two that go. Doesn't have to be American.

Yeah, no, no, I'll go anywhere. See, if you say it's who I got to eat dinner with, I'd take my mom, my grandfather any day. But if it's someone you have to learn about, I still think, and, you know, it's funny. I go, I start with Dr. King and then I go, or should I go back to Gandhi, and then should I go back even further

for where Gandhi gets it from? But I still take Dr. King. I still take Dr. King. I take Mr. Rogers. You can make it, Jim Henson, you can make it Mr. Rogers, but when I was five years old, Mr. Rogers and Jim Henson on Sesame Street taught me you could use your creativity to put good into the world.

And to this day, all I'm trying to do is on some level, I hope, trying to use my creativity to put good into this world. I never write a book about a plot to kill Washington. To me, it's about Washington's character. It's to inspire. I never write a thriller just to make it turn the prehistory. pagers. It's like here's the people at Dover who deal with our fallen soldiers. Like these are

the good stories. This is where, you know, we can rise up as people. And our kids' books, the same thing is like just showing that power. But I feel like, and I'm trying to think of who it is, there's, you know, I'll tell you who it is. Here's one. This will be, here's my good last one. Sheila Spicer. So you know, never heard of her. She was my ninth grade English teacher. And Sheila Spicer, African-American woman, who I moved from New York. My parents didn't know what an honors class was, much less a college, you know, and she's changed my life with three words. She said to me, you can write. I said, well, everyone can write. She said, no, no, no, you know what you're doing. And she tried to put me in

the honors class. I had some sort of conflict. She said, here's what I'm going to do. She said, you're going to sit in the corner for the entire year, ignore everything I do on the blackboard, you're going to do the honors work instead, ignore every homework assignment I give, do the honors work instead. Wow. And what she was really saying was, you're going to thank me later.

Now, a decade later, as someone who appreciates all history, especially my own, my first book comes out. I walk back to her classroom. I knock on the door. And she says, can I help you? I said, my name is Brad Meltzer.

I wrote this book, and it's for you. thunk, put it down. She starts crying. I said, why are you crying? She said, you know, I was going to retire this year because I didn't think I was having an impact anymore. This woman changed my life. The most important person beside my own family, the first person who ever told me beside my family, I was good at something, changed my life and had no idea of her impact, no concept of her legacy. And I realized with her that we all have this legacy. I always, I always, I was there. We have our family, which we all know, but you also have these people you see every day. You have the Sheila Spicers that are out there that you work with or coworkers or people like that that are part of

your legacy too. This woman, again, the biggest impact on me and had no concept of her legacy. And in fact, when she finally retired, I went to her retirement party. And I said, she didn't know I was going to be there. And I realized as I stepped in that it was a potential disaster because when you go back to revisit your own history, you risk that history. All your memories of what you thought it was are all at risk. And she had actually lasted 12 more years after my thank you to her. When I went back and said, she was going to retire, she lasted 12 more years, is finally retiring. I said, don't tell her I'm going to be there. A coworker called me and said, I know what she means to you. And I said, I sat there and I'm hiding behind a pillar. It's a Friday afternoon. All she's got to do is say,

you know, it's a bunch of teachers who are tired on a Friday. It's five o'clock at night. All she's got to do is say, I hate half of you. I love the other half of you. Thanks for this vase you gave me. I'm going to have, you go have a good life. And I realize watching this, I'm like, what if she's not as good as I remember? All my history is destroyed. and she gets in front of these jaded teachers on a Friday afternoon at 5 o'clock and says, gives this speech and says to all of those out there who think that these kids have changed and America's changed and time has changed. Do not give up on these kids.

Do not give up on these kids. And she gives the rallying speech like at the end of Braveheart, where I want to go and sign up for an education certificate. And she has no idea I'm there. There's not for show. She has no concept of what's happening. I'm like, oh, my God. There's that one.

and who changed my life when I was a kid at ninth grade. There she is. And I highly recommend to anyone listening to this. There is someone, and I know you have it too, who was the first person who took a chance on you, the first person who told you were good at something, go find them and say thank you. You will never believe what comes from it. A few years ago, a sailor on a submarine wrote me. a letter and said, this was actually a decade ago, and said, I can't tell you where I am.

I'm an undisclosed location with the military, but we don't have many books on this submarine, but we have one of your thrillers. And I just want to thank you, because at a time when I really needed ease, this thing brought me ease. And I thought, that's a really nice thank you. I got to do something nice for that sailor. So I called up my publisher, and I said, can I get 10,000 books donated to the USO? And they said, sure. And I said, that was easy. So I called another publisher, called another, called another. We eventually got 40,000 books donated to the U.S.O. I got involved with the U.S.O.

I've done a lot of work with U.S.O. I've gone everywhere from the Middle East in Kuwait to Cuba. I do whatever they ask. I always go over the years. And when I go to Kuwait for the first one, it was during the war. And war was basically winding down at this point. And I go there and one of the first soldiers that I meet says, I want to thank you, Brad, for all those books you donated a decade ago.

And I said, how do you even know that? Nobody knows that story. And he said, well, when I was stationed in Iraq and Afghanistan, I'd always see Staxiard books. And they'd always say, courtesy of the U.S.O. So I knew that you had to have done it. I said, no, but I'm here to thank you. You're getting it all wrong. Don't thank me.

I'm here to thank you. So I come back from that trip. And I'm like, I've got to track down that original guy on the sailor. And I got to find him and tell him what his thank you set in motion. So I actually track them down. I couldn't find the email bounced back. I found his phone on my column up. I said, my name is Brad Meltzer.

10 years ago you wrote me a letter from a submarine thanking me. I just wanted you to know I got involved with the USO. We got 40,000 books, don't we? All these people were inspired thanks to what you did and your thank you. And I figured it's going to be all inspired. And you know what you're on the phone with someone, you know something's wrong? And I say to him, are you okay? And he says, no.

And I said, what's wrong? And he said, a few days ago, he says to me, my mother died of breast cancer. And what he has no idea of is my mother had just died of breast cancer. And I said, I think I'm here to deliver a message to you. And he says, what's the message? And I said, well, my mom died, everyone gave me this useless advice that I really couldn't deal with, you know, and it just wasn't helpful. And I know they meant well, but it just didn't do me any good.

I was so mad and upset that I lost my mom. And one person said something that really meant the world to me. So I think I'm here to share that message with you. and that's why we're really speaking today and he says what's the message and I said to him our mothers never leave us ever

and he starts crying and because he's crying I'm obviously getting emotional in that moment and I'm not one of those new agey people who feels like you know rainbows and glitter cannons rain down but sometimes in this universe we feel like we're alone and other times we feel like we're profoundly

connected to anyone listening out there find that person think that person who gave you your first real chance that person who took that chance on you told you were good at something track them down and say thank you you will never believe what comes from it it will always pay back so i take miss spicer i'll take her any day this has been very satisfying because i have learned a little bit about history i've learned a little bit about you and i have also discovered that you are a much better man than i am

and so i have something to shoot for vice versa always always i am i the dad thing is blow in my mind right No, I didn't know we had that. Explain with like everything in an odd way. It does. Yeah, that's a good one. Brad, thank you. Thank you, sir. Name of the book, The First Conspiracy, the Secret Plot to Kill George Washington.

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